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Mortal Kombat's resident Thunder God takes on Star Wars' favorite son of the Dark Side.

Since the second MK flick blew, I'm going to use Christopher Lambert's version.

Oh god.

No.

Rayden

Rayden. He can fight up close and personal while also using his lightning. Plus, wasnt he a God?

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Rayden. He can fight up close and personal while also using his lightning. Plus, wasnt he a God? Yeah, that last bit is kinda the beater for me as well.

end of story then?

God is nothing more then a title...

You realize that Raiden got knocked the ****ed out by a mere mortal in Armageddon? A mortal whome Palpatine would outright destroy?

Read the conditions of the fight.

Point still stands.

What's Raiden best feat?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Point still stands.

What's Raiden best feat?

Let's see..in the game he actually destroys the world in the MK1 ending. He beats the shit out of Kintaro in the second game.

and Chris Lambert is a badass actor...that and blasting both subzero and scorpion was pretty sweet.

In addition to blowing up the planet, he also loses to Taven.

Taven. As I said, Palpatine would destroy Taven.

And Palpatine can teleport across the Galaxy... so destroying the planet would ultimately just hinder both of them.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Point still stands.

What's Raiden best feat? No it doesnt, he said "Christopher Lamberts version."

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
In addition to blowing up the planet, he also loses to Taven.

Taven. As I said, Palpatine would destroy Taven.

And Palpatine can teleport across the Galaxy... so destroying the planet would ultimately just hinder both of them.

I am under the impression we were talking about the Raiden portrayed in the movie Mortal Kombat 1 and Palpatine as portrayed in the 6 Star Wars Movies. Though, I suppose if we take their most powerfu non-canon/movie abilities into consideration Raiden kills Palpatine even more.

Snafu said it is Raiden from MK 1.

Raiden takes it.

Originally posted by Bardock42
I am under the impression we were talking about the Raiden portrayed in the movie Mortal Kombat 1 and Palpatine as portrayed in the 6 Star Wars Movies. Though, I suppose if we take their most powerfu non-canon/movie abilities into consideration Raiden kills Palpatine even more.

Prove it.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Prove it.

Well, I was under the impression that Raiden at his strongest had the powers of an Elder God, or am I wrong about that?

Raiden is a GOD.

Well, to be fair, the wrinkly half of Picollo was a God. It's just a title...though, in Raiden's case, as far as I know connecter do quite some power.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well, I was under the impression that Raiden at his strongest had the powers of an Elder God, or am I wrong about that?

Raiden doesn't become an elder god until I think MK 2 or MK 3.

I'm confused now though.

Is this Raiden from the MK1 game, or the MK1 movie? Or does he get his abilities from both? Is this Palpatine in general, or only from what we've seen in the 6 movies?

If it's just what we've seen from the movies, then I agree that Raiden takes it with some effort.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Raiden doesn't become an elder god until I think MK 2 or MK 3.

I'm confused now though.

Is this Raiden from the MK1 game, or the MK1 movie? Or does he get his abilities from both? Is this Palpatine in general, or only from what we've seen in the 6 movies?

If it's just what we've seen from the movies, then I agree that Raiden takes it with some effort.

I thought it was Raiden from Mortal Kombat 1 Movie (Christopher Lambert) vs. most powerful Palpatine from the two Star Wars trilogies.

I'd say Raiden, since Palpatine has never been shown with his lightsaber in 4-6, and the only thing he really has is his lightning.

Raiden from MK1 Movie wasn't very impressive. He would get diced by Palpatine.

Game Raiden on the other hand, would utterly destroy (movie) Palpatine.

Raiden is a GOD.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Raiden is a GOD.

You say that like that actually MEANS something, RJ.

Yeah, God is just a title. Not that Raiden wouldn't win. But you could call Alfred a God, wouldn't make him stronger.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
You say that like that actually MEANS something, RJ.

Because it does. How is a mortal (The Emperor) supposed to kill the Japanese God of Thunder?

The same way Kratos eats gods for breakfast in God of War? The same way Taven, a mortal, beat Rayden's ass with utter ease in Mortal Kombat Armageddon? The same way Raiden was injured by.. "raptor ninajs" in the second Mortal Kombat movie? Gandalf is a god (Demi-god, rather.), yet he could be killed by orcs...


Simply being a god does not make you invincible.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
The same way Kratos eats gods for breakfast in God of War? The same way Taven, a mortal, beat Rayden's ass with utter ease in Mortal Kombat Armageddon? The same way Raiden was injured by.. "raptor ninajs" in the second Mortal Kombat movie? Gandalf is a god (Demi-god, rather.), yet he could be killed by orcs...


Simply being a god does not make you invincible. one more person who didnt read the conditions of the fight.

Are you retarded dude?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Are you retarded dude?

Originally posted by Snafu the Great
Mortal Kombat's resident Thunder God takes on Star Wars' favorite son of the Dark Side.

Since the second MK flick blew, I'm going to use Christopher Lambert's version.


Are you?

Nope, though I don't see what the OP's post has to do with anything. But lets make it easy for you.


Provide feats that prove that Raiden wins, aside from "He's a god so he wins".

Show me why he wins because he's a god. What has he done that makes him even a slight challenge for Sideous?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Nope, though I don't see what the OP's post has to do with anything. But lets make it easy for you.


Provide feats that prove that Raiden wins, aside from "He's a god so he wins".

Show me why he wins because he's a god. What has he done that makes him even a slight challenge for Sideous? thread starter specified Raiden from the first MK movie, so thats what we have to work with.

He has his power of thunder and lightning, plus he can come and go like the wind. and being a God means he doesnt tire or bleed.

Prove that him being a god means he doesn't tire or bleed. Not all gods work the same way and have the same powers and abilities.

well, remember the second MK movie?

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
thread starter specified Raiden from the first MK movie, so thats what we have to work with.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
haermm

The mere fact that Raiden can come and go like the wind, in addition to his godly powers, thats enough really.

They square off and Raiden starts dematerializing/materializing around the room, Palpy is gonna have his hands full.

What "godly" powers? Show them to me. Your entire argument seems to hang upon Raiden having some uber magical powers that he can pull out of his ass even though we've never seen him do them before.

Regular old lightning is something Sideous can easily handle, considering lightning is his forte. Teleportation is only helpful for dodging attacks. It won't help him against someone who knows what direction you're going to attack from before you even do it, thanks to the force. Sideous lightsaber will cleave right through his staff and his hands with no effort. So this is how it will play out.

Raiden can't get in close because he does not have anything that can beta a lightsaber. So his only hope is to teleport out of reach and shoot lightning blasts, which is something Sideous can easily counter with both his hands and his lightsaber if need be. So... what weapons does Raiden have to kill Sideous with? His hat and his bad diologue maybe?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
What "godly" powers? Show them to me. Your entire argument seems to hang upon Raiden having some uber magical powers that he can pull out of his ass even though we've never seen him do them before.

Regular old lightning is something Sideous can easily handle, considering lightning is his forte. Teleportation is only helpful for dodging attacks. It won't help him against someone who knows what direction you're going to attack from before you even do it, thanks to the force. Sideous lightsaber will cleave right through his staff and his hands with no effort. So this is how it will play out.

Raiden can't get in close because he does not have anything that can beta a lightsaber. So his only hope is to teleport out of reach and shoot lightning blasts, which is something Sideous can easily counter with both his hands and his lightsaber if need be. So... what weapons does Raiden have to kill Sideous with? His hat and his bad diologue maybe? well, it was never specified if Palpy had a saber or not, so until the thread starter specifies, we can drop that one.

An up close Raiden pwns Palpy. Did you see what he did to Lui Kang when Lui attacked him?

A lightsaber is the standard weapon for all Jedi and Sith, considering he kept one in his sleeve for all of his time as chancellor, I.E. the first three movies, it's logical to assume that he would start off with one. That'd be like saying in an Obi-Wan vs. whoever match that because the thread starter didn't specifically say Obi-Wan had his lightsaber, he doesn't have it.

And the thread starter didn't say Luke had his lightsaber in the Luke vs. Neo thread, yet you automatically assumed he had it and even used it in several of your arguments. You're using a double standard because it suits your argument. Again.

Grasping for straws.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
A lightsaber is the standard weapon for all Jedi and Sith, considering he kept one in his sleeve for all of his time as chancellor, I.E. the first three movies, it's logical to assume that he would start off with one. That'd be like saying in an Obi-Wan vs. whoever match that because the thread starter didn't specifically say Obi-Wan had his lightsaber, he doesn't have it.

And the thread starter didn't say Luke had his lightsaber in the Luke vs. Neo thread, yet you automatically assumed he had it and even used it in several of your arguments. You're using a double standard because it suits your argument. Again.

Grasping for straws. The thread starter came back and said Luke is NJO Luke with a saber, do try and keep up. He did this because people thought it was ROTJ Luke who has NO chance against Neo.

Like the Yoda versus Dumbledore thread, I said NO SABER for Yoda. Its standard equipment, durh, but whoever starts the thread has the right to say what goes.

So until the thread starter verifies Sidious has a saber, its not a valid argument.

The thread starter didn't say that until the second page. Four posts or so into the first page you said Luek will win if he keeps his hands on his lightsaber, even though the thread starter never specified whither or not Luke had one. You automatically assumed Luke had one because all Jedi and Sith carry around lightsabers. I just checked again, and the thread starter never actually specifically said weither or not Luek got his lightsaber. He just said "I want it to be as close as possible, so if luke needs the books sure". It's on the second page. No mention of a lightsaber. Yet you use Luke's lightsaber n your arguments several times.

You're either a liar or a hypocrite.

Like I said before.



By your logic, Iron Man in the Iron Man vs. Incredible Hulk thread doesn't have any of the weapons or devices Iron Man had in the movie, because the thread starter didn't state specify exactly what weapons he had. That'd rediculous.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
The thread starter didn't say that until the second page. four posts or so into the first page you said Luek will win if he keeps his hands on his lightsaber, even though the thread starter never specified whither or not Luke had one. You automatically assumed Luke had one because all Jedi and Sith carry around lightsabers.

Do try to either lie better, or remember your own words.

Like I said before.



By your logic, Iron Man in the Iron Man vs. Incredible Hulk thread doesn't have any of the weapons or devices Iron Man had in the movie, because the thread starter didn't state specify exactly what weapons he had. That'd rediculous. You're funny, you are literally making me laugh.

I believed Luke had a chance with his lightsaber even before the thread starter said it was NJO Luke. When he said it was NJO Luke WITH a saber, it was painfully obvious what the outcome would be.

I never said ALL people believed NJO Luke had no chance, did I now? I said "people", not "all people."

Again, its up to the thread starter to name weponry.

But the thread starter didn't say Luke had his lightsaber. So why would you even bring up his lightsaber in the first place? Because you assumed he had it in the fight?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
But the thread starter didn't say Luke had his lightsaber. So why would you even bring up his lightsaber in the first place? Because you assumed he had it in the fight? If I remember right, someone assumed and he verified.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
If I remember right, someone assumed and he verified.

You're being a jackass; Blax is correct. Your first post in the thread, which happened to be the 5th reply, you said:

"as long as NJO Luke keeps ahold of his saber, he has a chance. If it goes hand to hand, he gets pwned." -RJ

So you took it upon yourself to assume that Luke had a saber, when it was never mentioned ny thr thread creator. You are being a hypocrite by saying Blax can't assume Palpatine has one in this fight.

Edit: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f102/t481255.html

Originally posted by Robtard
You're being a jackass; Blax is correct. Your first post in the thread, which happened to be the 5th reply, you said:

"as long as NJO Luke keeps ahold of his saber, he has a chance. If it goes hand to hand, he gets pwned." -RJ

So you took it upon yourself to assume that Luke had a saber, when it was never mentioned. You are being a hypocrite by saying Blax can't assume Palpatine has one. I assumed and G Duy verified. Whats the problem? All I am saying is that it's not verifed if Sidious has one.

Why get into that, post pages of replies about it, then Snafu comes back and says Sidious has no saber?

Just trying to save us all a bunch of wasted effort.

Hypocrisy still stands.

No it doesn't. Just because I am the one who assumed Luke had a saber and LEARNED about assuming what weaponry each combatant has access to, I am a hypocrite?


Riiiiiight.

You assumed that Luke had a saber, when the thread creator didn't mention one. (Which is fine, since sabers and Jedi go together like milk and cookies.)

Blax assumed Palpatine had a saber when the thread creator didn't mention one.

You told Blax he can't assume Palpatine has one because it wasn't specifically mentioned in the thread.

Add those three facts up together and it = hypocrisy.

Originally posted by Robtard
You assumed that Luke had a saber, when the thread creator didn't mention one. Which is fine, since sabers and Jedi go together like milk and cookies.

Blax assumed Palpatine had a saber when the thread creator didn't mention one.

You told Blax he can't assume Palpatine has one because it wasn't specifically mentioned in the thread.

Add those three facts up together and it = hypocrisy. I assumed and D Guy verified. I never should have assumed, I should have asked first. Blax and the rest of us should do the same, wait til Snafu states one way or the other.

Yeah, Jedi have lightsabers, but here in the versus thread, the thread starter has to state what type of weaponry is involved.

Yoda versus Dumbles, Yoda with a saber, is a one sided battle, just as as it would be having Sidious facing Raiden with a saber.

It makes all the sense in the world Snafu means Palpys force power only.

But if Snafu wants to arm Sidious with a saber, thats his call.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
The same way Kratos eats gods for breakfast in God of War?

I know who Kratos is from Greek Mythology, but I have no idea what God of War is.

Also, Greek gods are a bad standard when comparing other gods from around the world. Greek gods were bascially just humans who were immortal and had some extra powers. They had physical bodies, ate, had a sexual drive, and were very emotionally unstable. So if you think about it, the Olympians weren't very different from modern-day comic book superheroes.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
The same way Taven, a mortal, beat Rayden's ass with utter ease in Mortal Kombat Armageddon? The same way Raiden was injured by.. "raptor ninajs" in the second Mortal Kombat movie?

I don't know what you're talking about, I haven't played video games since I was 12.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk

Simply being a god does not make you invincible.

Then you're not a god. Which means this fight isn't to the death, which means only the Emperor can die, so its pretty one-sided.

I agree, Mota.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
which means only the Emperor can die, so its pretty one-sided.

Well, if this is the movie forum, then the express use of NJO Luke in the neo vs Luke thread would have been disallowed. However, he was used, so it's not outside the realm of possiblitiy for comic book standards to also apply to Palpatine. If this were the case, the Emperor has lived as a disembodied spirit on several occasions. So death would become irrelevant. Also, in the comics and books, the Emperor has destroyed planets with force storms from across the galaxy, kept track of people across the galaxy, been able to control the will and fighting spirit of vast numbers of troops, etc.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Prove it.

STFU BASTARD!

I HATE when people sit back and say 'Prove it.'

well, I guess we aren't gonna get an answer to the saber question.

Originally posted by Combat_Guru
STFU BASTARD!

I HATE when people sit back and say 'Prove it.'

Oh, in that case Palpatine wins 10/10.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Oh, in that case Palpatine wins 10/10.

Thats more like it.

Proof is for the women and the weak, I don't need proof for make believe, just a writer!

Originally posted by Combat_Guru


Proof is for the women and the weak, I don't need proof for make believe, just a writer!

This is the 'Movie Vs.' forum, take that shit to the religious forum.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I assumed and D Guy verified. I never should have assumed, I should have asked first. Blax and the rest of us should do the same, wait til Snafu states one way or the other.

Yeah, Jedi have lightsabers, but here in the versus thread, the thread starter has to state what type of weaponry is involved.

Yoda versus Dumbles, Yoda with a saber, is a one sided battle, just as as it would be having Sidious facing Raiden with a saber.

It makes all the sense in the world Snafu means Palpys force power only.

But if Snafu wants to arm Sidious with a saber, thats his call.

Fine then. Let's use your logic.


The thread starter never specified weither or not Rayden can use his powers. So until we get clarification, Rayden is not allowed to teleport or use any of his lightning powers. The thread starter did not specify weither or not the force is allowed, so no force powers can be used. The thread starter did not specify weither they could walk, or use their fists, or even stand up.

So until the thread starter specifies weither or not they can do any of these things, Rayden and Sideous will sit in one spot (Though that's me assuming they're allowed to sit down. The thread starter didn't specify.) Until Snafu makes things more clear.

Rogue Jedi logic prevails.

/thread



Reported.

The day you are perma-banned, which is inevitable because you're a troll and you've been banned before, I am going to dance.

Superman would thrash Goku by the way.



God of War is a video game set in the time of Ancient Greece. You play the role of Kratos, a mortal man who kills Ares, God of War.



So yo're saying Raiden wins when you don't even know who he really is or what he's done?



Well, to help you out... the "gods" in Mortal Kombat are more akin to the Greek Gods in that they are not infallibe, all powerful, etc. They're basically just like comic book superheroes, as you said.



On KMC, in verse matches the victor is decided by one of the two fighters being unable to fight back. So Battle Field removal, KO, death, etc. are all viable forms of winning a match, unless specified by the thread starter. Besides the fact that you're wrong about Rayden being unable to die, even if he was immortal, he can still be knocked out and such, which would give Palpatine the win.

LOL WOW ! This debate is pretty heated.

Ok i am going to used the terms the best way i know how.
Provided this thread is in the MOVIE versus forum, we have to assume that the movie iterations of both characters are being used, so no DE sidious or video game raiden.

That being said i say raiden takes this.
lightening seems to be just one of the things palpatine does but its raidens specialty, so im sure his attack is better crafted because he spends more time on it.

when sith do force lightening it seems they have to take a couple seconds to position thier hands then charge it, then send it towards thier enemies, i have seem dooku do this in aotc and and palpatine do it in rotj and it takes all of 3 seconds.

raiden on the other hand seems to have it flowing through him so could probably shoot it out instantly.

so we have 3 scenarios occurring.

A) raiden shocks him to death because he needed more time to gather lightening( which they were both trying to do)

B) siddious force pushes raiden into the wall which knocks him off balance then strikes him down.

C) siddious gets out his lightsaber because he assumes that raiden isnt force sensitive and gets supprised with a lightening death


so raiden takes is 6.6/10

also blax-hydralix if i may lapse into my language for a little while

en repuesto al batalle ente goku y superman, superman lo perdio por que puede ser affectado con el kamehameha que no es energia electrico pero lo es "ki" y por eso goku ganaria.

quando superman es muy fuerte, goku puede destruir un mundo solamente con su energia

I'm not sure if you realize this or not, but a lot of what you just said makes no sense.

Originally posted by Devil King
I'm not sure if you realize this or not, but a lot of what you just said makes no sense.

entonces necesita que aprender espanol

Originally posted by Man of Christ

That being said i say raiden takes this.
lightening seems to be just one of the things palpatine does but its raidens specialty, so im sure his attack is better crafted because he spends more time on it.

Well... what does that mean exactly? His lightning is "better"? From what we've seen him do in the movie, his lightning is not all that different from regular force lightning, nor any more potent. Dooku's lightning blew off a chunk of the steel ceiling in AotC, and Sideous's lightning is far more potent then Dooku's is, and while it it's true that it only one of many things Sideous can do it, it's also his specialty, his forte.



Well, when Dooku did it to Anakin in AotC and to Ventress as soon as he raised his hand lightning shot out. Both Raiden and jedi cast lightning the same way, through there hands.



Meh, debatable. And besides even if Raiden can shoot faster, Sideous can still block lightning with his hands like Yoda and Dooku, or with his lightsaber like Mace and Obi-Wan.



Entirely feasible considering Raiden can not dodge or block the force.



With his lightsaber out Sideous can still cast lightning and defend against lightning with his free hand or his lightsaber.





Sorry man, but even though I'm Mexican I don't really speak Spanish. My grandmother refused to teach my ma spanish, so she doesn't know it and can't teach me. I'm taking classes, but I can can only understand and speak a few phrases at my current level.

YOU don't understand me, in an invornment like this, with dog bastards like you, and crappy authority like mods on this site, I can't control myself, it's best I'm not on, it'[s like an addiction, I'll get just as much satifasction as you.



Not if I write their crossover shit for brains.

Which was my point in saying, 'Proof is for the women and the weak in fary land, cause all you need is a WRITER.'

Besides, it's not like Superman beating Goku would make it any more real than if their universes met.

I think Goku would kill Superman, he's the one made of steel.

Look at Goku's thousand mile stare in my sig, that stare makes people like Superman cry.

I mean read that part of the Manga, Goku's face is bloodied, his friends have been killed, he's fighting a planet destroyer, and all he can think about is breaking something.

The reason i assumed that with siddious's lightsaber out he couldnt defend against lightening is because sidious' lightening destroyed yoda's saber which shows that lightening on a raiden or siddious level can bypass the saber defense

furthermore, since raiden is not force sensitive, siddious wont know that he can shoot lightening out of his hands so when raiden raises his finger palpatine will be like "what are you doing? where is your blaster"
then raiden shocks him before he has the time to put up a defense

Yoda's lightsaber was not destroyed, it was just knocked out of his hands because Yoda did not have proper footing to brace himself and he did not have a firm grip on his lightsaber, plus he was surprised. If you remember though, when Mace was fighting Sideous Mace was able to defend against Sideous' lightning with his lightsaber. So it depends.

The force gives the user super human reflexes and the like. Raiden's lightning moves slow enough that it can be dodged by peak human fighters. Sideous, who like other Jedi moves fast enough to block lasers, should have no problem putting up a defense.

And by the way, could you translate what you said in Spanish? It'll help me with mah edumcation.

Originally posted by Combat_Guru
YOU don't understand me, in an invornment like this, with dog bastards like you, and crappy authority like mods on this site, I can't control myself, it's best I'm not on, it'

Then go away.





Then go away and go write it. Fulfill your fanboy fetishes.

It's called an addition dumbass.

How am I supposed to go away when I enjoy so much loosing control?

Fetishes, tsk, hardly, Superman never lost his temper to the degree Goku did in his transendence of The Super Saiyan, Vegeta couldn't have gotten that mad if he were in Goku's shoes, Goku wasn't corrupt, and he had never felt real hate before.

Goku was a good guy before that point, but after that, his persona slightly changed, and his potenital encreased, he was no longer a low class Saiyan, he had become a Saiyan, and for that reason alone, I share hate with Goku, and I'd like for Goku to rip something significant's head off.

Something as significant as Superman, thats what I feel.

Now you know.

Originally posted by Man of Christ
entonces necesita que aprender espanol

that might make sense if anything you said was in spanish.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Then go away.





Then go away and go write it. Fulfill your fanboy fetishes.

I don't have a clue why why someone would argue Goku's demise, preach it, and worship it to the degree that you do.

Except for the reason I preach Superman's defeat, this reason is simple, it's not a dispute of characters, but a dispute of us, this is why I preach it, it's a personal matter, it's between you, and me, and I hate you.

Originally posted by Devil King
that might make sense if anything you said was in spanish.
dont let jealousy cloud your judgment padawan

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Yoda's lightsaber was not destroyed, it was just knocked out of his hands because Yoda did not have proper footing to brace himself and he did not have a firm grip on his lightsaber, plus he was surprised. If you remember though, when Mace was fighting Sideous Mace was able to defend against Sideous' lightning with his lightsaber. So it depends.

The force gives the user super human reflexes and the like. Raiden's lightning moves slow enough that it can be dodged by peak human fighters. Sideous, who like other Jedi moves fast enough to block lasers, should have no problem putting up a defense.

And by the way, could you translate what you said in Spanish? It'll help me with mah edumcation.

i say the element of supprise gives raiden the win here because for example, siddious knew yoda had the force but even then he did nothing to defend against yoda's force push in the office.

imagine then if palpatine was caught off guard in this same scenario but instead of a tk push it was enough lightening to stop a heart.

sids gets creamed

Originally posted by Man of Christ


also blax-hydralix if i may lapse into my language for a little while

en repuesto al batalle ente goku y superman, superman lo perdio por que puede ser affectado con el kamehameha que no es energia electrico pero lo es "ki" y por eso goku ganaria.

quando superman es muy fuerte, goku puede destruir un mundo solamente con su energia

Translation: In response to the battle between goku and superman. Superman lost it because he can be affected with the kamahameha which is not electrical energy but it is "Ki". Because of this Goku will win.

while superman is very strong, goku can destroy a world only with his energy

Originally posted by Man of Christ
Translation: In response to the battle between goku and superman. Superman lost it because he can be affected with the kamahameha which is not electrical energy but it is "Ki". Because of this Goku will win.

while superman is very strong, goku can destroy a world only with his energy

Why do you assume this "Ki" shit will affect Superman?

Originally posted by Robtard
Why do you assume this "Ki" shit will affect Superman?

we must discuss this on another thread because our debate will be off topic

Originally posted by Robtard
Why do you assume this "Ki" shit will affect Superman?

Chi shit?

It's DBZ's equavilant of dark energy, which is stronger than gravity itself.

This 'Chi shit' is energy in it's purest form.

Chi balls are condensed explosions, that stay in a ball instead of expand in every direction, this means their mass is great, and when all of that mass is released in an explosion, it causes the gravity relative to itself to disapate into energy, blowing pretty much any matter into shapeless paste.

This is especially dangerous in a Kameha wave, because this Chi Ball is at the end of a wide laser beam, and when it hits it's target, it just plows through it, and THEN explodes if the target is durable enough to take the impact, and that explosion is the killer.

I've watched BDZ before, that shit didn't always take out Goku's foes and they weren't nearly as durable as Superman.

Originally posted by Robtard
I've watched BDZ before, that shit didn't always take out Goku's foes and they weren't nearly as durable as Superman.

Says WHO?

PLease open a new thread for this dicsussion

Originally posted by Man of Christ
dont let jealousy cloud your judgment padawan

You play a lot of video games, don't you?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Fine then. Let's use your logic.


The thread starter never specified weither or not Rayden can use his powers. So until we get clarification, Rayden is not allowed to teleport or use any of his lightning powers. The thread starter did not specify weither or not the force is allowed, so no force powers can be used. The thread starter did not specify weither they could walk, or use their fists, or even stand up.

So until the thread starter specifies weither or not they can do any of these things, Rayden and Sideous will sit in one spot (Though that's me assuming they're allowed to sit down. The thread starter didn't specify.) Until Snafu makes things more clear.

Rogue Jedi logic prevails.Christopher Lambert as Raiden could teleport and use lightning powers, thread starter specified Christopher Lambert, remember?

Originally posted by Man of Christ
i say the element of supprise gives raiden the win here because for example, siddious knew yoda had the force but even then he did nothing to defend against yoda's force push in the office.

imagine then if palpatine was caught off guard in this same scenario but instead of a tk push it was enough lightening to stop a heart.

sids gets creamed

The force also moves a thousand times faster, and is for the most part undodgable. It also can only be blocked by the force, whereas lightning can be blocked by the force, counter lightning, and lightsabers, as well as be dodged.

You're assuming that Sideous will be unable to dodge or block a lightning blast, despite the fact that he moves and reacts a hundred times faster then padawans, who can easily block blaster bolts.

Raiden's lightning moves slow enough that regular fighters and ninja can dodge it.



But he didn't specify which abilities Raiden could use.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
The force also moves a thousand times faster, and is for the most part undodgable. It also can only be blocked by the force, whereas lightning can be blocked by the force, counter lightning, and lightsabers, as well as be dodged.

You're assuming that Sideous will be unable to dodge or block a lightning blast, despite the fact that he moves and reacts a hundred times faster then padawans, who can easily block blaster bolts.

Raiden's lightning moves slow enough that regular fighters and ninja can dodge it.



But he didn't specify which abilities Raiden could use. The force moves a thousand times faster? Where did you hear that?

And the thread starter specified Christopher Lamberts Raiden, who could indeed use lightning powers AND teleport.

"thousand" was hyperbole. My point was that the force is much, much faster then Raiden's lightning is. A force is instantaneous unless it's in a tangible form such as lightning. There is no time between when the attack is cast and when it effects the victim. Raiden's lightning on the other hand, is not instantaneous. It like force lightning does not have the same characteristics as real electricity, most notably it's speed.

Yes he has the abilities, but the thread starter did not specify whither or not he could use them. He didn't say "Christopher Lambert's Raiden with all his abilities" now did he? He just said Christopher Lambert's Raiden, which could mean anything.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
"thousand" was hyperbole. My point was that the force is much, much faster then Raiden's lightning is. A force is instantaneous unless it's in a tangible form such as lightning. There is no time between when the attack is cast and when it effects the victim. Raiden's lightning on the other hand, is not instantaneous. It like force lightning does not have the same characteristics as real electricity, most notably it's speed.

Yes he has the abilities, but the thread starter did not specify whither or not he could use them. He didn't say "Christopher Lambert's Raiden with all his abilities" now did he? He just said Christopher Lambert's Raiden, which could mean anything. You are being difficult just to be difficult. Saying it is Christopher Lamberts version implies he has said powers.

Rogue Jedi logic dictates that what is implied is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is what the thread starter specifies.

Thats what we have to work with. Get used to it or GTFO.

That being the case, until the thread starter specifies wither or not Raiden can use his abilities, he can not use them. Same goes for Palpatine.

That's just how things work around here RJ. Get used to it or GTFO.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
That being the case, until the thread starter specifies wither or not Raiden can use his abilities, he can not use them. Same goes for Palpatine.

That's just how things work around here RJ. Get used to it or GTFO. Aw, someone still hve a wet diaper about the whole lightsaber thing?

I have been posting here since day one, I have no need for a refresher on forum rules.

Posting where, in the movie verse? That pretty much makes two of us.

Though you posting here since day one is apparently utterly irrelevant, since you admitted to assuming that Luke had his lightsaber in the Neo vs. Luke thread, even though the thread starter never specified as to wither or not Luke even had his lightsaber.

Maybe you do need a refresher, if you're breaking the rules like that?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Posting where, in the movie verse? That pretty much makes two of us.

Though you posting here since day one is apparently utterly irrelevant, since you admitted to assuming that Luke had his lightsaber in the Neo vs. Luke thread, even though the thread starter never specified as to wither or not Luke even had his lightsaber.

Maybe you do need a refresher, if you're breaking the rules like that? Bottom line is that the thread starter specified Raiden from the first MK movie, so it's a no brainer to include all of Raidens powers. Weaponry and powers are different.

No they're not.

Thats your comeback? Man.......tell you what, pm Impediment and we'll see who has the right interpretation of the rules.

It doesn't matter that much to me, though you can feel free to do so.. At this point, all I'm arguing is semantics; expressing how ridiculous this "rule", or your interpretation of the rule, is. Sideous would win this even without his lightsaber.

Sure he would.

Well, I'm glad you agree.

Can this thread die now?

Nope. Raiden would win because as Palpy attacks all he has to do is teleport outta the way and attack from another angle.

You can't "teleport" away from the force.

And he can't even see what's attacking him. What, he just teleports around for no reason? Palpatine doesn't even have to raise his hand. He just has to look at Raiden, and he'll go flying into a wall at 50 MPH. And that's me being easy... Palpatine can snap his fingers and Raiden's chest will instantly cave in on itself, similiar to what Mace did to Greivous.

Here's something we haven't considered...do they know about each others powers before they fight? If not, that adds a whole new twist to things.

Not really, considering all of Raiden's attacks are dodgable and blockable, whereas Sideous force attacks are for the most part instantaneous, undetectable, and unblockable. Raiden can not detect the force, he can not sense the force, he can not see the force or feel the force. He has no way of knowing if it's being used. So even if he knew what Sideous was capable of, he wouldn't know if Palps is actually using any of the attacks until after he's hit by it, since there are no tell tale signs that the force will be used. So essentially, he won't know whats going on until after his neck has been snapped or his lungs have been crushed.

How do you figure Raidens attacks are blockable?

Thing is, if Raiden knows about Palpys powers, he aint gonna sit there like an moron, he is gonna teleport all around the room, wait for an opening, and attack.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
How do you figure Raidens attacks are blockable?

Thing is, if Raiden knows about Palpys powers, he aint gonna sit there like an moron, he is gonna teleport all around the room, wait for an opening, and attack.

Wouldn't Palpatine also posses that premonition that you touted on and on about in regards to Luke and how attacks wouldn't hit him because of it?

Because Raiden's lightning has been shown to be blockable in the all of the games, which his character is based off of, and we've seen time and again that force users tend to have no problems with blocking lightning?

If you have proof that Raiden's attacks are unblockable, show it to me.



Prove that he can "teleport" from the force. The force isn't some monster or invisible hand trying to grab him. It's basically reality itself. And besides Raiden can not teleport around the room forever. If he could, why doesn't he do so in his fights in the movies, as opposed to running and doing flips like everyone else around him?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Because Raiden's lightning has been shown to be blockable in the all of the games, which his character is based off of, and we've seen time and again that force users tend to have no problems with blocking lightning?

If you have proof that Raiden's attacks are unblockable, show it to me.



Prove that he can "teleport" from the force. The force isn't some monster or invisible hand trying to grab him. It's basically reality itself. And besides Raiden can not teleport around the room forever. If he could, why doesn't he do so in his fights in the movies, as opposed to running and doing flips like everyone else around him? Now you are bringing the games into this.....AGAIN......You never learn.

Teleport from the force? Elaborate on that.

I bring the games into it because what the **** else am I supposed to go off of? Your word? Movie Raiden is based off of video game Raiden, his personality is based off of video game Raiden, his feats are based off of video game Raiden, his powers are based off of video game Raiden. Hence, it's logical to assume that his powers work the same way as his video game counter part. It's a hell of a lot more logical then your argument, which is nothing more then "Raiden's attacks are unblockable because I say so". If you think Raiden's attacks are unblockable and undodgable, provide proof, or hush up. If you can't, your argument is void and we can move on.



Your entire argument hinges upon two things: Raiden's attacks being unblockable (which is false), and him teleporting away from all of Palpatine's attacks. You say he'll just teleport around the room constantly firing off attacks and looking for openings. I call bullshit, because there is no proof that Raiden can teleport around in circles forever, if there was he would just do it in all of his fights, which he doesn't. Second, you can not dodge a force attack by teleporting because the force is not a tangible object, it's all encompassing and it is everywhere, so if Palpatine tries to crush his chest and Raiden teleports to the opposite end of the room he'll still be hit by the attack and his chest will still eb crushed because the force is everywhere and you can not "avoid" it.

edit- and by the way, you're now arguing about Raiden and Sideous knowing each others attacks, even though the thread starter never specified as such. So... why are you taking the thread's scenario into your hands?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
I bring the games into it because what the **** else am I supposed to go off of? Your word? Movie Raiden is based off of video game Raiden, his personality is based off of video game Raiden, his feats are based off of video game Raiden, his powers are based off of video game Raiden. Hence, it's logical to assume that his powers work the same way as his video game counter part. It's a hell of a lot more logical then your argument, which is nothing more then "Raiden's attacks are unblockable because I say so". If you think Raiden's attacks are unblockable and undodgable, provide proof, or hush up. If you can't, your argument is void and we can move on.



Your entire argument hinges upon two things: Raiden's attacks being unblockable (which is false), and him teleporting away from all of Palpatine's attacks. You say he'll just teleport around the room constantly firing off attacks and looking for openings. I call bullshit, because there is no proof that Raiden can teleport around in circles forever, if there was he would just do it in all of his fights, which he doesn't. Second, you can not dodge a force attack by teleporting because the force is not a tangible object, it's all encompassing and it is everywhere, so if Palpatine tries to crush his chest and Raiden teleports to the opposite end of the room he'll still be hit by the attack and his chest will still eb crushed because the force is everywhere and you can not "avoid" it.

edit- and by the way, you're now arguing about Raiden and Sideous knowing each others attacks, even though the thread starter never specified as such. So... why are you taking the thread's scenario into your hands? I never said they were unblockable, YOU said they were blockable, and until you provide PROOF that CHRISTOPHER LAMBERTS Raiden, NOT video game Raiden can have his attacks blocked, drop it. YOU brought it up, you made a claim, back it up with proof.

You know NOTHING of force attacks it seems. Yes, the force is all encompassing, but that doesnt mean the attacks Palpy throws at him don't have to be aimed. If Raiden is standing there and Palpy force attacks him, and Raiden teleports behind him, the force attack MISSES.

And if you are gonna throw in video game Raiden, I am gonna throw in Raiden from the second MK movie. Raiden gets in close and thats all she wrote, he is a master at hand to hand combat. Palpy wouldnt last ten seconds with Raiden in his face.

You dug yourself in a mighty big hole it seems. lets see you dig yourself out.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I never said they were unblockable, YOU said they were blockable, and until you provide PROOF that CHRISTOPHER LAMBERTS Raiden, NOT video game Raiden can have his attacks blocked, drop it. YOU brought it up, you made a claim, back it up with proof.

I already did. We have seen force users block lightning all the time with both their lightsabers and with juust the force. I have stated this numerous times. Your turn to provide a counter-argument. Show me in-movie proof please, if you can. I doubt you can though.



Prove it.



No he wouldn't... because he'd get sliced in half by Sideous' lightsaber. Or... his chest would just get crushed. Just because he's "in his face" doesn't mean force attacks can not be used.

So... no. Sideous would still win this pretty easily.

And don't try to use a strawman fallacy, RJ. It's sad.



Don't forget about this.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
I already did. We have seen force users block lightning all the time with both their lightsabers and with juust the force. I have stated this numerous times. Your turn to provide a counter-argument. Show me in-movie proof please, if you can. I doubt you can though.Hey, I didnt say "Raidens attacks cannot be blocked." You said they can be blocked. Dont try to turn the tables, just back up your claim with proof.



Watch the SW movies. Watch the force attacks. Watch and pay attention.



Yeah, I am gonna ignore the saber comment.

And Raiden is a God. To Quote Lui Kang in the second MK movie: "Your blood flows, Khan, just like the blood of a mortal."....See how that works? You break the rules of the thread, you bring in shit that doesnt belong in the thread, and I PROVE that Raiden is a God. Funny that you are actually defeating yourself here.

Raiden...GOD
Palpy....MORTAL



DO THE MATH

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Hey, I didnt say "Raidens attacks cannot be blocked." You said they can be blocked. Dont try to turn the tables, just back up your claim with proof.

I already did. If you can no t, or will not, provide a counter-argument, then there is no point in pursuing the point.

Raiden's atacks are blockable.





That's not proof. That's fallible interpretation.





I never said he WASN'T a god. I said being a god doesn't make him infallible. There are different kinds of gods. Not all gods have infinite power. Not all gods have infinite energy. Not all gods are immortal. Show me where I said he wasn't a god. And immortal just means you can not die. You can still be knocked out/sliced in half, fried, defeated. Immortality is irrelevant.





You don't even know what a god is. What are you talking about?

Originally posted by Robtard
Wouldn't Palpatine also posses that premonition that you touted on and on about in regards to Luke and how attacks wouldn't hit him because of it?

Also like to bring this up, since it was a good point.

Even if Raiden can teleport around forever, how is that going to do anything? Sideous can easily anticipate anything Raiden does.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
I already did. If you can no t, or will not, provide a counter-argument, then there is no point in pursuing the point.

Raiden's atacks are blockable.And who is to say Raiden cannot block a force attack with his own? Oh, I bet YOU are gonna assume he cant and declare it as fact.





I could use the same argument against you. Every time a force attack is used, the attacker gestures at the victim.





So tell me, genius, what kind of God is Raiden? Hmm?





Even if he is a low ranking God (interms of power) he is still a God, and Palpy is still a mortal. He cannot bleed, hence Lui Kangs quote from MK2.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Also like to bring this up, since it was a good point.

Even if Raiden can teleport around forever, how is that going to do anything? Sideous can easily anticipate anything Raiden does. Raiden is no ordinary mortal, you think it will be that easy to read his mind?

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Raiden is no ordinary mortal, you think it will be that easy to read his mind?

It's not mind reading, it's the ability to sense things before they happen, as said by Qui Gon Gin(sp?) in Ep 1.

Palpatine "pwns" Raiden. Either with force powers or saber.

Originally posted by Robtard
It's not mind reading, it's the ability to sense things before they happen, as said by Qui Gon Gin(sp?) in Ep 1.

Palpatine "pwns" Raiden. Either with force powers or saber. Jedi can sense intent, like the intent one has towards another. Luke Skywalker had this power on a whole different level than Palpy did, he could sense his attackers intent AND interpret their actions. There is no evidence that Palpy had it like Luke.

If he did, why did he get tossed down a reactor shaft by Vader? Remember when he and Yoda are fighting in the senate chamber in ROTS? And when Palpy was hurling those seating platforms at Yoda, then Yoda hurled them back? Did you see Palpys reaction? He never saw it coming. So when facing Raiden, a GOD (yes, he in fact is a God), odds are he will get his ass handed to him.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Jedi can sense intent, like the intent one has towards another. Luke Skywalker had this power on a whole different level than Palpy did, he could sense his attackers intent AND interpret their actions. There is no evidence that Palpy had it like Luke.

If he did, why did he get tossed down a reactor shaft by Vader? Remember when he and Yoda are fighting in the senate chamber in ROTS? And when Palpy was hurling those seating platforms at Yoda, then Yoda hurled them back? Did you see Palpys reaction? He never saw it coming. So when facing Raiden, a GOD (yes, he in fact is a God), odds are he will get his ass handed to him.

I'm going off by what was said in the movie, force users have the ability to sense things before they happen, one of the reason why Anakin was able to pilot a pod, take it up with Lucas or Qui Gon Gin. Ergo, Palpatine would sense any attack Raiden did before it happened; since Raiden doesn't have super speed, I don't see how he could counter this.

Raiden is a god, but he is shown with limited powers, as he didn't defeat his opponents with god-like omnipotence. He seems to be a weather god with applicable weather powers. He may be immortal and be able to reform himself after Palpatine cuts him in two with saber or uses a force power to choke/crush him, but that is a win first for Palpatine.

And here are a few of Raidens attacks:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rayden



Static Teleport: At will, Rayden vanishes and reappears behind the opponent. (MK, MKII, MKT, MK4, MKG, MK, MK:U, MK:A)

Lightning Bolt: Rayden sends bolts of lightning flying at the opponent. (MK, MKII, MKT, MK4, MKG, MKA, MK, MKM, MK:U, MK:A)

Torpedo: Rayden flies horizontally at his opponent and pushes them against the wall. Rayden can also do the move on the air, although not in the first game and Armageddon. (MK, MKII, MKT, MK4, MKG, MK, MK:U, MK:A)

Shocking Touch: Rayden grabs the opponent, holds them in the air, and electrocutes them. In Deception and Armageddon, he ends the move by punching the enemy away. (MKII, MKT, MKA, MK, MK:U, MK:A)

Recurring fatalities
Electric Decapitation: Rayden sends a surge of electricity into the opponent's head and it explodes. (MK, MKT)

Explosive Uppercut: The god crouches down and sends a vicious electric charged uppercut to the opponent blowing him/her into pieces. (MKII, MKT)

Electrocution: Rayden grabs his opponent, holds him/her a few feet off the ground, and electrifies them until they explode. (MKII, MKT, MK4, MKG, MKA)


Yeah, Raiden can match Palpy move for move. So Palpy has a saber, so what? Raiden merely has to teleport AT WILL and attack from behind Palpy.


Another thing.....Raidens lightning attacks are on a whole different level than that of Palpy. Look, here, when he attacks Scorpion and Sub Zero:


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They are thrown across the room like rag dolls. I know, I know, Palpy hurled Mace Windu out a window, BUT Mace Windu was wounded and helpless, not to mention he was facing TWO Sith at the same time. That was like shooting fish in a barrel.

Not to mention the fact that Raiden did all this while teleporting, on the fly.

Originally posted by Robtard
I'm going off by what was said in the movie, force users have the ability to sense things before they happen, one of the reason why Anakin was able to pilot a pod, take it up with Lucas or Qui Gon Gin. Ergo, Palpatine would sense any attack Raiden did before it happened; since Raiden doesn't have super speed, I don't see how he could counter this.

Raiden is a god, but he is shown with limited powers, as he didn't defeat his opponents with god-like omnipotence. He seems to be a weather god with applicable weather powers. He may be immortal and be able to reform himself after Palpatine cuts him in two with saber or uses a force power to choke/crush him, but that is a win first for Palpatine. When Raiden had his powers, he most certainly DID defeat his opponents easily. He beat the piss outta his brother, remember?

You are forgetting that Raiden can take much more punishment than Palpy. He took a fireball (thats what I call it) Shao Khan shot at him and it didnt even faze him.

If they know about each others powers beforehand, Raiden is not gonna get close to Palpy until he gets that saber out of his hand. And, with his martial arts skills, it wouldn't be that hard.

Not sure how any of his physical attacks are going to counter a saber that would just cut through any punch or kick.

With Palpatine's precog, he would be ready to slice Rayden the moment he materialized from a teleport, be it from behind, front or side.

Face it, Rayden is outclassed despite his god status. He has never shown anything that could defeat a guy with Palpatine's abilities. Seems god doesn't equal omnipotence when it comes to him.

Originally posted by Robtard
Not sure how any of his physical attacks are going to counter a saber that would just cut through any punch or kick.

With Palpatine's precog, he would be ready to slice Rayden the moment he materialized from a teleport, be it from behind, front or side.

Face it, Rayden is outclassed despite his god status. He has never shown anything that could defeat a guy with Palpatine's abilities. Seems god doesn't equal omnipotence when it comes to him. Ypu didnt read a word I said, did you?

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Raiden kills Liu Kang in less than TWO SECONDS with one of his electric attacks here.....Liu Kang, mortal.....Palpy, mortal.

That's the game.

Still, Raiden wins.

Hey, others here have taken it upon themselves to go beyond the rules of the thread, I am following suit.

Really? Well if this is going to just turn into shit, Sideous in DE can teleport, and has lightning that rips up time itself and destroys multiple mile-long ships.

In addition, if you're using video games hen youalso acknowledge that video game Raiden's lightning moves slow as hell, so it's easily dodgable, especially to a man who as moving so fast that he was invisible. Sideous DE feats > Raiden even with his video game feats.

So... he still wins.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Really? Well if this is going to just turn into shit, Sideous in DE can teleport, and has lightning that rips up time itself and destroys multiple mile-long ships.

In addition, if you're using video games hen youalso acknowledge that video game Raiden's lightning moves slow as hell, so it's easily dodgable, especially to a man who as moving so fast that he was invisible. Sideous DE feats > Raiden even with his video game feats.

So... he still wins. link.

And by the way, here's Raiden canonically getting knocked the **** out by Taven, a mere "mortal" who is far weaker and slower then Palpatine. Plus he doesn't have the force.

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Which is still the Emperor, just in a weaker body, you idiot.

Now I understand why you were riding my coat tails in the other thread, clinging to my arguments. You don't actually know anything about Star Wars.

And your strawmanning again. Feel free to notice the video.

Here, I'll spell everything out for you. I'm used to holding your hand by now.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Palpatine#Palpatine_Reborn_.284.E2.80.9311_ABY.29

"But even death was not the end for Palpatine. Unlike his Sith predecessors, Palpatine had never intended to be replaced by an apprentice, expecting his Empire to rule the galaxy eternally, with only himself as its true leader. Unable to rediscover his Master's lost secret, Palpatine had to find a different way to cheat death... At an unknown point in time prior to his death at the Battle of Endor Palpatine had found a different way to cheat death by preserving his spirit after the death of his body, by the method of spirit transference. He arranged for a series of clones of himself to be created for his spirit to possess, in the event that he would perish... Unfortunately, the clones were heavily ravaged by the dark side and not sustained by the Force. Each body he took would age and deteriorate more quickly than the last. But the Dark Lord wasn't concerned; he had an endless supply of clones which he could use to rule the Empire."


The only "clone" part was the physical, empty vessel. The spirit, the mind, the abilities, the powers, the essense, is still the exact same original Palpatine. It's actually an even more inrecible fear for Palpatine, because the clone bodies themselves were weak and deteriating, so all of his power came from hs own spirit, not the bodies.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Which is still the Emperor, just in a weaker body, you idiot.

Now I understand why you were riding my coat tails in the other thread, clinging to my arguments. You don't actually know anything about Star Wars.

And your strawmanning again. Feel free to notice the video. It's not Palpy, plain and simple. Thats like comparing Jango Fett to Boba Fett.

I know nothing about SW, right. Keep on saying that, maybe you will actually believe it.


And Taven, a mortal?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taven_(Mortal_Kombat)

Hmmm.......What now? Gonna dig yourself a bit deeper?

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Here, I'll spell everything out for you. I'm used to holding your hand by now.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Palpatine#Palpatine_Reborn_.284.E2.80.9311_ABY.29

"But even death was not the end for Palpatine. Unlike his Sith predecessors, Palpatine had never intended to be replaced by an apprentice, expecting his Empire to rule the galaxy eternally, with only himself as its true leader. Unable to rediscover his Master's lost secret, Palpatine had to find a different way to cheat death... At an unknown point in time prior to his death at the Battle of Endor Palpatine had found a different way to cheat death by preserving his spirit after the death of his body, by the method of spirit transference. He arranged for a series of clones of himself to be created for his spirit to possess, in the event that he would perish... Unfortunately, the clones were heavily ravaged by the dark side and not sustained by the Force. Each body he took would age and deteriorate more quickly than the last. But the Dark Lord wasn't concerned; he had an endless supply of clones which he could use to rule the Empire."


The only "clone" part was the physical, empty vessel. The spirit, the mind, the abilities, the powers, the essense, is still the exact same original Palpatine. It's actually an even more inrecible fear for Palpatine, because the clone bodies themselves were weak and deteriating, so all of his power came from hs own spirit, not the bodies. Spin it any way you want, it's a CLONE, NOT PALPY. Try again.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
It's not Palpy, plain and simple. Thats like comparing Jango Fett to Boba Fett.

Yes it is. Learn to read. I know it's hard for you, but I even used small words in the above post, just so you can understand it. Don't pass over it, I'm sure you can do it if you try real hard.





And again, you fail. Where does it say he isn't a mortal? It says he is a half-god. That doesn't make him immortal. And look what it says in your own damn proof. Daegon, Taven's half-god brother, killed their parents, one of which was a full god and the other wasn't (Argus, Taven's father, was "the most poweerful God in Edneia." Yet he was killed. hm...). So... about that immortality thing? If the most powrful god int he entire realm was killed, obviously he wasn't immortal, and by that same token, Raiden who is the same type of god as Argus is also not immortal. So how is a half god immortal?




Why? Because you say so? Provide proof for why it's "not palpy" and maybe I'll care. All yoru doing right now is crying.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Yes it is. Learn to read. I know it's for you, but I even sued small words in the above post, just so you can understand it. Don't pass it over it, I'm sure you do it if you try real hard.Clone. Not Palpy. 2 plus 2 is 4, not 5. Any idiot could tell the difference.





Half God, you just said it. Hercules was half god, and his strength far surpassed that of a mortal. Immortal or not, he is HALF GOD, and therefore possesses strength far greater than a human.




Because....it's....a clone......

Is Jango Fett Boba Fett? Nope. It's not rocket science, you know.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Half God, you just said it. Hercules was half god, and his strength far surpassed that of a mortal. Immortal or not, he is HALF GOD, and therefore possesses strength far greater than a human.

Why even bring up strength? I never even said strength. You said that Taven was not a mortal, that he was a half-god. I said that being a half-god does not make him immortal because his father was a full god like Raiden, yet he was still killed. hence, he is not immortal, and neither is Raiden.

I see your point though, and it's wrong. Taven was a half-god, yes. But he was still not physically stronger then a human. He was hard pressed to beat Sonya Blade, Sektor, Kobra, etc. All of whom were not stronger then your usual humans in the mortal kombat-verse, and Palpatine would destroy all of those people without much effort.




Jango Fett are Boba Fett are also two entirely different people with different souls. Palpatine's clones aren't their own people., it's just the same palpatine but in a different body. He's basically a demon, hence the "spirit transfer technique". He posses people. There's a reason Wookipedia states that Palpatine is the same person even though he's in a different body.

So... I'm still looking for proof from you, since you made the claim. Again, actual proof would be nice, not just your reasonings and interpretations.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Why even bring up strength? I never even said strength. You said that Taven was not a mortal, that he was a half-god. I said that being a half-god does not make him immortal because his father was a full god like Raiden, yet he was still killed. hence, he is not immortal, and neither is Raiden.

I see your point though, and it's wrong. Taven was a half-god, yes. But he was still not physically stronger then a human. He was hard pressed to beat Sonya Blade, Sektor, Kobra, etc. All of whom were not stronger then your usual humans in the mortal kombat-verse, and Palpatine would destroy all of those people without much effort.




Jango Fett are Boba Fett are also two entirely different people with different souls. Palpatine's clones aren't their own people., it's just the same palpatine but in a different body. He's basically a demon, hence the "spirit transfer technique". He posses people. There's a reason Wookipedia states that Palpatine is the same person even though he's in a different body.

So... I'm still looking for proof from you, since you made the claim. Again, actual proof would be nice, not just your reasonings and interpretations.


Taven was hard pressed to beat Sonya Blade, Sektor, Kobra, etc., but knocked out Raiden....do you see the holes in your argument? If he knocked out a GOD, he should have no trouble beating a human.

And your word is all we have to go on as to his strength. Half God means more than human, less than a God, therefore far stronger than a human.


So first you totally break the rules of the thread, adding shit on as you go to suit your argument, and now you have resorted to Palpys CLONE.

Reach much?

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Taven was hard pressed to beat Sonya Blade, Sektor, Kobra, etc., but knocked out Raiden....do you see the holes in your argument? If he knocked out a GOD, he should have no trouble beating a human.

Or maybe gods just aren't as strong as you like to pretend they are. The "holes" in my argument don't matter, it's Mortal Kombat's story and if they want to show humans and half-gods being superior or on equal footing to gods, then that is there choice. As far as Mortal Kombat is cocnerned, yes, Raiden is not that much stronger then Sonya, Sektor, Kobra etc. Just goes to show that he isn't as powerful as you wish him to be. That's how the game makers wanted it to be like, that's how they did it. Deal with it.



No... half-god means one of your parents was a god and the other wasn't. That's it. A "God" is just a being with supernatural abilities. Super natural does not always equal super human.





Debatable. And you've been doing the same shit. Last I checked, it was you who first posted a video showing video game Raiden... so are you going to give me the "two wrongs make a right" speech RJ? "Well you were doing it so I did it too!!!!!!!"

Pathetic.



Hypocrite. Myself, Robtard, and even Bardock, who thinks Raiden would win, have caught you and called you out on doing so. Only difference is that the shit I'm adding is correct, and I know more about both Raiden and Palpatine then you ever will, since all you have to go on is wikipedia articles and youtube videos whereas I have actually beaten and own all of the Mortal Kombat games, as well as read all of the novels and comics that Palpatine is in, and seen the movies. Can't say the same for you though, buddy.



You mean Palpatine in just a different body, right? And you didn't post a counter argument so I guess you can't. Good. This thread is over then, Sideous wins.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Or maybe gods just aren't as strong as you like to pretend they are. The "holes" in my argument don't matter, it's Mortal Kombat's story and if they want to show humans and half-gods being superior or on equal footing to gods, then that is there choice. As far as Mortal Kombat is cocnerned, yes, Raiden is not that much stronger then Sonya, Sektor, Kobra etc. Just goes to show that he isn't as powerful as you wish him to be. That's how the game makers wanted it to be like, that's how they did it. Deal with it.So now you are speaking for the game makers? Tell me, how is Mr. Boon? You have trouble wrapping your mind around the idea of someone being a GOD, and what makes them a God.



Half God means super human strength. Name me one example of any fictional half god who could not easily beat a human.





I see, you started all the adding on shit, so I was supposed to just sit back and stick to Christopher Lamberts Raiden? You couldnt win the argument according to the thread rules, so you broke them. THAT is pathetic.



Mob mentality. Dude, I grew up on SW, I have read almost all the novels, but hey, if you wanna pump yourself up and THINK you pwn me in SW knowledge, go right ahead.



I mean it is not Palpy, it is a frigging clone, and the fact that your entire argument is based on Palpy in a CLONE body shows that you are grasping for straws.

I thought the idea is that Palpatine's "clones" are indeed him.

No. The game speaks for itself. The game depcits, in it's canon story mode, Taven being hard pressed to beat Sonya, Sektor, etc., yet still knocking Raiden out.

Ask Mr.Boon himself. he is the one who has shown Raiden to not be that much stronger then humans and half-gods, and what he shows and what is canon is law, even if it does not seem logical to you.




Prove it.



Taven.




Broke the rules according to you. Until Impediment himself comes in here and tells me that what I did was wrong, I don't care what your opinion of what the rules are is.



No. Just proof thast you're an idiot.



So did I. And I've read all the novels. *shrug*




No it doesn't.



Correct. RJ apparently does not understand this, though.

Originally posted by Bardock42
I thought the idea is that Palpatine's "clones" are indeed him.

From what Blax linked, they would be him. Being clones and having the original Palpatine's spirit in them would qualify.

They are him. What would be the point of Palpatine cloning himself if the clone wouldn't be him? His spirit left one body and inhabited the next, which was an exact physical reproduction of the very body he'd just left. That's the whole point of cloning himself. Anyone who doesn't understand that has no business arguing the merrits of this character, and is likely only doing it because their argument has failed them and backfired.

So we have gone from Palpy in the movies to Palpy resurrected in a clone? This is what happens when a thread starter sucks at making versus threads.

And to be fair, look at the first post. It says "The fave son of the dark side" and "Christopher Lamberts Raiden."....Anyone see the muck up?

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
So we have gone from Palpy in the movies to Palpy resurrected in a clone? This is what happens when a thread starter sucks at making versus threads.It's not the thread-creator's fault when some of the people who take it upon themselves to post have the reading comprehension of a dying bonobo. Blax has more than made his case, while you resort to idiocy and blatant hypocrisy - using a game clip of Raiden killing someone 'in two seconds' while simultaneously whining about this being the CL incarnation of the character.



You claim that Raiden is a master hand-to-hand combatant? Fine. Palpatine is noted as "a master of every weapon and every style" by Nick Gillard, and kills two of the Jedi Order's finest swordsmen with one move apiece, then proceeds to kill a third four seconds later while fending off one of the deadliest duelists in the saga's history.

You claim that Raiden's powers exceed those of Palpatine's? The Sith Lord's apprentice blew chunks out of a stone ceiling with his lightning and knocked a Jedi out for several straight minutes. Palpatine's lightning, when turned back upon him, melted his face. He then proceeded to blast the offender several dozen meters out a window.

Taking EU into account, Sidious absolutely obliterates Raiden. As of DE, the Sith is a god in all but name: his lightning wipes out battalion of armored soldiers and disintegrates individuals and chunks of metal, he can literally rip apart the fabric of space-time, his own personal power is such that he can impart fragments of it to lesser individuals and empower them to the point that they can stalemate four thousand-year old Jedi Masters in combat, and his speed-assisted lightsaber skills allow him to disarm a formidable swordsman (Luke Skywalker) in one move.

Your pathetic excuse for an argument hinges around two points:

One is the fact that Raiden is a god, when you can't even quantify what that means. Ares in God of War was a god who could hurl pillars across continents with enough accuracy to pin a single human to a wall and could grow to immense sizes. Kratos owned him. Raiden, on the other hand, is limited to flying at low speeds and firing lightning from his hands, and is never stated to be immune to bodily harm. Meanwhile, his (EU) opponent destroys entire starfleets and moves so fast he can only be sensed as waves of darkness in the Force.

The other is that, somehow, Palpatine is actually limited to his movie-incarnations, sans a lightsaber. The thread-creator only limited Raiden, in the sense that you can only draw on feats accomplished in the MK movie. He made no such point regarding Palpatine.

You've actually convinced me that the SWVF isn't home to the densest people at KMC, which is quite an accomplishment.

Originally posted by Faunus
It's not the thread-creator's fault when some of the people who take it upon themselves to post have the reading comprehension of a dying bonobo. Blax has more than made his case, while you resort to idiocy and blatant hypocrisy - using a game clip of Raiden killing someone 'in two seconds' while simultaneously whining about this being the CL incarnation of the character.



You claim that Raiden is a master hand-to-hand combatant? Fine. Palpatine is noted as "a master of every weapon and every style" by Nick Gillard, and kills two of the Jedi Order's finest swordsmen with one move apiece, then proceeds to kill a third four seconds later while fending off one of the deadliest duelists in the saga's history.

You claim that Raiden's powers exceed those of Palpatine's? The Sith Lord's apprentice blew chunks out of a stone ceiling with his lightning and knocked a Jedi out for several straight minutes. Palpatine's lightning, when turned back upon him, melted his face. He then proceeded to blast the offender several dozen meters out a window.

Taking EU into account, Sidious absolutely obliterates Raiden. As of DE, the Sith is a god in all but name: his lightning wipes out battalion of armored soldiers and disintegrates individuals and chunks of metal, he can literally rip apart the fabric of space-time, his own personal power is such that he can impart fragments of it to lesser individuals and empower them to the point that they can stalemate four thousand-year old Jedi Masters in combat, and his speed-assisted lightsaber skills allow him to disarm a formidable swordsman (Luke Skywalker) in one move.

Your pathetic excuse for an argument hinges around two points:

One is the fact that Raiden is a god, when you can't even quantify what that means. Ares in God of War was a god who could hurl pillars across continents with enough accuracy to pin a single human to a wall and could grow to immense sizes. Kratos owned him. Raiden, on the other hand, is limited to flying at low speeds and firing lightning from his hands, and is never stated to be immune to bodily harm. Meanwhile, his (EU) opponent destroys entire starfleets and moves so fast he can only be sensed as waves of darkness in the Force.

The other is that, somehow, Palpatine is actually limited to his movie-incarnations, sans a lightsaber. The thread-creator only limited Raiden, in the sense that you can only draw on feats accomplished in the MK movie. He made no such point regarding Palpatine.

You've actually convinced me that the SWVF isn't home to the densest people at KMC, which is quite an accomplishment.


You just said it:

The thread-creator only limited Raiden, in the sense that you can only draw on feats accomplished in the MK movie. He made no such point regarding Palpatine

Fair? I think not. Its up to the THREAD STARTER to state conditions of the fight, NOT us. When it is left up to us, it leads to stupid online fueds such as the one going on now.

I have never uttered a word to Blax before this, and for this to be our first online exchange, well, thats just not right.

Even movie Rayden has a chance of winning this, considering he can actually become a being of electricity (which is an application of electricity that Palpatine can't be said to be able to effectively attack or defend against), especially if we were to recognise a major limitation of the Force, in the sense that Palpatine can't sense or direct his powers against matter that isn't made up of Force energy (which Raiden and his powers, being separate from the SW setting, and thus not subject to its rules, aren't).

Snafu did not go into detail as to the conditions of this fight, this led to Blax and I having words.

If it wasn't he and I, it would have been someone else.

Well theres not much screen time for Raiden in just one movie... So its hard to judge.

You have to remember that MK is also a old and probably low-budget movie. That said, their abilities arent going to be too spectacular.

If games are taken into account, Raiden would utterly destroy Palpatine, no one can argue that one.

Let it be known that the Star Destroyers Palpatine curbstomps are equipped with shielding capable of resisting gigantons of damage.

Originally posted by Placidity
If games are taken into account, Raiden would utterly destroy Palpatine, no one can argue that one.

If the games are taken into account, then EU could be taken into account, and it suddenly wouldn't mean much.