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Both fight each other at thier peaks and, its a competition of the force vs dark magic.

1) no saber, no wand
2) all out

who takes it

Can Voldermort even use magic without his wand?

Palpatine at his peak would likely be in RotJ, in which case he dominates Voldemort with or without a lightsaber.

No wand? crylaugh

Palpatine at his peak can create Wormholes which destroy fleets, drain whole planets, and other shit I prolly forgot. Also, Palpatine is faster. Palpatine with a gesture can use Force Crush to kill Voldemort, but Voldemort can one shot Palpatine with Avada Kedavra, so it is hard to say. Whoever does what first wins.

But Voldy needs a wand for that, yes?

I don't think so actually.

Just like Palpatine doesn't need a saber for his greatest powers.

I actually just asked someone who is into Harry Potter, like REALLY into it, and they said we never are told what powers Voldy has without a wand.

Fanboys vs Fanboys

Well someone told me he could do it without the wand, Idk really.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
I don't think so actually.

Just like Palpatine doesn't need a saber for his greatest powers.Uh, they're not really comparable. A lightsaber is a sword - he doesn't need to kill things with his mind. The movie Voldemort, to my knowledge, requires a wand to do anything truly notable, and he certainly can't use his deadly spells without it.

Looks like some research is in order. haermm

Well someone told me Voldemort doesn't need it, but I really do not know.

In the Harry Potter universe, wizards need their wands to use magic.

Period.

Palpatine would kill Voldemort without his wand.


Now, were he to have his wand............

Googling now.

Even with the wand, like I said it depends on who can do what first.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_in_Harry_Potter

just to clarify i saw in the movies that without a want voldemort had been possessing people, could he not do this to palp?
as he did to prof quail and potter?

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_in_Harry_Potter

I ain't readin' all that shit. no2

Originally posted by Man of Christ
just to clarify i saw in the movies that without a want voldemort had been possessing people, could he not do this to palp?
as he did to prof quail and potter? Possess Palpatine? The very thought of that confuses and angers me.

Quail...Was a bumbling idiot. Potter actually expelled him, Palpatine can as well.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Possess Palpatine? The very thought of that confuses and angers me.

Quail...Was a bumbling idiot. Potter actually expelled him, Palpatine can as well. You are confused, while me, I am crylaugh

If Voldy needs his wands to focus his magic powers and cast a successful magic spell, he needs his wand.

Palpy doesn't need a wand. He'll burn Voldy's ass with Force Lightning.

Is Evada Kedavra focused magic?

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Is Evada Kedavra focused magic?

It has to be, since it is the deadliest magic spell. In my opinion.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Is Evada Kedavra focused magic? Of course it is. It is the single strongest spell against a living thing in HP.

Force Lightning? Bah, why not use a Force Storm and such Voldemort in a wormhole?

well if it is focused magic he needs a wand.

Lightning to tha face.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Potter actually expelled him, Palpatine can as well.

Voldemort got the **** out of him because Harry is a beacon of love. He loves, is loved, and is full of sugar, spice, and everything nice. Palpatine's as much of a douche as Voldemort is, so I doubt that that particular defense will be available to him.

Voldemort's AK will own Palpatine, but Palpatine can also break Voldemort's wand and do all sorts of nasty shit to him. Then again, Voldemort can teleport.

Voldeport?

I think having a scenario where both of the combatants are without their primary weapon is just batshit stupid.

Of course, I think offering to different scenarios is stupid anyway, it inevitably gets confusing.

Originally posted by Gideon
Voldemort got the **** out of him because Harry is a beacon of love. He loves, is loved, and is full of sugar, spice, and everything nice. Palpatine's as much of a douche as Voldemort is, so I doubt that that particular defense will be available to him.

Voldemort's AK will own Palpatine, but Palpatine can also break Voldemort's wand and do all sorts of nasty shit to him. Then again, Voldemort can teleport. True, but Palpatine is also much stronger in the mental area than Potter, and has mind powers as well like dominate mind(t3h mindtrick). I think his mind, will, and TP is strong enough to resist Voldemort.

Of course, Avada Kedavra would own Goddamn near anyone short of an immortal, but can he use it before Palpatine could Force Crush his ribcage, or some other bullshit way? Since Voldemort has no power over the force, he would be defenseless against it.

This is only the Movie Palpatine against the Movie Voldemort at there peaks isn't it?

And since movie palpatine has showed no defense against magic he is just as powerless against magic as Voldemort is against the force however I would say that Voldemort has a advance against the movie version, Voldemort can with a swing of his ward force palpatine to the ground (ore was it in the book (Book Number 4) he did that to harry?) and then Blast him, what is important for Voldemort is to either take out palpatine quickly ore get a protego spell up and running.

I believe you're confusing the Imperius Curse and actual possession, both of which Voldemort is capable of. Harry resisted both attacks, one due to intense force of will and the other due to his innate ability to love, something Voldemort is incapable of and something that repulses him. Palpatine most certainly can resist the Imperius Curse, and I would say that he could do so in a much easier and effortless fashion than Potter. But I highly doubt even his considerable willpower would be enough to stop actual possession by Voldemort. However, if this were Return of the Jedi-era Palpatine, he has learned the "transfer and control of souls" technique that enabled him to survive the second Death Star's destruction and kill Imperial engineer Bevel Lemelisk (the designer of the first Death Star) and then subsequently transfer his spirit into a clone recepticle. Point being, if this is OT-era Palpatine, he could very well take control of Voldemort's spirit.





The problem is that this isn't a clear cut fight. Voldemort, in the fifth Harry Potter movie, demonstrated a capacity for destruction that is easily on par with Palpatine's own. Consider their similar duels; Voldemort versus Dumbledore and Palpatine versus Yoda. Both were in an arena-esque environment and both involved manipulating the environment. Palpatine and Yoda demonstrate strength, speed, and reflexes well beyond Dumbledore or Voldemort. In sheer telekinesis, Palpatine and Yoda were capable of handling automobile sized Senate pods without difficulty (and both defied the law of physics and gravity when doing so), which is well beyond the telekinesis that Voldemort and Dumbledore exhibited. The problem is that Voldemort demonstrated the ability to apparate (to teleport) which would nullify long term speed advantages held by Palpatine; if Palpatine charges, Voldemort can just vanish. He can't compensate for the disparity in reflexes, however, and Palpatine remains quicker than Voldemort -- but outright speed will do him no good. Likewise, Voldemort's powers are from a magical basis; while Palpatine's mastery of the Force allows him a considerable arsenal, it cannot compete with the range and versatility of outright magic. Voldemort has a curse that, if it connects with Palpatine, will kill him. Of course, one could make the argument that if that happens, Palpatine can just possess Voldemort's body.

Concluding: Voldemort has a far greater range than Palpatine's telekinesis, Force lightning, and metaphysical attacks; he is capable of teleportation, which nullifies Palpatine's long term speed advantages and will allow room for the element of surprise; and he demonstrates raw power on par with Palpatine's in the Force, demonstrated in his environmentally destructive fight with Dumbledore. On the other hand, Palpatine's superior physical speed, strength, agility, and reflexes would allow him to dodge the Avada Kedavra curse handily; his superb and (as far as the movies are concerned) peerless precognition aren't infallible, but would likely allow him to detect where Voldemort might turn up, since this is a combat situation (Palpatine's precognition has only failed him in meditation, not combat); he is a cunning and clever fighter who manipulates the environment akin to Voldemort and does so on a destructive scale.

It could go either way. But Voldemort can only win by throwing everything and the kitchen sink at Palpatine and teleporting like a mynock out of hell. Attempting to possess Palpatine will be doomed to failure, and Palpatine is just as capable of throwing the environment at him as well.

Originally posted by Gideon
The problem is that this isn't a clear cut fight. Voldemort, in the fifth Harry Potter movie, demonstrated a capacity for destruction that is easily on par with Palpatine's own. Consider their similar duels; Voldemort versus Dumbledore and Palpatine versus Yoda. Both were in an arena-esque environment and both involved manipulating the environment. Palpatine and Yoda demonstrate strength, speed, and reflexes well beyond Dumbledore or Voldemort. In sheer telekinesis, Palpatine and Yoda were capable of handling automobile sized Senate pods without difficulty (and both defied the law of physics and gravity when doing so), which is well beyond the telekinesis that Voldemort and Dumbledore exhibited. The problem is that Voldemort demonstrated the ability to apparate (to teleport) which would nullify long term speed advantages held by Palpatine; if Palpatine charges, Voldemort can just vanish. He can't compensate for the disparity in reflexes, however, and Palpatine remains quicker than Voldemort -- but outright speed will do him no good. Likewise, Voldemort's powers are from a magical basis; while Palpatine's mastery of the Force allows him a considerable arsenal, it cannot compete with the range and versatility of outright magic. Voldemort has a curse that, if it connects with Palpatine, will kill him. Of course, one could make the argument that if that happens, Palpatine can just possess Voldemort's body.

Concluding: Voldemort has a far greater range than Palpatine's telekinesis, Force lightning, and metaphysical attacks; he is capable of teleportation, which nullifies Palpatine's long term speed advantages and will allow room for the element of surprise; and he demonstrates raw power on par with Palpatine's in the Force, demonstrated in his environmentally destructive fight with Dumbledore. On the other hand, Palpatine's superior physical speed, strength, agility, and reflexes would allow him to dodge the Avada Kedavra curse handily; his superb and (as far as the movies are concerned) peerless precognition aren't infallible, but would likely allow him to detect where Voldemort might turn up, since this is a combat situation (Palpatine's precognition has only failed him in meditation, not combat); he is a cunning and clever fighter who manipulates the environment akin to Voldemort and does so on a destructive scale.

It could go either way. But Voldemort can only win by throwing everything and the kitchen sink at Palpatine and teleporting like a mynock out of hell. Attempting to possess Palpatine will be doomed to failure, and Palpatine is just as capable of throwing the environment at him as well.

I agree entirely with the majority of this post, I also agree that it will be very close indeed however,

I must admit Gideon that I find the scenario where Voldemorts get possessed by Palpatine just as unlikely as I find Voldemort possessing Palpatine (if they works in the same manner which I isn't sure of)

As I see it Voldemort has a greater arsenal then Palpatine has, but that's based on the spells in the books.

Also he most likely dodge the Avada Kedavra agreed but can he dodge the Dolor spell that requires nothing except Voldemort pointing his staff towards Palpatine...

I assumed when it was said "both at their peaks", that the absolute strongest canon version of each character was to be used, which would be DE Palpatine.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
I assumed when it was said "both at their peaks", that the absolute strongest canon version of each character was to be used, which would be DE Palpatine.

no sir, as this is the movie versus forum so im using them at thier peaks in films.

Originally posted by Strangelove
I think having a scenario where both of the combatants are without their primary weapon is just batshit stupid.

Of course, I think offering to different scenarios is stupid anyway, it inevitably gets confusing.

its merely to test all areas for a fuller perspective

Question to all: in Harry Potter OTP (order of the Phoenix)

voldemort conjures a fire dragon and shoots it at dumbledore in thier duel, if he did this do palpatine, how could palpatine respond?

If Palpatine gives wizardman a blast of Force Lightning to tha face, how would wizardman respond?

If Palpatine force crushes wizardman's neck in a second, how would wizardman respond? Oh wait, he couldn't.

If we're going by movie versions, it seems like its a matter of who strikes first. However, Palps is alot more agile and could possibly evade some attacks.

He certainly couldn't overpower or withstand it, but -- unlike Dumbledore -- Palpatine can use the Force to enhance his physical attributes well beyond human norm. He could probably run around or evade it, since he is (according to the novel) attributed the relative speed of "blur" to the most powerful Jedi Knight ever (Anakin Skywalker).

...well techinically palpatine doesnt have a way to kill voldemort seeing as he has all of his horcruxes

Originally posted by DestinyGuy678
...well techinically palpatine doesnt have a way to kill voldemort seeing as he has all of his horcruxes

Technically, Palpatine can survive death as well, as he did after RotJ.

Originally posted by Gideon
Technically, Palpatine can survive death as well, as he did after RotJ. he survived that? what happened after his fight with vader?

From my point of view, Palpatine has no way to survive death as it hasn't been shown in the movie (and we are only using the movie version if I understand correctly) that he can transport his soul and cheat death in the EU is, i don't know, maybe not of so much use here, Voldemort however we know has the Horcruxes because a entire movie eventually will be made about Harry looking after them...

Originally posted by Utrigita
From my point of view, Palpatine has no way to survive death as it hasn't been shown in the movie (and we are only using the movie version if I understand correctly) that he can transport his soul and cheat death in the EU is, i don't know, maybe not of so much use here, Voldemort however we know has the Horcruxes because a entire movie eventually will be made about Harry looking after them...

Since his spirit fled Endor immediately afterwards, there would be no reason for the movie to show all. The ability to cheat death was something that Palpatine learned during the OT. If you want to get technical, no movie has yet to display Voldemort with his horcruxes, so perhaps we should eliminate those as well?

Originally posted by Gideon
Since his spirit fled Endor immediately afterwards, there would be no reason for the movie to show all. The ability to cheat death was something that Palpatine learned during the OT. If you want to get technical, no movie has yet to display Voldemort with his horcruxes, so perhaps we should eliminate those as well?

I know Gideon,

But it isn't showed in the movie, which is my point (getting technical), Voldemort has been shown in the first movie (when Quirrell was killed, Voldemorts spirit survived) to cheat death.

Not quiet the movie will show the Horcruxes that we know as a fact will be the case, will the movies concerning Star Wars ever show that Palpatine cheated death? Most likely not.

Did the thread starter specify Palpantine from the movies only?

Originally posted by Man of Christ
no sir, as this is the movie versus forum so im using them at thier peaks in films.



its merely to test all areas for a fuller perspective

Question to all: in Harry Potter OTP (order of the Phoenix)

voldemort conjures a fire dragon and shoots it at dumbledore in thier duel, if he did this do palpatine, how could palpatine respond?

If I'm not mistaking it was man of christ that made this thread.

Didnt see that. In that case, the whole thing about Palpy cheating death doesnt play.

Again, if it is the time period during the movies, Palpatine's ability to transcend death does apply.

Originally posted by Gideon
Again, if it is the time period during the movies, Palpatine's ability to transcend death does apply.

As im sure there are many opinions out there here is my ruling:

The cheating death thing does not apply

Reasons:

this is the movie versus forum and the whole "cheat death" thing is contingent upon comic book knowlege and we are not using the comics as a point of refrence.
basically the only reason people use the "cheat death" thing is because of comic book knowlege.

if the comic did not exist then people wouldnt use the cheat death concept, so while some may consider it cannon, i am consiering it immaterial, and irrelevant for this thread because it is EU matterial and has nothing to do with the movie.

Then this thread is spite since one person in it can't be beaten and this thread should be closed.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Then this thread is spite since one person in it can't be beaten and this thread should be closed.

palpatine is not defenseless, ever heard of force choke?
if voldemort cant utter the spell because he's choking????


there are advantages on both sides

Originally posted by Gideon
Again, if it is the time period during the movies, Palpatine's ability to transcend death does apply. How so? It is not stated in the movies that he can cheat death, therefore it is not applicable here.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
How so? It is not stated in the movies that he can cheat death, therefore it is not applicable here.

And it hasn't been stated in any Harry Potter movie that Voldemort can cheat death, either. If we're going to apply these fights to JUST WHAT WE SEE IN THE MOVIE (and not something we can infer that they have), neither of them possess that power.

Originally posted by Gideon
And it hasn't been stated in any Harry Potter movie that Voldemort can cheat death, either. If we're going to apply these fights to JUST WHAT WE SEE IN THE MOVIE (and not something we can infer that they have), neither of them possess that power.

Originally posted by Gideon
And it hasn't been stated in any Harry Potter movie that Voldemort can cheat death, either. If we're going to apply these fights to JUST WHAT WE SEE IN THE MOVIE (and not something we can infer that they have), neither of them possess that power.

We just see him survive death in the first film.

Originally posted by Utrigita
We just see him survive death in the first film.

Damn. Touche.

Originally posted by Utrigita
We just see him survive death in the first film. So if Voldemort dies, he will be given the time in this thread to come back to life over a 14 year period and then pwn Sidious to become the winner?

Sorry what? I just stated that we saw him survive death, when Quirrel died, Voldemort that was bound to him was killed too but survived.

Originally posted by Gideon
Since his spirit fled Endor immediately afterwards, there would be no reason for the movie to show all. The ability to cheat death was something that Palpatine learned during the OT. If you want to get technical, no movie has yet to display Voldemort with his horcruxes, so perhaps we should eliminate those as well?

EU is non-canon so says GL.

Originally posted by Gideon
And it hasn't been stated in any Harry Potter movie that Voldemort can cheat death, either. If we're going to apply these fights to JUST WHAT WE SEE IN THE MOVIE (and not something we can infer that they have), neither of them possess that power.

Originally posted by Utrigita
We just see him survive death in the first film.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Sorry what? I just stated that we saw him survive death, when Quirrel died, Voldemort that was bound to him was killed too but survived. And then what? Will t3h super 1337 face spirit pwn Palpatine?

the super what? haermm

Lets compare the feats shall we:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Gnjyp0nSqc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Gnjyp0nSqc

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Lets compare the feats shall we:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Gnjyp0nSqc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Gnjyp0nSqc That's not comparing feats.

How is it not?

The videos do not compare them. That is something you have to do by watching them. It would be comparing Voldy's magical feats to Palpatine's force and physical feats.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
How is it not?

The videos do not compare them. That is something you have to do by watching them. It would be comparing Voldy's magical feats to Palpatine's force and physical feats. No, I mean you posted the same video, twice.

haermm

Originally posted by Bardock42
No, I mean you posted the same video, twice.

Oh i guess i forgot to press copy for one of them.

By bad.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6UABZA9ZpA

Originally posted by jinXed by JaNx
Can Voldermort even use magic without his wand?

Yes but he can't use nearly as many spells but he can still use telekenisis telepathy and use shields and that thing he did in HPOTP when he shot the magical dark stuff at dumbledore and repulse it he can apparate create those tentacles he did in the last battle against harry deflect other projectiles with his hand so he has a well placed arsenal without his wand but he can't use the more we'll know spells like avada kedavra so he can't go up against sidious head to head but deflect everything sidious throws against and do a good counter as well
So it won't be as flashy but it is still not going to be a curb stomp for sidious I believe with his wand voldemort would triumph but without his wand he won't be able to do the spells he is used to doing but could make new ones so I believe it might be a tie or voldemort wins but narrowly

Originally posted by jinXed by JaNx
Can Voldermort even use magic without his wand?

Yes but he can't use nearly as many spells but he can still use telekenisis telepathy and use shields and that thing he did in HPOTP when he shot the magical dark stuff at dumbledore and repulse it he can apparate create those tentacles he did in the last battle against harry deflect other projectiles with his hand so he has a well placed arsenal without his wand but he can't use the more we'll know spells like avada kedavra so he can't go up against sidious head to head but deflect everything sidious throws against and do a good counter as well
So it won't be as flashy but it is still not going to be a curb stomp for sidious I believe with his wand voldemort would triumph but without his wand he won't be able to do the spells he is used to doing but could make new ones so I believe it might be a tie or voldemort wins but narrowly

Nice thread and an easy win for the Sith.

Palpatine is simply much better. He speedblitzes Voldemort and than fries him with lightning.

Palpaatine and Windu can fight so fast Anakin can't physically see them, only sense their force presence or some shite, Anakin being capable of matching Obi-Wan

Voldemort gets speedblitzed, hard