Race of 5D imps VS The Beyonders

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occultdestroyer
Who wins?



PS: Please don't spam or troll. Thanks.

CaptainStoic
This seems more like a battle of wills, and until someone can prove that they wouldn't be going back and forth, making and unmaking reality, this fight should be a stalemate.

Utrigita
I'm leaning towards the Beyonders.

Astner
If a Cosmic Cube had the potential to wipe out and recreate the Omniverse when the restrictions were lifted. And the Beyonders are the makers of the Cubes.
I'd go with the Beyonders--however they haven't appeared on panel yet.

Utrigita
No but a scan of there dimension have been shown I believe.

fangirl101
5-D imps have the power to create cube like beings. batmite anyone? And Batmite actuallys shows his power. Potenial means nil when it hasn't happened.

Nestical
beyonders ftw

Erik-Lensherr
no expression

Utrigita
Originally posted by fangirl101
5-D imps have the power to create cube like beings. batmite anyone? And Batmite actuallys shows his power. Potenial means nil when it hasn't happened.

Just like Molecule Man has showed his power? He is a cosmic cube that possesse just a fraction of what the Beyonders does.

A single Cosmic Cube merged the 616 reality and another reality then it merged one with the previous two and then it merged a fourth with the other three, nearly causing the Marvel Omniverse to collapse, and it was the very same cosmic cube that undid all the damage done. (It was in the Chaos Engine.)

Mephisto compared a newly crafted CCU to the infinite gems (seperate ore connected I am not aware of).

And again they are just a fraction.

EDIT: Just remembered Thanos used a Single CCU to take control over the entire 616 reality.

fangirl101
Originally posted by Utrigita
Just like Molecule Man has showed his power? He is a cosmic cube that possesse just a fraction of what the Beyonders does.

A single Cosmic Cube merged the 616 reality and another reality then it merged one with the previous two and then it merged a fourth with the other three, nearly causing the Marvel Omniverse to collapse, and it was the very same cosmic cube that undid all the damage done. (It was in the Chaos Engine.)

Mephisto compared a newly crafted CCU to the infinite gems (seperate ore connected I am not aware of).

And again they are just a fraction.

EDIT: Just remembered Thanos used a Single CCU to take control over the entire 616 reality.
All of that is fine. But "potential" for omniversal destruction and remaking is what I was referring to.

Utrigita
Why? Have the IMP's ever done that?

The a single Cube have almost collapsed the entire omniverse and then rebuilt it. It was in Chaos engine sorry if my formulation doesn't say that very clearly.

guy222
Beyonders

King Kandy
Originally posted by fangirl101
All of that is fine. But "potential" for omniversal destruction and remaking is what I was referring to.
There's no talk about "potential." The CC has actually collapsed the omniverse.

quanchi112
Does this include the true Beyonders as well?

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Astner
If a Cosmic Cube had the potential to wipe out and recreate the Omniverse when the restrictions were lifted. And the Beyonders are the makers of the Cubes.
I'd go with the Beyonders--however they haven't appeared on panel yet.

Creators aren't necessarily as great or greater than their creations.

Scientists and engineers can make weapons of mass destruction for example.

It was a group of human scientists that created Adam Warlock.

Nothing substantial has been revealed about the Beyonders to my knowledge.

I cant see how they can feature in any versus match.

Knowsbleed33
Beyonders

Mr Master
Originally posted by GalacticStorm

Creators aren't necessarily as great or greater than their creations.

Scientists and engineers can make weapons of mass destruction for example.

It was a group of human scientists that created Adam Warlock.
To be fair, first reason doesn't really relate though to the comics,
in terms of what Human beings are,
and ... what the BeyonderS are,

Human beings aren't using their own life-force/energies to create w.o.m.d's,
their using outside sources like machines,
to harness energy from other sources themselves.

While in the case of the BeyonderS, (mind you, it's fiction)
it's energy from their own Universe, that seeps into an adjacent Universe that they created,
which opens a tiny rift roughly every 32 years according to Doom,
basically,
if you can figure the geographical locations, time and what have you,
and the means to capture the energy, you get yourself a CCU:

http://s2d2.turboimagehost.com/t/567933_k3.jpg

................................................................................


In fact, the LT calls the BeyonderS the "Infinite" and goes on to basically say,
that "a minute bit of their energy" is what makes up a Cosmic Cube's energy/power.

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/7901/b3bi8.th.jpg

................................................................................


A Cosmic Cube's power doesn't increase with time,
like Kubik said, he's "limited by his omnipotence", (funny, how that's possible)
cause that's all he is, a piece of infinite energy allowed to manifest sentience,
while Human beings can grow further, (again, funny, how that's possible)

http://s2d2.turboimagehost.com/t/567898_K1.jpg http://s2d2.turboimagehost.com/t/567899_k2.jpg

................................................................................


This is why Owen Reece has surpassed the Cube being's plateau,
and is now far beyond a Cube being himself,
although he "theoretically" has an equal amount of energy as other Cube beings,
Owen's "potential" for growth because he was a Human being first,
is far greater than that of the others because of said reasons.

http://s2d2.turboimagehost.com/t/568014_K4.jpg
http://s2d2.turboimagehost.com/t/568015_k5.jpg

This is all Post-retcon btw.
after he merged with Post-retcon Beyonder that is,
which is still canon, the whole Inhuman/Mutant deal turned out to be a farce,
also,
2008 bios of Shaper of Worlds references Owen
and Beyonder still as part of the Cosmic Cube ordeal,
which is good,
cause I wasn't feeling the new ret-con
that seemed to be another once again jammed into Beyonder's timeline.


I'd say the Enclave scientist that bred Warlock
fall into the same category as the example above,
that can't be compared to what the Beyonder are,
and how they create Cosmic Cubes.
Originally posted by GalacticStorm

Nothing substantial has been revealed about the Beyonders to my knowledge.

I cant see how they can feature in any versus match.
I agree. thumb up The BeyonderS' full power can't be accurately judged,
but where ever it is, it's ridiculously high,
cause indeed,
we have at-least that "minute bit of energy" to have a slight idea,
of just how much more powerful the BeyonderS must be,
IMO, up there in that top 5, that's more than 5, it's tight!
if after all, said fraction can have so much influence across basically all of Marvel.

Galan007
Originally posted by Utrigita
The a single Cube have almost collapsed the entire omniverse and then rebuilt it. It was in Chaos engine sorry if my formulation doesn't say that very clearly. i have my doubts on that story's canonicity, personally.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Galan007

i have my doubts on that story's canonicity, personally.
It's canon brother G.

(2006 CCU Handbook bio)


http://s2d2.turboimagehost.com/t/568430_CCU1.jpg
http://s2d2.turboimagehost.com/t/568431_CCU2.jpg

Galan007
^^

by bad, that's not the arc i was referring to. i was talking about that x-o manowar crossover.

Utrigita
I will crawl straight to the cross and say that I have absolutely no idea, just thought it was Canon.

Galan007
Originally posted by Utrigita
I will crawl straight to the cross and say that I have absolutely no idea, just thought it was Canon. i've never seen it mentioned anywhere else, personally.

but if you do think that crossover is 100% canonical, then you must also believe that iron man and x-o manowar were able to restore the multiverse (and much more) to it's previous state with the cc. yes, IRON MAN AND X-O MANOWAR..... REWEAVE THE FABRIC OF CREATION. none

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Mr Master
To be fair, first reason doesn't really relate though to the comics,
in terms of what Human beings are,
and ... what the BeyonderS are,

Human beings aren't using their own life-force/energies to create w.o.m.d's,
their using outside sources like machines,
to harness energy from other sources themselves.

While in the case of the BeyonderS, (mind you, it's fiction)
it's energy from their own Universe

http://s2d2.turboimagehost.com/t/567933_k3.jpg

This doesn't make any sense. You've said but humans aren't using their own life force/energies to create weapons of mass destruction and yet you've gone on to say that the energy that is utilised by the Cubes comes not directly from the Beyonders but from their universe.

In that case, my point stands and if anything it is bolstered.

You try to save yourself by saying that its their universe that they created that the energy derives from. Can you show me where that was revealed to the comic buying public?

As it stands the Cubes are just the experiments of the Beyonders utilising energy from their native dimension. I'm fine with being wrong, thats totally cool, i'd just like you to show me where its supposedly stated that the C Cubes power comes directly from the Beyonders as opposed to their home dimension.




Originally posted by Mr Master
In fact, the LT calls the BeyonderS the "Infinite" and goes on to basically say,
that "a minute bit of their energy" is what makes up a Cosmic Cube's energy/power.

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/7901/b3bi8.th.jpg


Not true at all.

LT states that the powers of the infinite were placed in mortal hands, he then further clarifies this stating "by allowing minute bits of energy from the universe of the Beyonders to slip through"

His explaination is that the Cosmic Cube experiments were made possible by energy from the universe of the Beyonders. He doesn't tell us at any point that the power is inherent to the Beyonders. That is your assumption. Plausible but not at any point confirmed as fact.




Originally posted by Mr Master
A Cosmic Cube's power doesn't increase with time,
like Kubik said, he's "limited by his omnipotence", (funny, how that's possible)
cause that's all he is, a piece of infinite energy allowed to manifest sentience,
while Human beings can grow further, (again, funny, how that's possible)

http://s2d2.turboimagehost.com/t/567898_K1.jpg http://s2d2.turboimagehost.com/t/567899_k2.jpg

................................................................................


Whats this about? Has no relevance to what i said. Not being difficult, you just appear to have gone off on a tangent.





Originally posted by Mr Master
I'd say the Enclave scientist that bred Warlock
fall into the same category as the example above,
that can't be compared to what the Beyonder are,
and how they create Cosmic Cubes.

Of course it can. Its simple. A creator isnt necessarily as great as or greater than its creations. Until you find some proof that the Cubes were powered by energies inherent to the Beyonders as opposed to them using the power of their universe, then you can't really use the Cubes as proof of how cosmically powerful they are.



Originally posted by Mr Master
I agree. thumb up The BeyonderS' full power can't be accurately judged,


Cool.

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