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On a barren planet.

The planet is destroyed and the Destroyer hurls Cain into the sun for a bitter bfr.

destroyer

Which version of Juggernaut? And who's wearing the Asgardian Destroyer?

Destroyer

Destroyer through BFR only.
And that's if he's smart enough.

Originally posted by h1a8
Destroyer through BFR only.
And that's if he's smart enough.


Destroyer.

The destroyer stood up to 12 celestials. for a limited time. I dont see any version of juggernaut doing that. Even glactus is weary of the celestials.

Originally posted by zeel
Destroyer.

The destroyer stood up to 12 celestials. for a limited time. I dont see any version of juggernaut doing that. Even glactus is weary of the celestials.

That Destroyer was powered by most if not all of the skyfathers and over 2000 ft tall.
It is of no comparison here. Also it is known that the Destroyer isn't even scratching Juggs. It only wins through BFR.

Powered by all of the Asgardians save Thor

Originally posted by h1a8
That Destroyer was powered by most if not all of the skyfathers and over 2000 ft tall.
It is of no comparison here. Also it is known that the Destroyer isn't even scratching Juggs. It only wins through BFR.

my apologies for quoting from marvel.com but...



The destroyer has a LOT of different weapons- it isn't just a tank, and it's fast as hell when it wants to be. Juggernaut is extremely slow in comparison, isn't as maneuverable (no flight, and didnt spiderman get him stuck in concrete for weeks?) and DOES feel pain.

Remember classic juggs was beaten senseless and KOed by Nimrod. the destroyer would have a field day with him. I mean, matter manipulation? juggs would find himself stuck in a block of adamantium faster than he could think.

Destroyer 10/10, even without the BFR.

Originally posted by guy222
Powered by all of the Asgardians save Thor

I think the destroyer's beam is stronger than Cyttorak's incantation.

What do you think?

Originally posted by Space M ummy
my apologies for quoting from marvel.com but...



The destroyer has a LOT of different weapons- it isn't just a tank, and it's fast as hell when it wants to be. Juggernaut is extremely slow in comparison, isn't as maneuverable (no flight, and didnt spiderman get him stuck in concrete for weeks?) and DOES feel pain.

Remember classic juggs was beaten senseless and KOed by Nimrod. the destroyer would have a field day with him. I mean, matter manipulation? juggs would find himself stuck in a block of adamantium faster than he could think.

Destroyer 10/10, even without the BFR.

It is PIS for anyone to beat Juggs senseless let alone harm him physically. PIS isn't allowed here. And it is a no no to use low feats when there are contradiction high ones.

And making Juggs stuck is BFR.
Also matter manipulation doesn't mean that one can turn air into adamantium. It would take a large portion of the Earth's atmosphere to become just 1lb of adamantium. And energy cannot be created nor destroyed. A penny has the energy to blow up a state (or several states). That means that one would need the energy of a super megaton bomb just to create a mass of a penny. Also just because someone can manipulate matter doesn't mean that they can do it absolutely. For example, me turning hydrogen to helium doesn't mean I can turn hydrogen to Iron.

Destroyer is not even putting a scratch on Cain. The disintegrating beam will just tickle him.

Originally posted by llagrok
I think the destroyer's beam is stronger than Cyttorak's incantation.

What do you think?

Hell no! The godblast couldn't even put a microscopic scratch on Juggs.
And that godblast can easily bust Uru metal too.

AD. Juggs gets his head in his helmet handed to him

Originally posted by hulkcpbifiussjf
AD. Juggs gets his head in his helmet handed to him

Impossible

Originally posted by h1a8
Hell no! The godblast couldn't even put a microscopic scratch on Juggs.
And that godblast can easily bust Uru metal too.

Never seen it do that, only seen the hammer be destroyed because it was overloaded when Thor used it inside Exitar.

Stalemate.

Destroyer

Originally posted by llagrok
I think the destroyer's beam is stronger than Cyttorak's incantation.

What do you think?

Odin's greatest creation>Juggernaut

Originally posted by guy222
Destroyer

You are sure guy? I to be frank haven't seen a feat from the Destroyer that would argue that it's above the power of Cyttoraks blessing... But any information to the contrary is welcome

Originally posted by guy222
Odin's greatest creation>Juggernaut

True. And that is why it wins.
Through BFR.

Asgardian Destroyer ftw

Do we know how strong Cyttorak is in comparison to the Asgardians?

Originally posted by h1a8
Also matter manipulation doesn't mean that one can turn air into adamantium. It would take a large portion of the Earth's atmosphere to become just 1lb of adamantium. And energy cannot be created nor destroyed. A penny has the energy to blow up a state (or several states). That means that one would need the energy of a super megaton bomb just to create a mass of a penny. Also just because someone can manipulate matter doesn't mean that they can do it absolutely. For example, me turning hydrogen to helium doesn't mean I can turn hydrogen to Iron.

Aren't you the one who said that magic needs no explanation? So what's with all of this??

Destroyer = Magical Armor powered by Magical means and performing magical feats... helllooooo!

A better argument would have been to request feats wherein the destroyer showed the level of matter manipulation that allows it to create a material like adamantium.

Destroyer wins

I don't think the Disintegrator Beam would overpower Cyttorak's enchantment...I do think he'd physically go through Juggs pretty easily, though. So, Destroyer FTW.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
Remember classic juggs was beaten senseless and KOed by Nimrod. the destroyer would have a field day with him. I mean, matter manipulation? juggs would find himself stuck in a block of adamantium faster than he could think.

Destroyer 10/10, even without the BFR.

Juggernaut was not beaten senseless by Nimrod. NR used high frequency sonics on him that disoriented him, not KO him. And this was after NR was able to get his helmet off.

Destroyer FTW 10/10

the destroyer hasnt show the physical strength to remove juggernaut any more than juggernaut has shown to be able to remove the destroyer. that could go 50/50

the only wave of magical energy that has affected juggernaut was thors godblast. it stopped his forward momentum. but thats it. in theory the destroyer could do the same (assuming his dissentigration beam has magical properties to it, instead of just being physical). even if it did "disentigrate" juggernaut, it doesnt mean he wouldnt instantly heal or reform after the attack. the destroyer has NO on panel showings to assume it could turn anything into adamantium and encase juggernaut.

the only way either of them is going to win is by simply putting the highest showing of one vs the other.

win for the destroyer: 2000ft tall version that stood against the celestials vs normal rampaging juggernaut

win for juggernaut: 2000ft tall version that literally smashed reality. (he probably wasnt 2000 ft tall, but he was big lol) vs 1 entity controling the destroyer.

juggs,but not by much

Originally posted by KillAll
the destroyer hasnt show the physical strength to remove juggernaut any more than juggernaut has shown to be able to remove the destroyer. that could go 50/50

the only wave of magical energy that has affected juggernaut was thors godblast. it stopped his forward momentum. but thats it. in theory the destroyer could do the same (assuming his dissentigration beam has magical properties to it, instead of just being physical). even if it did "disentigrate" juggernaut, it doesnt mean he wouldnt instantly heal or reform after the attack. the destroyer has NO on panel showings to assume it could turn anything into adamantium and encase juggernaut.

the only way either of them is going to win is by simply putting the highest showing of one vs the other.

win for the destroyer: 2000ft tall version that stood against the celestials vs normal rampaging juggernaut

win for juggernaut: 2000ft tall version that literally smashed reality. (he probably wasnt 2000 ft tall, but he was big lol) vs 1 entity controling the destroyer.
I think it depends on the entity. The evil spirit boosted Juggernaut pretty high but I'm sure an Odin powered Destroyer, which may or may not be this one, would be quite a force to be reckoned with.

Originally posted by Doctor-Alvis
I think it depends on the entity. The evil spirit boosted Juggernaut pretty high but I'm sure an Odin powered Destroyer, which may or may not be this one, would be quite a force to be reckoned with.


the evil spirt controlled the juggernaut power. it did not boost it. no on panel evidence to suggst that.

Originally posted by Ptr_Grifin
Juggernaut was not beaten senseless by Nimrod. NR used high frequency sonics on him that disoriented him, not KO him. And this was after NR was able to get his helmet off.

The helmet has been taken off before numerous times due to Juggernaut's magical weakness.

Longshot's knives weakened the seals, allowing rogue to pull it off. the explanation was that longshot was from a dimension of magic + science, and juggs has a magical vulnerability.

Thunderstrike using the bloodaxe took it off in one hit.

Sort of related: shatterstar managed to go through whatever force fields juggs has and made him bleed for the exact same reason longshot did. "my swords were forged in a dimension of magic and science." Clearly not PIS here, this happened three separate times with three separate characters.

The destroyer, as a magical weapon/entity outclasses all three of those cases by an order of magnitude. That helmet may as well not even be there. A few quick strikes and those seals are F-I-N-I-S-H-E-D.

and to the genius who said "no enough matter to turn air into adamantium blah blah etc" the destroyer is a walking magical condiut. It can channel sufficient raw magical energies (presumably from wherever odin gets it from) to shatter mjolnir out of thin air, which if you want to use scientific rules, it could easily convert to whatever matter it chooses at it's leisure without creating or destroying anything.

nice try though.

Juggs is beaten to a pulp 10/10.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
The helmet has been taken off before numerous times due to Juggernaut's magical weakness.

Longshot's knives weakened the seals, allowing rogue to pull it off. the explanation was that longshot was from a dimension of magic + science, and juggs has a magical vulnerability.

Thunderstrike using the bloodaxe took it off in one hit.

Sort of related: shatterstar managed to go through whatever force fields juggs has and made him bleed for the exact same reason longshot did. "my swords were forged in a dimension of magic and science." Clearly not PIS here, this happened three separate times with three separate characters.

The destroyer, as a magical weapon/entity outclasses all three of those cases by an order of magnitude. That helmet may as well not even be there. A few quick strikes and those seals are F-I-N-I-S-H-E-D.

and to the genius who said "no enough matter to turn air into adamantium blah blah etc" the destroyer is a walking magical condiut. It can channel sufficient raw magical energies (presumably from wherever odin gets it from) to shatter mjolnir out of thin air, which if you want to use scientific rules, it could easily convert to whatever matter it chooses at it's leisure without creating or destroying anything.

nice try though.

Juggs is beaten to a pulp 10/10.
Juggs does have a weakness to magic...but he did get burnt to nothing but bones from some magic guy and still came back and beat him down just with his skeleton

Originally posted by LDHZenkai
Juggs does have a weakness to magic...but he did get burnt to nothing but bones from some magic guy and still came back and beat him down just with his skeleton

that fight was a little odd since it was outside of our dimension, in the realm of dreams or something. (D'spayre? Nightmare? one of the two.)
I'm not entirely convinced had that happened in 616 that juggs could survive something like that. interesting he was also still wearing his helmet (?) when that happened.

mid level psionics (classic psylocke, for instance) have KO'ed him but demons who control their own realms can't? ok...

Age Of Apocalypse Juggernaut (who had the same origins, but an alternate timeline) was killed by a brain aneurysm. I'm willing to bet jugg's true durability is somewhere in between. If you can shatter enchanted uru, you can PROBABLY shatter jugg's skull just as easily sans helmet.

and remember, a defeat is just a KO/incapacitation. If juggs heals later after being KTFO, it's still a loss.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
that fight was a little odd since it was outside of our dimension, in the realm of dreams or something. (D'spayre? Nightmare? one of the two.)
I'm not entirely convinced had that happened in 616 that juggs could survive something like that. interesting he was also still wearing his helmet (?) when that happened.

mid level psionics (classic psylocke, for instance) have KO'ed him but demons who control their own realms can't? ok...

Age Of Apocalypse Juggernaut (who had the same origins, but an alternate timeline) was killed by a brain aneurysm. I'm willing to bet jugg's true durability is somewhere in between. If you can shatter enchanted uru, you can PROBABLY shatter jugg's skull just as easily sans helmet.

and remember, a defeat is just a KO/incapacitation. If juggs heals later after being KTFO, it's still a loss.
Yea but even getting burnt to a crisp like that didn't knock juggs out. And thors hammers made out of uru right? It had no effect on him what so ever. But i think it just depends on if Odin is more Powerful than Cyttorak. At least when it comes to imbuing things with durability

classic thor could not take out the destroyer, on top of that it would shitstomp him whenever they fought.

classic thor has figured out how to end a stalemate with classic juggs by de-powering him (magic negating vortex), then beating him around seemingly to a potential juggy loss. note, thor still had his 60 limit back then, without that he would have ko'd juggs imo

however, the dread destroyer has no limits to it's ability to block juggernaut's magic with a field, and it's strength/durability is greater than thor's.

even though it's ABC, a common denominator (thor) is useful in this instance.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
that fight was a little odd since it was outside of our dimension, in the realm of dreams or something. (D'spayre? Nightmare? one of the two.)
I'm not entirely convinced had that happened in 616 that juggs could survive something like that. interesting he was also still wearing his helmet (?) when that happened.

mid level psionics (classic psylocke, for instance) have KO'ed him but demons who control their own realms can't? ok...

Age Of Apocalypse Juggernaut (who had the same origins, but an alternate timeline) was killed by a brain aneurysm. I'm willing to bet jugg's true durability is somewhere in between. If you can shatter enchanted uru, you can PROBABLY shatter jugg's skull just as easily sans helmet.

and remember, a defeat is just a KO/incapacitation. If juggs heals later after being KTFO, it's still a loss.

It was D'Spayre

Originally posted by KillAll
the evil spirt controlled the juggernaut power. it did not boost it. no on panel evidence to suggst that.
I think him growing into a giant and breaking through dimensional barriers with his fist is plenty of evidence.

Originally posted by LDHZenkai
Do we know how strong Cyttorak is in comparison to the Asgardians?

How are any of the Asgardians relevant?

Originally posted by guy222
Odin's greatest creation>Juggernaut

Guy is right on the money.

Nothing Juggs could do to the Destroyer. I think either Destroyer overpowers the enchantment of Cyttorak, or Juggs bfr's himself since he knows he can't win.

Destroyer FTW.

Juggernaut likely gets disintegrated

D'spayre disentigrated juggernaut with his own magic or mostly dissolved him. when he regained his magic (his magic was missing which is why he was able to be harmed) he reformed instantly.


your average every day destroyer cant do anything to juggernaut. any more than he can to the destroyer.

it would take some extreme circumstances for either to win

as for the disentigration beam, it didnt even disentigrate thor, let alone juggernaut...

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Aren't you the one who said that magic needs no explanation? So what's with all of this??

Destroyer = Magical Armor powered by Magical means and performing magical feats... helllooooo!

A better argument would have been to request feats wherein the destroyer showed the level of matter manipulation that allows it to create a material like adamantium.
This is before I thought about it. But you are right.

Let us get the facts straight before we come to any conclusions.
Name some feats that suggest that Destroyer's beams will do damage to Juggs.

Now name some high feats that possibly show that Juggs can resist the Destroyer's beams.

For the latter I can name Thor resisting the D beam for a small moment and Juggs durability>>> Thor's. And I can name Juggs resisting Thor's godblast. I'd say Godblast is roughly equal to the disintegrator beam.

the destroyer is far stronger than classic thor was, and juggernaut was about equal with thor when they fought. so the dread destroyer will be the offensive aggressor the entire time, after juggy opens his big mouth about his secret weakness like always, it's only a matter of time before the destroyer erects a magical field surrounding him that negates his magical sustenance. then it's curtains for a de-powered juggernaut.

and the destroyer's magic makes the soul animating it more aggressive, it won't hold back from doing anything to kill juggernaut at any time. so a disintegrator shot is almost assured if juggernaut lasts long enough. without his magic, a d-shot will cut through him like butter.

it will play out almost exactly like the nimrod/juggernaut fight, just this time it will cost juggernaut his life.

Originally posted by h1a8
Let us get the facts straight before we come to any conclusions.
I laughed at you trying to get facts straight.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
the destroyer is far stronger than classic thor was, and juggernaut was about equal with thor when they fought.

when was thor ever able to match juggernauts strength? oh you mean the time when juggernaut CASUALLY back handed thor and hurtled him across the sky? oh, oh now i see it.


Originally posted by psycho gundam
so the dread destroyer will be the offensive aggressor the entire time, after juggy opens his big mouth about his secret weakness like always, it's only a matter of time before the destroyer erects a magical field surrounding him that negates his magical sustenance. then it's curtains for a de-powered juggernaut.


if the destroyer cuts off the power, it is no longer fighting "the juggernaut". and its been seen that a juggernaut usually always exists. so if it leaves cain somebody else will become the juggernaut... in which case the destroyer didnt stop "the juggernaut".







Originally posted by psycho gundam
and the destroyer's magic makes the soul animating it more aggressive, it won't hold back from doing anything to kill juggernaut at any time. so a disintegrator shot is almost assured if juggernaut lasts long enough. without his magic, a d-shot will cut through him like butter.




actually what you are describing is the juggernaut also. the magic that animates the human makes them more agressive also, and they dont hold back. the magic affects cain differently however... he is just evil himself. the beam will not hurt juggernaut . nothing on panel suggest otherwise. it leans heavily the opposite way in fact. almost nothing in comic-dom has hurt him but all of the sudden because you said so it will? i doubt it.


Originally posted by psycho gundam
it will play out almost exactly like the nimrod/juggernaut fight, just this time it will cost juggernaut his life.


so now not only is the destroyer magically sophisticated, but technologically sophisticated too?? and whats to stop juggernaut from permanently turning on his shield??? it has NEVER been penetrated. by anything.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
the destroyer is far stronger than classic thor was, and juggernaut was about equal with thor when they fought. so the dread destroyer will be the offensive aggressor the entire time, after juggy opens his big mouth about his secret weakness like always, it's only a matter of time before the destroyer erects a magical field surrounding him that negates his magical sustenance. then it's curtains for a de-powered juggernaut.

and the destroyer's magic makes the soul animating it more aggressive, it won't hold back from doing anything to kill juggernaut at any time. so a disintegrator shot is almost assured if juggernaut lasts long enough. without his magic, a d-shot will cut through him like butter.

it will play out almost exactly like the nimrod/juggernaut fight, just this time it will cost juggernaut his life.

I disagree that destroyer is far stronger than classic thor (or stronger at all). The only way to say who is stronger is when one overpowers another when grappling or by better feats. It is foolish to go by who gets knocked around more to prove who is the stronger. Because if we didn't know any better we will think Spidey is stronger than Iron man just by their fights.

Also if destroyer isn't said nor shown to negate Juggs enchantment then he can't.

Juggs is not vulnerable to magic. He is vulnerable to certain magic. Just like the only radiation that Superman is vulnerable to is krytonite radiation.

Originally posted by h1a8
Juggs is not vulnerable to magic. He is vulnerable to certain magic. Where did you get that?

Originally posted by Mindset
Where did you get that? Mathematical equations

Of course.

Originally posted by Mindset
Where did you get that?

Most magical attacks are shown to do nothing to Juggs. The Godblast is just one example. Other magical attacks are shown to affect Juggs.

Originally posted by h1a8
Most magical attacks are shown to do nothing to Juggs. The Godblast is just one example. Other magical attacks are shown to affect Juggs. Wasn't the godblast blocked by his FF?

Originally posted by Mindset
Where did you get that?


well considering that almost everything dr. strange threw at juggernaut he litterally walked through. or that thors godblast couldnt affect him. or that d'spayre took most of the juggernauts magic and still couldnt stop him... or that the blood axe which put a large chasm in the earth didnt affect him in the slightest...

its safe to say that juggernaut has atleast some magical protection. if not about from most types.

Yea what the guy above me said.

Originally posted by KillAll
when was thor ever able to match juggernauts strength? classic levels of the both of them were pretty much deadlocked in strength. juggernaut actually believed that stealing thor's hammer would give him the advantage against him.

Originally posted by KillAll
if the destroyer cuts off the power, it is no longer fighting "the juggernaut". and its been seen that a juggernaut usually always exists. so if it leaves cain somebody else will become the juggernaut... in which case the destroyer didnt stop "the juggernaut". .... wrong and irrelevant

Originally posted by KillAll
actually what you are describing is the juggernaut also. the magic that animates the human makes them more agressive also, and they dont hold back. the magic affects cain differently however... he is just evil himself. the beam will not hurt juggernaut . nothing on panel suggest otherwise. it leans heavily the opposite way in fact. almost nothing in comic-dom has hurt him but all of the sudden because you said so it will? i doubt it. wrong and irrelevant

Originally posted by KillAll
so now not only is the destroyer magically sophisticated, but technologically sophisticated too?? and whats to stop juggernaut from permanently turning on his shield??? it has NEVER been penetrated. by anything. he can turn his shield on anytime he wants, and keep it up for that matter. the thing is, a magical barrier can negate that feature. simple as that.

Yea what the guy above me said.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
classic levels of the both of them were pretty much deadlocked in strength. juggernaut actually believed that stealing thor's hammer would give him the advantage against him.

.... wrong and irrelevant

wrong and irrelevant

he can turn his shield on anytime he wants, and keep it up for that matter. the thing is, a magical barrier can negate that feature. simple as that.

When did Cain ever try to steal Mjolnir? Cain always shrugged blows from that hammer off with a smile. Mjolnir has never hurt him out of the three times they fought.

he tried to lift it and quickly found out that his soul was full of fail.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
he tried to lift it and quickly found out that his soul was full of fail.

Doesn't mean he saw it as the way to beat him. He owned it with him during their first fight by riding it back into his face.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
he tried to lift it and quickly found out that his soul was full of fail.
I honestly don't even even know why he would think he would be able to lift it

Originally posted by jalek moye
I honestly don't even even know why he would think he would be able to lift it

Cain more than likely didn't know about the enchantment on it.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Cain more than likely didn't know about the enchantment on it.
hmm i always figured he could like sense when objects are magical or somthing.

Originally posted by jalek moye
hmm i always figured he could like sense when objects are magical or somthing.

Not that I know of. I know he can sense when and who the telepath is who is messing with him. If he can sense magical objects then that doesn't mean he can sense the exact properties and what it does.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Doesn't mean he saw it as the way to beat him. He owned it with him during their first fight by riding it back into his face. i hate scanning by the way.

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/5740/28857733.jpg

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/8696/61962082.jpg

Originally posted by psycho gundam
classic levels of the both of them were pretty much deadlocked in strength. juggernaut actually believed that stealing thor's hammer would give him the advantage against him.

.... wrong and irrelevant

wrong and irrelevant

he can turn his shield on anytime he wants, and keep it up for that matter. the thing is, a magical barrier can negate that feature. simple as that.


just curious, why is it any more relevant when you stated it about the destroyer? and actually, both are fact on panel for the juggernaut also.


has the destroyer or anybody been shown to be able to negate juggernauts power really? dr strange stated he couldnt separate the bonds between cain and the magic. i doubt the destroyer could fair any better.

thor did it once, but for 30 seconds. to which juggernaut instantly healed when he got his magic back.

IF you cut the power off completely you have a normal man. and the power would go to somebody else. this was rescently revealed in excaliber. which is one of the reasons why cains power was diminishing.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
i hate scanning by the way.

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/5740/28857733.jpg

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/8696/61962082.jpg

Thats when his invulnerability was tied into his FF. Notice how he said F' it, I don't need it to beat you after he realized he couldn't. See how Cain is relying on his FF to protect him from a punch? The writer thought that was why he is invulnerable.

Originally posted by KillAll


IF you cut the power off completely you have a normal man. and the power would go to somebody else. this was rescently revealed in excaliber. which is one of the reasons why cains power was diminishing.

Cain's power was diminishing because he was using it for good. If Thor really did cut him off from all of his powers then Cain would've instantly turned into an old man.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Cain's power was diminishing because he was using it for good. If Thor really did cut him off from all of his powers then Cain would've instantly turned into an old man.



that and because cyttorak wanted a new avatar. somewhere else to stick the magic lol...

and of coarse he didnt cut off all his power. just alot of it. he obviously still had some strength. enough to still put thor on his butt (another reason to assume juggernaut is still stronger, without a portion of his magic, he is still able to withstand thors barage of punchs and put thor down).

juggernaut claimed that his strength was easily thor's equal, that can be translated to when being at his lowest, it's the same as thor possesses (according to him (he gloats a lot), but obviously NOT by much as seen throughout the fight.

the destroyer tools thor when they fought, only one (classic thor) thor got a sick combo on him and quickly bfr'd him. without bfr the destroyer would have mauled him again. thor and juggy are around the same strength so imo the dread destroyer would beat him down just the same.

and thor only had to ditch the vortex due to his reliance on mjolnir to keep him thor, the destroyer doesn't have to worry about reverting to a mortal after 60 seconds, he would keep beating him till there was nothing left.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
juggernaut claimed that his strength was easily thor's equal, that can be translated to when being at his lowest, it's the same as thor possesses (according to him (he gloats a lot), but obviously NOT by much as seen throughout the fight.

the destroyer tools thor when they fought, only one (classic thor) thor got a sick combo on him and quickly bfr'd him. without bfr the destroyer would have mauled him again. thor and juggy are around the same strength so imo the dread destroyer would beat him down just the same.

and thor only had to ditch the vortex due to his reliance on mjolnir to keep him thor, the destroyer doesn't have to worry about reverting to a mortal after 60 seconds, he would keep beating him till there was nothing left.
Thor #411 and 412 thor get beat down with ease by Juggernaut. Juggernaut knocks him out, then takes the full power of thors god blast (which at that time was powerful enough to drive galactus back), and isn't effected in the slightest. They had to BFR juggernaut because Thor + The New Warriors were getting beat down with the ease. So i think writing that he was thors equal in strength was just an accident. Of course Thors strenght has varied greatly so who knows... ::shrugs::

that was 8th day juggy iirc.

thor was trying to stop juggernaut while he was compelled to power the god engine.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
that was 8th day juggy iirc.

thor was trying to stop juggernaut while he was compelled to power the god engine.

You're mistaken. Thor fought 8th Day Juggernaut in Thor v2 #17. It's been mentioned by two writers that those at Marvel say Juggernaut is able to increase his strength.

anyone have a scan of that?

Originally posted by LDHZenkai
Thor #411 and 412 thor get beat down with ease by Juggernaut. Juggernaut knocks him out, then takes the full power of thors god blast (which at that time was powerful enough to drive galactus back), and isn't effected in the slightest. They had to BFR juggernaut because Thor + The New Warriors were getting beat down with the ease. So i think writing that he was thors equal in strength was just an accident. Of course Thors strenght has varied greatly so who knows... ::shrugs::

Thor was afflicted by a weakness at the time. By his showings on that fight (him barely being able to lift the train car Jugz threw at him), his strength was diminished by a LOT. God blast would have also been much weaker as the God blast IS linked to his life force.

no, when thor fired the god blast he stated that his strength had returned, or that the illness had left his limbs (as in it was now gone). dont remember. so his god blast wouldnt have been weakened.


there is nothing to state that juggernauts power was altered in 8th day either. he looked completely normal. he just acted different.

anybody got a scan of destroyer stopping magical abilities from being recieved??? if so i'd like to see it. until then i dont think it has shown the ability to stop cain from recieving the juggernaut power.

Originally posted by LDHZenkai
Thor #411 and 412 thor get beat down with ease by Juggernaut. Juggernaut knocks him out, then takes the full power of thors god blast (which at that time was powerful enough to drive galactus back), and isn't effected in the slightest. They had to BFR juggernaut because Thor + The New Warriors were getting beat down with the ease. So i think writing that he was thors equal in strength was just an accident. Of course Thors strenght has varied greatly so who knows... ::shrugs:: Thor was weakened in that New Warriors fight. True story.

Destroyer 6/10. He has exotic abilities as well, not just forceblasts and stuff.

Juggs has nothing the Destroyer and the Destroyer hasn't proven he can hurt Juggs (or has he?)