DE Sidious vs. ROTS Dooku, Darth Sion, and Darth Bane

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Mizukage Yoda
Let the match begin...I have no comments on this fight

Enyalus
Heh. How far apart do they start?

DarkSerpent
In sabers 10/10 for the team. Sion can get the sabers stuck in his body while the others hack sidious to bits. If Bane has his Orbalisk, then this is spite for sabers.

The force-No idea

Allout- If the team charges and makes it to Sids in time, its ownage.
If not, don't know.
Lightning shouldn't be much of a problem for Sion as he can resurrect atleast a couple times before loosing concentration or something.

Mizukage Yoda
Lets say the Genosian arena as the setting they start 20 meters from each other

Enyalus
That's about 65 feet apart from each other, which I don't think would be enough to safely shield Sidious from his own Force Storm.

I would give the team the win in all three areas.

SIDIOUS 66
I don't really know. Everyone keeps harping about how hard it would be to kill Sion. I think it was even harder to kill Sidious due to the fact that he was able to keep his spirit intact in the physical world, and was able to possess other bodies.

As far as a physical battle they might beat Sdious, but there are other ways Sidious can win.

Faunus
All this is is a physical battle. It's not a long, drawn-out conflict that takes place over an extended period of time.

SIDIOUS 66
I meant what if Sidious was able to possess on of their bodies.

Enyalus
He would have to die first. Thus, they would win. He can't do astral projection.

SIDIOUS 66
So you are saying that if they killed him together, and then he possessed Bane's body, and then proceeded to take out Sion and Dooku, that he would be the looser, because they physically beat him?

Mizukage Yoda
Ok I'd hate to interfere hear, but what you are saying simply does not add up to me. I don't think Sids can just possess any random individual I believe the one he possesses must have a weak mind: Unborn child, clone. If he could just possess anyone he'd possess Luke and call it a day.

Enyalus
Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
I don't think Sids can just possess any random individual I believe the one he possesses must have a weak mind: Unborn child, clone. If he could just possess anyone he'd possess Luke and call it a day.

This is true. He expressly asks Luke's permission.

"Let me offer you a bargin, my friend...I will kill you now...or you can permit me to move into your body. Then you and I will rule the universe...as one."

SIDIOUS 66
I don't think it had anything to do with how strong one's mind was. Padme had a strong mind, so do you think it would be impossible for him to possess her body. I think it had something to with how powerful the force was with that person. According to the dark empire source book it says he was able to possess other bodies, but said nothing about how strong the mind had to be. His ariginal plan was to wait for Leia's baby to grow up and then possess his body. Im sure Anakin Solo would of had a very strong mind by the time he was grown him being a Skywalker. He wanted Luke as his apprentice, so he did not want to take Luke's body.

SIDIOUS 66
Originally posted by Enyalus
This is true. He expressly asks Luke's permission.

"Let me offer you a bargin, my friend...I will kill you now...or you can permit me to move into your body. Then you and I will rule the universe...as one."

Here is more quotes:

" Surely you know that if you strike me down, in anger, i will live again!.... Perhaps i will even live as you"!

" Indeed, i can enter anyone.... I can overshadow the soul that dwells therein".

" At the appropriate age i will displace the personality that dwells within... Take on its young jedi body as my own"!

SIDIOUS 66
Do you think if Sidious did enter Bane's body that Bane's spirit would overshadow Sidious's?

Enyalus
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Here is more quotes:

" Surely you know that if you strike me down, in anger, i will live again!.... Perhaps i will even live as you"!

" Indeed, i can enter anyone.... I can overshadow the soul that dwells therein".

" At the appropriate age i will displace the personality that dwells within... Take on its young jedi body as my own"!

Yes, but when push came to shove, he had to ask permission - indicating that the above lines were mostly bravado.

I think that Bane has an incredibly powerful mind and will. I don't think he could enter Bane's body nor take it over. Besides that, Sidious would have to live in constant pain (orbalisks) - as he does already. I don't think that would be a desirable upgrade.

SIDIOUS 66
Not a desirable upgrade, but better than being dead. I don't think Bane's spirit is as powerful as Sidious's.

Enyalus
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Not a desirable upgrade, but better than being dead. I don't think Bane's spirit is as powerful as Sidious's.

Although I wish I could disagree, I don't think I can. But then again, I think Sidious' spirit is stronger than a fetus version of Anakin Solo, or Leia Solo, but he couldn't enter them, either.

SIDIOUS 66
Originally posted by Enyalus
Although I wish I could disagree, I don't think I can. But then again, I think Sidious' spirit is stronger than a fetus version of Anakin Solo, or Leia Solo, but he couldn't enter them, either.

Well there are two reasons why he couldn't enter Anakin's body. One was because Brand(don't remember how to spell his first name) got in the way, and the other was because Leia used the light side to protect Anakin.

Enyalus
I'm talking about Dark Empire. Not it's sequels. Fetus version of Anakin.

SIDIOUS 66
Originally posted by Enyalus
I'm talking about Dark Empire. Not it's sequels. Fetus version of Anakin.

Because he really did not have to at the time. He had plenty of clones to possess. Plus he wanted to wait until Anakin got older.

Enyalus
That's why he attempts to touch Leia's stomach and gets zapped?

Schwarzenegger
Originally posted by Enyalus
That's about 65 feet apart from each other, which I don't think would be enough to safely shield Sidious from his own Force Storm.

I would give the team the win in all three areas. Not really, the DE audio book stated he was about to unleash a second storm in the eclipse to kill luke and leia before he got cut off. The storm he was going to create however is much smaller than what he did to the rebel fleet.

Enyalus
No way to gauge how powerful that might have been...

Schwarzenegger
Its already been described to be able "rip a planets surface apart", a lesser force storm would do lesser damage.

Enyalus
Originally posted by Schwarzenegger
Its already been described to be able "rip a planets surface apart", a lesser force storm would do lesser damage.

Captain Obvious, anyone? stick out tongue

Enyalus
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
I don't think it had anything to do with how strong one's mind was.
I just wanted to bump this in order to congratulate myself and say that Dynasty of Evil validates me. big grin

Hewhoknowsall
(Assuming that Bane gets his orbalisks in this case)

Sabers: Spite. Bane alone would pose a threat; add in these two and it isn't really a contest. Bane and Sion are pretty much immune to damage and Dooku is no slouch either.

Force: Virtual spite in the other direction. Sidious Force lightning's them.

All out: I'd go for the team if they're smart and blitz Sidious and try and get into a lightsaber duel.

truejedi
Sion cannot be killed. That'd be annoying for Sidious.

ares834
True. But what exactly does Sion's immortality entail? Palpatine coul chop Sion into little pieces, sure he may still be "alive" but he can't do any thing either.

Hewhoknowsall
Originally posted by truejedi
Sion cannot be killed. That'd be annoying for Sidious.

Like what ares834 said, what if someone, say, decapitates Sion? How is Sion going to survive that?

Nephthys
Just plop it back on?

Hewhoknowsall
Originally posted by Nephthys
Just plop it back on?

What if you hold on to the head?

Nephthys
Fight Dooku and Bane while holding a human head? That seems unwise.

Hewhoknowsall
Originally posted by Nephthys
Fight Dooku and Bane while holding a human head? That seems unwise.

But if Sion's head (and, thus, his brain) isn't attached to his body then not only will Sion technically die in a matter of moments, how will he move when his nervous system is not functional?

Nephthys
Until we have further details about his technique I'm assuming that he'd just survive as a head, animated and kept alive by the Force. That ancient Sith did so for ages. He can use the Force to move himself or just put his head back on with it.

Enyalus
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
But if Sion's head (and, thus, his brain) isn't attached to his body then not only will Sion technically die in a matter of moments, how will he move when his nervous system is not functional?
facepalm

Holy shit, man.

Galan007
The parenthesized "and, thus, his brain" comment literally made me lol.

I love you HWKA! he

Enyalus
It's like asking, "But if a Jedi's weapon is all the way across the room (and, thus, not upon his person), how will the Jedi be able to move it?"

Hewhoknowsall
Originally posted by Enyalus
It's like asking, "But if a Jedi's weapon is all the way across the room (and, thus, not upon his person), how will the Jedi be able to move it?"

If there were a way to test it, I might be willing to bet you a few dollars that you wouldn't have posted this if you hadn't read some other posts that were negative against me and decided to join the bandwagon (cause that's what a lot of people do, hence why Stalin stayed in power in the USSR for so long, and why people thought that the world was flat for so long). I'm also 99% or so sure that you wouldn't have posted this if, say, Galan007 said this. Am I right?

With all due respect, your analogy is flawed. You're basically claiming that someone can reattach a head with the same ease that one with Force powers can grab a weapon across a room.

Nephthys
Yeah, his analogy is wrong. no expression

Galan007
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
If there were a way to test it, I might be willing to bet you a few dollars that you wouldn't have posted this if you hadn't read some other posts that were negative against me and decided to join the bandwagon (cause that's what a lot of people do, hence why Stalin stayed in power in the USSR for so long, and why people thought that the world was flat for so long). I'm also 99% or so sure that you wouldn't have posted this if, say, Galan007 said this. Am I right?

With all due respect, your analogy is flawed. You're basically claiming that someone can reattach a head with the same ease that one with Force powers can grab a weapon across a room. Name dropper. uhuh

Enyalus
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
If there were a way to test it, I might be willing to bet you a few dollars that you wouldn't have posted this if you hadn't read some other posts that were negative against me and decided to join the bandwagon
Well, I don't know about joining any bandwagons, but I'll grant you you're probably right in this case. For what its worth, I apologize for any prejudices I've already picked up.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
I'm also 99% or so sure that you wouldn't have posted this if, say, Galan007 said this. Am I right?
Galan wouldn't have said that. Reason coming below....

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
With all due respect, your analogy is flawed. You're basically claiming that someone can reattach a head with the same ease that one with Force powers can grab a weapon across a room.
Have you played KOTOR II or read its Campaign Guide? If so, you would have understood that that is Sion's niche. He has been "killed" many times. But he's immortal. His hate allows him to keep his body together, no matter how many times he is struck down.

"Inevitably, probability has its day and Sion is struck down. Yet death does not come for Darth Sion, and each centimeter of his failing body comes alive with anguish, multiplying that infinitely distant point of pain one thousandfold until his brain threatens to collapse. Improbably, Sion gets up. And as he locks eyes with his attacker, Sion lets all of his anger for being killed - all the hatred clotting his heart - explode.

Sion finds that keeping his decomposing flesh tethered together with dark side energy is inexplicably painful, and requires endless concentration on the rage that festers inside him - but immortality is immortality Sion embarks on a Jedi-assassination spree, "dying" many more times, but always ending more enemy lives."

Galan's probably already read that or other similar literature on Sion and so would be well enough informed as to never suggest what you did...Sion keeps his body held together with hatred and dark side energies. Yes, he can reattach his head without a problem.

mattatom
That or when the blade passes through his neck, the flesh just reforms around it, rather than reattaching.

Letum Lettow
He's a super zombie with a fetish for women with "Broken Home/Family" issues.

Enyalus
Originally posted by Letum Lettow
He's a super zombie with a fetish for women with "Broken Home/Family" issues.
You mean there are other kinds of women?

Letum Lettow
Originally posted by Enyalus
You mean there are other kinds of women? shifty

Indeed.

Hewhoknowsall
Originally posted by Enyalus

Well, I don't know about joining any bandwagons, but I'll grant you you're probably right in this case. For what its worth, I apologize for any prejudices I've already picked up.



Well, you're willing to admit it, which counts for something.



Which dodges my question.



But what if he's decapitated?



1. This isn't conclusive evidence that Sion could survive a decapitation.
2. Your analogy claimed that Sion could reattach his head with similar ease in which a Jedi can get his lightsaber from across a room. However, your quotes (in addition to failing to prove that Sion can reattach his head) disprove this, as they describe that it is super painful for Sion.

Gideon
The fact that Sion died is proof (to me) that Sion can die.

ares834
He only dies when he wanted to die.
no expression

Shoes
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
(Assuming that Bane gets his orbalisks in this case)

Sabers: Spite. Bane alone would pose a threat; add in these two and it isn't really a contest. Bane and Sion are pretty much immune to damage and Dooku is no slouch either.

Force: Virtual spite in the other direction. Sidious Force lightning's them.

All out: I'd go for the team if they're smart and blitz Sidious and try and get into a lightsaber duel.

Palpatine melts all three of their sabers.

Dooku and Sion are both gone, and then it's Sidious vs Bane.

DrunknClockwork
Just severe Sion of the Force and he'll become Chop suey. big grin

Enyalus
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
But what if he's decapitated?
Have other Sith survived being decapitated? (The answer is yes; see Marka Ragnos' rival.)

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
1. This isn't conclusive evidence that Sion could survive a decapitation.
How about you prove that Sion will die from being decapitated, when I've proven that typical and repeated death blows...are not death blows where Sion is concerned. I've brought enough evidence for reasonable doubt, IMO.
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
2. Your analogy claimed that Sion could reattach his head with similar ease in which a Jedi can get his lightsaber from across a room. However, your quotes (in addition to failing to prove that Sion can reattach his head) disprove this, as they describe that it is super painful for Sion.
Why wouldn't it be that easy? The Force is controlled with the mind. His brain would be intact. And he can hold his body together using dark side energies. He Force Pulls his body together after being decapitated, then holds it together with Dark Side power. Simple as that.

And yes it's painful. That's what ALLOWS Sion his incredible ability. He is the "Lord of Pain." His pain and hatred further his immortality ability.

Letum Lettow
Originally posted by Shoes
Palpatine melts all three of their sabers.

Dooku and Sion are both gone, and then it's Sidious vs Bane. Dooku maybe, but Sion will attempt a simple, brutal beatdown.

Hewhoknowsall
Originally posted by Enyalus

Have other Sith survived being decapitated? (The answer is yes; see Marka Ragnos' rival.)





Yes, but they couldn't reattach their heads (or did they?) and that doesn't mean that Sion can do the same.



It's generally assumed that a human being will die from decapitation. It's up to you to prove that Sion is an exception.



Generally, pain reduces your ability to think and, based on some evidence, seems to temporarily reduce the ability of Force users to use the Force. In AOTC, Obi Wan struggled to use the Force to get that lightsaber and toss it to Anakin, something that he would normally be able to do with ease. In FOTJ: Abyss, Luke while having not eaten or drunken for weeks had his Force powers diminished. Therefore, it would be difficult for Sion to use his Force powers to get his head back on (if he even can), especially if Sidious tosses it out of the arena.

Oh, and by the way I think that the team would win this fight. I'm just saying that I'm not sure if Sion can survive a decapitation, and if he can how quickly and easily he can come back.

Enyalus
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
It's generally assumed that a human being will die from decapitation. It's up to you to prove that Sion is an exception.
I just ****ing proved that Sion doesn't die in trauma that a human being would die from. Read the damn quote.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
Generally, pain reduces your ability to think and, based on some evidence, seems to temporarily reduce the ability of Force users to use the Force.
The Lord of Pain is obviously different, as I've already shown.

If you don't have anything else to contribute, I'm done.

Hewhoknowsall
Originally posted by Enyalus

I just ****ing proved that Sion doesn't die in trauma that a human being would die from. Read the damn quote.



Yes, I read the quote. If Sidious stabs Sion in the chest then maybe Sion won't die. But if Sidious decapitates Sion (from which it would be scientifically impossible for a normal human without any sort of super advanced/super natural aid to survive for more than a few moments) and Force hurls his head out of the arena, then will Sion have enough energy to somehow get out of the Geonosis arena and put it back on? By the time he does (if he does), his team may already have won though.



Pain may have less of an effect on him, but Sion isn't immune to pain.

Nephthys
You mean like the Force? erm

Shoes
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
But if Sidious decapitates Sion... etc


Sion found that he could hold his own decomposing body together with the dark side of the Force.

If he is decapitated, that part of his body starts to decompose. Therefore, Sion cannot be decapitated. You lose.



He chose to embody his pain rather than tolerate it as a normal part of existence, turning it into something far greater. Sion fed upon his pain for sustenance...

lol

kodiak430
DE sidious was probably the most powerful sith ever, but against all three of these other sith masters, he's not going to win /:

Shoes
dooku wasn't a master /:

Nephthys
Only a master of evil. wink

Gideon
no he wuznt cuz palpy wuz da real evil

Nephthys
geet ota mai face man, GOSH!

SonOfTheSuns
Bane was the reason Palps came into power anyway. Darth Sion is the Lord of Pain, he is technically undead, and not a normal human. I couldn't care less about Dooku. Besides Boba Fett kills them all!

Kaysh mirsh solus - "His brain cell's lonely."

chilled monkey
Originally posted by Gideon
no he wuznt cuz palpy wuz da real evil

Beg your pardon, but yes he was.

Dooku was A master. Palpatine was THE master.

chilled monkey
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
Pain may have less of an effect on him, but Sion isn't immune to pain.

No he's not. That's why he's called "The Lord of Pain." Because he embraces pain and suffering to fuel his power and keep himself alive (or rather animated).

His flesh is decaying and covered in cracks, his bones had thousands of fractures and he feels every bit of it.

Seriously, if beheading could permanently kill him it would have been used long ago.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
Generally, pain reduces your ability to think and, based on some evidence, seems to temporarily reduce the ability of Force users to use the Force.

Generally people (even Force users) don't walk around as living corpses.

Are you getting it yet that Darth Sion isn't like other Force-users? He's a zombie for pity's sake.

Shoes
Originally posted by chilled monkey
Beg your pardon, but yes he was.

Dooku was A master. Palpatine was THE master.

Lord =/= Master

The quote was also referring to Vader.

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