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Okay, since Viktor was able to take on Michael, a hybrid, and beat him, whereas Marcus got owned, I'd say Viktor would win. Now, this doesn't mean Markus is a weakling, but he couldn't take Michael. Only when he caught him off guard did he beat him. Viktor, on the other hand, fought him hand to hand, and was about to kill him, had it not been for Selene. I could be wrong, and Markus could viciously beat his ass, but I want to hear some replies, nonetheless.

Battle of the Elders

Viktor

http://www.freewebs.com/realmoftheunderworld/Viktor.jpg

VS

Markus

http://www.vfxtalk.com/feature/luma_pictures/underworld2/luma_underworld_header.jpg

What do you guys think?

Michael was a newly born vamp/lycan, I doubt he had time to get used to his new powers.

True, but he owned Marcus, and he was giving Viktor a good fight, but was beaten. I do think that Viktor may have still won had Michael been used to his powers.

But, between Markus & Viktor, who would you say is stronger?

Markus versus Michael in the back of the truck? Is this the fight you mean?

Yes, indeed. I've watched that movie about 6 times this week, maybe more, and Markus got his ass owned.

I beg to differ. It was a draw until the end, when Markus threw Michael out of the truck like a rag doll.

Michael got more hits in, but yeah, he did get thrown out like a ragdoll. It could've just been because Markus wasn't ready to face him as he was unaware of his power, so that could be a reason. Lots of characters lose fights because they underestimate their opponents.

Remember when the cops were shooting at Micheal? He was visibly hurt, it took Selene's blood to heal him. Markus took dozens of hits from Selen's Beretta at point blank range and shrugged them off as if they were nothing.

Yeah, I thought about that shortly after my last post, but was too lazy to notice. Now it makes me wonder if Viktor could take as many shots and shrug them off...probably not.

Here's an interesting question: Why do people believe Markus was a hybrid?

Because of the wings I guess.

I guess it's because that Lycan scientist's blood dripped into his catacomb, but that hardly would result in him becoming a hybrid.

Wait, wasn't he son of the immortal Corvinus?

Yes, he was, and he got bitten by bat. He offered Viktor the gift of immortality for his military expertise (sp?), and both Viktor and Ameila undercut Marcus' power.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Remember when the cops were shooting at Micheal? He was visibly hurt, it took Selene's blood to heal him. Markus took dozens of hits from Selen's Beretta at point blank range and shrugged them off as if they were nothing.

It tokes selene's blood because Micheal had refused in any way to feed since he became a hybrid, that was the reason to his sudden lose of durability against the Police.

Indeed, good point.

Thanks.

As for the battle itself, I am tempted to give it to Viktor that is a warrior Markus isn't, that alone can make a difference as also could be seen when Micheal and Viktor battled each other, Viktors skill was superior to Micheals gaining him the win, but I'm not sure, I'm quiet sure that Markus is no slug in H2H combat either the problem is that we only saw him in h2h with Micheal that is beneath Viktor... but...

I'm still not entirely sure myself. Viktor seemed to have more feats in his favor. He was able to kill Raze with virtually no effort, and tossed Selene like a ragdoll.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Thanks.

As for the battle itself, I am tempted to give it to Viktor that is a warrior Markus isn't, that alone can make a difference as also could be seen when Micheal and Viktor battled each other, Viktors skill was superior to Micheals gaining him the win, but I'm not sure, I'm quiet sure that Markus is no slug in H2H combat either the problem is that we only saw him in h2h with Micheal that is beneath Viktor... but... And the fact that Michael was a newly born vamp/lycan when he fought Viktor means nothing? He didnt have time to fully adjust to his new powers, did he? I am betting Michael at the end of part two would give Viktor a much better fight.

They fought nearly equal, but what I'm trying to get across is that they fought more equal than Michael & Markus. It seemed like Michael was adaptin well against Viktor, and was an all out beast against Markus.

Michael was actually pwning Viktor in the ass at first if you remember, but the inexperienced hybrid eventually was overcome by the more experienced Viktor.

Yeah, I know, we all know, which is why many think Viktor himself may have been stronger than Markus.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
And the fact that Michael was a newly born vamp/lycan when he fought Viktor means nothing? He didnt have time to fully adjust to his new powers, did he? I am betting Michael at the end of part two would give Viktor a much better fight.

Whether he was getting used to his power ore not is unclear he already within a few minutes had learned to move with the speed that Selene used in the second movie. It was however from my point of view clear that Viktor in skill was above Michael, that skill was what kept Viktor alive. I'm sure he would give him a better fight, since Micheal since then had increased his skills, but what he showed was nothing that I would say that Micheal in skill was above Viktor.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Michael was actually pwning Viktor in the ass at first if you remember, but the inexperienced hybrid eventually was overcome by the more experienced Viktor.

Which was my point. Skills not strength decided the outcome and I have a really hard time gauging just how good Markus is...

Markus seemed about equal with best from what we saw, while Viktor seemed above Viktor in strength and skill. We all must remember the super punch he gave Michael.

Sorry what?

I really don't understand how what I said was in any way unclear.

Viktor seemed above Viktor?

Markus seemed equal with best from what we saw? Best what?

That's what happened when you don't pay attention to what you're typing...

I meant that Viktor seemed a little above Markus, and from what we saw with Markus & Michael on the back of the truck, he was a little equal with Michael at best.

Ahh thanks, agreed.

Sorry, I thought I had typed something else. Lol, my bad.

But yeah, as I was saying, Viktor gave Michael one hell of a punch. I'm still unsure about Markus. You'd think he'd be stronger due to him being the first true vampire, right?

It can happen.

Yes I do but by how much I have no idea, as a Vampire the strongest initially no doubt but again by how much, as we have previous discussed skill could possibly reflect a increased strength with each specie, and Viktors skill is very high, higher then Markus in my opinion. The Hybrid transformation only made him stronger but by how compared to Viktor I have no idea, Viktor put down a Raze with ease, I also think the blood that was mixed has some influence on the increased power between the hybrids. I mean Markus first vampire mixed with a relative (I think) weak lycan. Micheal only two links away from the original link with the vampire and mixed with a very powerful Lycan... but as Selene mentioned being the first have some sort of influence too...

Well, Markus isn't a hybrid, if that's what you're hinting at. The only reason he has the bat form is because of him being the very first vampire, as Tanis explained to Selene. However, I will agree with you that Michael appears to be so strong because he has the blood of an elder (Ameila), not to mention the initial bite from Lucian, and the eventual bite from Selene. He's also shown regeneration skills beyond any other lycan or vampire. That hole in his chest was freakin' huge.

Think he could regenerate from decapitation?

Well Markus is a Hybrid. How do you think he got those wiings he didn't have them when he appeared the first time, he got them because that Lycan, that Viktor killed with a single punch, blood ran down into his mouth and awaked him so I will respectfully disagree, Markus a Hybrid. The rest we can easily agree on.

perhaps if one cut if off and held it maybe...

Originally posted by Utrigita
Which was my point. Skills not strength decided the outcome and I have a really hard time gauging just how good Markus is... More like experience.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Well Markus is a Hybrid. How do you think he got those wiings he didn't have them when he appeared the first time, he got them because that Lycan, that Viktor killed with a single punch, blood ran down into his mouth and awaked him so I will respectfully disagree, Markus a Hybrid. The rest we can easily agree on.

perhaps if one cut if off and held it maybe...

Eh, no, no, and no. Viktor and Ameila undercut Markus' power, and lied to everyone to say he was the first true vampire. There's no possible way he'd become a hybrid from that little blood. All it did was awaken him, he already had the form seeing as he was the first true vampire. William, bitten by wolf, become a werewolf, Markus, bitten by bat, become a batlike creature.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Well Markus is a Hybrid. How do you think he got those wiings he didn't have them when he appeared the first time, he got them because that Lycan, that Viktor killed with a single punch, blood ran down into his mouth and awaked him so I will respectfully disagree, Markus a Hybrid. The rest we can easily agree on.

perhaps if one cut if off and held it maybe...

Markus isn't a hybrid (wolf/bat), he's a vampire, the first Vampire.

Edit: From Wiki

"His blood seeped into Marcus' tomb and revived the slumbering Elder, allowin him to be awakened before Kraven was able to kill him. It is shown here that unlike the other vampires, he has a more bat like form with wings due to him having been the true first vampire."

Just like his brother is more wolf-like than the other Lycans since he was the first werewolf.

That's all I'm saying. Plus, think about this: If it were that simple for him to become a hybrid, why did Lucian go through all of the trouble to get Amelia's blood, and to bite Michael, and then obtain his blood to test it?

Originally posted by Robtard
Markus isn't a hybrid (wolf/bat), he's a vampire, the first Vampire.

Edit: From Wiki

"His blood seeped into Marcus' tomb and revived the slumbering Elder, allowin him to be awakened before Kraven was able to kill him. It is shown here that unlike the other vampires, he has a more bat like form with wings due to him having been the true first vampire."

Just like his brother is more wolf-like than the other Lycans since he was the first werewolf.

Funny because on Wiki the very same site you are using under the picture it says "Marcus in his full hybrid state."

You are aware that anyone can edit wikipedia, and I was the one who had to change it so that it said hybrid. He's not a hybrid, Selene only said so because she had not yet discovered he was the first vampire. Tell me, if he's a hybrid, why does he have bat wings, and a very bat like face? He's not a hybrid, that's why.

Originally posted by Markus Corvinus
Eh, no, no, and no. Viktor and Ameila undercut Markus' power, and lied to everyone to say he was the first true vampire. There's no possible way he'd become a hybrid from that little blood. All it did was awaken him, he already had the form seeing as he was the first true vampire. William, bitten by wolf, become a werewolf, Markus, bitten by bat, become a batlike creature.

Yes I'm full aware of that. That little blood? How much did Micheal require to become a hybrid? A bite from Lucian along with the blood from Selene was enough to transform Micheal into a Hybrid. No he didn't always have that form, if he had why didn't he display it prior? Also look at Kraven when he confronts Markus he doesn't immidiately recognise him instead he asks Markus? Also his color is very far from the other vampires and looks exactly like the Hybrid Micheals skin.

Originally posted by Markus Corvinus
You are aware that anyone can edit wikipedia, and I was the one who had to change it so that it said hybrid. He's not a hybrid, Selene only said so because she had not yet discovered he was the first vampire. Tell me, if he's a hybrid, why does he have bat wings, and a very bat like face? He's not a hybrid, that's why.

I am I just pointed out the doublestanard in what Robtard posted. Tell me if he isn't a Hybrid then why does he has the same color on his skin as Micheal, also it's very possible given the circumstances that transformed him into a vampire in the first place (the bat bite) evolved when it came into contact with the Lycan blood, think about it Micheal gets a complete package with apperances from both sides, Markus as the first vampire not the human descendent would instead trigger the more batlike DNA. You can perhaps tell me how he survived the blood of a Lycan after the scientist specificly in the first movie pointed out that even at cell level their different dna fought each other? That blood shouldn't have awakened him it should have killed him.

From what I heard, Michael had a more Lycan appearance whereas Markus had a more batlike appearance as hybrids, since Michael was originally a Lycan and Markus was originally a vampire.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Funny because on Wiki the very same site you are using under the picture it says "Marcus in his full hybrid state."

You realize that "hybrid" can refer to more than just vampire/werewolf combo thing right? In that little picture with that "hybird" caption, they're referring to his human/bat hybrid form.

Seriously, the movies aren't that hard to follow.

Begs the question too, if he was somehow part werewolf(which he isn't), why would he grow wings and a batl-ike face from being a vamp/wwolf cross? Answer: He isn't part werewolf.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
From what I heard, Michael had a more Lycan appearance whereas Markus had a more batlike appearance as hybrids, since Michael was originally a Lycan and Markus was originally a vampire.

Dude, seriosuly now, the movies are not complex. Markus looks like a bat because he was the first vampire (bitten by bat); William looks like a wolf because he was the first werewold (bitten by a wolf).

Skin color means absolute nothing, and I really would think people have a hard time following what they are watching. Whoever watched the movie would know that black is basically the color for werewolves (hence why when Michael was first changing into a hybrid, his skin became completely black first) and the color for vampires is blue. It's not hard to follow at all. Markus is not a hybrid, if he were, he wouldn't be so bat like. By the way, if he's a hybrid, why did he have to get out of the sunlight and why was he hung in a bat like possession whilst sleeping? Correct me if I'm wrong but Michael doesn't have to be afraid of light, and he doesn't sleep like a bat. I swear, if anyone thinks that Markus is a hybrid after I have compiled all of this, I'll be forced to think there's something wrong with your comprehension, sorry.

Calm down.

I'm perfectly calm...just baffled at how anyone thinks he's a hybrid is all.

Deep breaths, we'll get through this.

How funny.

Originally posted by Robtard
Deep breaths, we'll get through this. Hot.

I'm in the midst of rewatching the fight between Michael & Viktor. Viktor truly kicked his ass.

Originally posted by Robtard
You realize that "hybrid" can refer to more than just vampire/werewolf combo thing right? In that little picture with that "hybird" caption, they're referring to his human/bat hybrid form.

Seriously, the movies aren't that hard to follow.

Begs the question too, if he was somehow part werewolf(which he isn't), why would he grow wings and a batl-ike face from being a vamp/wwolf cross? Answer: He isn't part werewolf.

You do realise that such a crossing is called a vampire not a Hybrid? In Underworld a Hybrid is a crossing between a Vampire and a Lycan.

From my point of view the case is fair straight forward so it is in my opinion, a Descendent of Alexander Corvenus gets Lycan blood in his mouth and survives, what happened to the other Descendent that happened to get his the two DNA's mixed?

He is part werewolf, let me explain why however his apperance is as it is. Micheal when assuming his Hybrid form is still portrayed as a human his entire body structure is human, it would only be logical to assume that when the first of the vampires gets a amount of blood from a Lycan then the bat gene will trigger. Maybe you would like to explain too me why Kraven is shocked when he sees Markus and why Markus prior didn't show that form? Maybe you can explain to me why Markus can go toe on toe with Micheal a Hybrid and defeat him, when it has been clearly stated that a Hybrid is stonger then both races, Micheal defeats William but gets defeated by Markus that by you isn't more then a the first vampire which should make no difference, he should have been owned.

Originally posted by Markus Corvinus
Skin color means absolute nothing, and I really would think people have a hard time following what they are watching. Whoever watched the movie would know that black is basically the color for werewolves (hence why when Michael was first changing into a hybrid, his skin became completely black first) and the color for vampires is blue. It's not hard to follow at all. Markus is not a hybrid, if he were, he wouldn't be so bat like. By the way, if he's a hybrid, why did he have to get out of the sunlight and why was he hung in a bat like possession whilst sleeping? Correct me if I'm wrong but Michael doesn't have to be afraid of light, and he doesn't sleep like a bat. I swear, if anyone thinks that Markus is a hybrid after I have compiled all of this, I'll be forced to think there's something wrong with your comprehension, sorry.

Even though his skin color is completely different from all the others vampires? Yes it appears that way. And you draw the conclusion that vampires are blue from what? He wasn't anything near that batlike in his very first apperance, what triggered that transformation? Certainly not age since the vampires doesn't evolve. Again as mentioned before it's entirely possible that the transformation triggered the more Batlike DNA in, what is your explanation for his sudden showing of this form he most certainly wasn't in it when we meet him the first time. Micheal was raised and born as a human, Markus for the more then 500 years been used to seeking shelter whenever the sun was appearing why should he change his habbits and take the chance that the sun would fry him?

Also none of you have answered my most vital question... If Markus wasn't transformed into a Hybrid when absorbing the blood of the Lycan then how did he survive that? The species hate each other...

I will be forced to think the same thing about yours from my point of view it's very clear that Markus is a hybrid else he would have stood no chance against the Hybrid that are more powerful then both races individually.

Am I correct Markus when I assume that none of us are going to agree with the other on this point?

Agree to disagree?

Oh and sorry for the last Comment I know that their is nothing wrong with you ability to comprehend, we just analyse Markus in two entirely different ways.

Selene called Markus a hybrid herself

Human/Bat

Markus was never human, he was the immortal son of Alexander Corvinus, so he's an immortal/vampire hybrid, if you want to look at it that way. I'll say it once more: Selene said Markus was a hybrid before learning the truth behind him being the first true vampire. That's why he has the form. And I'm just going to conclude that Utrigita didn't pay attention to what he was watching, hence the absurd belief that Markus is a hybrid. If he were, he wouldn't be so bat like, and if you can't see that he's like that due to being the first vampire, it's not due to you thinking your right, it's downright incompetence.

Originally posted by Utrigita
You do realise that such a crossing is called a vampire not a Hybrid? In Underworld a Hybrid is a crossing between a Vampire and a Lycan.

From my point of view the case is fair straight forward so it is in my opinion, a Descendent of Alexander Corvenus gets Lycan blood in his mouth and survives, what happened to the other Descendent that happened to get his the two DNA's mixed?

He is part werewolf, let me explain why however his apperance is as it is. Micheal when assuming his Hybrid form is still portrayed as a human his entire body structure is human, it would only be logical to assume that when the first of the vampires gets a amount of blood from a Lycan then the bat gene will trigger. Maybe you would like to explain too me why Kraven is shocked when he sees Markus and why Markus prior didn't show that form? Maybe you can explain to me why Markus can go toe on toe with Micheal a Hybrid and defeat him, when it has been clearly stated that a Hybrid is stonger then both races, Micheal defeats William but gets defeated by Markus that by you isn't more then a the first vampire which should make no difference, he should have been owned.

You're being incredibly dense, that "hybrid" caption in the picture is in reference to Markus taking his half man/bat form, as he's able to look human or release just some of his bat features ar will.

Where is it stated anywhere in the film that drinking werewolf blood would make any vampire a werewolf-vamp hybrid? It doesn't. If that's all it took, then there would have been no need for Michael/the plot in the first film.

He's incredibly strong because he was the first vampire, just as William is incredibly strong because he was the first werewolf. As far as who defeats who, it's called plot-line and action, if Michael went in and just killed everyone, then there wouldn't much of a story.

As I also recall in the first film, Viktor, an elder vamp (not a hybrid nor the first of his race) put a decent beat-down on Michael.

Got it? Good.

Michael was needed because he just so happened to have the "Corvinus strand" or whatever it is called.

Which Markus has also.

Whoa.

Michael was also not the original vamp or werewolf, he had a clean slate to work with.

Whoa X2.

I hate how people forget Singe's explanation on the whole hybrid issue. Viktor brought up Markus, and Singe said they needed a pure source.

Originally posted by Robtard
You're being incredibly dense, that "hybrid" caption in the picture is in reference to Markus taking his half man/bat form, as he's able to look human or release just some of his bat features ar will.

Where is it stated anywhere in the film that drinking werewolf blood would make any vampire a werewolf-vamp hybrid? It doesn't. If that's all it took, then there would have been no need for Michael/the plot in the first film.

He's incredibly strong because he was the first vampire, just as William is incredibly strong because he was the first werewolf. As far as who defeats who, it's called plot-line and action, if Michael went in and just killed everyone, then there wouldn't much of a story.

As I also recall in the first film, Viktor, an elder vamp (not a hybrid nor the first of his race) put a decent beat-down on Michael.

Got it? Good.

That would be a matter of perspective concerning who is being dense. So you say that the batform is a form that he had all along with Black Eyes just a Micheal? If he was a Vampire his iris would still be visible. And btw



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_(Underworld)#Hybrids

Have you even watched the movies and payed attention to other then the fight scenes? Why do you think that the Lycan where searching for the last remaining mortal descendent of Alexander Corvenus for their own twisted pleasure? No they did it because only a descendent of the Corvenus was capable of overcomming the feud between the two bloodlines, as the scientist says when he explains what they are trying to create, he clearly says that even on a cellular level the two species fight against each other, now take that knowlegde and try and put some werewolf blood into the mouth of any none Corvenus that is a vampire and think a bit about the result.

He is incrediably strong because he became a hybrid, not because he is the first vampire which as so wonderful clearly showed by Micheal was nothing against the power of a hybrid. No it wouldn't hence the reason they had to create a new being that could lay the smack down on Micheal and give him opposition, hence Markus was ressurrected as a Hybrid he even acknowlegde in the film that he himself isn't a vampire but something more.



Now why would Markus be talking about a new race if he himself wasn't a part of one seems highly irrationel.

Micheal who at that point wasn't in complete control of his own power and didn't understand his own strength and he fought a much more experienced warrior.

Got it? I would be surprised.

Just as a last note you can go to this site

http://www.sonypictures.com/movies/underworldevolution/site/home.html

and read a bit about Markus if you doesn't wasn't too allow me to quote.



Well atleast the bat/human = Hybrid got shot down...

There was no new breed, he was the first vampire, and so he looks like a vampire. On the special features of the DVD they don't say anything at all about him being a hybrid or new breed.

It might be so but The Lycans resemble their creator William (looks like him) Now I may be wrong but I don't think I have seen any single vampire in any way resembling Markus in the form you claim that he had all along, I have however seen alot of vampires reflecting his apperance when he appeared the first time the human appearance.

Okay so tell me why the official website says otherwise, tell me why Markus in the movie itself doesn't refere to himself as a vampire as both Robtard and you claim that he is.

Tell me why you'd think it's so easy for a new breed to be created with a few spills of blood. You lack serious logic.

Few spills of Blood, the average human body contain 5,6 liters of blood, seeing how, when Kraven and his gang entered the crypt, one could see that all the blood that had left singes body had flowned into Markus crypt we have no idea of how much blood he actually got but judging from the size of the pool of blood I would say more then a few spills.

Now you tell me, why a Vampire can go toe to toe and defeat with a Hybrid, a Hybrid that rips the head of William the strongest Lycan that is should be superior to any Vampire.

Originally posted by Utrigita
It might be so but The Lycans resemble their creator William (looks like him) Now I may be wrong but I don't think I have seen any single vampire in any way resembling Markus in the form you claim that he had all along, I have however seen alot of vampires reflecting his apperance when he appeared the first time the human appearance.

Okay so tell me why the official website says otherwise, tell me why Markus in the movie itself doesn't refere to himself as a vampire as both Robtard and you claim that he is.

My, my, the Lycans look different than William too, the're almost hairless and blue/black-skinned, he looks like a bipedal wolf, since he was the first werewolf. Just as Markus looks or can look a lot different than the other vampires because he was the first vampire.

As far as strength/power goes, the vampires gain more strength as they age, it's the reason why Viktor was such a bad-ass, he was an elder. Remember when he easily broke a Lycan's neck with one hand in that shitty first film?

Tell me something, if Markus is a werewolf/vampire hybrid as you seem so intent on believing, why doesn't he have a single Lycan feature, but instead, looks entirely like a man-bat when transformed?

Markus never defeated Markus. They fought on the back of the truck, and Michael beat the crap out of him. He was thrown off the truck, not defeated. The second time they "fought" Michael was caught off guard and not in hybrid form, which allowed Markus an easy win. First he's a hybrid, now he's a new breed. Please stop coming up with all these ridiculous theories.

Originally posted by Robtard
My, my, the Lycans look different than William too, the're almost hairless and blue/black-skinned, he looks like a bipedal wolf, since he was the first werewolf. Just as Markus looks or can look a lot different than the other vampires because he was the first vampire.

As far as strength/power goes, the vampires gain more strength as they age, it's the reason why Viktor was such a bad-ass, he was an elder. Remember when he easily broke a Lycan's neck with one hand in that shitty first film?

Tell me something, if Markus is a werewolf/vampire hybrid as you seem so intent on believing, why doesn't he have a single Lycan feature, but instead, looks entirely like a man-bat when transformed?

I find it rather funny that you choose to answer to my post directed towards Markus instead focusing on the post directed to you at the top...

You can still tell me similarities between William and his offspring care to point out the similarities between Markus Bat form and his off spring? Thought not because their is none when he is in that form

I do remember that yes.

I have already answered that question at least two times, and still you ask the same question and you are calling me dense? But I think Wikipedia which you used originally said it best.

Dude, Selene herself said that the virus they transmute is deadly and most humans die within an hour of being bitten, so what makes you think his offspring would gain a bat form like him? Truly, you have nothing supporting your claim, not even Wikipedia.

Originally posted by Utrigita
I find it rather funny that you choose to answer to my post directed towards Markus instead focusing on the post directed to you at the top...

You can still tell me similarities between William and his offspring care to point out the similarities between Markus Bat form and his off spring? Thought not because their is none when he is in that form

I do remember that yes.

I have already answered that question at least two times, and still you ask the same question and you are calling me dense? But I think Wikipedia which you used originally said it best.

Because it was nothing but more senseless ramblings.

Because the (non-original) vampires do not tranform, they have a single form? Whoa.

Yeah, that wiki article on Underworld Hybrids isn't cited, for al we know, some silly ass-clown wrote it and/or edited it.

I also have to ask, why did you switch from calling Markus a "hybrid", like Michael, to a "new breed" now? Granted, that makes more sense, why the oh-not-so-clever switch?

Originally posted by Markus Corvinus
Markus never defeated Markus. They fought on the back of the truck, and Michael beat the crap out of him. He was thrown off the truck, not defeated. The second time they "fought" Michael was caught off guard and not in hybrid form, which allowed Markus an easy win. First he's a hybrid, now he's a new breed. Please stop coming up with all these ridiculous theories.

No it would seem strange to battle oneself. As I recall it was Micheal that was thrown out of the truck by Markus and that was far from a owning in Micheals favor until that point they seemed equal, but one could notice that Markus almost with a grace threw of Micheal when he grabbed the necklas.

A Hybrid is a new breed and it isn't my words it's Markus own and the official sites, but ofcause you certainly know better then both..

Originally posted by Robtard
Because it was nothing but more senseless ramblings.

Because the (non-original) vampires do not tranform, they have a single form. Whoa.

Yeah, that wiki artile on Underworld Hybrids isn't cited, fro al we know, some silly ass-clown wrote it.

I also have to ask, why did you switch from calling Markus a "hybrid" like Michael to a "new breed" now? Granted, that makes more sense, why the oh-not-so-clever switch?

Robtard, I've been on many forums in my 14 years, and if it's one thing I've noticed in debates is that if someone knows they're wrong, and don't want to admit it, they're going to switch up what they say to something else, until they can find ANOTHER lie. Markus is not a hybrid, or new breed, simply the first vampire. Any other belief than that is senseless rambling.

Well, that "new breed" makes some sense, as Markus is of that first bloodline, so who knows what werewolf blood (infection) would do in these silly w-wolf/vamp movies.

Either way, I'm debating idiocy over a series of flims I didn't even really enjoy, so have fun.

Originally posted by Robtard
Because it was nothing but more senseless ramblings.

Because the vampires do not tranform, they have a single form? Whoa.

Yeah, that wiki artile on Underworld Hybrids isn't cited, fro al we know, some silly ass-clown wrote it.

I also have to ask, why did you switch from calling Markus a "hybrid" like Michael to a "new breed" now? Granted, that makes more sense, why the oh-not-so-clever switch?

Thats senseless rabble Robtard, provided proof both from the official movie site and the words from Markus in movie, if you call both senseless rabbling well that's up too you even though you have provided not a single shead of proof to prove your logic other then saying Bat/human = Hybrid.

They do transform, but certainly not into the form that Markus has, to make it short, the vampires retain their human form resembling their sire as we saw him first, we didn't see any other Vampire then Markus in the form that you claim he always had, we see the Lycans in the same form as their sire has. With fure etc.

For all we know some silly ass-clown wrote what you quoted.

I isn't making the switch I'm just quoting the Official site, if I was wrong on him being a Hybrid so be it, but that he is only a Vampire as both Markus and you claim is from my point of view, supported with the previous mentioned quotes, simply dead wrong.

Originally posted by Markus Corvinus
Robtard, I've been on many forums in my 14 years, and if it's one thing I've noticed in debates is that if someone knows they're wrong, and don't want to admit it, they're going to switch up what they say to something else, until they can find ANOTHER lie. Markus is not a hybrid, or new breed, simply the first vampire. Any other belief than that is senseless rambling.

So you are going directly against what the Official site and Markus himself states? Interesting...

Apparently the 14 years have thought you something else too...

He was referring to it being a new race because he was going to awaken and unite with William. I guess next you're going to tell me at the end of the movie Selene is still a vampire.

And that race would be what to be exact? Not a Vampire, like you claim he is, not a Lycan as William is, but what Markus became and that sure as hell isn't a vampire, he directly in movie stats that he no longer is a vampire in that conversation with his father.

"A new race created in the image of their maker. Their new God. Me. "

No I isn't, that would be silly.

What's silly is you debating Markus being a hybrid, then moving on to him being a new breed. Decide what made up theory you want to use and stick with it.

What is silly of you is sticking to the the assumption that he is Vampire even when proof is presented that proves the opposite, you then moves on and calls a person with another view on the subject a lie, idiot and mentally retarded, no offence but I thought that 14 years on the internet had learned you that, that isn't the way to behave on a forum, if you doesn't think you are getting through to person at the other end then you leave the discussion.

Now to drop the offensive tone and the debating blah...

A new breed cannot be a Hybrid? Micheal was a fusion between a Lycan and then a Vampire, for Markus it imo was the other way around first a Vampire and then a Lycan wouldn't that make like some kind of a subspecie within the Hybrids?

I don't recall calling anyone an idiot or mentally retarded, so please stop trying to put words in my mouth, okay?

Dude, HE WAS THE FIRST VAMPIRE WHICH IS WHY HE HAS A BAT FORM, HE'S NOT A NEW BREED OR HYBRID!

Originally posted by Markus Corvinus
I'll be forced to think there's something wrong with your comprehension, sorry.

What do you call this then?

Okay Markus

Then why is the Official Site calling him a new breed, and why is he not refering to himself as a vampire any longer?

Two simple Questions.

Thinking back on the movie, Utrigita is most likely correct. He's not a hybrid in the sense that Michael is, since he still has his vampire weaknesses, but it was implied that the were-blood did alter him, ie "new breed" would be correct.

Edit: Markus, your homework for tonight is to re-watch Underworld 2, get to it.

Then I would like to apoligise/withdraw/concern for/(on) my previous statement that he was a Hybrid in the same sense as Micheal.

Originally posted by Robtard
Thinking back on the movie, Utrigita is most likely correct. He's not a hybrid in the sense that Michael is, since he still has his vampire weaknesses, but it was implied that the were-blood did alter him, ie "new breed" would be correct.

Edit: Markus, your homework for tonight is to re-watch Underworld 2, get to it.

If you say so.

I still doubt the were blood altered him. Think about it: Selene immediately knew it was him when he came to them...if he were altered and the form was new, then she wouldn't have immediately knew it was him.

The problem with this battle is if you take the fights with Michael into account. But then again that's their only common enemy fight in which anyone can draw a comparison from.

But if you go but just feats alone, I do believe that Marcus comes out on top by far. Even though he got owned at the start by Michael, he does show other impressive feats that Viktor never did. I might also add later in the movie, Marcus shows that he CAN beat Michael when he "kills" him. Marcus also has a healing factor that is unlike any other. In the truck chase scene, I lost count of how many bullets he took to the face at point blank range, yet he seemed to only be affected momentarily.

Also, if you just go along with Vampire logic alone, Marcus is older than Viktor and therefore should be stronger. Plus he is also a hydrid, which I am led to believe makes him even stronger.

Markus was affected by the vampire blood, but he's not a hybrid in the way Michael is. Whereas Michael is basically 50% vampire and 50% werewolf, Markus is around 85-90% vampire, and about 10-15% werewolf. But, one thing I must add on is that Markus caught Michael off guard when he "killed" him, and if that's any indication, Michael has the best healing factor out of any of the characters we've seen in the franchise yet. One would believe Markus is the stronger vampire because of his age, but it seems that he isn't, largely because Viktor had less problems when fighting Michael.

Just my $0.02.