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both at full power all over the earth with no one living on it

Vegate Cheated on SSJ4 he goes down hard

and NO anime stuff here (I think)

Surfer wins hands down. And this will be closed

anime dont belong here and black hair goku without going super sayain would own surfer. Why go as far as super sayain 4

Originally posted by carver9
anime dont belong here and black hair goku without going super sayain would own surfer. Why go as far as super sayain 4 you know that Sayian have no counter to Matter Manipulation

SS can turn Goku and anyone from dbz to Gas

Originally posted by carver9
anime dont belong here and black hair goku without going super sayain would own surfer. Why go as far as super sayain 4

there are comic /art book versions. so why close it

Originally posted by rox
there are comic /art book versions. so why close it

I have been arguing this for 2 years and the rules hasnt changed yet. You can try but I promise you its pointless. Its so many people that I want to tag anime characters against.

Originally posted by rox
there are comic /art book versions. so why close it they bring to much drama

and people will start spamming Naruto vs Ichhigo etc it gets ugly quick I think there are other forums for such discussions

LOLOLOL at base goku doing anything at all to surfer,they get energy drained and fast.

it's over 9000!

Originally posted by kgkg
you know that Sayian have no counter to Matter Manipulation

SS can turn Goku and anyone from dbz to Gas

I agree but the problem that silver surfer would have would be to hit him with anything. Goku has some of the best combat speed feats in comics. Surfer would be overwhelmed.

Lets not add up the blasts that goku has dodged since his creation. Goku is a beast and his fighting style is on a different level then anyone that surfer would ever face in his life or in his wet dreams.

vegeta could block his chi force from getting drained and then blitz him.

I don't even think surfer could last the multi panel stare down let alone the ssj4 kamehameha(sp?) wave

:P

Originally posted by vlaaad12345
LOLOLOL at base goku doing anything at all to surfer,they get energy drained and fast.

So now surfer can absorb ki. This isnt solar energy or anything. This is a good thread, I hope it dont get closed.

Originally posted by EkinEku
vegeta could block his chi force from getting drained and then blitz him.

I don't even think surfer could last the multi panel stare down let alone the ssj4 kamehameha(sp?) wave

:P

Like I said before, black hair goku would be more then enough. Dragonballz characters fight on a level that has yet to be seen by any other character in comics.

Originally posted by carver9
I agree but the problem that silver surfer would have would be to hit him with anything. Goku has some of the best combat speed feats in comics. Surfer would be overwhelmed.

Lets not add up the blasts that goku has dodged since his creation. Goku is a beast and his fighting style is on a different level then anyone that surfer would ever face in his life or in his wet dreams. the combat is really inconsistent.

have any proof of nano second reaction speed?

i mean the speed remain pretty much the same since SS to SS4 speed was a vague stuff.

-You know SS can absorb Energy from Vegeta
-SS can Stop TIME
- SS can go back in TIME
- SS can Phase and pull Vegetas heart out
etc

Silver surfer turns vegeta into a vegetable, or traps him in an unbreakable shell of ethel energy with a thought cutting of his airsupply and immobilizing him.

Originally posted by kgkg
the combat is really inconsistent.

have any proof of nano second reaction speed?

i mean the speed remain pretty much the same since SS to SS4 speed was a vague stuff.

-You know SS can absorb Energy from Vegeta
-SS can Stop TIME
- SS can go back in TIME
- SS can Phase and pull Vegetas heart out
etc

So you dont agree with the fact that the more powerful you are the more faster and stronger you are. Hell super humans was shooting blast at goku and it was going straight through him. They was even punching at him and there punches was going straight through him and he was moving the entire time but he was moving so fast that noone was able to see it and this is people that had super speed themselves.

I agree that surfer is powerful but again he would be so overwhelmed by goku he wont have the opportunity to any of that, especially a angry goku.

Originally posted by ultimatethor
Silver surfer turns vegeta into a vegetable, or traps him in an unbreakable shell of ethel energy with a thought cutting of his airsupply and immobilizing him.

and how is this suppose to happen with goku hitting him 100's of times per second.

Hell tien hit yamcha in the regular dragonball series 47 times in the blink of a eye and goku>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>yamcha during that saga.

Originally posted by carver9
So you dont agree with the fact that the more powerful you are the more faster and stronger you are. Hell super humans was shooting blast at goku and it was going straight through him. They was even punching at him and there punches was going straight through him and he was moving the entire time but he was moving so fast that noone was able to see it and this is people that had super speed themselves.

I agree that surfer is powerful but again he would be so overwhelmed by goku he wont have the opportunity to any of that, especially a angry goku. I don't agree that Goku was stronger or faster than SS.

SS reacts in Nano second.

He need a that much time to Turn Goku into Dust.

Omni directional blast solves the hitting him probelm although its not like surfer couldnt blitz goku anyways.

if he trapped him in the bubble vegeta could punch a hole in the empty space of the shell and then go into an alternate dimension, punch thru that hole, and blindside him with millions of devistating blows.

^remember were talking about vegeta here

Originally posted by kgkg
I don't agree that Goku was stronger or faster than SS.

SS reacts in Nano second.

He need a that much time to Turn Goku into Dust.

If they was having a race, yes I agree surfer would win but combat speed goku has him by miles.

Answer this, when the ginyu force was shooting the blasts through gokus body how fast do you think that he had to react/move with hundreds of blast going through him?

When you answer that then think about this, his body appeared as if it wasnt moving at all.

Originally posted by EkinEku
if he trapped him in the bubble vegeta could punch a hole in the empty space of the shell and then go into an alternate dimension, punch thru that hole, and blindside him with millions of devistating blows.

What are you talking about.

Originally posted by rox
there are comic /art book versions. so why close it this version of vegeta is from DB-GT. just so you know, DB-GT never had any volumes in manga, it only had the TV show. so your statement is incorrect.

Originally posted by carver9
and how is this suppose to happen with goku hitting him 100's of times per second.

Hell tien hit yamcha in the regular dragonball series 47 times in the blink of a eye and goku>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>yamcha during that saga.

Silver surfer has reacted to speed blitzez before and also he just needs a thought to trap goku in an ethel energy field. Game over. Also its not like goku has ever shown to be able to move at light speeds in or out of battle.Almost Nothin in DBZ is ever quantified

Again omnidirectional blast,black hole,straight up energy drain...pick one.

This is pointless. It going to be closed any moment now anyways. There is an anime manga forum for these type of matches

Surfer in a stomp, due to matter manipulation and much greater speed.

Originally posted by ultimatethor
Silver surfer has reacted to speed blitzez before and also he just needs a thought to trap goku in an ethel energy field. Game over. Also its not like goku has ever shown to be able to move at light speeds in or out of battle.Almost Nothin in DBZ is ever quantified

I agree silver surfer has reacted to speed blitz but not speed blitzes of dragonball level.

Goku would be all over surfer before he had the time to think and why your at it can you show me surfer fighting someone at light speed (even though I think that goku by the time he fought vegeta had the ability to move at light speed). Just think about it like this, picollo destroyed the moon with a blast that made it to the moon instantly, picollo shot that same blast at raditz and raditz dodged it while being caught off guard.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
Surfer in a stomp, due to matter manipulation and much greater speed.

Flying speed but combat speed goku>>>>>>>>>>>surfer

Dbz characters have no proof of ever moving at lightspeed let alone by the saiyan saga,surfer has much much better speed,durability,energy output than goku,get over it.

please close this. unnecessary shit storm.

I don't know about surfer have a speed advantage

Then you don't read much surfer,dbz characters take time to cross the planet,surfer crosses galaxies in seconds.

Originally posted by vlaaad12345
Dbz characters have no proof of ever moving at lightspeed let alone by the saiyan saga,surfer has much much better speed,durability,energy output than goku,get over it.

Energy output is questionable
I give the edge to surfer with durability
Speed Gokus combat speed>>>>surfer by miles.

Goku has already owned superman in wizard, twice, I cant wait until they make one with him and surfer.

Originally posted by carver9
I agree silver surfer has reacted to speed blitz but not speed blitzes of dragonball level.

Goku would be all over surfer before he had the time to think and why your at it can you show me surfer fighting someone at light speed (even though I think that goku by the time he fought vegeta had the ability to move at light speed). Just think about it like this, picollo destroyed the moon with a blast that made it to the moon instantly, picollo shot that same blast at raditz and raditz dodged it while being caught off guard. b

I dont need to show a scan of surfer fighting someone at light speed because NO dragon ball character has shown to be capable of anything even close to it. Reacting to lasers after they are fired is something that Ss has shown to be capable of numerous times. SS is also too durable to be taken out by any DB character.

Originally posted by carver9
What are you talking about.

He could punch through dimensions, like when escaping that training room (lord only knows how he punched into the right deminsion.)

Originally posted by vlaaad12345
Then you don't read much surfer,dbz characters take time to cross the planet,surfer crosses galaxies in seconds.

When have dbz characters ever rush to get somewhere?

Only buu and gotenks busted through a dimension...and in the same place there was a hole before so no vegeta can't punch through dimensions like prime.

n/m

Originally posted by carver9
Energy output is questionable
I give the edge to surfer with durability
Speed Gokus combat speed>>>>surfer by miles.

Goku has already owned superman in wizard, twice, I cant wait until they make one with him and surfer.

Questionable? SS energy output is multiple times any body in Dbzs. Durability wise he is also multiple times superior. Speed, goku may have better combat speed but nothin Ss cant deal with. If wizard brings out an issue in which goku defeats silver surfer they shud be sued for defamation of character and outright stupididty.

Wow wizard where dumb dbz fans who don't know a damn thing about superman vote for him...your actually trying to use that as any sort of proof?superman would stomp all over goku surfer does it even harder.

Originally posted by ultimatethor
b

I dont need to show a scan of surfer fighting someone at light speed because NO dragon ball character has shown to be capable of anything even close to it. Reacting to lasers after they are fired is something that Ss has shown to be capable of numerous times. SS is also too durable to be taken out by any DB character.

Youre the one that keep bringing up light speed and its different to jump and bounce around while lasers is being shot at you. Goku did this in a completely different style, he was moving so fast that it appeared as if he was a ghost or intagible but he was moving the entire time. He was moving so fast that super speed punches appeared as if they were going clean through his body. That alone is light speed reaction, with blast that make it to the moon instantly going through you and it appears as if your not even moving.

Originally posted by ultimatethor
Questionable? SS energy output is multiple times any body in Dbzs. Durability wise he is also multiple times superior. Speed, goku may have better combat speed but nothin Ss cant deal with. If wizard brings out an issue in which goku defeats silver surfer they shud be sued for defamation of character and outright stupididty.

Good one.

Goku has done so much with his ki blast that it ridiculous. Both of them are versatile as hell thats why I was unable to answer that question.

Durability, naah, not multiple times, I give surfer a small edge. Gokus body has been through hell and he still have all of his body parts. Thats a feat alone.

I dont see anything wrong with surfer losing to goku, hell the guy screamed and stop a volcanoe from erupting.

Gokus combat speed would overwhelm surfer.

Originally posted by carver9
Youre the one that keep bringing up light speed and its different to jump and bounce around while lasers is being shot at you. Goku did this in a completely different style, he was moving so fast that it appeared as if he was a ghost or intagible but he was moving the entire time. He was moving so fast that super speed punches appeared as if they were going clean through his body. That alone is light speed reaction, with blast that make it to the moon instantly going through you and it appears as if your not even moving.

I said surfer has reacted to Laser blasts coming directly for him AFTER they had been fired. Not jumping and bouncing around. What u have described Goku doing is just moving fast and creating blurred or after images images, somethin that even the whizzer can do. There is nothin light speed about it.

Originally posted by ultimatethor
I said surfer has reacted to Laser blasts coming directly for him AFTER they had been fired. Not jumping and bouncing around. What u have described Goku doing is just moving fast and creating blurred or after images images, somethin that even the whizzer can do. There is nothin light speed about it.

It was just one after image the entire time, there wasnt multiple. You didnt see the dodging you only seen him and then you have to think about how many blast was being shot at him and think about WHOS shooting at him (beings that also possessed super speed) and how he dodged the blast. They couldnt even see him move and they possess speed themselves.

Originally posted by carver9
Good one.

Goku has done so much with his ki blast that it ridiculous. Both of them are versatile as hell thats why I was unable to answer that question.

Durability, naah, not multiple times, I give surfer a small edge. Gokus body has been through hell and he still have all of his body parts. Thats a feat alone.

I dont see anything wrong with surfer losing to goku, hell the guy screamed and stop a volcanoe from erupting.

Gokus combat speed would overwhelm surfer.

Oh really? What has goku done that can come even remotely close to creating a black hole as an after effect of an energy blast?. Nothing. Versatility wise, SS and goku are not even in the same dimension. SS outnumbers goku in powers by a ratio of 10:1.

Durability wise, when i see goku do something even remotely close to fighting inside a blackhole while weakned then we can discuss that.

Screaming and stopping a volcanoe erupting is of no relvance here and still is not even a surfer level feat. Surfer cud stop a volcano from erupting by blinking.

Gokus combat speed, is unquantifiable and not that impressive. Surfer stomps him 10/10.

Originally posted by ultimatethor
Questionable? SS energy output is multiple times any body in Dbzs. Durability wise he is also multiple times superior. Speed, goku may have better combat speed but nothin Ss cant deal with. If wizard brings out an issue in which goku defeats silver surfer they shud be sued for defamation of character and outright stupididty.


Surfer can't one shot multiple galaxies.

Originally posted by carver9
It was just one after image the entire time, there wasnt multiple. You didnt see the dodging you only seen him and then you have to think about how many blast was being shot at him and think about WHOS shooting at him (beings that also possessed super speed) and how he dodged the blast. They couldnt even see him move and they possess speed themselves.

Well generally after images are drawn to show the readers superspeed movement. The characters themselves still see them as one image. Evrything still unquantifable. Surfer has been shown to react to a blitz from ganyemede who actually CAN move at light speed. Goku has got nothin on surfer.

Originally posted by TheBadguy
Surfer can't one shot multiple galaxies.

Who in Dbz one shotted multiple galaxies?

Originally posted by ultimatethor
Who in Dbz one shotted multiple galaxies?


Broly one shotted most of the south galaxy quadrant which was made of at least 4 galaxies.

stop with the broly one shotted a galaxy..that's BS..

Originally posted by TheBadguy
please close this. unnecessary shit storm.

no keep it. good topic

Goku going so fast that energy moves through him? A energy blast goes forward... lets say 1000 miles a second... it still consumes that space for a fraction of a second... If Goku so fast he could dodge that energy blast... he would still have to stay out of the zone where the blast WAS in order to still be unaffected by the blast. so for that second or fraction of a second you would see goku was NOT there. And thus had moved. The other other option is that he could phase his atoms... because he moved so fast.. he approaches light speed and disperses his atoms infinitely wide... so as to be unaffected by the energy.. however the problem with that is that since his atoms are dispersed you would either see goku as this incredibly wide character... or to the point where he was invisible to the naked eye.

So fast you didn't see him move is idiotic. My guess is goku is the mutant lovechild of shadowcat. and energy phases through him. Also does goku no longer have to breathe air or what, i gave up after dbz. surfer turns the air around them into poison gas or something.

Originally posted by rotiart
Goku going so fast that energy moves through him? A energy blast goes forward... lets say 1000 miles a second... it still consumes that space for a fraction of a second... If Goku so fast he could dodge that energy blast... he would still have to stay out of the zone where the blast WAS in order to still be unaffected by the blast. so for that second or fraction of a second you would see goku was NOT there. And thus had moved. The other other option is that he could phase his atoms... because he moved so fast.. he approaches light speed and disperses his atoms infinitely wide... so as to be unaffected by the energy.. however the problem with that is that since his atoms are dispersed you would either see goku as this incredibly wide character... or to the point where he was invisible to the naked eye.

So fast you didn't see him move is idiotic. My guess is goku is the mutant lovechild of shadowcat. and energy phases through him. Also does goku no longer have to breathe air or what, i gave up after dbz. surfer turns the air around them into poison gas or something.


I know what you mean. but its no worse than the crap we see in comics. Next Superman will find out his farts allow him to time travel.

surf this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNgzfFx-7b4&NR=1

Originally posted by TheBadguy
Broly one shotted most of the south galaxy quadrant which was made of at least 4 galaxies.
No its made of 1 galaxy..theres only 4 galaxies in dbz,and broly is non-canon anyways,manga is all that can be used for canon debates and in the canon manga no dbz char ever showed lightspeed they were only planet busters and could barely take planet busting power themselves.

Originally posted by vlaaad12345
No its made of 1 galaxy..theres only 4 galaxies in dbz,and broly is non-canon anyways,manga is all that can be used for canon debates and in the canon manga no dbz char ever showed lightspeed they were only planet busters and could barely take planet busting power themselves.


Did you even bother to read the thread? He's more canon than the character being used for this thread. there are 4 galaxy quadrants, north, south, east, and west. the total is 16 galaxies.

Originally posted by TheBadguy
Broly one shotted most of the south galaxy quadrant which was made of at least 4 galaxies.

No it was just the south galaxy not the entire quadrant.

I agree but the problem that silver surfer would have would be to hit him with anything. Goku has some of the best combat speed feats in comics. Surfer would be overwhelmed.

Lets not add up the blasts that goku has dodged since his creation. Goku is a beast and his fighting style is on a different level then anyone that surfer would ever face in his life or in his wet dreams

This is why we cant have Anime vs Marvel or Dc characters. Dumb dumbs like this guy who are obsessed with Anime and no matter how much you try to explain to them why will never learn.


Goku can't move close to light speed. Goku is a retard just read the Manga. Goku's body isn't nearly as durable. No Saiyan can breath in outer space. Silver Surfer could beat Goku, Vegeta and Gohan while watching tv.

I forgot to mention this. Mr Satan was able to track with his eyes the Vegito vs Super Gohan Buu fight. Just watch the fight again for those who forgot. The whole time Satan was looking up in the air watching the fight. Dragonball Z characters don't move as fast as you think they do. I am not talking about the american dub who have characters saying stuff they never said in the manga. Like Raditz could move faster than the speed of light.

Somebody else mention this but Dragonball Z is inconsitent. Some time Goku can teleport to other planets in seconds yet it takes him minutes or more to teleport various places on earth. Charactes powers usually jump around more than any american comics. At the start of Dragonball Z Goku was 24 and have a power level of 400 tops. In a years time it jump to 8,000 base. A few months later when he fought Freeza and turned SSJ it was 15,000,000. There are times when A character is hiding his power yet all of the Z warriors could sense that persons true power. Yet there are times that a character is going all out and nobody can sense his true power.


In Dragonball GT no saiyan besides Goku could even go SSJ 2 anymore. Wouldn't logic tell you that over all those years Vegita would be able to go SSJ3 just like Goku? Even though the show says SSJ 4 Goku and Vegeta are their most powerful transformations they dont appear to be any more poweful than they were in their SSJ 2 or 3 transformations. You remember when regular Perfect Cell powered up against Gohan and the planet shook? It was no different than when SSJ 3 Goku shook the earth. Shouldnt SSJ3 Goku powering up do more than regular Perfect Cell?

Dragonball Z was a stupid show that had no real plot and i am glad it is over now. But even their best characters are no match for a guy like The Silver Surfer.