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Who takes this?

Dormammu

RKT.

RKT

what if the battle takes place in his realm?

how much more powerful was RKT than odinpowered thor?

odin=dormmy (or at least the 2 are close enough)

if RK thor is more powerful than odin then he'd win this.

Originally posted by leonidas
how much more powerful was RKT than odinpowered thor?

odin=dormmy (or at least the 2 are close enough)

if RK thor is more powerful than odin then he'd win this. He had Rune Magic so ya he was more powerful.

Originally posted by leonidas
how much more powerful was RKT than odinpowered thor?

odin=dormmy (or at least the 2 are close enough)

if RK thor is more powerful than odin then he'd win this.

RKT was much more powerful than any other Thor and IMO was almost twice as powerful than Odin..He wins this

I think it's an even split. Dormmy has always been above skyfather (Odin fight notwithstanding) and has given Eternity fights for a while, the first time he even made Eternity go dormant for around two months.

doesn't odin also have rune magic? he did sacrifice on of his eye just like thor and hanged himself too i think?? though to a lesser degree as thor sacrificed both his eyes and hanged himself to death?

Originally posted by kgkg
He had Rune Magic so ya he was more powerful.

Odin had Rune Magic as well. I recall him displaying it when he sent his ravens to spell on Surtur.

As for this fight, I'm siding with Dormammu.

Dormammu wins. he's strong enough to challenge Galactus/Eternity/etc.

Isn't Dormammu stronger outside his realm due to needing to expend power inside it? Or is it due to his hunger for matter?

As a representative of Lord Chaos, Dormammu also held the upper hand in a formal game of cosmic chess against Odin, who was representing Master Order, but it ultimately ended in a draw as Odin wished.
Thor Annual #9

From Wiki.

I am not sure, but I would say Dormammu is more powerful. And yes, Rulk handled Dormammu.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Odin had Rune Magic as well. I recall him displaying it when he sent his ravens to spell on Surtur.

As for this fight, I'm siding with Dormammu. RKT gave up both eyes or something which gave him more knowledge, right?

Originally posted by Mindset
RKT gave up both eyes or something which gave him more knowledge, right?

I don't think it did but I could be wrong. It seemed more like Thor had to make an even greater sacrifice than Odin to gain the same wisdom since Odin had already sacrifice one eye.

Dormy is no joke, and written seriously according to his power/history set,
he's above RK Thor imo.

But let's not bring up Eternity yall,
Dormy could never touch Eternity without PIS helping him out.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
I don't think it did but I could be wrong. It seemed more like Thor had to make an even greater sacrifice than Odin to gain the same wisdom since Odin had already sacrifice one eye.
He had to sacrifice both eyes to gain the equal wisdom of odin however when odin hung himself he only went to the brink of death while thor travelled past that and I believe actually died while doing so and in turn gained more power then odin from the runes.

RKTwins

Originally posted by vlaaad12345
He had to sacrifice both eyes to gain the equal wisdom of odin however when odin hung himself he only went to the brink of death while thor travelled past that and I believe actually died while doing so and in turn gained more power then odin from the runes.

I like that Marvel have kept some aspects of Norse mythology with their Asgardians. The Norse gods were all about making sacrifices for power. Although they lose the whole point of the Norse gods by bypassing ragnarok. gods are much for fun to read when they have a raganarok/apocalypse event hanging over their heads.

Originally posted by vlaaad12345
He had to sacrifice both eyes to gain the equal wisdom of odin however when odin hung himself he only went to the brink of death while thor travelled past that and I believe actually died while doing so and in turn gained more power then odin from the runes.

iirc thor sacrificed both eyes because the sacrifice had to be unique. since odin already sacrificed one eye, thor had to sacrifice both. or he could have sacrificed a leg or an arm as long as it was unique.

as for the hanging, yeah, i believe odin just almost died while thor did die and overcame death thus becoming more powerful.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Dormy is no joke, and written seriously according to his power/history set,
he's above RK Thor imo.

i'd disagree. he's on the level of mephisto and surtur and several others--he's lord of a splinter realm. his level does seem to fluctuate more than some though but he has been equated with odin as well.




now THAT i couldn't agree with more.

Originally posted by Mr Master
But let's not bring up Eternity yall,
Dormy could never touch Eternity without PIS helping him out.
He's done it many times though, in fact Eternity's second appearance was Dormy fighting him even. So Eternity was originally and always conceived as a Dormammu level character (and visa versa). It's not PIS, he was always considered that powerful.

Originally posted by King Kandy
He's done it many times though, in fact Eternity's second appearance was Dormy fighting him even. So Eternity was originally and always conceived as a Dormammu level character (and visa versa). It's not PIS, he was always considered that powerful.

many times? you've brought up the one time. the second time he tackled eternity in a spoof series with umar and the cosmic axis nonsense/pis. what other times are you talking about? and that first time was happening in an era where odin was equal to galactus. odin's own feats from that era were ludicrous.

Originally posted by leonidas
many times? you've brought up the one time. the second time he tackled eternity in a spoof series with umar and the cosmic axis nonsense/pis. what other times are you talking about? and that first time was happening in an era where odin was equal to galactus. odin's own feats from that era were ludicrous.
Well okay maybe it was only two times. But it happened in both of their early history, showing they were conceived as near-equals. So it wasn't PIS.

Dormy.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Well okay maybe it was only two times. But it happened in both of their early history, showing they were conceived as near-equals. So it wasn't PIS.

aside from that one feat against eternity, what has he done that warrants putting him above odin? he was not able to defeat mephisto and needed help. it was alluded that he was equal to odin in their chess match. his realm was destroyed by that crazy computer virus demon (along with many of the other splinter realms) in the magik II limited series. he's had multiple defeats at the hands of strange. so . . . what feats does he have that make you think he's anywhere remotely close to eternity?

Originally posted by leonidas
aside from that one feat against eternity, what has he done that warrants putting him above odin?
Well he imprisoned the mindless ones who were said to be living destroyer armors. But really, the Eternity feat should be enough.

Originally posted by leonidas
he was not able to defeat mephisto and needed help.
Pure PIS. Also it should be noted his power varies under different conditions.

Originally posted by leonidas
it was alluded that he was equal to odin in their chess match.
Dormammu was outside his realm, and had recently resurrected. Whenever he reincorporates he's weak for a while.

Originally posted by leonidas
his realm was destroyed by that crazy computer virus demon (along with many of the other splinter realms) in the magik II limited series.
That's by no means a bad showing. That beast easily killed thousands of magic-users, many who ruled their own realms. It's insane.

Originally posted by leonidas
he's had multiple defeats at the hands of strange.
None that didn't have extenuating circumstances.

Originally posted by leonidas
so . . . what feats does he have that make you think he's anywhere remotely close to eternity?
Oh, only the fact that he knocked him out for two months.

Losing to Classic Strange is not really a low feat. Dude was a serious beast of a mage. Not to mention that Dormammu is on par with the Vishanti.

The chess match just showed that conceptually speaking, they're pretty much equals in terms of how diametrically opposed they are. And if I sound like Allan right there, good.

I mean, when you think about nobility and order, Odin comes pretty quickly to mind. "Regal One" and all that. And when you think of evil and chaos...Dormammu isn't far away. "Dread One" and such. So of course they're the perfect beings to be chosen as the avatars of Lord Chaos and Master Order. Says nothing about their power levels.

And the stalemate they had in that game was basically intentional. Its the way the Cosmos itself wants. Odin understood that. And Dormammu seemed to understand that, too, from his comments about Thor's behavior in attempting to interfere.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Losing to Classic Strange is not really a low feat. Dude was a serious beast of a mage. Not to mention that Dormammu is on par with the Vishanti.
Dormammu never had a clean loss to Strange.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Well he imprisoned the mindless ones who were said to be living destroyer armors. But really, the Eternity feat should be enough.


Pure PIS. Also it should be noted his power varies under different conditions.


Dormammu was outside his realm, and had recently resurrected. Whenever he reincorporates he's weak for a while.


That's by no means a bad showing. That beast easily killed thousands of magic-users, many who ruled their own realms. It's insane.


None that didn't have extenuating circumstances.


Oh, only the fact that he knocked him out for two months.

so . . . really nothing except that 40 year-old feat. with the exception of that eternity feat (which odin can nearly match) odin's showings are better on a consistent basis.

and eny--i get that it doesn't mean they were 'necessarily' egual in terms of power, but the allusion was pretty clear and it makes sense that each would choose an avatar close in relative power.

You're saying Odin can also KO Eternity? I don't buy it.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Dormy.

Originally posted by King Kandy
You're saying Odin can also KO Eternity? I don't buy it.

certainly not currently. neither could dormmy. back in the time you're talking about odin defeated his dark side, infinity. and depending on how you interpret the retcon, that side of him was drawing power from the current version of infinity--the obverse of eternity. shaking the multiverse is a well known feat. being considered an equal to galactus himself.

fact is--dormmy has never reached that level (of battling eternity) again. and since he never has since, it's impossible and illogical to claim he's at that level--or really anywhere near it.

i still say the overwhelming amount of evidence points to his being on odin's level. if rkt>odin, i'd give thor the match. i'd call it even against odin himself.

Based on feats, Dormammu wins.

Originally posted by occultdestroyer
Based on feats, Dormammu wins.

the 40yr old eternity feat aside, which "featS" are you referring to?

Originally posted by leonidas
the 40yr old eternity feat aside, which "featS" are you referring to?
Losing to the Avengers and Loki in his own realm while amped by the Evil Eye?

Originally posted by Enyalus
Losing to the Avengers and Loki in his own realm while amped by the Evil Eye?



pretty much.

Bonafide cosmic flashlight is what it looked like...

dormammu = agamotto > rkt > odin

Originally posted by shokosugi
dormammu = agamotto > rkt > odin

proof?

Originally posted by Enyalus
Losing to the Avengers and Loki in his own realm while amped by the Evil Eye?
The evil-eye backfiring was what caused him to lose.

Originally posted by King Kandy
The evil-eye backfiring was what caused him to lose.
No, I'm pretty sure it was him wearing a purple shirt and his head being on fire.

Lack of fashion sense kills.

Originally posted by Enyalus
No, I'm pretty sure it was him wearing a purple shirt and his head being on fire.

Lack of fashion sense kills.
Is it just me or did his design change a lot in his first couple appearances? When he first appeared he wore all these elaborate costumes, but afterwords he started to just have "superhero tights"... probably lazy artists.

Early Strange Tales Dormy was awesome in multiple ways. Fashion sense was one of those.


I <3 that series.

Also he didn't get dragged down by endless bad showings.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Is it just me or did his design change a lot in his first couple appearances? When he first appeared he wore all these elaborate costumes, but afterwords he started to just have "superhero tights"... probably lazy artists.
he got redesigned again i think for Hood's storyline. Or he is just looking different

Originally posted by Enyalus
Early Strange Tales Dormy was awesome in multiple ways. Fashion sense was one of those.


I <3 that series.

those early strange tales WERE cool. seemed strange was constantly battling some cosmic-inter-dimensional guy who could wipe out our universe with a shrug. but they were always so damn ugly! that was when there really was no sense of a hierarchy like there is now. we just knew ALL those guys were really bad-ass.

alas, things change . . .

Originally posted by leonidas
those early strange tales WERE cool. seemed strange was constantly battling some cosmic-inter-dimensional guy who could wipe out our universe with a shrug. but they were always so damn ugly! that was when there really was no sense of a hierarchy like there is now. we just knew ALL those guys were really bad-ass.

alas, things change . . .

How do you think Spiral would do as Sorcerer Supreme?

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
How do you think Spiral would do as Sorcerer Supreme?

Originally posted by King Kandy
The evil-eye backfiring was what caused him to lose.

funny thing about this is that it was WANDA's power that disrupted the "all-powerful" eye which then drained dormmy's power. in that arc, that AMPED version of dormmy didn't seemed too eager to face uatu in battle--"i would battle even you". he also had no idea how uatu circumvented his spells and entered the dark dimension. later when it seemed uatu was a little miffed at dormmy, dormmy quickly urged uatu to forget about his anger.

so if an amped dormammu wasn't too eager to face a single watcher . . .

Originally posted by leonidas
proof?


yeah here's your proof

*shows leonidas his butt*

Originally posted by leonidas
how much more powerful was RKT than odinpowered thor?

odin=dormmy (or at least the 2 are close enough)

if RK thor is more powerful than odin then he'd win this.

Much more powerfull than his daddy, cause he also had the one thing Odin never had, the power/magic of the Runes, hence, Rune Lord Thor! And he takes this, handily! He defeated those elder gods who sit above, disolved Mangog with but a touch, and decapitated Loki and kept his head alive and at his side the whole ride of Ragnarok!

Originally posted by lordraiden
Much more powerfull than his daddy, cause he also had the one thing Odin never had, the power/magic of the Runes, hence, Rune Lord Thor! And he takes this, handily! He defeated those elder gods who sit above, disolved Mangog with but a touch, and decapitated Loki and kept his head alive and at his side the whole ride of Ragnarok!

cool. didn't know that. i agree then--if he was indeed much more powerful than odin, thor wins pretty soundly imo.

Originally posted by leonidas
funny thing about this is that it was WANDA's power that disrupted the "all-powerful" eye which then drained dormmy's power. in that arc, that AMPED version of dormmy didn't seemed too eager to face uatu in battle--"i would battle even you". he also had no idea how uatu circumvented his spells and entered the dark dimension. later when it seemed uatu was a little miffed at dormmy, dormmy quickly urged uatu to forget about his anger.

so if an amped dormammu wasn't too eager to face a single watcher . . .
Yeah but he said he would fight him if he had to. Also this was around the time where the Watcher was considered on Galactus's level.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Yeah but he said he would fight him if he had to. Also this was around the time where the Watcher was considered on Galactus's level.

as was odin. and an amped dormmy none-too-thrilled to fight a galactus level watcher (watcher were ALWAYS considered less than g though) clearly indicates dormmy is nowhere NEAR eternity's level.

Dormy's still around the level of any one member of the Vishanti, though. Which would put him above Odin, IMO.

Unclear as to whether it would put him above RKT, though.

it's possible. amped by the eye he was able to overcome odin's spell and change thor to human. don't know if he could do that without the aid of the eye. i still say a fight between odin and dormmy could go either way, but it's possible dormammu may be a slight bit above odin. my point was it was very debateable and he was no where near eternity level. this was a pretty good match. i'm still not sure how far above odin RKT was, but if he was clearly beyond him, i still say RTK clearly wins this.

He was definitely near Eternity level. Eternity was just as strong as he is now (was a full universe in first appearance, so actually a bit more), so actually all that's happened is Dorm had a lot of PIS showings since then.

Originally posted by King Kandy
He was definitely near Eternity level. Eternity was just as strong as he is now (was a full universe in first appearance, so actually a bit more), so actually all that's happened is Dorm had a lot of PIS showings since then.

I'm pretty sure that the 616 eternity is more than a single universe.

Talk to the Master

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
I'm pretty sure that the 616 eternity is more than a single universe.

Talk to the Master
Not the one that appeared in strange tales.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Not the one that appeared in strange tales.

his nature has changed. eternity--currently--is a multiverse unto himself.

as i've said--things change.

Originally posted by leonidas
his nature has changed. eternity--currently--is a multiverse unto himself.

as i've said--things change.
Really? Doesn't he have universal incarnations as well?

Whatever, Eternity has changed so many times.

First Version: Embodiment of a universe separate from the main one.

Second Version: Embodiment of time in the universe.

Third: Embodiment of life (on Earth), life (in the universe), Human life or whatever else writers who had no clue what they were doing thought of.

Fourth: Universal time again.

Fifth: Multiverse and universal incarnations, of time.

Sixth: Is the multiverse but has aspects.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Really? Doesn't he have universal incarnations as well?

Whatever, Eternity has changed so many times.

First Version: Embodiment of a universe separate from the main one.

Second Version: Embodiment of time in the universe.

Third: Embodiment of life (on Earth), life (in the universe), Human life or whatever else writers who had no clue what they were doing thought of.

Fourth: Universal time again.

Fifth: Multiverse and universal incarnations, of time.

Sixth: Is the multiverse but has aspects.



it is kinda ridiculous. don't forget the infinity aspect as well! anyway, all that's to say characters and how they are portrayed change dramatically over time. if there was a time marvel wanted everyone to think dormmy was an eternity level being, those times have past.

instead, they want us to think rulk is at that level.

Infinity seems like a dead concept now... she makes appearances but isn't really relevant to what Eternity is.

Dormammu 6/10

yeah. oblivion too. too bad. they had some potential. maybe.

Originally posted by leonidas
yeah. oblivion too. too bad. they had some potential. maybe.
Oblivion isn't a dead concept at all. His avatar, Maelstrom, just made a GOTG appearance three months ago or so. And openly said he was serving Oblivion still.

Originally posted by leonidas
yeah. oblivion too. too bad. they had some potential. maybe.
Infinity and Oblivion were such ill-conceived concepts.

There was life (Eternity) and Death, contrasted. Galactus balanced them.

Similarly, Eternity was the universes beginning, Death was it's end, Galactus was the balancer.

Everything covered. There was no need to introduce those other two for Quasar.

Other concepts that faded were Chaos and Order. They actually had the role of being opposite to death instead of eternity, and later on they were equal to Eternity and Death, and IB was equal to galactus.

Originally posted by lordraiden
Much more powerfull than his daddy, cause he also had the one thing Odin never had, the power/magic of the Runes, hence, Rune Lord Thor! And he takes this, handily! He defeated those elder gods who sit above, disolved Mangog with but a touch, and decapitated Loki and kept his head alive and at his side the whole ride of Ragnarok!

RKT did defeat the ones who sit above, but he did it by busting the loom of the fates and not fighting them directly. if he did fight them directly i'm not too sure if he'd win

Originally posted by gogogadgetgo
RKT did defeat the ones who sit above, but he did it by busting the loom of the fates and not fighting them directly. if he did fight them directly i'm not too sure if he'd win

That's the whole point of skyfathers and above/abstract beings, they don't fight physically, ie duke it out! You don't have to lay someone out to defeat them ;-) Bottom line is, they were begging him to join them so he wouldn't end their reign of Ragnarok and stop the cycle of them feeding on the Aesir/Asgardians endless cycle of Ragnarok!

Originally posted by Enyalus
Oblivion isn't a dead concept at all. His avatar, Maelstrom, just made a GOTG appearance three months ago or so. And openly said he was serving Oblivion still.

hmph. who knew!

Originally posted by lordraiden
That's the whole point of skyfathers and above/abstract beings, they don't fight physically, ie duke it out!
Actually they do it all the time.

Dormammu

Bump.

I always thought Dormmy and Odin was near the same.

RKT is leagues above odin. What RKT displayed Odin could never hope to accomplish. Odin gave his right eye and earn partial rune power/knowledge. Thor sacrificed everything hence he earned power far and above Odin.

RKT wins in my opinion but hard to determine but what margin.

Rune King Thor > Dormammu/Odin

From what I understand.

Odin clearly surpasses Thor in feats as back in the day, this guy at the very least equaled an Abstract like Galactus, but shit changes.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Rune King Thor > Dormammu/Odin

From what I understand.

Odin clearly surpasses Thor in feats as back in the day, this guy at the very least equaled an Abstract like Galactus, but shit changes. you TOOL....then you go ahed and get mad at me because Cyttorak does not have all the showings of Odin?...you are a DUMB ASS...

sly

Cytorrak literally has no feats. We have no clue how powerful he is. To say he is above Odin is baseless.

Rune King Thor on the other hand was clearly meant to surpass Odin in power. He did what Odin could never do, and it was stated that Odin wanted a son that could surpass him. Hence why he mated with the Elder Goddess Gaea. It was Thor's destiny to defeat Those Who Sit Above.

Back in the day Odin always had ridiculous feats. He was easily a Galaxy buster. Shit, he has feats that surpasses Galactus. The Cosmic Hierarchy changes but at that current point in time, he was meant to be ">Odin".

I do not see the problem here dumbass.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
sly

Cytorrak literally has no feats. you know them, but you are blind by FANBOY madness....its happens to thor FANS....

Outside his realm, Dormammu would probably lose.

In his realm, it would be a different story.

Dormammu ftw

RKT