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Out of all of the Akatsuki, there are 2 fights I would want to see: Itachi vs Kisame, and this one: Kisame vs Deidara.

Who is the better Akatsuki?

Kisame.

Skill, power, experience, etc.

Originally posted by Bada's Palin
Kisame.

Skill, power, experience, etc.

I will agree that he probably does have more of all of those things to his advantage, but I still don't think Kisame can beat Deidara. I say Deidara 6.5/10.

I've made a decision to not debate about Akastskutski members who are still alive.

Originally posted by NonSensi-Klown
I've made a decision to not debate about Akastskutski members who are still alive.

Why?

Because the ones who are still alive haven't shown there full abilities yet, except for Pein I guess. Kinda.

Originally posted by NonSensi-Klown
Because the ones who are still alive haven't shown there full abilities yet, except for Pein I guess. Kinda.

Well, what if I said 30% chakra Kisame vs Deidara. Now will you choose who would win?

Kisame is fast enough to get to Deidara before he makes the bird, strong enough to one shot him, has jutsus that would make his clay useless(lol water), and has a weapon that shaves, which I imagine would really really hurt.

kisame will win but i dont think it will be a one shot

kisame would win because only 30 percent was enough to almost beat guy. he can change the landscape to giv him the advantage. deidara would put up a good fight as always but loses cause he's not good enough.

Originally posted by roz88
kisame would win because only 30 percent was enough to almost beat guy. he can change the landscape to giv him the advantage. deidara would put up a good fight as always but loses cause he's not good enough.

I respectivly disagree.

I actually think deidara would beat 30% kisame

Originally posted by yungz22
I actually think deidara would beat 30% kisame

I agree. Until we see Kisame fight at full strength, the fight is Deidara vs 30% Kisame, and I say Deidara beats 30% Kisame.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
I agree. Until we see Kisame fight at full strength, the fight is Deidara vs 30% Kisame, and I say Deidara beats 30% Kisame.

this is a first we usually dont agree

Originally posted by yungz22
this is a first we usually dont agree

Usually, ha. Can you think of one that we did agree? I currently can't, can you? But that is a good thing then. I always will ahve someone to debate against.

But yeah, until we see Kisame fight at 100% chakra, Deidara wins.

Until ore is revealed about Kisame. Im going to Say Deidara

agree deidara will beat 30%

Tell me Kris Blaze, how does Kisame win?

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Tell me Kris Blaze, how does Kisame win?

who is kris blaze?

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/member.php?s=&action=getinfo&userid=107187

Originally posted by yungz22
I actually think deidara would beat 30% kisame


i think he would beat 30 percent kisame but not 100 percent kisame

^We can't say that because we haven't seen him 100% yet.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Tell me Kris Blaze, how does Kisame win?

Superior speed and reaction timed coupled with superior durability and strength together with far superior charka pool and much better techniques.

Tell me how he will avoid a C-3 Bomb?

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Superior speed and reaction timed

Originally posted by Final Blaxican


You do realize that a C-3 bomb can blow up an entire leaf village in an instant right? I don't see him escaping that, even with speed and reaction time.

You do realize that the C3 bomb takes time and concentration to make, right?

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
You do realize that the C3 bomb takes time and concentration to make, right?

How long did it honestly take him to create one against Gaara? Not that long. Creates one quickly and drops it. There is know way he can stop it once it is created.

I wonder how much damage the clay explosive will do when it lands in a lake.

Well it will do quite a bit, hitting water itself won't help absorb very much of the damage, just the heat.

But it doesn't matter.



And how is Deidera going to survive the blast? He'll have to create his bird first, which takes about 8-10 seconds, then he'll have to fly up to a high altitude to protect himself, then he'll make the bomb, which also takes 8-10 seconds.

And so you think Kisame, who has a plethora of long range attacks at his disposal and is already very fast in his own right, is just going to let Deidera do all of that without attacking once?

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
And how is Deidera going to survive the blast? He'll have to create his bird first, which takes about 8-10 seconds, then he'll have to fly up to a high altitude to protect himself, then he'll make the bomb, which also takes 8-10 seconds.

And so you think Kisame, who has a plethora of long range attacks at his disposal and is already very fast in his own right, is just going to let Deidera do all of that without attacking once?

You do realize that he use it against Gaara and stayed out of range? That's how he avoids it. Get's on his bird, makes C-3, blows it up on Kisame. He will probably be on the bird while they are fighting, so he doesn't waste time creating a bird.

Deidara will be in the sky. Kisame's attacks will try to attack him, and because Deidara is on his bird, he can easily avoid Kisame's water style attacks. It doesn't matter if Kisame is fast, because Sasuke couldn't touch him with his speed.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
I wonder how much damage the clay explosive will do when it lands in a lake.

Why would Deidara blow up the clay bombs under water? Are you kidding me?

You assume that he starts off the bird... why?

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
You do realize that he use it against Gaara and stayed out of range? That's how he avoids it. Get's on his bird, makes C-3, blows it up on Kisame. He will probably be on the bird while they are fighting, so he doesn't waste time creating a bird.

Deidara will be in the sky. Kisame's attacks will try to attack him, and because Deidara is on his bird, he can easily avoid Kisame's water style attacks. It doesn't matter if Kisame is fast, because Sasuke couldn't touch him with his speed.

Is that why Deidara won the fight against Sasuke?

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
You assume that he starts off the bird... why?

I din't say he stars on the bird. I said that he fights on the bird. Kisame speed blitzes, doesn't work, Deidara makes one in the air.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Is that why Deidara won the fight against Sasuke?

No, Sasuke nutrilized his clay with lightning, something Kisame lacks.

The only bomb Dei has ever made that was villagwe busting was his suicide bomb, the one used on Sungakure was only about the size of a city block if that, what Deidara said about the bomb is irrelevant.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
I din't say he stars on the bird. I said that he fights on the bird.

And you assume that Kisame is going to stand in one spot like an idiot while Deidera-

****ing hell. I'll just quote myself:

It doesn't take 8-10 sec. to create his bird. He will be on it in like 5 sec. And once he gets on his bird, he makes a C-3 bomb, which Kisame will not be able to stop. Kisame will attack, but because of the bird, they won't be able to connect.

Yeah, the idea of Kisame reaching him in 5 seconds is crazy.....

i actually give it to deidara here, as long as he's prepared for a 30% kisame clone that is. 100% kisame is a very different situation i'm assuming.

Originally posted by Wil7
I will agree that he probably does have more of all of those things to his advantage, but I still don't think Kisame can beat Deidara. I say Deidara 6.5/10.
How could you agree to all that and still think deidaras gonna win?
Originally posted by Wil7
Well, what if I said 30% chakra Kisame vs Deidara. Now will you choose who would win?
That still doesnt change the fact that blax hasnt seen there full abilities.
All you did was even out the fight. a little.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Yeah, the idea of Kisame reaching him in 5 seconds is crazy.....

Well, Kisame would speed blitz, but it won't work, and he will jump away, and finish making the bird, as he was able to create against Sasuke while Sasuke was attacking.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
i actually give it to deidara here, as long as he's prepared for a 30% kisame clone that is. 100% kisame is a very different situation i'm assuming.

100% Kisame wins probably

Originally posted by k1Lla441
How could you agree to all that and still think deidaras gonna win?

Easy, because Kisame can create a lake to give him the advantage, and Kisame has been fighting for longer. Kisame just doesn't have anything to nutrilize clay bombs.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
That still doesnt change the fact that blax hasnt seen there full abilities.
All you did was even out the fight. a little.

So, now we are talking about a fight between 30% Kisame vs Deidara, and I already said 100% Kisame would win, but not 30%.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Well, Kisame would speed blitz, but it won't work, and he will jump away, and finish making the bird, as he was able to create against Sasuke while Sasuke was attacking.



100% Kisame wins probably



Easy, because Kisame can create a lake to give him the advantage, and Kisame has been fighting for longer. Kisame just doesn't have anything to nutrilize clay bombs.



So, now we are talking about a fight between 30% Kisame vs Deidara, and I already said 100% Kisame would win, but not 30%.

Actually Ik=just thought of something. Deidara's bombs are infused with his chakra and that is what makes them explode right? Well Kisame's sword eats chakra what Kisame were to hit the bombs with his sword would they be defused. That is the question. Because if that were to happen which i don't see why not Deidara is finished

Originally posted by yungz22
Actually Ik=just thought of something. Deidara's bombs are infused with his chakra and that is what makes them explode right? Well Kisame's sword eats chakra what Kisame were to hit the bombs with his sword would they be defused. That is the question. Because if that were to happen which i don't see why not Deidara is finished

Would Deidara be stupid enough to not blow them up before Kisame tries to defuse? I don't think so. If Kisame tries to defuse it, Deidara would blow up the bomb right in his face.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Well, Kisame would speed blitz, but it won't work, and he will jump away, and finish making the bird, as he was able to create against Sasuke while Sasuke was attacking.



100% Kisame wins probably



Easy, because Kisame can create a lake to give him the advantage, and Kisame has been fighting for longer. Kisame just doesn't have anything to nutrilize clay bombs.



So, now we are talking about a fight between 30% Kisame vs Deidara, and I already said 100% Kisame would win, but not 30%.
1.What makes you automatically assume that his speed blitz wont work? please clarify.

2. he wins definitely

3. Dont assume he has to automatically nutrilize the bombs. He could stop deidara from even starting the bomb, he could run away from the bomb, or he could stay close to deidara ensuring that the bomb would kill both of them if he used it. Dont limit him to just "neutralizing" the bomb.

4. Still doesnt make any sense. blax said he cant make any judegment of this fight becuase he hasnt seen there full abilities. you giving kisame 30 percent chakra doesnt change the fact that he hasnt seen there full abilites. get it?

Originally posted by k1Lla441
1.What makes you automatically assume that his speed blitz wont work? please clarify.

2. he wins definitely

3. Dont assume he has to automatically nutrilize the bombs. He could stop deidara from even starting the bomb, he could run away from the bomb, or he could stay close to deidara ensuring that the bomb would kill both of them if he used it. Dont limit him to just "neutralizing" the bomb.

4. Still doesnt make any sense. blax said he cant make any judegment of this fight becuase he hasnt seen there full abilities. you giving kisame 30 percent chakra doesnt change the fact that he hasnt seen there full abilites. get it?

Sasuke tried to speed blitz against Deidara, and it didn't work, and Sasuke's speed is far superior to Kisame's.

Everyone knows Kisame wins at 100%.

How is he going to stop him from making the bombs while Deidara is in the air, flying around on his bird, and think that Kisame's 30% water style attacks could hit him when Gaara himself had trouble getting near him? Kisame won't be able to keep near Deidara because of the bird. He gets on that bird and keeps in the air.

I get it. I said I changed it to 30% Kisame. I don't care anymore if we haven't seen 100% Kisame, I just care about 30% Kisame currently.

When did he try to speed blitz him?

Numerous times in the very beginning of the fight. Deidara said Sasuke was too fast, but he was still avoiding him.

Deidera was already on his bird before the fight even staretd. And they ambushed Sawsgay anyway. He didn't know Deidera was there until he attacked him from the sky.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Well, Kisame would speed blitz, but it won't work, and he will jump away, and finish making the bird, as he was able to create against Sasuke while Sasuke was attacking.



100% Kisame wins probably



Easy, because Kisame can create a lake to give him the advantage, and Kisame has been fighting for longer. Kisame just doesn't have anything to nutrilize clay bombs.



So, now we are talking about a fight between 30% Kisame vs Deidara, and I already said 100% Kisame would win, but not 30%. 1. Because Deidara is faster than Kisame, right?

2. Yeah.

3. Water disolves clay.

4. No.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. Because Deidara is faster than Kisame, right?

2. Yeah.

3. Water disolves clay.

4. No.

Never said he was, and I never said he wasn't. But if Sasuke can't speed blitz, what makes you think Kisame can?

You actually think that Kisame will be able to dissole the clay before Deidara blows up a C-3 bomb on his ass?

Yes

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Never said he was, and I never said he wasn't. But if Sasuke can't speed blitz, what makes you think Kisame can?

You actually think that Kisame will be able to dissole the clay before Deidara blows up a C-3 bomb on his ass?

Yes

Because when deidara fought sasuke he was already on his bird. Kisame, in this fight, wont let deidara even get near his bird. Thats why kisame can.

He can definitely. Now it comes down to who can do jutsu faster: can kisame hit deidara with water faster, or can deidara make his bomb faster? seems like a pretty obvious answer.

No. you still dont get it. reread my above post over and over again until you do.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
Because when deidara fought sasuke he was already on his bird. Kisame, in this fight, wont let deidara even get near his bird. Thats why kisame can.

He can definitely. Now it comes down to who can do jutsu faster: can kisame hit deidara with water faster, or can deidara make his bomb faster? seems like a pretty obvious answer.

No. you still dont get it. reread my above post over and over again until you do.

Well, since you don't know, Deidara was standing next to Tobi, and Sasuke speed blitzed him numerous times, and it didn't work, and still got on the bird.

Here is another question, can Kisame hit Deidara with the water if Deidara is on the bird? The answer is also pretty obvious. Gaara's sand was chasing his ass, and yet Deidara was able to create bombs.

*sigh* how about I don't care .

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Never said he was, and I never said he wasn't. But if Sasuke can't speed blitz, what makes you think Kisame can?

You actually think that Kisame will be able to dissole the clay before Deidara blows up a C-3 bomb on his ass?

Yes Because Deidara won't be ambushing Kisame in this fight. In other words, he won't already be on his bird.

Only the specific bomb you are speaking took some time to make...amd going by Kisame's speed, he can dodge it.

It was not a village buster, nowhere near.

And, considering the pressure Kisame can fire certain water jutsus, yeah.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Because Deidara won't be ambushing Kisame in this fight. In other words, he won't already be on his bird.

Only the specific bomb you are speaking took some time to make...amd going by Kisame's speed, he can dodge it.

It was not a village buster, nowhere near.

And, considering the pressure Kisame can fire certain water jutsus, yeah.

You are still dodging the fact that even while Sasuke was speed blitzing Deidara, he was still able to create the bird. Sasuke's speed>>>Kisame's speed.

C-3 is a village destroyer. Gaara's sand just stopped the explosion. Deidara said himself that the village has a great artistic design, but let's blow it to pieces anyway.

Deidara can still go underground and place the clay under ground, he can make a mine field, and more.

That's the point, he didn't speed blitz him. Deidera already had his bird.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/356/10/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/356/11/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/356/12/

By the time Sawsgay even knew Deidera was there, Deidera was already on his bird. Before the fight even started.

He wasn't even fighting Deidara in the beginning, as he gets off of the bird to confront Sasuke. So he didn't start on the bird in the beginning.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/07/

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
He wasn't even fighting Deidara in the beginning, as he gets off of the bird to confront Sasuke. So he didn't start on the bird in the beginning.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/07/

It's very likely for Kisame to do all that talking.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
He wasn't even fighting Deidara in the beginning, as he gets off of the bird to confront Sasuke. So he didn't start on the bird in the beginning.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/07/

And Sawsgay could have killed him then, but he targeted Tobi instead. As pointed out, Sawsgay spared him because he wanted information.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
You are still dodging the fact that even while Sasuke was speed blitzing Deidara, he was still able to create the bird. Sasuke's speed>>>Kisame's speed.

C-3 is a village destroyer. Gaara's sand just stopped the explosion. Deidara said himself that the village has a great artistic design, but let's blow it to pieces anyway.

Deidara can still go underground and place the clay under ground, he can make a mine field, and more. 1. No, he never evaded Sasuke to create the bird, and Sasuke even alludes that he would have been killed, but Sasuke wanted information from him. and Sasuke is not much faster than Kisame. That is biased slander.

2. No it isn't. It clearly only enveloped what was about the size of maybe two city blocks. What Deidara said is irrelevant, what was shown is what matters.

3. Good thing Kisame can just create a lake for the battlefield, so he will never have to touch the ground.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. No, he never evaded Sasuke to create the bird, and Sasuke even alludes that he would have been killed, but Sasuke wanted information from him. and Sasuke is not much faster than Kisame. That is biased slander.

2. No it isn't. It clearly only enveloped what was about the size of maybe two city blocks. What Deidara said is irrelevant, what was shown is what matters.

3. Good thing Kisame can just create a lake for the battlefield, so he will never have to touch the ground.

Who cares if he spared him. All that matters is that Sasuke speed blitzed and Deidara avoided him, several times. Sasuke>>>Kisame in speed .

*sigh*. Then why did Gaara have to protect the entire village? If you say what Deidara said is irrelevant when he has known more about his jutsu's than anyone, then this conversation is irrelevant.

That's one problem down, but he still won't be able to avoid C-3, or C-4.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Who cares if he spared him. All that matters is that Sasuke speed blitzed and Deidara avoided him, several times. Sasuke>>>Kisame in speed .


You just contradicted yourself.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Who cares if he spared him. All that matters is that Sasuke speed blitzed and Deidara avoided him, several times. Sasuke>>>Kisame in speed .

*sigh*. Then why did Gaara have to protect the entire village? If you say what Deidara said is irrelevant when he has known more about his jutsu's than anyone, then this conversation is irrelevant.

That's one problem down, but he still won't be able to avoid C-3, or C-4. 1. As my overweight, half-breed ward just stated, that is a contradiction. Why is Sasuke much faster than Kisame?

2. He didn't. He protected the small section Deidara's bomb would have destroyed. As can be seen, the sand did not envelop the entire village either.

3. Deidara won't have time to make them considering Kisame's speed, and his devastating lonmg range attacks.

When the battle starts, why can't Kisame just puke out a lake? It will happen quicker than Deidara making the bird, and put Deidara underwater, making him easy prey for Kisame.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. As my overweight, half-breed ward just stated, that is a contradiction. Why is Sasuke much faster than Kisame?

2. He didn't. He protected the small section Deidara's bomb would have destroyed. As can be seen, the sand did not envelop the entire village either.

3. Deidara won't have time to make them considering Kisame's speed, and his devastating lonmg range attacks.

When the battle starts, why can't Kisame just puke out a lake? It will happen quicker than Deidara making the bird, and put Deidara underwater, making him easy prey for Kisame.

1. Because he is faster. Kisame has shown no big speed feats.

2. The small section, you mean the entire village?

3. Again, Kisame's water style attacks are useless while Deidara is in the air. Deidara would blow Kisame's shark like ass to pieces.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
1. Because he is faster. Kisame has shown no big speed feats.


Which doesn't matter because Deidera isn't as fast or faster than Sawsgay... And he still didn't make his bird before Sawsgay could attack him. In fact, when Deidera made the big ass C2 bird Sawsgay literally stood there and watched him.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
Which doesn't matter because Deidera isn't as fast or faster than Sawsgay... And he still didn't make his bird before Sawsgay could attack him. In fact, when Deidera made the big ass C2 bird Sawsgay literally stood there and watched him.

I know, but he is able to dodge Sasuke and avoid him. So, if Sasuke tried to attack, he would just use the bird and go higher in the air to avoid him.

But that still doesn't change the fact that Sawsgay had numerous chances to kill him (In the beggining, when Deidera was forming the C2 bird), but chose (Not couldn't, chose), not to kill him. The only time Sawsgay tried to speed blitz him and Deidera dodged was when Deidera was already on his bird, not before.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/08/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/09/

And notice that Deidera was standing on the right side of Tobi, yet Sawsgay sliced Tobi on his left side. And then remarked that Deidera was the talker so Sawsgay wanted to interrogate him.

What does that prove? Sawsgay wasn't even aiming at him. Just because he jumped away doesn't mean he moved faster.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
And notice that Deidera was standing on the right side of Tobi, yet Sawsgay sliced Tobi on his left side. And then remarked that Deidera was the talker so Sawsgay wanted to interrogate him.

What does that prove? Sawsgay wasn't even aiming at him. Just because he jumped away doesn't mean he moved faster.

The side doesn't matter. What matters is that is still avoided Sasuke before he sliced through Tobi. If it was the right side, the result would have remained the same.

It proves that he has avoided extremely quick speed, and Kisame won't be able to speed blitz him.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
The side doesn't matter. What matters is that is still avoided Sasuke before he sliced through Tobi. If it was the right side, the result would have remained the same.

We don't know that.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
We don't know that.

Yeah we do. It shows Deidara jumping out of the way, and then Sasuke slashing. If Sasuke slashing at the right, Deidara would have still jumped out of the way first.

And how do we know that Sawsgay, using his great speed and Shunshin as well, wouldn't have simply followed Deidera when he jumped and slashed him when he was in midair, and thus trapped (You can't change direction in midair)? The only reason Sawsgay stoppd the attack is because he got Tobi...

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
And how do we know that Sawsgay, using his great speed and Shunshin as well, wouldn't have simply followed Deidera when he jumped and slashed him when he was in midair, and thus trapped (You can't change direction in midair)? The only reason Sawsgay stoppd the attack is because he got Tobi...

Because by the time Sasuke finished the first slash, Deidara was already on the tree, so Sasuke would try to slash again, and Deidara would just jump out of the way again.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/14/

So Deidara can blow a C1 bomb up to avoid someone.

Nice. Not even revealing why he had to use explosions to dodge.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/13/

Sasuke went behind him without Deidara noticing until he was there, and HAD to detonate the bomb.

He could NOT cope with Sasuke's speed like you are suggesting, and didn't dodge Sasuke the first time, Sasuke was not even aiming for him. And you know, that was only one rushing slash, during a speedblitz, Kisame would be actively pursuing him, not moving in straight lines and stopping if he misses.

Kisame has no speed feats? How about overwhelming Gai.

Look at the scan smart one. The bomb, the explosion, and the sand was nowhere near the size of the whole village.

Are you like, dense, or what? Deidara is not starting this fight on his bird, and it takes alot less time for Kisame to barf out a lake than it does for Deidara to make his bird.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Nice. Not even revealing why he had to use explosions to dodge.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/13/

Sasuke went behind him without Deidara noticing until he was there, and HAD to detonate the bomb.

He could NOT cope with Sasuke's speed like you are suggesting, and didn't dodge Sasuke the first time, Sasuke was not even aiming for him. And you know, that was only one rushing slash, during a speedblitz, Kisame would be actively pursuing him, not moving in straight lines and stopping if he misses.

Kisame has no speed feats? How about overwhelming Gai.

Look at the scan smart one. The bomb, the explosion, and the sand was nowhere near the size of the whole village.

Are you like, dense, or what? Deidara is not starting this fight on his bird, and it takes alot less time for Kisame to barf out a lake than it does for Deidara to make his bird.
feels like a weight has been lifted off my shoulders

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Nice. Not even revealing why he had to use explosions to dodge.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/13/

Sasuke went behind him without Deidara noticing until he was there, and HAD to detonate the bomb.

He could NOT cope with Sasuke's speed like you are suggesting, and didn't dodge Sasuke the first time, Sasuke was not even aiming for him. And you know, that was only one rushing slash, during a speedblitz, Kisame would be actively pursuing him, not moving in straight lines and stopping if he misses.

Kisame has no speed feats? How about overwhelming Gai.

Look at the scan smart one. The bomb, the explosion, and the sand was nowhere near the size of the whole village.

Are you like, dense, or what? Deidara is not starting this fight on his bird, and it takes alot less time for Kisame to barf out a lake than it does for Deidara to make his bird.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/08/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/09/

As I have said already, It won't matter what side he is on because he jumped out of the way first, and then the slash happened.

Wow, overwelming Gai. Impressive. Just because he overwelmed Gai doesn't make him fast.

You are talking about the beginning of the explosion. You are saying that explosions don't get bigger. Is that what you are saying?

While Kisame barfs out a lake, Deidara creates the bird. It is that simple.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/08/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/09/

As I have said already, It won't matter what side he is on because he jumped out of the way first, and then the slash happened.

Wow, overwelming Gai. Impressive. Just because he overwelmed Gai doesn't make him fast.

You are talking about the beginning of the explosion. You are saying that explosions don't get bigger. Is that what you are saying?

While Kisame barfs out a lake, Deidara creates the bird. It is that simple.

Overwhelming guy is an impressive speed feat, speed being one of his major fighting points and him working out all the time.

But the point is Kisame is fast enough to speed blitz. Too fast for deidara to make his bird. Fight is over. And if he tries to make these "mines" then while hes doing that kisame will make a lake. He cant make mines and his bird at the same time.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
Overwhelming guy is an impressive speed feat, speed being one of his major fighting points and him working out all the time.

But the point is Kisame is fast enough to speed blitz. Too fast for deidara to make his bird. Fight is over. And if he tries to make these "mines" then while hes doing that kisame will make a lake. He cant make mines and his bird at the same time.

He overwhelmed him with jutsu's and pure strength, not speed.

Kisame won't be able to speed blitz, because he is not fast enough. Deidara would just jump away and make a bird, and once that happens, the fight is pretty much over. He would make the bird then mines, all he needs is his mouths on his palms. He would just shoot them out and blow them all up before they hit the ground, and Kisame would have nowhere to run.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/08/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/09/

As I have said already, It won't matter what side he is on because he jumped out of the way first, and then the slash happened.

Wow, overwelming Gai. Impressive. Just because he overwelmed Gai doesn't make him fast.

You are talking about the beginning of the explosion. You are saying that explosions don't get bigger. Is that what you are saying?

While Kisame barfs out a lake, Deidara creates the bird. It is that simple. 1. I saw the scans already, Sasuke was not making an effort to hit him, hell, he stopped after slashing Tobi, do you even know what a speed-blitz is? It's overwhelming the opponent, not even giving them time to use their own attacks, with your speed. Sasuke did NOT try to blitz him. He barely dodged one slash not even meant for him, and then we see that Deidara had great difficulty dodging Sasuke, hence why he used an explosion to knock him away. If you are still going to defend Deidara resisting a blitz, you are biased, and a fanboy, plain and simple.

2. Um, yeah, it does. Gai is like, you know, fast. If the person were slow, he could use his speed to close the distance or evade his blows, he could not against Kisame.

3. Then prove the explosion became as big as the village. Because the explosion was shown in ONE panel, and the sand was clearly not as large as a village, you are grabbing at straws.

4. How does Deidara create the bird before being flooded by water?

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. I saw the scans already, Sasuke was not making an effort to hit him, hell, he stopped after slashing Tobi, do you even know what a speed-blitz is? It's overwhelming the opponent, not even giving them time to use their own attacks, with your speed. Sasuke did NOT try to blitz him. He barely dodged one slash not even meant for him, and then we see that Deidara had great difficulty dodging Sasuke, hence why he used an explosion to knock him away. If you are still going to defend Deidara resisting a blitz, you are biased, and a fanboy, plain and simple.

2. Um, yeah, it does. Gai is like, you know, fast. If the person were slow, he could use his speed to close the distance or evade his blows, he could not against Kisame.

3. Then prove the explosion became as big as the village. Because the explosion was shown in ONE panel, and the sand was clearly not as large as a village, you are grabbing at straws.

4. How does Deidara create the bird before being flooded by water?

AGAIN, if it was meant for Deidara, he would have still dodged the attack, because he jumped out of the way, then the slash occured.

If Kisame was fast, he would have dodged the 6th gate, not get is ass pumbled to death. Wow, fast attacks, slow running, that's a big difference.

You are still acting as if explosions don't get bigger, that they stay one size, which is incorrect.

Gai, Neji, Lee, and even Tenten avoided the attack. While the lake is being created, Deidara creates the bird.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
If Kisame was fast, he would have dodged the 6th gate, not get is ass pumbled to death. Wow, fast attacks, slow running, that's a big difference..

- That was a clone with 30% of his chakra.

- Kakashi needed sharingan to see Lee when he had the 4th gate, the clone still reacted to Gai using 6th gate....

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
- That was a clone with 30% of his chakra.

- Kakashi needed sharingan to see Lee when he had the 4th gate, the clone still reacted to Gai using 6th gate....

Speed doen't take chakra. 30% speed=100% speed

Gai doesn't have sharingan and he kept up with it pretty well. Gaara reacted to Lee as well, but still couldn't stop it.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Speed doen't take chakra. 30% speed=100% speed

Not true at all. Ninja use chakra under their feet to increase their speed in addition to clinging to surfaces.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Speed doen't take chakra. 30% speed=100% speed

Gai doesn't have sharingan and he kept up with it pretty well. Gaara reacted to Lee as well, but still couldn't stop it.

Chakra affects anything. A boost in chakra would naturally lead to a boost in both speed and stamina.

Even so, being able to react to Gai going 6th gate is the fastest we've seen yet.

No, you have to train your body for speed. Speed isn't counted as a jutsu.

Yeah, that's a tiny speed feat, which isn't much?

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
AGAIN, if it was meant for Deidara, he would have still dodged the attack, because he jumped out of the way, then the slash occured.

If Kisame was fast, he would have dodged the 6th gate, not get is ass pumbled to death. Wow, fast attacks, slow running, that's a big difference.

You are still acting as if explosions don't get bigger, that they stay one size, which is incorrect.

Gai, Neji, Lee, and even Tenten avoided the attack. While the lake is being created, Deidara creates the bird. 1. You're a fvcking moron. What part of "overwhelming the opponent, not even giving them time to use their own attacks, with your speed" is so hard to comprehend? Sasuke slashed once and then stopped, and then we clearly see he cannot react to Deidara's speed like you say he can, so you are just grasping at straws and acting like an idiot.

2. Gai, one of the fastest characters in the series, unlocking the 6th Gate, which makes him multiple times faster. Are you saying stupid shit like this on purpose, or are you serious? Are you implying Deidara could have dodged Gai using the 6 Gates?

3. Prove that the explosion was any bigger than what we saw. And then there is the fact that we clearly can see the sand shield is not covering near the whole village. So you are wrong, I am right, deal with it.

4. All of whom, except maybe Tenten, are much faster than Deidara. Sasuke could not avoid Sasuke with his own speed, a lake spawning almost instantaneously will trap him.

Not that Kisame needs a single jutsu to win this fight.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
No, you have to train your body for speed. Speed isn't counted as a jutsu.

Yeah, that's a tiny speed feat, which isn't much?
How is that not much? have you seen rock lee at his 4th gate? you cant even see him move.

So im thinking that a clone, with 30 percent chakra, even reacting to a 6TH gate gai, is an amazing speed feat.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
How is that not much? have you seen rock lee at his 4th gate? you cant even see him move.

So im thinking that a clone, with 30 percent chakra, even reacting to a 6TH gate gai, is an amazing speed feat.

The gates use chakra, and are jutsu's. Running around doesn't use chakra.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. You're a fvcking moron. What part of "overwhelming the opponent, not even giving them time to use their own attacks, with your speed" is so hard to comprehend? Sasuke slashed once and then stopped, and then we clearly see he cannot react to Deidara's speed like you say he can, so you are just grasping at straws and acting like an idiot.

2. Gai, one of the fastest characters in the series, unlocking the 6th Gate, which makes him multiple times faster. Are you saying stupid shit like this on purpose, or are you serious? Are you implying Deidara could have dodged Gai using the 6 Gates?

3. Prove that the explosion was any bigger than what we saw. And then there is the fact that we clearly can see the sand shield is not covering near the whole village. So you are wrong, I am right, deal with it.

4. All of whom, except maybe Tenten, are much faster than Deidara. Sasuke could not avoid Sasuke with his own speed, a lake spawning almost instantaneously will trap him.

Not that Kisame needs a single jutsu to win this fight.

1. How many jutsu's did you actually see Gai try to get off? The fact is that Deidara was able to dodge Sasuke's attack, no matter what direction he slashed.

2. Gai, only one of the fastest because of the gates. Never said that, because the 6th gate is faster than Sasuke's speed with ease.

3. You're not really reading my posts, are you? I said that they show the beginning of the explosion. You are acting like explosions don't get bigger.

4. Lee>Deidara, Neji<Deidara, Tenten<Deidara, and Gai<Deidara.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
The gates use chakra, and are jutsu's. Running around doesn't use chakra.



1. How many jutsu's did you actually see Gai try to get off? The fact is that Deidara was able to dodge Sasuke's attack, no matter what direction he slashed.

2. Gai, only one of the fastest because of the gates. Never said that, because the 6th gate is faster than Sasuke's speed with ease.

3. You're not really reading my posts, are you? I said that they show the beginning of the explosion. You are acting like explosions don't get bigger.

4. Lee>Deidara, Neji<Deidara, Tenten<Deidara, and Gai<Deidara.



now your just avoiding the arguement

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
No, you have to train your body for speed. Speed isn't counted as a jutsu.



So? Jutsus don't have to use chakra. There are jutsu that use zero chakra. What's your point?

Pretty sure even taijutsu requires chakra, that's why Sharingan can read taijutsu, and why Sasuke felt chakra in Rock Lee's block before the chuunin exam.

And if Chakra didn't afefct your speed and strength then how come ninjas get slower and weaker when they run out of chakra?

Show me where it states that speed uses chakra. You just have to build your body up to be fast.

Originally posted by k1Lla441
now your just avoiding the arguement

Yeah, good arguement as well, clapping, bravo.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. How many jutsu's did you actually see Gai try to get off? The fact is that Deidara was able to dodge Sasuke's attack, no matter what direction he slashed.

2. Gai, only one of the fastest because of the gates. Never said that, because the 6th gate is faster than Sasuke's speed with ease.

3. You're not really reading my posts, are you? I said that they show the beginning of the explosion. You are acting like explosions don't get bigger.

4. Lee>Deidara, Neji<Deidara, Tenten<Deidara, and Gai<Deidara.


1. Gai is a TAIJUTSU specialist, not a Ninjutsu specialist, and what are you implying? We already know that Gai had an incredibly difficult time fighting Kisame, and what was your point in mentioning this irrelevant piece of anyway? He dodged ONE of Sasuke's attacks, and, it was not even aimed at Deidara, who was SPARED by Sasuke for questioning. Oh...And then, we see Deidara cannot handle Sasuke's speed. You lost this argument. Grow a pair and admit it.

2. O RLY? Gai even without the Gates is one of the fastest in the series, second only to guys like Itachi or Madara in terms of speed, Gai is also far faster than Deidara. Gai is faster than Sasuke, period.

3. Prove that that was only the beginning of the explosion.

4. I'm sorry, but did you just say Gai is slower than Deidara? Gai is faster than Lee, Neji is faster than Deidara in terms of reflexes by feats, and TenTen is the only one who may be slower, but that is from lack of feats.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. Gai is a TAIJUTSU specialist, not a Ninjutsu specialist, and what are you implying? We already know that Gai had an incredibly difficult time fighting Kisame, and what was your point in mentioning this irrelevant piece of anyway? He dodged ONE of Sasuke's attacks, and, it was not even aimed at Deidara, who was SPARED by Sasuke for questioning. Oh...And then, we see Deidara cannot handle Sasuke's speed. You lost this argument. Grow a pair and admit it.

2. O RLY? Gai even without the Gates is one of the fastest in the series, second only to guys like Itachi or Madara in terms of speed, Gai is also far faster than Deidara. Gai is faster than Sasuke, period.

3. Prove that that was only the beginning of the explosion.

4. I'm sorry, but did you just say Gai is slower than Deidara? Gai is faster than Lee, Neji is faster than Deidara in terms of reflexes by feats, and TenTen is the only one who may be slower, but that is from lack of feats.

1. I am not worried about Gai vs Kisame right now. Are you not getting that Deidara JUMPED OUT OF THE WAY, and then the SLASH OCCURED, or is that not getting through your thick skull.

2. With the gates Gai is faster, without them he is slower than both of them.

3. Go find the manga of the explosion.

4. Nope, Gai is faster, although Deidara does have good reflexes. Neji is only has fast reflexes because of Byakugan, and if he was fast, he would have dodged the punch from Naruto. So Deidara is still faster in reflexes as he dodged Sasuke's speed blitz, as if Neji would as well, but if he didn't have byakugan, and regular eyes, he would probably die.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. I am not worried about Gai vs Kisame right now. Are you not getting that Deidara JUMPED OUT OF THE WAY, and then the SLASH OCCURED, or is that not getting through your thick skull.

2. With the gates Gai is faster, without them he is slower than both of them.

3. Go find the manga of the explosion.

4. Nope, Gai is faster, although Deidara does have good reflexes. Neji is only has fast reflexes because of Byakugan, and if he was fast, he would have dodged the punch from Naruto. So Deidara is still faster in reflexes as he dodged Sasuke's speed blitz, as if Neji would as well, but if he didn't have byakugan, and regular eyes, he would probably die. 1. Yet you were the one who brought up what techniques Gai used. The attack was not meant for him, and it was not a speedblitz, and then when Sasuke was aiming for Deidara, Deidara could not dodge him. You lost. Deal with it.

2. Both of who? Itachi and Madara? Duh. I just said that, now you are dodging, and Gai with the six Gates is still not as fast as Madara.

3. http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/249/11/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/249/12-13/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/249/14/

So as we can clearly see, the explosion, and the shield, were not as large as the whole village.

4. Neji always has had fast reflexes, with or without Byakugan, and without it is still faster than Deidara. And Sasuke did not speedblitz Deidara, I have explained to you what an actual speedblitz is multiple times, but because you're am idiot, you have chosen to ignore it.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. I am not worried about Gai vs Kisame right now. Are you not getting that Deidara JUMPED OUT OF THE WAY, and then the SLASH OCCURED, or is that not getting through your thick skull.

2. With the gates Gai is faster, without them he is slower than both of them.

3. Go find the manga of the explosion.

4. Nope, Gai is faster, although Deidara does have good reflexes. Neji is only has fast reflexes because of Byakugan, and if he was fast, he would have dodged the punch from Naruto. So Deidara is still faster in reflexes as he dodged Sasuke's speed blitz, as if Neji would as well, but if he didn't have byakugan, and regular eyes, he would probably die.


giljotiinistop while you have the chance.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. Yet you were the one who brought up what techniques Gai used. The attack was not meant for him, and it was not a speedblitz, and then when Sasuke was aiming for Deidara, Deidara could not dodge him. You lost. Deal with it.

2. Both of who? Itachi and Madara? Duh. I just said that, now you are dodging, and Gai with the six Gates is still not as fast as Madara.

3. http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/249/11/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/249/12-13/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/249/14/

So as we can clearly see, the explosion, and the shield, were not as large as the whole village.

4. Neji always has had fast reflexes, with or without Byakugan, and without it is still faster than Deidara. And Sasuke did not speedblitz Deidara, I have explained to you what an actual speedblitz is multiple times, but because you're am idiot, you have chosen to ignore it.

1. I see you are avoiding the 1st speedblitz fact. Deidara knew he couldn't avoid the 2nd one, but he kinda did when he blew up the C-1 bomb.

2. I know, and I was agreeing.

3. I don't care for the manga views of the explosion because what they show in some manga's are bad.

4. Incorrect. Neji can dodge Lee's speed with his byakugan, but can he dodge Lee's speed without byakugan? The answer should be simple. I got what a speedblitz is. Sasuke aimed for Tobi, but Deidara still jumped out of the way before the slash occured, so if he aimed for Deidara, he would have still avoided it. Get that through your head.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. I see you are avoiding the 1st speedblitz fact. Deidara knew he couldn't avoid the 2nd one, but he kinda did when he blew up the C-1 bomb.

2. I know, and I was agreeing.

3. I don't care for the manga views of the explosion because what they show in some manga's are bad.

4. Incorrect. Neji can dodge Lee's speed with his byakugan, but can he dodge Lee's speed without byakugan? The answer should be simple. I got what a speedblitz is. Sasuke aimed for Tobi, but Deidara still jumped out of the way before the slash occured, so if he aimed for Deidara, he would have still avoided it. Get that through your head.

1. He didnt avoid it.

2. No you werent.

3. Is this a joke?? You were the one who asked to see the manga explosion!
Posted by Ultimate Wil:
Go find the manga of the explosion.

4. If sasuke ever speed blitzed deidara, then deidara would be dead.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
3. I don't care for the manga views of the explosion because what they show in some manga's are bad.



*sighs*

And what part of " THE BYAKUGAN DOES NOT GRANT PRECOGNITIVE ABILITIES", do people not understand?

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. I see you are avoiding the 1st speedblitz fact. Deidara knew he couldn't avoid the 2nd one, but he kinda did when he blew up the C-1 bomb.

2. I know, and I was agreeing.

3. I don't care for the manga views of the explosion because what they show in some manga's are bad.

4. Incorrect. Neji can dodge Lee's speed with his byakugan, but can he dodge Lee's speed without byakugan? The answer should be simple. I got what a speedblitz is. Sasuke aimed for Tobi, but Deidara still jumped out of the way before the slash occured, so if he aimed for Deidara, he would have still avoided it. Get that through your head. 1. No. But the fact that Sasuke was not aiming for Deidara and then the fact that we see Deidara could not cope with his speed discredits that "feat." And he did not try to pursue Deidara with his speed. Which is what a speedblitz is.

3. You just asked for the manga view of the explosion, and those scans clearly show the explosion and the shield were not that large at all. Now, you're just trying to BS your way out of the argument.

4. Byakugan does not grant pre-cog abilities like I originally thought it did, that's Neji's natural speed. Answer this. Would Deidara have been un-injured if Sasuke kept trying to attack him instead of doing single sword slashes? The answer is obvious.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. No. But the fact that Sasuke was not aiming for Deidara and then the fact that we see Deidara could not cope with his speed discredits that "feat." And he did not try to pursue Deidara with his speed. Which is what a speedblitz is.

3. You just asked for the manga view of the explosion, and those scans clearly show the explosion and the shield were not that large at all. Now, you're just trying to BS your way out of the argument.

4. Byakugan does not grant pre-cog abilities like I originally thought it did, that's Neji's natural speed. Answer this. Would Deidara have been un-injured if Sasuke kept trying to attack him instead of doing single sword slashes? The answer is obvious.

1. What I am trying to say is that Deidara still dodged the 1st one, even though not attempted for him. If Sasuke tried after the 1st one, Deidara would be dead.

3. Yes, before you posted it, I looked at it, and I didn't think that was right, and then I looked at the anime, and at first, they show it taking out the entire center, and then showing Gaara's sand covering almost all of the village.

4. Yeah it does, because if it didn't, then Lee would have beaten Neji's ass a long time ago because of the speed without weights. You never answered my question. Deidara would have died.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
*sighs*

And what part of " THE BYAKUGAN DOES NOT GRANT PRECOGNITIVE ABILITIES", do people not understand?

It allows you to see the persons chakra, and almost 360 degrees. So he can dodge most attacks.

Allowing you to see chakra and all-around doesn't suddenly make it have pre-cog abilities. The only thing it does is give you insight on a person. Neji is just a better taijutsu user than Lee..which is why he wins.

As for the fight Kisame would own Deidara.

Originally posted by Kento
Allowing you to see chakra and all-around doesn't suddenly make it have pre-cog abilities. The only thing it does is give you insight on a person. Neji is just a better taijutsu user than Lee..which is why he wins.

As for the fight Kisame would own Deidara.

Actually it does, because you can see where he is and an attack, and he can dodge it in time. If Neji didn't have byakugan, lee would own him.

Deidara>30% Kisame

Originally posted by Kento
Allowing you to see chakra and all-around doesn't suddenly make it have pre-cog abilities. The only thing it does is give you insight on a person. Neji is just a better taijutsu user than Lee..which is why he wins.

As for the fight Kisame would own Deidara. the newest databook states that neji has the same speed as lee has, though it looks like it's more close combat quickness rather than traveling speed.

anyway, deidara imo would destroy the 30% clone if he was prepared for it and knew what he was up against.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
Actually it does, because you can see where he is and an attack, and he can dodge it in time.

That's not precog. That's seeing an attack as it's happening, not before, which is what precognition is.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. What I am trying to say is that Deidara still dodged the 1st one, even though not attempted for him. If Sasuke tried after the 1st one, Deidara would be dead.

3. Yes, before you posted it, I looked at it, and I didn't think that was right, and then I looked at the anime, and at first, they show it taking out the entire center, and then showing Gaara's sand covering almost all of the village.

4. Yeah it does, because if it didn't, then Lee would have beaten Neji's ass a long time ago because of the speed without weights. You never answered my question. Deidara would have died.



It allows you to see the persons chakra, and almost 360 degrees. So he can dodge most attacks. 1. Then wtf are you even arguing? It doesn't matter if he can dodge the first friggin attack if he gets decapitated by the second.

3. And guess what? The manga is the canon, most official source of Naruto, NOT the anime! Because it was NEVER present in the anime that the explosion or the sand were as large as the village.

4. Or, maybe it is because Neji has the reflexes and speed to block and dodge Lee's blows? Yes Neji can dodge Lee without the Byakugan, because the Byakugan does not give precog abilities like the Sharingan.

Which does not give him precog.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
Actually it does, because you can see where he is and an attack, and he can dodge it in time. If Neji didn't have byakugan, lee would own him.

Deidara>30% Kisame

Can you explain to me how the **** "360 degree vision" is helpful at all when your opponent is standing right in front of you, throwing punches? You realize that in 99% percent of close quarters fights the two opponents are facing each other, right? So being able to see through your sister's t-shirt and having a 60 degree vision isn't at all helpful in a fist fight.

It is only helpful when fighting opponents who can attack from all angles like Naruto, Lee has no such moves.

Its only real advantage against Lee is that Byakugan is required for the Jyuken fighting style.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
the newest databook states that neji has the same speed as lee has, though it looks like it's more close combat quickness rather than traveling speed.

anyway, deidara imo would destroy the 30% clone if he was prepared for it and knew what he was up against. What were there stats before the timeskip in the first databooks? Even still what I said is relevant. Neji IS the better taijutsu user and that is why he wins.

Eh Deidara does have moves that could oneshot Kisame 100% or 30% I just don't think he has the speed to do it before Kisame does something.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. Then wtf are you even arguing? It doesn't matter if he can dodge the first friggin attack if he gets decapitated by the second.

3. And guess what? The manga is the canon, most official source of Naruto, NOT the anime! Because it was NEVER present in the anime that the explosion or the sand were as large as the village.

4. Or, maybe it is because Neji has the reflexes and speed to block and dodge Lee's blows? Yes Neji can dodge Lee without the Byakugan, because the Byakugan does not give precog abilities like the Sharingan.

Which does not give him precog.

1. I am saying that he was still able to dodge the 1st one. Sasuke is faster than Kisame by alot, which makes dodging Kisame easier.

2. Anime shows all of the angles, and the manga gives one shitty look and that's it.

4. He can block and dodge his attacks because of his byakugan, allowing to see chakra, and 360 degrees. No he can't, are you crazy? Lee would easily destroy Neji if Neji didn't have byakugan. Byakugan allows you to see where the person will be, and has pretty much the exact thing as sharingan. Just look at the Naruto/Neji fight.

You don't listen to you?

Look at the Naruto fight/ What? Byakugan is useful there because Naruto can literally coem from any angle, because of his kage bunshins. Rock Lee can not do that.. so how woulda the Byakugan matter?

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. I am saying that he was still able to dodge the 1st one. Sasuke is faster than Kisame by alot, which makes dodging Kisame easier.

2. Anime shows all of the angles, and the manga gives one shitty look and that's it.

4. He can block and dodge his attacks because of his byakugan, allowing to see chakra, and 360 degrees. No he can't, are you crazy? Lee would easily destroy Neji if Neji didn't have byakugan. Byakugan allows you to see where the person will be, and has pretty much the exact thing as sharingan. Just look at the Naruto/Neji fight. 1. Sasuke is not faster than Kisame by alot. That's slander.

2. And it also shows what is incorrect. We clearly see from the ground in the manga that the sand shield was NOT as large as the village.

4. Which does not give you precog against an opponent or help you predict movements. Lee would destroy Neji if he did not have the Byakugan, you are right about that, but not because Neji uses it to track Lee's movements, it is because his entire fighting style depends on it. YOU look at the Naruto/Neji fight, the Byakugan was useful there because he had an opponent attacking from all angles, Lee is one person.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. Sasuke is not faster than Kisame by alot. That's slander.

2. And it also shows what is incorrect. We clearly see from the ground in the manga that the sand shield was NOT as large as the village.

4. Which does not give you precog against an opponent or help you predict movements. Lee would destroy Neji if he did not have the Byakugan, you are right about that, but not because Neji uses it to track Lee's movements, it is because his entire fighting style depends on it. YOU look at the Naruto/Neji fight, the Byakugan was useful there because he had an opponent attacking from all angles, Lee is one person.

1. Sasuke>Kisame in speed

2. Yeah, one crappy view makes you correct? You really need to watch the anime, because it clearly shows sand over almost the entire village.

3. Yes, Lee would because he wouldn't be able to avoid any of his speed moves, unlike with Byakugan he can, so we agree on one thing. Well since Neji is a defensive fighter, Neji won't really attack unless he is attacked, and he won't be able to avoid Lee's speed, or use gentle fist. And you see Lee zooming around Gaara with 1 attack at his front, and less than a second later he is attacking his back dude.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. Sasuke>Kisame in speed

2. Yeah, one crappy view makes you correct? You really need to watch the anime, because it clearly shows sand over almost the entire village.

3. Yes, Lee would because he wouldn't be able to avoid any of his speed moves, unlike with Byakugan he can, so we agree on one thing. Well since Neji is a defensive fighter, Neji won't really attack unless he is attacked, and he won't be able to avoid Lee's speed, or use gentle fist. And you see Lee zooming around Gaara with 1 attack at his front, and less than a second later he is attacking his back dude. 1. Not by a substantial enough amount to change the difference between what would happen if they blitzed Deidara.

2. Only my view clearly shows it is not that large, and manga is canon, anime is not.

3. Can you fvckin read? Byakugan does NOT make it easier to dodge attacks, it has NEVER been stated, and you CAN'T prove it. He CAN avoid Lee's speed, he's DONE it. Gaara? Gaara is perhaps THE slowest character in the series, he is accustomed to no moving when fighting, and has never shown impressive reflexes. Neji, unlike Gaara, can do this funny thing called tracking Lee's movement and turning around.

The Byakugan is nothing like the sharingan. Everytime neji dodges an attack it is because of his own reflexes he dodges anything that comes in his general area. But there is still a chance he might get hit because he cant predict exactly where the attacks will go.

Sharingan on the otherhand allows you to counter and dodge attacks rather than just dodge. Because you can see when and where the punch will go before it is even thrown.

deidara for the win.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. Not by a substantial enough amount to change the difference between what would happen if they blitzed Deidara.

2. Only my view clearly shows it is not that large, and manga is canon, anime is not.

3. Can you fvckin read? Byakugan does NOT make it easier to dodge attacks, it has NEVER been stated, and you CAN'T prove it. He CAN avoid Lee's speed, he's DONE it. Gaara? Gaara is perhaps THE slowest character in the series, he is accustomed to no moving when fighting, and has never shown impressive reflexes. Neji, unlike Gaara, can do this funny thing called tracking Lee's movement and turning around.

1. There is a big difference if Kisame speed blitzed Deidara then when Sasuke speed blitzed Deidara actually. Kisame needs his sword to to a speed blitz and with it, it makes him slower than he really is, and with or without the sword, he is slower than Sasuke.

2. Manga sucks, anime doesn't .

3. Can you fvckin understand? Byakugan allows the user to see chakra wherever and whenever, allowing him to dodge attacks when normal people wouldn't be able to dodge attacks. Neji avoided Lee's speed with Byakugan activated, allowing him to see Lee's chakra, and without it, as we have already comfirmed, Neji gets stomped. Gaara has the sand to keep up most speed and usually doesn't need to worry about someone hitting him, and Gaara sadly has no Byakugan so he can stop attacks from Lee. If Neji didn't have Byakugan, and Gaara did, Garra would be able to stop Lee's attacks then. Anyone with Byakugan can stop Lee's speed.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
2. Manga sucks, anime doesn't .

This is why you are retarded

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
2. Manga sucks, anime doesn't

You're an idiot.



Which doesn't matter because ROCK LEE USES ****ING TAIJUTSU.

IF SOMEONE IS THROWING A PUNCH AT ME I CANT SEE CHAKRA BUT I CAN ****ING DODGE THE PUNCH. THE BYAKUGAN ONLY HELPS SEE THINGS THAT ARE INVISIBLE BUT ROCK LEE IS NOT INVISIBLE THUS THE BYAKUGAN IS NOT HELPFUL. IS THIS REALLY SO HARD FOR YOUR BRAIN TO ****ING UNDERSTAND? ARE YOU RETARDED?

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
You're an idiot.



Which doesn't matter because ROCK LEE USES ****ING TAIJUTSU.

IF SOMEONE IS THROWING A PUNCH AT ME I CANT SEE CHAKRA BUT I CAN ****ING DODGE THE PUNCH. THE BYAKUGAN ONLY HELPS SEE THINGS THAT ARE INVISIBLE BUT ROCK LEE IS NOT INVISIBLE THUS THE BYAKUGAN IS NOT HELPFUL. IS THIS REALLY SO HARD FOR YOUR BRAIN TO ****ING UNDERSTAND? ARE YOU RETARDED?

this what ive been tryin to tell the man

Originally posted by yungz22
this what ive been tryin to tell the man I think everybody has. He just doesn't seem to understand the message though.

I think that might get me banned.

Ill put it in another way. Neji's Byakugan can see that's all it can do nothing else kind of like an enhanced version of the human eye we have now.
Sharingan is different because it analyzes everything it sees. Even the slightest finger movement would not be missed by it. Now having this extreme analyzing ability it allows the user to do three things see,copy and predict. As you can see Byakugan can only do one of these things and that is see it coming.


If both neji and sasuke were to see a punch coming at they both would avoid the attacks in two different ways. Sasuke would be able to risk more by just countering the technique because he knew when and where the attack would land. Neji on the otherhand would have move out of the way instead of just countering it like sasuke would have.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
2. Manga sucks, anime doesn't .

facepalm

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. There is a big difference if Kisame speed blitzed Deidara then when Sasuke speed blitzed Deidara actually. Kisame needs his sword to to a speed blitz and with it, it makes him slower than he really is, and with or without the sword, he is slower than Sasuke.

2. Manga sucks, anime doesn't .

3. Can you fvckin understand? Byakugan allows the user to see chakra wherever and whenever, allowing him to dodge attacks when normal people wouldn't be able to dodge attacks. Neji avoided Lee's speed with Byakugan activated, allowing him to see Lee's chakra, and without it, as we have already comfirmed, Neji gets stomped. Gaara has the sand to keep up most speed and usually doesn't need to worry about someone hitting him, and Gaara sadly has no Byakugan so he can stop attacks from Lee. If Neji didn't have Byakugan, and Gaara did, Garra would be able to stop Lee's attacks then. Anyone with Byakugan can stop Lee's speed. 1. Wtf? So now Kisame needs his sword to be fast lol? Why can't he just use those things called fists combined with his monster strength to punch Deidara in the stomach, stunning him...Like he did to Gai!

2. Manga is canon, anime is not. You're an idiot, I am not.

3. Jesus Christ I swear to God I hope you are trolling, there is no way someone can be this fvckin stupid. Byakugan gives you the power to see through things, see the chakra circulatory system, and see near 360 degrees around him, NONE OF THAT helps you dodge attacks from a single target like Rock Lee, unlike Naruto who can attack from all sides, making Byakugan useful in that regard. Of course Neji would lose without Byakugan, because without it he can't see the chakra circulatory system, which is the basis of his entire fighting style. Neji can dodge Lee's attacks because he has fast reflexes.

You know what, fvck this arguing, PROVE Byakugan makes you better at dodging attacks, or stfu and concede you ugly maggot.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. Wtf? So now Kisame needs his sword to be fast lol? Why can't he just use those things called fists combined with his monster strength to punch Deidara in the stomach, stunning him...Like he did to Gai!

2. Manga is canon, anime is not. You're an idiot, I am not.

3. Jesus Christ I swear to God I hope you are trolling, there is no way someone can be this fvckin stupid. Byakugan gives you the power to see through things, see the chakra circulatory system, and see near 360 degrees around him, NONE OF THAT helps you dodge attacks from a single target like Rock Lee, unlike Naruto who can attack from all sides, making Byakugan useful in that regard. Of course Neji would lose without Byakugan, because without it he can't see the chakra circulatory system, which is the basis of his entire fighting style. Neji can dodge Lee's attacks because he has fast reflexes.

You know what, fvck this arguing, PROVE Byakugan makes you better at dodging attacks, or stfu and concede you ugly maggot.

1. Are you reading my posts, oops I forgot, your blind, my bad. Did I say he needs his sword to be fast, no, I said he needs his sword to speed blitz or else he wouldn't do shit if he speed blitzed with nothing.

2. Anime is better, manga sucks

3. *sigh* Are you serious? If Lee can't get around Neji with Byakugan, and he can with Neji not using his Byakugan, then that means helps your fvcking reaction time. If a kunai is thrown at Neji from behind, and Neji blocks it, and then if the kunai is thrown at Neji, and Neji turns his head and see's it and gets hit in the heart, then Byakugan is helping your reaction time. If Lee was doing the exact same thing to Neji that he did to Gaara, and Neji doesn't have Byakugan, he won't be able to stop the attacks because of his reaction time, but with Byakugan, well he already has.

Byakugan helps him SEE not react. It may give him the advantage of not being hit from behind but if Lee was moving to fast for him to dodge it wouldn't matter what he could see. Why don't you get this? Seriously....Just because you can see something doesn't give you the ability to dodge it.

Originally posted by Kento
Byakugan helps him SEE not react. It may give him the advantage of not being hit from behind but if Lee was moving to fast for him to dodge it wouldn't matter what he could see. Why don't you get this? Seriously....Just because you can see something doesn't give you the ability to dodge it.

Still, if he can stop Lee's attacks with Byakugan, and he can't without Byakugan, then it helps. Why can't you get that?

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
Still, if he can stop Lee's attacks with Byakugan, and he can't without Byakugan, then it helps. Why can't you get that? He CAN stop and/or dodge Lee without the Byakugan..The only thing the Byakugan helps is seeing the chakra system which is what the fighting style attacks.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. Are you reading my posts, oops I forgot, your blind, my bad. Did I say he needs his sword to be fast, no, I said he needs his sword to speed blitz or else he wouldn't do shit if he speed blitzed with nothing.

2. Anime is better, manga sucks

3. *sigh* Are you serious? If Lee can't get around Neji with Byakugan, and he can with Neji not using his Byakugan, then that means helps your fvcking reaction time. If a kunai is thrown at Neji from behind, and Neji blocks it, and then if the kunai is thrown at Neji, and Neji turns his head and see's it and gets hit in the heart, then Byakugan is helping your reaction time. If Lee was doing the exact same thing to Neji that he did to Gaara, and Neji doesn't have Byakugan, he won't be able to stop the attacks because of his reaction time, but with Byakugan, well he already has. 1. Prove he needs his sword to speed blitz. What kind of ignorant shit is this? So he needs his sword to blitz someone? That implies he needs the sword to be fast. Wouldn't do shit if he blitzed with nothing? He would KO Deidara pretty easily, given that Deidara is a pussy in terms of h2h combat.

2. You're trolling. Do it again and I'll report you.

3. And what makes you think Neji cannot dodge Lee without Byakugan? You have no basis for such a statement.

Your example sucked, a kunai being thrown behind him was never in his field of vision, Rock Lee would be starting in Neji's field of vision and would be seen moving, trying to get behind Neji.

and you didn't actually prove anything I noticed.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. Prove he needs his sword to speed blitz. What kind of ignorant shit is this? So he needs his sword to blitz someone? That implies he needs the sword to be fast. Wouldn't do shit if he blitzed with nothing? He would KO Deidara pretty easily, given that Deidara is a pussy in terms of h2h combat.

2. You're trolling. Do it again and I'll report you.

3. And what makes you think Neji cannot dodge Lee without Byakugan? You have no basis for such a statement.

Your example sucked, a kunai being thrown behind him was never in his field of vision, Rock Lee would be starting in Neji's field of vision and would be seen moving, trying to get behind Neji.

and you didn't actually prove anything I noticed.

1. What else does he have to kill him besides jutsu's.

2. Like you did to me you do it again and i will report you back

3. What makes you think that he can?

Actually my example has a meaning, because he doesn't need to waste time dodging it, while without it, dead. While people faster than him can dodge it.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. What else does he have to kill him besides jutsu's.

2. Like you did to me you do it again and i will report you back

3. What makes you think that he can?

Actually my example has a meaning, because he doesn't need to waste time dodging it, while without it, dead. While people faster than him can dodge it. 1. His far greater physical strength? And questions normally have question marks at the end.

2. You started trolling by avoiding the point because you could not answer it with a dumbass comment.

3. Because Byakugan does not make him faster.

I'm sorry, but I didn't actually see any proof in this point.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. His far greater physical strength? And questions normally have question marks at the end.

2. You started trolling by avoiding the point because you could not answer it with a dumbass comment.

3. Because Byakugan does not make him faster.

I'm sorry, but I didn't actually see any proof in this point.

1. Oops, I forgot I was getting graded on this.

2. Wow, and I see a quote with cursing, hmm, what if I reported that, all of that cursing in all of your posts.

3. Byakugan helps you react quicker.

Lets see, what have you proved compared to me, oh yeah, nada.

Originally posted by Ultimate Wil
1. Oops, I forgot I was getting graded on this.

2. Wow, and I see a quote with cursing, hmm, what if I reported that, all of that cursing in all of your posts.

3. Byakugan helps you react quicker.

Lets see, what have you proved compared to me, oh yeah, nada. 1. I accept your concession.

2. I accept your concession.

3. Prove it.

I don't have to prove a negative, burden of proof is on you, you made the claim.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
1. I accept your concession.

2. I accept your concession.



Don't deny you took that out of my book! 131

neji is fast and can fight extremely well, he just happens to own byakugan eyes'.

sharingan helps one react quicker, that's the purpose of one of the tomei pupils.

Wil, Eneru, no need for bashing each other. It's a wee bit childish. Cool it and debate politely or not at all.

Also, I believe the rule is that the manga is canon and the anime is not. There is no matter of what is cool and what sucks in that, so don't try to make it one.

There is no canon in most anime or manga. Canon is determined by the creators, not people on the internet.

"Canon" is usually whichever came first.

Originally posted by Pyron_Knight
There is no canon in most anime or manga. Canon is determined by the creators, not people on the internet. And the Manga is directly from the creator(in this case Kishimoto), the anime is not.