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both timeskip

kiba will win

Haven't seen much on how they've improved after timeskip, but pre-timeskip Lee was far superior, so i'd bet on Lee.

Lee, he's a hard guy to piss on and not the guy you want to piss off.

Lee, pretty quicky with Primary Lotus.

braveheart and roz already kno what im gonna say and its not bias lee would beat that ass

Originally posted by yungz22
braveheart and roz already kno what im gonna say and its not bias lee would beat that ass

Well, he kinda does beat Kiba's ass.

naruto beat kiba, lee would have one shotted both of them at the same time.

Originally posted by Wil Deidara
Well, he kinda does beat Kiba's ass.

i kno they are just tryin to say kiba wins to make me mad

Lee wins after he uses Gates

If Kiba has time to morph into the double-headed wolf it's over in a few seconds. Otherwise, he gets speed blitzed.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
naruto beat kiba, lee would have one shotted both of them at the same time.

i dont think lee would hav 1 shotted them.. and wat about fang over fang?

Originally posted by Csdabest
Lee wins after he uses Gates

why would lee just open the gates at the beginning of the fight?

Originally posted by braveheart
why would lee just open the gates at the beginning of the fight?

That's not what he said at all. Not that he needs anything more against Kiba.

Originally posted by braveheart
i dont think lee would hav 1 shotted them.. and wat about fang over fang?

fang over fang is easily dodged

Lee punches Akamaru, and then primary lotus's kiba.

Akamaru is bigger now and wont get slap around so easily. kiba is good ninja that could beat lee if he put some thought into it.

Kiba and thought in the same sentence? That's absurd.

Anyway Lee should win.

Lee needs time to open gates and considering he saw what happened with Lee. I dont think he will let him that easily

Because Kiba has the speed or skill to even attempt to keep up with Lee w/o gates? We've not seen anything from either of them the three years later but I highly doubt Akamaru being bigger has made the gap between Lee and Kiba any smaller. Not when Lee is one that trains like crazy, and Kiba was always one of the weaker rookies.

Originally posted by Kento
Kiba and thought in the same sentence? That's absurd.

Anyway Lee should win.

we all made the mistake naruto doesn t think but he really comes up wit good ideas. kiba will come up wit somethin he wont underestimate a strong opponent like he did naruto.

Originally posted by roz88
we all made the mistake naruto doesn t think but he really comes up wit good ideas. kiba will come up wit somethin he wont underestimate a strong opponent like he did naruto. Yes but in Naruto's case he's stronger, and has more tenacity than Kiba who is really just a stupid, hot-head who is weaker than he thinks he is. Even a weakened Naruto beat Kiba and took everything he had while Lee was owning Sasuke, and a perfectly fine Naruto during the same arc before any power up training. Sure Kiba got stronger but so did Lee. Kiba would never even see him.

The difference is that morph into into the twin headed is near instantaneous, while the Gates are not. And once Kiba morphs non-gate Lee will lose. Two-headed wolf is probably faster then sound. Missing the target creates enough wind to rip it in half.

And before he even does that he has to get Akamaru to mark the person because he can't see to hit them. And he'd never do it because he'd never see Lee, and Lee would be knocking him, and Akamaru senseless while running circles around them literally.

That's true.I forgot that he's nearly blind when he does it.

Well DB stated they have the same speed tier

Those little numbers are irrelevent and should be disregarded. Thi is of course if you're referring to those "Kakashi is an 8 in taijutsu and Zabuza is a 7" stuff.

Originally posted by Csdabest
Well DB stated they have the same speed tier Sure Kiba can probably attack as fast as Lee can move effortlessly with fang over fang and the variations..But he can't see, and he can't dodge, and he can't counter that speed. And he's nowhere near skilled enough in fighting to even hope to compete.

Originally posted by Kento
Sure Kiba can probably attack as fast as Lee can move effortlessly with fang over fang and the variations..But he can't see, and he can't dodge, and he can't counter that speed. And he's nowhere near skilled enough in fighting to even hope to compete.

i doubt kiba is as fast as lee because with the speed he has shown i dont think it can get past garra's defenses

Those little numbers are irrelevent and should be disregarded. Thi is of course if you're referring to those "Kakashi is an 8 in taijutsu and Zabuza is a 7" stuff.


That would be cool until you realize the official stats say Zabuza is a 9 in taijutsu and Kakashi was a 8 when they first fought.

Which is ironic considering Kakashi whooped his ass in taijutsu.

With his sharingan on.

Which doesn't matter because Zabuza never showed any real taijutsu talents anyway.

Ever. He swings his sword up and down and side-to-side. Where's the omg insane taijutsu?

It's irritating when people beef up characters who are freakin' dead. I, personally, only believe inf feats.

Still he beat him in taijutsu with the sharingan on. The ultimate plot device to beat taijutsu and ninjutsu. That's all I was pointing out because you said it was ironic Kakashi beat him in taijutsu. That doesn't prove the stats wrong or right when he was beaten by a eye with pre-cog abilities.

You're correct, then. I suppose that whooping his ass is pointless when he has the sharingan on.

Not to mention the specific instance you're speaking of, is when Zabuza was weakened from his battle with Kakashi, only then was he beaten in Taijutsu.

Please, don't start. If Zabuza was at full health and completely rested Kakashi would have beaten his ass silly with Sharingan activated anyway. Hell, the reason why he was weakened was because Kakashi had already beaten his ass silly.

They have near the same speed in base. and While Kiba can transform quicker. Lee is at a disadvantage cuz he wont have time to really transform .And Kiba nose is pretty good. He was the first to notice Madara when he spacetimed jutsu away. And was the first one to attack. And it was quite some distance away SO to say kiba isnt fast is kind of rediculous.

And what happened to Kiba after he found Tobi?? He wasn't even worth the effort to phase through..Tobi just skipped out of the way. lol

And no way Kiba is even close to Lee's base speed without weights on.

Originally posted by Csdabest
They have near the same speed in base. and While Kiba can transform quicker. Lee is at a disadvantage cuz he wont have time to really transform .And Kiba nose is pretty good. He was the first to notice Madara when he spacetimed jutsu away. And was the first one to attack. And it was quite some distance away SO to say kiba isnt fast is kind of rediculous.

This is true.

Also, Akamaru is his mount now, allowing him extra speed, as well as conserving his energy.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
Please, don't start. If Zabuza was at full health and completely rested Kakashi would have beaten his ass silly with Sharingan activated anyway. Hell, the reason why he was weakened was because Kakashi had already beaten his ass silly. Not with Taijutsu.

Kakashi gained the upper hand with the summoning jutsu, which lacerated all his limbs, his neck, and several other places on his torso.

And if Kakashi with Sharingan can easily beat his ass when Zabuza is at full health...Why doesn't he?

Originally posted by Csdabest
They have near the same speed in base. and While Kiba can transform quicker. Lee is at a disadvantage cuz he wont have time to really transform .And Kiba nose is pretty good. He was the first to notice Madara when he spacetimed jutsu away. And was the first one to attack. And it was quite some distance away SO to say kiba isnt fast is kind of rediculous.

none said kiba isnt fast its just he is not as fast as lee. Plus all of the attacks kiba has shown besides transformation are dodgeable

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Not with Taijutsu.

Kakashi gained the upper hand with the summoning jutsu, which lacerated all his limbs, his neck, and several other places on his torso.

And if Kakashi with Sharingan can easily beat his ass when Zabuza is at full health...Why doesn't he?

For the same reason Kimmimaro didn't kill Naruto in a few seconds.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Not with Taijutsu.

Kakashi gained the upper hand with the summoning jutsu, which lacerated all his limbs, his neck, and several other places on his torso.

And if Kakashi with Sharingan can easily beat his ass when Zabuza is at full health...Why doesn't he? Didn't Kakashi pretty much do that after he was freed from the water sphere prison? Neither was really hurt and Kakashi proceeded to own him. That's why Zabuza used the mist the second time.

Jaxx has a hard-on for the mist ninja. 313

I thought that was for Broli.































j/k

Well, buff manly men in general. I don't quite know the obsession with Zabuza though, as he's relatively scrawny.

EDIT-

And I just checked those "lacerations" by the way. They're no teven that deep, first off. Second off, Neji had amassive hole put in his body only a few inches from his heart and was super low on chakra yet he still moved both of his hands so fast that both of his hands were blurs. Genin level Neji has greater durability than Zabuza?

Zabuza can't take Kakashi on in taijutsu, 3 tomoe Sharingan is too much of a haxx.

Do you know what the Sharingan does? Apparently not, It can bore into a persons mind and play tricks on them. That is why Kakashi won their first fight, well that and Naruto and Sasuke saving him fromt he water sphere. Kakashi and Zabuza were bascially equal at the time they fought, Why would they introduce a villian who Kakashi is alot better than to move the plot at that time?

As i said before there was no way Kakashi was going to die that early in the story, Zabuza was just a charcter to make Kakashi and the sharingan look good. Just like Haku was there to make Naruto look good, He wasn't going to win the fight.

Anyway Lee should be able to baet Kiba.

Zabuza being weaker than Kakashi because Kakashi's the main character is irrelevent. Kakashi is still stronger than he is.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Not with Taijutsu.

Kakashi gained the upper hand with the summoning jutsu, which lacerated all his limbs, his neck, and several other places on his torso.

And if Kakashi with Sharingan can easily beat his ass when Zabuza is at full health...Why doesn't he?

He kinda did though, during their first encounter.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
For the same reason Kimmimaro didn't kill Naruto in a few seconds. Only we know that Kim is much better at Taijutsu than Naruto, unlike with Zabuza and Kakashi.

He was held still by the dogs, and then was barely moving when fighting Kakashi, half-limping while swinging his sword.

Then, a few pages later after some of the fight has taken place off-panel, at some point Zabuza was stick in the arms, and shoulder areas with several kunai.

It was at this point when Kakashi was able to do that b!tch punch you like to go on about.

Oh and Kakashi himself disagrees with you.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/31/18/

"You can't beat me in your current state."

A direct implication that Zabuza is presently too injured to have a chance at beating him.

Now, I never have said that Zabuza is stronger than Kakashi, only that in terms of Taijutsu Kakashi does not completely dominate Zabuza, if at all, they were equal the times they fought before, when both were primed, Kakashi won before through the use of the Sharingan and jutsus.

When were they ever "equal" in Taijutsu?

In both of their fights, Kakashi never unintentionally allowed Zabuza to land a single hit on him using Taijutsu.

And in their original fight, Zabuza did the same.

Kakashi never tried. ermm

I would say Lee I bet Lee could have even beat Sakon is the rescue the emo **** arc

The first kick Zabuza landed on Kakashi knocked him through the air and put him in position to be trapped in the water sphere, Maybe in the Naruto you people watched you didnt see that. Kakashi stated himself if Naruto and Sasuke didnt help him he would of died.

It the creator stats show that Zabuza is better than Kakashi then he is, why even discuss what the creator already stated? We all know Naruto, Sasuke and Sakura are the main charaters so they werent going to die early in the story and neither was Kakashi another popular character. Why didnt Haku just put Naruto and Sasuke to sleep and then help Zabuza kill Kakashi? In fact Haku was suppose to be able to kill or put his opponent so sleep with one needle so why didnt he?

In the second fight with Zabuza and Kakashi it wasnt really a fight. Kakashi again state that he knew Zabuza was the type of opponent who liked to clown around so Zabuza wasnt serious at first. Zabuza himself stated he wanted to toy with Kakashi before killing him as pay back from their first fight. After the dogs bit Zabuza's arms, back and legs he was done. It is also hard to fight a person who has mastered the Sharingan in a head to head fight just using taijutsu to began with.

I also mentioned this already. Zabuza was the first real villian on Naruto, Why introduce a villian who is alot weaker than the main characters? What would that prove? Zabuza was a elite Jonin and Kakashi was a elite Jonin. Zabuza would of won both fights if Kakashi wasnt saved in the first fight and if Zabuza didnt get to cocky and get bit in their second fight.

Either way Lee can beat Kiba.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
Kakashi never tried. ermm Yet you have no evidence to make such a statement other than the one time when Zabuza was weakened.

Oh yeah, and like the dude above me just said, Zabuza used Taijutsu to get him in a position to use the Water Sphere, trapping him.

But he let that happen, right?

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Yet you have no evidence to make such a statement other than the one time when Zabuza was weakened.


You're not being serious, are you?

I always thought that Kakashi was much stronger than Zabuza. I just figured Zabuza had the advantage during their fight because of his mist jutsu.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
If Kiba has time to morph into the double-headed wolf it's over in a few seconds. Otherwise, he gets speed blitzed.
Thats just the thing, he WOULDNT have time to morph.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
You're not being serious, are you? Yes I am being quite serious.

Originally posted by big juggy man
The first kick Zabuza landed on Kakashi knocked him through the air and put him in position to be trapped in the water sphere, Maybe in the Naruto you people watched you didnt see that. Kakashi stated himself if Naruto and Sasuke didnt help him he would of died.


In the second fight with Zabuza and Kakashi it wasnt really a fight. Kakashi again state that he knew Zabuza was the type of opponent who liked to clown around so Zabuza wasnt serious at first. Zabuza himself stated he wanted to toy with Kakashi before killing him as pay back from their first fight. After the dogs bit Zabuza's arms, back and legs he was done. It is also hard to fight a person who has mastered the Sharingan in a head to head fight just using taijutsu to began with.

well ok sasuke and naruto saved kakashi and he admits it fine... but you areforgetting that the only reason kakashi got caught in the first place was because he had to protect 3 little kids and an old man, on a one on one battle kakashi would have owned zabuza, how many times has been said in naruto that an ambush gives the opponent the upper hand and both times kakashi was ambush and he stills defeats the enemy... so i think thats enough proof that kakashi is stronger and way better fighter than zabuza

as for lee and kiba... kiba was dead scared of gaara and lee almost defeated gaara so lee would have owned him before the 2 year gap... as for now we have no idea of what kiba is capable of...

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Yes I am being quite serious.

Foolish. But it hardly matters, you have no argument.





Oh. You mean the one where Zabuza was standing right behind him with his sword drawn and was in a superior position to attack and Kakashi was surprised?

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/13/02/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/13/04-05/

***** please. The ONLY time Zabuza and Kakashi engage in pure taijutsu with no little tricks and jutsu spam Kakashi plays around with him.

I'll concede this debate if you add me on LIVE. 131

I honestly would if I could.

But I d'unt have my xboxes anymore.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
I honestly would if I could.

But I d'unt have my xboxes anymore. .........WHAT!?

My dad took them. ermm

...Why?

Grades.

...Just when I felt like you could not fail me further, when I thought my opinion of you had dropped to the very bottom of the deepest ravine, you prove that there is still one thing you can never fail to do...And that is fail me.

Nah but for real, that sucks ass man.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
...Just when I felt like you could not fail me further, when I thought my opinion of you had dropped to the very bottom of the deepest ravine, you prove that there is still one thing you can never fail to do...And that is fail me.


You should write poetry.

Originally posted by Final Blaxican
You should write poetry. Wut