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Darkseid and Thanos have to two years to build a glorious empire

building an empire
the both start with a group of samll people they have to use they charisma and intellect to influence people. they have to use every resource they can to expand they empire through trading, inventing technolgy, building powerful warriors and increasing they wealth.


Technology
they have to build the most adavane technolgy in the universe that put other empires technology such has the kree and the skrull to shame
1. war machine
2.advanced genetic engineering
3.advanced robotics
4.advanced warp-drive starships
etc,etc


Economy
they have to build the most wealthiest empire in the entrie universe and most have possession of treasures and golds.

Society and Culture
they also should must have different class of people such has engineers,philosphers,warriors etc etc

they have 2 years to build a glouries empire

who wins

Thanos creates the Death Star, minus two meter hole.

darkseid win he turn Apokolips into a warzones

Darkseid has actual experience at this game and would probably win, save for one problem.



Economy
they have to build the most wealthiest empire in the entrie universe and most have possession of treasures and golds.

Society and Culture
they also should must have different class of people such has engineers,philosphers,warriors etc etc

Apokolips does not have wealth in the traditional sense, and Darkseid would see no need to accumulate it. Gods do not care about money.

As for culture......."Die for Darkseid." That basically sums up the culture of Apokolips.

And since Darkseid runs apokolips as an absolute totalitarian dictatorship, we can expect essentially the same on this, Apokolips 2. durkseid

Better empire, yes. But you can argue that Darkseid fails to meet two of the criteria for winning this thread.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Darkseid has actual experience at this game and would probably win, save for one problem.



Economy
they have to build the most wealthiest empire in the entrie universe and most have possession of treasures and golds.

Society and Culture
they also should must have different class of people such has engineers,philosphers,warriors etc etc

Apokolips does not have wealth in the traditional sense, and Darkseid would see no need to accumulate it. Gods do not care about money.

As for culture......."Die for Darkseid." That basically sums up the culture of Apokolips.

And since Darkseid runs apokolips as an absolute totalitarian dictatorship, we can expect essentially the same on this, Apokolips 2. durkseid

Better empire, yes. But you can argue that Darkseid fails to meet two of the criteria for winning this thread.

hmm

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Darkseid fails well done

Originally posted by Mekrob
Death Star ...

Hardly constitutes an Empire. DS wins this by default, he actually has experience running a full fledged empire for millenia.

A better candidate here would be Annhilus or someone of that ilk in place of Thanos.

If Thanos set out to do this I see no reason why he couldn't outdo Darkseid here. Thanos is also much more inventive than Ds when it comes to inventions and ingenuity imo.

Originally posted by Allankles
Hardly constitutes an Empire. DS wins this by default, he actually has experience running a full fledged empire for millenia.

A better candidate here would be Annhilus or someone of that ilk in place of Thanos. Right.

You foiled my entirely serious post.

Originally posted by quanchi112
If Thanos set out to do this I see no reason why he couldn't outdo Darkseid here. Thanos is also much more inventive than Ds when it comes to inventions and ingenuity imo.

Darkseid has created weapon that are capable of pentreate the source

Originally posted by beast1234
Darkseid has created weapon that are capable of pentreate the source i laffed

pentreate?

penetrate?

Originally posted by Mekrob
Right.

You foiled my entirely serious post.

Should have put a after I finished the first sentence. The rest of the post was addressing the thread in general.

Thanos doesn't build empires he's an adventuring rogue. He's had some experience controlling a military force early in his shelf life but the more recognizable version of Thanos is a hitchhiker i.e. someone like Annhilus would be better than Thanos, we can actually observe his abilities in this regard.

Originally posted by Allankles
Should have put a after I finished the first sentence. The rest of the post was addressing the thread in general.

Thanos doesn't build empires he's an adventuring rogue. He's had some experience controlling a military force early in his shelf life but the more recognizable version of Thanos is a hitchhiker i.e. someone like Annhilus would be better than Thanos, we can actually observe his abilities in this regard.

Thanos in the past tried to create his own pantheon of gods

Originally posted by beast1234
Thanos in the past tried to create his own pantheon of gods

He's already from a pantheon of soughts. Meh! To me Thanos is a character with unrealized potential.

*cough* Clone, and he didn't make them using his own power. *cough*

we all know that thanos has it not has experience in running an empire this thread is about who can build the greastest empire in the universe in 2 years

Thanos is not liked very much in the Universe might have a hard time recruiting.

Originally posted by Allankles
He's already from a pantheon of soughts. Meh! To me Thanos is a character with unrealized potential.

Unrealized?

He almost became God twice.

Tough call. The problem is if feel thanos is more resourceful but DS already has an empire at his disposal from the jump.

DS has already bitched entire Worlds of thier pantheons. It's nothing for him to take the places of those Gods should he wish and have empires ready made.

Darkseid. Obviously, he has experience in governance. But above all else is he has an authoritarian mindset...he lives to subjugate people, concepts, and powers to his will

Thanos is not a character concerned with authority or influence (he willingly effected an air of submission towards annihilus...) but rather is more refined in manipulation (...until such time that he found annihilus' and his goals did not coincide) and knowledge. Until the past few years he was interested in gaining death's favor...ruling lands and influencing others was irrelevant to him.

In fact we need only look at adam warlock's assessment of thanos...everytime he attains supreme power, he sub-consciously knows that he is unworthy, and provides the means to his own undoing. DS doesn't have this trait. Thanos is much more willing to work with others in order to manipulate them for his own personal agenda. He's never had an agenda of conquest. I would even say that he finds conquest such a small and limited idea.

This is probably the only time I'll agree that DS wins seeing as he has way more experience than Thanos doing this.

Originally posted by Allankles
He's already from a pantheon of soughts. Meh! To me Thanos is a character with unrealized potential. What? He has become supreme how many times and saved the universe how many times and you say this.

Originally posted by Tenebrous
Darkseid. Obviously, he has experience in governance. But above all else is he has an authoritarian mindset...he lives to subjugate people, concepts, and powers to his will

Thanos is not a character concerned with authority or influence (he willingly effected an air of submission towards annihilus...) but rather is more refined in manipulation (...until such time that he found annihilus' and his goals did not coincide) and knowledge. Until the past few years he was interested in gaining death's favor...ruling lands and influencing others was irrelevant to him.

In fact we need only look at adam warlock's assessment of thanos...everytime he attains supreme power, he sub-consciously knows that he is unworthy, and provides the means to his own undoing. DS doesn't have this trait. Thanos is much more willing to work with others in order to manipulate them for his own personal agenda. He's never had an agenda of conquest. I would even say that he finds conquest such a small and limited idea. I disagree.

Thanos subjugates those to his will and above all things accomplishes what he sets out for. If this is his goal he isn't going to drop the ball so to speak.


Subconsciously losing which he hasn't done since ig is just a plot device for him to lose. He didn't lose his power in the hotu by the way. Anyways even if that were allowed to enter a thread that is only after he achieves his goal not before so.


Thanos doesn't need an army, but in his past has shown the ability to amass quite an army early on in his history.

IM gonna say they all start from scratch like the OP said. DS has the experience. He has the type of personality to, he enjoys the power and wielding it to control people.

But... His world Apok, is a sh*t hole. Everyone is suffering and in despair. There is no Golden Age, since it's a perpetual sh*t hole. They have crazy tech but seems like a they just invested everything in thier military and science.

Thanos isn't the type that would want to make alot of people suffer and warship him. He is a badass mofo and kill you if your in his way but he isn't egotistical sadist.

Thanos is very resourceful and has one of the best minds of the MU.

I would rather live in a world ruled by Thanos then DS.

IMO it's a toss up in the Robotics and warmachine categories. As for genetics and Ships are concerned Thanos made clones that fooled death and Thanos ship aint no joke.

Not sure about the economy but DS world, looks like everyone is a bum and dressed in rags.

Society and Culture (idk if Apok has any of this). Can't say anything for thanos on this area.

Originally posted by Tenebrous
Darkseid. Obviously, he has experience in governance. But above all else is he has an authoritarian mindset...he lives to subjugate people, concepts, and powers to his will

Thanos is not a character concerned with authority or influence (he willingly effected an air of submission towards annihilus...) but rather is more refined in manipulation (...until such time that he found annihilus' and his goals did not coincide) and knowledge. Until the past few years he was interested in gaining death's favor...ruling lands and influencing others was irrelevant to him.

In fact we need only look at adam warlock's assessment of thanos...everytime he attains supreme power, he sub-consciously knows that he is unworthy, and provides the means to his own undoing. DS doesn't have this trait. Thanos is much more willing to work with others in order to manipulate them for his own personal agenda. He's never had an agenda of conquest. I would even say that he finds conquest such a small and limited idea.

We all know that thanos is not the type to rule the universe. but this thread is about which of these two can build a glorious empire that is more powerful then the kree or the skrull. Darkseid has more experience in running an empire but Apokolips is handly an empire becuase most of the people are slave. before i thought darkseid would win because i did not think it through. to have an empire you need great people such has philosphers,warriors,scientist,politician,military
genius etc. That why i think the kree is the greatest empire. Thanos is not has selfish has darkseid is. But darkseid is the perfect candidate to challenge thanos because he turn apokolips into one of the most feared planets in the universe legendary for it nuclear weapons.

Originally posted by beast1234
We all know that thanos is not the type to will the universe. but this thread is about which of these two can build a glorious empire that is more powerful then the kree or the skrull. Darkseid has more experience in running an empire but Apokolips is handly an empire becuase most of the people are slave. before i thought darkseid would win because i did not think it through. to have an empire you need great people such has philosphers,warriors,scientist,politician,military
genius etc. That why i think the kree is the greatest empire. Thanos is not has selfish has darkseid is. But darkseid is the perfect candidate to challenge thanos because he turn apokolips into one of the most feared planets in the universe legendary for it nuclear weapons.

Exactly what I pointed out in the first post. Apokolips may not qualify for wealth and culture, depending on your point of view.

Apokolips is a dictatorship, which is an empire. Also, Apokolips doesn't have nukes in the conventional sense. They do have planet killing and planet conquering weapons though. Which Darkseid lends or gives out to other people ostensibly as an arms dealer, but really it's just to spread his influence and make people suffer.

There is no dispute as to how powerful an empire made by Darkseid would be. The question is whether it meets the criteria for this thread.

I love the Darkseid/Thanos rivalry. Thanos is obviously smarter, but lack of intellect has never stopped brutes from running a government before. Not to mention Thanos' inferiority complex. Darkseid wins.

Darkseid is a brute? Do you have any idea how HARD it is to run a dictatorship let alone one like Apokolips? Darkseid is constantly manipulating his court and courtiers against each other for his own amusement.

Thanos would never be able to run Apokolips.

He's a brute in comparison to Thanos. He's been tricked by Anarky for crying out loud.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I disagree.

Thanos subjugates those to his will and above all things accomplishes what he sets out for. If this is his goal he isn't going to drop the ball so to speak.


Subconsciously losing which he hasn't done since ig is just a plot device for him to lose. He didn't lose his power in the hotu by the way. Anyways even if that were allowed to enter a thread that is only after he achieves his goal not before so.


Thanos doesn't need an army, but in his past has shown the ability to amass quite an army early on in his history.

Thanos doesn't overtly subjugate. He is much more a manipulator...he will subjugate 1 to control 100.

"If this is his goal" is the key....you and I both know it's not in his character to go running around setting up empires. He will get BORED. Remember that issue where he reveals his monster craft, and how he explained he built it in his "early years" when he merely dreamed of conquest?

Now if he had to assemble an empire so that it would somehow serve his personal means, then he could do it. But to create an empire for its own end...he doesn't find such things interesting. How many times has Thanos dismissed conquest as "petty"

He entertained Anarky and let him go. 2nd, Anarky was smart enough to construct his own personal transporter to the 4th world. A huge feat of genius.

Countdown, Genesis, Legends, Final Crisis, need I go on?

Eh, I like DS more as a character anyway.

Originally posted by Tenebrous
Thanos doesn't overtly subjugate. He is much more a manipulator...he will subjugate 1 to control 100.

"If this is his goal" is the key....you and I both know it's not in his character to go running around setting up empires. He will get BORED. Remember that issue where he reveals his monster craft, and how he explained he built it in his "early years" when he merely dreamed of conquest?

Now if he had to assemble an empire so that it would somehow serve his personal means, then he could do it. But to create an empire for its own end...he doesn't find such things interesting. How many times has Thanos dismissed conquest as "petty" Yes, but in this thread that is his goal. If Mistress Death told him to build an empire, he'd build an empire.

I agree that prolly wouldn't do this on his own, but this thread has them both out to do this and to that end I see Thanos seeing it through.

Also, Thanos does not have the huge handicap of New Genesis watching his every move.

quanchi112

how do you think thanos empire will be like

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Countdown, Genesis, Legends, Final Crisis, need I go on? Haven't you argued for Countdown being forgotten?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Also, Thanos does not have the huge handicap of New Genesis watching his every move. He had the god of time creating a character designed to destroy him. Ds does things all the time regardless of new genesis.

Originally posted by Mekrob
Haven't you argued for Countdown being forgotten?

I willingly embrace the hypocrisy. dur

Thanos he actually used to have an empire based on Titan before Capt. Marvel beat him so he's not inexperienced. I think the standard of living would be way better in his empire because lets face it Apokalips is not a good place to live.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Thanos he actually used to have an empire based on Titan before Capt. Marvel beat him so he's not inexperienced. I think the standard of living would be way better in his empire because lets face it Apokalips is not a good place to live. Agreed. It wouldn't be hard to turn Darkseid's poor population against Ds.

Originally posted by beast1234
quanchi112

how do you think thanos empire will be like Enormous and stock full of clones.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Enormous and stock full of clones.

i mean hiw would the society and culture be like do you think that thanos empire will have great people such has engineers,philosphers,warriors,mathematician great people like
ronan the accuser

Originally posted by beast1234
i mean hiw would the society and culture be like do you think that thanos empire will have great people such has engineers,philosphers,warriors,mathematician great people like
ronan the accuser I don't think he would browbeat them as badly as Ds does and that his empire would be somewhat less of a dictatorship than Thanos'.

For the most part I think he could clone his way to the top if he wanted to.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I don't think he would browbeat them as badly as Ds does and that his empire would be somewhat less of a dictatorship than Thanos'.

For the most part I think he could clone his way to the top if he wanted to.

i mean without the clone . How great do you think his subject will be will they be has great has the kree. for example the krees have amazing people in they ranks.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Agreed. It wouldn't be hard to turn Darkseid's poor population against Ds.

Darkseid actively cultivates his own rebellions just so he can break their spirits and crush them. It is nowhere near that easy.

To quote from Superman The animated series: "I am many things, Kal-El... but here, I am God."

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Darkseid actively cultivates his own rebellions just so he can break their spirits and crush them. It is nowhere near that easy.
See what I mean? That is not a healthy form of government. Thanos wins.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Darkseid actively cultivates his own rebellions just so he can break their spirits and crush them. It is nowhere near that easy.

So your stance is they rebel all the time so Thanos being able to start a rebellion isn't likely?

I never said I liked or even agreed with Darkseid's system. But it does work for him. srug I can see how it fails to meet the thread criteria.

But by the same token, Thanos's supporters haven't given proof that Thanos can make ANY system work long term.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Darkseid actively cultivates his own rebellions just so he can break their spirits and crush them. It is nowhere near that easy.

To quote from Superman The animated series: "I am many things, Kal-El... but here, I am God." Originally posted by Mindset
So your stance is they rebel all the time so Thanos being able to start a rebellion isn't likely? Originally posted by TricksterPriest
I never said I liked or even agreed with Darkseid's system. But it does work for him. srug I can see how it fails to meet the thread criteria.

But by the same token, Thanos's supporters haven't given proof that Thanos can make ANY system work long term. Thanos hasn't needed to, but when he did have an empire there were no rebellions at all.

Originally posted by King Kandy
See what I mean? That is not a healthy form of government. Thanos wins.

Darkseid's philosophy works in regards to breeding better soldiers and military minds. I believe the true purpose for his subjugation is to make his subject see the universe in his terms, that everything turns to anarchy and only DS will can transform it.

Now in terms of the economy of this Empire everything would be military based, with the export product being weapons, the same as Apokolips.

People won't be happy in DS empire, but they will be extremely loyal to him.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Unrealized?

He almost became God twice.

A few minis where he got quick power ups, nothing sustainable as an enjoyable long term series.

He's had his non power up phases where he clashed with SS, but again they went with a plot where he was killing defenseless populations for universal balance, again not a story that his arch enemy SS or himself could thrive in to produce an interesting conflict.

Marvel doesn't give Thanos good motivations for doing what he does, Annhilation being the most recent example.

Who need motivation when death beside him.

It's hard to have motivation when you have accomplished everything and you're the best at w/e you do.

amirite Quan?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
But by the same token, Thanos's supporters haven't given proof that Thanos can make ANY system work long term.
The guy had an intergalactic empire for years before Marvel came in and dethroned him.

Intergalactic, Empire, Rebellion, Clones, Darkside, and I believe some stud mentioned the Death Star earlier...

There's no way...

Originally posted by Mekrob
and I believe some stud mentioned the Death Star earlier...

Nah, you said it.

Originally posted by Mindset
Nah, you said it.

heh!

Originally posted by King Kandy
The guy had an intergalactic empire for years before Marvel came in and dethroned him.

Pre-India Jones Thanos is a blur to me.

Originally posted by Mindset
Right, you said it. You know what, flattery will get you everywhere.

Originally posted by Allankles
A few minis where he got quick power ups, nothing sustainable as an enjoyable long term series.

He's had his non power up phases where he clashed with SS, but again they went with a plot where he was killing defenseless populations for universal balance, again not a story that his arch enemy SS or himself could thrive in to produce an interesting conflict.

Marvel doesn't give Thanos good motivations for doing what he does, Annhilation being the most recent example. What? I have been over this with you. Unlike Ds, Thanos has changed as a character. His actions in annihilation were because he was bored. Good thing the guy wasn't motivated to universal destruction at the time.

I like marvel's direction for Thanos and I think that dc's take on Darkseid is utterly a borefest.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thanos' actions in annihilation were because he was bored. the guy wasn't motivated and I think that he is utterly a borefest.

Fixed.

Do you think that the reason his character keeps changing is because his previous iterations didn't work well?

Look at Norman Osborn or Lex Luthor. Both characters have changed for the better. Luthor went from being generic mad scientist Pre Crisis to a business mongul/scientist/entrepeneur Post-Crisis.

Norman went from second rate villain to Spidey, to mastermind on the level of Luthor. These characters are changed when their previous incarnations don't do them justice.

Same thing applies to Thanos, his power up minis were always short sighted in their scope, blame the writers, there was nothing sustainable as far as good story telling with those plots. So they have to change up his character to try and improve that.

No need for DC to change what makes DS a great villain. Manipulator, warlord, his malleable principles of honor, complexity and his desire to be the one god.

You read the Jack Kirby stuff and the JKFW and it's easy t see how they've made the NG saga sustainable, a war which has been fought in many ways on many different avenues/planes/fields all leading to "final battle" as we saw in Final Crisis. "Final battle" has been a part of the NG story at least as far back as the mid 90's.

These things were building up for years, not just a quick short sighted mini, characters like Thanos need to be changed up, DS doesn't, he can already contribute to make good stories.

Originally posted by Allankles
Fixed.

Do you think that the reason his character keeps changing is because his previous iterations didn't work well?

Look at Norman Osborn or Lex Luthor. Both characters have changed for the better. Luthor went from being generic mad scientist Pre Crisis to a business mongul/scientist/entrepeneur Post-Crisis.

Norman went from second rate villain to Spidey, to mastermind on the level of Luthor. These characters are changed when their previous incarnations don't do them justice.

Same thing applies to Thanos, his power up minis were always short sighted in their scope, blame the writers, there was nothing sustainable as far as good story telling with those plots. So they have to change up his character to try and improve that.

No need for DC to change what makes DS a great villain. Manipulator, warlord, his malleable principles of honor, complexity and his desire to be the one god.

You read the Jack Kirby stuff and the JKW and it's easy t see how they've made the NG saga sustainable, a war which has been fought in many ways on many different avenues/planes/fields all leading to "final battle" as we saw in Final Crisis. "Finable battle" has been a part of the NG story at least as far back as the mid 90's.

These things were building up for years, not just a quick short sighted mini, characters like Thanos need to be changed up, DS doesn't, he can already contribute to make good stories. lulz.

Darksied's long term plans are that awesome...yet he failed badly in FC all that time planning and still failed.

Spoken by a moron who didn't understand the story. durink

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Spoken by a moron who didn't understand the story. durink such a easy thing to say,when you're trying to stick up for the fact he had a set goal and failed.and that FC was well below par in terms of expectations.

Originally posted by Allankles
Fixed.

Do you think that the reason his character keeps changing is because his previous iterations didn't work well?

Look at Norman Osborn or Lex Luthor. Both characters have changed for the better. Luthor went from being generic mad scientist Pre Crisis to a business mongul/scientist/entrepeneur Post-Crisis.

Norman went from second rate villain to Spidey, to mastermind on the level of Luthor. These characters are changed when their previous incarnations don't do them justice.

Same thing applies to Thanos, his power up minis were always short sighted in their scope, blame the writers, there was nothing sustainable as far as good story telling with those plots. So they have to change up his character to try and improve that.

No need for DC to change what makes DS a great villain. Manipulator, warlord, his malleable principles of honor, complexity and his desire to be the one god.

You read the Jack Kirby stuff and the JKFW and it's easy t see how they've made the NG saga sustainable, a war which has been fought in many ways on many different avenues/planes/fields all leading to "final battle" as we saw in Final Crisis. "Final battle" has been a part of the NG story at least as far back as the mid 90's.

These things were building up for years, not just a quick short sighted mini, characters like Thanos need to be changed up, DS doesn't, he can already contribute to make good stories. Changing my quote just shows how utterly desperate you are.

No, the reason he keeps changing as a character is the fact that acquiring outside power has never really fulfilled him the way he thought it would. Thanos has achieved his goals and is right beside Mistress Death. Ds still hasn't achieved his.

Most of your post has nothing to do with success, but just your opinion on the matter. Thanos is held in high regard while Darkseid is mocked across the boards. Blame the writers.

Ds has gotten old and stale. I mean how many times do we have to see Ds and the ale. It's like Thanos still showing up with the ig. Been there done that. He has moved on while Ds hasn't. Not only that but the ale doesn't work on insane people.

I like different stories while you are content with the same old stuff thirty years later.

Originally posted by skyfather
such a easy thing to say,when you're trying to stick up for the fact he had a set goal and failed.and that FC was well below par in terms of expectations. Agreed. I read it recently and it was quite a bore. I do wonder how long bruce wayne will stay dead though?

Originally posted by skyfather
lulz.

Darksied's long term plans are that awesome...yet he failed badly in FC all that time planning and still failed.

I don't get how this address my post. I said DS stories if you read the JKFW or the original JK comics are far more sustainable as far as good story telling is concerned. This is about story telling not who got what.

And unless you missed it, DS destroyed New Genesis in "final battle".

He's not

Originally posted by Allankles
I don't get how this address my post. I said DS stories if you read the JKFW or the original JK comics are far more sustainable as far as good story telling is concerned. This is about story telling not who got what.

And unless you missed it, DS destroyed New Genesis in "final battle". Off panel and because of the ale.

Originally posted by Allankles
I don't get how this address my post. I said DS stories if you read the JKFW or the original JK comics are far more sustainable as far as good story telling is concerned. This is about story telling not who got what.

And unless you missed it, DS destroyed New Genesis in "final battle". destroying new genssis wasnt his main or end goal.

Then what was? Let's see how much you actually know.

What was Darkseid's goal? What is his guiding philosophy? Why does Darkseid do what he does? And, what is the ALE, just for good measure?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Then what was? Let's see how much you actually know.

What was Darkseid's goal? What is his guiding philosophy? Why does Darkseid do what he does? And, what is the ALE, just for good measure? To be gay.

Answer for all the above questions.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Changing my quote just shows how utterly desperate you are.

No, the reason he keeps changing as a character is the fact that acquiring outside power has never really fulfilled him the way he thought it would. Thanos has achieved his goals and is right beside Mistress Death. Ds still hasn't achieved his.

Again how is being beside Mistress Death good for a plot? How does it translate into Thanos actually playing a role in making a story good? It doesn't, he jumps into situations with zero sense of urgency because he'll be bakc with lady Death anyway, again you read enough stories and this is the hallmark of weak story telling.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Most of your post has nothing to do with success, but just your opinion on the matter. Thanos is held in high regard while Darkseid is mocked across the boards. Blame the writers.

I don't see anyone familiar with the New God comics mocking DS. 1st they understand that the war with New Genesis was always for the fate of the universe. 2) That the war in the 4th world has spilled over many realities and all these conflicts lead to "final battle" where all time becomes one time and the final outcome is decided.


Originally posted by quanchi112
Ds has gotten old and stale. I mean how many times do we have to see Ds and the ale. It's like Thanos still showing up with the ig. Been there done that. He has moved on while Ds hasn't. Not only that but the ale doesn't work on insane people.

Shows how much you know, the ALE is not something that appears all that often pick up the comprehensive JKFW, most of the New God titles hell even DOTNG or Countdown and the ALE is not featured or doesn't play a big role. It has it's place it doesn't appear in majority of DS' stories

Originally posted by quanchi112
I like different stories while you are content with the same old stuff thirty years later.

LOL Pick up A NG comic sometime. The war has taken many different forms, many different characters are invovled and it's not even always about the direct conflict with New Genesis and Apokolips. Geez, stop talking out of your ass.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Then what was? Let's see how much you actually know.

What was Darkseid's goal? What is his guiding philosophy? Why does Darkseid do what he does? And, what is the ALE, just for good measure? darksied's goal was to conquer earth and enslve humanity.


darksied wants to be the arcitect of the 5th world,he does what he does because he is a despot ruler.

the ale takes away free will

Originally posted by skyfather
darksied's goal was to conquer earth and enslve humanity.


darksied wants to be the arcitect of the 5th world,he does what he does because he is a despot ruler.

the ale takes away free will

You have only scratched the surface. Try a little harder.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
You have only scratched the surface. Try a little harder. maybe so,but do you think im gonna go through all the points from 7 soliiers,countdown and Dotng.

Originally posted by skyfather
maybe so,but do you think im gonna go through all the points from 7 soliiers,countdown and Dotng. Trick just wants to understand the story, so he asked someone to explain it for him.

Originally posted by Allankles
Again how is being beside Mistress Death good for a plot? How does it translate into Thanos actually playing a role in making a story good? It doesn't, he jumps into situations with zero sense of urgency because he'll be bakc with lady Death anyway, again you read enough stories and this is the hallmark of weak story telling.



I don't see anyone familiar with the New God comics mocking DS. 1st they understand that the war with New Genesis was always for the fate of the universe. 2) That the war in the 4th world has spilled over many realities and all these conflicts lead to "final battle" where all time becomes one time and the final outcome is decided.




Shows how much you know, the ALE is not something that appears all that often pick up the comprehensive JKFW, most of the New God titles hell even DOTNG or Countdown and the ALE is not featured or doesn't play a big role. It has it's place it doesn't appear in majority of DS' stories



LOL Pick up A NG comic sometime. The war has taken many different forms, many different characters are invovled and it's not even always about the direct conflict with New Genesis and Apokolips. Geez, stop talking out of your ass. Thanos has always wanted her affections. He has always had a fascination with death which makes him stand out more than your typical I want to control everything type of villain.

Annihilus was held in high regard with Mistress death and he organized the abduction of Galactus through T and A.

I have the entire run of the new gods. This is all subjective here mind you, but I find them boring with the same song and dance being gone over again and again.

Ds wanted the ale since the beginning and held an aspect of it during rock of ages and is still at it nowadays. Snoozefest. The ale shouldn't even be dragged into these stories anymore. It's a 30 plus year thing.

I have picked up many. Ares was the one who ended Izaya, not Ds. In countdown the Source defeated all the new gods. Ds's ultimate triumph happened off panel and with the ale. Not that glorious imo.


I found it ironic to have Morrion use Batman to deliver the fatal blow to Ds even though he mocked Batman causing Ds to bleed.

Originally posted by Mekrob
Trick just wants to understand the story, so he asked someone to explain it for him.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thanos has always wanted her affections. He has always had a fascination with death which makes him stand out more than your typical I want to control everything type of villain.

Annihilus was held in high regard with Mistress death and he organized the abduction of Galactus through T and A.

So? I don't see how what you've written makes Thanos a better character. You've only given me the same points that make Thanos dull.

There's nothing there that makes a good foil for a hero.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I have the entire run of the new gods.

I doubt you do, given that you think the ALE is in every DS related story when that doesn't come close to being the case.

Originally posted by quanchi112
The ale shouldn't even be dragged into these stories anymore. It's a 30 plus year thing.


The ALE is knowledge, a doctrine that states that DS is the rightful master of all sentient beings in the universe. If it were merely a gem or some device, you'd have a point, but it is more than that ...

Too bad Thanos's plans only go as far as stealing a few trinkets and tech.

thanos take this

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
But by the same token, Thanos's supporters haven't given proof that Thanos can make ANY system work long term.

Thanos had his own following of Nihilists that spanned across galaxies. He's also been shown to be very charismatic while leading whole armies before...which is somewhat similar to a civilization. Hell, he even charmed the People of Rigel after it was his fault that half their planet's population was destroyed. Leading an empire would be no problem for Thanos, if that's what he wanted (which he doesn't normally, but for the purposes of this thread he does.)

Originally posted by Lord Feron
IM gonna say they all start from scratch like the OP said. DS has the experience. He has the type of personality to, he enjoys the power and wielding it to control people.

But... His world Apok, is a sh*t hole. Everyone is suffering and in despair. There is no Golden Age, since it's a perpetual sh*t hole. They have crazy tech but seems like a they just invested everything in thier military and science.

Thanos isn't the type that would want to make alot of people suffer and warship him. He is a badass mofo and kill you if your in his way but he isn't egotistical sadist.

Thanos is very resourceful and has one of the best minds of the MU.

I would rather live in a world ruled by Thanos then DS.

IMO it's a toss up in the Robotics and warmachine categories. As for genetics and Ships are concerned Thanos made clones that fooled death and Thanos ship aint no joke.

Not sure about the economy but DS world, looks like everyone is a bum and dressed in rags.

Society and Culture (idk if Apok has any of this). Can't say anything for thanos on this area.

I pretty much agree with everything here. I'd especially give Thanos the edge in genetics and star ships.

Also, as far as other tech goes and Darkseid creating things that 'penetrate' the Source Wall...Thanos has drained off the power of all the Infinity Gems and turned it into a weapon, plus has done extensive research on the Heart of the Universe and the Power Cosmic.



If this were in a comic, Darkseid would win. It's just not in Thanos' character to do this type of stuff. But since its specified here, I'm giving Thanos the nod.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Thanos had his own following of Nihilists that spanned across galaxies. He's also been shown to be very charismatic while leading whole armies before...which is somewhat similar to a civilization. Hell, he even charmed the People of Rigel after it was his fault that half their planet's population was destroyed. Leading an empire would be no problem for Thanos, if that's what he wanted (which he doesn't normally, but for the purposes of this thread he does.)



I pretty much agree with everything here. I'd especially give Thanos the edge in genetics and star ships.

Also, as far as other tech goes and Darkseid creating things that 'penetrate' the Source Wall...Thanos has drained off the power of all the Infinity Gems and turned it into a weapon, plus has done extensive research on the Heart of the Universe and the Power Cosmic.



If this were in a comic, Darkseid would win. It's just not in Thanos' character to do this type of stuff. But since its specified here, I'm giving Thanos the nod.

Good to see you back Eny... where have you been hiding?

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Good to see you back Eny... where have you been hiding?

Grad school is rough this time of year. And work's been too busy to get on from there lately.

Yeah I know what you mean buddy that can make it tough to find time. My girl right now is trying to get in Berkeley Grad and has barely anytime for anything other then school. Well, I hope things quite down a little buddy.

double

Originally posted by Enyalus
I pretty much agree with everything here. I'd especially give Thanos the edge in genetics and star ships.


Genetics I could see an argument there but star ships? Apokolips has an extensive array of star ships, it'd be more likely for DS to constuct these. DS can also apparently form state-sized star ships with his power alone.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Thanos had his own following of Nihilists that spanned across galaxies.

DS has worshippers all over the cosmos even on Earth (JK's first stories of the NG). Apparently even MM's brother was one of his devotees.

Originally posted by Allankles
Genetics I could see an argument there but star ships? Apokolips has an extensive array of star ships, it'd be more likely for DS to constuct these. DS can also apparently form state-sized star ships with his power alone.

I'll have to see if Quan or anyone else recalls how large the Dreadnaught666 was. Planet-destroying power with a single blast and I think...over 60 miles in length. Unsure about the last part. I can find out later.

Originally posted by Enyalus
I'll have to see if Quan or anyone else recalls how large the Dreadnaught666 was. Planet-destroying power with a single blast and I think...over 60 miles in length. Unsure about the last part. I can find out later.

DS created a Star ship the size of New York state with his own power.

thanos easily,in every department.

Originally posted by skyfather
thanos easily,in every department.

No.

Inventions, military science, devotion/loyalty, size, influence, industry. DS has experience in all of this and thus stomps Thanos by default. Thanos doesn't really have the track record.

As far as economy goes Apokolips doesn't use the flawed human models of economy. He can create city-planets with power and energy being supplied by vast fire pits.

The only department Thanos might get the nod by default is the number of wealthy individuals.

Probably culture too. Apokolips isn't exactly a patron of the arts. Unless you like looking at Darkseid.

Originally posted by Allankles
No.

Inventions, military science, devotion/loyalty, size, influence, industry. DS has experience in all of this and thus stomps Thanos by default. Thanos doesn't really have the track record.

As far as economy goes Apokolips doesn't use the flawed human models of economy. He can create city-planets with power and energy being supplied by vast fire pits.

The only department Thanos might get the nod by default is the number of wealthy individuals. fanboy

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Probably culture too. Apokolips isn't exactly a patron of the arts. Unless you like looking at Darkseid.

Art? Yes. But culture is a more broad subject.

Originally posted by Mindset
fanboy

I'm a DS fan, just like you're a von Doom fan.

"Die for Darkseid" That's rather hard to argue for as culture, though you are right that culture is subjective.

I don't like Doom, I just recognize his brilliance and overall superiority over most comic characters.

Originally posted by Allankles
No.

Inventions, military science, devotion/loyalty, size, influence, industry. DS has experience in all of this and thus stomps Thanos by default. Thanos doesn't really have the track record.

As far as economy goes Apokolips doesn't use the flawed human models of economy. He can create city-planets with power and energy being supplied by vast fire pits.

The only department Thanos might get the nod by default is the number of wealthy individuals.
do you just make stuff up for the sake of it?

it's obvious you think thanos is far superior,but you just post nonsense to try and convince yourself.

Originally posted by Mindset
I don't like Doom, I just recognize his brilliance and overall superiority over most comic characters.

Your welcome to your opinion. I don't see the superiority, but I do see the ham fisted nature of his character though.

It's not an opinion, it's a fact.

Originally posted by skyfather
do you just make stuff up for the sake of it?

it's obvious you think thanos is far superior,but you just post nonsense to try and convince yourself.

^Does not read DC. durhmm

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
^Does not read DC. durhmm ^does not read ANY comic's,and even gets mocked by his "friends" he thinks he has on here.

Originally posted by Allankles
Art? Yes. But culture is a more broad subject.

Then by all means give me the culture your referring to when speaking of DS planet?

Originally posted by skyfather
do you just make stuff up for the sake of it?

it's obvious you think thanos is far superior,but you just post nonsense to try and convince yourself.

I don't have to make stuff up, Thanos doesn't have the track record.

DS has already been a part of mental conditioning projects, galactic conquests, pantheon conquests, been worshipped across the cosmos, building armies, fleets and their armaments. He always has scientists turning his ideas into reality.

He's already made long lasting inventions. He uses Apok weapons and inventions and uses them to spread his influence across many worlds. He's been there done that. The tech level of Apok speaks for itself.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Then by all means give me the culture your referring to when speaking of DS planet?

Culture:-

the set of shared attitudes, values, goals, and practices that characterizes an institution, organization or group.

Anything that characterizes an empire, nation, etc is it's culture.

Originally posted by Mindset
It's not an opinion, it's a fact.

Nah!

Originally posted by Allankles
So? I don't see how what you've written makes Thanos a better character. You've only given me the same points that make Thanos dull.

There's nothing there that makes a good foil for a hero.



I doubt you do, given that you think the ALE is in every DS related story when that doesn't come close to being the case.



The ALE is knowledge, a doctrine that states that DS is the rightful master of all sentient beings in the universe. If it were merely a gem or some device, you'd have a point, but it is more than that ...

Too bad Thanos's plans only go as far as stealing a few trinkets and tech. Thanos isn't dull to me and has actually changed which is far more interesting to me than I want to control everyone and everything. Ds doesn't even stand out in that regard.

No, I said that the ale is mentuioned far too much and that he is still relying on it even in today's stories. Thanos seeks something and gains it in that story. Ds pisses around and takes years to achieve his goals.

The ale is a plot device and gives him the ability to control beings outside his power. Spin it however you want he still lost with the ale like usual.


Saying this about Thanos sounds to me like you have Thanos envy. Being a ds fan I can see why.

Originally posted by Allankles
So? I don't see how what you've written makes Thanos a better character. You've only given me the same points that make Thanos dull.

There's nothing there that makes a good foil for a hero.



I doubt you do, given that you think the ALE is in every DS related story when that doesn't come close to being the case.



The ALE is knowledge, a doctrine that states that DS is the rightful master of all sentient beings in the universe. If it were merely a gem or some device, you'd have a point, but it is more than that ...

Too bad Thanos's plans only go as far as stealing a few trinkets and tech.

Wonderfully done Allankles . Did you pick up FC Submit?? I thought it was pretty good.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
^Does not read DC. durhmm Because Trick reads Marvel... amirite!?!?!

Originally posted by skyfather
^does not read ANY comic's,and even gets mocked by his "friends" he thinks he has on here. nice

Originally posted by Allankles
I don't have to make stuff up, Thanos doesn't have the track record.

That's not true. Leading armies, having galaxy-spanning followings, subjecting the entire f*cking Marvel Universe to his rule, Thanos has done all that before. And it was all covered on the previous page, so I don't get why you're saying he doesn't have the track record.

Originally posted by Enyalus
That's not true. Leading armies, having galaxy-spanning followings, subjecting the entire f*cking Marvel Universe to his rule, Thanos has done all that before. And it was all covered on the previous page, so I don't get why you're saying he doesn't have the track record.

The thread is about running and sustaining an empire. Collecting artifices doesn't count.

Originally posted by Allankles
The thread is about running and sustaining an empire. Collecting artifices doesn't count.

He's still run an entire planet before (well, moon - Titan.) And the other stuff brought up isn't just written off because of the 'no artifacts' clause.

Originally posted by kevdude
Wonderfully done Allankles . Did you pick up FC Submit?? I thought it was pretty good.

I picked it up, I think I have every issue save, Revelations 5, don't know what happened there. I thought FC was building up nicely up till after FC 5.

Originally posted by Enyalus
He's still run an entire planet before (well, moon - Titan.) And the other stuff brought up isn't just written off because of the 'no artifacts' clause.

But you brought up his artifice collection feats. That doesn't translate to leading and sustaining an empire.

Originally posted by quanchi112


Saying this about Thanos sounds to me like you have Thanos envy. Being a ds fan I can see why.

Why would I be envious of a guy who's entire history is littered with poor writing and simplistic plot progression? Come back to me when someone writes a decent story on Post TQ Thanos.

Originally posted by Allankles
Why would I be envious of a guy who's entire history is littered with poor writing and simplistic plot progression? Come back to me when someone writes a decent story on Post TQ Thanos. ...


lulz

Originally posted by Allankles
The thread is about running and sustaining an empire. Collecting artifices doesn't count. Thanos has sustained quite a force early on and has shown the ability to be able to do so. If he wanted to it's an easy fix,but he usually doesn't need all the help.Originally posted by Allankles
Why would I be envious of a guy who's entire history is littered with poor writing and simplistic plot progression? Come back to me when someone writes a decent story on Post TQ Thanos. There are plenty of great Thanos stories out there. His series I enjoyed,the ig story,etc.


Don't hate on him because he is held in a higher regard to fans in general than Darkseid.

DS wins. Thanos doesn't have what it takes in this scenario.

Originally posted by Badabing
DS wins. Thanos doesn't have what it takes in this scenario. Thanos incites a riot and Ds's forces turn on Ds. Thanos for the win. He can sit on his ass and tear Ds's army apart from the inside.

Darkseid has more experience.

Originally posted by Spire
Darkseid has more experience. That doesn't mean anything.

Originally posted by quanchi112
That doesn't mean anything.

k

Yeah experience means nothing the bias is obvious

Originally posted by iceman24567
Yeah experience means nothing the bias is obvious

Absolutely nothing. Especially the sixteen years with PC Supes.

Originally posted by iceman24567
Yeah experience means nothing the bias is obvious Thanos has had experience with building an army. Just because Ds has done this longer that doesn't mean he would win this particular thread based on that fact. Most of Ds's poor population utterly despise him.

Quan, do you know why most of them don't rebel? It's because they FEAR him. They are slaves to his will because they honestly believe he is GOD. Apokolips is Darkseid's ideal society, formed to his specifications and will.

Any Empire he creates will be built on these principles. An army of fanatics devoted to a leader as a supreme deity, with terrible wrath and a single command.

DIE FOR DARKSEID!

Darkseid's ideal is to break people, to make them feel life itself is worthless and there is no point to anything. In essence, to embrace the ideal of Anti-life.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Quan, do you know why most of them don't rebel? It's because they FEAR him. They are slaves to his will because they honestly believe he is GOD. Apokolips is Darkseid's ideal society, formed to his specifications and will.

Any Empire he creates will be built on these principles. An army of fanatics devoted to a leader as a supreme deity, with terrible wrath and a single command.

DIE FOR DARKSEID!

Darkseid's ideal is to break people, to make them feel life itself is worthless and there is no point to anything. In essence, to embrace the ideal of Anti-life. They feel life is worthless, yet they fear for their lives?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Quan, do you know why most of them don't rebel? It's because they FEAR him. They are slaves to his will because they honestly believe he is GOD. Apokolips is Darkseid's ideal society, formed to his specifications and will.

Any Empire he creates will be built on these principles. An army of fanatics devoted to a leader as a supreme deity, with terrible wrath and a single command.

DIE FOR DARKSEID!

Darkseid's ideal is to break people, to make them feel life itself is worthless and there is no point to anything. In essence, to embrace the ideal of Anti-life. Yes, they fear him but wouldn't hesitate to replace him with a new leader or mock him as they did when Yuga came to town.

Originally posted by Spire
Absolutely nothing. Especially the sixteen years with PC Supes. Oh that's nothing of course Thanos wins no matter what because he fought Odin

Originally posted by quanchi112
There are plenty of great Thanos stories out there. His series I enjoyed,the ig story,etc.


The Ig story: no real drama, no intrigue. One sided plot progression, a shallow set of huddles, a typical Thanos tale.

The IG story was a bit better than Hunger and Infity Abyss, which is to say it was tolerable - especially after TQ - but that's not saying much.

Originally posted by Allankles
The Ig story: no real drama, no intrigue. One sided plot progression, a shallow set of huddles, a typical Thanos tale.

The IG story was a bit better than Hunger and Infity Abyss, which is to say it was tolerable - especially after TQ - but that's not saying much. http://uppitynegronetwork.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/haterade.jpg

Haterade frost is best.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, they fear him but wouldn't hesitate to replace him with a new leader or mock him as they did when Yuga came to town. ..........Yuga was the former ruler who Darkseid deposed on his quest to take over Apokolips. That might have something to do with it. And really? Yuga Khan? A being capable of soloing Asgard or Olympus?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Don't hate on him because he is held in a higher regard to fans in general than Darkseid.

I could care less if you idolize Thanos, good stories and Thanos are separated by a dimension called "good writing".

Originally posted by Mindset
http://uppitynegronetwork.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/haterade.jpg

Goes down better than Infinity Abyss, you should try some. Maybe when someone writes Thanos a decent tale, I'll have good things to say on the matter.

Originally posted by Allankles
The Ig story: no real drama, no intrigue. One sided plot progression, a shallow set of huddles, a typical Thanos tale.

The IG story was a bit better than Hunger and Infity Abyss, which is to say it was tolerable - especially after TQ - but that's not saying much. What? The universe was in peril and the heroes matched an offensive while meph convinced him to lower his powers to give them a chance. Thanos still triumphed and then took on the gods of the universe. It was quite epic with him in the meantime taking out half the universe, cutting off odin and the gods on asgard, etc.


In fc you had Ds still chirping about the ale.........then batman comes in and deals the fatal blow to the mighty darkseid with a gun that shoots radion. The epic storyline ended with me utterly bored and Mandrakk being the true villain not Ds.


Fc will never ever be held in the same regard as the ig.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
..........Yuga was the former ruler who Darkseid deposed on his quest to take over Apokolips. That might have something to do with it. And really? Yuga Khan? A being capable of soloing Asgard or Olympus? No, the point is when someone else came in and kicked his ass his followers were happy to follow someone else. Most of his followers will jump at the first chance to betray him and that includes Desaad and the higher ups. No loyalty in his army.

Originally posted by Allankles
I could care less if you idolize Thanos, good stories and Thanos are separated by a dimension called "good writing". All subjective. Mindset called you out on hatin Thanos. Thanos is still respected is my point across the boards while Darkseid isn't. That is a fact.

i belive thanos will make a better empire then darkseid

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thanos is still respected is my point across the boards while Darkseid isn't. That is a fact.

And I said, I could care less if you idolize the guy, he simply doesn't make for good stories and that's a fact.

DS has a better rep within the media, he's a bigger character, because he actually makes for a great foil for heroes with his diabolical mind.

DS is a better product than Thanos: fact.

Allankles' opinion is as bias as Quan's, and that's a fact.

Originally posted by quanchi112


Fc will never ever be held in the same regard as the ig.

No legitimate comic critic has any high regard for the IG (don't kid yourself), and if you're talking story telling FC was better at least before the last couple of issues.

More than that, FC was a Crisis which will have an effect on the story operations within the company for some time. More important to DC than IG ever was to Marvel.

Originally posted by Allankles
And I said, I could care less if you idolize the guy, he simply doesn't make for good stories and that's a fact.

DS has a better rep within the media, he's a bigger character, because he actually makes for a great foil for heroes with his diabolical mind.

DS is a better product than Thanos: fact. I said that he is still a highly respected character across the lands while Ds isn't. Cbr and herochat both treat him like garbage.

Ds isn't a better product at all. Ds has gotten stale. He is just another superman villain nowadays.

Originally posted by Mekrob
Allankles' opinion is as bias as Quan's, and that's a fact. I'm not biased.Originally posted by Allankles
No legitimate comic critic has any high regard for the IG (don't kid yourself), and if you're talking story telling FC was better at least before the last couple of issues.

More than that, FC was a Crisis which will have an effect on the story operations within the company for some time. More important to DC than IG ever was to Marvel. Ig has stood the test of time while fc was a snoozefest that was by far the weakest of all the crisis. I could care less about long term effects, the ig was a much better story.

Originally posted by Allankles
DS has a better rep within the media, he's a bigger character
What does that make Wolverine?

Originally posted by quanchi112
I'm not biased. hysterical