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put these mystics in a list from strongest to weakest

zom
in betweener
master order
lord chaos
the vishanti
cyttorak
atum the god eater
set
gaia
shuma gorath
sis neg
dr strange
dormammu
umar
mephisto
loki
rune king thor
zeus
hercules
adam warlock
black heart
ghost rider
mordru
dracula
dr strange
the ancient one

{you can add any other magical marvel character to represent your own heirarchy}

Chaos/Order
Inbetweener
Atum th Godeater
Zom
Shuma gorath
The Vishanti(all three)
Rune king thor
set
Dormmamu
Cytorrak
Zeus
gaia
Mephisto
Umar

no order,to 5

Zom
Sis neg
Vishanti
Dr strange(by feats)
C&O

Why is Dr. Strange on their once and Doom isn't on there at all?

Also, the Hood has recently almost killed Strange.

Originally posted by Mindset
Why is Dr. Strange on their once and Doom isn't on there at all?

Also, the Hood has recently almost killed Strange.

Because Doom's magic prowess is barely comparable to Sabrina's Alakazam.

Doom could beat anyone you can think of and those you can't.

Then that means I lose either way?

Originally posted by Mindset
Doom could beat anyone you can think of and those you can't. sentry,morgan le fay.

Originally posted by Nihilist
sentry,morgan le fay.

He only lost to Sentry because that was wanking Sentry season. KMC rules, Doom owns him.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
He only lost to Sentry because that was wanking Sentry season. KMC rules, Doom owns him. he walked through his magic,imo it wasnt wanking sentry at all.irrc early on in that he(sentry) was getting chumped.

Sise-Neg

Originally posted by Nihilist
he walked through his magic,imo it wasnt wanking sentry at all.irrc early on in that he(sentry) was getting chumped. He didn't walk through his magic, he cheapshotted Doom while he was fighting the other Avengers...

And yea, they were wanking Sentry, since Doom's armor has taken A LOT more power than Sentry exerted to break it.

Morgan Le Fey had onsided prep and Doom was only using magic, he's about to kick her ass anyway.

Originally posted by Mindset
He didn't walk through his magic, he cheapshotted Doom while he was fighting the other Avengers...

And yea, they were wanking Sentry, since Doom's armor has taken A LOT more power than Sentry exerted to break it.

Morgan Le Fey had onsided prep and Doom was only using magic, he's about to kick her ass anyway. sentry walked through the bands of cyttorak/our some spell, irrc Doom even comented on it.

So Le Fay out prepped Doom,and he need's help to kick her ass.

Originally posted by Nihilist
sentry walked through the bands of cyttorak/our some spell, irrc Doom even comented on it.

So Le Fay out prepped Doom,and he need's help to kick her ass. Sentry didn't walk through the bands, he rammed Doom while Doom was busy fighting Tony.

The only time Doom actually attacked Sentry he had him writhing in pain.

Uh no, to say Morgana outprepped Doom would mean Doom would have had to actually prep, which he didn't. Evidently she needed prep in order to beat him...

Originally posted by Mindset
Sentry didn't walk through the bands, he rammed Doom while Doom was busy fighting Tony.

The only time Doom actually attacked Sentry he had him writhing in pain.

Uh no, to say Morgana outprepped Doom would mean Doom would have had to actually prep, which he didn't. Evidently she needed prep in order to beat him...
i'll re read it, tonight.

Thought doom was the prep master who prep's for everything, ever dently not..sdurug

Originally posted by Nihilist
i'll re read it, tonight.

Thought doom was the prep master who prep's for everything, ever dently not..sdurug His plan was to act like he lost so he could go back in time and pimpslap her.

Originally posted by Mindset
His plan was to act like he lost so he could go back in time and pimpslap her. yeah ok then

Originally posted by Nihilist
sentry walked through the bands of cyttorak/our some spell, irrc Doom even comented on it.

So Le Fay out prepped Doom,and he need's help to kick her ass.

Captain Britain also broke the Bands of Cyttorak.

Don't be angry just because Doom is superior to Apocalypse.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Captain Britain also broke the Bands of Cyttorak. so have many other,the strength of the bands depend on the caster usually, but they are not involved in this discussion.

Originally posted by Nihilist
so have many other,the strength of the bands depend on the caster usually, but they are not involved in this discussion.

Yeah you have a point. I forgot who summoned them on Quasar though.

Originally posted by Mindset
Don't be angry just because Doom is superior to Apocalypse. really, seeing as doom was fooled by loki and couldnt see through his plan yet apoc could.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Yeah you have a point. I forgot who summoned them on Quasar though.

Modred the mystic

Originally posted by Nihilist
really, seeing as doom was fooled by loki and couldnt see through his plan yet apoc could. Yea, too bad Doom has the greater accomplishments.


Doom throws a table at Apoc, what then?

Originally posted by Naija boy
Modred the mystic

You know you always have my back with invaluable knowledge.

Originally posted by Mindset
Yea, too bad Doom has the greater accomplishments.


Doom throws a table at Apoc, what then? Greater accomplishments...like Thanos has over Doom, them type?

He smashes it like he did vs dracula, or Apoc morphs into reed a doom loses yet again.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Greater accomplishments...like Thanos has over Doom, them type? I'm not seeing the point you are trying to make.

That both Doom and Thanos are superior to Apoc? Well yea, that's obvious.

Originally posted by Mindset
I'm not seeing the point you are trying to make.

That both Doom and Thanos are superior to Apoc? Well yea, that's obvious. Nice dodge.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Greater accomplishments...like Thanos has over Doom, them type?

He smashes it like he did vs dracula, or Apoc morphs into reed a doom loses yet again.

Yeah but unlike Thanos and Doom, Doom doesn't feel the need to keep up with his affairs like Thanos feels the need to keep up with Doom.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Nice dodge. What need did I have to dodge?

Doom is superior to Apoc.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Yeah but unlike Thanos and Doom, Doom doesn't feel the need to keep up with his affairs like Thanos feels the need to keep up with Doom. thats his loss then really, also so Doom tracked the energy signature's in both the IG/IW and HOTU.

To be fair though Apoc's failure is Marvel's fault for wasting all of the potential he had.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
To be fair though Apoc's failure is Marvel's fault for wasting all of the potential he had. indeed,the writer's of messhiah war want to bring Apoc back and make him a top villain like he was originaly intended but "ONLY IF MARVEL WILL LET THEM"they said.

Teh instance in question:

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/2254/imdoom4ot4.th.jpg http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/3686/58953633.th.jpg http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/3210/imdoom5vr3.th.jpg

Originally posted by Nihilist
indeed,the writer's of messhiah war want to bring Apoc back and make him a top villain like he was originaly intended but "ONLY IF MARVEL WILL LET THEM"they said.

Yeah on paper his powerset rocks, but it somehow loses its awesomeness when brought on panel.

Originally posted by Mindset
Yea, too bad Doom has the greater accomplishments.


Doom throws a table at Apoc, what then? LOL.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Yeah on paper his powerset rocks, but it somehow loses its awesomeness when brought on panel. if/when he comes back they'll chump him out again.

Originally posted by Galan007
Teh instance in question:

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/2254/imdoom4ot4.th.jpg http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/3686/58953633.th.jpg http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/3210/imdoom5vr3.th.jpg doesnt look like sentry cheap shotted him, seeing as at one part doom targetss him.

Originally posted by Nihilist
doesnt look like sentry cheap shotted him, seeing as at one part doom targetss him. Doom doesn't target him, Doom is attacking Tony, he only turns around to defend himself against Sentry.

Btw, Galan posted the scans out of order.

Those 3 scans are from 2 diff comics.

Originally posted by Mindset
Doom doesn't target him, Doom is attacking Tony, he only turns around to defend himself against Sentry.

Btw, Galan posted the scans out of order.

Those 3 scans are from 2 diff comics. in the first scan he clearly targets sentry whilst casting magic saying begone.

Saying begone doesn't mean he is attacking him, he is still facing towards Tony, he doesn't turn around until Sentry tries to ram him.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l54/Markymark_016/MightyAvengers9-020.jpg
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l54/Markymark_016/MightyAvengers9-021.jpg

I'm really not even sure what Doom is even doing since Tony doesn't even get damaged.

Originally posted by Mindset
Saying begone doesn't mean he is attacking him, he is still facing towards Tony, he doesn't turn around until Sentry tries to ram him.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l54/Markymark_016/MightyAvengers9-020.jpg
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l54/Markymark_016/MightyAvengers9-021.jpg

I'm really not even sure what Doom is even doing since Tony doesn't even get damaged. he already has tony ensnared, he fire's some kind of magic blast at sentry saying begone because he's the nearest threat.

I don't see him fire anything at Sentry, if the energy is the red glow, then he never actually fired it.

If you are talking about the the bluish/purple energy that Sentry flew through than, that is just the energy that is radiating from Doom.

The crimson bands are just meant to hold people anyway, as far as I know.


But when Doom clearly attacks Sentry, well:
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l54/Markymark_016/MightyAvengers10-009.jpg
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l54/Markymark_016/MightyAvengers10-010.jpg

Originally posted by Mindset
I don't see him fire anything at Sentry, if the energy is the red glow, then he never actually fired it.

If you are talking about the the bluish/purple energy that Sentry flew through than, that is just the energy that is radiating from Doom.

The crimson bands are just meant to hold people anyway, as far as I know.


But when Doom clearly attacks Sentry, well:
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l54/Markymark_016/MightyAvengers10-009.jpg
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l54/Markymark_016/MightyAvengers10-010.jpg sentry would have killed him if it wasnt for stark, once he regained his composure.

Originally posted by Nihilist
sentry would have killed him if it wasnt for stark. Yea, based off of Tony saying that, no actual feat.

But yea...

Originally posted by Mindset
Yea, based off of Tony saying that, no actual feat.

But yea... meh, considering stark knows what Sentry/Doom is capable of.

Originally posted by Nihilist
meh, considering stark knows what Sentry/Doom is capable of. Except he doesn't, he barely knows what either one is capable of.

He doesn't understand Sentry's powers, and he doesn't know about Doom's magic.

Doom has been learning all kinds of mystic arts, as evidence in MA and recently Dr. Strange talks about it when he considers the thought that Doom may be the new Sorcerer Supreme.

ge back on topic guys.

Originally posted by Mindset
Doom could beat anyone you can think of and those you can't.

Except Guardian

Originally posted by Naija boy
Chaos/Order
Inbetweener
Atum the Godeater
Zom
Shuma gorath
The Vishanti(all three)
Rune king thor
set
Cytorrak
Zeus
Dormmamu
gaea
Mephisto
Umar

Sise-Neg
Archenemey(did he use magic?)
Zom
Atum
Chaos/Order
Cyttorak
The Vishanti(all three)
Chthon
Inbetweener
Rune king thor
Set
Dormmamu the Dread
Mephisto
gaea
Zeus
Umar
Doctor Strange/Nightcrawler's mom/Brother Vodoo
The Enchantress/Clea

Originally posted by galactusischere
Sise-Neg
Archenemey(did he use magic?)
Zom
Atum
Chaos/Order
Cyttorak
The Vishanti(all three)
Chthon
Inbetweener
Rune king thor
Set
Dormmamu the Dread
Mephisto
gaea
Zeus
Umar
Doctor Strange/Nightcrawler's mom/Brother Vodoo
The Enchantress/Clea
isnt lord chaos and master order the source of all magic?

IDK, but im pretty sure guys like Zom, AE, Shuma, and Sise-Neg had surpassed them.

Why is Atum above Chaos/Order?

Aren't they > Inbetweener who is Galactus level.

Originally posted by Mindset
Why is Atum above Chaos/Order?

Aren't they > Inbetweener who is Galactus level.

Galactus>O/C>I-B.

The Galactus that fought I-B wasn't exactly well-fed.

Originally posted by galactusischere
Galactus>O/C>I-B.

The Galactus that fought I-B wasn't exactly well-fed. Based on what?

Anyway, from feats IB > Atum.

Originally posted by Mindset
Based on what?

Anyway, from feats IB > Atum.

Galactus' position and purpose is more important that Order and Chaos.

And Atum ate a whole buncha gods. Over hundreds I have heard.
That right there is abstract level power.

Originally posted by galactusischere
Galactus' position and purpose is more important that Order and Chaos.

And Atum ate a whole buncha gods. Over hundreds I have heard.
That right there is abstract level power. Galactus position and importance is greater than MJJ, HOM Wanda, etc.

Anyway, from feats IB > Atum.

C/O > IB.

Originally posted by Mindset
Galactus position and importance is greater than MJJ, HOM Wanda, etc.
Which is why Galactus owns the most powerful weapon in all of MU.



True dat.

Shuma Gorath > Dormammu

Dormammu > Blackheart

Bllackheart > Mephisto

Mephisto > Ghost Rider

That is all that I have.

Sise-Neg
The Living Tribunal
Zom/Slorioth
Order/Chaos
In-Betweener

That would be the top group IMO. I'm not going to get into Elder Gods, Skyfathers, etc.

Sise-Neg
The Living Tribunal
Eternity
Zom/Slorioth
Order/Chaos
In-Betweener
The Vishanti

Originally posted by the Darkone
Sise-Neg
The Living Tribunal
Eternity
Zom/Slorioth
Order/Chaos
In-Betweener
The Vishanti
eternity is not a mystic.....

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
eternity is not a mystic.....
Actually he is. He has access to magic as well. being everything and all.

Zom is NOT above Lord Chaos and Master Order and to believe so is silly.

Originally posted by TheTyrant
Actually he is. He has access to magic as well. being everything and all. lord chaos and master order is the source of all magic, they should be first or after sis-neg

Originally posted by CortSether
Zom is NOT above Lord Chaos and Master Order and to believe so is silly.

He's done considrably more than they have.

I know this is from a couple pages ago but I would just ignore anything Iron Man has to say about a fight involving magic of any sort. It took him how many years to finally believe that Thor was really Thor and Asgard even existed? And that's after massive experience fighting alongside Thor and the various Asgard heroes and villians. Tony Stark is the Peter Venkman of Marvel comics.

How LT is mystic?
Also HoM WANDA SHOULD BE INCLUDED

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
He's done considrably more than they have.

Because they're not the type to do things, they rarely appear in comics at all, but they are a big chunk of reality and are magic itself. Even the strongest magic wielders should be below them.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
He's done considrably more than they have.

If LC and MC decided to shut off access to their magic Zom wouldn't be able to scratch his own butt.

And what has Zom done at all besides get banished and look stupid?

Originally posted by CortSether
If LC and MC decided to shut off access to their magic Zom wouldn't be able to scratch his own butt.

And what has Zom done at all besides get banished and look stupid?

That's not how Order and Chaos work, stop making up lies.

Scare the shit out of Eternity, and get the LT's attention unprompted.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
That's not how Order and Chaos work, stop making up lies.

Scare the shit out of Eternity, and get the LT's attention unprompted.

He got LTs attention because he was a creation and not a part of the balance between chaos and order. He was also trying to destroy everything. Shuma just ruled over the earth for a long while and ate people it's not against any rules so LT wouldn't have cared.

And there was zero detail as to how it went down between Eternity, Dormammu and Zom. But Dormammu was able to put Zom in chains and Zom was sealed in a vase. There's nothing that indicates Eternity feared Zom's power.

And I'm not making up lies, Zom wouldn't be able to do jack squat to LC/MO.

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/godhed1big.jpg these guys are all equals