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SOCIALISM!!!!!!!

^ftw

No different than what the bush administration was doing really.

Originally posted by King Kandy
No different than what the bush administration was doing really.
What about CHAAAAAAAAAAAANGE?

The more things change, the more they stay the same. These similarities are a good sign.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
What about CHAAAAAAAAAAAANGE?
Can't change everything. I'm just glad about the small progress that is happening.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
What about CHAAAAAAAAAAAANGE?

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
What about CHAAAAAAAAAAAANGE?

Get the hell away from me, you vile, putrescent, homeless, imbecile!

"Our only comfort is that the terrorists will probably turn the clock back only 200 years rather than 5000. For what we now fear is not so much the death and suffering that their infernal regimes can cause, but the loss of liberty that will come about as a result of Western government's response to terrorist acts. We now worry not about the end of civilization but rather about the... end of various socio-political institutions that emerged in Europe and North America in the wake of the Bourgeois revolutions."

-Richard Rorty

so why is a republican, whose party supported this sort of behaviour in the bush regime, posting this up in the hope of getting negetive reactions from people? you obviously dont disagree with this stuff, so shudnt u be happy? height of hypocrisy

Originally posted by leonheartmm
so why is a republican, whose party supported this sort of behaviour in the bush regime, posting this up in the hope of getting negetive reactions from people? you obviously dont disagree with this stuff, so shudnt u be happy? height of hypocrisy
You just don't get it. Anything a republican does is good, everything a democrat does is bad... even if it's the same thing.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
so why is a republican, whose party supported this sort of behaviour in the bush regime, posting this up in the hope of getting negetive reactions from people? you obviously dont disagree with this stuff, so shudnt u be happy? height of hypocrisy

http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/files/images/080211_change.jpg

I am just pointing out how stupid all the liberals that bought into Obama's BS look now. I know it isn't polite, but I just love saying, "told you so".

Originally posted by King Kandy
You just don't get it. Anything a republican does is good, everything a democrat does is bad... even if it's the same thing.

Oh the irony is so strong.

Originally posted by KidRock

Oh the irony is so strong.
How so?

Originally posted by King Kandy
How so?

Past 8 years: GITMO is illegally holding people, Bush is a facist! Unjustified wars need to end, Blood for oil Bush! Bush is destroying our civil rights!

Currently: Illegally detaining people? It's cool Obama, Bush did it too. Ending the wars? You take your time, it'll come eventually. Civil rights? Na, Obama would never do something like preventative detention.


It was all terrible when Bush was doing it, but now that it's Obama..there is no problem. So it's quite ironic how you would call out Republicans for having a problem with this now while being okay with it for the past 8 years; when Democrats have been bitching and moaning for 8 years about the same issues but are now okay with them because a man with a D next to his name is doing it.

Originally posted by KidRock
Past 8 years: GITMO is illegally holding people, Bush is a facist! Unjustified wars need to end, Blood for oil Bush! Bush is destroying our civil rights!

Currently: Illegally detaining people? It's cool Obama, Bush did it too. Ending the wars? You take your time, it'll come eventually. Civil rights? Na, Obama would never do something like preventative detention.


It was all terrible when Bush was doing it, but now that it's Obama..there is no problem. So it's quite ironic how you would call out Republicans for having a problem with this now while being okay with it for the past 8 years; when Democrats have been bitching and moaning for 8 years about the same issues but are now okay with them because a man with a D next to his name is doing it.

I agree on the hypocrisy of the matter.


What are the types of people being detained, though? That may shed some light on this. I don't think it is as simple as you make it out to be. Enlighten me.

You know you ****ed up if you have MSNBC hating on you Obama. Olbermann is still nowhere to be found though.

1uuWVHT1WUY

kidrock, my problem with you posting this stuff has NEVER{other than in the economy department, which was BS on ur part} had anything to do with SUPPORTING the liberal party. MY problem has to do with YOU supporting the neo cons and all their BS and THEN brining out selective examples from obama in an attempt to justify how wrong YOU are.

YEA, the conservatives can be very corrupt and rather hypocritical. but that does NOT in any way shape or FORM, take away from the fact that the necons and their agenda is criminally bigoted and ****ing evil.

basically, NO1 here beleives in your or the neo con's GOOD INTENTIONS, being the motivation for posting this type of propaganda{true or otherwise}, since people KNOW, that neo cons are a worse evil only using these things incincerely as political leverage to establish an even WORSE society and agenda.

basically, hypocrisy and more hypocrisy. again, shudnt you be SUPPORTING this?!?!?!?!?!?1


and for HEAVENS sake stop trying to compare liberal news networks to fox news, its utter FAIL. there is no contest. fox news outshines all of them COMBINED in its BS and ****ed up non existant journalistic ethic and shamelessness.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Can't change everything. I'm just glad about the small progress that is happening.
What, creating trillions in debt over the rest of his presidency?

Very bad idea

Originally posted by KidRock
Currently: Illegally detaining people? It's cool Obama, Bush did it too.
Ending the wars? You take your time, it'll come eventually.
Civil rights? Na, Obama would never do something like preventative detention

You really don't see the difference between cleaning up another person's problems and making them in the first place?

Originally posted by KidRock
Past 8 years: GITMO is illegally holding people, Bush is a facist! Unjustified wars need to end, Blood for oil Bush! Bush is destroying our civil rights!

Currently: Illegally detaining people? It's cool Obama, Bush did it too. Ending the wars? You take your time, it'll come eventually. Civil rights? Na, Obama would never do something like preventative detention.


It was all terrible when Bush was doing it, but now that it's Obama..there is no problem. So it's quite ironic how you would call out Republicans for having a problem with this now while being okay with it for the past 8 years; when Democrats have been bitching and moaning for 8 years about the same issues but are now okay with them because a man with a D next to his name is doing it.
Try and find a post where I claimed Obama would institute major change. I bet you can't.

Originally posted by RocasAtoll
What, creating trillions in debt over the rest of his presidency?
You know the economic meltdown started before Obama was in office, right?

Obama never said he would end wars. He said he would end a war.

Otherwise you're not far off from reality.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
You really don't see the difference between cleaning up another person's problems and making them in the first place?

Only problem is, he isn't cleaning anything up..he is making it dirtier.

Even Rachel Maddow said Obama is taking steps that were only on the horizon for the Bush administration

Originally posted by leonheartmm
kidrock, my problem with you posting this stuff has NEVER{other than in the economy department, which was BS on ur part} had anything to do with SUPPORTING the liberal party. MY problem has to do with YOU supporting the neo cons and all their BS and THEN brining out selective examples from obama in an attempt to justify how wrong YOU are.

YEA, the conservatives can be very corrupt and rather hypocritical. but that does NOT in any way shape or FORM, take away from the fact that the necons and their agenda is criminally bigoted and ****ing evil.

basically, NO1 here beleives in your or the neo con's GOOD INTENTIONS, being the motivation for posting this type of propaganda{true or otherwise}, since people KNOW, that neo cons are a worse evil only using these things incincerely as political leverage to establish an even WORSE society and agenda.

basically, hypocrisy and more hypocrisy. again, shudnt you be SUPPORTING this?!?!?!?!?!?1


and for HEAVENS sake stop trying to compare liberal news networks to fox news, its utter FAIL. there is no contest. fox news outshines all of them COMBINED in its BS and ****ed up non existant journalistic ethic and shamelessness.

I really don't want to school you again. Go pay for an education. I am not going to make you cry again.

Just for laughs: What is a neo-con? What do they support and what are their policies?

Originally posted by King Kandy
Try and find a post where I claimed Obama would institute major change. I bet you can't.

Why would I do that? Millions of Americans out there DID say he would make big changes and bought into his garbage.

Originally posted by KidRock
Why would I do that? Millions of Americans out there DID say he would make big changes and bought into his garbage.
Because you were replying to MY post. I am not "millions of americans" and my views are in no way the same as most democrats.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Because you were replying to MY post. I am not "millions of americans" and my views are in no way the same as most democrats.

Actually, it was Leonhearts post.

Your post was quoted to point out the hypocrisy.

And yes, your views on economics are the same as most democrats.

Originally posted by KidRock
Actually, it was Leonhearts post.

Your post was quoted to point out the hypocrisy.

And yes, your views on economics are the same as most democrats.
Yes, you quoted my post to point out the hypocrisy of views expressed by people who were not me. I think the problem is clear here.

Originally posted by KidRock
Only problem is, he isn't cleaning anything up..he is making it dirtier.

Even Rachel Maddow said Obama is taking steps that were only on the horizon for the Bush administration



I really don't want to school you again. Go pay for an education. I am not going to make you cry again.

Just for laughs: What is a neo-con? What do they support and what are their policies?



Why would I do that? Millions of Americans out there DID say he would make big changes and bought into his garbage.

so an uneducated redneck whose ideal is kidrock and who doesnt know the connection between deficit and debt is going to SCHOOL me???

srry, id forgotten how ignorant and full of your own southern shit you usually are. my mistake hillbilly.

now why dont you TRY and address my problems with you. if you can get your head out of ur ass long enough that is.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Yes, you quoted my post to point out the hypocrisy of views expressed by people who were not me. I think the problem is clear here.

Um no, I pointed out how your comment about everything republicans do is good and democrats are bad is just ironic and hypocritcal..it had nothing to do with you being for "change" or anything.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
so an uneducated redneck whose ideal is kidrock and who doesnt know the connection between deficit and debt is going to SCHOOL me???

srry, id forgotten how ignorant and full of your own southern shit you usually are. my mistake hillbilly.

now why dont you TRY and address my problems with you. if you can get your head out of ur ass long enough that is.

So you're a degenerate bigot too? Your parents must be proud.

Originally posted by KidRock
Um no, I pointed out how your comment about everything republicans do is good and democrats are bad is just ironic and hypocritcal..it had nothing to do with you being for "change" or anything.



So you're a degenerate bigot too? Your parents must be proud.

i dunno, was your mother a cow?

Originally posted by KidRock
Um no, I pointed out how your comment about everything republicans do is good and democrats are bad is just ironic and hypocritcal..it had nothing to do with you being for "change" or anything.

It was not hypocrisy as I never made statements where I said dems=good, republicans=bad. Again, you take opinions of others and apply them to me even though I said nothing of the sort.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
i dunno, was your mother a cow?

Why? You wanna pray to her?

See kids, being a bigot is so easy even I can do it.

^no, i was just tryin to answer your question when you asked me if i was a bigot. i have this thing against cows and their children masquerading as human beings.

so was she, or does tabboed skull****ing explain you?

moral of the story, behave civilly with others unless you can take it yourself. SPECIALLY if you are ignorant. *see editing is so easy even i can do it*

Originally posted by leonheartmm
^no, i was just tryin to answer your question when you asked me if i was a bigot. i have this thing against cows and their children masquerading as human beings.

so was she, or does tabboed skull****ing explain you?

moral of the story, behave civilly with others unless you can take it yourself. SPECIALLY if you are ignorant. *see editing is so easy even i can do it*

Originally posted by leonheartmm
so an uneducated redneck whose ideal is kidrock and who doesnt know the connection between deficit and debt is going to SCHOOL me???

srry, id forgotten how ignorant and full of your own southern shit you usually are. my mistake hillbilly.

now why dont you TRY and address my problems with you. if you can get your head out of ur ass long enough that is.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
i dunno, was your mother a cow?

How civil. Moron.

^u reap what you sow. now, if u wanna answer my allegation reasonable without getting your unjustifyable large ego in the way and claiming humiliations on your part as "schooling" , then we can have a civil discourse. unless youd rather be raped by me in both your knowledge and your ability to take crude jabs at the other person..

Originally posted by leonheartmm
^u reap what you sow. now, if u wanna answer my allegation reasonable without getting your unjustifyable large ego in the way and claiming humiliations on your part as "schooling" , then we can have a civil discourse. unless youd rather be raped by me in both your knowledge and your ability to take crude jabs at the other person..

You're honestly just not worth anybody's time. You embarrass yourself.

^says the hypocritical right wing mouthpiece, when asked to stop bitching and start a valid discussion.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
^says the hypocritical right wing mouthpiece, when asked to stop bitching and start a valid discussion.

I am having valid discussions, with people other then you. People that are intelligent enough to make valid points and arguements..such as King Kandy.

And not "Was your mother a cow?"

I am not being a jerk to you, I am simply stating you're not worth my time on here.

lmao, i started with a non offensice statement. u replied with egotistical/self obsessed bullshit and a non answer, i simply continued the tradition.

no1 is disagreeing with what you posted. well not totally. i was merely elaborating on the problem with YOU posting it. and u cant seem to be able to justify yourself or ur habits.

Ditch the personal attacks, please.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
lmao, i started with a non offensice statement. u replied with egotistical/self obsessed bullshit and a non answer, i simply continued the tradition.

no1 is disagreeing with what you posted. well not totally. i was merely elaborating on the problem with YOU posting it. and u cant seem to be able to justify yourself or ur habits.

Feel free to use the ignore button then.

^that applies to you since you chose to reply with the stuff u did.

Originally posted by BackFire
Ditch the personal attacks, please.

You voted for Obama, how do you feel about this?

Originally posted by KidRock
You voted for Obama, how do you feel about this?

I'll wait to complain till he actually DOES it. "To consider" it is a far cry from doing it.

Originally posted by BackFire
I'll wait to complain till he actually DOES it. "To consider" it is a far cry from doing it.

It doesn't bother you that he has came out and said he is even considering locking people up when they havent committed a crime?

It would sorta bother me if he did it.

But I don't think he will. Too much blow back. I mean, Maddow went after him. Freaking Maddow.

Him thinking about considering it doesn't bother me. Of course he's going to think about considering it. He'd be stupid not too, because it's an option, and one that would make things easy. But it would prove him to be a hypocrite to actually do it.

Originally posted by KidRock
You're honestly just not worth anybody's time.
Originally posted by KidRock
You're honestly just not worth anybody's time.
Originally posted by KidRock
You're honestly just not worth anybody's time.

Originally posted by King Kandy
You know the economic meltdown started before Obama was in office, right?
You do understand creating even greater public debt and propping up failed companies will only hurt the economy more, right?

Originally posted by RocasAtoll
You do understand creating even greater public debt and propping up failed companies will only hurt the economy more, right?
So if Obama did nothing, the debt would remain exactly where it is? No, the poor economy would worsen and build up debt no matter what Obama did.

Originally posted by King Kandy
So if Obama did nothing, the debt would remain exactly where it is? No, the poor economy would worsen and build up debt no matter what Obama did.

So pretty much "**** it, there is already a fire going, we might as well throw a bunch of gasoline on it, maybe that will put it out?"

Oh and for the record share very few if ANY beliefs that Neo-Conservatism does.

Originally posted by King Kandy
So if Obama did nothing, the debt would remain exactly where it is? No, the poor economy would worsen and build up debt no matter what Obama did.


No, the debt would evaporate with the evaporating companies (bankruptcy), business practices would be forced to change rather than their diapers being changed for them, foreign borrowing would be reduced as no money would need to be borrowed from other nations to foot the bill for the companies' mistakes (and there are numerous reasons why you don't want your nation to be in huge debt other nations), the system is allowed to mature from mistakes on it's own in a free market; the companies not bailed out have a chance to restructure, reorganize, file chapter 11, and get rid of contractual agreements that hold them back from fixing their problem (getting rid of their union contracts, stopping pension, etc.); and, finally, tax dollars can be spent on things other than bailing out poisonous asset ridden companies.

(That was a LONG sentence.)

On the downside, there would be many short term job losses, a shift in job types could be observed and that's hard to adapt to on the short term, some companies may ship jobs overseas to save money because of the loss in spending power from the middle class, and...and...I can't think of anything else.

I would love to see some market attrition with other organizations replacing or entirely different organizations replacing the losses. I'm more capitalist, though, and fair is fair. You do crappy business and it bites you in the butt, your business fails.



Some calls this naive as the US banking market is so closely tied in with the rest of the world that it literally affects the rest of the world. Strange, because everything went to shizer anyway...it's not like things would have been that much different. In fact, the stock market may have done better if they didn't drag it out so long...and just went belly up.


Edit- this seems like the wrong thread for this.

Originally posted by KidRock
So pretty much "**** it, there is already a fire going, we might as well throw a bunch of gasoline on it, maybe that will put it out?"

Actually gasoline can be used to put out a small fire in much the same way that water can. It's really only the fumes that are easy to ignite.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Actually gasoline can be used to put out a small fire in much the same way that water can. It's really only the fumes that are easy to ignite.

10 trillions dollars of debt is a small fire?

Originally posted by KidRock
10 trillions dollars of debt is a small fire?

If described entirely by a single burning check. Also, I wasn't using a metaphor.

Originally posted by King Kandy
So if Obama did nothing, the debt would remain exactly where it is?'
If Obama hadn't decided to go on a plan of printing thousands of bills that weakened the value of the dollar, if Obama had not put tax money into businesses that are economically nonviable, if he hadn't put the government debt into a larger hole, the debt wouldn't have shot up so high and we wouldn't be in such a bad place when the next recession happens.
Originally posted by King Kandy
No, the poor economy would worsen and build up debt no matter what Obama did.
What has the economy done so far? Recover? No. The market would have corrected itself and in the end become healthier for the cutting away of weak companies and strengthening of healthy companies.

So it's Guantanamo 2?

Guantonomo Bay was the most humane part in America. Despite it actually being on the island of Cuba.

Originally posted by RocasAtoll
If Obama hadn't decided to go on a plan of printing thousands of bills that weakened the value of the dollar, if Obama had not put tax money into businesses that are economically nonviable, if he hadn't put the government debt into a larger hole, the debt wouldn't have shot up so high and we wouldn't be in such a bad place when the next recession happens.
12 trillion dollars of debt under Bush. It's hardly shot up at all, actually.

Originally posted by RocasAtoll
If Obama hadn't decided to go on a plan of printing thousands of bills that weakened the value of the dollar, if Obama had not put tax money into businesses that are economically nonviable, if he hadn't put the government debt into a larger hole, the debt wouldn't have shot up so high and we wouldn't be in such a bad place when the next recession happens.

What has the economy done so far? Recover? No. The market would have corrected itself and in the end become healthier for the cutting away of weak companies and strengthening of healthy companies.

Good posts, very true..glad someone is educating themselves.

Originally posted by lord xyz
So it's Guantanamo 2?

Guantonomo Bay was the most humane part in America. Despite it actually being on the island of Cuba.

Change you can believe in.

Originally posted by KidRock
Good posts, very true..glad someone is educating themselves.



Change you can believe in. I want Bill back.

Originally posted by lord xyz
I want Bill back.
Yeah, a dem who actually made a national surplus.

Originally posted by RocasAtoll
What has the economy done so far? Recover? No. And what would it have done otherwise? Correct itself while how many people suffer? It's like arguing about whether to strangle the people or the economy. I mean, you'll have to put the people through a certain level of suffering but you don't want to cut off so much support they're forced into survival mode...oh wait, I forgot, the democrats are always wrong...

Originally posted by Quark_666
And what would it have done otherwise? Correct itself while how many people suffer?

That's the idea. Free-market's are supposed to be self correcting. Assuming people are logical and intelligent short term suffering leads to long term benefit for everyone.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
That's the idea. Free-market's are supposed to be self correcting. Assuming people are logical and intelligent short term suffering leads to long term benefit for everyone.

This is correct. As long as they aren't stupid...it should be a self-correcting system.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
That's the idea. Free-market's are supposed to be self correcting. Assuming people are logical and intelligent short term suffering leads to long term benefit for everyone.
This is very idealistic. If the only way to describe things is that it is "supposed" to do something or will "assuming" certain things, then there must not have been much in the way of a solid system.

Yeah hence "that's the idea". However all systems require one to make assumptions.

I guess, but the assumptions don't seem to be panning out.

To which the counter argument would be that we don't have a truly free-market system.

To which the counter is that actually building a proper free-market system would require destroying all business and government then start from the ground up, which is something that will never get any support from anyone but anarchist and libertarians.

To which the counter argument is that I'm wrong about that assumption in some way.

Which is counter with "No I'm not shut up Ba- jerk!"

I really haven't seen anything to suggest a true free-market wouldn't just be people endlessly scheming to rip each other off.

Originally posted by King Kandy
I guess, but the assumptions don't seem to be panning out.


Well, you have at least 3 out of 3 laymen agreeing (Myself, you, and SC (Not Santa Clause)). Funny how they - our congressmen - didn't believe it would work and the experts at the banks didn't exercise it.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
That's the idea. Free-market's are supposed to be self correcting. Assuming people are logical and intelligent short term suffering leads to long term benefit for everyone.

Correct.

Or at the very least a free market will rebound the best.

If you left the markets alone they would have had problems, but eventually rebounded.

Obama on the other hand chose to intervene and now we are having problems, eventually will rebound AND be a few trillion dollars more in debt.

Originally posted by KidRock
Correct.

Or at the very least a free market will rebound the best.

If you left the markets alone they would have had problems, but eventually rebounded.

Obama on the other hand chose to intervene and now we are having problems, eventually will rebound AND be a few trillion dollars more in debt.
lol. If it's only "a few trillion dollars" he's got nothing on Reagan & Bush.

Originally posted by Quark_666
And what would it have done otherwise? Correct itself while how many people suffer? It's like arguing about whether to strangle the people or the economy. I mean, you'll have to put the people through a certain level of suffering but you don't want to cut off so much support they're forced into survival mode...oh wait, I forgot, the democrats are always wrong...
The government isn't supporting anyone. All it is doing is setting up the economy for an even greater fall and slower growth in the future.
Originally posted by King Kandy
12 trillion dollars of debt under Bush. It's hardly shot up at all, actually.
Ya, because adding more debt onto an already staggering amount is justified because "everyone else is doing it".

Originally posted by King Kandy
I really haven't seen anything to suggest a true free-market wouldn't just be people endlessly scheming to rip each other off.

likely, but also in that market, the schemers would be separated from government in such a way that they would suffer the consequences of such terrible business practice.

Originally posted by RocasAtoll
Ya, because adding more debt onto an already staggering amount is justified because "everyone else is doing it".
No, the whole reason i'm arguing this is because KidRock said dems passed the problems down to your children and reps don't.

Originally posted by King Kandy
No, the whole reason i'm arguing this is because KidRock said dems passed the problems down to your children and reps don't.


That's obviously wrong because it's both parties' and the American people's fault.

Yes, which is why i've had to argue in five different threads that Republicans have built up as much if not more debt than democrats.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Yes, which is why i've had to argue in five different threads that Republicans have built up as much if not more debt than democrats.

Well, then, I guess we find ourselves agreeing, yet again. If only all politics were this easy.

Originally posted by King Kandy
No, the whole reason i'm arguing this is because KidRock said dems passed the problems down to your children and reps don't.
As long as you aren't trying to give Obama a pass, go ahead.

Originally posted by RocasAtoll
As long as you aren't trying to give Obama a pass, go ahead.
I'm giving him as much of a pass as KidRock was giving republicans.

Originally posted by inimalist
likely, but also in that market, the schemers would be separated from government in such a way that they would suffer the consequences of such terrible business practice.

In an Obama style economy the schemers will be the government itself.

It makes liberals angry that the rich step all over the poor to make their money, so they want government intervention. The government and help regulate it, only to have those government officials get rich and have the perks.

Just see Chris Dodd and the Countrywide Loan scandal. You want to see corruption? See Democrats when they're allowed to control the economy.

Originally posted by KidRock
You want to see corruption? See Democrats when they're allowed to control the economy.
I didn't realize the past republican administrators were saints.

I remember when GM was begging for bailout money or they would go bankrupt. Government intervention and regulation is necessary! The government will protect them from going under!


30 billion dollars later..


GM prepares for bankruptcy protection announcement

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090531/ap_on_bi_ge/us_automakers

Originally posted by KidRock
I remember when GM was begging for bailout money or they would go bankrupt. Government intervention and regulation is necessary! The government will protect them from going under!


30 billion dollars later..


GM prepares for bankruptcy protection announcement

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090531/ap_on_bi_ge/us_automakers
And so what exactly was the point in you posting that other GM thread? Spam?

Originally posted by King Kandy
And so what exactly was the point in you posting that other GM thread? Spam?

This post was about how GM is going bankrupt after Obama (and your) socialist ideals put us 30 billion more dollars into the hole.

The NEW thread is about how the same morons that made the decision to burn 30,000,000,000 are now going to be the ones controlling 70% of the new GM.

Lets read please.

Obama is Spock.

Bi-racial, tall, deep voice, saves the Earth.