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The Dark Knight vs The World's Smartest Man.

Anything goes.

Who wins?

Adrian dominates this fight.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Adrian dominates this fight.

That doesn't even come close to capturing what would happen.

He whoops Batman's ass so bad, he fixes his voice.

Spite.

Originally posted by KingD19
He whoops Batman's ass so bad, he fixes his voice.

I'm seriously laughing at the fact that people think Ozy would even come close to dominating this fight. He's faster than Batman, yes, but he's neither more skilled, nor is he stronger.

He's at least as skilled and he's stronger.

Batman arm curled Liam Neeson while hanging off the side of an icy cliff, that's definitely some serious levels of strength.

Ozy picked up a 200+ pound Comedian over his head and toss his ass like a rag doll. He also sent Rorschach and Owl flying with kicks. That's a greater level of strength than the above.

Originally posted by Davis Bloome
He's faster than Batman, yes, but he's neither more skilled, nor is he stronger.

No way in hell is he either of those. Ozy curbstomps Batman.

Batman wins with prep and standard equipment.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Batman wins with prep and standard equipment.

Not sure about that, as Ozy is an uber-genius, so it stands to reason he'd out-prep the prepper.

What standard equipment of Batman's do you see him winning with? Because Ozy's bullet avoidance is better than Batman's, so a bat-grappler isn't like to make contact.

Well this is going to be in a neutral environment right? If so, Ozy can't choose the location and won't be aware of it anymore than Batman. Thus, both he and Batman will prep based on the others weaknesses.
Batman will upgrade his armor to be more resistent to anything Ozy can bring(Batman survived being burned alive and falling off a several story building).

On the other hand, Ozy was never seen prepping against anyone more high tech than Nite Owl, who just had a laser gun. Batman has a gun that shoots those sticky bombs. Since he is better at stealth, Bats wins.

Did you watch The Watchmen? He out thought Dr. Manhattan and destroyed him temporarily. Considering Dr. Manhattan's level of intelligence and power, that speaks very well for Ozymandias' abilities and is well above anything Batman has done in either BB or TDK.

This is Movie Vs, so Batman can only bring what he showed in the films, including armor. That sticky-bomb-gun isn't going to help him much against a guy who can evade gunfire shot from a gunman standing 15 feet away.

By the same token, we never saw how the device that Adrian made actually interupted Jons precog, so it doesn't matter. He never explained the process of what he actually did to stop Dr Manhattan from knowing, and ultimately Jon could have stopped him from destroying New York if he really wanted to.

Batman has a grappling hook and can fly. He has the tumbler for this if he can bring standard equipment, which would hold up against anything seen in Watchmen. He has arguably similar fighting abilities.

isn't this spite????

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
By the same token, we never saw how the device that Adrian made actually interupted Jons precog, so it doesn't matter. He never explained the process of what he actually did to stop Dr Manhattan from knowing, and ultimately Jon could have stopped him from destroying New York if he really wanted to.

Batman has a grappling hook and can fly. He has the tumbler for this if he can bring standard equipment, which would hold up against anything seen in Watchmen. He has arguably similar fighting abilities.

It was explained? Ozy's machine sent out some manner of energy (forget what they named it) who's particles traveled backwards in time; that's the reason why it interrupted Manhattan's ability to see into the future. So he did out think him, if only momentarily.

The Tumbler isn't standard equipment, it's a vehicle. But he would need to it defeat Ozy in an H2H fight. Fighting prowess is probably on par, add Ozy's speed and strength level, Batman goes down, which is the point.

Edit: The OP says "anything goes"; that only helps Ozymandias here, as he's clearly smarter and wealthier, so he'd probably just use his financial influence to bankruplt Wayne.

Originally posted by Robtard
It was explained? Ozy's machine sent out some manner of energy (forget what they named it) who's particles traveled backwards in time; that's the reason why it interrupted Manhattan's ability to see into the future. So he did out think him, if only momentarily.

The Tumbler isn't standard equipment, it's a vehicle. But he would need to it defeat Ozy in an H2H fight. Fighting prowess is probably on par, add Ozy's speed and strength level, Batman goes down, which is the point.

Edit: The OP says "anything goes"; that only helps Ozymandias here, as he's clearly smarter and wealthier, so he'd probably just use his financial influence to bankruplt Wayne. That feat only counts against beings like Dr Manhattan, it means nothing here.

If it's anything goes, then Batman has a major advantage. Detective work is Batmans true strength, and he would figure out what Ozy was planning. If you recall, he figured out Ra's Al Ghuls plot in a matter of seconds in BB. Ozy has never shown this level of foresight because he never had someone who was intellectually similar to him to compete with.

Ozy only showed bullet timing against a bunch of people he was expecting to show up and had known previously. We know nothing about where he learned to fight, while we do know that Bruce got trained by the best assassins in the world.

Ozy caught a bullet. A f*cking bullet. Okay? Anything that Bats throws at Ozy will be caught.

Ozy demonstrated skills/speed/strength in "Watchmen" that would leave Batman a quivering puddle of black jell-o.

And Batman beat up a whole f**cking SWAT Team by himself.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
That feat only counts against beings like Dr Manhattan, it means nothing here.

If it's anything goes, then Batman has a major advantage. Detective work is Batmans true strength, and he would figure out what Ozy was planning. If you recall, he figured out Ra's Al Ghuls plot in a matter of seconds in BB. Ozy has never shown this level of foresight because he never had someone who was intellectually similar to him to compete with.

Ozy only showed bullet timing against a bunch of people he was expecting to show up and had known previously. We know nothing about where he learned to fight, while we do know that Bruce got trained by the best assassins in the world.

Why does out-smarting a god-like being not count here, yet outsmarting a human like Raj Al Ghul count? Considering intelligence, resourcefulness and outright craftiness can make or break this fight?

Again, Ozymandias out-smarting Dr. Manhattan and pulling off a stunt that tricked the entire world and all it's governments out-shadows anything Batman has done(by a lot too), including outwitting Raj Al Ghul.

I'm sorry, he knew the gunman would be coming, that doesn't counter he still ****ing avoided multiple rounds due to sheer speed and skill. Who cares if he was trained by a nun, we saw him fight, we saw his speed and we saw his strength.

What it comes down too, we have two very formidable guys. Ozy is smarter, faster and stronger than Batman, going off movie eats.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
And Batman beat up a whole f**cking SWAT Team by himself.

Rorschach did very well against a "****ing SWAT team", he also didn't have all the fancy gear Batman had, or someone helping him via radar and constant communications.

(Ozymandias would destroy Rorschach)

Judging by movie feats, Batman would hold his own against Ozy for about, maybe, the same amount of time that Rorschach held ground against the swarm of cops.

Then Ozy would kiss Bats goodnight.

Ozymandias was deliberately powered up to the level he is, in both the graphic novel and film, but at a superhuman level.

Batman is the pinnacle of human perfection, but at a more realistic level.

Movie feats would favor Ozy here.

Originally posted by Robtard
Why does out-smarting a god-like being not count here, yet outsmarting a human like Raj Al Ghul count? Considering intelligence, resourcefulness and outright craftiness can make or break this fight?

Again, Ozymandias out-smarting Dr. Manhattan and pulling off a stunt that tricked the entire world and all it's governments out-shadows anything Batman has done(by a lot too), including outwitting Raj Al Ghul.

I'm sorry, he knew the gunman would be coming, that doesn't counter he still ****ing avoided multiple rounds due to sheer speed and skill. Who cares if he was trained by a nun, we saw him fight, we saw his speed and we saw his strength.

What it comes down too, we have two very formidable guys. Ozy is smarter, faster and stronger than Batman, going off movie eats. Dr Manhattan is so removed from humanity that he doesn't see the need for plot or tact. He is a government stooge, a shill, a tool. And we can't forget that Jon COULD have stopped the explosion in NYC if he really wanted too. He is possible of being in several places at once.

Ozy if anything has it easier than Batman. He is both the richest man in the world and an ex vigilante with supurb fighting abilities. The fat cats in the government or other corporations would never touch him because of the service he did for their country. Batman has to deal with mobsters, The Joker, the Feds, the City Government, intenational terrorists and ninjas.

It doesn't matter how good Ozys skills are, Batman would know what he was planning against him and would counteract it. And Rorschach is only as good as the location he is in. His grapple gun would bounce off of Batmans armor.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Dr Manhattan is so removed from humanity that he doesn't see the need for plot or tact. He is a government stooge, a shill, a tool. And we can't forget that Jon COULD have stopped the explosion in NYC if he really wanted too. He is possible of being in several places at once. Wrong. Jon's perception of time was clouded by the tachyons that Veidt used.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Ozy if anything has it easier than Batman. He is both the richest man in the world and an ex vigilante with supurb fighting abilities. The fat cats in the government or other corporations would never touch him because of the service he did for their country. Batman has to deal with mobsters, The Joker, the Feds, the City Government, intenational terrorists and ninjas.

Doesn't matter. The GCPD acknowledges Batman for his service. Can we say "Bat-signal"? Apples and oranges, sir.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
It doesn't matter how good Ozys skills are, Batman would know what he was planning against him and would counteract it. And Rorschach is only as good as the location he is in. His grapple gun would bounce off of Batmans armor.

You're describing the strong points of BOTH people. Bats and Ozy are renowned for their planning skills. How do you think that Ozy bested Jon?

Originally posted by Impediment
Wrong. Jon's perception of time was clouded by the tachyons that Veidt used.

Jon is supposed to be a genius in his own right, why didn't he figure that someone was screwing with his perception? And Jon STILL could have crushed Adrian like an ant and stopped his plot, I'm sure you remember the termite monologue



Originally posted by Impediment
Doesn't matter. The GCPD acknowledges Batman for his service. Can we say "Bat-signal"? Apples and oranges, sir.

Only Jim Gordan and the few good cops on the force. You know how corrupt Gotham is, right?



Originally posted by Impediment
You're describing the strong points of BOTH people. Bats and Ozy are renowned for their planning skills. How do you think that Ozy bested Jon? Ozy was never shown to have great planning skills against people as smart as Batman.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch

It doesn't matter how good Ozys skills are, Batman would know what he was planning against him and would counteract it. And Rorschach is only as good as the location he is in. His grapple gun would bounce off of Batmans armor.

You're bias is laughable, you're saying Batman would just counter anything Ozymandias would/could potentially do, due to his abilities, yet ignore that Ozymandias did far (and by a lot) greater.

Ozymandias out-thought a god-like being (if only momentarily) and set a plot that fooled all the governments of the world, yet movie-feats Batman is someone going to best him?

In short, your argument is "Batman wins because he's the Batman."

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch

Ozy was never shown to have great planning skills against people as smart as Batman.

Just smarter, Dr. Manhattan and arguably Rorschach and Night Owl.

What are Batman on-screen intelligence feats?

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Jon is supposed to be a genius in his own right, why didn't he figure that someone was screwing with his perception? And Jon STILL could have crushed Adrian like an ant and stopped his plot, I'm sure you remember the termite monologue

Honestly, I dunno. Ask Alan Moore. The fact is, Ozy bested Jon, the most powerful man on Earth, creatively, by f*cking with Jon's noodle.





Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Only Jim Gordan and the few good cops on the force. You know how corrupt Gotham is, right?

While this is true, Batman has the respect and the fear of Gotham's resident's. He is both loved and feared. Only at the end of The Dark Knight was he labeled a "murderer" to mask the evil deeds of the Joker and save what hope was left for Gotham City.



Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Ozy was never shown to have great planning skills against people as smart as Batman.

You're kidding, right? Ozy planned to have himself almost assassinated, framed Rorschach, mess with Jon's mind, and, in a way, save Earth from killing itself.

All Batman did was install some sonar devices in Gotham's residents' cell phones. Hell, even the Joker's planning scheme was more elaborate than Batman's.

Originally posted by Robtard
You're bias is laughable, you're saying Batman would just counter anything Ozymandias would/could potentially do, due to his abilities, yet ignore that Ozymandias did far (and by a lot) greater.

Ozymandias out-thought a god-like being (if only momentarily) and set a plot that fooled all the governments of the world, yet movie-feats Batman is someone going to best him?

In short, your argument is "Batman wins because he's the Batman."


Originally posted by Robtard Just smarter, Dr. Manhattan and arguably Rorschach and Night Owl.

What are Batman on-screen intelligence feats?]

Figuring out Ra's Al Ghuls plot

Taking back his fathers company right out from under the ex president of Wayne Enterprises

General knowledge of where everyone is going to be at all times, perhaps best exemplified by the early TDK scene with the Scarecrow(Sans The Joker)

Impressive Detective work

Building that giant sonar machine within a few hours of the bomb threat at Gotham Hospital

Taking down a whole SWAT Team on the fly


Unfortunatly, Nolan didn't make Batman as smart as he should be in the movies. He's still capable of beating Ozymandias based on movie feats though.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Unfortunatly, Nolan didn't make Batman as smart as he should be in the movies. He's still capable of beating Ozymandias based on movie feats though.

Wrong. Nolan did a fine job of making Batman evenly powered and smart, just like from the comics.

However, we aren't judging by comic feats. remember: here we judge by MOVIE feats only.

How is Bats capable of besting Ozy? Nite Owl, in a way, is a generic rip-off of Batman, and had his ass handed to him by Ozy.

Originally posted by Impediment
Honestly, I dunno. Ask Alan Moore. The fact is, Ozy bested Jon, the most powerful man on Earth, creatively, by f*cking with Jon's noodle.

Ever hear the expression "Reed Richards is Useless"? They spoke too soon. Jon is smart only in a few areas, he's probably a savant.







While this is true, Batman has the respect and the fear of Gotham's resident's. He is both loved and feared. Only at the end of The Dark Knight was he labeled a "murderer" to mask the evil deeds of the Joker and save what hope was left for Gotham City..

And people respect and fear Ozymandias, on a much higher level. He gets it easy because people are too intimidated by him.





You're kidding, right? Ozy planned to have himself almost assassinated, framed Rorschach, mess with Jon's mind, and, in a way, save Earth from killing itself.

All Batman did was install some sonar devices in Gotham's residents' cell phones. Hell, even the Joker's planning scheme was more elaborate than Batman's. Aside from the tachyon machine he built, Ozy never did much of anything that Bruce couldn't have done, if not better. Remember, Bruce Wayne is one of the richest men on Earth and the consummate playboy and media darling. The fact that he convinced people that he's just a young billionaire douche and avoids the paparazzi is impressive just as much as what Adrian did, probably more so.

Originally posted by Impediment
Wrong. Nolan did a fine job of making Batman evenly powered and smart, just like from the comics.

However, we aren't judging by comic feats. remember: here we judge by MOVIE feats only.

How is Bats capable of besting Ozy? Nite Owl, in a way, is a generic rip-off of Batman, and had his ass handed to him by Ozy.

Batman would discover whatever grandious plot Adrian was plotting and neutralize it probably. Also, he would train harder and get the proper intel on how to beat Adrian in a direct confrontation.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Batman would discover whatever grandious plot Adrian was plotting and neutralize it probably. Also, he would train harder and get the proper intel on how to beat Adrian in a direct confrontation.

There you go again: hypothesizing.

We have to go buy what we saw on screen. Period.


Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Aside from the tachyon machine he built, Ozy never did much of anything that Bruce couldn't have done, if not better. Remember, Bruce Wayne is one of the richest men on Earth and the consummate playboy and media darling. The fact that he convinced people that he's just a young billionaire douche and avoids the paparazzi is impressive just as much as what Adrian did, probably more so.


Operative word, Hatch: couldn't have. Meaning, essentially, he didn't on screen, and is a moot point here in the MVF.

You're still clinging to Batman, in my opinion, from spite, dude.

Are you really arguing that Batman wins simply cuz he's Batman?

BTW, I'm not trying to sound like a dick.

Originally posted by Impediment
There you go again: hypothesizing.

We have to go buy what we saw on screen. Period.

Operative word, Hatch: couldn't have. Meaning, essentially, he didn't on screen, and is a moot point here in the MVF.

You're still clinging to Batman, in my opinion, from spite, dude.

Are you really arguing that Batman wins simply cuz he's Batman?

BTW, I'm not trying to sound like a dick. I'm saying that Batman has better feats.

Adrian being called the Smartest Man Alive is not a movie feat. He was easily defeated by Dr Manhattan when he showed up. His plan easily could have been foiled. Batman deals with people more on his level and mostly defeats them.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
I'm saying that Batman has better feats.

Adrian being called the Smartest Man Alive is not a movie feat. He was easily defeated by Dr Manhattan when he showed up. His plan easily could have been foiled. Batman deals with people more on his level and mostly defeats them.

Yet he actually doesn't, going by movie feats.

Correct, but he factually proved it, as he out-smarted a god-like being (if only temporarily) and he tricked the entire planet, that in out itself counters anything Batman has done in BB and TDK intelligence-wise.

Ozy also wasn't "defeated", his plan played out exactly as he had planned, he tricked the entire world and counted on Dr. Manhattan seeing his logic (of making Dr. H the villain) and going along with it. Trying to destroy him was a safety measure.

From a H2H standpoint, Ozy is faster and stronger.

So really, you have no valid argument.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
I'm saying that Batman has better feats.

Adrian being called the Smartest Man Alive is not a movie feat. He was easily defeated by Dr Manhattan when he showed up. His plan easily could have been foiled. Batman deals with people more on his level and mostly defeats them.

Manhattan defeating Veidt is laughable. Remember? The "Termite monologue".

Batman does NOT, in fact, deal with people on his own level, physically, strategically, and mentally. The Scarecrow? The Joker? Ra's? All defeated by Bats' brain power. And we also have to include the common thugs a la Joe Chill.

Also, I might remind you, from reading Rob's posts, Ozy picked up Blake like a rag doll and threw him out of a plate glass window.

Show me on scene from either Batman Begins or The Dark Knight where Batman displays such strength.

Originally posted by Impediment
Also, I might remind you, from reading Rob's posts, Ozy picked up Blake like a rag doll and threw him out of a plate glass window.

Show me on scene from either Batman Begins or The Dark Knight where Batman displays such strength.

All the WM crew showed greater strength than peak human. Even the skinny chic was strong enough to toss large men about and shatter arms/legs with just one hit.

Nite Owl, in a way, is a generic rip-off of Batman (rich, vigilante, mechanical, fear inducing, costumed, strong as hell/athletic), and had his ass handed to him by Ozy. Explain to me how Bats could hold his own. please.

Originally posted by Robtard
Yet he actually doesn't, going by movie feats.

Correct, but he factually proved it, as he out-smarted a god-like being (if only temporarily) and he tricked the entire planet, that in out itself counters anything Batman has done in BB and TDK intelligence-wise.

Ozy also wasn't "defeated", his plan played out exactly as he had planned, he tricked the entire world and counted on Dr. Manhattan seeing his logic (of making Dr. H the villain) and going along with it. Trying to destroy him was a safety measure.

From a H2H standpoint, Ozy is faster and stronger.

So really, you have no valid argument. If Jon was a god like being, he would of known someone was trying to **** with him. One of his main powers is seeing the future.

Originally posted by Impediment Manhattan defeating Veidt is laughable. Remember? The "Termite monologue".

Batman does NOT, in fact, deal with people on his own level, physically, strategically, and mentally. The Scarecrow? The Joker? Ra's? All defeated by Bats' brain power. And we also have to include the common thugs a la Joe Chill. Ra's Al Ghul and The Joker both have genius level intelligence and a lot of resources, and Scarecrow is in the same ball park. All three of them have a legitimate shot of fu*king up Ozymandias in a confrontation involving prep.

And do you think Batman would try to fight Ozy without profiling him first?

Originally posted by Robtard
All the WM crew showed greater strength than peak human. Even the skinny chic was strong enough to toss large men about and shatter arms/legs with just one hit.

My point, exactly. Even Silk Spectre II could, probably, go against Bats.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Ra's Al Ghul and The Joker both have genius level intelligence and a lot of resources, and Scarecrow is in the same ball park. All three of them have a legitimate shot of fu*king up Ozymandias in a confrontation involving prep.

And do you think Batman would try to fight Ozy without profiling him first?

1. Joker is just insane. Period. Good planner? Yes. Genius? Hell, no. Criminal genius? Maybe.

2. These bat-villains have no relevance in a fight with Ozy.

3. Ozy would, in fact, kill all 3 of these Bat-villains.

4. There is no prep-time in this Vs. Match, per the thread starter.

Where does it say no prep time?

In the opening post. The thread starter merely says "Anything goes". If the thread starter says "prep time" then it is allowed. If not, then prep time is considered void.

The thread starter say "Anything Goes". Doesn't that negate default thread requirements?

And btw, The Joker is a genius based on the gas grenade and untraceable poison he made, presumably. In additon to his BRILLIANT strategical skills and ability to organize. Ra's too, has about the same amount of influence as Ozy based on BB feats.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
The thread starter say "Anything Goes". Doesn't that negate default thread requirements?

And btw, The Joker is a genius based on the gas grenade and untraceable poison he made, presumably. In aditon to his BRILLIANT strategical skills and ability to organize. Ra's too, has about the same amount of influence as Ozy based on BB feats.

"Anything goes" usually means that there are no limitations to this fight scenario.


What gas grenade? What poison? There was NO mention in TDK of gas or poison.

The gas grenade that killed the bank manager and the poison in the bottle of the police comissioner. Presumably The Joker made them both, but that is irrelevent because I can't prove it.

The gas grenade is not proven. 'Twas just green smoke.

The "poison" was, in fact, corrosive acid that destroyed the previous commishioner's insides.

Originally posted by Davis Bloome
I'm seriously laughing at the fact that people think Ozy would even come close to dominating this fight. He's faster than Batman, yes, but he's neither more skilled, nor is he stronger.

...Wait, you're serious?

Dude, he threw a full grown man out of a bullet proof window. Not to mention is extreme versatility with weapons and almost superhuman reflexes.

You're right. Ozymandias doesn't dominate this fight. He rules it with an iron fist.

First of all, Nite-Owl is actually based off of the Blue Beetle. All the Watchmen characters in fact were based off of characters DC had acquired from Charlston Comics. Rorschach is based off the Question, Dr. Manhattan is based off of Captain Atom, cannot remember the others.

Second of all, Batman out-prepping Adrian is laughable. Adrian in the film was able to come up with an intricate plan that fooled Dr. Manhattan for most of the film, fooled the planet, and brought the world from the verge of nuclear war and united it in peace. Adrian SHITS on Batman in the intellect and prep department.

Now, H2H...Lol. Silk Spectre II could beat Batman. Adrian showed far greater speed and strength, able to at least match power with Eddie "Comedian" Blake, who at the age of 67 was shattering stone pillars with his punches and was punching directly through walls, he also threw Blake through a window easily. It should be mentioned Blake is a very large man. Also, he caught a bullet, as well as physically besting both Rorschach and Nite-Owl. Adrian is also at least as skilled.

Adrian stomps.

Ozymandias outsmarted Dr. Manhattan, so it's not a question who's smarter.

As for fighting ability, the man can catch bullets, he's certainly faster.

Batman would get sent to the Oblivion ward of the nearest medical facility.

-AC

IMO a person who could catch a flying dagger, outsmart Dr. Manhattan, and pick up a 250 pound guy tossing him out of a window, stomps batman.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Ozymandias outsmarted Dr. Manhattan, so it's not a question who's smarter.

As for fighting ability, the man can catch bullets, he's certainly faster.

Batman would get sent to the Oblivion ward of the nearest medical facility.

-AC

Thank you, AC.

My point, exactly.

"What's the use of all those push-ups if you can't even lift a bloody log?".

Alfred knows who'd win this fight.

Bye, Dr. Will Hatch.

-AC

Originally posted by NemeBro
First of all, Nite-Owl is actually based off of the Blue Beetle. All the Watchmen characters in fact were based off of characters DC had acquired from Charlston Comics. Rorschach is based off the Question, Dr. Manhattan is based off of Captain Atom, cannot remember the others.

Second of all, Batman out-prepping Adrian is laughable. Adrian in the film was able to come up with an intricate plan that fooled Dr. Manhattan for most of the film, fooled the planet, and brought the world from the verge of nuclear war and united it in peace. Adrian SHITS on Batman in the intellect and prep department.

Now, H2H...Lol. Silk Spectre II could beat Batman. Adrian showed far greater speed and strength, able to at least match power with Eddie "Comedian" Blake, who at the age of 67 was shattering stone pillars with his punches and was punching directly through walls, he also threw Blake through a window easily. It should be mentioned Blake is a very large man. Also, he caught a bullet, as well as physically besting both Rorschach and Nite-Owl. Adrian is also at least as skilled.

Adrian stomps. While I agree that the Watchmen are superior in H2H than Batman(Like I said when the movie came out: "No way are the Watchmen not metahumans", or something along those line), Batman would outprep Adrian.

Read my posts, fooling Dr Manhattan was easy because Jon is a savant. Fooling the worlds government was easy because he's the worlds richest man, an American hero, and that they presupposed governments were distracted by the Cold War. It was a cake walk. Adrian would have to find Batman first, and discover his identity. Good luck Ozymandias, you're not going to find him.

Meanwhile, Batman is capable of locating people and uncovering plots. He also has gadgets and can build them himself too. He won't beat Ozy H2H, and Ozy won't know how to beat Batman because he can't find him.

Advantage: Bruce Wayne.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
While I agree that the Watchmen are superior in H2H than Batman(Like I said when the movie came out: "No way are the Watchmen not metahumans", or something along those line), Batman would outprep Adrian.

Read my posts, fooling Dr Manhattan was easy because Jon is a savant. Fooling the worlds government was easy because he's the worlds richest man, an American hero, and that they presupposed governments were distracted by the Cold War. It was a cake walk. Adrian would have to find Batman first, and discover his identity. Good luck Ozymandias, you're not going to find him.

Meanwhile, Batman is capable of locating people and uncovering plots. He also has gadgets and can build them himself too. He won't beat Ozy H2H, and Ozy won't know how to beat Batman because he can't find him.

Advantage: Bruce Wayne.

Again: There is no prep here.

Where, and how, is Jon a savant?

This isn't a contest of detective skills. Who cares about secret identities?

We're talking..............about...............FIGHTS. Period.

The original poster said "Anything Goes". That means prep is included.

Jon is a savant because he was too thick to know what Ozymandias was up to. When I originally read the novel, I figured it out a quarter of the way through.

Negative.

"Anything goes" means any kind of fight tact goes.

PM Snafu and ask him if prep is involved.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
If Jon was a god like being, he would of known someone was trying to **** with him. One of his main powers is seeing the future.

Ra's Al Ghul and The Joker both have genius level intelligence and a lot of resources, and Scarecrow is in the same ball park. All three of them have a legitimate shot of fu*king up Ozymandias in a confrontation involving prep.

And do you think Batman would try to fight Ozy without profiling him first?

God-like doesn't mean "God", him being outsmarted despite his near omnipotence isn't a negative to Dr. Manhattan, it's a plus to Ozymandias' abilities.

And Dr. Manhattan would outsmart and destroy all of Batman's villains, all at the same time too. Another plus to Ozymandias gaining one over on Dr. Manhattan.

You keep bringing up this nonsense like it's one-sided. Would Ozymandias not profile Wayne in the same manner? He would and he would out-class him here too, as he's far smarter, so he'd out-prep Wayne.

You have no valid argument and every single point you've brought up has been obliterated by movie feats; you can't prove that Wayne has a single ability over Veidt, be it speed, strength, fighting prowess, wealth or intelligence. So just stop the nonsense.

Edit: I see you've now concede that Batman is not even on par with Ozy in H2H, so you've changed tactics to "he'd never find Batman." Which can easily be countered by the fact that Raj Al Ghul used his influence to uncover that Wayne was Batman, Raj has nothing on Veidt's abilities and resources. Hell, that weasely accountant discovered that Wayne was Batman.

Well, even if Batman doesn't get owned, he's still going to lose. Originally, I didn't take into account that Ozy lifted a 6'2, 240 lb man above his head and tossed him with ease. I'd say Batman would have better luck against someone like Nite Owl or against Rorscach, to which he'd likely win, but agaisnt Ozy he'd eventually lose.

Originally posted by Robtard
God-like doesn't mean "God", him being outsmarted despite his near omnipotence isn't a negative to Dr. Manhattan, it's a plus to Ozymandias' abilities.

And Dr. Manhattan would outsmart and destroy all of Batman's villains, all at the same time too. Another plus to Ozymandias gaining one over on Dr. Manhattan.

You keep bringing up this nonsense like it's one-sided. Would Ozymandias not profile Wayne in the same manner? He would and he would out-class him here too, as he's far smarter, so he'd out-prep Wayne.

You have no valid argument and every single point you've brought up has been obliterated by movie feats; you can't prove that Wayne has a single ability over Veidt, be it speed, strength, fighting prowess, wealth or intelligence. So just stop the nonsense.

Edit: I see you've now concede that Batman is not even on par with Ozy in H2H, so you've changed tactics to "he'd never find Batman." Which can easily be countered by the fact that Raj Al Ghul used his influence to uncover that Wayne was Batman, Raj has nothing on Veidt's abilities and resources. Hell, that weasely accountant discovered that Wayne was Batman. Yes it is a negative. The reason Batman and Dr Doom(Among others, these just being my two favorite examples) outsmart god like beings and even the gods themselves in comics is because they are literally smarter than the gods or god like beings. Dr Manhattan never showed a brilliant thought or action in anything he ever did. He was a powerful joke. He's the stereotype of Superman as an overpowered idiot personified. Sure, he is good at specific fields, but he is incredibly naive. I'm being hard on Jon here, but I'm doing so to prove that it wasn't difficult for Adrian to trick him.

That's not the fight proposed, and I agree with you. Dr Manhattan potentially could beat anyone not intangible.

Movie feats. Wayne has shown consider skills in areas Adrian never did. He has shown to be prepared in every fight he goes into. He has been shown to have a mind near to or equaling Ozymandias(In my opinion surpassing Ozymandia).

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Yes it is a negative. The reason Batman and Dr Doom(Among others, these just being my two favorite examples) outsmart god like beings and even the gods themselves in comics is because they are literally smarter than the gods or god like beings. Dr Manhattan never showed a brilliant thought or action in anything he ever did. He was a powerful joke. He's the stereotype of Superman as an overpowered idiot personified. Sure, he is good at specific fields, but he is incredibly naive. I'm being hard on Jon here, but I'm doing so to prove that it wasn't difficult for Adrian to trick him.

That's not the fight proposed, and I agree with you. Dr Manhattan potentially could beat anyone not intangible.

Movie feats. Wayne has shown consider skills in areas Adrian never did. He has shown to be prepared in every fight he goes into. He has been shown to have a mind near to or equaling Ozymandias(In my opinion surpassing Ozymandia).

No, you're foolishly dismissing Dr. Manhattan's abilities in some pathetic attempt to make your argument more valid. It's failing miserably and you're looking more and more petty.

Dr. Manhattan could out-think and outright destroy anyone Batman has faced in BB and TDK, which is the point as it pertains to Ozy being superior to Batman.

Again, you're not applying that same logic to Ozymandias, you're being biased. Batman still gets outwitted, one example was him being hit by the Scarecrow poison. Veidt was never outwitted, he planned a world-wise ruse, which included outsmarting a super-being able to see the future and his plan went exactly as planned.

What has Bale-Batman done in the intelligence section that makes him smarter than Veidt?

Originally posted by Robtard
No, you're foolishly dismissing Dr. Manhattan's abilities in some pathetic attempt to make your argument more valid. It's failing miserably and you're looking more and more petty.

Dr. Manhattan could out-think and outright destroy anyone Batman has faced in BB and TDK, which is the point as it pertains to Ozy being superior to Batman.

Again, you're not applying that same logic to Ozymandias, you're being biased. Batman still gets outwitted, one example was him being hit by the Scarecrow poison. Veidt was never outwitted, he planned a world-wise ruse, which included outsmarting a super-being able to see the future and his plan went exactly as planned.

What has Bale-Batman done in the intelligence section that makes him smarter than Veidt? Not if he didn't see a reason to. He was all ready to stop Adrians plan and let WWIII begin. He doesn't care. Humans mean nothing to him, and the petty actions of Batman and the Scarecrow would be equivelent to us caring what happens to microbes on Ganymede.

You're assuming that the Watchmen characters tried to stop Adrian. They didn't even TRY to know what Adrian was up to. No one. You are assuming that the Watchmen characters are as intelligent as Batman, and you're wrong on all accounts including movie feats.

I already list some of his feats. I wish he had more, because he should. It is more than adequate, however.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Not if he didn't see a reason to. He was all ready to stop Adrians plan and let WWIII begin. He doesn't care. Humans mean nothing to him, and the petty actions of Batman and the Scarecrow would be equivelent to us caring what happens to microbes on Ganymede.

You're assuming that the Watchmen characters tried to stop Adrian. They didn't even TRY to know what Adrian was up to. No one. You are assuming that the Watchmen characters are as intelligent as Batman, and you're wrong on all accounts including movie feats.

I already list some of his feats. I wish he had more, because he should. It is more than adequate, however.

He didn't care after a certain point, Veidt still out-smarted him. You can dance around this all you like, but the movie proves you wrong.

They did, but his plan was concocted perfectly, as it fooled them until the end. Even after they figured a part of it out, Night Owl, Rorschach and Silk Specter couldn't defeat him. He even temporarily took Manhattan out of the picture to buy himself time.

What you listed did not counter anything, Batman defeated Raj Al Ghul and the Joker doesn't surpass Veidt and his world-wide plan.

So you have nothing, or else you'd have a logical point to make. Just stop the nonsense.

Even manhattan called Ozy the smartest man in the world. He stated that he did infact outsmart him, but his "omnipotence" negated it.

Originally posted by Robtard
He didn't care after a certain point, Veidt still out-smarted him. You can dance around this all you like, but the movie proves you wrong.

They did, but his plan was concocted perfectly, as it fooled them until the end. Even after they figured a part of it out, Night Owl, Rorschach and Silk Specter couldn't defeat him. He even temporarily took Manhattan out of the picture to buy himself time.

What you listed did not counter anything, Batman defeated Raj Al Ghul and the Joker doesn't surpass Veidt and his world-wide plan.

So you have nothing, or else you'd have a logical point to make. Just stop the nonsense. You're evading my point. Dr Manhattan could have stopped Adrian, but he chose not to. He could have stopped him from investigating his plan and stopping him. The whole argument of Adrians actual feat rests on this. If Adrian was smarter, he would have found a way to steal Jons powers. Adrian has no other feats but being a superior fighter than Batman. Batman would negate this with prep.

There is no prep here, get that through your thick head.

So a mod tells you there is no prep here and you contine to ignore it?

Fail....


Ozy stomps.

We'll see once the OP answers you scumbag.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
You're evading my point. Dr Manhattan could have stopped Adrian, but he chose not to. He could have stopped him from investigating his plan and stopping him. The whole argument of Adrians actual feat rests on this. If Adrian was smarter, he would have found a way to steal Jons powers. Adrian has no other feats but being a superior fighter than Batman. Batman would negate this with prep.

You have no point for me to evade. Manhattan could have stopped him after he realized what Veidt was doing, doesn't counter that Veidt had already duped him, with giving people cancer Manhattan had been around to making that device that countered his future-sight ability.

You're stupidly assuming again, who knows if stealing Manhattan's powers is even possible to begin with.

Just stop, Veidt is clearly the smarter of the two and being so, would out-prep Batman. He orchestrated a world-wide ruse that brought about world peace, Wayne has nothing on this; you now this, as you still have yet to post a feat of Batman's that counters it and just continue ranting like a moron. Your whole argument consist of making bogus negative claims about Veidt and Manhattan, it's sad.

Either hes trolling or just very bias.

Probably a combo of both.

Originally posted by Robtard
You have no point for me to evade. Manhattan could have stopped him after he realized what Veidt was doing, doesn't counter that Veidt had already duped him, with giving people cancer Manhattan had been around to making that device that countered his future-sight ability.

You're stupidly assuming again, who knows if stealing Manhattan's powers is even possible to begin with.

Just stop, Veidt is clearly the smarter of the two and being so, would out-prep Batman. He orchestrated a world-wide ruse that brought about world peace, Wayne has nothing on this; you now this, as you still have yet to post a feat of Batman's that counters it and just continue ranting like a moron. Your whole argument consist of making bogus negative claims about Veidt and Manhattan, it's sad. So you're saying that it's a feat for Adrian when no one was making any effort to stop him? Jon was dense enough not to investigate his own powers for the 26 or so years since he had his powers. Wouldn't you investigate yourself father if you were capable of what he was, now that it is all at your will? He was a savant.

It was just an example to point out what a legitimate feat would be for the Watchmen characters. It is dubious that Adrian did much of anything.

He is the smarter of the two because he is said to be by the author through the characters. That's not a movie feat, and not compatible with the rules of the forum. I am not making bogus claims as I said Batman would lose H2H. I admit that he would lose without prep. He, however, has shown what he can do with prep against people activly trying to "beat" him.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
So you're saying that it's a feat for Adrian when no one was making any effort to stop him? Jon was dense enough not to investigate his own powers for the 26 or so years since he had his powers. Wouldn't you investigate yourself father if you were capable of what he was, now that it is all at your will? He was a savant.

It was just an example to point out what a legitimate feat would be for the Watchmen characters. It is dubious that Adrian did much of anything.

He is the smarter of the two because he is said to be by the author through the characters. That's not a movie feat, and not compatible with the rules of the forum. I am not making bogus claims as I said Batman would lose H2H. I admit that he would lose without prep. He, however, has shown what he can do with prep against people activly trying to "beat" him. How the hell would he prepare for an asskicking? Tie a pillow around his waist? I mean what can he honestly do. He can't shoot him because hell dodge it. He can't outfight him by your own ommision. What exactly is he supposed to be able to do with prep?

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
So you're saying that it's a feat for Adrian when no one was making any effort to stop him? Jon was dense enough not to investigate his own powers for the 26 or so years since he had his powers. Wouldn't you investigate yourself father if you were capable of what he was, now that it is all at your will? He was a savant.

It was just an example to point out what a legitimate feat would be for the Watchmen characters. It is dubious that Adrian did much of anything.

He is the smarter of the two because he is said to be by the author through the characters. That's not a movie feat, and not compatible with the rules of the forum. I am not making bogus claims as I said Batman would lose H2H. I admit that he would lose without prep. He, however, has shown what he can do with prep against people activly trying to "beat" him.

Manhattan believed his inability to see the future meant a nuclear holocaust had/will happen in the future(as the world was on the brink of war), which is what Veidt wanted him to believe; it worked, flawlessly.What proof do you have the Manhattan is "dense" or even a "savant"? None.

You didn't pay attention to the movie, did you, or you are just trolling? If Veidt didn't "do much of anything", there wouldn't have been a story.

You are making b.s. claims. Veidt with prep fooled the entire planet and a super-being, Batman beat Raj Al Ghul, the Scarecrow and the Joker, he also had Fox helping him many a time.

Again, your argument is laughable, just stop.

Originally posted by omgchos
How the hell would he prepare for an asskicking? Tie a pillow around his waist? I mean what can he honestly do. He can't shoot him because hell dodge it. He can't outfight him by your own ommision. What exactly is he supposed to be able to do with prep?

There's nothing he can do to prepare for a fight with Ozy. At most he can train harder than he normally does, but he's not likely to get strong enough or better to the point where he can last incredibly long against Ozy. Ozy is just going to kick his ass, plain & simple. Even with a year of training prep I don't see it doing Batman any good.

Originally posted by omgchos
How the hell would he prepare for an asskicking? Tie a pillow around his waist? I mean what can he honestly do. He can't shoot him because hell dodge it. He can't outfight him by your own ommision. What exactly is he supposed to be able to do with prep? Batman would investigate Veidt, choose the arena and set up an operation because of Batmans superior stealth. Ozymandias is a publically known individual, so this will be even easier. If prep is allowed, it depends on how much prep. It wouldn't really matter though because Batman has shown to figure out labyrinthian schemes within seconds of hearing them. If the OP says there is no prep allowed, I will willingly concede that Veidt wins.

"Batman has shown to figure out labyrinthian schemes within seconds of hearing them."

What movie feat(s) do you ascribe this to?

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Batman would investigate Veidt, choose the arena and set up an operation because of Batmans superior stealth. Ozymandias is a publically known individual, so this will be even easier. If prep is allowed, it depends on how much prep. It wouldn't really matter though because Batman has shown to figure out labyrinthian schemes within seconds of hearing them. If the OP says there is no prep allowed, I will willingly concede that Veidt wins.
Ok we ARE talking about movie batman right. He may have been smarter than the average person, but Ozy is said by mister manhattan to be the smartest person in the world. And you have not answered my question. Exactly what arena would allow him to beat the fastest strongest smartest man in the world.

Originally posted by Robtard
Manhattan believed his inability to see the future meant a nuclear holocaust had/will happen in the future(as the world was on the brink of war), which is what Veidt wanted him to believe; it worked, flawlessly.What proof do you have the Manhattan is "dense" or even a "savant"? None.

You didn't pay attention to the movie, did you, or you are just trolling? If Veidt didn't "do much of anything", there wouldn't have been a story.

You are making b.s. claims. Veidt with prep fooled the entire planet and a super-being, Batman beat Raj Al Ghul, the Scarecrow and the Joker, he also had Fox helping him many a time.

Again, your argument is laughable, just stop. So that means Jon wasn't aware of his powers. He had 26 years to study on his new powers, and he sat on his "ass" being a government shill. Not to mention that his removal from humanity was partly a put on.

In the context of this fight, Batman has done more.

Rorschach figured out what was going on before he left for Antarctica. Batman is at least as skilled a detective, you can see this in both BB and TDK. Unlike Rorschach, Batman has better tools.

Originally posted by omgchos
Ok we ARE talking about movie batman right. He may have been smarter than the average person, but Ozy is said by mister manhattan to be the smartest person in the world. And you have not answered my question. Exactly what arena would allow him to beat the fastest strongest smartest man in the world. A place that would allow Batman time to set up sticky bombs to explode at pre determined moments and coerce Vedit into stepping into these trajectories. Veidt did the same thing, but he didn't do it with someone who is close to an intellectual peer like Batman.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
So that means Jon wasn't aware of his powers. He had 26 years to study on his new powers, and he sat on his "ass" being a government shill. Not to mention that his removal from humanity was partly a put on.

In the context of this fight, Batman has done more.

Rorschach figured out what was going on before he left for Antarctica. Batman is at least as skilled a detective, you can see this in both BB and TDK. Unlike Rorschach, Batman has better tools.

Non sequitur response, very telling. Which part of 'Manhattan was fooled into believing his inability to see the future meant Armageddon had happened' means he's unaware of his powers?

Yet you can't logically counter anything Veidt has done with Batman's feats. Just stick to B.S. claims of 'Batman is smarter because he's Batman.'

Rorschah figured it out after it was already too late. Being too late in this fight means Batman gets defeated. Of note, Rorschach not having Wayne's resources, yet still being a bad-ass detective tells us he's better than Wayne at detective work.

So you are saying that the man who can teleport to specific locations, build a complex machine with his mind, involving hundreds of small parts, turn a bunch of stuff from mars into a complex design of floating crytals that spun in sequence, and can be in multiple places at once is someone not worth outsmarting. Just because he was detatched from humanity doesn't change the fact that he was technically a genius.

Originally posted by omgchos
So you are saying that the man who can teleport to specific locations, build a complex machine with his mind, involving hundreds of small parts, turn a bunch of stuff from mars into a complex design of floating crytals that spun in sequence, and can be in multiple places at once is someone not worth outsmarting. Just because he was detatched from humanity doesn't change the fact that he was technically a genius.

He also left this galaxy to go and "create life", clearly he's no mental match for Wayne, who relys heavily on Fox for his inventions.

Yeah god forbid a man who can punch through concrete with his bare hands runs into a man who has trouble with dogs and skinny, pipe wielding, men in make up.

Originally posted by Robtard
Non sequitur response, very telling. Which part of 'Manhattan was fooled into believing his inability to see the future meant Armageddon had happened' means he's unaware of his powers?

Yet you can't logically counter anything Veidt has done with Batman's feats.

Rorschah figured it out after it was already too late. Being too late in this fight means Batman gets defeated. Of note, Rorschach not having Wayne's resources, yet still being a bad-ass detective tells us he's better than Wayne at detective work. Everything, it's illogical! How does nuclear holocaust on Earth affect him in any way? Jon wasn't an idiot, but he was slow on the uptake. I'll refer you back to the "Reed Richards Is Useless" trope. I don't like the name myself, but it fits here. Dr Manhattan is omnipotent, but did nothing for 26 years and let himself get beat by a guy with pedophilia on his hard drive.

I am going by the rules of this forum. If there was a fight thread here called "Robocop vs The Butterball cenobite", you can't just say the cenobite wins when he didn't do anything in the movie.

Rorschach not being adequately prepared isn't a plus on his resume.

Originally posted by omgchos
So you are saying that the man who can teleport to specific locations, build a complex machine with his mind, involving hundreds of small parts, turn a bunch of stuff from mars into a complex design of floating crytals that spun in sequence, and can be in multiple places at once is someone not worth outsmarting. Just because he was detatched from humanity doesn't change the fact that he was technically a genius. Maybe he's autistic.

Autistic people can't focus on something unfamiliar. They use numbers to describe things, and the like. Mr manhattan just lets his god-like mind wander.

An omnipotent being not fully aware of his powers does not deserve to have them,

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Everything, it's illogical! How does nuclear holocaust on Earth affect him in any way? Jon wasn't an idiot, but he was slow on the uptake. I'll refer you back to the "Reed Richards Is Useless" trope. I don't like the name myself, but it fits here. Dr Manhattan is omnipotent, but did nothing for 26 years and let himself get beat by a guy with pedophilia on his hard drive.

I am going by the rules of this forum. If there was a fight thread here called "Robocop vs The Butterball cenobite", you can't just say the cenobite wins when he didn't do anything in the movie.

Rorschach not being adequately prepared isn't a plus on his resume.

That was a conclusion he came too, as he wasn't sure what was blocking his ability, just that it was blocked. This shows how ingenious Veidt was. See, you're ranting nonsense again, Manhattan was developing a machine to give free energy to the entire planet, so clearly he was doing something with his time.

No, you're making claims you can't back up (see your "labyrinth" claim as one of many examples) and making false claims about Veidt and Manhattan is some sad attempt to prove your senseless points correct.

Hahahahaa, there you go again, every time a point of your is obliterated(and they all have been), you try and dance it into something else. You claimed Batman is a better detective than Rorschach; when going by movie feats, he isn't.

You're either trolling for fun or your bias is so heavy it's causing you to consistently act like a complete imbecile. Either way, it's getting old.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
An omnipotent being not fully aware of his powers does not deserve to have them,
Hows that?

Originally posted by Robtard
That was a conclusion he came too, as he wasn't sure what was blocking his ability, just that it was blocked. This shows how ingenious Veidt was. See, you're ranting nonsense again, Manhattan was developing a machine to give free energy to the entire planet, so clearly he was doing something with his time.

No, you're making claims you can't back up (see your "labyrinth" claim as one of many examples) and making false claims about Veidt and Manhattan is some sad attempt to prove your senseless points correct.

Hahahahaa, there you go again, every time a point of your is obliterated(and they all have been), you try and dance it into something else. You claimed Batman is a better detective than Rorschach; when going by movie feats, he isn't.

You're either trolling for fun or your bias is so heavy it's causing you to consistently act like a complete imbecile. Either way, it's getting old. Jon was making an emotional decision to ignore facts. He knew nothing about himself. The fact that he remained on US Government property being their stooge is proof of this. He's a big, powerful idiot savant.

I never once made a false claim against Veidt. Theoretically he could beat Batman, but not based on any feats shown.

Having equipment doesn't make you a lesser detective. Bruce discovered Ra's Al Ghuls plot in seconds after hearing it by the way.

Originally posted by omgchos
Hows that? Because it negates his omnipotence. Omnipotence and omniscience go hand in hand.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Maybe he's autistic. facepalm

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Jon was making an emotional decision to ignore facts. He knew nothing about himself. The fact that he remained on US Government property being their stooge is proof of this. He's a big, powerful idiot savant.

I never once made a false claim against Veidt. Theoretically he could beat Batman, but not based on any feats shown.

Having equipment doesn't make you a lesser detective. Bruce discovered Ra's Al Ghuls plot in seconds after hearing it by the way.
Cuz he told him the whole damn thing. He didn't even see the attack on his house coming. Whereas Ozy acticated the bomb the second Rorschach and Night Owl Landed to preempt any possibility of them beating him. Even though he knew he could outfight them both.

Originally posted by omgchos
So you are saying that the man who can teleport to specific locations, build a complex machine with his mind, involving hundreds of small parts, turn a bunch of stuff from mars into a complex design of floating crytals that spun in sequence, and can be in multiple places at once is someone not worth outsmarting. Just because he was detatched from humanity doesn't change the fact that he was technically a genius.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Maybe he's autistic.

the perfect counter argument. crylaugh

Do I need to bring out the clip Omg?

No clip could prove you right.

Originally posted by omgchos
No clip could prove you right. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6E9k7qP_aU

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Jon was making an emotional decision to ignore facts. He knew nothing about himself. The fact that he remained on US Government property being their stooge is proof of this. He's a big, powerful idiot savant.

I never once made a false claim against Veidt. Theoretically he could beat Batman, but not based on any feats shown.

Having equipment doesn't make you a lesser detective. Bruce discovered Ra's Al Ghuls plot in seconds after hearing it by the way.

Lol, dude. I just told you why he was on the compound, he was developing that free energy source for the world. Nice try though.

Yeah, you did. You claimed " didn't do much of anything" for one. You also said Batman would have the time to investigate Veidt and just assumed Veidt would be sitting on his ass.

But having lesser equipment and resources yet still being able to perform on a comparable level does. WTF? He discovered it after he heard it? That doesn't sound like much detective work going on In reality, Fox helped him, remember when Fox told Wayne about the vaporizer device and how it could/would affect the water pipelines under Gotham.

Ok so he knew kane was working for Rhaz, he knew Rhaz wanted to destroy the city, not much deductive reasoning ther my friend.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6E9k7qP_aU

Did you ****ing watch that clip? Ra's basically tells Wayne what he's doing. Not much master detective work there, chief.

You're clearly attributing comic Batman abilities and using it as the basis for your argument here. Poor form.

Originally posted by Robtard
Lol, dude. I just told you why he was on the compound, he was developing that free energy source for the world. Nice try though.

Yeah, you did. You claimed " didn't do much of anything" for one. You also said Batman would have the time to investigate Veidt and just assumed Veidt would be sitting on his ass.

But having lesser equipment and resources yet still being able to perform on a comparable level does. WTF? He discovered it after he heard it? That doesn't sound like much detective work going on In reality, Fox helped him, remember when Fox told Wayne about the vaporizer device and how it could/would affect the water pipelines under Gotham. So Dr Manhattan can't see all realities, then. He is not omnipotent. Fine, just fine. He is still very powerful. Can't figure out Veidts plot, kind of useless to the plot of the movie and book.

No, I was joking about Adrian sitting on his ass, but he didn't fool anyone relevent. It's like if you were to you're about to shoot someone where you live. I would have no way to get there unless we just happen to live next to eachother, and even then it's doubtful. In the same way, no one relevent could have stopped Ozymandias.

Rorschach never stopped a Joker or Ra's level villain, and Bruce WAS aware of what was going on if you had payed attention.

Except for ozymandias, who fooled the world. And yes he did stop his plan, para the journal that leeked to the press.

Originally posted by Robtard
Did you ****ing watch that clip? Ra's basically tells Wayne what he's doing. Not much master detective work there, chief.

You're clearly attributing comic Batman abilities and using it as the basis for your argument here. Poor form. No he didn't, he only told him about the flowers used to make the fear toxin. Irrelevent because Fox already gave Wayne the antidote. Wayne figured out where and when everyone was going to be, and where Ra's would be situated during the evaporation of the water supply.

I wish I could.

Originally posted by omgchos
Except for ozymandias, who fooled the world. And yes he did stop his plan, para the journal that leeked to the press. No one was interested or was intimidated by Veidt.

That wasn't even a response to my statement. If someone had caught on to a plot to blow up millions you bet your ass they would have cared.

Originally posted by omgchos
That wasn't even a response to my statement. If someone had caught on to a plot to blow up millions you bet your ass they would have cared.

He's just dancing and playing games.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiggs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Wait wrong thread.

I love how I was ignored.

-AC

Did the people rooting for Batman here actually see Watchmen? If so they would seen the following:

-Ozymandias' opening fight scene with Comedian.
-Ozymandias is actually bullet-time, he was actually dodging bullets.
-Ozymandias catching a bullet.
-Ozymandias' pwning of both Rorschach and Nite Owl, who are arguably each better than Batman, at the same time.
-Ozymandias is w/o question smarter than Batman.

Spite thread IMO.

no batman has strengthspeedsmarttrainingmaskcapebats!

No, Batman has absolutely shit in this fight.

He may have the "stealth" to his advantage, but i doubt once he snuck out from the shadows and came in for a punch/kick that it would be fast enough to catch Ozymandias by srprise.

Originally posted by omgchos
He may have the "stealth" to his advantage, but i doubt once he snuck out from the shadows and came in for a punch/kick that it would be fast enough to catch Ozymandias by srprise. Rorschac and Nit Owl had the same advantage and he took them both out at the same time w/o breaking a sweat.

My point exactly.

Originally posted by Darth Martin
Rorschac and Nit Owl had the same advantage and he took them both out at the same time w/o breaking a sweat.

They actually didn't, he was on to them before they closed in, despite them being as silent as the deadliest of farts. Ozy is just that good.

Didn't he have the tv circuits.

Atleast he didn't know when they would exactly attack. It's been awhile.

Originally posted by Darth Martin
Didn't he have the tv circuits.

Atleast he didn't know when they would exactly attack. It's been awhile.

He was watching the telly; I could swear as they approached he made a ever so slight movement with the eyes indicating that he knew they were there. I could be wrong, as I only watched the film once back when it first came out.

Either way, he's clearly fast enough to dodge or counter one of their attacks even if he realizes it's coming midpoint through the attack. So Batman isn't likely to succeed in killing or KO'ing him from a first sneak attack, if he somehow manages to sneak uo on him.

Nah, Batman's dead for sure.

No!

Originally posted by Darth Martin
No, Batman has absolutely shit in this fight. No, Batman has bats. Ozymandias has no bats.

Ergo, Batman wins. You can't prove me wrong!

Ozymandias has a genetically customized tiger.

Genetically customized tigers defeat bats.

Ergo, Ozymandias wins. You can't prove me wrong.

Ozymandias genetically customized tiger has no on-screen feats except getting disintegrated. The bats pwned GCPD and SWAT teams at the same time, busted through a whole building, and once scared the goddamn Batman.

Ergo, the bats > lameass bluelynx"tiger". And since my punctuation is moar emphatic than yours, I win!

Any attempts to one-up my emphaticness by increasing font size, using bold or variably colored characters, or larger amounts of punctuation are anticipated and mocked.

Tony Montana had a tiger too.

Ozymandias would so destroy movies Batman...

The only Batman that stand a chance is Adam West's and only if he pulls out a "anti-villain bat bomb" or something like that.

Originally posted by Eminence
Ozymandias genetically customized tiger has no on-screen feats except getting disintegrated. The bats pwned GCPD and SWAT teams at the same time, busted through a whole building, and once scared the goddamn Batman.

Ergo, the bats > lameass bluelynx"tiger". And since my punctuation is moar emphatic than yours, I win!

Any attempts to one-up my emphaticness by increasing font size, using bold or variably colored characters, or larger amounts of punctuation are anticipated and mocked.

No, on all accounts.

The bats didn't so much pwn, as they annoyed.

Originally posted by Eminence
Ozymandias genetically customized tiger has no on-screen feats except getting disintegrated. The bats pwned GCPD and SWAT teams at the same time, busted through a whole building, and once scared the goddamn Batman.

Ergo, the bats > lameass bluelynx"tiger". And since my punctuation is moar emphatic than yours, I win!

Any attempts to one-up my emphaticness by increasing font size, using bold or variably colored characters, or larger amounts of punctuation are anticipated and mocked.
Joker's dogs>Batman>SWAT team>LYNX?

Someone should make a GAMMA Poodle from the Hulk movie vs. Batman thread.



Adrian still stomps.

Originally posted by Prime#
bats>building>elevator shaft>Joker's dogs>Batman>SWAT team>LYNX? Fixed.

Originally posted by Darth Martin
Rorschac and Nit Owl had the same advantage and he took them both out at the same time w/o breaking a sweat. No he didn't. Ozy knew they were coming from the moniters. You don't think Bats would be aware of this and prep against it?

Originally posted by Prime#
Joker's dogs>Batman>SWAT team>LYNX?

Wrong, Sir.

Those Rotts did not defeat Batman, the first one that charged, he back-handed and it went flying, the other two brought him down momentarily and then the Joker jumped in with his bit of pipe. He kicked Joker, and then tossed the dogs.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
No he didn't. Ozy knew they were coming from the moniters. You don't think Bats would be aware of this and prep against it?

Adrian was watching the telly, the news to be exact. He knew at the last moment they were coming, if anything.

What's Batman going to prep? Get extra-extra-extra quiet Bat-boots? Please, he's getting his ass kicked, no way around it.

Spite. Batman doesn't have a bat's chance in hell in this fight. Adrian displayed a level of speed and agility that Bruce would never be able to match. H2H Batman is dead.

B-But... the bats...!

Originally posted by Robtard
Adrian was watching the telly, the news to be exact. He knew at the last moment they were coming, if anything.

What's Batman going to prep? Get extra-extra-extra quiet Bat-boots? Please, he's getting his ass kicked, no way around it.
Puhleze, Batman wouldn't let Ozy choose the fighting location anyway. Until the OP rings in on how much preptime is involved, Bats still has a fighting chance.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Puhleze, Batman wouldn't let Ozy choose the fighting location anyway. Until the OP rings in on how much preptime is involved, Bats still has a fighting chance.

And you're still being ridiculous by arguing that only Batman gets prep here, if prep is allowed, then they both get it, you clownish bastard.

Originally posted by Robtard
And you're still being ridiculous by arguing that only Batman gets prep here, if prep is allowed, then they both get it, you clownish bastard. And you're still using circular logic by saying the Ozymandias wins because he was the best in his continuity. Building a machine that could only affect Dr Manhattan is irrelevent in this fight.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
And you're still using circular logic by saying the Ozymandias wins because he was the best in his continuity. Building a machine that could only affect Dr Manhattan is irrelevent in this fight.

Now you're just ignorantly ranting again.

He set a plan to fool the entire planet and all its governments and he pulled it off flawlessly, ie he fooled/tricked everyone. He's clearly the more intelligent and has Batman beat (by a lot) in the "prep" department, the man can literally cover all angles and consider all factors. So in short, allowing prep in this fight only helps Ozymandias.

Hatch does this on every other thread I've seen him post in. Just ignore him.

Originally posted by Robtard
Now you're just ignorantly ranting again.

He set a plan to fool the entire planet and all its governments and he pulled it off flawlessly, ie he fooled/tricked everyone. He's clearly the more intelligent and has Batman beat (by a lot) in the "prep" department, the man can literally cover all angles and consider all factors. So in short, allowing prep in this fight only helps Ozymandias. See, you just proved my point. It's impossible to know how Bale Batman would do in Watchmens universe with the same resources, but what we do know is that he has better prep feats than anyone in Watchmens universe going up against Ozymandias. Therefore the claim "Ozymandias fooled the entire world" is a non feat.

You have yet to prove Batman has "better prep feats".

Ha, let me guess, Batman outsmarting his opponents is a feat, but Ozymandias outsmarting his, which includes a god-like being and everyone on the planet somehow doesn't count?

Dude, I've obliterated every single failed point you've tried to B.S. in here for pages now, just give it up, your argument boils down to "Batman wins because he's Batman." Just STFU with that.

Yes, because Batmans opponents were activly working against him while no one was aware of Ozys plan until it was too late or didn't have the power to stop him if they tried. Batman has shown that he can take down lots of people at once, and the cop out argument against Batman concenrning the dogs is BS. He knocked one out with one slap of his arms. He has also shown to be a better detective than anyone in Watchmen.

Wrong, Batman was actively working against his opponents, not the other way around. Only one time was it reversed, when Ras went purposely to Bruce's house, because he figured out who Batman was behind the mask.

Ozymandias had Rorschach, Night Owl and Spectre actively trying to figure out what in the hell was going on, why Comedian was killed etc.

Ozymandias can take down two people at once who are capable of taking out multiple opponents themselves. You also previously said that Batman is no match in H2H to Ozymandias, now you're flipping again? Make up your mind.

See, your argument is just ill informed nonsense yet again and all you have is "Batman wins because he's Batman."

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
He has also shown to be a better detective than anyone in Watchmen. Seeing how Rorschach is the only detective in Watchmen that's not a very impressive feat. In Rorschach's defense he works with what limited resources he has. He's got nowhere near as many toys as Ozymandias, Nite Owl, or even Batman.

I have no idea how this argument has gotten to 8 pages with ridiculous claims such as Batman being the pinnacle of human fighting ability. He a rich bloke who got pissed off at corruption and went and got an above average fight training and has a whole load of money to build gadgets and fight a bunch of fat old gangsters and the occasional crazy and reasonably intelligent villian.

Ozymandias was able to outthink and outfit the heros of his day. People who knew him and knew his abilities. To outwit and fool a super being that can see the future takes an immense level of intelligence. Almost an impossible degree of it. He fought and easily defeated other watchmen who themselves had better one-on-one fighting ability that Batman.

To be fair, outsmarting Dr. Manhattan is not as great a feat as people are pretending it is.

While he himself is very intelligent even as a human, along with possessing knowledge none can possess, his future-sight is overrated, he directly states that he can do nothing to change the future, only see it. He likens it to a multi-sided diamond, humans choose to see one side at a time, he sees the thing in its entirety.

Still more intellectually impressive than anything Baleman has done, which is the point here.

Dr. Hatch, this is just getting sad. Aren't you ready to admit that you're hanging onto this match due to fanboy-ism?

This is borderline spite, if you ask me.

Originally posted by Impediment
Dr. Hatch, this is just getting sad. Aren't you ready to admit that you're hanging onto this match due to fanboy-ism?

This is borderline spite, if you ask me. I'll go so far as admiting that I'd prefer Batman to win over Ozymandias, yeah. I think he does have a fighting chance though. Veidts greatest feat is based on the circular logic that "Ozymandias wins because he is called the Worlds Smartest Man". Not only could Dr Manhattan have stopped him, Veidt couldn't prevent Rorschach from breaking out of jail. Batman accomplished all of the things he set out to do.