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Lets say if thor or sentry joined the jla (sentry with a brain and personality), do you think that they would take the shine away from some of the major players in the jla?

Do you think that the jla would rely more on them then they would the major guns in the jla like Supes, Wonder woman, etc.... or do you think that they would be second guns?

In this scenerio, the jla members have known Sentry (lets give sentry the personality he had before this mental breakdown) and thor for a while and they have gotten accustomed to there personalities.

Wonder Woman would have a restraining order out against Thor!

Superman wouldn't be second to Sentry.

Batman would be downgraded and play second to Thor.

The new DC Trinity would be Thor, Superman, and Wonder Woman.

I'd like to see DC's Heracles on at least the JSA with a power upgrade.

Also, I would like to see DC with their own version of Thor.

Originally posted by janus77
Wonder Woman would have a restraining order out against Thor!

What? Who would enforce that?

Originally posted by carver9
Lets say if thor or sentry joined the jla (sentry with a brain and personality), do you think that they would take the shine away from some of the major players in the jla?

Do you think that the jla would rely more on them then they would the major guns in the jla like Supes, Wonder woman, etc.... or do you think that they would be second guns?

In this scenerio, the jla members have known Sentry (lets give sentry the personality he had before this mental breakdown) and thor for a while and they have gotten accustomed to there personalities.

I think Thor would maybe take the place of Captain Marvel/Shazam who would go to JSA. Wonder Woman and her greek gods may get pushed into the background. Sentry would wind up on the JSA or a solo guy.

Originally posted by janus77
Thor would have a restraining order out against Wonder women!

Fixed she would be all over the God of Thunder

Doesnt matter, he only messes with blonds anyway, he'd prolly end up screwing Sentry

Thor literally steals Supe's thunder. Sentry... he has the power set and the S so Idk if Supes and Him can be on the same team without the readers being lik e WTF! So yeah not sure about him...

Sentry would just be a small step up from Captain Atom. His level wouldn't be the same as A+ guys in DC.

Sentry = Captain Atom.

Shouldn't this be in the comic books section?

Thor's the only one whose power set would serve any purpose on that team. The JLA already has Sentry's powers signed in triplicate.

If anyone got "downgraded" from a popularity standpoint, it would be Diana. She's always been a distant third in popularity anyway.

Sentry would end up on the Outsiders or some other B-list team.

the outsiders are so not b-list

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Doesnt matter, he only messes with blonds anyway, he'd prolly end up screwing Sentry

Nah Thor dates blondes only for short term he like brunettes better just ask SIF she had Thor for a few 1000's years

Originally posted by Sin I AM
the outsiders are so not b-list


Sorry, he meant a C listed team.

Back on topic thor would be a big plus but i see him butting heads with Supes and the others too much.

Sentry........

Originally posted by DarkOdin
Thor would be a big plus but i see him butting heads with Supes and the others too much.

Didn't the void make like some kind of giant monster that challeneged the entire jla
Didn't Morgana kill sentry and he poores back to life a short time later
Didn't sentry have his wife died only to healher back to life.... Unless of course she like that monster were creations of bob...
Erase the minds of everyone on earth including high level telepaths like xavier from remembering who he is
Forget superman this guy is more like Martian manhunter... His weakness is psychosis? Fear of himself whole mm is fear of fire until recent events....
And his power is that of a million suns... Supes would never run outta power
And if he really could heal... The team has a healer!
And he can create lifesize monsters...
And a powerful telepath...

If anything he replaces mm

Thor replaces wonder woman

Batman stays
So does superman and green lantern
And flash

Not sure who I'd gave for number seven. Hawkman seems lame to me...
Can I choose zatanna for hottie plus magic potential?

Thor and Sentry would really replace any "main" member in JLA. Look at Batman, he is very weak, yet he is still the most valuable because of the story. That wouldn't change!!! Same goes with Superman, and WW, and any other main character. Sentry will wouldn't get nothing!! Thor on the other hand would obviously get something.

I think thor would be top gun because where the jla failed at thor would be the main person knocking heads around. Example, it took the entire jla along with prep to drop titus BUT thor would have been the last man standing knocking titus head in circles, probably defeating him on his own.

Konvikt had a great showing but he would have gotten soloed by thor also ending with thor standing over a dead konvikts body.

Same for despero; thor would have found some kind of way of depowering despero during v&v which would have lead to him defeating a similar villian that is already in his ranks of defeating.

Thor would play a huge role on the jla and I honestly think that he'll be the top gun on the team due to his versatility, raw power, and damage soak abilities.

Thor would be like having a brute version of surfer on your team that just dont care.

Thats my opinion though.

Originally posted by carver9
I think thor would be top gun because where the jla failed at thor would be the main person knocking heads around. Example, it took the entire jla along with prep to drop titus BUT thor would have been the last man standing knocking titus head in circles, probably defeating him on his own.

Konvikt had a great showing but he would have gotten soloed by thor also ending with thor standing over a dead konvikts body.

Same for despero; thor would have found some kind of way of depowering despero during v&v which would have lead to him defeating a similar villian that is already in his ranks of defeating.

Thor would play a huge role on the jla and I honestly think that he'll be the top gun on the team due to his versatility, raw power, and damage soak abilities.

Thor would be like having a brute version of surfer on your team that just dont care.

Thats my opinion though.
Wow!!

Most of those scenarios, PIS was involved. If PIS wasn't involved, Flash would be ever where stealing, and lending speed to heroes and villains. Despero, took down everyone in a few hits. Thor would go down too.

He will only play as a support.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Wow!!

Most of those scenarios, PIS was involved. If PIS wasn't involved, Flash would be ever where stealing, and lending speed to heroes and villains. Despero, took down everyone in a few hits. Thor would go down too.

He will only play as a support.

Thor has taken hits from mangog, Destroyer, Mindless hulk (who IS stronger than despero), attacks from a celestial, drax with the power gem.

Thors damage soak ability is greater than almost anyone on the jla discluding orion.

Despero isnt any different from anything thor has faced on a day to day basis. A determined thor should whip his ass and I dont care who you named that despero took out, he could still fall to thor.

LOL do u read comics carver?

I don't even want to argue with him.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
LOL do u read comics carver?

Love them, I'm trying to become an artist for comics, wish me luck.


The question you need to ask yourself is do you know thor and if so I want you to think of his rogue (enemies) and then compare them to the people that I named that dropped the jla and let me know if you think thor could withstand attacks from those enemies.

Then another thing I want you to answer is; when was the last time thor has EVER been one shotted, even durinig the times he has fought these powerful members in his rogue?

Originally posted by xJLxKing
I don't even want to argue with him.

Is Despero stronger than mangog or the destroyer?

Originally posted by carver9
Is Despero stronger than mangog or the destroyer?
No idea! V& V Despero was tough. His is a better telepathic then MM, easily defeat CM, Superman, Powergirl, WW, and a few other High members of JLA, or JSA.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
No idea! V& V Despero was tough. His is a better telepathic then MM, easily defeat CM, Superman, Powergirl, WW, and a few other High members of JLA, or JSA.


I'm not downing your opinion but you have to think about it like this, Odin created the destroyer to have enough invulnerability to withstand attacks from the celestial. Odin created the destroyer to have enough strength to tumble the celestial and thor has withstood attacks from it.

Mangog, he's just a god killer and even odin himself fears mangog strength. Thor has taken punishment and failed on numerous of times to fall to mangogs might.

I know how powerful despero is but mangog and the destroyer just appear to be on a different level.

What despero did, a thousand bricks has done the same thing. Doomsday fought the jla, the general, amped solomon grundy, konvikt, titus, the list goes on. Hell, hulk has fought the entire avengers before but he would still lose against thor.

Originally posted by carver9
I'm not downing your opinion but you have to think about it like this, Odin created the destroyer to have enough invulnerability to withstand attacks from the celestial. Odin created the destroyer to have enough strength to tumble the celestial and thor has withstood attacks from it.

Mangog, he's just a god killer and even odin himself fears mangog strength. Thor has taken punishment and failed on numerous of times to fall to mangogs might.

I know how powerful despero is but mangog and the destroyer just appear to be on a different level.

What despero did, a thousand bricks has done the same thing. Doomsday fought the jla, the general, amped solomon grundy, konvikt, titus, the list goes on. Hell, hulk has fought the entire avengers before but he would still lose against thor.
Yet, The celestial looked at him like a joke! Odin even with all that power was nothing to the celestial.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Yet, The celestial looked at him like a joke! Odin even with all that power was nothing to the celestial.

Who doesnt the celestial look at as insects? Hell, the celestial looked at thor like a mere insect but ended up getting damaged by him.

With the knowledge that you have of thor, do you honestly think that despero could one shot him?

Originally posted by carver9
Who doesnt the celestial look at as insects? Hell, the celestial looked at thor like a mere insect but ended up getting damaged by him.

With the knowledge that you have of thor, do you honestly think that despero could one shot him? One shot him? Of course not, but Despero will beat Thor

Originally posted by xJLxKing
One shot him? Of course not, but Despero will beat Thor


Despero couldnt take a mace hit to the head, I think one more of those would have literally done some serious damage to him.

Thor hammer>hawkgirls mace.

One hit with full strength from thor hammer should do some major damage to despero BUT I'm going to leave this alone, we have two different opinions thats not going to change, I'm not going to say you're wrong because you could be right, but I'm sticking to thor whipping despero ass.

Originally posted by carver9
Despero couldnt take a mace hit to the head, I think one more of those would have literally done some serious damage to him.

Thor hammer>hawkgirls mace.

One hit with full strength from thor hammer should do some major damage to despero BUT I'm going to leave this alone, we have two different opinions thats not going to change, I'm not going to say you're wrong because you could be right, but I'm sticking to thor whipping despero ass.
That's not how it works. He broke a few teeth. Nothing too serious. He wasn't even going all out in that fight. There have been instances where Superman got hit and was bleeding, yet he wins easily. A PERFECT example is when he fought that Kryptonian in New Krypton. Same strenght, you would think that Superman would fight him evenly, but of course not. We can easily see Superman tanking the damage.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
That's not how it works. He broke a few teeth. Nothing too serious. He wasn't even going all out in that fight. There have been instances where Superman got hit and was bleeding, yet he wins easily. A PERFECT example is when he fought that Kryptonian in New Krypton. Same strenght, you would think that Superman would fight him evenly, but of course not. We can easily see Superman tanking the damage.


Is these the same kryptonians that was basically getting stalemated by 6 of the jla members?

Is these the same kryptonians that one in the batch, one of the strongest got taken out by black lightning?

Not a good example.

Despero was slobbing from the mouth when he got hit by that mace.

The mace usually have more of a impact on beings that is magical in nature since it disrupts magical forces but that cant be said about despero since, well, he's not magical at all.

Originally posted by carver9
Is these the same kryptonians that was basically getting stalemated by 6 of the jla members?

Is these the same kryptonians that one in the batch, one of the strongest got taken out by black lightning?

Not a good example.

Despero was slobbing from the mouth when he got hit by that mace.

The mace usually have more of a impact on beings that is magical in nature since it disrupts magical forces but that cant be said about despero since, well, he's not magical at all.
Hawkmans Mace>Thor if they slam each other.

Any ways The Kryptonians have the same amount of power that Superman has. I don't know what you are talking about.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Hawkmans Mace>Thor if they slam each other.

Any ways The Kryptonians have the same amount of power that Superman has. I don't know what you are talking about.

From there showings, no, there not as powerful as supes, seemed much weaker.

What I'm talking about with black lightning was when he first met a kryptonian that basically whipped his ass in there first confrontation. They met again when the jla invaded the kryptonians and black lightning one shotted him.

Supes before getting slammed by supergirl said that the kryptonians didnt stand a chance against the small number of jla that he brought with them and it was more kryptonians than jla members.

I cant believe you said hawkman (even though it was hawkgirl) mace is stronger than thor mace if they slammed together. Thats just a plain out lie. Beta ray bills mace slammed against a planet twice and destroyed it. Theres no on panel proof suggesting hawkgirl mace could do the same thing or even close to it.

Originally posted by carver9

I cant believe you said hawkman (even though it was hawkgirl) mace is stronger than thor mace if they slammed together. Thats just a plain out lie. Beta ray bills mace slammed against a planet twice and destroyed it. Theres no on panel proof suggesting hawkgirl mace could do the same thing or even close to it.

I can't believe anyone would think that.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Hawkmans Mace>Thor if they slam each other.
...

Wow.





Just, no. Definitely not true.

Originally posted by Enyalus
...

Wow.





Just, no. Definitely not true.

Dosen't Hawkgirls/man mace disrupt magic? WOuldnt it have an effect on his hammer magically.

Originally posted by Hyperion Prime
Dosen't Hawkgirls/man mace disrupt magic? WOuldnt it have an effect on his hammer magically.


No and that wasnt what jlking was talking about. He's basically saying that despero would take Thors hammer to the face better than he would Hawk girls mace to the face when its plain and clear that thors hammer packs more hitting power; planet destroying, hitting power.

The Claw of Horus is a great weapon.


http://www.imageurlhost.com/images/yu2t5d903oc1664zktou_thumb.jpg

Originally posted by Hyperion Prime
Dosen't Hawkgirls/man mace disrupt magic? WOuldnt it have an effect on his hammer magically.

It's just Uru metal. And it's got a magical enchantment on it to always return to Thor's hand. Its other, magical, capabilities only come into play when Thor wants them to.

And Nth metal isn't harder than Uru or anything. Hell, I've seen Hawkman's mace shatter just like I've seen Mjolnir shatter.

Originally posted by The Scribe
The Claw of Horus is a great weapon.


http://www.imageurlhost.com/images/yu2t5d903oc1664zktou_thumb.jpg

I tried to use that as evidence in a debate against Superman, and was told that it was Superman's intention to get knocked out by Hawkman...

Which, actually, the issue does imply. But still.

Originally posted by The Scribe
The Claw of Horus is a great weapon.


http://www.imageurlhost.com/images/yu2t5d903oc1664zktou_thumb.jpg

I'm going to start this off with this; proof that beta ray bills hammer is equal to thors.
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l92/priest_85/SecretInvasionThor01Zone-Meganpg11.jpg

Then this:

http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/2520/stormbreaker0308io5.jpg
http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/305/stormbreaker0309dg2.jpg

Planet shattering hits is >than the weight of the planet.

Originally posted by Enyalus
I tried to use that as evidence in a debate against Superman, and was told that it was Superman's intention to get knocked out by Hawkman...

Which, actually, the issue does imply. But still.

It was his intention but he was still koed, he just let the attack hit him whereas he could have simply tried to dodge it.

They all play second fiddle to the Sentry

Originally posted by tkitna
They all play second fiddle to the Sentry

I agree with this

Sentry would be a good fit in the JSA. A Superman-esque character that would be very useful to have, plus he'd have the guidance of a lot of veterans who would steer him in the right direction.

Thor would be a great addition to the JLA normally, but I can't really see him fitting in. I don't think he'd get along with Batman, and he might respect Supes, but...I don't think he'd get along with him, either. Wally and Diana he'd probably be cool with.

Could see Thor leading the Titans or the Outsiders, though. I think he'd probably enjoy leading the Titans. Bunch of younger heroes coming up, being able to guide 'em and watch them grow.




So...neither one of them are a good fit for the JLA IMO.

Originally posted by Enyalus
I tried to use that as evidence in a debate against Superman, and was told that it was Superman's intention to get knocked out by Hawkman...

Which, actually, the issue does imply. But still.

I don't believe Superman looks forward to getting hit by the Claw again.

Nor, does anyone else.

We were discussing the Mace, so I don't see what Horus's Claw had to do with it...

I like how because it draws power from the magnetic core of the Earth, it's like being hit by a planet, I wish my science classes would teach me interesting things like that.

Originally posted by Mindset
I like how because it draws power from the magnetic core of the Earth, it's like being hit by a planet, I wish my science classes would teach me interesting things like that.
It's from a Superman/Batman issue...what do you expect?

Definitely not quality writing.

Originally posted by The Scribe




Also, I would like to see DC with their own version of Thor.



What? Who would enforce that? Why not, marvel usually copies everything else from DC, why not a whole new line of heroes for dc copied from Marvel's major characters?!

Originally posted by lawest9
Why not, marvel usually copies everything else from DC facepalm

Originally posted by lawest9
Why not, marvel usually copies everything else from DC, why not a whole new line of heroes for dc copied from Marvel's major characters?!
There are plenty of Marvel knockoffs in DC like the Black Racer(Surfer knockoff) and the Guardian(Captain America).

Imperiex

Originally posted by Mindset
Imperiex
The "Hulky" version of Grundy.

Doomsday.

Lobo

Superman and Batman

Originally posted by darthgoober
There are plenty of Marvel knockoffs in DC like the Black Racer(Surfer knockoff) and the Guardian(Captain America).

Apart from his skiis/board the Black Racer is nothing like Surfer. How is the god of death anything like Surfer?

As far as Guardian I agree somewhat but are you going to say every character with a shield is a CA knockoff? Not likely. I don't agree with lawest but these are not the best examples.

Sentry would be pushed to another team e.g JSA

And DC already has a Thor, he just doesn't roam in the Superhero main stream circles, he spends his time battling demons and tackling other demon/god crisis in the Asgard realm.

Originally posted by Allankles

And DC already has a Thor, he just doesn't roam in the Superhero main stream circles, he spends his time battling demons and tackling other demon/god crisis in the Asgard realm. So he doesn't really have anything to do with this thread, right?

Thor already exists in DC. You know the TC probably didn't know that.

Originally posted by carver9
No and that wasnt what jlking was talking about. He's basically saying that despero would take Thors hammer to the face better than he would Hawk girls mace to the face when its plain and clear that thors hammer packs more hitting power; planet destroying, hitting power.
Don't put words in my mouth. I said if they slam into each other
Hawkman's mace>Thor's hammer





Why not? The mace disturbs magic, which the Hammer is enchanted with.

Originally posted by Allankles
Thor already exists in DC. You know the TC probably didn't know that. But he's not part of the JLA, so it doesn't matter.

You yourself explained how is wasn't relevant, unless you just wanted to give him a Flash Fact.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Don't put words in my mouth. I said if they slam into each other
Hawkman's mace>Thor's hammer





Why not? The mace disturbs magic, which the Hammer is enchanted with. It wouldn't damage Mjolnir.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Why not? The mace disturbs magic, which the Hammer is enchanted with.
I've already addressed this a page before.

Originally posted by Allankles
Apart from his skiis/board the Black Racer is nothing like Surfer. How is the god of death anything like Surfer?
Surfer was introduced as a harbinger of Death associated with Galactus just as Black Racer was associated with DS(who was originally a Galactus knockoff himself). That combined with the whole board/ski similarity, their names being a combination of their color schemes and methods of travel(Black Racer/Silver Surfer), and the fact that both were regarded as second only to G and DS, all point to BR being a knockoff of Norrin.

Originally posted by Allankles
As far as Guardian I agree somewhat but are you going to say every character with a shield is a CA knockoff? Not likely. I don't agree with lawest but these are not the best examples.
Not everyone with a shield, but everyone from the WW2 era wielding a shield who's attributes fall close to the limits of the human range and spends a large portion of their fights bouncing around like a superball... sure.

Originally posted by lawest9
Why not, marvel usually copies everything else from DC, why not a whole new line of heroes for dc copied from Marvel's major characters?!

Thor is from mythology.
Marvel, DC, and other companies copy from each other, sometimes.

Black Racer and Silver Surfer have lots in common.

Why?

Jack Kirby created them both.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Surfer was introduced as a harbinger of Death associated with Galactus just as Black Racer was associated with DS(who was originally a Galactus knockoff himself). That combined with the whole board/ski similarity, their names being a combination of their color schemes and methods of travel(Black Racer/Silver Surfer), and the fact that both were regarded as second only to G and DS, all point to BR being a knockoff of Norrin.

Black Racer wasn't associated with DS. He existed before DS so how was he related to DS? Surfermay be a habringer but Black Racer is death... literally: an incarnation. They have no similarities outside of a minor aesthetic similarity.

Further Darkseid isn't a knock off of Glactus that's ridiculous. First of all DS is infinitely cooler than Galactus and they have nothing in common excep that they were made by the same person.

Kirby based Darkseid on Nixon and Jack Palance not some cosmic parasite. Highfather as his counterpart is supposed to be the common sense guy among cosmic powers.


Originally posted by darthgoober
Not everyone with a shield, but everyone from the WW2 era wielding a shield who's attributes fall close to the limits of the human range and spends a large portion of their fights bouncing around like a superball... sure.

I already said I agree in part, but the super soldier hero is not something unique to CA.

Originally posted by Allankles
Black Racer wasn't associated with DS. He existed before DS so how was he related to DS? Surfermay be a habringer but Black Racer is death... literally: an incarnation. They have no similarities outside of a minor aesthetic similarity.
They were introduced in the same issue. Hence, the association. They're similar on many levels, which is why they meshed so well in the Amalgam Universe.

Originally posted by Allankles
Further Darkseid isn't a knock off of Glactus that's ridiculous. First of all DS is infinitely cooler than Galactus and they have nothing in common excep that they were made by the same person.

Kirby based Darkseid on Nixon and Jack Palance not some cosmic parasite. Highfather as his counterpart is supposed to be the common sense guy among cosmic powers.
Unless I'm mistaken, Kirby has went on record as saying that he created DS to give him a Galactus to play with in DC. I know because nvr and Galen used to try to use that as evidence of DS being beyond the likes of Thanos.





Originally posted by Allankles
I already said I agree in part, but the super soldier hero is not something unique to CA.
It was at the time. Since Superman was created, there have been numerous characters following his basic archetype and they're pretty much ALL regarded as knockoffs because he came first. Same thing applies here...

Originally posted by darthgoober
They were introduced in the same issue. Hence, the association. They're similar on many levels, which is why they meshed so well in the Amalgam Universe.

They were meshed because of aesthetics and because they had the same creator. Their roles and personalities are different.


Originally posted by darthgoober
Unless I'm mistaken, Kirby has went on record as saying that he created DS to give him a Galactus to play with in DC. I know because nvr and Galen used to try to use that as evidence of DS being beyond the likes of Thanos.

In terms of placement in the cosmic hierachy and overall power in DC, not in terms of their personality/motivations/character. Of course DS is above Thanos in terms of cosmic hierachy.


Originally posted by darthgoober
It was at the time. Since Superman was created, there have been numerous characters following his basic archetype and they're pretty much ALL regarded as knockoffs because he came first. Same thing applies here...

I agree, but WW2 is the only thing that ties them together. Drawing similarities with the shield would be like saying every character with a cape is a Dracula knock off.

Originally posted by Allankles
They were meshed because of aesthetics and because they had the same creator. Their roles and personalities are different.
Glads and Supes's roles and personalities are very different. Doesn't change the fact that Glads is a knockoff.

Originally posted by Allankles
In terms of placement in the cosmic hierachy and overall power in DC, not in terms of their personality/motivations/character. Of course DS is above Thanos in terms of cosmic hierachy.
Again, Gladiator and Supes are completely different in regards to personality/motivation/character, it doesn't change the fact that Glads is a Supes knockoff.

If you want to refuse to acknowledge the obvious similarities between Galactus/Surfer and DS/Black Racer then more power to you(we drifted far enough off topic), but I'd be willing to bet that pretty much everyone else sees it and agrees with me...

Originally posted by Allankles
I agree, but WW2 is the only thing that ties them together. Drawing similarities with the shield would be like saying every character with a cape is a Dracula knock off.
The shield is one of many similarities as we've been over. But going into combat with ONLY a shield was virtually unheard of before Cap. So any "human" character(especially a soldier/patriot) who goes into combat unarmed except for a shield is a Cap knockoff.

By the same token, any character with "super" attributes across the board that can also fly is a Superman/Captain Marvel knockoff.

Originally posted by carver9
No and that wasnt what jlking was talking about. He's basically saying that despero would take Thors hammer to the face better than he would Hawk girls mace to the face when its plain and clear that thors hammer packs more hitting power; planet destroying, hitting power.


I agree with you, Black adam has crushed hawkmans mace in his bare hands like it was a handful of crackers. As powerful as BA is he aint doing that to thors hammer. NOt even supes is doing this. Further more doing dmg to despero is nothing new. This dude has unmeasureable strength but shit durability. Doing damge to him is not that hard. takeing his hits now thats a whole diffrent thing.

superman is a knockoff of Dracula.
Cape? Check!
Superstrength? Check!
Superspeed? Check!

There I said it. Deal with it.

And Jesus is a knockoff of a dozen other gods that came before him.

Originally posted by rotiart
superman is a knockoff of Dracula.
Cape? Check!
Superstrength? Check!
Superspeed? Check!

There I said it. Deal with it.

And Jesus is a knockoff of a dozen other gods that came before him.

Originally posted by rotiart
superman is a knockoff of Dracula.
Cape? Check!
Superstrength? Check!
Superspeed? Check!

There I said it. Deal with it.

And Jesus is a knockoff of a dozen other gods that came before him. Jesus was first.

http://www.campped.com/images/thejesus/3.jpg

ROTFL

you forgot to mention the sunlight effects both of them as well.. check

what about the myth biblical reference like:

herakles

Samson?

The new trinity would be Superman, Thor and Batman.

The new Trinity would be Thor and his two fists.

Superman + Sentry...
You make them mad.. Sentry throws superman into the sun.

"
If you want to refuse to acknowledge the obvious similarities between Galactus/Surfer and DS/Black Racer then more power to you(we drifted far enough off topic), but I'd be willing to bet that pretty much everyone else sees it and agrees with me...
"

Ummm.....hell nah. I completely fail to see where there is any similarity beyond some surface superficiality.

Galactus is a cosmic entity, and the sentience of a previous universe given form. Surfer is his scout, and the guy who designates which planets are next on the dinner list. You can say he's marking them for death, but that's it. He just marks them. Galactus is closer to Death than Surfer. And Surfer not only rebelled, he represents completely different character motivations and ideals than the Racer.

Darkseid is evil personified. He is the worst tyrant in the history of DC. He is an abstract concept, a god representing anti-life, totalitarianism, enslavement of everything and corruption. Galactus is NONE of these things.

The Black Racer is DEATH. He is also an abstract entity, representing death for the gods. He is one of the many incarnations of Death in DC. His host was previously a broken man, paralyzed from the neck down. Only able to move in the service of his dread purpose, he cannot be stopped, he cannot be defeated. And in the end, he comes for all who cross his path.

You are arguing for a vague similarity based on some initial concept of the Racer in his first appearence with Darkseid. But even that is a stretch.

Allan is right that there is a similarity in the hierarchy. But Galactus and Darkseid operate in completely different ways and circles. Or are you just arguing the point because DS is above Thanos's petty machinations?

Originally posted by darthgoober
Glads and Supes's roles and personalities are very different. Doesn't change the fact that Glads is a knockoff.

You forgot to mention that Glads powers are exactly likes Supes which is what makes him a knockoff. There's nothing about Blackracer that is similar to Surfer except that he's used skiis as a vehicle. They have no similiarities beyond that. Their powerset etc nothing at all similar. Glads is a kryptonian through and through.



Originally posted by darthgoober
Again, Gladiator and Supes are completely different in regards to personality/motivation/character, it doesn't change the fact that Glads is a Supes knockoff.

Addressed above. DS and Galactus have nothing in common even down to their powers. They have zero similarities. Thanos is a Darkseid knock off in terms of his overall role as a villain. Darkseid has absolutely nothing in common with Galactus however, and was actually based on Nixon and Palance not some dude who devours the life force from worlds.

Anyway you look at the characters they have no similarities. DS may have been Kirby's "Galactus" in DC, but that was only as far as cosmic hierachy/power level is concerned. They have absolutely nothing at all in common.



Originally posted by darthgoober
The shield is one of many similarities as we've been over. But going into combat with ONLY a shield was virtually unheard of before Cap. So any "human" character(especially a soldier/patriot) who goes into combat unarmed except for a shield is a Cap knockoff.

By the same token, any character with "super" attributes across the board that can also fly is a Superman/Captain Marvel knockoff.

A shield is pretty standard as far equipment is concerned. His role as a patriot/super soldier is where the CA similarities come in, on top of his WW2 veteran status.

A shield is pretty standard, I gave you the example of the Dracula/vampire myths and their/his capes.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
"
If you want to refuse to acknowledge the obvious similarities between Galactus/Surfer and DS/Black Racer then more power to you(we drifted far enough off topic), but I'd be willing to bet that pretty much everyone else sees it and agrees with me...
"

Ummm.....hell nah. I completely fail to see where there is any similarity beyond some surface superficiality.

Galactus is a cosmic entity, and the sentience of a previous universe given form. Surfer is his scout, and the guy who designates which planets are next on the dinner list. You can say he's marking them for death, but that's it. He just marks them. Galactus is closer to Death than Surfer. And Surfer not only rebelled, he represents completely different character motivations and ideals than the Racer.

Darkseid is evil personified. He is the worst tyrant in the history of DC. He is an abstract concept, a god representing anti-life, totalitarianism, enslavement of everything and corruption. Galactus is NONE of these things.

The Black Racer is DEATH. He is also an abstract entity, representing death for the gods. He is one of the many incarnations of Death in DC. His host was previously a broken man, paralyzed from the neck down. Only able to move in the service of his dread purpose, he cannot be stopped, he cannot be defeated. And in the end, he comes for all who cross his path.

You are arguing for a vague similarity based on some initial concept of the Racer in his first appearence with Darkseid. But even that is a stretch.

Allan is right that there is a similarity in the hierarchy. But Galactus and Darkseid operate in completely different ways and circles. Or are you just arguing the point because DS is above Thanos's petty machinations?

Originally posted by Allankles
You forgot to mention that Glads powers are exactly likes Supes which is what makes him a knockoff. There's nothing about Blackracer that is similar to Surfer except that he's used skiis as a vehicle. They have no similiarities beyond that. Their powerset etc nothing at all similar. Glads is a kryptonian through and through.





Addressed above. DS and Galactus have nothing in common even down to their powers. They have zero similarities. Thanos is a Darkseid knock off in terms of his overall role as a villain. Darkseid has absolutely nothing in common with Galactus however, and was actually based on Nixon and Palance not some dude who devours the life force from worlds.

Anyway you look at the characters they have no similarities. DS may have been Kirby's "Galactus" in DC, but that was only as far as cosmic hierachy/power level is concerned. They have absolutely nothing at all in common.


You guys are trying to argue as if a character's "role" and/or personality are the key factors as to whether or not they're a "knockoff" character but it doesn't work like that. DS and Thanos have different powers/personalities/motivations and roles in their respective universes but that doesn't change the fact that Thanos is a DS knockoff. BR may or may not be more powerful but that doesn't matter, Supes is considered to be far more powerful than many of his copycats but they're still regarded as such even though they function on a different level of power, have different roles in their respective universes, and different backgrounds/personalities/motivations.

But like I said before, if you want to ignore the obvious in regards to the characters then be my guest...



Originally posted by Allankles


A shield is pretty standard as far equipment is concerned. His role as a patriot/super soldier is where the CA similarities come in, on top of his WW2 veteran status.

A shield is pretty standard, I gave you the example of the Dracula/vampire myths and their/his capes.
If it's so standard, then I'm sure you'd have no difficulty naming some of these characters who's only notable piece of offensive/defensive equipment is a shield. I'm not denying that there've been characters of note since medieval days that used a shield, but I can't think of a single one before Cap who pretty much relied on it alone.

Capes are common, always have been. And it in no way started with Drac, so he wouldn't be the "template" even if the parallel you're trying to draw applied here(which it doesn't). Shields are less common, and all but unheard of as a sole weapon before Cap.

What's more, I didn't say that Guardian was a Cap knockoff solely because of his shield, I said he was a Cap knockoff and you started talking about how not every character with a shield is a knockoff of Cap. The whole "anybody with a shield" thing was just something you cooked up in your head.


You know, I'm pretty sure I've seen a thread dedicated to sorting through knockoff characters somewhere but I can't seem to find it. So if either of you would like to continue this discussion feel free to find and bump it or start a new one because we're nowhere near the topic from Thor/Sentry and the JLA.

Originally posted by darthgoober
DS and Thanos have different powers/personalities/motivations and roles in their respective universes but that doesn't change the fact that Thanos is a DS knockoff. BR may or may not be more powerful but that doesn't matter, Supes is considered to be far more powerful than many of his copycats but they're still regarded as such even though they function on a different level of power, have different roles in their respective universes, and different backgrounds/personalities/motivations.

Thanos is a villain concerned with universal domination that is where he is similar to DS. Further Thanos creator stated that Thanos was a tribute to Darkseid.

Darkseid and Galactus have the same creator and have no similarities whatsoever. Just because Kirby made Galactus doesn't mean he had the same idea with Darkseid. He didn't, as evidence by the fact that they have nothing in common except cosmic rep.

And evidence by the fact that Kirby stated he based DS of off Nixon. Nixon was a huge inspiration for the character as was Jack Palance's villain characters. Galactus doesn't even factor there.

Darkseid and Thanos actually have enough similarities that the connection can be made. On top what's already been stated by Starlin.

Originally posted by darthgoober
f it's so standard, then I'm sure you'd have no difficulty naming some of these characters who's only notable piece of offensive/defensive equipment is a shield. I'm not denying that there've been characters of note since medieval days that used a shield, but I can't think of a single one before Cap who pretty much relied on it alone.

Capes are common, always have been. And it in no way started with Drac, so he wouldn't be the "template" even if the parallel you're trying to draw applied here(which it doesn't). Shields are less common, and all but unheard of as a sole weapon before Cap.

What's more, I didn't say that Guardian was a Cap knockoff solely because of his shield, I said he was a Cap knockoff and you started talking about how not every character with a shield is a knockoff of Cap. The whole "anybody with a shield" thing was just something you cooked up in your head.



I already said Guardian was a knockoff I just don't like it when people draw parallels off of simple aesthetical aspects. As you well know shields have been used by humans since before the Bronze age, CA's use of a shield as both weapon/defensive tool is unique but the shield itself isn't, which was my point.

Originally posted by rotiart
Superman + Sentry...
You make them mad.. Sentry throws superman into the sun.
and powers Superman up?

Everybody loves Thor, Sentry? I don't even want him in the Avengers.

Thor would, no doubt, be kinda like batman where he'll spend most of his time in his home town, protecting it. Wonder Woman would be too into him and maybe join him instead of going after Batman. Sentry would probably spend most of his time with Martian Manhunter because of manhunter's mind powers. He'd have to do this just to keep from going crazy.