Project Natal (xbox 36o)

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FistOfThe North
Project Natal (pronounced "nuh-tall"wink is the code name for a "controller-free gaming and entertainment experience" by Microsoft for the Xbox 360 video game platform. Based on an add-on peripheral for the Xbox 360 console, Project Natal enables users to control and interact with the Xbox 360 without the need to touch a game controller, through gestures, spoken commands, or presented objects and images. The project is aimed at broadening the Xbox 360's audience beyond its typically hardcore base.

wikipedia.org




I saw this device being demo'd on E3 on xbox live. It looks promising for the non-hardcore fans. It's looking like a Wii killer. The games seemed pretty simple.

I don't think i'll be getting it. it's a cool concept but it seems to simple. Unless they come out with something catering to my need which is hardcore, which isn't going to happen with this device seemingly, i'll pass.

Tsal Can
Hm, Milo is freaky in my honest opinion sad

Quincy
Is this the same thing as Milo?

Darth Vicious
I'll get it depending on the price.

Neo Darkhalen
So.....Xbox wii or........Xbox eyetoy......Yeah I don't think it'll work tbh...who knows if it does then Milo will be a revolutionary game.

Smasandian
Milo isn't a game. It's a tech demo to show off the possibilities of Project Natal.

It looks catered towards casual games, but you never what developers will think of when it gets released.

WO Polaski
i've heard aboutbeen following this for several months.

it's the Wii if the Wii didn't suck. not really. butis basically like a wii+. full body control instead of just your arms...

Here's the concept video for it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_txF7iETX0

i agree with the guy who last commented on the video i highly doubt the actual device will be that cool.

but if it is...

the technology isnt that advanced. its not impossible either. in fact movies have been using it for ten+ years.

edit- another video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ie02k3eAvxY&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09-yAnwiIRU

Ushgarak
You can go too far. The Wii Remote has been badsly used by many companies who just subsitute wagglign the Remote for button pressing, despite the waggle being slower and less reliable, thus making for WORSE control. Only certain games have used the Remote properly (Suepr Mario Galaxy being the one that has done it best so far).

Translate that to whole body movement with no buttons involved at all and you have the recipe for a whole bunch of crap.

WO Polaski
you also have a recipe for complete badassery. *shrug* you're right, but, nothing risked nothing gained ya know?

the worse that can happen is that itll suck and people wont buy it. microsoft makes soo much money it wont really matter either way.

SaTsuJiN
Originally posted by Smasandian
Milo isn't a game. It's a tech demo to show off the possibilities of Project Natal.

It looks catered towards casual games, but you never what developers will think of when it gets released. I've read that Milo will be a game.. I think its geared towards raising a responsible kid or some crap.. which you know 90% of todays parents or wanna-be parents will fail at

Darth Vicious
Originally posted by SaTsuJiN
I've read that Milo will be a game.. I think its geared towards raising a responsible kid or some crap.. which you know 90% of todays parents or wanna-be parents will fail at

I have enough raising my kids to be bothered raising Milo. Maybe the game its gear towards young/tween girls.

FistOfThe North
Originally posted by WO Polaski
it's the Wii if the Wii didn't suck. not really. it's basically like a wii+. full body control instead of just your arms..


Body control instead of just your arms and controllers or ("wands"wink.

And expensive platforms. ('cough' wii fit.)

Ultimate Wil
Project Natal is soooooooooooooooooooooo retarded

H. S. 6
If the technology works like they're saying it will, it's truly going to change gaming. Not the full-body controls, but the level of interaction that becomes possible. It would provide the next level of immersion--imagine, you're playing a war game where you're shouting orders in the midst of battle.

Hell, imagine a conversation in Mass Effect, where you're actually in the conversation.

Of course, this is all assuming the technology is truly up to the bar they're setting.

jinXed by JaNx
Originally posted by Ushgarak
You can go too far. The Wii Remote has been badsly used by many companies who just subsitute wagglign the Remote for button pressing, despite the waggle being slower and less reliable, thus making for WORSE control. Only certain games have used the Remote properly (Suepr Mario Galaxy being the one that has done it best so far).

Translate that to whole body movement with no buttons involved at all and you have the recipe for a whole bunch of crap.


Yeah, i agree with that completely. I'm sure the software will blow but everyone will buy it.


I'm like everyone else. I would like to see the dawn of virtual reality but this motion sensing crap is nothing more than an expensive and empty gimmick.

To me, the natal seems to say that Microsoft isn't content with their fan base, so they are going to one up the Wii and steal their gamers. Mean while, the gamers get to suffer because we have to sit and choose between several different pieces of shit that have similar features but completely different games. Microsoft gets you every which way and this is just another scam..,i'm sure.

What ever happened to the goddamn controller? That was fine, i mean it sufficed enough to encourage people to buy three or four 360's every two years after their machines died.

That's another thing. If Microsoft can't even get a gaming console right, what makes them believe that they can properly develop some futuristic full motion and voice sensing technology? Oh, wait, yeah...,they dont expect to. They just expect us to buy what ever piece of crap they drop on our heads.

WO Polaski
all companies are like that jinxed. its just that some have the intelligence and initiative to do it while most dont.

jinXed by JaNx
oh yeah, i know, but i don't think it's intelligence or initiative that inspires a company to tread in new waters, I think it is money wink I went the long way around the building to say that just that...,it's all about money and rarely ever about the games and experiences. I don't mean to sound like a purest or anything i just wish that more developers would go about things with "fun" in mind rather than money. But, i guess that's business huh and their are plenty of development teams out there that just want to entertain, i know that but i just don't sense any heart coming from this natal thing laughing out loud

WO Polaski
the money is the intitiative. microsoft is greedy yeah one of the greediest. stick out tongue

Neo Darkhalen
Originally posted by WO Polaski
the money is the intitiative. microsoft is greedy yeah one of the greediest. stick out tongue

Can't really blame them at the end of the day it's a business and the whole point of a business is to make money. But there greed is excessive.

WO Polaski
oh yes. i hope that im one day successful enough to **** people over and get tons of money. thats my dream. stick out tongue

Smasandian
How can a company greed be excessive?

They're creating new hardware so people can buy there products. It's a smart business plan.

S_D_J

Neo Darkhalen
Originally posted by Smasandian
How can a company greed be excessive?

They're creating new hardware so people can buy there products. It's a smart business plan.

I mean in terms of forcing dev's to charge for there dlc really, they make more then enough money it seems pointless to force people like Valve and Epic to charge for content, especially when the content is only around 3 maps or so and even then 800 points is in most cases a rather steep price.

Peach
Well, considering it's Microsoft's server space that's being used...

And I've never heard anything about Epic wanting to release DLC for free but being made to charge. And Valve...what DLC have they offered? All I know about was the Left 4 Dead maps and survivor mode. Which, unless something changed recently, is free.

Also, say whatever you want about them "being unable to making a working console" or being greedy or whatnot, but the fact stands that Microsoft made a console that has sold very well and has the best games of the generation. When it was discovered the system had problems, and how widespread they were initially, they could have just blown everyone off. Instead, they extended warranties, refunded repair fees charged before the warranty was extended, and redesigned the system multiple times to try and cut down the likelihood of problems popping up. They didn't need to do all of that.

Anyway, on topic, I can't stand motion sensing controls and I highly, highly doubt that Natal will look or work even a fraction as well in reality as it did at E3.

Smasandian
Yeah, MS is a business. People who love video games sometimes forgot about that.

They want to get a piece of the casual crowd that the Wii has. If Project Natal works, and is advertised correctly, I can see this thing selling crazy well.

If not then the technology behind it would be probably be used in something different.

Neo Darkhalen
Originally posted by Peach
Well, considering it's Microsoft's server space that's being used...

And I've never heard anything about Epic wanting to release DLC for free but being made to charge. And Valve...what DLC have they offered? All I know about was the Left 4 Dead maps and survivor mode. Which, unless something changed recently, is free.

Also, say whatever you want about them "being unable to making a working console" or being greedy or whatnot, but the fact stands that Microsoft made a console that has sold very well and has the best games of the generation. When it was discovered the system had problems, and how widespread they were initially, they could have just blown everyone off. Instead, they extended warranties, refunded repair fees charged before the warranty was extended, and redesigned the system multiple times to try and cut down the likelihood of problems popping up. They didn't need to do all of that.

Anyway, on topic, I can't stand motion sensing controls and I highly, highly doubt that Natal will look or work even a fraction as well in reality as it did at E3.

Epic were forced to charge for Gears of War 1 content, Valve are being made to charge for TF2 content upon release.

I'm not complaining about the console (I never did,) can't really mine's never had the RROD.

The only thing I complain about is that point I made previous.

WhoopeeDee
Originally posted by FistOfThe North
Project Natal (pronounced "nuh-tall"wink is the code name for a "controller-free gaming and entertainment experience" by Microsoft for the Xbox 360 video game platform. Based on an add-on peripheral for the Xbox 360 console, Project Natal enables users to control and interact with the Xbox 360 without the need to touch a game controller, through gestures, spoken commands, or presented objects and images. The project is aimed at broadening the Xbox 360's audience beyond its typically hardcore base.

wikipedia.org




I saw this device being demo'd on E3 on xbox live. It looks promising for the non-hardcore fans. It's looking like a Wii killer. The games seemed pretty simple.

I don't think i'll be getting it. it's a cool concept but it seems to simple. Unless they come out with something catering to my need which is hardcore, which isn't going to happen with this device seemingly, i'll pass.

I won't rule nothing till I see more...but it sure looks like something to keep an eye out.

jinXed by JaNx
Originally posted by Smasandian
How can a company greed be excessive?

They're creating new hardware so people can buy there products. It's a smart business plan.


I think it's excessive greed when a company forces their audience to pay additional fee's to unlock content that is already on the game disc. That is just disgusting.

Neo Darkhalen
Originally posted by jinXed by JaNx
I think it's excessive greed when a company forces their audience to pay additional fee's to unlock content that is already on the game disc. That is just disgusting.

That is a real problem.

Nemesis X
Can we punch Milo in the face?

Smasandian
Originally posted by jinXed by JaNx
I think it's excessive greed when a company forces their audience to pay additional fee's to unlock content that is already on the game disc. That is just disgusting.

True, that's not good.

But what does that have to do with MS decision to create a motion based system for the 360?

Zack Fair
Natal looked cool...then I realized its probably going to suck.

All I know is that I'm going to wait and see how this turns out. Maybe buy it after 2+ years from release....buying an xbox360 when it first came out made me realize being an early adopter(is that what its called?) sucks =\

Smasandian
Journalists have tried it out and they say it's pretty damn sweet and works really well for a prototype.


They played Burnout Natal edition (a game reworked for Natal for testing) and it worked. Just like the video.

Nemesis X
Is Natal going to be in stores or on the Xbox Live market?

Neo Darkhalen
Originally posted by Nemesis X
Is Natal going to be in stores or on the Xbox Live market?

It's a physical product it's a bar picking up motion sensing something so big couldn't go on the market place and how would you create strings of data that recognise motion anyway? You would need specialised components.

jinXed by JaNx
Originally posted by Smasandian
True, that's not good.

But what does that have to do with MS decision to create a motion based system for the 360?


laughing out loud it doesnt have anything to do with MS. I was just randomly answering the the question you asked...,"how can a companies greed be excessive" out of context wink

Also, MS is pretty goddamn excessive with charging for goofy dumbass pictures, themes and cheap ass arcade games, but i guess that just makes the knuckleheads who buy the crap the dumbasses eh

I do have to give MS some props though. They have been giving back a little bit to their live audience lately, but not nearly as much as they could.

Natal is going to be a cheap gimmick though, mark my words. I'm curious if i'll have to eat them next year lol

Smasandian
I find it funny when people call it a cheap gimmick.

They said that about the Wii, look how much sales it's doing. So can't really be called a cheap gimmick.

If Project Natal works, and I think it will this is a huge thing for them.

k1Lla441
Too me it kinda seems like a sad attempt to head in the direction that nintendo went.. it may work though. If it does then im going to ps3, As it will pretty much be the last hardcore console left. This will make microsoft more money though.

Smasandian
PS3 is doing the same thing as the Wii with their motion controller with Eye Toy, or Playstation Eye.

How does Project Natal lessen Xbox 360's hardcore value? It's an add-on to the system, 360 still has hardcore developers. It won't change a thing. Just added revenue for MS.

WO Polaski
hating on Natal is a cool kid thing; so that's what everyone's going to do. everyone's a skeptic. its the same reason everyone hates america. big grin *shrug*

if it works it'll be badass beyond belief. ill fork over money for it.

Smasandian
I would too.

k1Lla441
Originally posted by Smasandian
PS3 is doing the same thing as the Wii with their motion controller with Eye Toy, or Playstation Eye.

How does Project Natal lessen Xbox 360's hardcore value? It's an add-on to the system, 360 still has hardcore developers. It won't change a thing. Just added revenue for MS.
Well from the little games they shown at e3, they added avatars last e3, and they've been having commercials with kung fu panda and lego indiana jones while talking about the "family", it seems like there headed that way.

Playstation seems like there getting motion control but not necassarily for family purposes, unlike the 360.

WO Polaski
sony already admitted that they essentially just tacked there motion sensor on at the last minute as soon as they saw the wii-mote. so sony's just as guilty as trying to to capitalize on nintendo's success.

k1Lla441
Tacking on a motion controller doesnt mean there doing it for family reasons.

jinXed by JaNx
Originally posted by Smasandian
I find it funny when people call it a cheap gimmick.

They said that about the Wii, look how much sales it's doing. So can't really be called a cheap gimmick.

If Project Natal works, and I think it will this is a huge thing for them.


I still think the Wii is a cheap gimmick. I try hard not to base my opinions around popularity or sales. The motion sensor bullcrap for the Wii did very little to enhance gameplay. In most cases it's nothing more than a nuisance and hinderance. There are only very few exceptions in games where i think the Wii has succeeded. Otherwise the games are cheap and pointless. That's just me though.

A full body motion sensor sounds really really cool and i would like to see it work but i just don't see it happening. Maybe MS will succeed where Nintendo failed. The company definitely has the money and they also have the luxury of studying Nintendos' efforts. However, unless their efforts are centered around creating a new way to play and experience games i don't see it succeeding. I think the Natal is nothing more than cashing in on a popular trend in video games right now. I'm sure im wrong but thats just what i think. I have more confidence in waiting for Nintendo to perfect what they started with the Wii.

WO Polaski
Originally posted by k1Lla441
Tacking on a motion controller doesnt mean there doing it for family reasons.

but that does mean that they only did it because nintendo did it and because nintendo made money doing it, not because they genuinely thought itd make games better or would enhance the experience for gamers. so how does that make them any better?

avatars isnt family related and sony did that first anyway, PS3 has lego indiana jones and lego batman and all that crap as well, so microsoft hasnt done anything family related sony hasnt already done.

Genesis
Originally posted by Peach
Well, considering it's Microsoft's server space that's being used...

And I've never heard anything about Epic wanting to release DLC for free but being made to charge. And Valve...what DLC have they offered? All I know about was the Left 4 Dead maps and survivor mode. Which, unless something changed recently, is free.

Also, say whatever you want about them "being unable to making a working console" or being greedy or whatnot, but the fact stands that Microsoft made a console that has sold very well and has the best games of the generation. When it was discovered the system had problems, and how widespread they were initially, they could have just blown everyone off. Instead, they extended warranties, refunded repair fees charged before the warranty was extended, and redesigned the system multiple times to try and cut down the likelihood of problems popping up. They didn't need to do all of that.

Anyway, on topic, I can't stand motion sensing controls and I highly, highly doubt that Natal will look or work even a fraction as well in reality as it did at E3.

From a business standpoint, that's absurd. A business does not operate similar to a person but acts as a body. They *HAD* to redesign the console to address these issues because:

A) As a corporation, they needed to appeal to their consumers or they lose their income. Several users complained about the "bladed dashboard" software on the 360 so Microsoft began to develop the NGE (Which has had numerous software problems, particularly regarding audio output) If they ignored their consumers, they'd lose business. They do need to do these things as a multi-billion dollar corporation or their operation suffers greatly.

B) Several lawsuits (A few major ones for disc-scratching and the infamous "RRoD"wink initiated Microsoft to begin upgrading the system hardware. They outfitted the newer models with a spare HDMI port and a more effective heat sink. They did not do this until their company was at stake for losing monetary gain.

C) The 360 is a part of a triumvirate of consoles that compete vigorously. Also, Microsoft happens to be in the middle. With Nintendo already smashing their marketing sales with the Wii, technical problems is primarily unacceptable. If you're losing buyers for a product you've generated and that product has a strong failure rate (A staggering 33% for the RRoD issue ALONE) it is a necessity to upgrade such failures and maintain your marketing position. They have to remain in the middle, push Sony's platform down and try to surpass Wii whilst satisfying their current consumers and trying to impress potential consumers.


Did you think Microsoft was just being generous?



Oh, they did indeed. Microsoft is a massive business empire and their gaming front is an important and major access point for monetary growth. If they start falling behind (And even in the slightest) it means millions and millions of dollars.


On another note, I do agree with your views on the Natal. I don't think it will function smoothly and these devices are killing the old school controller!

k1Lla441
Originally posted by WO Polaski
but that does mean that they only did it because nintendo did it and because nintendo made money doing it, not because they genuinely thought itd make games better or would enhance the experience for gamers. so how does that make them any better?

avatars isnt family related and sony did that first anyway, PS3 has lego indiana jones and lego batman and all that crap as well, so microsoft hasnt done anything family related sony hasnt already done.
They obviously made the motion controllers to copy nintendo; maybe not for the same reasons, but its obvious that they did copy them, or copy the general idea of it.

The way the 360 has avatars and the way they advertised it makes it obvious that they did it because the success of the wii; then they have commercials with lego indiana jones and kung fu panda, and actually package those two games with the console, all while talking about families during the commercial, then yea it seems like there trying to go with families. Sony has not advertised anything related to families, has not metioned them like microsoft has, i mean have you even seen project natal at e3? in every vid it shows families on the damn game.

You cant deny that microsoft is trying to head in the direction of the wii while sony isnt.

S_D_J
Originally posted by WO Polaski
but that does mean that they only did it because nintendo did it and because nintendo made money doing it, not because they genuinely thought itd make games better or would enhance the experience for gamers. so how does that make them any better?

avatars isnt family related and sony did that first anyway, PS3 has lego indiana jones and lego batman and all that crap as well, so microsoft hasnt done anything family related sony hasnt already done.

Sony hasn't bundled E software with the PS3, nor has marketed the sixaxis as a family experience.

as k1Lla441 says Microsoft has tried hard to get on that Family vibe thing since the Wii practically invented such crowd. Sony has been more coy about it.

It's a huge market, and can't really blame M$ for trying to cash in on it. Being concerned about Natal screwing up (in any degree possible, as lesser as it may be) the hardcore crowd is a genuine concerned. Especially when all facts points toward that direction.

I'm sorry, hardcore pleasing developers might be involved in it, but I find it really stupid (and quite hypocrite) to say "that the biggest obstacle gaming has is the hand-held controller"

In most cases motion controlled games has been prove to hinder enjoyment of the game. a game plays better using buttons and the ocasional (but tightly implemented) motion control.

Natal could work,and looks cool. But it would surely be used to churn more casual shovelware crap than anything else


Here's hoping I'm wrong. no expression

k1Lla441
Im hoping with you, i like the 360 as a hardcore console, but damn money is dragging that away from us, slowly. Personally, i think in the future its going to be nintendo and microsoft competing, while sony gets all the money and profit of the hardcore gamers. That is why im getting a ps3. Its sad to say but its true.

Ushgarak
I understand the rumour now is that a new version of the 360 will launcxh next year with this integrated (though almost certainly existing console owners can just upgrade).

k1Lla441
You mean natal? i thought it was just going to be a seperate piece no expression

Ushgarak
It will be- as I say, existing users can upgrade. But an integrated console release next year is the current word.

Neo Darkhalen
Yahtzee makes an interesting point on Natal:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/779-The-Second-Annual-E3-Hype-Massacre

FeelGood
Originally posted by WO Polaski
its the same reason everyone hates america. big grin *shrug*

Yes that's the reason. no expression

Anyway this looks pretty cool, how it could work in proper games is the only thing I'm interested in, not hitting bricks and whatever.

Dark Exile
Originally posted by Ushgarak
It will be- as I say, existing users can upgrade. But an integrated console release next year is the current word.

Give it a faster processor and some better chips under the hood to where it makes the graphics a little sharper, 500 GB Hard Drive, and integrate Natal in the actual console itself I would buy it.

Everything I have heard is that the "new console" just wont be a Slim 360, or a 720 for that matter, just something in between. They(MS) did say they were going to market it like a new console didn't they, make the console "new" enough and ill pick it up for sure.

TheOneBumGun
So will you be able to play on GTA and other games with this?

FistOfThe North
Ex-Microsoft Studio Manager Predicts Failure for Natal


Former Microsoft studio manager Scot Bayless predicts that Project Natal is doomed to failure because Microsoft refused to integrate the motion-sensing device into the Xbox 360.

more...

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/100963-Ex-Microsoft-Studio-Manager-Predicts-Failure-for-Natal-UPDATED




well i sure hope it's a success. meaning not only with party games but for hardcore games, as well. natal should be to hardcore games what the wii motion controllers are to party games.

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