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who would win

Where? Under what circumstances? Have you read the LOTF novels? Mara Jade is the smarter fighter as she almost had Jacen, but he easily eclipses her in force abilities. In an open area where Mara Jade can't use her surrounding, Jacen wins rather easily.

agreed.

mara with prep and the right terrain can win even without a whole lot of difficulty.

Mara had both when she attacked him. There was "a whole lot of difficulty," and then she died.

In a neutral setting, Caedus mutilates her.

Originally posted by Eminence
Mara had both when she attacked him. There was "a whole lot of difficulty," and then she died.

In a neutral setting, Caedus mutilates her.

No sorry, we can't agree on something. Mara wins.

Originally posted by Eminence
Mara had both when she attacked him. There was "a whole lot of difficulty," and then she died.

In a neutral setting, Caedus mutilates her.

jacen won by making his face look like Bens... exploiting family ties is a plot device that he doesnt have in a vs. fight... and up until that point she was winning.

so with prep she wins.

Originally posted by WO Polaski
jacen won by making his face look like Bens... exploiting family ties is a plot device that he doesnt have in a vs. fight... and up until that point she was winning.

so with prep she wins.

Ok no. Faunus' argument involves a neutral setting. Mara doesn't have the advantage of surprise and close combat in a neutral setting, therefore she dies gruesomely.

i agree that shed lose in a neutral setting. if they randomly met on a grassy field in the middle of nowhere then she has no chance. i was referring specifically to this:



when that happened its not as if caedus bypassed all her prep and cunning with his sheer skill and tenacity.

Originally posted by WO Polaski
i agree that shed lose in a neutral setting. if they randomly met on a grassy field in the middle of nowhere then she has no chance.


You're right, because they were in close quarters with Mara's surprise and close combat skills, and it still wasn't enough. She doesn't stand a chance on neutral ground.

edited.

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
You're right, because they were in close quarters with Mara's surprise and close combat skills, and it still wasn't enough. She doesn't stand a chance on neutral ground.

my point is that it wasnt enough only because caedus used a plot device. its the equivalent of comic book PIS. she didnt lose because he was a better fighter. so ultimately what im saying is that with preperation and no plot devices she can get around the masssive force advantage caedus has and take the win. without that she loses.

Originally posted by WO Polaski
my point is that it wasnt enough only because caedus used a plot device. its the equivalent of comic book PIS. she didnt lose because he was a better fighter.

Explain the PIS to me please. Nobody is claiming he was a better or smarter fighter, because the edge for that goes to Mara. In closed quarters she can pull stuff out of her ass, whereas in a neutral setting she can't. And it wasn't PIS, Jacen tricked her with a force technique and capitalized on her hesitation.

Indeed. PIS would be Caedus not simply ripping her head off with his vastly superior command of the Force.

he tricked her by transforming his face into bens which made her hesitate out of love for her son. most mothers wouldnt willingly attack their own child. its a weakness of her character which is why its plot device. by the way kmc rules work characters arent binded to their personalities meaning in the middle of a vs. match maul wont get arrogant and slip up and yoda wont hesitate to go for the kill and mara wont freeze up when she sees caedus transform his face into that of her sons.

an example would be the fact that a couple years ago captain america completely whooped spidermans ass in a hand-to hand fight. captain america is weaker slower less durable and not as smart a fighter but he won because peter kept holding back because he sees steve rogers as a father figure. thus you cant really argue that captain america is the better fighter in that duel because ultimately he won due to exploiting a character flaw.

Originally posted by Eminence
Indeed. PIS would be Caedus not simply ripping her head off with his vastly superior command of the Force.

when has caedus done that before?

Originally posted by WO Polaski
he tricked her by transforming his face into bens which made her hesitate out of love for her son. most mothers wouldnt willingly attack their own child. its a weakness of her character which is why its plot device. by the way kmc rules work characters arent binded to their personalities meaning in the middle of a vs. match maul wont get arrogant and slip up and yoda wont hesitate to go for the kill and mara wont freeze up when she sees caedus transform his face into that of her sons.
I'm not too familiar with PIS like what you just described because it seemed like a smart move and a last resort. In fact, I thought characters WERE binded to their personalities.

Wait, wasnt Mara talking to him on a comlink or something, and he force choked her?

Originally posted by Incanus
Wait, wasnt Mara talking to him on a comlink or something, and he force choked her?


what?

Originally posted by WO Polaski
he tricked her by transforming his face into bens which made her hesitate out of love for her son. most mothers wouldnt willingly attack their own child. its a weakness of her character which is why its plot device. by the way kmc rules work characters arent binded to their personalities meaning in the middle of a vs. match maul wont get arrogant and slip up and yoda wont hesitate to go for the kill and mara wont freeze up when she sees caedus transform his face into that of her sons.
Thta is not PIS... That is exploiting a chracter flaw. A good example of PIS is why didn't Leia send the Death STar plans to their base instead of flying a ship there that she knew had a tracking device on it.

Originally posted by WO Polaski
agreed.

mara with prep and the right terrain can win even without a whole lot of difficulty.
Wrong. She was killed by Cadeus with prep and the right terrain. Sure you can call "PIS" but the fact still remains she was haing difficulty with him before her flaw was exploited. In fact, he was winning until he tripped.

Originally posted by ares834
Thta is not PIS... That is exploiting a chracter flaw. A good example of PIS is why didn't Leia send the Death STar plans to their base instead of flying a ship there that she knew had a tracking device on it.

its technically CIS but CIS and PIS are so close to being the same thing theres no point in specifying.



she was getting ready to make the killing blow when he did it. he was losing until he exploited the character flaw AKA CIS.