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DE Sidious vs

Ulic and Malak
Dooku and Galen Marek
Kun and Kreia
Cadeus and Bane
Yoda and Mace
Nihilus and Sion on Malachor V

Which team do you think would be a match or defeat DE Sidious together?
The list is not in order of which team is more powerful so choose in any order.

Feel free to mix the teams up.

I'd say only Cadeus and Bane or Yoda and Mace would be able to win.

dooku and galen marek may have a chance but the only team that would beat him would be mace and yoda.

Originally posted by bayhunter12
dooku and galen marek may have a chance but the only team that would beat him would be mace and yoda.

You think Dooku and Galen have a better chance than Bane and Caedus?

Ulic malak would lose
bane and caedous would win
yoda mace would win
dooku marek is debatable
nihilous sion would lose.

Originally posted by Vorpal Ruin
You think Dooku and Galen have a better chance than Bane and Caedus?
Yes or at least a very similar chance.

Originally posted by ares834
Yes or at least a very similar chance.

Dooku is not in the same league as Bane or Caedus in anyway, so his team's chances go down a fair amount.

The only teams that have a realistic shot are Bane and Caedus,Yoda and Mace, and maybe Nihilus and Sion due to his drain but Malachor also helps Sidious so I think he win that one too.

I'm waiting for one of the Newbers to come in talkin' 'bout Sion's invincibility and Nihilus' mega death ray.

Originally posted by Kotor3
DE Sidious vs

Ulic and Malak

Sidious wins.

Dooku and Galen Marek have a chance.

Kreia is almost worthless, sids wins.

the duo wins

duo wins.

i see the duo winning, even if nihilus is denied the insta kill. Sion is invincible.

Darth Sion's invincibility and Nihilus' Mega Death Ray kill Sidious dead.

Originally posted by Eminence
Darth Sion's invincibility and Nihilus' Mega Death Ray kill Sidious dead. Why I oughta...

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Why I oughta...
Hug him?

Originally posted by mattatom
Hug him? Oh, a wise guy eh?

What a character. What a guy!

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Oh, a wise guy eh?
I would of thought you'd of worked that one out by now Lucien, whats with the revamp of your sig, picture, comment, etc.? Been meaning to ask.Originally posted by Eminence
What a character. What a guy!

I'm Red's protege what do you expect?

Originally posted by mattatom
I would of thought you'd of worked that one out by now Lucien, whats with the revamp of your sig, picture, comment, etc.? Been meaning to Cuz he <--- is cool. And that -v- is too.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Cuz he <--- is cool. Agreed
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
And that -v- is too.
Agreed.

However, are you?

He rides the Nuts, ergo he is.

Originally posted by Eminence
He rides the Nuts, ergo he is.
You ride the Nutcracker!

Nutriders... forumers in disguise.

...



...

Originally posted by mattatom
You ride the Nutcracker! hey, the faunuts deserve riding. they are so big and bouncy and firm...

Originally posted by ~:Mr.Anderson:~
hey, the faunuts deserve riding. they are so big and bouncy and firm...
Like his mums *coughs*.

The Jinx Forcefield on jokes is still up. I am prepared, neck-stabber.

Originally posted by Eminence
The Jinx Forcefield on jokes is still up. I am prepared, neck-stabber.
I abandoned the way of the shiv, milliseconds ago, you have nothing to fear now, I am totally, mysided.

Sidious pwns all of em because eminence will argue so and then sidious will become nutrider prime!

Originally posted by mattatom
I abandoned the way of the shiv, milliseconds ago, you have nothing to fear now, I am totally, mysided.

I don't believe you.

Originally posted by Slash_KMC
I don't believe you.
I haven't shivved anyone yet, and I made you laugh, that's gotta count for something.

Originally posted by mattatom
I haven't shivved anyone yet, and I made you laugh, that's gotta count for something.

I never said I'd mind though if you shivved anyone, as long as it isn't me.

Originally posted by mattatom
Exchange it. I use $ anyway, but yeh.

Why would you use $ over there?

Originally posted by Slash_KMC
Wow, really? Already? Why? Yeah, Matt, why haven't you changed it yet?

crylaugh

Originally posted by Slash_KMC
Wow, really? Already? Why?
Yes really.
Yes already.
What do you think?Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Yeah, Matt, why haven't you changed it yet?
Just have, and i'm not going to trade this one in yet.

Originally posted by mattatom
What do you think?


I dislike this thinking I do for myself, hence why I ask.

Originally posted by Slash_KMC
I dislike this thinking I do for myself, hence why I ask.
You asking why we moved, or why we got engaged?

Originally posted by mattatom
You asking why we moved, or why we got engaged?

Well, both actually.

Originally posted by Slash_KMC
Well, both actually.
For the former, work (for her) MLG tournaments (for me).
Well for the latter, why do people usually get engaged?

Originally posted by mattatom
For the former, work (for her) MLG tournaments (for me).
Well for the latter, why do people usually get engaged?

But so soon... I couldn't give up dating and meeting new girls every time. It's just too much fun.

But anyhow, what game do you play?

Originally posted by Slash_KMC
But so soon... I couldn't give up dating and meeting new girls every time. It's just too much fun.

But anyhow, what game do you play?
I haven't either, were engaged but nonexclusive, its so much fun.
Mostly Halo, but I haven't played in a long while, so I'm looking for work at the moment.

mattatom
I haven't either, were engaged but nonexclusive, its so much fun.

I think there was an episode of CSI about that.

I say the following teams: Mace and Yoda
Dooku and Galen Marek
Caedus and Bane (Maybe)

Originally posted by DarthDaniel1001
I say the following teams: Mace and Yoda
Dooku and Galen Marek (Maybe)
Caedus and Bane

Galen would have to hold Sidious off while Dooku proceeded to kill him...... Im pretty sure Sidious gave it his all when he fought Marek. Same with Vader.........

Sidious gave it all? No you fanboy, sidious didn't unleash his all on galen or he would have pwn3d him like he did in the DS ending.

Why exactly are you in Star Wars vs. Forum? You all the sudden started coming here a lot.

Hell man, I wasnt sure, and you call me a fanboy. You have serious problems.

I was talking to Wolverine2179

Nah, he called me a fanboy of Sidious because i said i was pretty sure he gave it his all.

Originally posted by Wolverine2179


Hypocrite.


Anyway, Sidious wins all except Yoda/Mace and maybe Caedus/Bane.

H
Why exactly are you in Star Wars vs. Forum? You all the sudden started coming here a lot. He's been here for four years.

Originally posted by Incanus
Nah, he called me a fanboy of Sidious because i said i was pretty sure he gave it his all. I actually meant galen fanboy

And to hewhoknowsall, i been here for quite sometime, but it is only lately i have been extremely active due to my constant NutRiding onzeh a2es0m3 FauNut.

Galen is a loser......... How could he even POSSIBLY have 1 fanboy?

Dude chill im jusr messin with ya, not trying to piss you off or anything but im blad you hate galen marek.

He is by far the worst character/jedi/sith ever created.

Agreed, I didnt get mad, was just wondering how any one like him could get any fanboys, i ment to make it bold, i dont know how tho..... =-p

Sidous wins all but Caedus and Bane. And if its not Bane with Orbalisks, DE sidious wins anyway. Yoda/mace would push him to the brink (mostly because of yoda,) but i think he gets that win as well.
Pwns. the rest.

Ummm, dude, Yoda and Mace could kill Sidious, due to the fact of Yoda fighting him to an appeared standstill, (he saw a clear vision of the future while deflecting the lightning and knew he could risk dying there. He knew he was gonna train Luke.) so he left. Mace beat Sidious in pure saber combat, though he used the force, but Sidious would lose that fight. Hes not all powerful.

Originally posted by Incanus
Ummm, dude, Yoda and Mace could kill Sidious, due to the fact of Yoda fighting him to an appeared standstill, (he saw a clear vision of the future while deflecting the lightning and knew he could risk dying there. He knew he was gonna train Luke.) so he left. Mace beat Sidious in pure saber combat, though he used the force, but Sidious would lose that fight. Hes not all powerful.

lol, i'm surprised Gideon hasn't gotten to you yet. He convinced me. DE sidious is on a WHOLE different level than ROTS sidious. DE sidious is the single strongest user on the entire dark side. (ever read the DE comics?)

Agreed that the jedi duo OWN ROTS sidious. But mace and yoda never fought the DE version of Sidious.

Yeah, but im harder to convert, i guess, as I actually think about what I know of the characters. Will Sidious create a wormhole to kill them? No. He would kill himself. Can they deflect lightning, HELL YEAH. Vapaad would keep Mace up, or he would get pwned. Yoda would still have a fair chance. Combining the two is just the death of Sidious.

Originally posted by Incanus
Yeah, but im harder to convert, i guess, as I actually think about what I know of the characters. Will Sidious create a wormhole to kill them? No. He would kill himself. Can they deflect lightning, HELL YEAH. Vapaad would keep Mace up, or he would get pwned. Yoda would still have a fair chance. Combining the two is just the death of Sidious.
i can respect that. Yoda and Mace are the class of the Prequel jedi. I don't find DE sids a force God like they paint FOTJ luke. Yoda would have a chance, and i doubt either would be overwhelmed, but it would just take either one getting opened up for a force attack for a moment, and Sidious could Insta-Kill them. (done to force neophytes of his order i believe) Close fight though.

Uh, decribe this inst-kill, as if it involes A. lightning, or B. Nihilus, then this is my answer: They can absorb/deflect lightning. and B. Sidious is not Nihilus therefore he has no planet killing drain.

Originally posted by Incanus
Uh, decribe this inst-kill, as if it involes A. lightning, or B. Nihilus, then this is my answer: They can absorb/deflect lightning. and B. Sidious is not Nihilus therefore he has no planet killing drain.
definitly not nihilus. Basically just waves his hand at these force neophytes and they drop over dead, the way i understood it. I'll wikki to be sure. I don't read comics myself.

Ok, so he kill Noephytes, that automatically means he can do it to the 2 most powerful jedi in the order?

Originally posted by Incanus
Ok, so he kill Noephytes, that automatically means he can do it to the 2 most powerful jedi in the order?
can't be proven obviously.and I can't find the info about the instakill right now. pretty sure it was lightning that killed them instantly. I'd think if one of them took a shot of lightning like that, it would at least take them out of the fight. Once again, couldn't be proven. Mace was better, and Yoda admits he "just doesn't have it" against ROTS sidious, so i think a sidious improved to the point that he is would have the edge.

Originally posted by truejedi
I don't find DE sids a force God like they paint FOTJ luke.

When Luke blunts the sensitivity of ten thousand Jedi across a galaxy for decades, conjures a storm that can obliterate a fleet of state of the art ships "with a mere thought," alters the alignment of planets without being present while simultaneously enslaving/draining the billions of inhabitants, and lastly serves as a focusing mechanism for the dark side of the Force, give me a jingle.

You could make a fine case for Skywalker beating Sidious in a fight, but as far as command of the Force is concerned?

It's not even close.



Right. And he wouldn't against the guy who has problems beating droidekas or random monks on distant worlds?

Altered planetary alignments? Goddang, seems every time you speak of him you reveal a new feat.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Altered planetary alignments? Goddang, seems every time you speak of him you reveal a new feat.

Are you telling me you didn't read the damn essay I spent ****ing hours on?

haermm

Originally posted by Gideon
Are you telling me you didn't read the damn essay I spent ****ing hours on?

haermm Maybe if you spent a few hours doing some damn laundry...

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Maybe if you spent a few hours doing some damn laundry...

I take that as a "no."



I don't know if there are words which which to describe my hatred for you.

Originally posted by Gideon
I take that as a "no."



I don't know if there are words which which to describe my hatred for you. I'm your new #1 on Gideon's top 10 "Gonna Kill These F*ckers" list? What did I do to deserve that?

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I'm your new #1 on Gideon's top 10 "Gonna Kill These F*ckers" list? What did I do to deserve that?

Read the essay.

Go forth and read it now.

Originally posted by Gideon


You could make a fine case for Skywalker beating Sidious in a fight, but as far as command of the Force is concerned?

It's not even close.


agreed. Now give them two or three more FOTJ books, and we will see. Seems like they are TRYING to make Luke master every possible aspect of the force before they kill him. (and i just know they are going to kill him)
ROTS Yoda isn't in the same ballpark as these two. Not a chance, i take it back from earlier. Thanks for refreshing me on DE sids. been awhile.

Originally posted by Gideon
When Luke blunts the sensitivity of ten thousand Jedi across a galaxy for decades, conjures a storm that can obliterate a fleet of state of the art ships "with a mere thought," alters the alignment of planets without being present while simultaneously enslaving/draining the billions of inhabitants, and lastly serves as a focusing mechanism for the dark side of the Force, give me a jingle.

You could make a fine case for Skywalker beating Sidious in a fight, but as far as command of the Force is concerned?

It's not even close.


Luke beats Sidious.

Originally posted by Gideon
When Luke blunts the sensitivity of ten thousand Jedi across a galaxy for decades, conjures a storm that can obliterate a fleet of state of the art ships "with a mere thought," alters the alignment of planets without being present while simultaneously enslaving/draining the billions of inhabitants, and lastly serves as a focusing mechanism for the dark side of the Force, give me a jingle.

I can't see Luke ever wanting to do any of that stuff, so whats the point of saying it?

Originally posted by Gideon
Right. And he wouldn't against the guy who has problems beating droidekas or random monks on distant worlds?

Or maybe just getting picked up and thrown into oblivion like a bit*h.

Originally posted by Slash_KMC
Luke beats Sidious.



Don't make me repeat myself. Or I'll have to go all Axl Rose on your ass, Slash.



Because in order to truly compare their respective Force mastery, we have to make a comparison of feats. The skills that Palpatine was capable of are truly mindboggling in scale and scope.

Luke? Not really.



I love a man with no regard for context. <3

Where to begin to punish you for your stupidityinsolence? We could begin with the crap with Vader not being a duel. We could also begin with even though it wasn't a duel, he still killed his attacker. Or we could say that it was a preordained movement, the fulfillment of a prophecy. Or the fact that the only b*tch in the scenario was Luke "I heart he fetal position!" Skywalker, who is incidentally the one we're comparing him to. Or, lastly, we could slip into the conversation casually that Palpatine returned from the dead stronger than ever.

You're wasting your time (and more importantly my time), child. Either make an argument or accept your crushing defeat.

...

I'll give you time. Meanwhile, I had to wake up extra early to go help my retarded sister move into her new apartment.

I'll check in later. Cya!

Originally posted by Gideon
When Luke blunts the sensitivity of ten thousand Jedi across a galaxy for decades,

Which Sidious hasn't done...



Which Sidious couldn't completely control...



Because planets have "alignments" nowadays, dependant on the personal power of the person who "caused" them...



Welcome to the wonderful world of hyperboles in written fiction.



Because things that look impressive must be impressive (in terms of power levels involved), meaning that every illusionist on a fair must be godlike.



Because Sidious would have no problems with...
Wait a second? Last time I checked, I saw Jedi Masters running away from Droidekas before figuring out their weakness (force pushing them against stable objects to short-circuit the shielding). And to note that somebody had problems with a certain enemy of unknown power, also doesn't serve as argument.

At least Luke managed not to be shoved into a reactor shaft by a crippled cyborg, get killed by his own force techniques or be shot to death by a random smuggler. Negative-Feat-Wars for teh win!

I'm bored, so I'll do this.



We can't be sure how Sidious does that. In fact, considering that this had taken effect over 200 years, this would be hard to accredit it solely to him. And Luke has simultaneously contacted every jedi in the galaxy via telekinesis, which is the same in scale.



And I believe Sidious himself says that that only takes a modicum of effort (power-wise). Simply knowing a technique that Luke doesn't isn't enough to put him above Luke force-wise. And Luke I believe can conjure an illusionary fleet of ships. Which is the same in scale. awermm



Again, nothing is known about how he actually does this. According to Byss and the Core Worlds, it was his 'dark side energies', which doesn't exactly give us enough information. Notwithstanding that Shaak Ti actually replicated this feat, turning felucia into a planet alive with the Force- 'So alive, in fact, that (everything on the planet) tapped into the Force as naturally as humans breathed oxygen'. Although of course she had more time in which to do this, but, judging from what the planet returns to after her death, she also had alot more resistence than Palpatine did.



Jingle. I seem to recall Luke focusing the entire Lightside through himself when he fought Palpatine.



Well, if we're going by characters lowest feats then Palpatine got owned by Leia right before she stole his Holocron.

Originally posted by Gideon
Don't make me repeat myself. Or I'll have to go all Axl Rose on your ass, Slash.




That always gets to you.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I'm bored, so I'll do this.

Will you be bored as I tear your flesh from bone? 131



His very existence. The Revenge of the Sith novelization explicitly accredits the feat to him.



The Force had been in a state of flux since two hundred years prior to the Clone Wars; that does not mean that Jedi sensitivity was blunted.



no

Luke went into a trance to contact a little over two hundred Jedi in order to recall them to Coruscant.

"Force call: A technique used by Luke Skywalker and the new Order of Jedi Knights that allowed a powerful Jedi to call out to other Jedi across a great distance. Depending on the strength and skill of the Jedi, the Force call could be made between star systems or -- in the case of Master Skywalker's call during the crisis with the Colony -- to all Jedi in the galaxy. It took a great deal of mental and physical effort to make such a call."

Calling =/= blunting Jedi sensitivity to the Force.

Two hundred Jedi =/= ten thousand Jedi.

Going into a trance/exuding great effort =/= managing to lead two highly active double lives, managing an intragalactic war, while simultaneously keeping one's own sensitivity to the Force a secret.

You win no points for this round.



Quote and source, plz.



All we have are comparisons. When you can provide something that suggests Skywalker's command of the Force is greater than Sidious's, I will reconsider.



Making an (admittedly very powerful) enemy sense an illusionary fleet of ships =/= conjuring a tear in the space/time continuum that destroys a fleet of state-of-the-art ships equipped with shields capable of resisting gigatons of energy.

You, again, win no points for this round.



Explain how this matters. The article directly attributes the feat to him; if you have something suggesting that it's not a product of his energies, share.

Otherwise,'





All planets are connected to the Force. Shaak Ti, while being planetside for decades, managed to hold the darkness back.

That's it. Impressive, but not the same.



Quote and source, plz.



You've been disconnected.





He "manifested the power of the lightside" during one engagement. Palpatine did the same thing with the dark side his entire life. He was a dark side nexus, according to Dark Empire, which is a vergence of Force energy. The Return of the Jedi novelization says that the dark side was "diffused," "nondirected" with his death, which ultimately led to the fragmentation of the Empire.

There's a reason it took a prophecy and a Chosen One to kill this guy. And why his death balanced the Force.



Yep. And Han Solo shot him in the back.

When you tell me how this compares to an actual fight to the death in which Luke was prepared (as against the Hidden One and the droideka) and had assistance (Mara was present against the droideka), you let me know.

while admitting Luke hasn't done any of those things, I'm not convinced he couldn't, if he knew the techniques, and had the desire
.
Also, Shaak Ti is able to alter the alignment of a planet as well, so that maybe isn't as hard as it seems it would be.

lastly, i considered luke's struggle against the random monk more a testament to the ability of the monk, more than an indication of lukes weakness.

its really that whole technique vs. Ability thing i guess. Sidious obviously had more knowledge of the force, but luke hasn't ran across a technique he isn't capable of yet, so with the knowledge and motivation, i see no evidence that he would be UNABLE to accomplish what sidious did.

Finally, not to ask you to repeat yourself again Gideon, just putting my opinion why luke would win in combat: Its short: Luke's combat feats in the mythos do outweigh those of Sidious, he has shown more combat focused techniques than Sidious as well. He has been described as "perhaps the greatest lightsaber duelist ever". (NJO i'm pretty sure) by an omnipotent narrator, and lastly, as of Invincible, he has shatterpoint, which was Sidious's downfall against a much weaker force-user in Mace windu.

You're entering into the realm of utter speculation; a step beyond what is debated here.

Now, should Skywalker receive some accolade in upcoming books that contradict the following, I'll happily accept it. But the fact of the matter is that he has not demonstrated a mastery of the Force which comes close to the Emperor's own. And realistically, why should he? Because he's a Skywalker? Because he's got the potential to be more powerful than Palpatine in the Force?

The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia removes all ambiguity from the argument: a high midichlorian count indicates a greater raw attunement to the Force than other Force users. But it does not, in any way, shape, or form mean that the person with great potential will become anyone truly special. Proficiency with the Force is attained only through training, meditation, and dedicated study.

Palpatine outstrips Luke in all three categories and he intentionally left the galaxy in such a state that Luke had scraps to work with. There's no wonder why Luke isn't in Palpatine's leage in Force command.

I am very confused with the midichlorian(sp?) thing because vader somewhat lost alot of midi's(hacked off limbs) hence his potential has been reduced severely.

What i don't get is if thats the case, how did obi wan tell that anakin had the highest count of midichlorians from a simple blood sample?

Confused!

Originally posted by Wolverine2179
I am very confused with the midichlorian(sp?) thing because vader somewhat lost alot of midi's(hacked off limbs) hence his potential has been reduced severely.

What i don't get is if thats the case, how did obi wan tell that anakin had the highest count of midichlorians from a simple blood sample?

Confused! Due to it's the midichlorian count per cell and naturally the blood also contains them I believe and it was Qui Gon which took the sample.

Originally posted by Gideon
You're entering into the realm of utter speculation; a step beyond what is debated here.
that's correct, it was speculation, I wouldn't try to use it to substantiate Skywalker, just musing.



QFT


The grandest scale of force might (and does mere scale necessitate more power?) shown by skywalker is arguably his cloaking of an entire planet to anyone that would stumble upon it with the echani cloaking technique. Or perhaps his manipulation of black holes. Any other feats that seem to be on a larger scale by Luke that I am missing?