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With MJJ being even greater than Matrix/Merlin and everything else it seems in the omniverse...how would he fare against the LT. I believe LT would win...but, would he give LT a run for his money?

He loses

LT>MJJ

I don't think anyone can beat the LT in current continuity.

I was just curious. The LT never intervened when MJJ became the 616 reality and threatened the omniverse...so, that's the main reason I brought this thread up.

Why would he? He only acts on his own accord when a law is broken. Any other time it's because someone asked for his judgement.

LT wins

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
With MJJ being even greater than Matrix/Merlin and everything else it seems in the omniverse...how would he fare against the LT. I believe LT would win...but, would he give LT a run for his money?

LMAO here! I mean seriously!!!

It's not even close at all...

Sigh, I guess MJJ is just overrated where ever I go...

M
Seriously though he has no business in a thread with LT EVER!!!

How can an omniversal level power be overrated?

Current LT seems to be unbeatable.

He/it wins.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
How can an omniversal level power be overrated?

Good thing he does'nt have that level of power then huh? LOL

M

LT stomps.

Originally posted by GamorasBigDaddy
Good thing he does'nt have that level of power then huh? LOL

M

Sure he does considering we have 3 seperate, credible sources saying he was a threat to all reality.

We even have Cobweb witnessing him blanking out the omniverse. Yet you keep living in denial.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Sure he does considering we have 3 seperate, credible sources saying he was a threat to all reality.

We even have Cobweb witnessing him blanking out the omniverse. Yet you keep living in denial.


LOL you really don't know a damn thing & EVERYTHING you just wrote just proved my point about it!

LMAO! Quite sad really...

I could take apart what you said to explain to you as it seems is needed but your just spamming me cause I owned you over at ICT so won't even bother with ya...

GBD

You owned nothing, you are nothing. You let people do it for you and then you misinterpret what they said.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
I was just curious. The LT never intervened when MJJ became the 616 reality and threatened the omniverse... exacly

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Why would he? He only acts on his own accord when a law is broken. Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
considering we have 3 seperate, credible sources saying he was a threat to all reality.
and threatning all Omniverse aint breaking a law? then what is? lol

LT for the win...easy!

Living Tribunal for an easy win.

LT

The thing about these omnipotent threads is that it is always going to be a stomp for one or the other or they're equal. When you get to all of this "infinite" power, all it becomes is one character is more "infinite" than the other. If one outclasses the other, how does it even become a fight?

Jaspers ain't doin jack to LT

LT is the top dog in Marvel besides the TOAA

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
I was just curious. The LT never intervened when MJJ became the 616 reality and threatened the omniverse...so, that's the main reason I brought this thread up.


Well cause the Capbritain stories ignored all other cosmic beings basically & continuity & made up there own shit separate from how things are usually done.

He created some new cosmics when it was never needed!

M

LT

Originally posted by GamorasBigDaddy
Well cause the Capbritain stories ignored all other cosmic beings basically & continuity & made up there own shit separate from how things are usually done.

He created some new cosmics when it was never needed!

M

More nonsense.

The LT never intervened because Jaspers never broke any laws. If you recall from the IG arc, the LT didn't intervene when Thanos had the IG because Thanos only wanted to replace Eternity's importance with his own.

The law of natural selection, the strong prey upon the weak. Jaspers simply replaced Eternity with himself.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
More nonsense.

The LT never intervened because Jaspers never broke any laws. If you recall from the IG arc, the LT didn't intervene when Thanos had the IG because Thanos only wanted to replace Eternity's importance with his own. then why did he intevene against Warlock?

huh thats weird they never mention Eternity either (yet they mention Eternity & LT & all the other abstarcts during the IG arc !!!)

Warlock was planning to do something unacceptable, I guess. Who knows how LT's rules work?

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Warlock was planning to do something unacceptable, I guess. yeah, but more unacceptable then warpin entire Omniverse? (asuming he could even do that)

I guess. Either that or LT is just a dick that likes to **** around with people. I kind of prefer the latter explanation.

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
then why did he intevene against Warlock?

You asked me this already and I already explained it. He and Eternity deemed Warlock wasn't mentally compotent enough for Godhood.



He became the 616 reality hence he replaced Eternity.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
You asked me this already and I already explained it. He and Eternity deemed Warlock wasn't mentally compotent enough for Godhood. so Adam was mad but MAD Jim Jaspers wasnt mad enuff?

wtf, Adam wuz only a universal threat (nowhere near omniversal anyway)

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I guess. Either that or LT is just a dick that likes to **** around with people. I kind of prefer the latter explanation. yeah me too it dont make sense but this whole arc dint make sense either, so

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
so Adam was mad but MAD Jim Jaspers wasnt mad enuff?

wtf, Adam wuz only a universal threat (nowhere near omniversal anyway)

There was a method to MJJ's madness. Besides, I don't think they were worried about Warlocks sanity. They doubted he could handle the job and would therefore cause more bad than good.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
There was a method to MJJ's madness. Besides, I don't think they were worried about Warlocks sanity. They doubted he could handle the job and would therefore cause more bad than good. but how could they think MJJ coud handle teh job & do "more good then bad" when all he wuz gonna do is twist the entire Omniverse, it dont get worse then that can it. i mean if jus warping everythin till every1 goes nuts is consider a "method" then how could Adam possbly be worse then that, lol


i mean Thanos wuz also gonna be god of Omniverse (rule the omniverse, not **** it up) with HOTU yet LT try to stop him, but he dint try to stop MJJ...wtf???

It's possible that LT foresaw Warlock doing something worse than MJJ was going to do.

For example, MJJ just wanted to take over reality, maybe Warlock was going to destroy it.

but MJJ was gonna **** up reality so bad that Merlin & co said its worse then destroying it


also Warlock only had IG, it aint Omniversal threat

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
but MJJ was gonna **** up reality so bad that Merlin & co said its worse then destroying it


also Warlock only had IG, it aint Omniversal threat The cosmics like LT, Eternity, etc. weren't involved in the story.

i mean if some1 like MJJ gets OK pass to be god of MU then anyone else shoud, cuz it dont get worse then him lol

IG is a lot more powerful than it was usually used for, have you read the arc where Rune got it? It was a threat to all universes

Or maybe LT knew he wouldn't have to interfere because he knew that MJJ would be defeated

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
so Adam was mad but MAD Jim Jaspers wasnt mad enuff?

wtf, Adam wuz only a universal threat (nowhere near omniversal anyway)

IG user is much more then Universal threat bub...

MJJ would be like a damn bug to Thanos or Warlock with it...

M

Originally posted by Mindset
The cosmics like LT, Eternity, etc. weren't involved in the story. in the MJJ story? yeah thats the prob they shoudve been involve but they werent

MJJ wuz mad + Omniversal, it dont get bigger then that IMO

^^^And that's basically it. How much fun would it be if the abstracts got involved every single time a powerful being "got out of hand"?

Fact is stuff like this has happened alot in the MU and the abstracts hardly get involved.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
^^^And that's basically it. How much fun would it be if the abstracts got involved every single time a powerful being "got out of hand"?

Fact is stuff like this has happened alot in the MU and the abstracts hardly get involved. like i said prev post, how often is there omniversal threat?

apart from MJJ, there was only Thanos with HOTU
and he wuz a lot more sane then MJJ + he dint wanna mess up the whole MU


the abstracts sweat the small stuff (universal threat & all that) but they ignore some o the bigger stuff, what the hell...

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
like i said prev post, how often is there omniversal threat?

apart from MJJ, there was only Thanos with HOTU
and he wuz a lot more sane then MJJ + he dint wanna warp mess up the whole MU


the abstracts sweat the small stuff (universal threat & all that) but they ignore some o the bigger stuff, what the hell...

You were smart to remove that Starbrand nonsense from your post. No Starbrand wielder was ever a threat to the omniverse. MJJ was, Thanos with the Heart obviously, HoM Scarlet Witch.

I don't have an explanation for you other than the LT seems to only get involved upon request or if you break one of his laws. An example of this would be when Strange released Zom.

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
in the MJJ story? yeah thats the prob they shoudve been involve but they werent

MJJ wuz mad + Omniversal, it dont get bigger then that IMO

sorry to beat a dead horse but MJJ jaspers was'nt a Ominversal power!

His Warp POTENTIALLY would of effected the Omniverse by spreading through ONE UNIVERSE AT A TIME, IF left unchecked!

That's a BIG difference to just saying he was Omniversal power.



IMO he showed nothing a CosmicCube could'nt do...

GBD

You don't know anything. If he can warp the entire omniverse he's an omniversal power.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
You don't know anything. If he can warp the entire omniverse he's an omniversal power.

Hello! that's not what he was doing!

He ONLY COULD EFFECT ONE UNIVERSE AT A TIME!

Is that hard to understand?

gbd

It didn't seem like one at a time, more like a geometric/exponential progression. He would affect several, each of them would affect several more, etc.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
It didn't seem like one at a time, more like a geometric/exponential progression. He would affect several, each of them would affect several more, etc.

Cobweb that chick that saw the future or someshit specifically pointed out how it spreads form ONE Universe at a time like a domino effect...

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
You were smart to remove that Starbrand nonsense from your post. No Starbrand wielder was ever a threat to the omniverse. MJJ was, Thanos with the Heart obviously, HoM Scarlet Witch.

I don't have an explanation for you other than the LT seems to only get involved upon request or if you break one of his laws. An example of this would be when Strange released Zom. yeah actualy its better without starbrand, cuz then that leaves even fewer Omniversal threats, wich means its even more exceptionel (and so more of reason for LT to intervene!)


if its a law thing then it dont make fockin sense, tryin to mess up all of MU (not just rule it) shoud be up there with worst possibel "cosmic crimes"

hell even warpin 1 single universe like mjj238 did is far worse then many other universal lvl threat (and LT had intervened b4 when only 1 universe was in danger, yet he dint try stop mjj238 either)

Originally posted by GamorasBigDaddy
Hello! that's not what he was doing!

He ONLY COULD EFFECT ONE UNIVERSE AT A TIME!

Is that hard to understand?

gbd

Say this out loud to yourself and see how ridiculous you sound.

You - "MJJ wasn't an omniversal power, he just had the potential to warp the entire omniverse"

^^^Say that to yourself a few times and you can get some idea of what we are thinking after we read one of your posts.

I think what it comes down to is that LT's rules are incomprehensible to lesser beings like us. Or he's just a dick.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Say this out loud to yourself and see how ridiculous you sound.

You - "MJJ wasn't an omniversal power, he just had the potential to warp the entire omniverse"

^^^Say that to yourself a few times and you can get some idea of what we are thinking after we read one of your posts.

I'm done with you.

Obviously you can't prove me wrong or would of already...

If you want to remain ignorant on the situation that's your problem...


GBD

Originally posted by GamorasBigDaddy
sorry to beat a dead horse but MJJ jaspers was'nt a Ominversal power!

His Warp POTENTIALLY would of effected the Omniverse by spreading through ONE UNIVERSE AT A TIME, IF left unchecked!

That's a BIG difference to just saying he was Omniversal power.



IMO he showed nothing a CosmicCube could'nt do...

GBD but even so, same with IG: IG is universal-lvl only yet LT intervene against Adam


i mean LT couldve at least sealed of 616 to stop MJJ warp from spreading (hes suppose 2 b capable of that)

IG is more than universal

Evidence: Thanos claimed he was lord of every universe when he got it

IG deflected a blast from the UN that has shown the ability to destroy and recreate the multiverse

Infinity Gems imperiled a multiverse when Rune had them

The IG was made out of 6 of 7 gems that formed the Infinity Being that created the multi/mega/omniverse

LT stated that a battle between him and AW would cause great devastation across reality (more than just one universe)

When Thanos got the HOTU which was obviously not just universal he claimed the only difference between it and the IG was that the IG was external control as opposed to internal

fair nuff but:Originally posted by Endless Mike
IG deflected a blast from the UN that has shown the ability to destroy and recreate the multiverse u sure about that? cuz iirc the UN can only take out 1 universe at a time (like Merlins celestal nulifier) not several universes all @ once......

In the Abraxas saga when Reed used it on Abraxas it destroyed the entire multiverse and recreated it without Abraxas

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
fair nuff but: u sure about that? cuz iirc the UN can only take out 1 universe at a time (like Merlins celestal nulifier) not several universes all @ once...... Where do you recall it ever taking out a universe?

Originally posted by GamorasBigDaddy
I'm done with you.

Obviously you can't prove me wrong or would of already...

If you want to remain ignorant on the situation that's your problem...


GBD

I proved you wrong on HC yet you continue with your inane nonsense.

Your problem is you have no clue what "omniversal" or "mulitversal" means. If Jaspers was only universal his warp would stop right at the boundaries of the universe. It doesn't, it spreads until it consumes all the reality that exsists across ALL dimensions making Jaspers an OMNIVERSAL level being.

Originally posted by Mindset
Where do you recall it ever taking out a universe? ? never (imo) but iirc it was state on panel that it can destroy 1 "timeline" (= 1 universe) or somethin like that
tho apprently its more powerfull

It was used to destroy a universe in the Black Celestial saga. It was also used in some other arc to destroy an aspect of Eternity

The UN reset the entire multiverse during the Abraxas saga.

I mentioned that already

I mentioned it again apparently. I was responding directly to Soul since your post hadn't appeared till after I responded.

Oh, sorry, no problem

Originally posted by Endless Mike
It was used to destroy a universe in the Black Celestial saga. Is that considered canon to 616?

Originally posted by Mindset
Is that considered canon to 616?

I think so, IIRC it took place mostly in an alternate universe but involved 616 characters

It was 616 Fantastic Four.

can UN restore a universe destroyed by CN? (offtopic, jus curious)

I'm not exactly sure how that would work? I think the UN can only restore things it nullified.

That's just a guess though.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
I'm not exactly sure how that would work? I think the UN can only restore things it nullified.

That's just a guess though.

Probably right

i dunno...nulified is nulified, so once somethins no more then its the same regardles what nulified it

actualy its the fact UN can undo nulification (even its own) thats a bit weird but thats comics logic i guess ^^



maybe a bit ontopic too, wuz wondering why no one restored 238 once the mjj arc wuz over (i mean at least hi-lvl abstracts like LT shoud be able to do it, unless thats not there job)

your face is weird

Well when something is nullified it goes to Oblivion, and Quasar was able to come back from Oblivion by escaping Deathurge

Originally posted by Mindset
your face is weird thats cuz my diet is weird

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Well when something is nullified it goes to Oblivion, and Quasar was able to come back from Oblivion by escaping Deathurge so suppose Thanos (when he try impress Ms Death) had used the UN to kill every1, Death woud not have been too happy then? (cuz every1 wouldve gone to Oblivion instead of Death)

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
so suppose Thanos (when he wanted impress Ms Death) had used the UN to kill every1, Death woud not have been too happy then? (cuz every1 wouldve gone to Oblivion instead of Death)

Probably. Although IIRC Death and Oblivion do share some ideals and their powers/realms overlap a bit

The Cosmics in Collision arc from Quasar sort of shifted the Oblivion/Death relationship around.

I'm not sure if that's been retconned or not.

I didn't read that, what happened?

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33

More nonsense.

The LT never intervened because Jaspers never broke any laws. If you recall from the IG arc, the LT didn't intervene when Thanos had the IG because Thanos only wanted to replace Eternity's importance with his own.

The law of natural selection, the strong prey upon the weak.
Jaspers simply replaced Eternity with himself.
Originally posted by Endless Mike

It didn't seem like one at a time,
more like a geometric/exponential progression.

He would affect several,

each of them would affect several more, etc.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I didn't read that, what happened?

It's been a while since I read it. IIRC Deathurge mentioned something in his fight with Ghost Rider about how Death served Oblivion. It was also mentioned some where in that arc that not only did Oblivion have domain over all the nullified, but he also had domain over the dead.

Also, Oblivion was creating and commanding Death avatars like Kid Death.

Originally posted by GamorasBigDaddy

sorry to beat a dead horse but MJJ jaspers was'nt a Ominversal power!

His Warp POTENTIALLY would of effected the Omniverse by spreading through ONE UNIVERSE AT A TIME, IF left unchecked!

That's a BIG difference to just saying he was Omniversal power.
Incorrect.

238 & 616 Jaspers WERE BOTH Omniversal powers,
even though they didn't get to actually warp the Omniverse.
The difference between the two? ... (one was vulnerable to celestial nullification) - 238 JJ

We know this is true that they were Omniversal powers because:

a. They were more powerful than Matrix/Merlin

b. Had it not been for a single plot device (Fury) 616 Jaspers would've warp all creation.

This fact was witnessed by Cobweb in a future where the Fury failed.
This fact was confirmed by Matrix/Merlin
This fact was stated in Matrix/Merlin's 83 Handbook bio.
(although this bio concerning an Omniverse didn't become canon till 95')

But even 616 MJJ's (2006) handbook bio states,
that as long as Jaspers is around,
the prime Multiverse (that houses 616) will always be in danger.

Also, the Exiles' Handbook bio of 2008 states,
that Jaspers was going to destroy the Omniverse in the "Die by the Sword" arc,
again, had it not been for the same plot device (Fury)
this dark result would've been definite.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
It's been a while since I read it. IIRC Deathurge mentioned something in his fight with Ghost Rider about how Death served Oblivion. It was also mentioned some where in that arc that not only did Oblivion have domain over all the nullified, but he also had domain over the dead.

Also, Oblivion was creating and commanding Death avatars like Kid Death.

That could explain why Phyla-Vell and Drax went to Oblivion's realm when Mentor killed them in GotG

Originally posted by SoulDevourer

but even so, same with IG:

IG is universal-lvl only yet LT intervene against Adam
IG is all powerful, it makes one GOD of all creation,
only the LT is known to surpass it's power.

EndlessMike gave you all the right reasons why too,
but to add to his eloquent:

Magus merged TWO Universes in an instant wth an incomplete IG,
this same incomplete IG owned the UN like a joke as mentioned by Mike.

The IG is the raw and near full power of the Infinity Being,
and the Infinity Being's power is what created the Omniverse originally,
including the LT.

Beyond that:

The IG is so powerful,
that TOAA himself, had to place the restriction on the Gems uniting again.

Of course, this ruling was either changed off-panel,
missed by all of us in some obscure issue,
ignored by knowledge lacking writers of the Illuminati,
or simply retconned.

I thought the ruling only applied to the 616 multiverse

Originally posted by Mr Master
IG is all powerful, it makes one GOD of all creation,
only the LT is known to surpass it's power.

So that means IG is far from being all powerful, literally.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Of course, this ruling was either changed off-panel,
missed by all of us in some obscure issue,
ignored by knowledge lacking writers of the Illuminati,
or simply retconned.

Could it be that since the Universe was destroyed/recreated 3 times since then that the restriction no longer applies? Eternity is the only one who can over-turn the ruling and since that Eternity technically no longer exsists (Entropy is now Eternity), maybe that's why?

Just a thought.

Originally posted by Endless Mike

I thought the ruling only applied to the 616 multiverse
That's what I initially thought,
until the Illuminati arc came out.

I remember Tony Stark stating something to the effect of:

'But I thought the Gems were restricted from uniting again'

Reed retorts with:

"Says who?"

Originally posted by Mr Master
That's what I initially thought,
until the Illuminati arc came out.

I remember Tony Stark stating something to the effect of:

'But I thought the Gems were restricted from uniting again'

Reed retorts with:

"Says who?"

Well did they unite them?

Just to clarify then...An IG holder, such as Thanos or Warlock could've defeated MJJ?...since it was mentioned that only the LT is known to surpass the power of the IG. I thought the Alien Entity was about the IG as well.

I was trying to recall Mr. Master's heirarchy....it's been a long while since I looked at it...and I don't know if he's added to it or changed it up since then.

I would also like further info on the Alien Entity and Infinity Being and how they pertain to the heirarchy in general

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
Just to clarify then...An IG holder, such as Thanos or Warlock could've defeated MJJ? thats good question

in MJJ arc they said he was omniversel threat, in fact they use teh word sevral times

in the IG arc they NEVER EVEN ONCE use the word "omniverse" iirc. not a single panel




btw whats to stop MJJ from turnin the gems into beans or somethin lol

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
I would also like further info on the Alien Entity and Infinity Being and how they pertain to the heirarchy in general

The Infinity Being was retconned into being Nemesis from the Avengers/Ultraforce books. She appeared in other stories as well.

Alien Entity, IMO, would be on the same level as beings who destroyed the MU and recreated it under their own power like Entropy and possibly Sise-Neg. I don't know if Sise-Neg qualifies though because he absorbed all the mystical energy throughout the time-stream so he didn't really do it under his own power.

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
thats good question

in MJJ arc they said he was omniversel threat, in fact they use teh word sevral times

in the IG arc they NEVER EVEN ONCE use the word "omniverse" iirc. not a single panel




btw whats to stop MJJ from turnin the gems into beans or somethin lol


lol..that would be funny. Thanos would've shit a brick if he saw the gems turned into beans.

Originally posted by SoulDevourer


and threatning all Omniverse aint breaking a law? then what is? lol

Well when Thanos got the Ig and was beating up entities LT didnt intervene. He saw it as survival of the fittest.

Ah somebody beat me to it.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Well when Thanos got the Ig and was beating up entities LT didnt intervene. He saw it as survival of the fittest.

Ah somebody beat me to it. yeah but he wasnt omniversel threat

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
yeah but he wasnt omniversel threat

Doesnt matter the point is that LT didnt do anything. LT doesnt just respond to ominversal threats.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Doesnt matter the point is that LT didnt do anything. LT doesnt just respond to ominversal threats. k then wut does he respond to? I mean its like he only sweat the smaller stuff (universel threats) but not the rilly big stuff

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
k then wut does he respond to? I mean its like he only sweat the smaller stuff (universel threats) but not the rilly big stuff

Dunno but im just thinking if was actually going to turn the universe into nothingness than thats something, like people are saying he wasnt destorying universes he was just replacing the order with himself.

To be quite honest I suspect the writers just didnt want him in the story.

only reason why the LT hasn't kicked his ass yet is because he either didn't care or nobody dimed mad jim yet.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Dunno but im just thinking if was actually going to turn the universe into nothingness than thats something, like people are saying he wasnt destorying universes he was just replacing the order with himself.thats the problem he wuz gonna replace order with somethin that was opposite of order (madness )

+1 prolly best xplanation

LT wouldn't care about MJJ, because hes not a threat.

The IG on the other hand, was.

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
yeah but he wasnt omniversel threat

You just don't get it do you? The LT and Eternity deemed that Warlock was not mentally fit for godhood.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
You just don't get it do you? The LT and Eternity deemed that Warlock was not mentally fit for godhood. u dont get it do u? mjj wuz *mad*. look it up, it means, u know, mad. serously what so hard 2 understand about dat? SO THEY SHOULD OF DEEM MJJ ALSO NOT FIT

warlock not fit & mjj fit = complete BS

mjj wuz gonna warp entire MU into madness so u tell me, what is it warlock could of done that was WORSE then that?

its like condemmin Castro & not Stalin get it now? GET IT?

MJJ had his own plot device.

The LT wasn't needed.

Originally posted by The Nuul
LT wouldn't care about MJJ, because hes not a threat.

The IG on the other hand, was. actually, the ig was inconsequential to the LT, the only reason he was involved was because eternity (being one of very few beings that can call for a trial with the LT) knew that it was only a matter of time before the gauntlet would usurp his 616 position, which it did briefly.

the LT even said that these things were part of the life cycle realities or some such and it was only natural...basically, "no biggy".


so basically it was eternity's bitching that made the LT even hold the trial in the first place, then galactus made the LT show up again to re activate the ig.

Originally posted by Peterlane
LT wins