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post-retcon molecule man
all at full power and complete mastery of powers

Molecule Man.

FS nor MrM ever showed the sheer SCOPE of owen's powers. not even close, really. unless you feel like entertaining a discussion regarding the POTENTIAL of an omega-level mutant, methinks this be spite . . .

Molecule Man...

MM by a universe.

Originally posted by leonidas
FS nor MrM ever showed the sheer SCOPE of owen's powers. not even close, really. unless you feel like entertaining a discussion regarding the POTENTIAL of an omega-level mutant, methinks this be spite . . .

it's not spite.and yes i am completely willing to entertain a discussion about potential

Originally posted by gobstakid777
it's not spite.and yes i am completely willing to entertain a discussion about potential

It really is spite, Molecule Man is on another level to these two.

Even Post Retcon, he and the Beyonder fought in a battle that warped things across the Multiverse...

Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
It really is spite, Molecule Man is on another level to these two.

Even Post Retcon, he and the Beyonder fought in a battle that warped things across the Multiverse...

they all have basically the same power,especially absolom.if they all had full mastery of said power....

Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
It really is spite, Molecule Man is on another level to these two.



if you want to talk about what an omega is SUPPOSED to ultimately be capable of, then maybe mr.m can one day match owen. but as they stand mr.m never showed anywhere CLOSE to the scope of owen's power level and FS is even further behind imo.

Originally posted by gobstakid777
they all have basically the same power,especially absolom.if they all had full mastery of said power....

Basically the same power, but on different levels.

I mean, technically The Silver Surfer can manipulate matter and energy akin to Molecule Man, but not on the same level as him.

Molecule Man.

current molecule man? isnt he weaker then surfer?

Originally posted by bbrem123
current molecule man? isnt he weaker then surfer?

No.

there is a scan in surfer respect thread saying molecule man is almost as powerful as the surfer

http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/1714/77299079.jpg

Originally posted by bbrem123
there is a scan in surfer respect thread saying molecule man is almost as powerful as the surfer

That was said by a random photographer in the MU if I'm not mistaken.

Molecule Man has fought and warped the multiverse, as well as defeated the Beyonder (post retcon), and stated that ripping apart galaxies is 'easy stuff' for him...

Molecule Man FTW

Molecule Man>=Mr M>>>>>>>>>>>>Firestorm

Mister M is actually pretty bad ass. He just needs more showings.

Originally posted by leonidas
this be spite . . .

Originally posted by AlmightyKfish

I mean, technically The Silver Surfer can manipulate matter and energy akin to Molecule Man, but not on the same level as him.

I disagree. on panel evidence says otherwise
http://img5.imageshack.us/i/77299079.jpg/
Surfer >>>=molecule man as proven on panel.

Originally posted by Naija boy
I disagree. on panel evidence says otherwise
http://img5.imageshack.us/i/77299079.jpg/
Surfer >>>=molecule man as proven on panel.
So that means both Surfer and MM are beneath Thanos. Cool.

Originally posted by Enyalus
So that means both Surfer and MM are beneath Thanos. Cool.



surfer is >= thanos as well or have u forgoton that a weakened surfer matched thanos output in annihilation?

Originally posted by leonidas


if you want to talk about what an omega is SUPPOSED to ultimately be capable of, then maybe mr.m can one day match owen. but as they stand mr.m never showed anywhere CLOSE to the scope of owen's power level and FS is even further behind imo. well if we are going to talk about potential, then firestorm has an infinite well of energy in which to draw from *shrug*

Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
Even Post Retcon, he and the Beyonder fought in a battle that warped things across the Multiverse... right, and he's also been practically mind raped by iron man's tech, and owned/killed by the MoD. none

Originally posted by Galan007
well if we are going to talk about potential, then firestorm has an infinite well of energy in which to draw from *shrug*

right, and he's also been practically mind raped by iron man's tech, and owned/killed by the MoD. none

Was the Iron Man tech thing when Tony wiped his identity from a bunch of villains minds? Or something to that effect

And the MoD thing was a) in Millars Old Man Logan Future where Iceman died from being beheaded and Jubilee fought a blood lusted Wolverine for far longer than the rest of the X men. Suffice to say power levels in that future can hardly be compared to the main 616.

b) All we saw was his body amongst a pile of villains, no fight or anything. That barely counts as an appearance , yet alone a low showing...

Originally posted by Galan007
well if we are going to talk about potential, then firestorm has an infinite well of energy in which to draw from *shrug*


that's different. does FS have the ability to actually learn to utilize all that power, or is it just available to him? i thought he was limited by his humanity or something, had to pick and choose his abilities (sort of) so as not to overload himself (for lack of a better term.)

an omega is (theoretically) capable of evolving to the point where they are capable of using nearly infinite power. potentially. in theory. so they say . . .

wow. that's a very decisive post.

Originally posted by leonidas
that's different. does FS have the ability to actually learn to utilize all that power, or is it just available to him? i thought he was limited by his humanity or something, had to pick and choose his abilities (sort of) so as not to overload himself (for lack of a better term.) judging by the professor's statements/point of view, i think he was more concerned with jason losing his humanity, than anything else. i mean, both he and ronnie had essentially lost touch with the 'material world' when their powers began to grow, and the good professor didn't want jason to have to go through that.

Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
b) All we saw was his body amongst a pile of villains, no fight or anything. That barely counts as an appearance , yet alone a low showing...

Regardless, this event never takes place since Ben woke Clyde before he was suppose to have killed MM.

Originally posted by AlmightyKfish

Was the Iron Man tech thing when Tony wiped his identity from a bunch of villains minds? Or something to that effect
LOL! at the thought og Tony's tech doing anything to Owen.

Other than Iron Man's comic making a statement concerning this comedy,
there's no proof of any kind that that's an actual fact,
since this supposed "mind rape" never took place on panel,
has not been confirmed in any other issue,
and is not mentioned in Tony's or Owen's new 09' Handbook bios.
Originally posted by AlmightyKfish

And the MoD thing was a) in Millars Old Man Logan Future where Iceman died from being beheaded and Jubilee fought a blood lusted Wolverine for far longer than the rest of the X men. Suffice to say power levels in that future can hardly be compared to the main 616.

b) All we saw was his body amongst a pile of villains, no fight or anything. That barely counts as an appearance , yet alone a low showing...


In 616, Post-MM (Owen Reece)
was called one of the most powerful beings in the Omniverse
by the LT himself.

Owen was able to easily rip out the essence of Kosmos,
from an astronomical distance away,
when Owen battle the essence of Kosmos (Beyonder)
reality withIN realities across the Omniverse was warped,
literally stated to be from the "quatum to the trans-Multiversal"
incredible.

Owen even stated that "ripping Galaxies apart was easy stuff" ...

So, when I see a writer suggesting that Tony affected this beast in any way,
with his human tech, I gotta laugh,
it's not like this is Doom or Reed,
who get a pass with any exaggeration they display.

Always make excellent points good friend

Aron the Rogue Watcher beat Reece

Too many comics today for ole guy222

Reece wins this

Mr. M had the potential to be badass

Originally posted by Mr Master
LOL! at the thought og Tony's tech doing anything to Owen.

Other than Iron Man's comic making a statement concerning this comedy,
there's no proof of any kind that that's an actual fact,
since this supposed "mind rape" never took place on panel,
has not been confirmed in any other issue,
and is not mentioned in Tony's or Owen's new 09' Handbook bios. right. despite owen's name being specifically mentioned, and his character specifically shown, i guess tony was lying to us. afterall, it wasn't mentioned in more than one issue - thus, it must not be canonical.

none

I'm disappointed in you, Galan.

You should have learnt by now, that's just the way things roll.

Originally posted by Galan007
right. despite owen's name being specifically mentioned, and his character specifically shown, i guess tony was lying to us. afterall, it wasn't mentioned in more than one issue - thus, it must not be canonical.

none

Hey Galan, i have some snake oil that I guarantee will cure all that ails you.

Do you believe me?

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Hey Galan, i have some snake oil that I guarantee will cure all that ails you.

Do you believe me? no. apparently you'd have to say it at least one more time to make it true.

good god, what has this forum come to? facepalm

The notion that we are not to believe anything written in a comic if it isn't mentioned in more than one source is one of the most laughable things I have ever heard. It goes to show you the lengths some people will go to to try and "protect" their fav characters.

It doesn't help when what's said contradicts everything else that's been written about said character. Clinging to one small showing as proof that a character isn't as powerful as people say he is when the rest of his showings disagree is even more laughable.

Stop being sour grapes children.

Oh, and Galan, do you believe me now?

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33

It doesn't help when what's said contradicts everything else that's been written about said character. Clinging to one small showing as proof that a character isn't as powerful as people say he is when the rest of his showings disagree is even more laughable.


Precisely.

Yea, the LT stating that Owen is one of the most powerful beings in the Omniverse,
is not to be believed.

Yea, Owen separating the essense of a Cube being (actual showing not just bull shit talk)
from an astronomical distance,
is not to be believed.

Yea, the Time Variance Authority (Omniversal Timline repairing crew)
complaining about Owen because he rearranged reality withIN realities across the Omniverse
(again, actual showing not just bull shit talk)
is not to be believed.

But a single claim by Tony in his own book (with NO showing of any kind)
is what counts.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
It doesn't help when what's said contradicts everything else that's been written about said character. Clinging to one small showing as proof that a character isn't as powerful as people say he is when the rest of his showings disagree is even more laughable. can you show me proof of post retcon owen having some type of immunity to mind-related attacks? y'all seem to be focusing solely on his personal power, forgetting that he was picked apart mentally (via a cyberprogram) - and not in the area of raw power.

Originally posted by Galan007

can you show me proof of post retcon owen having some type of immunity to mind-related attacks? y'all seem to be focusing solely on his personal power,

forgetting that he was picked apart mentally (via a cyberprogram) - and not in the area of raw power.
Can you show me proof of post retcon Owen
getting picked apart by any cyberprogram of any kind?

Or is this claim based on that single verbal claim withIN the Iron Man book?

Even if it did happen, (although there's no on panel depiction of it happening)
we don't know the circumstances of how it happened,
or like ... why it happened.

For all we know Owen allowed that shit ... or even helped it along,
just like he allowed himself to be imprisoned
due to depression after losing his love Marsha.

Bottomline:

It makes no sense, that a being the LT claimed
was one of the most powerful in the Omniverse,
easily extracted the essence of Kosmos from a ridiculous distance away
& rearranged reality across the realities of the Omniverse,
can possibly fall victim to Tony's freakin tech.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Regardless, this event never takes place since Ben woke Clyde before he was suppose to have killed MM.

If that were the case, the MOD would have simply ceased to be. If that were the case, there would have been no need for Clyde and the MOD's final battle, because there would have been no MOD. Because that was certainly not the case, we can logically assume all things still happened as were displayed (inc. MOD's owning of MM.)

Originally posted by Mr Master
Can you show me proof of post retcon Owen
getting picked apart by any cyberprogram of any kind?

Or is this claim based on that single verbal claim withIN the Iron Man book?

Even if it did happen, (although there's no on panel depiction of it happening)
we don't know the circumstances of how it happened,
or like ... why it happened. IIRC, Tony used his cyber program to wipe the specific memory of his secret identity from all the villains who knew it (MM was clearly shown amongst them.) So IF we are for some reason assuming Owen allowed his mind to be tampered with, then we must also assume every one of the other villains allowed their minds to be tampered with. Though that notion may sound ridiculous, we have to be fair.... Right?

But I'm not arguing with your stance, because now I can forget darn near every low feat my character has, because most of them weren't shown or mentioned more than once. So.... Thanks!

Originally posted by Merlyn

But I'm not arguing with your stance, because now I can forget darn near every low feat my character has, because most of them weren't shown or mentioned more than once. So.... Thanks! We already ignore low feats if most other feats contradict it.

Originally posted by Mindset
We already ignore low feats if most other feats contradict it. And what specific MM-feat contradicts a cyber program's ability to wipe a certain memory from his mind? None that I can think of.

I mean, it's not like MM would have been prepared, or even aware, that it was happening. It just.... Happened. MM's raw power has absolutely nothing to do with Tony's tech being able to affect his MIND. Nothing at all.

Did it ever actually happen?

So Tony could affect most reality warpers with this tech?

Originally posted by Mindset
Did it ever actually happen?

So Tony could affect most reality warpers with this tech? Yes it happened. I can't remember the specific issue number, but it was posted in the IM respect thread. Tony designed a cyber program that had the sole purpose of infiltrating the minds of all the villains who knew his secret identity, then eradicating that memory from their minds entirely. And Molecule Man was among the villains specifically depicted/mentioned in that scene.

The raw power at his disposal wouldn't come into play where mind-related-attacks are concerned. Nothing he's done on panel suggests any kind of enhanced resistance to that sort of 'attack'. Multiversal power or not.

Originally posted by Merlyn


If that were the case, the MOD would have simply ceased to be. If that were the case, there would have been no need for Clyde and the MOD's final battle, because there would have been no MOD. Because that was certainly not the case, we can logically assume all things still happened as were displayed (inc. MOD's owning of MM.)

Uhhh what? We actually SEE Clyde get awakened BEFORE he was when he supposedly killed all those villains and discovered his taste for slaughter? Are you suggesting there are multiple Clydes and MoD's? He can from a universe outside the prime multiverse which means there's only one Clyde Wyncham.

Originally posted by Merlyn

IIRC, Tony used his cyber program to wipe the specific memory of his secret identity from all the villains who knew it (MM was clearly shown amongst them.) So IF we are for some reason assuming Owen allowed his mind to be tampered with, then we must also assume every one of the other villains allowed their minds to be tampered with. Though that notion may sound ridiculous, we have to be fair.... Right?
Let me know when any of the other villains shown
have warped reality
across the realities of the Omniverse.

And let me know when the LT states that any of them
are one of the most powerful beings in the Omniverse.

... then come back with that cyberyidiyadagoble.
Originally posted by Merlyn

But I'm not arguing with your stance, because now I can forget darn near every low feat my character has, because most of them weren't shown or mentioned more than once. So.... Thanks!
.. poor attempt at sarcasm.

Originally posted by Mindset

We already ignore low feats if most other feats contradict it.

Originally posted by Merlyn

Yes it happened. I can't remember the specific issue number, but it was posted in the IM respect thread. Tony designed a cyber program that had the sole purpose of infiltrating the minds of all the villains who knew his secret identity, then eradicating that memory from their minds entirely. And Molecule Man was among the villains specifically depicted/mentioned in that scene.
False.

All we see is Tony's claim,
and a cpu image of villains that include Owen.

It has never been depicted on panel,
anything even alluding to this being a fact,
other than a single verbal claim in that Iron Man issue.
Originally posted by Merlyn

The raw power at his disposal wouldn't come into play where mind-related-attacks are concerned. Nothing he's done on panel suggests any kind of enhanced resistance to that sort of 'attack'. Multiversal power or not.


I see you don't know much about Owen's history,
scans coming up.

And that's Omniversal power dude.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Uhhh what? We actually SEE Clyde get awakened BEFORE he was when he supposedly killed all those villains and discovered his taste for slaughter? Are you suggesting there are multiple Clydes and MoD's? He can from a universe outside the prime multiverse which means there's only one Clyde Wyncham. Obviously everything still happened as was portrayed. Otherwise, by your line of 'logic', Clyde being 'woken up' before he discovered his taste for death, would have changed things in such a way that the MoD would have ceased to exist... There would have never even been a MoD, in fact. This of course is/was not the case at all.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Let me know when any of the other villains shown
have warped reality
across the realities of the Omniverse.

And let me know when the LT states that any of them
are one of the most powerful beings in the Omniverse. Which of course refers solely to his raw power. NOT any kind of resistence to the type of 'attack' Tony used.

Originally posted by Mr Master
False.

All we see is Tony's claim,
and a cpu image of villains that include Owen.

It has never been depicted on panel,
anything even alluding to this being a fact,
other than a single verbal claim in that Iron Man issue. I challenge you to shown me one "false" statement I made.

But of course the depiction of Owen's image + Tony's claim must have been wrong. Obviously we can't take things like that seriously when they concern your favorite characters.

Get real.


Originally posted by Mr Master
I see you don't know much about Owen's history,
scans coming up.

And that's Omniversal power dude. Save 'em. ALL the scans you post would be from a F4 annual (#27, IIRC.) And anyone who's read that issue would know as much about post retcon Owen, as there is to know.

And once again, NOTHING in that issue pertains to Owen having ANY sort of resistence to the type of 'attack' Tony used to erase a memory from his mind. Not one thing.