Uchiha Sasuke

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Omnislash Kid
Now has Susanoo! We dont even know the full extent of Sasuke's mangekyou sharingan. Ok so I guess my point to this thread is how strong do you think Sasuke is going to now at this point.

Also, for those of you who feel like calling me a "Narutard" and saying Naruto fails just shut up. Out of all the gay anime out there you decide thay Naruto is the gayest and think it sucks even though you've only seen the chunnin exams (which did suck). Naruto is actually a very good anime and that especially applies to the Shippuudan series. I prefer to only watch the original Japanese sub and manga. So call me what you will but this only proves you ignorance.

For those of you who do like Naruto answer my question from above. I think the series is going to get even more awesome (how is that possible? Well it is because Bruce Lee allows it to be)

KingD19
When did he get Susanoo? And isn't that a little bit unfair?? I guess continued use will eventually rob him of all his Sharingan related powers, he'll still be an ass hat though.

Magee
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
even though you've only seen the chunnin exams (which did suck). The whole chunnin exams arc was one of the best. blink

Sasuke is weak. Susanoo drains your life force and using MS techniques makes you go blind, I mean blood coming out of your eye is never a good thing. He is nothing with out these life destroying techniques, all Raikage and co have to do is fall back and let Sasuke waste away inside Susanoo until he can no longer sustain it. The guy is a joke, hopefully he dies during this fight.

Omnislash Kid
He just got it in the current manga chapter. And eventually. I mean he'll have his sight for a few years. I mean Itachi like 5-6 years before he lost his eye sight but was still able to fight Sasuke and let him live. Plus, Sasuke can steel Kakashi's or Danzo's eyes (well eye from Kakashi). If he had Kakashi's eye and then that mixed with with his would be awesome. Plus, he could later steal Danzo's and then be even more badass since I think the 3 would mix. At that point he would also have EMS as well as having Kakashi's special ability and whatever Danzo has. I suppose he could gouge Madara's eyes out and then mix Madara's with his making him more powerful. Technically it should work.

King Kandy
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
He just got it in the current manga chapter. And eventually. I mean he'll have his sight for a few years. I mean Itachi like 5-6 years before he lost his eye sight but was still able to fight Sasuke and let him live. Plus, Sasuke can steel Kakashi's or Danzo's eyes (well eye from Kakashi). If he had Kakashi's eye and then that mixed with with his would be awesome. Plus, he could later steal Danzo's and then be even more badass since I think the 3 would mix. At that point he would also have EMS as well as having Kakashi's special ability and whatever Danzo has. I suppose he could gouge Madara's eyes out and then mix Madara's with his making him more powerful. Technically it should work.
Did you forget the part about the EMS having to come from your brother?

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by Magee
The whole chunnin exams arc was one of the best. blink

Sasuke is weak. Susanoo drains your life force and using MS techniques makes you go blind, I mean blood coming out of your eye is never a good thing. He is nothing with out these life destroying techniques, all Raikage and co have to do is fall back and let Sasuke waste away inside Susanoo until he can no longer sustain it. The guy is a joke, hopefully he dies during this fight. They night know about regular shaingan but how would they know about EMS or MS? Very few people in their clans history even know specifics of MS and only Madara knew about EMS until he told Sasuke (well Itachi and Madara's brother both knew about EMS but we all know that doesn't amount to much at this point now). I dont see how the Raikage or anybody else would know what Susanoo does to a full extent. Even if they did one his from Susanoo and it's internal genjutsu for them so I dont think Sasuke is just going to stand there and waste his chakra for nothing

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by King Kandy
Did you forget the part about the EMS having to come from your brother? Madara said that but who knows what would happen if he mixed his with somebody else's? I mean hell, it was only said the Uchiha could have MS but here we see Kakashi has his own version without having to kill his best friend. Also, how could Madara accurately say that since he's the only one in his clans history to ever have it? We dont know for sure you need your brother's eye for EMS

King Kandy
Itachi said it and so did Madara. Actually, Itachi said that MANY Uchiha throughout history had taken their brother's eyes to get EMS, so this is something that has been tried and tested...

Kakashi's mangekyou is different from the others in many, many ways and doesn't really apply to the discussions of them.

Omnislash Kid
Did Itachi say that? I dont remember him saying anybody else besides Madara ever had EMS. If they did dont you suppose they'd technically be alive? Where are they? Also, both Itachi and Madara said the Uchiha clan is gone except for the exception for Sasuke and Madara. I dont see how any other Uchiha could have EMS

KingD19
Actually, Itachi took it from his best friend, Madara took it from his brother.

Omnislash Kid
I know. Itachi didn't have EMS though and as far as we know Madara is the only one with EMS. Like I said, if there was another EMS user dont you think Madara or Itachi would have mentioned them. Also, the fact that they both said the clan was whipped out. So, since Madara is the only recorded member to have EMS who says that Sasuke cant steel either Donzou's or Kakashi's eyes? I mean hell, they were both implanted and Kakashi has MS. I mean he shouldn't have it in the first place so why cant Sasuke get EMS from Kakashi since Kakashi has MS? Even if he doesn't get EMS I'm sure his sharingan would become more powerful regardless. Also, when Itachi died what if somebody preserved Itachi's eyes for Sasuke? I mean their clan is full of secrets so I think it's a possibility that Sasuke can go and get Itachi's eyes

King Kandy
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
Did Itachi say that? I dont remember him saying anybody else besides Madara ever had EMS. If they did dont you suppose they'd technically be alive? Where are they? Also, both Itachi and Madara said the Uchiha clan is gone except for the exception for Sasuke and Madara. I dont see how any other Uchiha could have EMS
Apparently not all EMS creates immortality; usually it just creates undecaying eyes. I could look up the quote if you want but i'd rather not.

King Kandy
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
Also, when Itachi died what if somebody preserved Itachi's eyes for Sasuke? I mean their clan is full of secrets so I think it's a possibility that Sasuke can go and get Itachi's eyes
Madara asked him if he was going to do that, and Sasuke refused to.

Omnislash Kid
Sasuke also refused to get MS because he wanted to become strong without being like his brother. And yes I would like a quote. And why would Madara's EMS only be able to give him immortality? If you can explain otherwise please do because I dont recall any other member having EMS and if they did why is Madara the exception (please dont say because he was the clans leader because that would mean that since supposedly since the sharingan are the eyes of the Sage of the Six paths that would mean he must of had immortality and that he must still be alive since Madara's blood is just a watered down version of the Sage's as well as his eyes)

Endless Mike
Worst character ever

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by Endless Mike
Worst character ever Care to elaborate or do you just not like his hair?
lol

King Kandy
First off, here it's stated that it only works on clansmen... it also states that many have killed eachother for their eyes, but you'll probably want something more explicit...

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/386/09/

Here it's flat-out stated that tons of uchiha have killed eachother for EMS:

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/386/13/

As for why only Madara got immortality, there's nothing to say except that it is simply not known at the moment.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by King Kandy
First off, here it's stated that it only works on clansmen... it also states that many have killed eachother for their eyes, but you'll probably want something more explicit...

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/386/09/

Here it's flat-out stated that tons of uchiha have killed eachother for EMS:

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/386/13/

As for why only Madara got immortality, there's nothing to say except that it is simply not known at the moment. Ok so that MIGHT rule out Kakashi or Danzou however, it never said how many of them actually obtained EMS. Hell, if that was the case then it was a civil war inside the clan in which case everybody was killing everybody. True, it said that many sacrifices were made but it doesn't necessarily mean any of them successfully obtained EMS (though it is probable). Even still, Sasuke still has the potential of gaining EMS because both Danzou's and Kakashi's eyes are of his clansmen and since it isn't specified that EMS does or does not give immortality what is to say that Sasuke wont gain immortality?

King Kandy
Look, it's flat out said that it has to come from your brother... you cannot avoid this conclusion...

Meanwhile, obviously it works, or else nobody would have attempted it after it was proven not to do anything...

Omnislash Kid
But you just stated that it had to come from you brother while you also stated it can come from other clans men (which could be anyone inside the clan). Which is it? If it's your brother Itachi's body is bound to be somewhere (or at least his eyes). However, if it's clansmen in general Kakashi and Danzou still have the eyes which came from clansmen which would technically work since they were originally clansmens eyes just transplanted. I also believe it was said that only Uchiha could have MS and like I said earlier look at Kakashi. I mean that's one hell of an exception so if that's the case why wouldn't Sasuke be able to get EMS from Kakashi on top of his eye being Obito's? You're saying one thing and then saying another. So which is it? Clanmen who have to be brothers or just clansmen? I mean you did point them out and it said both so both technically and logically Sasuke could obtain EMS from steeling Kakashi's eyes.

KingD19
They will eventually explain why Kakashi has a Mangekyo, they'll also explain why his is so drastically different. They'll explain why Madara is immortal, and why he can phase, and teleport, and all that stuff, we just have to wait. Stop trying to use that as a basis for other things. The rules for the Sharingan are known.

1. Regular Sharingan varies in power from 1, to 3 dots, 3 being the most powerful.

2. Dots and designs of each Sharingan are different.

3. To get the Mangekyo, you must take someone's eyes, it's supposed to be brother, be Itachi took his best friends(who could be seen as a brother) That could've been the only exception besides Sasuke.

4. To get the Eternal Mangekyo, you must take your brother's eyes, otherwise you'll just have Mangekyo, and eventually go blind, probably losing all Sharingan related abilities in the process.

5. Sharingan eyes can be transplanted, but they will always be on, so they must be covered to conserve energy, because the drain is far larger on a non Uchiha.

I could keep going.

King Kandy
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
But you just stated that it had to come from you brother while you also stated it can come from other clans men (which could be anyone inside the clan). Which is it? If it's your brother Itachi's body is bound to be somewhere (or at least his eyes). However, if it's clansmen in general Kakashi and Danzou still have the eyes which came from clansmen which would technically work since they were originally clansmens eyes just transplanted. I also believe it was said that only Uchiha could have MS and like I said earlier look at Kakashi. I mean that's one hell of an exception so if that's the case why wouldn't Sasuke be able to get EMS from Kakashi on top of his eye being Obito's? You're saying one thing and then saying another. So which is it? Clanmen who have to be brothers or just clansmen? I mean you did point them out and it said both so both technically and logically Sasuke could obtain EMS from steeling Kakashi's eyes.
I am done with you. All you do is make completely unsupported speculation and ask for info that has not yet been revealed... there is no exact explanation for how EMS works, so stop asking me for one.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by KingD19
They will eventually explain why Kakashi has a Mangekyo, they'll also explain why his is so drastically different. Stop trying to use that as a basis for other things. The rules for the Sharingan are in black and white.

1. Regular Sharingan varies in power from 1, to 3 dots, 3 being the most powerful.

2. Dots and designs of each Sharingan are different.

3. To get the Mangekyo, you must take someone's eyes, it's supposed to be brother, be Itachi took his best friends(who could be seen as a brother) That could've been the only exception.

4. To get the Eternal Mangekyo, you must take your brother's eyes, otherwise you'll just have Mangekyo, and eventually go blind, probably losing all Sharingan related abilities in the process.

5. Sharingan eyes can be transplanted, but they will always be on, so they must be covered to conserve energy, because the drain is far larger on a non Uchiha.

I could keep going. I keep using Kakashi as an example because it's a valid point. Please, explain why Kakashi is different because his eye was transplanted just like everybody else's so why is it that he's the only exception? So basically what you're saying is that while some rules have to be applied other that are physical rules are only optional. Hell, if that's the case why not just have Kakashi develop his own version of EMS hmm? So while you're trying to prove me wrong I can trump it all by using as Kakashi as an example every time because it disproves everything you're saying about Sasuke not being able to obtain EMS. If that's the case why would they mention all of this EMS crap and Sasuke if Sasuke isn't going to learn it. Though I digress since this is not directly related to the argument. So yes I understand everything you're saying but you also have to realize that since Madara is the only one of the clan to hace been recorded of having EMS that anything stands at this point. Yes there was a conflict in the clan but how many of them got EMS? It said the Madara ruled over his clan which may have prevented anybody from obtaining EMS. The facts can only be proven by one person and that's Madara. Also, since only one person has been recorded to have it though it was stated that there was conflict in the clan that doesn't mean anybody else obtained it otherwise that would have been recorded to as well as other things. So, since Madara is the only known person as of now to have EMS how accurate can all these statements be? It only stated there was a conflict in the clan (not a direct quote). That doesn't necessarily mean anybody else obtained EMS. Although I wont disprove the fact that Madara can also possible be an exception but that also doesn't prove that the rest of the clan had EMS. You'd think that if that was the case it would have been a secret and that only a few people in the clans history even knows of MS let alone EMS (which was stated by Itachi. Since you want to make statements facts I guess the technically proves that Madara was the only one to ever have EMS huh?)

KingD19
You can't use him as an example until everything about him is revealed.... There could be a perfectly logical reason that nobody thought of as why Kakshi has a Mangekyo. Maybe because he took his best friends eye, and in doing so, fulfilled the arrangement that you had to take an eye of a brother/friend to get Mangekyo. Maybe it's something like that.

But until they fully explain everything about what we're talking about, using those as points and examples is like me saying, only Sakura could be as strong as Tsunade, because only Sakura was trained by her. Until we learned that the reason they're so strong is because they release chakra at the exact moment they hit something, it could have been anything.

Omnislash Kid
Well then that also means that Sasuke can gain EMS from Kakashi am I right? Also, the Uchiha clans details about EMS apparently has a lot of exceptions. Since this is the case why cant Sasuke get EMS from Kakashi? I mean after all Madara did state that he was another descendent from the Sage of the Six Path's just like Madara so if you're saying Madara was also an exception than that also means Sasuke is an exception like both Kakashi and Madara in which case that means he's capable of obtaining EMS through Kakashi's eyes

KingD19
You can't say that until it does happen, or it's fully explained.

Omnislash Kid
Well the Uchiha clan has many loop holes in it's rules with all the exceptions it has. Also, something similar will probably happen? Why else would they mention all of this and Sasuke being a descendant of the SotSP (Sage of the Six Path's)? Also, the main idea of this thread was to predict what is going to happen. I think you're just angry because you dug your own whole and I'm pretty sure I won the argument playing by your "rules". I digress though.

KingD19
I'm not angry about anything, that very well may happen, but what I'm trying to get you to understand...is that you can't just make blind insinuations by putting together random facts and hoping that you're right.

King Kandy
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
Well the Uchiha clan has many loop holes in it's rules with all the exceptions it has. Also, something similar will probably happen? Why else would they mention all of this and Sasuke being a descendant of the SotSP (Sage of the Six Path's)? Also, the main idea of this thread was to predict what is going to happen. I think you're just angry because you dug your own whole and I'm pretty sure I won the argument playing by your "rules". I digress though.
He's not a descendant of the sage (well maybe he is but it's never stated), he's a descendant of the sage's elder disciple.

Omnislash Kid
I was kidding about you being angry btw. Also, they weren't random facts, everything was based off of logic and the exceptions of the rules which you cant deny dont exist because Sasuke is going to be proof because of what Madara stated, Madara is proof already (or by you said anyways even thoug I still believe Madara is the only one to have EMS. Though even if I'm wrong this is the second option in which case I'm still right), and Kakashi is the 3rd proof of the exception in which case Sasuke will get EMS not only because of where the story is obviously headed but because he's stated by Madara to be the exception. So, I understood every bit of what you were saying believe it or not however, I dont believe you understood what I was saying and am currently saying since this is based of the whole argument which I believe you didn't understand based on what I was saying. Logically, that means that you dont understand any of this unless you did understand what I was saying in which case you would have to accept the fact that I am most probably correct about all of this

KingD19
I'm confused right now. confused

Omnislash Kid
haha that's ok. People tend to be confued when I speak (in this case type). Just re-read what I said and it'll become clear

dadudemon
Originally posted by King Kandy
He's not a descendant of the sage (well maybe he is but it's never stated), he's a descendant of the sage's elder disciple.


Son, I thought.





And, no, to get MS, not EMS, you kill your best friend or at least someone that you hold really dear to yourself.

To get EMS, you take your brother's eyes. (I'm not talking to you, KK.)

occultdestroyer
Sasgay

NemeBro
Originally posted by dadudemon
And, no, to get MS, not EMS, you kill your best friend or at least someone that you hold really dear to yourself.

To get EMS, you take your brother's eyes. (I'm not talking to you, KK.) Not true, to get the MS, someone close to you has to die, and the emotion from the loss awakens it, you do not have to kill them, that was a lie from Itachi.

dadudemon
Originally posted by NemeBro
Not true, to get the MS, someone close to you has to die, and the emotion from the loss awakens it, you do not have to kill them, that was a lie from Itachi.

K. But, my point still stands, sans killing being an aboslute requirement.


And, no, my post is still not fully correct, either.





I failed to say that you have to take your brother's eyes AFTER both have MS. We know that Itachi was lying and wasting his time by pretending to take Sasuke's eyes. Sasuke didn't even have MS at the time.



And, since Sasuke lost his Brother, that was enough to awaken MS for him......as well as Itachi giving his bro powers. This is my opinion and it wasn't stated. However, it isn't baseless.

King Kandy
Originally posted by dadudemon
Son, I thought.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/462/12/

It never explicitly said they were his sons (hence why I wasn't ruling it out entirely), but it doesn't deny it either. On one hand is says he "entrusted two boys with his power" making it sounds like they were just two guys he'd met and trusted, but I think the line about them being "born with ______" makes people think they're his kids. It's a gray area at this point imo.

yungz22
Originally posted by KingD19
They will eventually explain why Kakashi has a Mangekyo, they'll also explain why his is so drastically different. They'll explain why Madara is immortal, and why he can phase, and teleport, and all that stuff, we just have to wait. Stop trying to use that as a basis for other things. The rules for the Sharingan are known.

1. Regular Sharingan varies in power from 1, to 3 dots, 3 being the most powerful.

2. Dots and designs of each Sharingan are different.

3. To get the Mangekyo, you must take someone's eyes, it's supposed to be brother, be Itachi took his best friends(who could be seen as a brother) That could've been the only exception besides Sasuke.

4. To get the Eternal Mangekyo, you must take your brother's eyes, otherwise you'll just have Mangekyo, and eventually go blind, probably losing all Sharingan related abilities in the process.

5. Sharingan eyes can be transplanted, but they will always be on, so they must be covered to conserve energy, because the drain is far larger on a non Uchiha.

I could keep going.

Actually the known way for an uchiha to get mangekyou is to kill your best freind not take someones eyes.

King Kandy
Originally posted by yungz22
Actually the known way for an uchiha to get mangekyou is to kill your best freind not take someones eyes.
We're talking about the way to get the Eternal Mangekyo, not the regular kind.

NemeBro
Not to mention you do not have to kill them anyway.

Kento
Originally posted by King Kandy
First off, here it's stated that it only works on clansmen... it also states that many have killed eachother for their eyes, but you'll probably want something more explicit...

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/386/09/

Here it's flat-out stated that tons of uchiha have killed eachother for EMS:

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/386/13/

As for why only Madara got immortality, there's nothing to say except that it is simply not known at the moment. You know..if Madara, and his brother were the first to awaken MS, and they were probably in there teens at the time, you have to wonder how the Uchiha Clan wasn't extremely small in the ten years before merging with Konoha, and how that in the 60 years of Konoha only Itachi ever had MS when a lot of Uchiha's were getting it.

King Kandy
Since when was it said that Itachi was the only one to get mangekyo since Madara did?

XanatosForever
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
Also, for those of you who feel like calling me a "Narutard" and saying Naruto fails just shut up. Out of all the gay anime out there you decide thay Naruto is the gayest and think it sucks even though you've only seen the chunnin exams (which did suck). Naruto is actually a very good anime and that especially applies to the Shippuudan series. I prefer to only watch the original Japanese sub and manga. So call me what you will but this only proves you ignorance.

For those of you who do like Naruto answer my question from above. I think the series is going to get even more awesome (how is that possible? Well it is because Bruce Lee allows it to be)

Actually, this is precisely why I follow the manga. I am well aware of the goings on in the Narutardverse, and the implications of Sasuke having attained Susano'o. That does not change the fact that you are a Narutard, and the series does fail. So congratulations, you have just achieved a massive fail. smile

As for the question, I really think Sasuke is at this point is made of nothing but PIS.

King Kandy
He is very boring. Every fight lately he has used nothing but MS. He barely even uses chidori anymore.

Nemesis X
Is this really a respect thread and if it is, are we actually now allowed to make those in the anime/manga forum?

King Kandy
It's not a respect thread. It's just a discussion on the character.

Kento
Originally posted by King Kandy
Since when was it said that Itachi was the only one to get mangekyo since Madara did? Itachi isn't the only one since Madara, and his brother..but he was the only one in Konoha to have it. Which means somewhere between the 20-30 years since Madara was born what happened to all of them? Madara claims he was the first..or was that Itachi?..anyway and then 20 years later after he does it at the most Uchiha and Senju join together. Itachi claims people were getting EMS and MS for however long he said. If it was such a common thing amongst the Uchiha, and apparently all MS techniques are the same besides Kakashi, you would think they'd be a lot more knowledge inside Konoha about them and Kakashi and Jiriaya wouldn have known what Tsukiyomi or Amaterasu was despite never seeing them.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by King Kandy
He is very boring. Every fight lately he has used nothing but MS. He barely even uses chidori anymore.

Can you blame the dude? He's been put up against some major players lately. Two of which made most of his Raiton techniques obsolete (one even made Chidori seem pathetic)

He makes use of Chidori here and there though. If that fails, he'll start spamming MS techniques.
He should use Kirin to take out the 4 opponents he's up against right now. Given that his Susano'o seems to be nearly complete, he can prepare the technique. But he might risk getting his team in the blast as well.

NemeBro
Taking the time to prep for Kirin when against so many high-profile opponents would be impractical.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by NemeBro
Taking the time to prep for Kirin when against so many high-profile opponents would be impractical.

If Susano'o does really provides him with a defense that is greater than Gaara's, he has all the time he needs erm. Provided he doesn't go on the offense with Susano'o of course.

King Kandy
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Can you blame the dude? He's been put up against some major players lately. Two of which made most of his Raiton techniques obsolete (one even made Chidori seem pathetic)

He makes use of Chidori here and there though. If that fails, he'll start spamming MS techniques.
He should use Kirin to take out the 4 opponents he's up against right now. Given that his Susano'o seems to be nearly complete, he can prepare the technique. But he might risk getting his team in the blast as well.
Kirin? Does Susanoo allow him the mobility needed for that technique (remember you need to get above your opponent.)?

NemeBro
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
If Susano'o does really provides him with a defense that is greater than Gaara's, he has all the time he needs erm. Provided he doesn't go on the offense with Susano'o of course. We have already seen Susano'o's shield can be damaged.

Ms.Marvel
Originally posted by King Kandy
Kirin? Does Susanoo allow him the mobility needed for that technique (remember you need to get above your opponent.)?

not too mention you need the whole specific weather and conditions thing.

Kento
Does Sasuke's Susano'o even have the shield that made it such a superb defense?

King Kandy
Originally posted by NemeBro
We have already seen Susano'o's shield can be damaged.
When has the shield ever been damaged? I don't think it has.

NemeBro
I'm pretty sure the Raikage just kinda did that. no expression

It's ribs were cracking from his powerbomb.

Edit: Just checked, actually, a few of them snapped.

EvilAngel
Originally posted by XanatosForever
Actually, this is precisely why I follow the manga. I am well aware of the goings on in the Narutardverse, and the implications of Sasuke having attained Susano'o. That does not change the fact that you are a Narutard, and the series does fail. So congratulations, you have just achieved a massive fail. smile

As for the question, I really think Sasuke is at this point is made of nothing but PIS.

Eh, Naruto does fail. But then every anime out there has atleast a few things wrong with it. When i think about it like that it;s not so much of a fail from my perspective.

Far be it from me to lie though and say allot of the crap doesn't hurt the feeling to the whole series. Just that it's not like Naruto is any much worse than any other anime.



Sasuke Uchiha...... I like him.

NemeBro
It's worse than One Piece. estahuh

Kento
Originally posted by NemeBro
I'm pretty sure the Raikage just kinda did that. no expression

It's ribs were cracking from his powerbomb.

Edit: Just checked, actually, a few of them snapped. He broke the ribs of an incomplete Susanoo, he never broke the shield that was shown being carried by Itachi's full Susanoo.

King Kandy
Originally posted by NemeBro
I'm pretty sure the Raikage just kinda did that. no expression

It's ribs were cracking from his powerbomb.

Edit: Just checked, actually, a few of them snapped.
Ribs=/=Shield

The shield is called Yata's Shield and is said to reflect any attack. So far, Sasuke has never manifested it.

dadudemon
Originally posted by EvilAngel
Eh, Naruto does fail. But then every anime out there has atleast a few things wrong with it. When i think about it like that it;s not so much of a fail from my perspective.

Far be it from me to lie though and say allot of the crap doesn't hurt the feeling to the whole series. Just that it's not like Naruto is any much worse than any other anime.



Sasuke Uchiha...... I like him.

Cool.

Nice choice on Avatar and Sig. big grin thumb up

EvilAngel
Originally posted by dadudemon
Cool.

Nice choice on Avatar and Sig. big grin thumb up

Thank you. Same to you too =)

I especially like your Signature =) It's definately got my approval!


Originally posted by NemeBro
It's worse than One Piece. estahuh

You mean the series where rubber is immune to lightning no matter it's power. Oh yeah, that's MUCH better ;p

NemeBro
Originally posted by King Kandy
Ribs=/=Shield

The shield is called Yata's Shield and is said to reflect any attack. So far, Sasuke has never manifested it. Aw shiznit.

Thinking back, you are right, I completely forgot about Yata's Shield.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by King Kandy
Kirin? Does Susanoo allow him the mobility needed for that technique (remember you need to get above your opponent.)?

I believe Itachi moved around a little with it, though I may be wrong. If Susano'o forms around the user, then there's a pretty high chance that it can move.

Having it rooted to one spot would only make it a defensive wall as he cannot attack his opponents properly (this is only if he doesn't have the Sword of Totsuka). Considering it takes quite a toll on the user, it wouldn't be the wisest jutsu to use if Sasuke wants to end the fight; provided he doesn't have the Sword.

Originally posted by Kento
Does Sasuke's Susano'o even have the shield that made it such a superb defense?
No idea. Even without it, it still has good defensive capabilities. Sasuke may have the shield as he stated that his defense was better than Gaara's. On the other hand, that statement could be a testament to Susano'o's defense if he doesn't have the shield; again, could be. He may very well be engaging in hyperbole for all we know.

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
not too mention you need the whole specific weather and conditions thing.
Gouryuka no jutsu and Amaterasu; he has both to aid him in making the storm conditions.

Originally posted by NemeBro
We have already seen Susano'o's shield can be damaged.

Just the body afaik. We haven't seen the actual shield get broken.
It also takes some serious power and blunt force (I believe) to break them. Gaara's the only one of the four who can deal that kind of damage with one of his crushing moves.

Temari deals cutting damage, while Kankuro, well not too sure if he can break it with his puppets. We haven't really seen what Darui (? - The dark-skinned dude) can do either. I doubt he can deal the amount of blunt force that the Raikage or Gaara can. Afaik, Susano'o's ribs haven't been sliced through.

If Susano'o can move with Sasuke, Gaara would have a hard time covering Susano'o with his sand. He'd also need more sand (though I don't think that is a factor). Meh, Sasuke has a shot of forming Kirin if he plays it right.

Ms.Marvel
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Gouryuka no jutsu and Amaterasu; he has both to aid him in making the storm conditions.

yeah but in a completely different environment. no reason to think hed be able to do the same in weather so cold that its snowing heavily since it requires heating up the air.

NemeBro
Originally posted by EvilAngel
You mean the series where rubber is immune to lightning no matter it's power. Oh yeah, that's MUCH better ;p Better than the series where an omnicidal maniac gets redeemed through the retardedly optimistic words of a teenager. 131

Bastard!! is possibly the best manga I have ever read though. There are virtually no flaws.

King Kandy
Originally posted by NemeBro
Better than the series where an omnicidal maniac gets redeemed through the retardedly optimistic words of a teenager. 131

To be fair that was probably the worst part of the entire series. It seriously made me consider quitting, but the manga got much better immediately after that.

NemeBro
Raikage is quite possibly the only reason I still even somewhat like it, he and his bro.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
yeah but in a completely different environment. no reason to think hed be able to do the same in weather so cold that its snowing heavily since it requires heating up the air.

Lightning can occur when snow falls (just as a heads-up, it's got no bearing on this discussion). The amount of snowfall isn't dependent on the temperature afaik.

The last time he used Goryuka no Jutsu, he had very little to no chakra left.
Considering he still has a lot of chakra left (he's using Susano'o and looks like he can still fight for some time), it's reasonable to think that he can use more Goryuka's this time for greater effect.

King Kandy
Originally posted by NemeBro
Raikage is quite possibly the only reason I still even somewhat like it, he and his bro.
They're pretty cool. I'm finding Danzo an interesting character too. Pain didn't really get awful until he and Naruto started to make speeches, either. And I can't deny that the action in the series is top notch, and much more creative than a lot of manga.

Kento
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Lightning can occur when snow falls (just as a heads-up, it's got no bearing on this discussion). The amount of snowfall isn't dependent on the temperature afaik.

The last time he used Goryuka no Jutsu, he had very little to no chakra left.
Considering he still has a lot of chakra left (he's using Susano'o and looks like he can still fight for some time), it's reasonable to think that he can use more Goryuka's this time for greater effect. You wouldn't think he has much chakra left. Sharingan genjutsu, Amaterasu, being beaten, and now Susanoo. But then again this is Sasuke.

King Kandy
Originally posted by Kento
You wouldn't think he has much chakra left. Sharingan genjutsu, Amaterasu, being beaten, and now Susanoo. But then again this is Sasuke.
He was "out of chakra" against Deidara and still pulled a bunch of jutsu out of his ass.

Kento
Originally posted by King Kandy
He was "out of chakra" against Deidara and still pulled a bunch of jutsu out of his ass. laughing Yea hence the 'Then again this is Sasuke' part. I mean Susanoo is suppose to be draining his life, and he's spamming techniques more than Itachi could, and he's like 'My eye is bleeding, and I can only open one but hey I have this cool black thing that means I'm unable to be hit so I'll win cause I have no chakra and I can pull off big moves now'

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by Kento
laughing Yea hence the 'Then again this is Sasuke' part. I mean Susanoo is suppose to be draining his life, and he's spamming techniques more than Itachi could, and he's like 'My eye is bleeding, and I can only open one but hey I have this cool black thing that means I'm unable to be hit so I'll win cause I have no chakra and I can pull off big moves now'

Haha
I've noticed that as well

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by Kento
You wouldn't think he has much chakra left. Sharingan genjutsu, Amaterasu, being beaten, and now Susanoo. But then again this is Sasuke.

He's probably going to lose chakra quickly anyway, now that he has Susano'o out. His Amaterasu wasn't particularly impressive in terms of how much flame he brought out.

This is the guy who's pulling off around 6-8 chidori-esque moves in a single fight. His chakra level has obviously increased, but I agree with you, he shouldn't be able to pull off those many jutsus consecutively, much less MS ones.

The only reason I said he still has a lot of chakra is because he had Susano'o out for some time, then he forms a better version, and he still seems to be alright for the most part (bleeding-eye aside).

~ How the heck does his hair stay in that shape after all that? He probably uses chakra to keep it like that laughing

NemeBro
Originally posted by King Kandy
They're pretty cool. I'm finding Danzo an interesting character too. Pain didn't really get awful until he and Naruto started to make speeches, either. And I can't deny that the action in the series is top notch, and much more creative than a lot of manga. Forgot about Danzo, and yes, I do like him. I like Madara too honestly.

Meh, I've seen better, though it's alright, Sasuke is a bore though.

EvilAngel
Originally posted by NemeBro
Better than the series where an omnicidal maniac gets redeemed through the retardedly optimistic words of a teenager. 131

Bastard!! is possibly the best manga I have ever read though. There are virtually no flaws.


Redeemed?

I don't think so, and i don't believe he thought it would either. However, he was placing his faith in the path Naruto would walk. Beleiving it to be the path his old best friend, who is in essence why he was on the path he himself was waling anyway, would have wanted.

Plus it's been known through the entire series Naruto has a passive Change mind-no jutsu, so it's not like it was all THAT surprising

NemeBro
Originally posted by EvilAngel
Redeemed?

I don't think so, and i don't believe he thought it would either. However, he was placing his faith in the path Naruto would walk. Beleiving it to be the path his old best friend, who is in essence why he was on the path he himself was waling anyway, would have wanted.

Plus it's been known through the entire series Naruto has a passive Change mind-no jutsu, so it's not like it was all THAT surprising Pain was a maniac who was willing to kill millions of people for his clearly warped definition of peace, yet I am supposed to believe that a kid, who was failing to ever convince Pain with his poor reasoning of why he should follow Jiraiya's little "dream," is able to convince this delusional maniac to go against what he has spent years believing, with The Gutsy Ninja book?

Dude naw.

This is why I like the Raikage, because he didn't just listen to Naruto's retardedly optimistic bullcrap, and told him to grow a pair.

By this point in the manga, if Sasuke doesn't die before it ends, Kishimoto is dead to me.

EvilAngel
Originally posted by NemeBro
Pain was a maniac who was willing to kill millions of people for his clearly warped definition of peace, yet I am supposed to believe that a kid, who was failing to ever convince Pain with his poor reasoning of why he should follow Jiraiya's little "dream," is able to convince this delusional maniac to go against what he has spent years believing, with The Gutsy Ninja book?

Dude naw.

This is why I like the Raikage, because he didn't just listen to Naruto's retardedly optimistic bullcrap, and told him to grow a pair.

By this point in the manga, if Sasuke doesn't die before it ends, Kishimoto is dead to me.

I think you're under estimating how easily people can be convinced. But at any rate i don't think you're taking everything into account here.


First of all, the whole concept of peace was something he asked Jiriaya a long time ago. And from the answer Jiraiya gave are the foundations of what he sought to do to achieve peace. When the blonde kid (forgot his name) died his path to achieve it become ..... disturbed.

After meeting Naruto who broke out of the Kyuubi's power through force of will power, he was impressed. Also that Naruto didn't kill him, which if you consider, is kind of a big deal after everything pain did. After hearing the Naruto is on the same path he had been on, and realises Naruto is so much more determined than he his, realising he's severely wounded anyway, he put the last of his faith in Naruto. Or something liek that.


Raikage is a wannabe badass. he's just a moody shit if you ask me.

Quincy
You guys can tear up the story and rag on Kishi and all that but just face it - you're straight up fans of this manga. And will keep reading it until the end.

NemeBro
Originally posted by EvilAngel
I think you're under estimating how easily people can be convinced. But at any rate i don't think you're taking everything into account here.


First of all, the whole concept of peace was something he asked Jiriaya a long time ago. And from the answer Jiraiya gave are the foundations of what he sought to do to achieve peace. When the blonde kid (forgot his name) died his path to achieve it become ..... disturbed.

After meeting Naruto who broke out of the Kyuubi's power through force of will power, he was impressed. Also that Naruto didn't kill him, which if you consider, is kind of a big deal after everything pain did. After hearing the Naruto is on the same path he had been on, and realises Naruto is so much more determined than he his, realising he's severely wounded anyway, he put the last of his faith in Naruto. Or something liek that.


Raikage is a wannabe badass. he's just a moody shit if you ask me. Pain was a delusional extremist, saying he should be easy to convince would be similar to saying Hitler for instance could have been easily convinced.


He asked Jiraiya when he was but a child, still innocent. Pain was not born a mass murderer, he became one based on a warped idealogy which he clung to for years after developing it, and murdered many to achieve it.

A single boy with will is able to convince said genocidal maniac to go against an idealogy he created years ago, one which has only been continually strengthened? Although I will buy the severely wounded and putting his faith in Naruto anyway, never thought of that. But regardless, Naruto is retardedly optimistic.

Um, what? He cut off his arm without so much as batting an eye, and this was after it was on fire from Amaterasu. He is not a wannabe badass, he IS a badass. As for him being a moody shit...You're a Sasuke fan. no expression Sasuke wants to kill everyone in Konoha for something three people were responsible for, Sasuke has been moody since the beginning of the series. Raikage is "moody," because for all he knows his younger brother is dead, of course he is going to have a short fuse.

EvilAngel
Originally posted by NemeBro
Pain was a delusional extremist, saying he should be easy to convince would be similar to saying Hitler for instance could have been easily convinced.


He asked Jiraiya when he was but a child, still innocent. Pain was not born a mass murderer, he became one based on a warped idealogy which he clung to for years after developing it, and murdered many to achieve it.

A single boy with will is able to convince said genocidal maniac to go against an idealogy he created years ago, one which has only been continually strengthened? Although I will buy the severely wounded and putting his faith in Naruto anyway, never thought of that. But regardless, Naruto is retardedly optimistic.

Um, what? He cut off his arm without so much as batting an eye, and this was after it was on fire from Amaterasu. He is not a wannabe badass, he IS a badass. As for him being a moody shit...You're a Sasuke fan. no expression Sasuke wants to kill everyone in Konoha for something three people were responsible for, Sasuke has been moody since the beginning of the series. Raikage is "moody," because for all he knows his younger brother is dead, of course he is going to have a short fuse.

Well guess you have your way of seeing it and i have mine. I'm not syaing it makes sense, but i think it makes allot more sense than how much it seems to make to you, if that makes sense at all as a sentence.

IMO ever since Yahiko (was that his name?) died Nagato was unsure of what he should do and instead took the only path he knew that was left. One carved through fear, the fear he knew when he was a child. So when Naruto came and offered a solution where no one died, and no one lived in fear, he felt sure that is what his friend would have done. As i say; or something like that.


Sasuke doesn't punch holes in tables because an arguement isn't gonig his way....

Sasuke's just.... traumatized, i mean, Itachi used the MS on him showing his whole family being butchered over and over for 72 hours when he was 5 ;p To find out Itachi did that on orders etc.... yeah i can't say i think anyone should be surprised ;p

King Kandy
The thing was, Sasuke was actually pretty decent for most of part one, he cared about his teammates, he seemed intelligent, I could see why he was popular... then after he started realizing Naruto was getting stronger than him he got all retarded and since then has done nothing but select retarded vendettas to fight for, when the whole thing should have gotten cleared up after Itachi died, or MAYBE going after Danzo next. But no, he immediately jumps to "I must DESTROY Konoha!"

dadudemon
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
~ How the heck does his hair stay in that shape after all that? He probably uses chakra to keep it like that laughing

laughing laughing laughing


He uses an AWESOME hair gel. big grin

Originally posted by EvilAngel
Plus it's been known through the entire series Naruto has a passive Change mind-no jutsu, so it's not like it was all THAT surprising

Yup. This is correct. I called it before their fight even started, in the Naruto thread. So did a few other people. It wasn't a shock and was almost fully expected to happen.

Originally posted by EvilAngel
I think you're under estimating how easily people can be convinced. But at any rate i don't think you're taking everything into account here.


First of all, the whole concept of peace was something he asked Jiriaya a long time ago. And from the answer Jiraiya gave are the foundations of what he sought to do to achieve peace. When the blonde kid (forgot his name) died his path to achieve it become ..... disturbed.

After meeting Naruto who broke out of the Kyuubi's power through force of will power, he was impressed. Also that Naruto didn't kill him, which if you consider, is kind of a big deal after everything pain did. After hearing the Naruto is on the same path he had been on, and realises Naruto is so much more determined than he his, realising he's severely wounded anyway, he put the last of his faith in Naruto. Or something liek that.


Raikage is a wannabe badass. he's just a moody shit if you ask me.

You're awesome. And if you're gender is female, that's...just.....awesome. As you probably know, this is a forum heavily dominated by males. And ladies rarely actually make an effort to debate as well as you just did. (I don't really know why, that's just the way it is on forums.)






Originally posted by Quincy
You guys can tear up the story and rag on Kishi and all that but just face it - you're straight up fans of this manga. And will keep reading it until the end.

You're correct. I tend to disregard people when they post many posts about each chapter, and then say they don't like it or that they are going to stop reading it. Yeah right. You guys love it and you know it. no expression

NemeBro
I have never said I was going to stop reading it, for the record.

But I'm not afraid to point out its flaws, Naruto "convincing" Pain, was just not believable, at least not the way it was written.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by NemeBro
I have never said I was going to stop reading it, for the record.

But I'm not afraid to point out its flaws, Naruto "convincing" Pain, was just not believable, at least not the way it was written.

Agreed. I wanted Naruto to be forced to kill him

NemeBro
Originally posted by EvilAngel
Well guess you have your way of seeing it and i have mine. I'm not syaing it makes sense, but i think it makes allot more sense than how much it seems to make to you, if that makes sense at all as a sentence.

IMO ever since Yahiko (was that his name?) died Nagato was unsure of what he should do and instead took the only path he knew that was left. One carved through fear, the fear he knew when he was a child. So when Naruto came and offered a solution where no one died, and no one lived in fear, he felt sure that is what his friend would have done. As i say; or something like that.


Sasuke doesn't punch holes in tables because an arguement isn't gonig his way....

Sasuke's just.... traumatized, i mean, Itachi used the MS on him showing his whole family being butchered over and over for 72 hours when he was 5 ;p To find out Itachi did that on orders etc.... yeah i can't say i think anyone should be surprised ;p I see what you mean, but I disagree, personally.

That may have been how it was at first, sure, but after like, what? Ten, twenty years or so, his mind was made up, his ideals were concrete. I do not think I worded my opinion on the event as well as I could have. My problem is HOW he was convinced, not that he was convinced.

He punched a hole in a table because they were wasting time with their political crap while his brother was missing...

Should I be surprised he wants to kill Danzo and the Elders? Of course not. But to butcher all of Konoha in some wangsty rampage of misguided revenge, which is only dragging everything his brother worked for through the mud? Dude naw.

Omnislash Kid
Well I personally dont like Raikage either. I mean I understand if he was angry but he's supposed to be a kage, that means keeping your cool even under these circumstances. I think he's just a hot head and doesn't deserve the title of Raikage. Also, it's like he was forcing Konoha to give him information on Sasuke otherwise he would start a war with Konoha (which I wouldn't doubt if he did)

dadudemon
Originally posted by NemeBro
Should I be surprised he wants to kill Danzo and the Elders? Of course not. But to butcher all of Konoha in some wangsty rampage of misguided revenge, which is only dragging everything his brother worked for through the mud? Dude naw.

I could have sworn Sasuke was just going after the elders, and not the whole village? To me, that's logical.


Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
Well I personally dont like Raikage either. I mean I understand if he was angry but he's supposed to be a kage, that means keeping your cool even under these circumstances. I think he's just a hot head and doesn't deserve the title of Raikage. Also, it's like he was forcing Konoha to give him information on Sasuke otherwise he would start a war with Konoha (which I wouldn't doubt if he did)

Well, a "kage", as far as I'm aware, is supposed to be the one best able to protect the village with a side of political clout. Meaning, first the ability to protect the village the best, and the other stuff is secondary.

That's what I thought it was supposed to be, at least. If that's the case, then that's what the Raikage does best. And, if you're not an idiot and work well with the Raikage, he appears to be logical. If Konoha would have killed Sasuke as soon as he went missing, Raikage would have respected that. That's what the villages are SUPPOSED to do.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by dadudemon
I could have sworn Sasuke was just going after the elders, and not the whole village? To me, that's logical.




Well, a "kage", as far as I'm aware, is supposed to be the one best able to protect the village with a side of political clout. Meaning, first the ability to protect the village the best, and the other stuff is secondary.

That's what I thought it was supposed to be, at least. If that's the case, then that's what the Raikage does best. And, if you're not an idiot and work well with the Raikage, he appears to be logical. If Konoha would have killed Sasuke as soon as he went missing, Raikage would have respected that. That's what the villages are SUPPOSED to do.
I know that they're supposed to protect the village but when the 3rd hokage died they were considering Hatake Kakashi. I know he's strong but he's nowhere near kage level (though maybe if he trained more I could see him being that strong)
And hell, they have Danzo as hokage now. I mean I dont doubt that he's strong but how strong is he really? I think he's probably going to be the weakest of all the hokage. Also, I dont agree with the fact that protecting comes before everything else. as being Kage. The Kage deal with financial issues as well and if they didn't do that then the village would be in poverty. I know you can say "well other people can deal with that work" but considering that other village ninja can also protect the village. It's not solely the kages responsibility but also the responsibility of all the village ninja. So, the two issues are as important. I mean that like only elected a President of a country based on his military knowledge. If that's the case that means anybody could become President.
Dont get me wrong, Raikage is very strong but I dont think he's cut out to be kage (especially if he needs other people to be nice to him to make logical decisions. I mean that's what this whole meeting is about right? Making good decisions in the form of uniting all the villages. Physical strength has nothing to do with good decision making)

NemeBro
Originally posted by dadudemon
I could have sworn Sasuke was just going after the elders, and not the whole village? To me, that's logical.




Well, a "kage", as far as I'm aware, is supposed to be the one best able to protect the village with a side of political clout. Meaning, first the ability to protect the village the best, and the other stuff is secondary.

That's what I thought it was supposed to be, at least. If that's the case, then that's what the Raikage does best. And, if you're not an idiot and work well with the Raikage, he appears to be logical. If Konoha would have killed Sasuke as soon as he went missing, Raikage would have respected that. That's what the villages are SUPPOSED to do. 1. His plans are to destroy all of Konoha, unless that changed and I forgot.



2. Holy shit you and I actually agree!? no expression

Indeed, Naruto is butthurt about how after nearly three years Konoha has labeled Sasuke a missing-nin to be executed...When that is what should have happened to start with.

Raikage is the strongest fighter in his country (Along with his bro), that is the main qualification for being a Kage, power to defend your village.

Ms.Marvel
Originally posted by NemeBro
1. His plans are to destroy all of Konoha, unless that changed and I forgot.

he told his team that he was only going to kill the elders, then later told tobi that he was going to kill everyone and only said he would kill only the elders to keep his team calm or something like that.

NemeBro
Ah, thanks for that.

Helps my point, going on a wangsty rampage.

dadudemon

Ms.Marvel
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/416/14/

there we go!

dadudemon
Originally posted by NemeBro
1. His plans are to destroy all of Konoha, unless that changed and I forgot.

Yeah, something like that. He said both, but I think he said something about all of konha?


Scans, por favor.

Edit - Cool, thanks Ms. Marvel.


Originally posted by NemeBro
2. Holy shit you and I actually agree!? no expression

Indeed, Naruto is butthurt about how after nearly three years Konoha has labeled Sasuke a missing-nin to be executed...When that is what should have happened to start with.

Raikage is the strongest fighter in his country (Along with his bro), that is the main qualification for being a Kage, power to defend your village.


Nah, we agree on lots of things.

Jiraiya was probably the strongest, which is why he was chosen first.


I would rank him in the top 5 ninjas.

Here's my ranking:

1. Pain.

2. Madara.

3. Jiraiya.

4. Raikage.

5. Itachi.

6. Killer Bee.

7. Sasuke.

8. Naruto.

You can move Naruto higher because he killed Hanzo and the three Sanin, together, could not. Naruto also got further against Pain's bodies than Jiraiya. Naruto also was "the first to overcome" that body control technique against pain while standing right next to him.

Raikage would be toast against someone like Itachi, if Itachi was going all out and was healthy. Killer Bee as well.

Madara should get his butt handed to him by Pain. All Pain has to do is control Madara's body. Can Madara super amp himself up into a Raikage or Sage mode type of state? I don't think so. I would say, with ease, that the Raikage can amp his strength high enough to resist Pain's body control technique, as well. Agreed?


Sasuke is above Naruto for practical reasons. However, no matter what, any subsequent fight of Naruto versus Sasuke will end up with Naruto winning. Go figure. The rasenshuriken has more cutting power than any technique in all of Naruto. It was cutting off several mountain peaks with no sign of slowing down before Naruto "fully" perfected it. I'd say, without a problem, that the Rasenshuriken could cut right through the Raikage, even though wind is weak against lightening.


Edit - My list is VERY debatable.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by dadudemon
laughing laughing laughing


He uses an AWESOME hair gel. big grin

DBZ-style gel no? Srsly, anime characters manage to keep the same hair-style for a lot of time. I think Bulma's hair changing made fun of that fact.


Originally posted by dadudemon
Yup. This is correct. I called it before their fight even started, in the Naruto thread. So did a few other people. It wasn't a shock and was almost fully expected to happen.

It's his strongest ability, kinda stupid, but you gotta admire the determination of the dude.

Originally posted by dadudemon
You're awesome. And if you're gender is female, that's...just.....awesome. As you probably know, this is a forum heavily dominated by males. And ladies rarely actually make an effort to debate as well as you just did. (I don't really know why, that's just the way it is on forums.)

Don't you have a wife stick out tongue?

Originally posted by dadudemon
Yeah, something like that. He said both, but I think he said something about all of konha?

He could have known that Madara wanted to take out Konoha, so he could have deliberately lied to Madara to make Madara think that Sasuke was being manipulated by him. At least, I hope that is the case. Going after the innocent is pathetic, especially considering Sasuke wouldn't harm the innocent at one point.

Originally posted by dadudemon
You can move Naruto higher because he killed Hanzo and the three Sanin, together, could not. Naruto also got further against Pain's bodies than Jiraiya. Naruto also was "the first to overcome" that body control technique against pain while standing right next to him.

Naruto killed Hanzo? I thought Nagato did that.

Without the transformation into the 8-tails, KB is below current Sasuke (even though he spams techniques) imo.

He was the first to pwn Sasuke twice or thrice, so he's MOAR kick-ass than his brother.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Raikage would be toast against someone like Itachi, if Itachi was going all out and was healthy. Killer Bee as well.

Why'd you put Raikage above Itachi then >__>?

Jiraiya could lose against an all-out+healthy Itachi as well. Itachi was perhaps weak when he came back to Konoha. Also, he never wanted to engage in a confrontation, he came back for Sasuke's safety. Finally, Itachi wouldn't truly fight someone so 'patriotic' towards the Leaf village, unless he were pissed.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Madara should get his butt handed to him by Pain. All Pain has to do is control Madara's body. Can Madara super amp himself up into a Raikage or Sage mode type of state? I don't think so. I would say, with ease, that the Raikage can amp his strength high enough to resist Pain's body control technique, as well. Agreed?

Current Madara would probably get stomped imo. The Madara that could control the Kyuubi would beat Pain.

Also, I don't think his strength will help him. His speed definitely would. He's probably so fast that Deva cannot use Shinra Tensei or the other gravity jutsu (not Chibaku, the other one)

Originally posted by dadudemon
Sasuke is above Naruto for practical reasons. However, no matter what, any subsequent fight of Naruto versus Sasuke will end up with Naruto winning. Go figure. The rasenshuriken has more cutting power than any technique in all of Naruto. It was cutting off several mountain peaks with no sign of slowing down before Naruto "fully" perfected it. I'd say, without a problem, that the Rasenshuriken could cut right through the Raikage, even though wind is weak against lightening.



At 8-tails, Naruto is pretty much above everyone erm. Though that is perhaps a state between Naruto & the Kyuubi, it's not Naruto (mentally), & it's not the Kyuubi either.

Current Naruto is below the spam-tastic MS wielding Sasuke though.

Uhh, dude, Wind is weak to fire, it's strong against Lightning.

Omnislash Kid

Demonic Phoenix
*** Originally posted by dadudemon
laughing laughing laughing


He uses an AWESOME hair gel. big grin



I figured it out. Since he no longer has to keep Orochimaru at bay, he spends more chakra on his hair laughing

Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
Well I dont really see Tsunade as kage level either

And as for the Danzo thing I thought they were all Chunnin that he killed (though I could be wrong. And if they were at the beginning of the series Sasuke took two Mist chunnin and won. I mean Kakashi finished them but Sasuke could have done it)

Ok and I guess Kakashi is close to Kage level in terms of actual ability. However, he doesn't have a lot of chakra and if he's dealing with Kage level opponents (like Akatsuki for example) he has to use sharingan which will wear him down way quicker.

And I know the Kage have a counsil but they're still Kage and they still have actual responsibilites as a Kage besides protecting the village. And yes, I also realize that they're the main guys to protect the village. And now that you mention Tsunade I think she might be the weakest. However, her regeneration made her a badass (cant deny that)

And since I dont see Raikage as actually being the kind of guy to take on any other responsibilities besides protecting the village I think he would be more fit to be the guy to go to when the village needs to open up a can of whoop ass kind of like Kakashi or Naruto for example

Like Dadudemon said, Kage doesn't only to how powerful you are. Naruto is the most powerful ninja in Konoha atm, yet we have Danzo as Hokage. KB is arguably more powerful (with the help of the 8 tails and all), but his brother is the Raikage.

She's definitely kage level though. Her strength (due to chakra in her case) rivals, if not surpasses, the Raikage's. Imo, she's the weakest of the Sannin, but she's still far more powerful than a Jounin.

We haven't seen her in a true fight in Part 2. She's most likely stronger now than she was in part 1.

Danzo is strong, don't let his appearance fool you. He also has the Sharingan and that mind control of his...

King Kandy
A Hokage is not about managing and funding the village. That is a minimal part of their job. Remember, Konoha is funded by the land of fire at large, and that is run by the Daimyo. The Hokage runs the military side of things but it is the Daimyo who ultimately is responsible for the existence of the ninja village. Like when the sand Daimyo cut the sunagakure budget, the kazekage couldn't do a thing to fix the finances, all he could do was ensure his ninja were as functional as possible.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by King Kandy
A Hokage is not about managing and funding the village. That is a minimal part of their job. Remember, Konoha is funded by the land of fire at large, and that is run by the Daimyo. The Hokage runs the military side of things but it is the Daimyo who ultimately is responsible for the existence of the ninja village. Like when the sand Daimyo cut the sunagakure budget, the kazekage couldn't do a thing to fix the finances, all he could do was ensure his ninja were as functional as possible. I meant more in terms of paying the ninja for their missions
Also, they have to arrange on how to spend the budget
I wouldn't leave that job to anyone because I wouldn't trust a council with that. Hell, look at what they made Itachi do. I wouldn't trust them with managing the villages budget

King Kandy
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
I meant more in terms of paying the ninja for their missions
Also, they have to arrange on how to spend the budget
I wouldn't leave that job to anyone because I wouldn't trust a council with that. Hell, look at what they made Itachi do. I wouldn't trust them with managing the villages budget
If you aren't going to trust them with even a budget, there's not really much of a point in having a council. The 3rd had them around for a reason. And not just because they used to be his team mates. It's because they know what they're doing.

Anyway, my point is that, the hokage is basically the "General" of the land of fire... it just happens that this comes with a city to manage, as well. But you remember, in terms of politics the hokage is not the head person, not at all.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by King Kandy
If you aren't going to trust them with even a budget, there's not really much of a point in having a council. The 3rd had them around for a reason. And not just because they used to be his team mates. It's because they know what they're doing.

Anyway, my point is that, the hokage is basically the "General" of the land of fire... it just happens that this comes with a city to manage, as well. But you remember, in terms of politics the hokage is not the head person, not at all. Yeah I know. And I agree he is more of a figure head though I have a point with Itachi. Also, Danzo is trying to take over the village and was in it with Orochimaru. Just because they're a council doesn't mean they can be completely trusted (though I think in this case at the moment Donzo is the only corrupt on excluding the Uchiha thing in the past in which case 2 other council members were involved.)
So I really do have a point
I mean look at our world. Does our world seem scott free of any corruption? No. And since this manga has a government it reflects aspects of our worlds governments as well as the corruption. I mean if I'm wrong about any of this please tell me but I think I'm right on this one (though yes, the Hokage has almost no financial power though he/ she does have SOME as well as being the "general" of their specific land)

King Kandy
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
Yeah I know. And I agree he is more of a figure head though I have a point with Itachi. Also, Danzo is trying to take over the village and was in it with Orochimaru. Just because they're a council doesn't mean they can be completely trusted (though I think in this case at the moment Donzo is the only corrupt on excluding the Uchiha thing in the past in which case 2 other council members were involved.)
So I really do have a point
I mean look at our world. Does our world seem scott free of any corruption? No. And since this manga has a government it reflects aspects of our worlds governments as well as the corruption. I mean if I'm wrong about any of this please tell me but I think I'm right on this one (though yes, the Hokage has almost no financial power though he/ she does have SOME as well as being the "general" of their specific land)
In no way am I claiming that the council had nothing to do with the Uchiha massacre, in fact they were in favor of it through and through. The Hokage is not a figure head, but he was pretty much the only member of Konoha's inner circle who was against the massacre. I don't think this has to do with corruption though. Even Itachi thought the massacre was the only solution to the Uchiha crisis.

I am just saying, a Hokage's role is to run the village and produce soldier ninja. It is nothing like electing a president, who runs general issues. A Hokage is appointed (not elected) specifically to run the country's military. Konoha is only important so long as it produces good ninja.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by King Kandy
In no way am I claiming that the council had nothing to do with the Uchiha massacre, in fact they were in favor of it through and through. The Hokage is not a figure head, but he was pretty much the only member of Konoha's inner circle who was against the massacre. I don't think this has to do with corruption though. Even Itachi thought the massacre was the only solution to the Uchiha crisis.

I am just saying, a Hokage's role is to run the village and produce soldier ninja. It is nothing like electing a president, who runs general issues. A Hokage is appointed (not elected) specifically to run the country's military. Konoha is only important so long as it produces good ninja. I remember Tsunade being appointed but the people had to agree with her being Hokage. I think she might be the only exception though but other than that we're both right I would think (unless of course you disagree in which case I dont really care because I doubt at this point I could change your mind since you most likely firmly believe what you're saying. Though I could be wrong about this)

King Kandy
You're actually right on that. Apparently a council of Jonin need to confirm a hokage choice. I forgot about that. Though I guess if they were really causing trouble the Daimyo could just add more people ala FDR.

dadudemon
Originally posted by King Kandy
You're actually right on that. Apparently a council of Jonin need to confirm a hokage choice. I forgot about that. Though I guess if they were really causing trouble the Daimyo could just add more people ala FDR.

LOL @ your supreme court reference. Well done, sir. Well done. big grin

NemeBro
Why would you consider Pain above Madara?

Considering nothing Pain could do would harm him...

dadudemon
Originally posted by NemeBro
Why would you consider Pain above Madara?

Considering nothing Pain could do would harm him...

I disagree...sort of.


Pain could capture and control Madara...with his real body, couldn't he? I assume that for anyone except Naruto, this works.

EvilAngel
Originally posted by dadudemon
:

You're awesome. And if you're gender is female, that's...just.....awesome. As you probably know, this is a forum heavily dominated by males. And ladies rarely actually make an effort to debate as well as you just did. (I don't really know why, that's just the way it is on forums.)

Because it's probably not worth it ;p I myself have too much free time =)

and Thank you by the way =)

p.s still loving the sig wink


Originally posted by NemeBro
I see what you mean, but I disagree, personally.

That may have been how it was at first, sure, but after like, what? Ten, twenty years or so, his mind was made up, his ideals were concrete. I do not think I worded my opinion on the event as well as I could have. My problem is HOW he was convinced, not that he was convinced.

He punched a hole in a table because they were wasting time with their political crap while his brother was missing...

Should I be surprised he wants to kill Danzo and the Elders? Of course not. But to butcher all of Konoha in some wangsty rampage of misguided revenge, which is only dragging everything his brother worked for through the mud? Dude naw.


Yes his mind would have been probably well made up. He defeated Naruto handily and lectured him, confident he was able to do the things he could not only because of his ability but because of his ideology. So when Naruto slapping his around as Kyuubi, then suppressed it on willpower alone. Then afterward defeated Deva path as himself despite all the damage the Kyuubi would have done to him. After that happening, one would naturally question how a 15 year old could possess such power. Pain beat Hanzo for pete's sake. The guy who slapped around Orochimaru, Jiraiya and Tsunade's as well as judging from the bodies a whole bunch of other ninja.

Just like Gaara, he wanted to know how a person could be so strong and fight so hard. The rest is just stuff i've already explained. He was critically damaged anyway, and at Naruto's mercy. The fact Naruto refused to kill him, even after killing many of his comrades, destroying his home etc. Well it's a powerful thing to see from someone so strong as what Naruto would have seemed to be. Well is i guess.


He also had a paddy when the Hokage was chosen to be the grand commander. He may possess physical power unlike other Ninja, but his head isn't exactly working as it could be.


I think he's going after those 3, and if people get in his way then.... well who knows what he's thinking. We'll just have to wait and see

King Kandy
Originally posted by dadudemon
I disagree...sort of.


Pain could capture and control Madara...with his real body, couldn't he? I assume that for anyone except Naruto, this works.
He has to get one of those chakra rods into him first, and Madara can just phase through those. So yeah it would work but he could never actually execute it.

I would put Pain on top of Madara just because, Madara may be invulnerable but he hasn't really done a whole lot to anyone else either. This isn't necessarily "who could beat who" but who would do better against a wide variety of opponents.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by King Kandy
He has to get one of those chakra rods into him first, and Madara can just phase through those. So yeah it would work but he could never actually execute it.

I would put Pain on top of Madara just because, Madara may be invulnerable but he hasn't really done a whole lot to anyone else either. This isn't necessarily "who could beat who" but who would do better against a wide variety of opponents. I believe Pain would own Madara. Even if Madara uses that jutsu where things just phase through him he also wouldn't be able to attack. Pain has six different bodies and one of those can heal, and the others specialize in ninjutsu. The sharingans offensive jutsu are used to target one person and since Pain has six bodies as well as being able to absord ninjutsu (not sure if that would work on amaterasu or not though but if it didn't he can still be revived). If Madara is capable of keeping up with Pain, Pain could just use kuchiyose gedo mazo. I dont think Madara would would technically be alive after that)

King Kandy
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
I believe Pain would own Madara. Even if Madara uses that jutsu where things just phase through him he also wouldn't be able to attack. Pain has six different bodies and one of those can heal, and the others specialize in ninjutsu. The sharingans offensive jutsu are used to target one person and since Pain has six bodies as well as being able to absord ninjutsu (not sure if that would work on amaterasu or not though but if it didn't he can still be revived). If Madara is capable of keeping up with Pain, Pain could just use kuchiyose gedo mazo. I dont think Madara would would technically be alive after that)
Oh yeah, that's a good point. Pain could just remove his soul w/ that technique. Madara would have to teleport away which is basically forfeiting.

Gedo Mazo kind of makes the dead demon seal obsolete, eh? I guess that's why it takes a rare sort of person to synch with it.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by King Kandy
Oh yeah, that's a good point. Pain could just remove his soul w/ that technique. Madara would have to teleport away which is basically forfeiting.

Gedo Mazo kind of makes the dead demon seal obsolete, eh? I guess that's why it takes a rare sort of person to synch with it. I think it would still work even if he did try to flee because since his form would be made of chakra (sort of) wouldn't the jutsu still be able to hit him and steel his soul anyway? I think it might be able to

King Kandy
I'm not talking about his phasing, i'm saying he can just get the hell out of there by teleporting to hawaii when Pain activates.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by King Kandy
I'm not talking about his phasing, i'm saying he can just get the hell out of there by teleporting to hawaii when Pain activates. Yeah I know but I dont think he would. Madara seems kind of ignorant so he might stick around (though if he's smart he would teleport)

King Kandy
The thing is, he knows all of Pain's powers. So yeah I think he'd get out of there and never come back, if the two came to blows.

Omnislash Kid
I dont think he knows all of his jutsu
I mean he probably knows most of them but I dont really think Pain has really shown anyone but Konan what he's truly capable of.

King Kandy
Originally posted by Omnislash Kid
I dont think he knows all of his jutsu
I mean he probably knows most of them but I dont really think Pain has really shown anyone but Konan what he's truly capable of.
OK, maybe not. But he does no about Gedo Mazo, as he has mentioned it many times. That's the only technique that could hurt him, anyway.

I doubt Nagato himself knew what he was truly capable of. One with the Rinnegan should have unlimited potential.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by King Kandy
OK, maybe not. But he does no about Gedo Mazo, as he has mentioned it many times. That's the only technique that could hurt him, anyway.

I doubt Nagato himself knew what he was truly capable of. One with the Rinnegan should have unlimited potential. Well yeah. I mean the Sage has the perfect body (no homo but by physical means he did) and he freaking invented ninjutsu. I mean Pain is a new generation with new jutsu so I'm sure he could learn every jutsu and make plenty of new ones, I dont see how Madara is the leader. Pain should obviously be more powerful (especially since the Sharingan is supposed to be a watered down version of Rinnegan)

King Kandy
Madara could never have been the true leader if Pain stood up for himself. But Madara had him convinced that he was so much smarter than him, the Pain was right to follow him. If Pain hadn't been manipulated he could not only have ruled Akatsuki but the entire world. I mean he has a Kekkai Genkai that can use every single jutsu in the world, even the sharingan's copying can't use special natures and kekkai genkai.

Additionally he has the power to bring the dead back to life in full, not imperfect necromancy like Orochimaru either, but genuine control over life and death. He was basically a god. He would have been the greatest ninja of all if he had a stronger will and wasn't constantly following others.

NemeBro
Madara's phasing ability has never failed. Not once. It has not one known flaw. Nor does his teleportation. He was able to forcibly subdue, and then control the Kyuubi, the most powerful being in Naruto short of only the Sage of Six Paths (Prolly), and was a rival to the Shodaime, one of the strongest ninja to ever live. He was physically strong enough to block Suigetsu's blade with one arm, and has reputedly one of the strongest chakras ever, the strongest of the Uchiha for sure.

Madara has not done much, but what he has done is very impressive, why the hell is everyone saying Pain can beat Madara as if it is a factual statement? Hell, it would actually be retarded for Pain to NOT be weaker than Madara, and if you notice, Pain was upset with obeying Madara, yet told Konan to stfu when speaking out against him and followed his orders anyway. Gee I wonder why?

Chances are, Madara is stronger, and the strongest ninja to currently be alive.

Also, that one attack Nagato used to soul rip those doodz when Hanzo attacked...You do see how much it drained him, right? You really think he can do it again?

Oh, and the jutsu is apparently not unique to Nagato, Madara plans on making Sasuke the new "catalyst" so to speak.

King Kandy
Originally posted by NemeBro
Madara's phasing ability has never failed. Not once. It has not one known flaw. Nor does his teleportation. He was able to forcibly subdue, and then control the Kyuubi, the most powerful being in Naruto short of only the Sage of Six Paths (Prolly), and was a rival to the Shodaime, one of the strongest ninja to ever live. He was physically strong enough to block Suigetsu's blade with one arm, and has reputedly one of the strongest chakras ever, the strongest of the Uchiha for sure.
The thing is, he is now a shadow of his former self. I have no doubt that when his plan to repower himself succeeds, he will be the strongest of all.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Madara has not done much, but what he has done is very impressive, why the hell is everyone saying Pain can beat Madara as if it is a factual statement? Hell, it would actually be retarded for Pain to NOT be weaker than Madara, and if you notice, Pain was upset with obeying Madara, yet told Konan to stfu when speaking out against him and followed his orders anyway. Gee I wonder why?
I never actually said Pain can beat Madara, I said he would probably do better against many opponents due to Madara displaying no offense at all. Pain follows Madara because he was manipulated into trusting him. What would be retarded, is if Madara was the strongest ninja alive while at the same time so obsessed with repowering himself.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Also, that one attack Nagato used to soul rip those doodz when Hanzo attacked...You do see how much it drained him, right? You really think he can do it again?
He was "drained" due to having gotten skewered by hundreds of rods sucking his chakra out of him. Since then he has been fine. I don't see it so much as drain as a transformation that he has already undergone.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Oh, and the jutsu is apparently not unique to Nagato, Madara plans on making Sasuke the new "catalyst" so to speak.
Yeah, that is really bugging me personally. If Sasuke somehow gets power over life and death with the sharingan, that would be the most retarded out of nowhere powerup yet.

Omnislash Kid
Originally posted by NemeBro
Madara's phasing ability has never failed. Not once. It has not one known flaw. Nor does his teleportation. He was able to forcibly subdue, and then control the Kyuubi, the most powerful being in Naruto short of only the Sage of Six Paths (Prolly), and was a rival to the Shodaime, one of the strongest ninja to ever live. He was physically strong enough to block Suigetsu's blade with one arm, and has reputedly one of the strongest chakras ever, the strongest of the Uchiha for sure.

Madara has not done much, but what he has done is very impressive, why the hell is everyone saying Pain can beat Madara as if it is a factual statement? Hell, it would actually be retarded for Pain to NOT be weaker than Madara, and if you notice, Pain was upset with obeying Madara, yet told Konan to stfu when speaking out against him and followed his orders anyway. Gee I wonder why?

Chances are, Madara is stronger, and the strongest ninja to currently be alive.

Also, that one attack Nagato used to soul rip those doodz when Hanzo attacked...You do see how much it drained him, right? You really think he can do it again?

Oh, and the jutsu is apparently not unique to Nagato, Madara plans on making Sasuke the new "catalyst" so to speak. Obviously he can do it again because he did before he died to revive all the people he killed. Also, he told Konan to stfu because he believed Madara knew what he was doing and so he was going to make sure it got done. I mean Pain was the most motivated out of all of them. If he had more self-esteem he could have been the leader. And no, I'm not saying Pain is riduculously stronger than Madara but I am saying Pain is better because of the fact that he has six bodies that are all very capable of killing high level ninja like Kakashi with ease as well as being revived, because of the fact that he already knows a large amount of ninjutsu, because he's capable of learning every known jutsu, because he has kuchiyose gedo mazo, and because he is a f****** legend, and has a way stronger kekke genkai than Madara and the whole freaking Uchiha clan. Yes I said it, Rinnegan is better than Sharingan. Also, Pain had a lot of chakra to. If I remember correctly all of his bodies had to use his chakra. On top of that, afte they all fought Naruto after using jutsu that used a s*** load of chakra he still had enough chakra to use kuchiyose gedo mazo one last time. Dont tell me Madara could easily be leader based off of terms of strength because he can't

EvilAngel
So because Pain's feats are currently better than Madara's you assume Pain is stronger?

No one knows at the moment who is stronger

But we know they are both immensely powerful. Pain can create something resembling a black hole, and copied that jutsu from the guy from KungFu Hussle ( ;p ). And Madara has a space time jutsu more advanced than the fourth, who was so strong in wars if he was spotted there was an immediate retreat order.


I have my own theories but i don't see the point in this arguement. Since it cannot be proven either way.

King Kandy
No, I believe Pain is stronger because Madara is obviously in a weakened state.

EvilAngel
You believing it doesn't make it so.

That's all there is to it imo

King Kandy
So how does me proving you were wrong when you said :

"So because Pain's feats are currently better than Madara's you assume Pain is stronger?"

Suddenly equal me trying to say that I knew for a fact he was stronger?

EvilAngel
Originally posted by King Kandy
So how does me proving you were wrong when you said :

"So because Pain's feats are currently better than Madara's you assume Pain is stronger?"

Suddenly equal me trying to say that I knew for a fact he was stronger?

You didn't prove anything ^^

Madara is in a weakened state doesn't mean a thing. It would be relative to how strong he was before versus how much 'weaker' he is.

So unless you know Madara was twice as powerful as Pain and is now at a third of his strength (just as an example) you can't possible know one is 'stronger'* than the other.


Which is what i said to begin with ;p


* Note strength can mean very little in the Naruto world. After all, in the right circumstances someone weaker can beat someone much stronger. So even though one may be stronger than the other who would win could still vary anyway.

King Kandy
I never said I KNEW Pain was stronger, that was my OPINION. What you said that was wrong, is saying I based that on lack of feats. I based that on, if he was stronger than any ninja alive, he would probably not be so concerned with repowering himself, nor would he have to rely on operatives so much.

EvilAngel
Originally posted by King Kandy
I never said I KNEW Pain was stronger, that was my OPINION. What you said that was wrong, is saying I based that on lack of feats. I based that on, if he was stronger than any ninja alive, he would probably not be so concerned with repowering himself, nor would he have to rely on operatives so much.

Originally posted by King Kandy


Suddenly equal me trying to say that I knew for a fact he was stronger?

Statements like those confuse me if you're tryng to get your opinion accross or trying to prove it.

Nevermind then, i really don't think anyone could know who is better at what until Madara fights.

King Kandy
You misunderstood me. That second quote there was a continuation of the first sentence in that post. It was me clarifying that I never claimed to know the fact of the matter.

Demonic Phoenix
So, back to Sasuke. Would Madara have really given up Sasuke had the Kages agreed to hand over the Hachibi and the Kyuubi or was Madara just lying?

Kento
I think he was lying. Then again I think he's going to pull an Orochimaru and take Sasuke's body because it has Susano'o, and isn't damaged. Which is why he's pushing him to get stronger, and take Itachi's eyes.

King Kandy
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
So, back to Sasuke. Would Madara have really given up Sasuke had the Kages agreed to hand over the Hachibi and the Kyuubi or was Madara just lying?
Obviously not, because apparently he needs Sasuke to use the sealing-statue anyway.

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