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Team Battle. Standard gear for all characters. The fight takes place in space. Bloodlust is on.

Team 1
Thor
Wonder Woman
Orion

Team 2
Superman
Captain Marvel
Black Adam

Which team takes it?

Team 2. WW is the weakest of the group. Not that she can't hand with them, but she will lose to anyone on team 2.
Superman>=Orion
CM>WW
BA>=<Thor(Current Thor loses though)

Originally posted by xJLxKing

BA>=<Thor

now that's a great statement

it means could go both ways.

I think BA would get owned by Thor, even if it went down to fisticuffs


Does Diana have her gear? That would even things out abit

Team 2 6-7/10.

A first iwas going to say team 2 but with standard equipment Team 1


Thor with mjolnir can BFR anyone on team 2 then it is 3 on 2. Perhaps warrior maddness also "hey it is bloodlust"

Orion with the astro force and the harness would be a beast.

WW with the lasso could take out another member on team 2 making it 3v1.

If this was just a brawl i would give it to team 2 but with all of team 1's gear they have the edge.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Team 2. WW is the weakest of the group. Not that she can't hand with them, but she will lose to anyone on team 2.
Superman>=Orion
CM>WW
BA>=<Thor(Current Thor loses though)


I think WW has a very good chance against CM and could definitely pull some wins off him. The lasso makes this even more so.

Originally posted by Sin I AM

Does Diana have her gear? That would even things out abit

Diana has the lasso, bracers and tiara - none of her more exotic gear.

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
I think WW has a very good chance against CM and could definitely pull some wins off him. The lasso makes this even more so. Yeah, WW can get some wins. Though, the majority goes to CM.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Yeah, WW can get some wins. Though, the majority goes to CM.

Makes for an interesting debate. I think she benefits more than he in a blood-lusted scenario though.

cant WW with her lasso revert Billy and Teth back to human form?

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
Makes for an interesting debate. I think she benefits more than he in a blood-lusted scenario though. I don't. She is not like Superman. She doesn't hold a huge amount of strength back because of her fear, compassion, and safety. Also, her magical weapons like Bracers, Sword, Lasso and Tiara won't be a huge help. He is magical, he is expected to have a huge amount of magical resistance.

Also, the biggest advantage when someone has BA and CM in there team is that they can transform into their mortal form like (billy) and then shout out Shazam again. They'll be in full strength again. This mean if CM beats WW, he can call out shazam 2x times. He'll be in full health and strength but his opponents won't be.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
cant WW with her lasso revert Billy and Teth back to human form?

Yup, but we can't assume she'd be able to do it everytime.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
I don't. She is not like Superman. She doesn't hold a huge amount of strength back because of her fear, compassion, and safety. Also, her magical weapons like Bracers, Sword, Lasso and Tiara won't be a huge help. He is magical, he is expected to have a huge amount of magical resistance.

Also, the biggest advantage when someone has BA and CM in there team is that they can transform into their mortal form like (billy) and then shout out Shazam again. They'll be in full strength again. This mean if CM beats WW, he can call out shazam 2x times. He'll be in full health and strength but his opponents won't be.

She does hold back strength wise, but what I was referring to was using her Tiara more as an offensive weapon. They may be magical but I am not betting that they cannot be cut by it. I also don't think that they will be at all resistant to the lassos powers. It's held gods before. I don't think CM and BA are getting out of it.

And ironically, what you consider to be their biggest advantage is perhaps their biggest disadvantage against WW. She could potentially force them to revert back to their mortal forms in which case they're dead before they get to shout shazam again.

she is the best fighter here, but imo billy and teth are too much for her...maybe 4 outta 10 against the shazams, and she has no business fighting Clark

Originally posted by xJLxKing


Well there biggest advantage just sucks b/c if they do that in space they die. Also there is no reason the lasso wouldn't work to tied them up.

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
She does hold back strength wise, but what I was referring to was using her Tiara more as an offensive weapon. They may be magical but I am not betting that they cannot be cut by it. I also don't think that they will be at all resistant to the lassos powers. It's held gods before. I don't think CM and BA are getting out of it.

And ironically, what you consider to be their biggest advantage is perhaps their biggest disadvantage against WW. She could potentially force them to revert back to their mortal forms in which case they're dead before they get to shout shazam again.
The advantage I am talking about kicks in after they defeat their opponent.

Yeah, you are right, WW will becomes more aggressive and looking to kill quickly when she is bloodlusted. Though, they same can be said for anyone on team 2. We know that Superman wins the majority over WW. She admitted it herself. BA is usually stronger then CM.

CM is never as aggressive as BA. If he was he'd be able to dodge the lasso: considering he knows what it's capable on doing. Also, like you said before. We can't except her to use it like that every time. Either way, I see CM winning 6/10

Team 2... 7/10

Team 2.

Team 1

Team 2
Either Captain Marvel or Black Adam would defeat Thor with absolute ease

WW and Orion closely follow

What are you smoking?

Originally posted by iceman24567
What are you smoking? Nothing, its common sense, Thor isnt going to give CM or Black Adam a good fight, especially BA considering that he pwned the JSA and JLA at the same time

It's common sense that you don't know what you are talking about.

He is smoking something

Team 1 gets stomped

Originally posted by iceman24567
It's common sense that you don't know what you are talking about. Then make a case

Why should I? Comics support my statement nothing supports yours

Originally posted by iceman24567
Why should I? Comics support my statement nothing supports yours In other words, you cant make a case

Why didnt you just say so

Nah in other words you don't know anything. Which was obvious the first time you posted in this thread

Originally posted by iceman24567
Nah in other words you don't know anything. Which was obvious the first time you posted in this thread Naw in other words, you cant make a case....which was obvious the first time you posted in this thread

Damn why can't we ever get creative trolls on this board? Damn shame at least entertain us dance, juggle make a joke or something or just stop trolling .

Originally posted by iceman24567
Damn why can't we ever get creative trolls on this board? Damn shame at least entertain us dance, juggle make a joke or something or just stop trolling .

Don't encourage him! You'll just end up with a headache

Team 2, but not a stomp...

Originally posted by iceman24567
Damn why can't we ever get creative trolls on this board? Damn shame at least entertain us dance, juggle make a joke or something or just stop trolling .

This guy might he used to be on the CBUB forum and trolled like no tomorrow actually his post now are the closing thing to debating i have every seen in about 3 years.

CBUB?

Originally posted by iceman24567
CBUB?

Comic book ultimate battle.

another debate forum a little different then this.

Must of the guys who actually debate are gone.

must guys left on the forum act like quan in a Thanos thread if you know what i mean

T2 6/10

Team 2. WW is the weak link here.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Team 2. WW is the weak link here.


I must be psychic. I knew you'd say that

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
I must be psychic. I knew you'd say that Then i must be physic too.

Originally posted by iceman24567
Then i must be physic too.

We should join the justice league!

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
We should join the justice league! So i can end up like the rest of those losers that are dying? No thanks

Originally posted by iceman24567
So i can end up like the rest of those losers that are dying? No thanks

But you get a shiny black ring if you die!

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
But you get a shiny black ring if you die! I'm already shiny and black bro

Originally posted by iceman24567
I'm already shiny and black bro

You're a ring?

Yes a diamond ring due to the fact that plenty of woman want me and i last forever

Originally posted by iceman24567
Yes a diamond ring due to the fact that plenty of woman want me and i last forever


I've got nothing

Awwwwww.

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
I must be psychic. I knew you'd say that I'm not the only one who said that. WW can't hang with the big boys. It'z za way it iz.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I'm not the only one who said that. WW can't hang with the big boys. It'z za way it iz.

Really? People who don't even like WW saying she'd be able to take 4/10 doesn't sound to me like she "can't hang with the big boys." I absolutely disagree with just about every opinion you have regarding the character. That is why I knew what you would say.

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
Really? People who don't even like WW saying she'd be able to take 4/10 doesn't sound to me like she "can't hang with the big boys." I absolutely disagree with just about every opinion you have regarding the character. That is why I knew what you would say. She can pull a fluke here or there. These guys would manhandle her physically. Superman crushed her once and easily broke her wrist like it was nothing. She can compete due to her skill level, but she weakens the team and they lose cuz of it.


Don't be upset she isn't an elite top tier. Dc makes the comics not me.

I would take WW at her best over any any member on both teams.

At her best she is fast enough to block or avoid any of their strikes, fast enough to lasso them, and certainly fast enough to land a blow (forming a koing combo). She simply counteracts for the easy win.
She also has the Aegis and tiara in case things get hairy.

By the way I can nearly crush my own wrists, or someone else's who have my same strength. Superman crushing her wrists doesn't prove his is stronger (although he is).

Originally posted by h1a8
I would take WW at her best over any any member on both teams.

At her best she is fast enough to block or avoid any of their strikes, fast enough to lasso them, and certainly fast enough to land a blow (forming a koing combo). She simply counteracts for the easy win.
She also has the Aegis and tiara in case things get hairy.

By the way I can nearly crush my own wrists, or someone else's who have my same strength. Superman crushing her wrists doesn't prove his is stronger (although he is). We don't argue based on powerset alone. She is weaker than all of these characters if she fights in character. Superman has always been portrayed as more formidable than she is. You tend to ignore comics and try to debate based on feats alone. Horrible way to debate.

Easily crushing her wrist does prove he is stronger.

Originally posted by quanchi112
We don't argue based on powerset alone. She is weaker than all of these characters if she fights in character. Superman has always been portrayed as more formidable than she is. You tend to ignore comics and try to debate based on feats alone. Horrible way to debate.

Easily crushing her wrist does prove he is stronger.

I'm not arguing power sets but basing what I said on what actually occurred in comics. WW has blocked, ducked, lassoed, and countered super fast beings like Superman, flash, multiple beams of light, etc. She has also used the Aegis and tiara before when it was a great need.

Excellent way to debate I would say.

Originally posted by quanchi112
We don't argue based on powerset alone. She is weaker than all of these characters if she fights in character. Superman has always been portrayed as more formidable than she is. You tend to ignore comics and try to debate based on feats alone. Horrible way to debate.

Easily crushing her wrist does prove he is stronger.

Quan, I am not even going to bother. We've already established that you are incapable of adequately interpreting the Sacrifice fight. Why you keep using it is beyond me. You pick and choose only the parts you think will help you and ignore the rest of it. You've also failed to read the stipulations in this fight. Why post?

And I find it hard to believe that you would challenge H1a8 on debating skills. She has the feats to put her with those guys AND the comics back that up. How many times have you heard that WW is second only to Supes. Her strength has been compared to CM. She's been written as being as fast or faster than guys in this group.

Going beyond whether or not you think this Team wins or not you cannot keep making statements like this when you never provide anything to back them up.

Originally posted by quanchi112
She can pull a fluke here or there. These guys would manhandle her physically. Superman crushed her once and easily broke her wrist like it was nothing. She can compete due to her skill level, but she weakens the team and they lose cuz of it.


Don't be upset she isn't an elite top tier. Dc makes the comics not me.

Thankfully you don't write for DC. I know plenty of DC writers who (thankfully) disagree with you.

A fluke here or there? Manhandle? Considering that she's fought them before and not been manhandled, your statement does not hold water.

Originally posted by h1a8
I'm not arguing power sets but basing what I said on what actually occurred in comics. WW has blocked, ducked, lassoed, and countered super fast beings like Superman, flash, multiple beams of light, etc. She has also used the Aegis and tiara before when it was a great need.

Excellent way to debate I would say.

You won't make much headway with him. Just walk away! haha
He completely ignores everything else that Diana brings to the table. In all honesty, I don't think he knows much about the character.

Anyway, I do agree that Diana written at her best would be a serious, serious threat. I wouldn't put her ahead of Thor but luckily he's on her team I think Clark would win more often than not in a brawl, but she has other options to end the fight. I think she could take the shazams.

Originally posted by h1a8
I'm not arguing power sets but basing what I said on what actually occurred in comics. WW has blocked, ducked, lassoed, and countered super fast beings like Superman, flash, multiple beams of light, etc. She has also used the Aegis and tiara before when it was a great need.

Excellent way to debate I would say. No, because you flat out ignore Superman's obvious physical advantages against WW. Like I said her skill level doesn't save her against any of these guys all out save a few fluke victories.Originally posted by Sasaraixx
Quan, I am not even going to bother. We've already established that you are incapable of adequately interpreting the Sacrifice fight. Why you keep using it is beyond me. You pick and choose only the parts you think will help you and ignore the rest of it. You've also failed to read the stipulations in this fight. Why post?

And I find it hard to believe that you would challenge H1a8 on debating skills. She has the feats to put her with those guys AND the comics back that up. How many times have you heard that WW is second only to Supes. Her strength has been compared to CM. She's been written as being as fast or faster than guys in this group.

Going beyond whether or not you think this Team wins or not you cannot keep making statements like this when you never provide anything to back them up. Superman has beaten her outside that fight. She avoided an all out superman because she couldn't hope to hang with him.

Superman has never gotten the better of Orion so saying she is only second to Supes is well, ignorant. captain marvel is also powerful enough to throw down with supes while WW is not. She needs to rely on skill and skill alone. Black Adam would break her face very quickly as he tends to try to crush his opponents and Thor is just as skilled as WW if not more and is stronger and his power levels are well above anyone else's in this thread.

h1 ignores the comics and goes by feats alone. That's cbr debating.

Thor would be better off fighting CM or BA as he has proven Magic resistance as well as potentially the ability to siphon off or cut them off from their powers like what he did to Jugs or simply BFR one of them. Orion can stall BA til Thor takes down CM. WW is better off fighting Supes defensively (she's been shown to be able to keep up with him) until Thor can beat CM.

I dunno, I think T2 has the edge in versatility here. Tho, admittedly, T2 shud still take the slight majority 6/10.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Thor would be better off fighting CM or BA as he has proven Magic resistance as well as potentially the ability to siphon off or cut them off from their powers like what he did to Jugs or simply BFR one of them. Orion can stall BA til Thor takes down CM. WW is better off fighting Supes defensively (she's been shown to be able to keep up with him) until Thor can beat CM.

I dunno, I think T2 has the edge in versatility here. Tho, admittedly, T2 shud still take the slight majority 6/10. I think team 1 has the versatility edge, personally. Team 2 has no weak links. They win a solid majority.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Thor would be better off fighting CM or BA as he has proven Magic resistance as well as potentially the ability to siphon off or cut them off from their powers like what he did to Jugs or simply BFR one of them. Orion can stall BA til Thor takes down CM. WW is better off fighting Supes defensively (she's been shown to be able to keep up with him) until Thor can beat CM.

I dunno, I think T2 has the edge in versatility here. Tho, admittedly, T2 shud still take the slight majority 6/10.

Greater magic resistance than Thor? I think not.

Originally posted by quanchi112
No, because you flat out ignore Superman's obvious physical advantages against WW. Like I said her skill level doesn't save her against any of these guys all out save a few fluke victories. Superman has beaten her outside that fight. She avoided an all out superman because she couldn't hope to hang with him.

Superman has never gotten the better of Orion so saying she is only second to Supes is well, ignorant. captain marvel is also powerful enough to throw down with supes while WW is not. She needs to rely on skill and skill alone. Black Adam would break her face very quickly as he tends to try to crush his opponents and Thor is just as skilled as WW if not more and is stronger and his power levels are well above anyone else's in this thread.

h1 ignores the comics and goes by feats alone. That's cbr debating.

No, I don't. You however know absolutely nothing about the character of WW. You keep arguing that she has to be physically superior to Superman to win, and she doesn't. I can't believe I have to explain this to you yet AGAIN. I have never once, ever, anywhere claimed that Superman was not stronger, more durable and faster than Wonder Woman. What I do believe is that his advantages are not so great that he places himself in another league. Nothing in their recent showings would allow you possibly think otherwise.

I will not disuss tha fight with you anymore. You ignore all of the damage Clark took in that fight and focus on one panel in that whole sequence. I don't know what language I have to write in. She didn't want to kill him!! It was kill him or get to Lord. Those are the choices the writer gave her. Hmmm, wonder what anyone would do?

Well, you just called Batman ignorant. I'm not the one who said that the only force on Earth who could stop her was Superman. It's not me who has compared her strength to Captain Marvel. That was Superman. It's not me who said that she was faster than Superman, that came from her own mouth. It's not me who called her the greatest warrior in the DCU. That was DC itself. And none of this is said to support the claim that she's superior to these guys. It is proffered to refute the (silly) claim that she will be manhandled by any of these guys. She is capable of taking more than a couple "fluke" wins. I won't even ask you how they are "fluke" as I already have a headache.

She can stalemate anyone on Team 2 in a normal battle and here if she is bloodlusted, she can use her Tiara for the kill. SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO KO THEM. SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO KO THEM. And I'm not conceding that she couldn't do that either. She still has her lasso to use as well. She has multiple defensive options thanks to her skill, innate durability, resistance to magic AND her bracers. All of this you overlook. Every time. You make ridiculous claims and back them up with nothing. I can't take it anymore. I think you will have the honor of being the first person on my ignore list.

As for my views on the battle at hand, I see it as a split but if 1 team has to win, I'd give Team 1 the slight majority 6/10. I don't see Thor losing any of his match-ups. I don't see his teammates falling before he's finished his fights.

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
No, I don't. You however know absolutely nothing about the character of WW. You keep arguing that she has to be physically superior to Superman to win, and she doesn't. I can't believe I have to explain this to you yet AGAIN. I have never once, ever, anywhere claimed that Superman was not stronger, more durable and faster than Wonder Woman. What I do believe is that his advantages are not so great that he places himself in another league. Nothing in their recent showings would allow you possibly think otherwise.

I will not disuss tha fight with you anymore. You ignore all of the damage Clark took in that fight and focus on one panel in that whole sequence. I don't know what language I have to write in. She didn't want to kill him!! It was kill him or get to Lord. Those are the choices the writer gave her. Hmmm, wonder what anyone would do?

Well, you just called Batman ignorant. I'm not the one who said that the only force on Earth who could stop her was Superman. It's not me who has compared her strength to Captain Marvel. That was Superman. It's not me who said that she was faster than Superman, that came from her own mouth. It's not me who called her the greatest warrior in the DCU. That was DC itself. And none of this is said to support the claim that she's superior to these guys. It is proffered to refute the (silly) claim that she will be manhandled by any of these guys. She is capable of taking more than a couple "fluke" wins. I won't even ask you how they are "fluke" as I already have a headache.

She can stalemate anyone on Team 2 in a normal battle and here if she is bloodlusted, she can use her Tiara for the kill. SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO KO THEM. SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO KO THEM. And I'm not conceding that she couldn't do that either. She still has her lasso to use as well. She has multiple defensive options thanks to her skill, innate durability, resistance to magic AND her bracers. All of this you overlook. Every time. You make ridiculous claims and back them up with nothing. I can't take it anymore. I think you will have the honor of being the first person on my ignore list.

As for my views on the battle at hand, I see it as a split but if 1 team has to win, I'd give Team 1 the slight majority 6/10. I don't see Thor losing any of his match-ups. I don't see his teammates falling before he's finished his fights. That's why I have always said she has to rely on Her SKILL level to win. She can win here and there it just isn't likely.

The point was she had to evade him though. She wasn't good enough to just ko him. She used her skills against his blind rage. She also used birds to buy time to get to Lord. It's pretty obvious that an extremely pissed off Superman can easily snap her wrist that it's nowhere near as close as you want it to be. She can win a few flukes that's it against the man of steel.

It's a silly statement. Are you honestly telling me that statement applies to Captain Marvel, Hal Jordan, Black Adam, Martian Manhunter, the Flash etc. ? Honestly, it doesn't. It's a statement that doesn't apply to everyone on the planet. You seem to vastly overrate WW to rabid levels.

If they are all bloodlusted she is toast. They are stronger, around as fast if not faster, and a lot stronger more powerful.

WW can beat anyone on here but loses a solid majority to all parties involved here hence she is the weakest link, goodbye.

Originally posted by quanchi112
That's why I have always said she has to rely on Her SKILL level to win. She can win here and there it just isn't likely.

The point was she had to evade him though. She wasn't good enough to just ko him. She used her skills against his blind rage. She also used birds to buy time to get to Lord. It's pretty obvious that an extremely pissed off Superman can easily snap her wrist that it's nowhere near as close as you want it to be. She can win a few flukes that's it against the man of steel.

It's a silly statement. Are you honestly telling me that statement applies to Captain Marvel, Hal Jordan, Black Adam, Martian Manhunter, the Flash etc. ? Honestly, it doesn't. It's a statement that doesn't apply to everyone on the planet. You seem to vastly overrate WW to rabid levels.

If they are all bloodlusted she is toast. They are stronger, around as fast if not faster, and a lot stronger more powerful.

WW can beat anyone on here but loses a solid majority to all parties involved here hence she is the weakest link, goodbye.

Imo, WW is at least stronger than everyone on both teams with the exception of Superman. And Superman is not that much stronger than her. Rhino is many many times stronger than Captain America yet Cap will Beat Rhino more times than not. If WW has martial art skills greater than any Earthly form, enough strength and speed to hurt, enough durability to take many blows, then of course she wins.

Yes WW needs her skills to win otherwise she is toast (I agree). But know that Superman was swinging at her with all his might at full speed yet she was fast enough to duck and block his attacks. She even hit him with a stunning hit to the ears that could have ended the fight there. But no she didn't want to kill or hurt him so she let up. Diana could beat anyone on both teams with these stunning type blows. All it takes is one, and then she finishes them with an amazong (amazing) combo.

Letting her use the tiara and lasso is spite.

Being somewhat physically superior doesn't prove a win.

knowing supes reputation and due to his own pride thor decides to square off with supes toe to toe and loans diana his hammer. as thor and supes pummel eachother and orion and ba square off diana proceeds to maul cm with moljnir. after finishing off cm she then helps orion take care of ba. then the two of them watch supes and thor but dont interfere due to thor insistance of testing his might. after a long battle without the aid of moljnir thor finaly falls and diana and orion ko a worn out supes ftw.

Originally posted by h1a8
Imo, WW is at least stronger than everyone on both teams with the exception of Superman. And Superman is not that much stronger than her. Rhino is many many times stronger than Captain America yet Cap will Beat Rhino more times than not. If WW has martial art skills greater than any Earthly form, enough strength and speed to hurt, enough durability to take many blows, then of course she wins.

Yes WW needs her skills to win otherwise she is toast (I agree). But know that Superman was swinging at her with all his might at full speed yet she was fast enough to duck and block his attacks. She even hit him with a stunning hit to the ears that could have ended the fight there. But no she didn't want to kill or hurt him so she let up. Diana could beat anyone on both teams with these stunning type blows. All it takes is one, and then she finishes them with an amazong (amazing) combo.

Letting her use the tiara and lasso is spite.

Being somewhat physically superior doesn't prove a win. Based on what feats is she stronger than Black Adam, Orion, Thor, Captain Marvel?

You just make ridiculous claims and never prove anything.

You are comparing these great heroes to that clod Rhino? Are ya serious?

The reason she stunned his ears is because she snuck up behind him. It was an utter cheapshot.

Diana isn't sneaking up on anyone here. Even with a cheapshot attack superman was still in it to win it.

Originally posted by batosaimsx
Nothing, its common sense, Thor isnt going to give CM or Black Adam a good fight, especially BA considering that he pwned the JSA and JLA at the same time

I'm a huge CM fan but come on this is Thor.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Based on what feats is she stronger than Black Adam, Orion, Thor, Captain Marvel?

You just make ridiculous claims and never prove anything.

You are comparing these great heroes to that clod Rhino? Are ya serious?

The reason she stunned his ears is because she snuck up behind him. It was an utter cheapshot.

Diana isn't sneaking up on anyone here. Even with a cheapshot attack superman was still in it to win it.

Based on feats yes she is stronger. The shazams have no great strength feats other than fighting Superman or beating up on teams. There is only one concept of Hercules The God of Strength. And D.C. mentions that Diana is stronger than Hercules (or the concept of him). CM and BA have the strength of Hercules (at least CM does). IMO, Thor is much weaker than Diana but don't argue that as you will lose in a long lengthy debate.

Diana doesn't need to sneak up on Superman or anyone else to hit them like she did when she cheapshotted Supes. If she hit him plenty of times in fair battle then she could ring his ears in fair battle too. Superman managed to come back because she let up. She didn't want to hurt him. In a fair fight to the finish she will not let up, but rather combo him till ko, lasso him after the hit, or tiara cut him after the hit. Remember these characters have the brains of the writer. That is why you see them do stupid things when you know they are smarter.

Originally posted by h1a8
Based on feats yes she is stronger. The shazams have no great strength feats other than fighting Superman or beating up on teams. There is only one concept of Hercules The God of Strength. And D.C. mentions that Diana is stronger than Hercules (or the concept of him). CM and BA have the strength of Hercules (at least CM does). IMO, Thor is much weaker than Diana but don't argue that as you will lose in a long lengthy debate.

Diana doesn't need to sneak up on Superman or anyone else to hit them like she did when she cheapshotted Supes. If she hit him plenty of times in fair battle then she could ring his ears in fair battle too. Superman managed to come back because she let up. She didn't want to hurt him. In a fair fight to the finish she will not let up, but rather combo him till ko, lasso him after the hit, or tiara cut him after the hit. Remember these characters have the brains of the writer. That is why you see them do stupid things when you know they are smarter. They don't need strength feats when they are shown to be peers to Superman. That's the gauge. Lifting certain things doesn't prove anything. You seem so behind on common sense and how to actually compare these characters I have no idea what your argument even is half the time.

How is Thor weaker than Diana? Please provide something not just one jackass statement after the next.

No, the reason he got his bell rung was because he had no idea where she was. When you get cheapshotted it's a cheapshot. Supes is a lot stronger than her.

wolverine wins

Team 2.

Wonder woman is underrated, she can take anyone on team 2. I give this to team 1, they have more fire power and they are more powerful period (excluding wonder woman). Thor is the most powerful on the field, 2nd Orion. This team should be switched around a bit.

I find Orion to be about Thor level, overall.

I agree, he is around thor level but I give thor a small edge against him power wise. Thor possess the strongest firepower, has the best damage soak, hardest hits, and is one of the best fighters on the field. Orion is just as good; thats why I said switch up the teams; orion and thor can get the majority against anyone on team 2.

Originally posted by carver9
I agree, he is around thor level but I give thor a small edge against him power wise. Thor possess the strongest firepower, has the best damage soak, hardest hits, and is one of the best fighters on the field. Orion is just as good; thats why I said switch up the teams; orion and thor can get the majority against anyone on team 2.

Orion astro force can pretty much match the godblast on it's best performances and Orion is a better fighter, mastering most, if not all forms of fighting in the universe. at least that's what hinted in simonson's run.

Originally posted by quanchi112
They don't need strength feats when they are shown to be peers to Superman. That's the gauge. Lifting certain things doesn't prove anything. You seem so behind on common sense and how to actually compare these characters I have no idea what your argument even is half the time. They were only shown to be peers to a holding back Superman. That's right Superman almost always holds back. So for practical purposes they are peers with Superman. But not potentially. The fact that she has enough strength to lift the entire Earth and Thor only a very small fraction of it. What that got to do with what I said? If you didn't understand then just say so. But don't dimiss it in ignorance. First Superman is not a lot stronger than Diana, a non holding back Superman is.

My point is that Diana got many hits on Superman even when he was aware (fair hits). One of these could be easily traded for the ear bell shot. Or at least combo it from an initial hit. But to be honest I only see Superman beating Diana if he uses his freeze breath. This would slow diana down for him to combo her to ko. Maybe her Aegis could protect her if she gets it up in time. It would be a good fight though. Not a cakewalk for Superman by a long shot. With that said, she is superior to the shazams in every way.

Originally posted by carver9
I agree, he is around thor level but I give thor a small edge against him power wise. Thor possess the strongest firepower, has the best damage soak, hardest hits, and is one of the best fighters on the field. Orion is just as good; thats why I said switch up the teams; orion and thor can get the majority against anyone on team 2.

I disagree. Superman would take a large majority against Thor with ease (mainly because of the speed advantage).

Orion solos

the ear shot was dumb. he uses his super hearing, that is capable of hearing shit in SPACE no less, and she manages to sneak up on him.

diana is capable of hanging with the big boys no doubt, but i don't see her beating the likes of clark, billy or adam for a majority without having some extra gear at her disposal...

Originally posted by -Pr-
the ear shot was dumb. he uses his super hearing, that is capable of hearing shit in SPACE no less, and she manages to sneak up on him.

diana is capable of hanging with the big boys no doubt, but i don't see her beating the likes of clark, billy or adam for a majority without having some extra gear at her disposal...


I respect that opinion and we can of course debate it. I just can't take the whole "out of her league and will get manhandled" crap.

I don't think she can take a majority from a bloodlusted Clark, but against the other two I'm not so sure.

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
I respect that opinion and we can of course debate it. I just can't take the whole "out of her league and will get manhandled" crap.

I don't think she can take a majority from a bloodlusted Clark, but against the other two I'm not so sure.

she's not out of her league, imo. at the very least, she's a small notch below in general. when it comes down to individual stats i'm sure there are debatable points, but in general, she'll give any of the top guys a fight...

i just see adam and billy as being closer to clark's level than they are to hers. again, though, if they do win, it's not going to be easy, at least imo.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I find Orion to be about Thor level, overall. Near but not at Thor level. Thor going all out would rock him.Originally posted by h1a8
They were only shown to be peers to a holding back Superman. That's right Superman almost always holds back. So for practical purposes they are peers with Superman. But not potentially. The fact that she has enough strength to lift the entire Earth and Thor only a very small fraction of it. What that got to do with what I said? If you didn't understand then just say so. But don't dimiss it in ignorance. First Superman is not a lot stronger than Diana, a non holding back Superman is.

My point is that Diana got many hits on Superman even when he was aware (fair hits). One of these could be easily traded for the ear bell shot. Or at least combo it from an initial hit. But to be honest I only see Superman beating Diana if he uses his freeze breath. This would slow diana down for him to combo her to ko. Maybe her Aegis could protect her if she gets it up in time. It would be a good fight though. Not a cakewalk for Superman by a long shot. With that said, she is superior to the shazams in every way. Most heroes hold back when squaring off against each other. That's hardly indicative of anything. Superman has bested WW without wanting to murder her.

When has she lifted the entire earth alone? When has Thor failed to lift the entire earth?

Superman is stronger, their fights show it, and it's been stated how many times? really? WW can hang with the big boys but loses a solid majority to each character in this thread making her the weak link just like I said.

When has superman ever needed to beat her by using his freezebreath? It's like you just make things up all the time and try to get by that way.

Originally posted by h1a8
I disagree. Superman would take a large majority against Thor with ease (mainly because of the speed advantage). Which he doesn't use all that often. If this is powerset then Thor godblasts from the word go.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Most heroes hold back when squaring off against each other. That's hardly indicative of anything. Superman has bested WW without wanting to murder her. Superman is renowned and proven to hold back. The shazams are not, especially BA. WW counters their first attack with one of her own then combos them to ko. If Superman's first attack is a freeze breath then he wins. This is from the Earth towing feat. I corrected calculated and posted that the force she was exerting was equivalent to the weight of the Earth. It's an old post, ill try to find it or repost it. When Thor lifted the cat that was suppose to actually be the Midgar Serpent he only managed to get one of the four legs of the cat off the ground. So I take it he lifted at most 1/4 of the Serpent's weight. Also if who's stronger is based off quantifiable feats then WW is a lot stronger. I clearly agree that Superman is stronger but strength doesn't mean anything when two's strength are in each other's vicinity. WW wins a major majority against all except Superman. He froze her in Sacrifice. That is a very good tactic and his only chance of beating her. If he will fails to use it often then WW wins a solid majority from Superman. I can live with that.

Originally posted by h1a8
Superman is renowned and proven to hold back. The shazams are not, especially BA. WW counters their first attack with one of her own then combos them to ko. If Superman's first attack is a freeze breath then he wins. This is from the Earth towing feat. I corrected calculated and posted that the force she was exerting was equivalent to the weight of the Earth. It's an old post, ill try to find it or repost it. When Thor lifted the cat that was suppose to actually be the Midgar Serpent he only managed to get one of the four legs of the cat off the ground. So I take it he lifted at most 1/4 of the Serpent's weight. Also if who's stronger is based off quantifiable feats then WW is a lot stronger. I clearly agree that Superman is stronger but strength doesn't mean anything when two's strength are in each other's vicinity. WW wins a major majority against all except Superman. He froze her in Sacrifice. That is a very good tactic and his only chance of beating her. If he will fails to use it often then WW wins a solid majority from Superman. I can live with that. Yes, and even when he has held back he can still beat WW. Captain Marvel isn't out to kill heroes either. BA is the you worry about. Any of these characters take WW for a solid majority based on their durability and strength. WW pulls a fluke here or there with her lasso. Superman don't need no stinking freezebreath to win here.

I figured it was something you worked up on your home calculator spinning it for WW. Thor's stronger.

It seems it does. Superman hasn't easily snapped BA's wrists or Captain Marvel's. They are peers to him while WW is slightly below their class.

This isn't the only way he beats her. Come on, man.

If you want to use powersets then he does it every single time.

Originally posted by h1a8
I disagree. Superman would take a large majority against Thor with ease (mainly because of the speed advantage).

No he wouldnt and Thor would land just as many hits against supes than the other way around. Thor is fast enough to tag superman and thor hits would carry more of an impact than what superman could dish out. Lets not even forget the things that Thor could do to supes whereas supes output of power would be brushed off by thor.

The only thing that even gives supes a chance against thor is his speed and even thats not enough.

Originally posted by -Pr-
the ear shot was dumb. he uses his super hearing, that is capable of hearing shit in SPACE no less, and she manages to sneak up on him.

diana is capable of hanging with the big boys no doubt, but i don't see her beating the likes of clark, billy or adam for a majority without having some extra gear at her disposal...

What was wrong with it? Diana has been trained to be one of the best warriors on the planet, I'm pretty sure she could make herself silent.

Originally posted by carver9
What was wrong with it? Diana has been trained to be one of the best warriors on the planet, I'm pretty sure she could make herself silent.

his super hearing can hear heartbeats. she does have a heartbeat doesn't she? he can hear through the vacuum of space, which is supposed to impossible.

nobody is sneaking up on him unless they can make their entire body silent and eliminate any changes they make to the surrounding air.

double post sorry

Originally posted by carver9
No he wouldnt and Thor would land just as many hits against supes than the other way around. Thor is fast enough to tag superman and thor hits would carry more of an impact than what superman could dish out. Lets not even forget the things that Thor could do to supes whereas supes output of power would be brushed off by thor.

The only thing that even gives supes a chance against thor is his speed and even thats not enough.

I'm a firm believer in the combo to ko principle which is based on who hits first. That is why I favor the faster guys. Now if Thor was faster or just as fast as then I would be on his balls more than any of you here (guaranteed fact). Superman would be a piece of sh!t to me.

Notice, I rarely argue in any threads where speed is not a factor. Speed is one the reasons why I love Spider-man so much. I'm learning to not like speed that much. Rulk is now my favorite character and he isn't super uber fast.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Greater magic resistance than Thor? I think not.

Sorry, very late reply. I meant that THOR has proven magic resistance (not the Marvels), giving him an edge against the Marvels. I mean I stated siphoning of powers, etc. Thor can do that, the Marvels can't.

Also, I mistyped. I meant T1 has the versatility edge but T2 gets the 6/10 wins. ^_^

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Sorry, very late reply. I meant that THOR has proven magic resistance (not the Marvels), giving him an edge against the Marvels. I mean I stated siphoning of powers, etc. Thor can do that, the Marvels can't.

Also, I mistyped. I meant T1 has the versatility edge but T2 gets the 6/10 wins. ^_^

I'm not too sure who has more resistance to magic, but Billy has withstood an attack from a Thunderbolt and Adam has flown right through Spectre. Spectre is more divine, but a Thunderbolt is high end magic/science.

Orion via AF

Originally posted by manx422
Orion via AF Are you saying Orion solos again?

Originally posted by h1a8
I'm a firm believer in the combo to ko principle which is based on who hits first. That is why I favor the faster guys. Now if Thor was faster or just as fast as then I would be on his balls more than any of you here (guaranteed fact). Superman would be a piece of sh!t to me.

Notice, I rarely argue in any threads where speed is not a factor. Speed is one the reasons why I love Spider-man so much. I'm learning to not like speed that much. Rulk is now my favorite character and he isn't super uber fast.

I guess you didnt get my post, I admit that supes is faster but thor will get some licks. Superman would have to be hitting Thor with some AMAZING a** to ko him in a way that you're putting it because thor has the best damage soak in this battle.

Originally posted by carver9
I guess you didnt get my post, I admit that supes is faster but thor will get some licks. Superman would have to be hitting Thor with some AMAZING a** to ko him in a way that you're putting it because thor has the best damage soak in this battle.

The combo to ko principle is misunderstand by you. Read over it again to gain the full understanding.