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Who Wins?

Location - Bespin - Cloud City - On a Landing Pad

Weapons and Environmental Obstacles - Long Drops / Falls around the Landing Pad hence it being ''CLOUD'' city, Cargo Containers and boxes around the Platform hence it being a "LANDING PAD". Also Security Guards. ----- Lightsabers and Force Only.

Level of Skill - Count Dooku <Sith Lord (Episode II)> / Kyle Katarn <Jedi Master (Prime)>

(Please use Canon information and use references to back your claims. I don't want this topic to be turned into a farce.)

Thank You.

Enjoy
(If you can)

Sabers-Dooku.
Force-Katarn.


I could swear this was done recently.

i think i did it recently.

Lol I could swear almost all theversus threads were done recently.

Katarn wins. You said landing pad right? Katarn is more proficient in the force, and isn't afraid of using Dark Side powers. He can just throw dooku off the platform with his superior force powers (I'm not really sure that they are superior though) lol

He also has imp training, and uses various weapons that dooku doesn't. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Kyle_Katarn

the pic that says Kyle Katarn often carried copious amounts of armament.

Out of curiosity what has Kyle Katarn actually displayed with the Force?

I think the Count has this. Katarn is good, but do you think he'd have been able to dominate Obi-wan as easily as Dooku did?

Possibly. You must remember Katarn comes from a completely different Breed of Jedi than Dooku did. NJO Jedi aren't afraid to play dirty.

Even though I would think that Katarn has this.

For reasons of

1 - He's Younger (Does not mean much in terms of the force but it must count for something.)

2 - He killed Dark Jedi of the likes of Jerec and Desann with Desann having fresh Valley of the Jedi energy within himself.

3 - He held his own against Caedus who is more powerful than Anakin Skywalker and we all know what happened to Dooku at the hands of Anakin.

I'm just pointed out what I think would be relevant to Katarn's side.

Now for Dooku

1) More Experience
2) Beat Anakin (EP II) and Obi-Wan-Kenobi (EP II & III) like it was nothing. I did not even see him break a sweat and then he held his own somewhat against Yoda.
3) Roughly the third best Lightsaber Duelist in the entire galaxy at that time.

For number 3 I gotta point out Kyle is third to Luke Skywalker as well. or at least seems to be so. I don't know I still stand by Kyle though.

I'm not negating anything, just contextualizing.

Originally posted by MasterAshenVor
Even though I would think that Katarn has this.

For reasons of

1 - He's Younger (Does not mean much in terms of the force but it must count for something.)

2 - He killed Dark Jedi of the likes of Jerec and Desann with Desann having fresh Valley of the Jedi energy within himself.

3 - He held his own against Caedus who is more powerful than Anakin Skywalker and we all know what happened to Dooku at the hands of Anakin.1.) Stamina most of all.

2.) Jerec was imbued with the Valley as well. But measuring up Jerec and Desann to Dooku is kinda iffy. I just don't see the High Inquisitor and a scarcely trained failed Jedi Padawan able to compete with Dooku. Least not in sabers. Jerec apparently had some god-powers.

3.) A>B>C, but it can work. Caedus=Vader (in-universe opinions aside) roughly, but does Vader=tEh z0ne Anakin? In terms of clarity and focus as they're combined with a saber duel?

Originally posted by MasterAshenVor
I'm just pointed out what I think would be relevant to Katarn's side.

Now for Dooku

1) More Experience
2) Beat Anakin (EP II) and Obi-Wan-Kenobi (EP II & III) like it was nothing. I did not even see him break a sweat and then he held his own somewhat against Yoda.
3) Roughly the third best Lightsaber Duelist in the entire galaxy at that time.

For number 3 I gotta point out Kyle is third to Luke Skywalker as well. or at least seems to be so. I don't know I still stand by Kyle though. 1.) Arguable. Experience is measured in deeds more than lifespan. Amount of experience gained per deed is subjective to endless debate. Katarn's many sexy adventures vs. Dooku's many crazy nights. Who knows?

2.) AotC Anakin would get tooled by both Katarn and Dooku (obviously, he already did with one) so he's a "meh". Same with Kenobi. A little display of Force prowess seems to do it with him. Soresu be damned.

3.) True. And Battlemaster Katarn merits like the same thing.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
1.) Arguable. Experience is measured in deeds more than lifespan. Amount of experience gained per deed is subjective to endless debate. Katarn's many sexy adventures vs. Dooku's many crazy nights. Who knows?

Haha, Dooku has the sexier accent, I think he wins that one. No, youre right, we dont really know.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
2.) AotC Anakin would get tooled by both Katarn and Dooku (obviously, he already did with one) so he's a "meh". Same with Kenobi. A little display of Force prowess seems to do it with him. Soresu be damned.

I really have a hard time seeing Katarn toss Obi-wan around the way Dooku was able to. We know that Dooku's force powers were basically enough that Yoda couldn't defeat him with just the Force.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
3.) True. And Battlemaster Katarn merits like the same thing.

Well, I actually put Dooku at fourth, but its third or fourth out of TEN THOUSAND very capable Jedi and Sith. Katarn was way up their (obviously behind Luke and Jacen, possibly Corran as well.) The bigger difference though is that Dooku, Mace, Yoda, and Sidious were basically in a league of their own. Kyle would have a hard time against Saba, Kyp, Solusar, Jaina, Mara, Lumiya (maybe even lose to her), and so on. He's good, but not in a higher league like Dooku was.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Haha, Dooku has the sexier accent, I think he wins that one. No, youre right, we dont really know. I hope you're not insinuating that Jeff Bennett's multi-talented voice loses him ground here? He could voice Saruman if he wanted.



Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
I really have a hard time seeing Katarn toss Obi-wan around the way Dooku was able to. We know that Dooku's force powers were basically enough that Yoda couldn't defeat him with just the Force. Though not as problematic as the KotOR fellas, it's still rather difficult to compare the NJO to the PT. Not to mention I don't know much about Katarn outside Outcast and people's talk of him holding off Caedus--who more or less rivals Vader. In strict use of offensive Force powers I see Katarn winning.



Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Well, I actually put Dooku at fourth, but its third or fourth out of TEN THOUSAND very capable Jedi and Sith. Katarn was way up their (obviously behind Luke and Jacen, possibly Corran as well.) The bigger difference though is that Dooku, Mace, Yoda, and Sidious were basically in a league of their own. Kyle would have a hard time against Saba, Kyp, Solusar, Jaina, Mara, Lumiya (maybe even lose to her), and so on. He's good, but not in a higher league like Dooku was. Well Kyle was the Battlemaster for a reason. I don't know anything about Saba or Kam so I can't say anything, but placing on par(ish) or under the likes of Kyp, Jaina, and Mara is pretty damn good, especially considering where they themselves stand. And earning recognition from Caedus is something too. That said, Dooku perfected a saber style specifically designed for duelling, and it's a style Katarn is unfamiliar with (I assume). In a strict saber duel I can't see Katarn winning.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I hope you're not insinuating that Jeff Bennett's multi-talented voice loses him ground here? He could voice Saruman if he wanted.

Touche.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Though not as problematic as the KotOR fellas, it's still rather difficult to compare the NJO to the PT. Not to mention I don't know much about Katarn outside Outcast and people's talk of him holding off Caedus--who more or less rivals Vader. In strict use of offensive Force powers I see Katarn winning.

Could you see Katarn obliterating Obi-wan the way Dooku did? How about matching Yoda in a Force fight? I can't, so I'm giving that to Dooku.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Well Kyle was the Battlemaster for a reason. I don't know anything about Saba or Kam so I can't say anything, but placing on par(ish) or under the likes of Kyp, Jaina, and Mara is pretty damn good, especially considering where they themselves stand. And earning recognition from Caedus is something too. That said, Dooku perfected a saber style specifically designed for duelling, and it's a style Katarn is unfamiliar with (I assume). In a strict saber duel I can't see Katarn winning.

The Battlemaster title just means that he was the guy who taught people lightsaber stuff. It's similar to saying that a physics professor at a university is better at physics than a guy running CERN. Yoda, Mace, Depa, Obi-wan, Anakin, and many others were all arguably better than Drallig. I think the same is true for Kyle. He is way up there, but he has the title do to his position as the head lightsaber instructor.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Could you see Katarn obliterating Obi-wan the way Dooku did? How about matching Yoda in a Force fight? I can't, so I'm giving that to Dooku.As of LotF, I can see Katarn grabbing Kenobi's windpipe and hucking him. And I can also see Katarn bringing down some rocks and blasting a little lightning.



Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
The Battlemaster title just means that he was the guy who taught people lightsaber stuff. It's similar to saying that a physics professor at a university is better at physics than a guy running CERN. Yoda, Mace, Depa, Obi-wan, Anakin, and many others were all arguably better than Drallig. I think the same is true for Kyle. He is way up there, but he has the title do to his position as the head lightsaber instructor. I know. Like I said, I don't know much about Katarn's saber skills. I base my position on his abilities on Caedus' recognition of his skills. Sith Lord that's second to Luke saying you're good... way to go Kyle.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
As of LotF, I can see Katarn grabbing Kenobi's windpipe and hucking him. And I can also see Katarn bringing down some rocks and blasting a little lightning.

We've never seen Katarn demonstrate anything to show he is that powerful though. Nothing I can think of at least.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I know. Like I said, I don't know much about Katarn's saber skills. I base my position on his abilities on Caedus' recognition of his skills. Sith Lord that's second to Luke saying you're good... way to go Kyle.

Second to Luke by a large margin. And yeah, Jacen said Kyle was good, but I think he'd say the same about Dooku as well.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
We've never seen Katarn demonstrate anything to show he is that powerful though. Nothing I can think of at least.I'm going by what I know from Outcast--it's all I have on the guy. The scene where he dangles Tavion over a pit and then waves his hand to toss her back to the ledge. Circa 12 ABY. Add 28-29 years, he better have something else going for him. And there was a case that Advent made for him in one of her threads. It sounded so good.



Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Second to Luke by a large margin. And yeah, Jacen said Kyle was good, but I think he'd say the same about Dooku as well. He had better. Makashi god's gonna be impressin' everyone from the NJO.

Who said that Makashi was not used in the NJO? I've never seen any evidence of that.

Ataru / Djem So / Shii Cho and Niman were used if I'm not mistaken

So why not Makashi?

There was no one to teach Luke's Order the old styles, that's why they developed the Strong, Medium, and Fast styles. Makashi especially would have been foreign, even amongst the PT Jedi, there were few who practiced it. Being designed for strictly lightsaber-lightsaber combat, it would'nt have been very practical in the age where there were no more saber-wielding opponents.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
There was no one to teach Luke's Order the old styles, that's why they developed the Strong, Medium, and Fast styles. Makashi especially would have been foreign, even amongst the PT Jedi, there were few who practiced it. Being designed for strictly lightsaber-lightsaber combat, it wouldn't have been very practical in the age where there were no more saber-wielding opponents.
I'm doing this because i'm bored.

Originally posted by mattatom
I'm doing this because i'm bored.

Plus, it's just too damn fun to catch the Canadian on these things. (No whatshesaid stuff!)

Originally posted by Slash_KMC
Plus, it's just too damn fun to catch the Canadian on these things. (No whatshesaid stuff!) That was a one time thing as it was too irresistable to resist.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I'm going by what I know from Outcast--it's all I have on the guy. The scene where he dangles Tavion over a pit and then waves his hand to toss her back to the ledge. Circa 12 ABY. Add 28-29 years, he better have something else going for him. And there was a case that Advent made for him in one of her threads. It sounded so good.

Thats true. I would be pretty shocked if Obi-wan isn't FAR more powerful than Tavion though.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
He had better. Makashi god's gonna be impressin' everyone from the NJO.

There was no one to teach Luke's Order the old styles, that's why they developed the Strong, Medium, and Fast styles. Makashi especially would have been foreign, even amongst the PT Jedi, there were few who practiced it. Being designed for strictly lightsaber-lightsaber combat, it would'nt have been very practical in the age where there were no more saber-wielding opponents.

I don't think this is correct. They rediscovered the original styles in a holocron Cin Drallig had made.

exactly my point.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
I don't think this is correct. They rediscovered the original styles in a holocron Cin Drallig had made. The ancient Great Holocron, Drallig had an entry on the seven lightsaber forms. It was rediscovered in 40 ABY and left in Tionne Solusar's care at the Ossus Library. Nowhere near long enough for anyone to gain intricate knowledge of the styles.

Three and a half years is a pretty long time to learn new forms when they already understand lightsaber combat very well.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Three and a half years is a pretty long time to learn new forms when they already understand lightsaber combat very well. One of those years was during the war, and the other two and a half are NOT enough. If it was then the NJO are children of the gods, cousins of Hercules--and nothing less. Not to mention we're now delving in to speculation.

Mark McGwire was stronger than ANH Vader. He could have learned how to fight with a lightsaber in just a few minutes, and then he would have overpowered Dooku.

No shit, Mark McGwire put a dent in the Sun Crusher using a porcelain twig.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
One of those years was during the war, and the other two and a half are NOT enough. If it was then the NJO are children of the gods, cousins of Hercules--and nothing less. Not to mention we're now delving in to speculation.

Sorry for the delayed response. Unplanned trip out of town.

What are we speculating on? Cin Drallig stated that it would take the average Jedi about ten years to master form six. Yeah, its not the same form, but if a form that combines elements of all the others can be mastered in ten years, two and a half should be more than enough time to gain at least a basic understanding. Anyway, we are getting a little off topic I think.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Sorry for the delayed response. Unplanned trip out of town.

What are we speculating on? Cin Drallig stated that it would take the average Jedi about ten years to master form six. Yeah, its not the same form, but if a form that combines elements of all the others can be mastered in ten years, two and a half should be more than enough time to gain at least a basic understanding. Anyway, we are getting a little off topic I think. We're speculating because we don't actually know who's been studying what out of the Holocron. I'd actually be pretty amazed if Kyle Katarn specifically studied Makashi AT ALL, nevermind for two and a half years.

Why would he not have studied it? Thats not the kind of thing the Orders battlemaster would just leave alone.

True. But did he?

Darth_Glentract
Why would he not have studied it? Thats not the kind of thing the Orders battlemaster would just leave alone.

It's quite possible that formal knowledge of the seven forms died with Order 66. Battlemasters, btw, (according to the Wizards of the Coast entry in the Jedi Academy Miniatures) are the most skilled swordsmen in the Order. Drallig and Katarn are specifically mentioned, though Dooku was "the Temple's most agile instructor" (LoE).

Originally posted by Gideon
It's quite possible that formal knowledge of the seven forms died with Order 66. Battlemasters, btw, (according to the Wizards of the Coast entry in the Jedi Academy Miniatures) are the most skilled swordsmen in the Order. Drallig and Katarn are specifically mentioned, though Dooku was "the Temple's most agile instructor" (LoE).

We know that it did not. As stated a few posts above, they were rediscovered in 40 ABY. I also have a really hard time taking seriously any statement that states Drallig as more skilled than Yoda or Mace and Katarn as more skilled than Luke. The claim is void.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
True. But did he?

I think its obvious he did, as, like I said, its not the kind of thing the battlemaster would just leave alone.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
We know that it did not. As stated a few posts above, they were rediscovered in 40 ABY. I also have a really hard time taking seriously any statement that states Drallig as more skilled than Yoda or Mace and Katarn as more skilled than Luke. The claim is void. Why? Technical skill doesn't equate to most proficient, or most capable. Vader was far more technically skilled than Luke, but Luke bested him. We've been over all that before when talking about Anoon, too. So it's not void just because you don't like it. Are you really going to say that Anakin was more technically skilled that Dooku???? And who got pwned there? Exactly... technical skill does not automatically earn you a victory.

Darth_Glentract
We know that it did not. As stated a few posts above, they were rediscovered in 40 ABY.

Formal knowledge of the seven forms as regards the actual disciplines. Modern researchers are aware of the infamous Greek Fire; that doesn't mean we can replicate it. The fact that Skywalker's new Jedi Order is now aware that there were seven forms of lightsaber combat does not mean that any of them are Masters of them.



Whoa.

I'm not sure if anyone's told you, Glentract, but it really doesn't matter what statements you like and which you don't; if they're canon, they apply. I realize cherrypicking was a common fixture amongst Janus and co., but I thought you would have outgrown that.

Anoon Bondara, who is the embodiment of a random ass Jedi, possesses skills with a blade that rival any of the eminent members of the Jedi High Council during the PT.

Technical skill, as Darth Subjekt just mentioned, is an area you're not considering, and it's an area in which the likes of Yoda, Windu, and even Luke Skywalker can be outstripped.

You have offered nothing as to why the statement should be void other than your personal opinion. And given your entire history with Marka Ragnos (I recall a fanfiction of yours where he solos most of his peers and rivals without breaking a sweat), your word alone isn't something any of us is going to consider.

Originally posted by Darth Subjekt
Why? Technical skill doesn't equate to most proficient, or most capable. Vader was far more technically skilled than Luke, but Luke bested him. We've been over all that before when talking about Anoon, too. So it's not void just because you don't like it. Are you really going to say that Anakin was more technically skilled that Dooku???? And who got pwned there? Exactly... technical skill does not automatically earn you a victory.

Fair enough. I admit I didn't consider that when reading the 'skill.'

Originally posted by Gideon
Formal knowledge of the seven forms as regards the actual disciplines. Modern researchers are aware of the infamous Greek Fire; that doesn't mean we can replicate it. The fact that Skywalker's new Jedi Order is now aware that there were seven forms of lightsaber combat does not mean that any of them are Masters of them.



Whoa.

I'm not sure if anyone's told you, Glentract, but it really doesn't matter what statements you like and which you don't; if they're canon, they apply. I realize cherrypicking was a common fixture amongst Janus and co., but I thought you would have outgrown that.

Anoon Bondara, who is the embodiment of a random ass Jedi, possesses skills with a blade that rival any of the eminent members of the Jedi High Council during the PT.

Technical skill, as Darth Subjekt just mentioned, is an area you're not considering, and it's an area in which the likes of Yoda, Windu, and even Luke Skywalker can be outstripped.

You have offered nothing as to why the statement should be void other than your personal opinion. And given your entire history with Marka Ragnos (I recall a fanfiction of yours where he solos most of his peers and rivals without breaking a sweat), your word alone isn't something any of us is going to consider.

I'm not saying that they mastered them the forms. I am saying though that they had three and a half years so far to become familiar with them. It's more than enough time to understand the basics, even though, yes, it wouldn't yet be mastered. However, lets say you're right, then it only goes to support my argument that Dooku is superior to Katarn.

Seriously though, a work of fanfiction from several years ago is pretty dumb to go by. Weak sauce, Gideon.

The whole point of that example was to show you that no one's opinion of a statement -- not even yours -- is relevant to a debate. The statement is canon, therefore, short of an obvious and irrevocable contradiction, it remains canon.

As for the rest, I don't disagree with you that Dooku is superior to Katarn. He surely is overall.

That's ridiculous. The whole reason this is fun is to interpret the stories and figure out who is more powerful through logic. If a statement is wack, given that Lucas has stated that there is no official "power scale," it should be ignored if there is reasonable argument against it.

i agree but... that isn't how things seem to work here...

I like the interpretation part, but only if it's backed up by something.

so where does it say that Drillig was more skilled than Yoda again? Bondara was more skilled than the both of them.

Apparently Cin is more 'technically' skilled because he was the battlemaster of the temple.

um, being battlemaster alone doesn't mean that.

It means he had time to teach while Yoda was busy,i don't know, LEADING THE ORDER. Ditto for Luke and Katarn.

The quotes would need to say that drillig was more skilled than Yoda, and Katarn was more skilled than Luke before it would be true.

Originally posted by truejedi
um, being battlemaster alone doesn't mean that.

It means he had time to teach while Yoda was busy,i don't know, LEADING THE ORDER. Ditto for Luke and Katarn.

The quotes would need to say that drillig was more skilled than Yoda, and Katarn was more skilled than Luke before it would be true. I hope that wasn't directed at me, I was merely summarising. Can't deny Kas'im was the best there though.

not directed at anyone really. whoever it was that said Drillag was more skilled than yoda. I will need proof. That he was battlemaster is not proof. that is all.

Originally posted by truejedi
not directed at anyone really. whoever it was that said Drillag was more skilled than yoda. I will need proof. That he was battlemaster is not proof. that is all. Originally posted by Gideon
It's quite possible that formal knowledge of the seven forms died with Order 66. Battlemasters, btw, (according to the Wizards of the Coast entry in the Jedi Academy Miniatures) are the most skilled swordsmen in the Order. Drallig and Katarn are specifically mentioned, though Dooku was "the Temple's most agile instructor" (LoE).

So, Wizards of the Coast entry in the Jedi Academy Miniatures, say that.

Originally posted by mattatom
So, Wizards of the Coast entry in the Jedi Academy Miniatures, say that.

tell me mattatom, do you believe the wizards of the coast entry in the jediacademy miniatures? i don't know if i believe it to be canon or not. especially since it is contradicted by other sources.

Originally posted by truejedi
tell me mattatom, do you believe the wizards of the coast entry in the jediacademy miniatures? i don't know if i believe it to be canon or not. especially since it is contradicted by other sources. Personally. No. I was just saying what i see.

and i thank you! i hope someone has a better source than that though. That's like saying the instruction manuel for my star wars stratego game is canon. And in it, it says that a 4 always beats a 5, and so on, so it could make our entire forum quite obsolete pretty quickly.

Originally posted by truejedi
and i thank you! i hope someone has a better source than that though. That's like saying the instruction manuel for my star wars stratego game is canon. And in it, it says that a 4 always beats a 5, and so on, so it could make our entire forum quite obsolete pretty quickly. It isn't already?

no. i talked about a bunch of topics. And so when people discuss them, our forum will leap back into beautiful full bloom.

Hence the Doom & Bloom.

Wizards of the Coast publishes all of the RPG books and ect. It's canon unless someone can find a blatant contradiction.

Accept it and move on.

the anoon bondara is a direct contradiction. Since HE was the most skilled jedi in the order, drillag, the battlemaster, could NOT have been the most skilled.

Originally posted by truejedi
the anoon bondara is a direct contradiction. Since HE was the most skilled jedi in the order, drillag, the battlemaster, could NOT have been the most skilled. Was Drallig battlemaster at the same point Anoon Bondara was alive?

truejedi
the anoon bondara is a direct contradiction.

no



#1. Anoon Bondara wasn't the most skilled Jedi in the Order. It was retconned by the Jedi Academy Sourcebook. He is one of the most skilled now.

#2. He died.



He was, according to this.

Seriously Gideon, you're being ridiculous. Some of us actually want to debate and enjoy the forum. There is no reason we can't use logic to form arguments. It really doesn't matter what some obscure quote somewhere says if there are reasonable arguments against it.

Darth_Glentract
Seriously Gideon, you're being ridiculous. Some of us actually want to debate and enjoy the forum. There is no reason we can't use logic to form arguments. It really doesn't matter what some obscure quote somewhere says if there are reasonable arguments against it.

No, Glentract, you're being ridiculous. Seriously. Your definition of debate consists of "picking which 'obscure statements' we like and don't like." For example, I don't see you dropping that 'obscure statement' that Marka Ragnos was the most powerful of the ancient Sith anytime soon, despite the fact that there is nothing to corroborate it. If we dropped obscure statements entirely, then the likes of Ragnos, Nihilus, Sion, Revan, et al. would be eliminated from the discussion completely.

You want to debate? Apply the statements into a logical process and go from there. There is wiggle room, but that requires a cogent, well-articulated argument that is backed up by sources. That's where the debate comes from.

The days of cherrypicking ended with Lightsnake, just in case you missed the memo.

Originally posted by Gideon
No, Glentract, you're being ridiculous. Seriously. Your definition of debate consists of "picking which 'obscure statements' we like and don't like." For example, I don't see you dropping that 'obscure statement' that Marka Ragnos was the most powerful of the ancient Sith anytime soon, despite the fact that there is nothing to corroborate it. If we dropped obscure statements entirely, then the likes of Ragnos, Nihilus, Sion, Revan, et al. would be eliminated from the discussion completely.

You want to debate? Apply the statements into a logical process and go from there. There is wiggle room, but that requires a cogent, well-articulated argument that is backed up by sources. That's where the debate comes from.

The days of cherrypicking ended with Lightsnake, just in case you missed the memo.

QFT(wtf does it mean anyways?)

Clarification: when I say it ended with Lightsnake, I meant he stopped it, not that he was the last one to cherrypick.

This isn't KOTOR and you're not HK-4

just so i've got this straight then, you are quoting a rule book for a role-playing game and calling it canon?

I don't want to misconstrue your statements. Are you seriously doing that?

Originally posted by truejedi
just so i've got this straight then, you are quoting a rule book for a role-playing game and calling it canon?

I don't want to misconstrue your statements. Are you seriously doing that?

...They are canon. C-canon.

honest question then: do you consider the instruction manuals for say Star Wars video games, or board games (i have like 5 SW board games) c-canon as well?

If not, why not?


And as well: do you consider promotional materials to be canon?

RPG books are specifically listed in the canon structure as C-canon.

That's interesting. I didn't know an actual official structure existed. Can you link it for me?

Originally posted by truejedi
That's interesting. I didn't know an actual official structure existed. Can you link it for me?

Yar.

http://forums.starwars.com/thread.jspa?forumID=24&start=15&threadID=152583&msRange=15

^ Last post of this page, by Leland Chee.

thanks. And i guess, since board games are part of the "everything else" that Chee mentions, their instruction manuel would be considered canon. This opens up argument i never bothered to form before to be honest.

Dooku in all categories