Monarch Vs Tyrant (Marvel)

Stoic

Originally posted by Cubey
What the hell does Prime have to do with anything.

Monarch faced off against him and now we're using him as a scale? erm

Tyrant fought Thanos, Monarch would beat him. Guess that means Monarch > Tyrant. Doesn't work.

Not only does Prime carry a huge jobber aura (lol stomping Mxy) but he was also amped by Oan energy, and Monarch was literally playing with him as you would a child. He had him boxed in most of the fight, while Prime managed to breach his armor after he let his guard down. Still not beating him though, considering Monarch was still alive afterwards.

Prime is the gauge, he's the scale, and he was weighed and measured. He helps to measure Monarch as well, and by my rough estimate Monarch would be eaten by Tyrant as the battle continued. Monarch is very energetic, Tyrant devours bio energy, and this makes him stronger. My guess is that at the end Monarch would look like the guy that tried to fight Jason Vorhees, but found out that it wasn't enough. He'd be left quivering as Tyrant sealed his fate... with a smile.

You see Tyrant is basically a super powered cosmic vampire, which is how he was written.

Thanos was being amped, doesn't count.

Cubey

Originally posted by Stoic
Prime is the gauge, he's the scale, and he was weighed and measured. He helps to measure Monarch as well, and by my rough estimate Monarch would be eaten by Tyrant as the battle continued. Monarch is very energetic, Tyrant devours bio energy, and this makes him stronger. My guess is that at the end Monarch would look like the guy that tried to fight Jason Vorhees, but found out that it wasn't enough. He'd be left quivering as Tyrant sealed his fate... with a smile.

You see Tyrant is basically a super powered cosmic vampire, which is how he was written.

Thanos was being amped, doesn't count.

Prime is never the gauge. It's like scaling A-Bomb vs his showing against Rulk. A-Bomb held his own, Surfer got stomped, so A-Bomb > Surfer? Monarch held his own, Mxy got stomped, so I'll just say Monarch > Mxy, fair?

Prime was toyed with the whole time, and never once actually did anything of importance of significance during the fight. Monarch let off a nuke in jest, and Prime only breached his armor because Monarch wanted to be all arrogant and whatnot.

And Prime was amped too, but suddenly it counts? Wtf.

Stoic

Originally posted by Cubey
Prime is never the gauge. It's like scaling A-Bomb vs his showing against Rulk. A-Bomb held his own, Surfer got stomped, so A-Bomb > Surfer? Monarch held his own, Mxy got stomped, so I'll just say Monarch > Mxy, fair?

Prime was toyed with the whole time, and never once actually did anything of importance of significance during the fight. Monarch let off a nuke in jest, and Prime only breached his armor because Monarch wanted to be all arrogant and whatnot.

And Prime was amped too, but suddenly it counts? Wtf.

You know that it's not as simple as that. The Surfer isn't a brawler, nor was he the current Surfer, he was plucked out of time from when he first became a Herald. He was green, while Rulk was seasoned.

Tyrant would have no problem handling Monarch's energy blasts, which would make him more powerful due to his energy leaching powers. There is also no evidence to suggest that Tyrant wouldn't be able to tear that suit off of him. Tyrant has no need of a suit, he is Tyrant, and Tyrant would eat Monarch.

Cubey

Originally posted by Stoic
You know that it's not as simple as that. The Surfer isn't a brawler, nor was he the current Surfer, he was plucked out of time from when he first became a Herald. He was green, while Rulk was seasoned.

Tyrant would have no problem handling Monarch's energy blasts, which would make him more powerful due to his energy leaching powers. There is also no evidence to suggest that Tyrant wouldn't be able to tear that suit off of him. Tyrant has no need of a suit, he is Tyrant, and Tyrant would eat Monarch.

He also beat Terrax. And Thor.

Tyrant gets stronger from the energy of biospheres.

Also, Monarch could just tear the suit himself as some crude last-ditch lol.

Stoic

Originally posted by Cubey
He also beat Terrax. And Thor.

Tyrant gets stronger from the energy of biospheres.

Also, Monarch could just tear the suit himself as some crude last-ditch lol.

Tyrant devours whatever energy is available, whether it be from a planet, or a sentient, Monarch's last mistake would be to blast this guy, and you and I know, that Monarch would blast him. Galactus himself was powering him up with his energy blasts.

Terrax was whooped because he trusted Rulk, besides Rulk is a badass.

Cubey

Originally posted by Stoic
Tyrant devours whatever energy is available, whether it be from a planet, or a sentient, Monarch's last mistake would be to blast this guy, and you and I know, that Monarch would blast him. Galactus himself was powering him up with his energy blasts.

Terrax was whooped because he trusted Rulk, besides Rulk is a badass.

He can also manipulate Tyrant's energy blasts. He doesn't have to necesarrily blast him.

What about Thor? That one has no excuse.

iceman24567

Monarch for the vast majority more impressive

Stoic

Originally posted by Cubey
He can also manipulate Tyrant's energy blasts. He doesn't have to necesarrily blast him.

What about Thor? That one has no excuse.
Wait a sec, are you comparing Rulk to Tyrant? He beat Thor. That's as far as it goes with Rulk in my opinion. You could send either or both Rulk and Thor, and Tyrant would beat them.

Since I don't know why you brought Rulk into this I'll leave it at that.

This thing about Monarch manipulating Tyrant's energy is uncertain at best, but what is certain is that Tyrant would have the advantage of consuming Monarch's, allowing him to become even more powerful.

When Galactus made Tyrant he made a near equal to himself in terms of power, which was also stated on panel.

thanos-prime

tyrant wins dp and fp

Prep-Man

Monarch.

Black bolt z

What tier is monarch?And DP tyrant?

FP tyrant stomps though.

D_Dude1210

DP Tyrant vs Monarch would be a good fight.

LOL at ppl who think Monarch beats FP Tyrant. When was Monarch ever categorized as an abstract?

amnesia

DP tyrant= Monarch wins. Hard.

FP tyrants stomps the shit out of monarch smile

carver9

Originally posted by Black bolt z
What tier is monarch?And DP tyrant?

FP tyrant stomps though.

Both are sub skyfather at best but again, some people look at versatility when ranking characters and Monarch did nothing versatile wise except shoot powerful blast and physically destroy people with his fist. With that said, if we are using Illa tier placement, he would be Elite Herald (versatility) but in my eyes he is a skyfather.

Galan007

Originally posted by Stoic
Prime was beaten by 2 Supermen laughing out loud

carver9

Originally posted by Galan007
laughing out loud

You mean IC Prime was beaten after he'd been exiled for "years" in the speed force under a red sun, after he battled most of DC's heroes simultaneously, and after the 2 Supermen ran him directly through yet another red sun?

Yeah, I really wouldnt call that an reason to downplay the character. It was basically prime without his powers fighting two other Supermen without their powers and I could see Prime losing that fight.

Galan007

Originally posted by carver9
Yeah, I really wouldnt call that an reason to downplay the character. It was basically prime without his powers fighting two other Supermen without their powers and I could see Prime losing that fight. Yup. An average adult should be able to beat up an average teenager.

"Id"

Bio-Energy = Atomic Energy?

I don't believe Monarchs blast will fuel Tyrant at all.

Galan007

^ I agree.

Stoic

Nah, he'd absorb it. Galactus was insulted by Ultron once, Ultron began his assault, and shot an atomic blast at big G. Galactus then proceeded to drain Ultron. This all happened in the Secret Wars.

Tyrant as I stated was created in Galactus' image, so yea he'd absorb it and become more powerful.
Like I said Monarch would die, or have to flee.

Galan007

facepalm

Cubey

Originally posted by Stoic
Wait a sec, are you comparing Rulk to Tyrant? He beat Thor. That's as far as it goes with Rulk in my opinion. You could send either or both Rulk and Thor, and Tyrant would beat them.

Since I don't know why you brought Rulk into this I'll leave it at that.

This thing about Monarch manipulating Tyrant's energy is uncertain at best, but what is certain is that Tyrant would have the advantage of consuming Monarch's, allowing him to become even more powerful.

When Galactus made Tyrant he made a near equal to himself in terms of power, which was also stated on panel.

No, the reason I brought Rulk into this is to show you why powerscaling jobber aura characters doesn't work. Rulk beat Thor, but A-Bomb held his own. Does this mean A-Bomb > Thor? Since you were so intent on using Prime losing to two Supermen to downplay Monarch, when Prime also has feats like owning Mxy.

Scaling from him DOES NOT WORK.

Now, Monarch's blasts MIGHT power him, until he learns what's happening. After that, he uses his energy manipulation. Did you forget Monarch can absorb as well?

Quit wanking him.

Stoic

Originally posted by Cubey
No, the reason I brought Rulk into this is to show you why powerscaling jobber aura characters doesn't work. Rulk beat Thor, but A-Bomb held his own. Does this mean A-Bomb > Thor? Since you were so intent on using Prime losing to two Supermen to downplay Monarch, when Prime also has feats like owning Mxy.

Scaling from him DOES NOT WORK.

Now, Monarch's blasts MIGHT power him, until he learns what's happening. After that, he uses his energy manipulation. Did you forget Monarch can absorb as well?

Quit wanking him.

If I am wanking Tyrant, would that mean that you're wanking Monarch? This is a good question that you should think about. In fact I'm not wanking Tyrant in the least, what I am doing is debating Tyrant from the writers perspective.

Never once did I add to Tyrant, powers that he does not possess. The fact of the matter is that Tyrant was stopped by the Ultimate Nullifier, and not Galactus, in fact Tyrant was able to cause Galactus pain, he was actually doing better in his battle with Galactus than the Inbetweener did against Galactus. That is until he was Nullified.

Originally posted by carver9
Both are sub skyfather at best but again, some people look at versatility when ranking characters and Monarch did nothing versatile wise except shoot powerful blast and physically destroy people with his fist. With that said, if we are using Illa tier placement, he would be Elite Herald (versatility) but in my eyes he is a skyfather.

Can a Skyfather or sub Skyfather take on Galactus, if he was serious? Would a Skyfather vs Galactus leave the Universe in tatters? Or would Galactus put the Skyfather down long before it ever got to that point?

I'm just going by what was written, but by all means if there are people out there that would like to make up their minds based on how they feel about a certain character go for it.

Cubey

Originally posted by Stoic
If I am wanking Tyrant, would that mean that you're wanking Monarch? This is a good question that you should think about. In fact I'm not wanking Tyrant in the least, what I am doing is debating Tyrant from the writers perspective.

Never once did I add to Tyrant, powers that he does not possess. The fact of the matter is that Tyrant was stopped by the Ultimate Nullifier, and not Galactus, in fact Tyrant was able to cause Galactus pain, he was actually doing better in his battle with Galactus than the Inbetweener did against Galactus. That is until he was Nullified.

You're wanking him by giving him things he was never said to have. You can do this to pretty much every character through equivocation. For example, you're applying mental resistance/offense to him just because he was able to go toe-to-toe with Galactus.

You also have no way to be objective about the *author's* intentions.

I might be wanking Monarch, entirely possible. But I already know he'd lose to FP Tyrant for sure. I just think it's a bit fanboyish to say the same for DP Tyrant is all happy

Tyrant was nullified, yeah. But he was also beat by Galactus, so we know he doesn't HAVE to be nullified to be beaten.

Stoic

Galactus is a far cry from Monarch though. You should mature a little, and stop resorting to name calling.

Cubey

Name-calling? Why so sensitive?

Anyways, Monarch is a far-cry from Galactus, but Galactus was fighting FP Tyrant. With DP Tyrant, it'd take a lot less.

thanos-prime

Originally posted by Cubey
You're wanking him by giving him things he was never said to have. You can do this to pretty much every character through equivocation. For example, you're applying mental resistance/offense to him just because he was able to go toe-to-toe with Galactus.

You also have no way to be objective about the *author's* intentions.

I might be wanking Monarch, entirely possible. But I already know he'd lose to FP Tyrant for sure. I just think it's a bit fanboyish to say the same for DP Tyrant is all happy

Tyrant was nullified, yeah. But he was also beat by Galactus, so we know he doesn't HAVE to be nullified to be beaten. i believe it was stated that tyrant grows weaker when being in close proximity to galactus so it's no wonder galactus can beat him if he is steadily growing weaker during the fight.
Why is it fanboyish to say he could lose to dp tyrant? dp tyrant took on a thanos amp'd by an orb and thanos was getting his ass beat and was unable to phase tyrant.

Stoic

Originally posted by Cubey
Name-calling? Why so sensitive?

Anyways, Monarch is a far-cry from Galactus, but Galactus was fighting FP Tyrant. With DP Tyrant, it'd take a lot less.

First of all DP Tyrant wasn't powering up to defeat Galactus, his goal was to dominate the Universe, hence the name Tyrant. Second of all while Tyrant was in what many have grown accustomed to calling a depowered state, he went up (pay attention) to Galactus' very face, and challenged him for ownership of Morg.

Words were exchanged between the two, which boiled down to them agreeing that a battle between the two would result in universal destruction (writers perspective not mine). What does this tell you about how powerful Tyrant was in this so called depowered state? I know what it tells me.

Galactus had a similar run in with a guy threatening another of his Herald's, his name was Koon if I'm not mistaken. Well do you know what Galactus did to Koon? He dismissed his power and used him to improve his ships on board computer by physically hooking him up to it. Why? because Koon like many other characters in the Marvel U are beneath him, Tyrant however proved that he was not, because if he were, Galactus would have trashed him on the spot, as he did previously to Koon.

In a forum battle both combatants fight at the best of their abilities, so if a Tyrant vs Galactus thread were to appear, many would use Galactus' ability to use massive TP attacks, mixed with hand to hand tactics, and energetic assaults, in an attempt to show who outweighs whom.

We never saw it on panel, but if these two were waging a war that decimated a universe I'd put my money on Galactus not pulling any punches (does this make sense)?

Why would it be so hard for you to accept that Galactus used this type of attack in concert with his other abilities? It is well within his power to do so isn't it? Tyrant a Skyfather? No no no no no!!! What Skyfather would be able to take on Galactus, and destroy a universe doing so?

In a forum battle if I started a thread called Aquaman vs Luke Cage, everyone and their grand mom would scream MIND RAPE FTW!!!! Even though Aquaman could hold his own against Cage. Why? Because it's part of his power set.

The assumption here is that if Galactus fought Tyrant to the ends of this decimated Universe and back again, he would have pulled out all of his weapons to put this guy down, and not hand him a bouquet of flowers with a smile.

Galactus did not beat Tyrant on panel, Tyrant was nullified, he would have won, but this would have taken a lengthy amount of time. Yes he was powered up and ready to take on Galactus in this fight, but it still doesn't dismiss the fact that when Tyrant was "depowered" that he made Galactus bow out.

I'm not sensitve to the least, I'm just saying that this is a discussion, and using name calling to get your point across seems a little childish.

Cubey

Originally posted by Stoic
First of all DP Tyrant wasn't powering up to defeat Galactus, his goal was to dominate the Universe, hence the name Tyrant. Second of all while Tyrant was in what many have grown accustomed to calling a depowered state, he went up (pay attention) to Galactus' very face, and challenged him for ownership of Morg.

He was absorbing power from biospheres of planets, was he not? So he wouldn't still be in his de-powered state. Obviously, that's why he was able to challenge Galactus after all that time of regaining power.

It tells me that someone who has been shown more than a few times to be a universal threat (Galactus) would be fighting with someone who could at least survive the assault. Doesn't mean Tyrant would even have a hand in it.

Though that's probably a very extreme way of putting it, it could also mean that "universal" destruction would be caused by wiping out tons of galaxies and lives. Doesn't Tyrant can unleash a universal wave like Monarch or Galactus.

Ok... So Tyrant could at the least hang with Galactus when he was at FP, or absorbing power from planets.

What about DP?

Yes, that's right. And they would be right because we have no inclination of Tyrant's mental prowess.

Because "destroying the universe" does not denote any type of mental assault. The image I get is Galactus and Tyrant simply clashing at each other and releasing large amounts of energy.

I have a hard time of it because there's a lack of on-panel proof of it.

You would think that, but considering Galactus WAS pulling punches in the fight, there's reasonable doubt.

I say he was pulling punches because he was obviously able to depower him, but didn't do so till after a titanic clash, which tells me he still had tricks he kept to himself.

Tyrant was nullified, but we already know Galactus was able to do it before. You still have no base to claim Tyrant would win again Galactus this time around.

What, saying it's fanboyish to think a non-amped Tyrant could beat a universe buster? laughing

Stoic

Did you read anything that I said? Tyrant in his first appearance captured Morg, Tyrant was not powered up yet, and he still went up to Galactus' very face, and challenged him for ownership of Morg, Galactus at that very moment said that a confrontation between the two of them would have caused universal destruction. Galactus then bowed out and Tyrant claimed proprietorship of Morg. Tyrant at that time was not powered up in the least.

Here's another example of Tyrant's energy absorption capabilities; Galactus blasted him, and he began draining the energy coming from Galactus, what about Tyrants other ability? He showed technopathic abilities as well. If Galactus made Tyrant in his image and Galactus used Hyperstorm like you and I would use a slurpie, this would be indicative of his ability to do the same to Monarch... and Monarch loves to blast the crap of of guys.

Let's see who would I place my bet on? An ancient super powered cosmic vampire, with the ability to challenge an Abstract being, and destroy a universe in the process, or some guy with super strength, atomic blasts, and a tin can for armor? I really think that this fight would resemble the one in Annihilation, you remember the one where Quasar fought Annihilus?

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Cubey
What, saying it's fanboyish to think a non-amped Tyrant could beat a universe buster? laughing

It's not really fanboyism to think that. Even though Monarch has a higher power output than DP Tyrant, DP Tyrant can just physically pierce Monarch's shell and absorb the explosion.

And yes, it's not out of the question for Tyrant tho absorb atomic energy. The sun is mostly a large nuclear reactor, and Surfer's been able to absorb energy there.

Stoic

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
It's not really fanboyism to think that. Even though Monarch has a higher power output than DP Tyrant, DP Tyrant can just physically pierce Monarch's shell and absorb the explosion.

And yes, it's not out of the question for Tyrant tho absorb atomic energy. The sun is mostly a large nuclear reactor, and Surfer's been able to absorb energy there.

That's exactly what I was trying to say Dude.

iceman24567

LOL at people still using DP Tyrants fight vs Galactus to prove he beats high end skyfathers Monarch easily

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by iceman24567
LOL at people still using DP Tyrants fight vs Galactus to prove he beats high end skyfathers Monarch easily

Doesn't answer the fact that the tactic might just work. It's been proven that the suit can be breached by a lot less than skyfathers after all. :-/

And what feats place Monarch at Odin-level?

iceman24567

Guardian amped Prime is the only person to breach it and he's a skyfather no expression

. Tanking shots from high herald characters without flinching then one shotting them casually. One shotting planets basically with a wave of his hand. Fighting a amped Prime physically the guy is a high end skyfather Odin level. Plus if Tyrant opens his shell he dies too but he won't reform later like Monarch

D_Dude1210

GA Prime might be more powerful than his already trans-tier regular self but he's no skyfather, kinda like Hulk at low herald doesn't make WWH mid-herald and WBH high herald. Tier increases should be much more than just power amps. Besides, DP Tyrant should be low skfather or top-tier trans to say the least.

Ppl aren't saying that DP Tyrant beats skyfathers. Ppl are saying that he can beat THIS particular skyfather (and I see Monarch as mid skyfather at best) due to powersets. No one disputes that Monarch has a much higher power output.

But breach suit + feed on energy might just work here. Not even saying it works every time but it CAN work. And surviving an explosion from the breached suit is actually pretty doable for ppl at this level, especially if he FEEDS on the energy as it comes out.

This is all IMHO, however, as characters with power levels of this level have always been hard to categorize and quantify properly.

Prep-Man

Superboy Prime has PC Superman level stats along with a Guardian. He's skyfather, IMO.

iceman24567

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
GA Prime might be more powerful than his already trans-tier regular self but he's no skyfather, kinda like Hulk at low herald doesn't make WWH mid-herald and WBH high herald. Tier increases should be much more than just power amps. Besides, DP Tyrant should be low skfather or top-tier trans to say the least.

Ppl aren't saying that DP Tyrant beats skyfathers. Ppl are saying that he can beat THIS particular skyfather (and I see Monarch as mid skyfather at best) due to powersets. No one disputes that Monarch has a much higher power output.

But breach suit + feed on energy might just work here. Not even saying it works every time but it CAN work. And surviving an explosion from the breached suit is actually pretty doable for ppl at this level, especially if he FEEDS on the energy as it comes out.

This is all IMHO, however, as characters with power levels of this level have always been hard to categorize and quantify properly. Most people agree Guardian amped Prime is Skyfather level. He's not going to have time to feed on the energy it's pretty much instant and what feats does Tyrant have to say he could feed on the energy Monarch releases? None. I disagree Monarch is easily a high end skyfather.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by iceman24567
Most people agree Guardian amped Prime is Skyfather level. He's not going to have time to feed on the energy it's pretty much instant and what feats does Tyrant have to say he could feed on the energy Monarch releases? None. I disagree Monarch is easily a high end skyfather.

Power Cosmic users like the Surfer have been able to pull off some pretty amazing energy absorption/manipulation feats. DP Tyrant is a more powerful and much older user of the PC. DP Tyrant's also been able to drain Galactus as well as absorb his eye beams in their fight (even tho, I'll have to agree that there is SOME context to that).

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l92/priest_85/SilverSurferv3108p09.jpg

Heh. Guess I'll have to simply respect, yet disagree, with your opinion here. Don't really feel like arguing the issue too much. Been a tiring week.

Lord Feron

Hard to classify a guy who is purly a amazing brick as skyfather... I always kind of believed skyfathers hsould have much ablities then punch hard and moving fast...

Sr J-Bieb

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Heh. Guess I'll have to simply respect, yet disagree, with your opinion here. Don't respect his opinion. The guy likes Iceman.

"Oh, he gets cold? Cool!"

amnesia

Puns are awesome.

"Id"

As a pumped up version of Captain Atom, Monarchs ability to manipulate energy carries over as well. Both are relatively in the same class, energy drain will not be as easily exploitable as some make it out be.

carver9

Originally posted by "Id"
As a pumped up version of Captain Atom, Monarchs ability to manipulate energy carries over as well. Both are relatively in the same class, energy drain will not be as easily exploitable as some make it out be.

Besides blasting and punching, what did Monarch do versatility wise to make you think he is a skyfather? Hell... the universal destroying blast really wasnt under his own power, he had to get destroyed to accomplish that feat so again, power wise, versatility wise, what has he done that makes you think he is skyfather material. Taking on Elite fighters? Despero along with NUMEROUS of other people have done this. Shoot a Nuke out of his hands, confused

.

Am I missing something to even make me believe that Odin wouldnt CRUSH him?

Cubey

Originally posted by Stoic
Did you read anything that I said? Tyrant in his first appearance captured Morg, Tyrant was not powered up yet, and he still went up to Galactus' very face, and challenged him for ownership of Morg, Galactus at that very moment said that a confrontation between the two of them would have caused universal destruction. Galactus then bowed out and Tyrant claimed proprietorship of Morg. Tyrant at that time was not powered up in the least.

Here's another example of Tyrant's energy absorption capabilities; Galactus blasted him, and he began draining the energy coming from Galactus, what about Tyrants other ability? He showed technopathic abilities as well. If Galactus made Tyrant in his image and Galactus used Hyperstorm like you and I would use a slurpie, this would be indicative of his ability to do the same to Monarch... and Monarch loves to blast the crap of of guys.

Let's see who would I place my bet on? An ancient super powered cosmic vampire, with the ability to challenge an Abstract being, and destroy a universe in the process, or some guy with super strength, atomic blasts, and a tin can for armor? I really think that this fight would resemble the one in Annihilation, you remember the one where Quasar fought Annihilus?

I read everything you wrote. Galactus gave him Morg for the other captured beings.

Also, yes even if Tyrant was an energy absorber, so is Monarch. Besides, he can always draw more power from the QF, and I have a really hard time believing he could do to Monarch what Galactus did to Hyperstorm. But like I said even if he could, Monarch has his own absorption to rely on.

And you keep on applying the "universe destroying" thing to Tyrant solely. Did you ever consider that what Galactus meant was that their energy would destroy galaxy after galaxy till nothing was left? Isn't that what Thanos said happened?

So you're wrongly calling DP Tyrant a universe buster because there can be different interpretation of the statements.

And rofl at trying to downplay Monarch. I can say that Monarch was able to challenge abstract beings and destroy the universe in the process, and have the actual feats to back it up. You on the other hand do not have a scan of Tyrant destroying the universe, only statements which can be interpreted in different ways (like the one above).

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
It's not really fanboyism to think that. Even though Monarch has a higher power output than DP Tyrant, DP Tyrant can just physically pierce Monarch's shell and absorb the explosion.

And yes, it's not out of the question for Tyrant tho absorb atomic energy. The sun is mostly a large nuclear reactor, and Surfer's been able to absorb energy there.

A universe's worth of energy? erm

Besides, didn't Monarch survive that later, and easily nuke a city upon awakening?

Harbinger

He tanked the explosion, and I think it was an entire country that he wiped out.

Stoic

Originally posted by Harbinger
He tanked the explosion, and I think it was an entire country that he wiped out.

He wiped out an entire country?

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Cubey
A universe's worth of energy? erm

Besides, didn't Monarch survive that later, and easily nuke a city upon awakening?

Galactus and Tyrant were made to be equals. Even at Tyrant's depowered state, they have similar powersets. They feed on energy and both doesn't seem to have any limits to how much they can absorb (as to when Galactus blasted him and he just absorbed the energy or when he used Galactus' tech to drain Galactus himself).

Besides, Tyrant doesn't need to absorb the whole explosion, just enough of it to do no damage to him. The same way that Nova didn't need to tank Galactus' entire "herald my rage" blast, just enough of it.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by "Id"
As a pumped up version of Captain Atom, Monarchs ability to manipulate energy carries over as well. Both are relatively in the same class, energy drain will not be as easily exploitable as some make it out be.

I'll have to disagree. In fact, Monarch seems to be unable to fully control his OWN powers. That is why he needs his suit to keep himself from blowing up. Tyrant, on the other hand, has been shown to be able to match Galactus at manipulating energies. Going so far as absorbing Galactus' attacks and taking over Galactus' ship in order to drain Galactus himself.

Cubey

Originally posted by Stoic
He wiped out an entire country?

On several occasions. Here's the most important stuff:

Kills/absorbs 51 Captain Atoms

http://a.imageshack.us/img23/6658/mon11.th.jpg http://a.imageshack.us/img230/1926/mon12.th.jpg

Blows up a country

http://a.imageshack.us/img837/3752/mon1f.th.jpg

Sets off a nuke

http://a.imageshack.us/img130/307/mon15m.th.jpg http://a.imageshack.us/img101/6084/mon16.th.jpg

Levels the universe

http://a.imageshack.us/img683/2783/mon17.th.jpg http://a.imageshack.us/img210/1720/mon18.th.jpg http://a.imageshack.us/img267/9463/mon19.th.jpg

Nukes another city/country afterwards

http://a.imageshack.us/img833/6017/mon23y.th.jpg http://a.imageshack.us/img27/4233/mon24.th.jpg

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Galactus and Tyrant were made to be equals. Even at Tyrant's depowered state, they have similar powersets. They feed on energy and both doesn't seem to have any limits to how much they can absorb (as to when Galactus blasted him and he just absorbed the energy or when he used Galactus' tech to drain Galactus himself).

Besides, Tyrant doesn't need to absorb the whole explosion, just enough of it to do no damage to him. The same way that Nova didn't need to tank Galactus' entire "herald my rage" blast, just enough of it.

And Monarch would be absorbing Tyrant's energies as well.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
I'll have to disagree. In fact, Monarch seems to be unable to fully control his OWN powers. That is why he needs his suit to keep himself from blowing up. Tyrant, on the other hand, has been shown to be able to match Galactus at manipulating energies. Going so far as absorbing Galactus' attacks and taking over Galactus' ship in order to drain Galactus himself.

No -_-

The suit was simply keeping his energy in check from blowing everything up. He was able to do energy manipulation just fine. Where did you get this?

OneDumbG0

Funny how awesomely powerful a fully energized Guardian-amped Superman Prime is to have defeated all those alternate Earth heroes.

Which makes Monarch awesomely powerful to have matched him in a fight.

But let's not forget that Monarch's so awesomely powerful that he can level a universe.

Which makes his armor even more awesomely powerful to contain that sort of energy.

Which makes a depleted Guardian-amped Superman Prime that much more awesome for ripping it apart.

Which makes a depleted Guardian-amped Superman Prime > a fully energized Guardian-amped Superman Prime...

... wait, what?

"Id"

Originally posted by carver9
Besides blasting and punching, what did Monarch do versatility wise to make you think he is a skyfather? Hell... the universal destroying blast really wasnt under his own power, he had to get destroyed to accomplish that feat so again, power wise, versatility wise, what has he done that makes you think he is skyfather material. Taking on Elite fighters? Despero along with NUMEROUS of other people have done this. Shoot a Nuke out of his hands, confused

.

Am I missing something to even make me believe that Odin wouldnt CRUSH him?

Skyfather? both Monarch, and Tyrant are listed under Sub Skyfather. Which is just about right.

Cubey

Originally posted by "Id"
Skyfather, both Monarch, and Tyrant are listed under Sub Skyfather. Which is just about right.

Go with Majestic for that respect thread evil face

"Id"

Majority vote wants the Main Man to have a proper respect thread done. And I am working on it.

He has been on a hot streak as of late.

Cubey

That's good too.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Cubey
And Monarch would be absorbing Tyrant's energies as well.

Monarch's best absorption feat (as you have shown above) is taking the energies of several low-mid herald levelers w/c were already down/dead.

Tyrant's best feat is absorbing a direct attack from Galactus as it struck him (gaining strength from it).

Yeahhhh, I'll go with Tyrant on this one...

Originally posted by Cubey
No -_-

The suit was simply keeping his energy in check from blowing everything up. He was able to do energy manipulation just fine. Where did you get this?

The fact that he wears the damned suit in the first place? :-/

Not saying he can't manipulate energy. Just saying that he's not at the level of Tyrant here.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by "Id"
Skyfather? both Monarch, and Tyrant are listed under Sub Skyfather. Which is just about right.

Ppl are saying that he's not JUST a skyfather (Monarch I mean) but a skyfather at the level of or exceeding that of Odin.

I happen to disagree.

"Id"

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by "Id"
Its due to Galacuts nature of synthesizing bio energy. Otherwise he would need equipment to drain his enemies like he did with Surfer, Gladiator, Bill etc..

"Synthesized Bio-energy" seems to be an ambiguous description of what the energy was composed of. Galactus is the source of the Power Cosmic, wouldn't the PC be categorized as SBE in the first place?

Edit. Not really the source, more like the Abstract entity that is the physical manifestation of it or somesuch.

Cubey

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Monarch's best absorption feat (as you have shown above) is taking the energies of several low-mid herald levelers w/c were already down/dead.

Tyrant's best feat is absorbing a direct attack from Galactus as it struck him (gaining strength from it).

These "several low-mid herald levelers w/c were already down/dead" Gave him enough energy to **** up the universe. So it's obviously at least Tyrant level if not higher.

If it's DP Tyrant, you'd be wrong.

Yeah what about it? He was wearing the suit since the 90's, but was still doing perfect energy manipulation. The suit is not there to account for sucking at energy manipulation, it's there to conceal his identity.

Monarch/CA has done more than Tyrant.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Cubey
These "several low-mid herald levelers w/c were already down/dead" Gave him enough energy to **** up the universe. So it's obviously at least Tyrant level if not higher.

You seem to have a different opinion of what constitutes a high-level energy absorption feat here. Quasar, given time and non-resisting opponents could have done the same.

Originally posted by Cubey
If it's DP Tyrant, you'd be wrong.

I disagree.

Originally posted by Cubey
Yeah what about it? He was wearing the suit since the 90's, but was still doing perfect energy manipulation. The suit is not there to account for sucking at energy manipulation, it's there to conceal his identity.

MONARCH wears the suit to hide his identity? Really? I guess it doesn't have anything to do with him blowing up if it gets torn open, right? Amirite?

Originally posted by Cubey
Monarch/CA has done more than Tyrant.

Such as?

"Id"

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
"Synthesized Bio-energy" seems to be an ambiguous description of what the energy was composed of. Galactus is the source of the Power Cosmic, wouldn't the PC be categorized as SBE in the first place?

Edit. Not really the source, more like the Abstract entity that is the physical manifestation of it or somesuch.

Regardless that is exactly why Tyrant was able to absorb Galactus blast. Otherwise, he wouldn't need equipment to drain Bill, Glads, Surfer etc..

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by "Id"
Regardless that is exactly why Tyrant was able to absorb Galactus blast. Otherwise, he wouldn't need equipment to drain Bill, Glads, Surfer etc..

I think he needs equipment to FORCIBLY drain it from resisting opponents. Kind of like he needed to use Galactus' ship to drain the energy from Galactus.

"Id"

Even if you want to play at that way, who said anything about Tryant bringing his ship or equipment into battle?

thanos-prime

Originally posted by "Id"
Even if you want to play at that way, who said anything about Tryant bringing his ship or equipment into battle?
If he forces the armor open he isn't forcibly draining the massive energy that's released is he? is monarch conscious in that form?

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by "Id"
Even if you want to play at that way, who said anything about Tryant bringing his ship or equipment into battle?

W/c is exactly my point. For Monarch, it's a unique case, as he will explode as soon as his suit is breached. Making it possible for Tyrant to drink the energy as it spills out w/o the need for his ship/equipment.

Prep-Man

Monarch has defenses to protect from suit damage as well. Energy absorption, teleportation, etc...

thanos-prime

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Monarch has defenses to protect from suit damage as well. Energy absorption, teleportation, etc... From what i have seen of him he seems to just blast or hit people not really trying to avoid attacks.

Prep-Man

Originally posted by thanos-prime
From what i have seen of him he seems to just blast or hit people not really trying to avoid attacks.

Most of those guys were pretty weak in comparison, so he didn't feel threatened.

The other Monarch, however can create force fields as well.

"Id"

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
W/c is exactly my point. For Monarch, it's a unique case, as he will explode as soon as his suit is breached. Making it possible for Tyrant to drink the energy as it spills out w/o the need for his ship/equipment.

Its not bio energy, so he doesn't drink the energy as you make claim. Nor does he have equipment to aid him. That is my point.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by "Id"
Its not bio energy, so he doesn't drink the energy as you make claim.

My point is that the description of "synthesized bio-energy" is quite vague. Galactus is the abstract physical manifestation of the Power Cosmic. And Power Cosmic users have been able to draw and absorb energies from ALL sources in the universe. One such similar example is the Surfer drawing energy from the sun (w/c is a large nuclear reactor unto itself).

I really think Tyrant can drink of Monarch's energy that spills out in case of a suit breach.

Originally posted by "Id"
Nor does he have equipment to aid him. That is my point.

Tyrant didn't need any equipment to absorb a direct attack from Galactus. He needed it to draw the energy OUT of him.

Once the suit is breached, he won't need any equipment, the energy will just spill from out of Monarch.

Cubey

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
You seem to have a different opinion of what constitutes a high-level energy absorption feat here. Quasar, given time and non-resisting opponents could have done the same.

Really? And what's Tyrant done that's of a higher level?

Oh and the key words in that post were "given enough time". Meaning it would take a lot for Quasar to do it. Monarch did it nonchalantly.

Then we must agree to disagree.

That too, but it doesn't augment his energy manipulation in any ways other than keeping the bulk of his power in check.

Creating city wide gravity wells, beating down Firestorm etc. And inn the Quantum Field, his powers truly have no limit like when he created and destroyed a universe.

But even aside from that he has a lot of energy manipulation feats.

KuRuPT Thanosi

IMO DP Tyrant and even Monarch are clearly AT LEAST skyfathers. IMO and others Thanos is a low to mid skyfather... Tyrant made Thanos run away and admit if he stayed he would've died. Thanos NEVER does this... even when faced with PEAK skyfather in Odin... did he ever back down or fear being killed? Nope. Against Tyrant he knew he didn't have a chance once they started fighting and left.

DP Tyrant beating a PREPPED and WELL-FED Galactus, Thanos, Morg. SS, Terrax, JOH, Gayn, BRB etc etc poops all over anything Monarch did. Dp Tyrant first made Galactus leave with his herald when Tyrant challenged him to a fight. What does that tell us... Galactus respected Tyrant's power and didn't want to fight him them. This gives us an idea of how strong he was. He then goes on to get the better of a well fed prepped galactus... That is clearly better than anything Monarch did or beat.

Both Tyrant win this thread. It's pretty clear to me.