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He gets to call one ally for each fight...but each ally can only help once.

Allies: Captain America, Punisher, Daredevil, Elektra, Blade

---

Gauntlet:

1. Silver Samurai

2. Lady Deathstrike

3. Daken

4. Cyber

5. Sabretooth

6. The Gorgon

Probably stops at Gorgon, might clear it, this isn't something I want to delve into too much.

Probably could utilize DD at Gorgon.

Elektra at Sabes.

Blade or Cap with Cyber, the rest don't matter too much at all.

3 Daken could cause some major porblems, though spiderman should be able to pull the win if he smart, though his teamate whoever he choices dies.


4 up he gunna have a lot of trouble and gotta pick his teammates carefully.

Might make it to Gorgon, if so he stops hard, DD as mention could be helpful except he lacks physical abilities to stand up with or cause damage to Gorgon.

Sounds alright. Daken wouldn't beat Spiderman for the majority on the forum alone, much less with help. Really the only thing I disagree with.

Gorgon may or may not... I'm iffy on that but you have a point.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
3 Daken could cause some major porblems, though spiderman should be able to pull the win if he smart, though his teamate whoever he choices dies.


4 up he gunna have a lot of trouble and gotta pick his teammates carefully.

Might make it to Gorgon, if so he stops hard, DD as mention could be helpful except he lacks physical abilities to stand up with or cause damage to Gorgon. I think he could beat Gorgon if he chooses Captain America or Blade...assuming he hasn't used them yet

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Sounds alright. Daken wouldn't beat Spiderman for the majority on the forum alone, much less with help. Really the only thing I disagree with.

Gorgon may or may not... I'm iffy on that but you have a point.
You be wrong, if spiderman did not fight smart he die. Daken has the ability to one shot Spiderman and also has the ability to completely **** with spidermans mind. Spiderman was only able to bypass the pheramones by relying soully on his spidersense and usign a plot device. Seems unlikely there going to be a huge electric fence generator lying around for spiderman to swing around.



Gorgon is leagues above DD physically. Spiderman really stands little chance, besides the fact on gorgon have to do is take off his sun glasses, he posses telepath that allow him to mind **** spiderman or rea dhis every move, he alos has insane damage soak which makes spiderman putting him down absurdly unlikely. He also easily fast enough to tag Spiderman with kill stroke with little to no effort.

Originally posted by Starscream M
I think he could beat Gorgon if he chooses Captain America or Blade...assuming he hasn't used them yet
what is blade or capt going to do for him? gorgon unarmed toying with elektra completely stomped her........

I forgot to stipulate that Gorgon will remain blindfolded

Originally posted by Battlehammer
what is blade or capt going to do for him? gorgon unarmed toying with elektra completely stomped her........ Capt is arguably a better fighter than Elektra...he also has the perfect defense against Gorgon with his shield. gorgon can't get past the shield.

Blade's sword skills and strength rivals gorgon's.

Originally posted by Starscream M
Capt is arguably a better fighter than Elektra...he also has the perfect defense against Gorgon with his shield. gorgon can't get past the shield.

Blade's sword skills and strength rivals gorgon's.


no

Gorgon>>Blade.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
You be wrong, if spiderman did not fight smart he die. Daken has the ability to one shot Spiderman and also has the ability to completely **** with spidermans mind. Spiderman was only able to bypass the pheramones by relying soully on his spidersense and usign a plot device. Seems unlikely there going to be a huge electric fence generator lying around for spiderman to swing around.



Gorgon is leagues above DD physically. Spiderman really stands little chance, besides the fact on gorgon have to do is take off his sun glasses, he posses telepath that allow him to mind **** spiderman or rea dhis every move, he alos has insane damage soak which makes spiderman putting him down absurdly unlikely. He also easily fast enough to tag Spiderman with kill stroke with little to no effort. No, you're wrong my friend. Many people can one shot many characters, especially Spiderman, does that happen? Nope, Carnage, Ock, and many others have failed as well. Also his phermones were countered by the SS, which is his ability and something he can use, he got beat pretty bad.

Who knows what he has lying around, but Daken can be webbed, and can be hurt by Spiderman. He isn't beating Spiderman and another helper. You can argue it all you want. I know what you're trying to say, but still.

Gorgon you have more a point on, he wouldn't be best using the physical on any of these opponents, when he has other means. And why when a martial artrist fights another weapon x character the physicality matters, but when a super powered person fights a martial artist that is a weapon x character skill matters?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
No, you're wrong my friend. Many people can one shot many characters, especially Spiderman, does that happen? Nope, Carnage, Ock, and many others have failed as well. Also his phermones were countered by the SS, which is his ability and something he can use, he got beat pretty bad.
I like to see spiderman keep fighting after being stabbed by 3 foot long claws one of which stops his body from healing.

His Pheramones were only counter when Spiderman closed his eyes and relied only on his spidersense which is how spiderman would need to win this.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Who knows what he has lying around, but Daken can be webbed, and can be hurt by Spiderman. He isn't beating Spiderman and another helper. You can argue it all you want. I know what you're trying to say, but still.
I think it safe to assume that eletric fence is not lying around.

Spiderman failed to webb him in thetre encounter it seems unlikely he be able too. Helper wont be much help. I see Spiderman winning, but only if he relies just on his spidersense, his helper will die and really be no help.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Gorgon you have more a point on, he wouldn't be best using the physical on any of these opponents, when he has other means. And why when a martial artrist fights another weapon x character the physicality matters, but when a super powered person fights a martial artist that is a weapon x character skill matters?
I dont get what you are saying and Gorgon has nothing to do with weapon x. Your not making any sense..........Gorgon is also a master Martial arts as well as possesing superhuman stats.

I think your trying to imply I am being bias, which you be quite mistaken.

Cyber's gonna be tough.

Originally posted by Starscream M
Capt is arguably a better fighter than Elektra...

No he not.

Originally posted by Starscream M

he also has the perfect defense against Gorgon with his shield. gorgon can't get past the shield.


Yes he can easily. He could simply stabb capt or take the shield away. You be insane to believe capt is standing up to Gorgon.

Originally posted by Starscream M

Blade's sword skills and strength rivals gorgon's.
No they dont. Gorgon was stamping on Wolverien and Elektra, blade would get utterly raped.

Originally posted by Battlehammer


Yes he can easily. He could simply stabb capt or take the shield away. You be insane to believe capt is standing up to Gorgon.
he can't stab capt because capt will have his shield up

capt shield has taken punches from hulk...it can surely handle gorgon's attacks

also, dont forget...spider-man is fighting gorgon at the same time

Originally posted by Battlehammer
I like to see spiderman keep fighting after being stabbed by 3 foot long claws one of which stops his body from healing.

His Pheramones were only counter when Spiderman closed his eyes and relied only on his spidersense which is how spiderman would need to win this.


I think it safe to assume that eletric fence is not lying around.

Spiderman failed to webb him in thetre encounter it seems unlikely he be able too. Helper wont be much help. I see Spiderman winning, but only if he relies just on his spidersense, his helper will die and really be no help.

Yea, but in this match Daken isn't sneaking up on him, and he isn't unknown to Spiderman anymore. Also Daken *did* cut him, he had a clean swipe from behind.

Carnage has instant death weapons that fire like guns and extended axes, Dock Ock has 4 arms that have their own AI.

In a straight up fight where they know the other (i.e) the forum I'd give the nod to Spiderman. But I don't really want to delve into this as I knew it would loop on and on.

I meant X as in weapon x character. I was just entertaining some possibilities. They'd be best trying to trick Gorgon on the last match. Other than that, not so sure.

Originally posted by Starscream M
he can't stab capt because capt will have his shield up

capt shield has taken punches from hulk...it can surely handle gorgon's attacks

also, dont forget...spider-man is fighting gorgon at the same time
Shield doe snot make him unstabbable. Gorgon good dela faster then capt is and can read his mind like an open book, there nothign Capt can do to stop from being stabbed.


Piercing attacks are quite different, Hulk does not posses gorgon ability to read minds, his MA skill nor his speed.

Wont make much difference capt be dead within few seconds of battle. Won't fare any better then Elektra did.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Yea, but in this match Daken isn't sneaking up on him, and he isn't unknown to Spiderman anymore. Also Daken *did* cut him, he had a clean swipe from behind.

Carnage has instant death weapons that fire like guns and extended axes, Dock Ock has 4 arms that have their own AI.

In a straight up fight where they know the other (i.e) the forum I'd give the nod to Spiderman. But I don't really want to delve into this as I knew it would loop on and on.

I meant X as in weapon x character. I was just entertaining some possibilities. They'd be best trying to trick Gorgon on the last match. Other than that, not so sure.
Yea when he was toy with him. SPiderman new about the pheramones which is why he was able to capitalized. Wolverien told him about them.


Yea but neither are as skilled, nor can they manipulate spiderman perception.

Spiderman new his powers when they fought. Spiderman would win I said that several times already, but he have to rely simply on his spidersense.

He not a weapon X character though..........You made no sense........There going to trick a person who at the age of 12 came up the an equation that proved with out a doubt gods existences lol.

you are all insane if you think any of the people on the list can do anything to gorgon and elektra>capt in a fight and she got wrecked

Originally posted by Battlehammer
There going to trick a person who at the age of 12 came up the an equation that proved with out a doubt gods existences lol. there is no god in marvel

Originally posted by Starscream M
there is no god in marvel
Yes there is..........

There are many "gods" in marvel. There is also God, in marvel. I have already had this stupid ass debate with you the first time you try to ignore the event with your typical nonsense.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Yea when he was toy with him. SPiderman new about the pheramones which is why he was able to capitalized. Wolverien told him about them.


Yea but neither are as skilled, nor can they manipulate spiderman perception.

Spiderman new his powers when they fought. Spiderman would win I said that several times already, but he have to rely simply on his spidersense.

He not a weapon X character though..........You made no sense........There going to trick a person who at the age of 12 came up the an equation that proved with out a doubt gods existences lol.

He had never experienced them before though. He always has Spidersense. He used Spidersense and the phermones weren't that effective. He'll do it in the future.

Skill and MA ability aren't the same thing, not directly, not the best comparison. Also has Daken shown the healing capability and skill of his father in any way?

I just meant who he was associated with to some degree, never mind I even said it.

The Christian God exists in Marvel?

Originally posted by Superman>>Thor
you are all insane if you think any of the people on the list can do anything to gorgon and elektra>capt in a fight and she got wrecked Might not be best to fight physically but it's possible to use other ways to win, not sure how the webbing would work, but maybe he could look at the shield on a really bright day, lol.

Not too serious right now.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
He had never experienced them before though. He always has Spidersense. He used Spidersense and the phermones weren't that effective. He'll do it in the future.

Skill and MA ability aren't the same thing, not directly, not the best comparison. Also has Daken shown the healing capability and skill of his father in any way?

I just meant who he was associated with to some degree, never mind I even said it.
I neevr said he dident have his spidersenses. I said he has to rely souly on it to claim victory, becuase his spidersenses, unlike his other senses can't be distorted.


Yes Daken has shown a lot of skill and has shown quite the ability to heal.


He not associated with weapon x at all. k

Originally posted by Doctor-Alvis
The Christian God exists in Marvel?
who said it was christian god?

Just said that god exists, there are many gods. Though TOAA is generaly consider god.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
I neevr said he dident have his spidersenses. I said he has to rely souly on it to claim victory, becuase his spidersenses, unlike his other senses can't be distorted.


Yes Daken has shown a lot of skill and has shown quite the ability to heal.


He not associated with weapon x at all. k I know not x, more or less Wolverine as in a weapon x related character, be like me saying a Spider character. It was a vague comparison.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Might not be best to fight physically but it's possible to use other ways to win, not sure how the webbing would work, but maybe he could look at the shield on a really bright day, lol.

Not too serious right now.
I guess he does not have stone stare for this fight.


Webbing won't work he cut it to bits and dodge it, considering how he delt with bullets and speedstirs a like lol.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
I know not x, more or less Wolverine as in a weapon x related character, be like me saying a Spider character. It was a vague comparison.
k


But yea Gorgon one of the few arc villains alone with Mister X that have no affiliation with weapon x at all.

Both seem to be the only two villains of his left lol.

Mister x had the msot bad ass bullet deflecting feat.

Omega Red, Gorgon are both perfect examples of Wolverine villains were he stands really no chance against them.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Omega Red, Gorgon are both perfect examples of Wolverine villains were he stands really no chance against them. add hulk to that list

Originally posted by Starscream M
add hulk to that list
Hulk not rally a villain.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
I guess he does not have stone stare for this fight.


Webbing won't work he cut it to bits and dodge it, considering how he delt with bullets and speedstirs a like lol. Yea they all do that, but if he were tied a certain way he wouldn't have the strength to get out, not saying it will be easy, but possible.

ye mister x had great feats until that piece of crap writer if i can even call him a writer decided that luke cage and iron fist can beat him like a child

I think Spiderman and his allies are going to have problems with 2-6 due to their opponents' durability/healing factors.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Yea they all do that, but if he were tied a certain way he wouldn't have the strength to get out, not saying it will be easy, but ossible.
Not to this extent. He was with ease dancing between machine gun firer and deflecting machine gun bullets all of them, you be hard presses to find anyone to match the level of bullet deflecting his did. He also seem to be implied to move at the speed of thought or higher, for when he had eletra it showed his perception it seem of the shield soldier they werent even moving. He also cut a speedstir arm off with ease and there responses was "no one moves that fast" Gorgon responds "the gorgon is that fast".

Him getting webbed is wishful thinking. He two fast, his reflexes are to good, he two skilled and could easily cut the webbing and simply he cna read spiderman like an open book.

Originally posted by Superman>>Thor
ye mister x had great feats until that piece of crap writer if i can even call him a writer decided that luke cage and iron fist can beat him like a child
yea reember or whatever his name was came on the arc for an issue or two and completely ignored mister x stated powers from the entire arc lol.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Not to this extent. He was with ease dancing between machine gun firer and deflecting machine gun bullets all of them, you be hard presses to find anyone to match the level of bullet deflecting his did. He also seem to be implied to move at the speed of thought or higher, for when he had eletra it showed his perception it seem of the shield soldier they werent even moving. He also cut a speedstir arm off with ease and there responses was "no one moves that fast" Gorgon responds "the gorgon is that fast".

Him getting webbed is wishful thinking. He two fast, his reflexes are to good, he two skilled and could easily cut the webbing and simply he cna read spiderman like an open book. Many street levelers do speed of thought feats, and remember webbing isn't like bullets, it is more like water from a fire hose, it spreads.

Now which is easier to hit someone with, something that spreads or something that doesn't?

Not to mention he will be fighting someone else to occupy him, if even for a few seconds. Not saying it is easy, but it is possible. He has to have the leverage to cut and swords are long and the leverage points are different.

Originally posted by TheKahn
I think Spiderman and his allies are going to have problems with 2-6 due to their opponents' durability/healing factors. Many characters give other characters "problems" but the early ones aren't going to be doing any majority against him especially with a team mate. They can still be hurt, ko'ed, knocked back, or incapacitated. Many characters in comics have healing factors, doesn't make them unstoppable by any means.

I'm talking about the early ones mainly. Distraction right into webbing.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Many street levelers do speed of thought feats, and remember webbing isn't like bullets, it is more like water from a fire hose, it spreads.

Now which is easier to hit someone with, something that spreads or something that doesn't?

Not to mention he will be fighting someone else to occupy him, if even for a few seconds. Not saying it is easy, but it is possible. He has to have the leverage to cut and swords are long and the leverage points are different.
No to this extent nor displayed this consistenly. He not a character with hundreds of apearances. he character with 20 and each time he shown with this crazy level of speed.


Does not matter when the object moves vastly slower then bullets espcially machine gun ones.


Taskmaster already showed us how easy it is to cut webbing, it far fetch to assume a guy with the level of skill, speed and reflexes as well as telepathy that Gorgon showed that he gunna get webbed up espicialy considering the people spiderman has failed to webb like shang-chi, DD, capt ect.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Many characters give other characters "problems" but the early ones aren't going to be doing any majority against him especially with a team mate. They can still be hurt, ko'ed, knocked back, or incapacitated. Many characters in comics have healing factors, doesn't make them unstoppable by any means.

I'm talking about the early ones mainly. Distraction right into webbing.

That's certainly a viable tactic. My only concern their offensive capacity as compared to the durability of Spiderman and his allies. A single hit from the one of gauntlet may be crippling while the opposite isn't really true, imo.

Gorgon perception it seem when compared to normal people, plus crazy bullet deflecting feat
http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/7757/telepathy1.th.jpg http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/2107/telepathy2.th.jpg




Gorgon showing a speedstir named Yo-Yo just how fast he is

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/4017/gorgonvssecretwarriors1.th.jpg http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/2209/gorgonvssecretwarriors2.th.jpg http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/5881/gorgonvssecretwarriors3.th.jpg http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/430/gorgonvssecretwarriors4.th.jpg


Seem very unlikely to assume he going to get webbed at all let a lone for a majority.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
No to this extent nor displayed this consistenly. He not a character with hundreds of apearances. he character with 20 and each time he shown with this crazy level of speed.


Does not matter when the object moves vastly slower then bullets espcially machine gun ones.


Taskmaster already showed us how easy it is to cut webbing, it far fetch to assume a guy with the level of skill, speed and reflexes as well as telepathy that Gorgon showed that he gunna get webbed up espicialy considering the people spiderman has failed to webb like shang-chi, DD, capt ect.

Yea, and firehoses and flamethrowers are often used in situations where it is hard to be accurate because of suppression and spam ability, bullets are so useless on the forum man, everybody dodges them, everyone. It's not even anything new. Spiderman has webbed fast characters before who have dodged the bullets, he has punched people who have dodged bullets and his webbing is slower than him....

You can cut a bit of it but more of it can overflow your body, it isn't a hard substance until it is set, it flows.

Of course he isn't going to web another hero in a crossover match too often instantly, it would be an early fight. He has the speed to do so and he is faster than DD, Capt, Shang, and his webbing is much stronger than them too. He really only needs to get one limb and remove their leverage.

He did web Daken. And he has webbed other fast characters too.

I'm not saying it is *easy* by any means, but it isn't impossible and Spiderman has had thousands of showings of him using it, and for it to be said he can't do it with a person fighting up close giving the opponent trouble isn't being very fair.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Gorgon perception it seem when compared to normal people, plus crazy bullet deflecting feat
http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/7757/telepathy1.th.jpg http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/2107/telepathy2.th.jpg




Gorgon showing a speedstir named Yo-Yo just how fast he is

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/4017/gorgonvssecretwarriors1.th.jpg http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/2209/gorgonvssecretwarriors2.th.jpg http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/5881/gorgonvssecretwarriors3.th.jpg http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/430/gorgonvssecretwarriors4.th.jpg


Seem very unlikely to assume he going to get webbed at all let a lone for a majority. I never said how many times he could do it. but he can.

Spiderman has dodged rain before in a light storm, that's about as good as it gets with Meta level dodging.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Many street levelers do speed of thought feats, and remember webbing isn't like bullets, it is more like water from a fire hose, it spreads.

Now which is easier to hit someone with, something that spreads or something that doesn't?

Not to mention he will be fighting someone else to occupy him, if even for a few seconds. Not saying it is easy, but it is possible. He has to have the leverage to cut and swords are long and the leverage points are different.

Gorgon is faster than Spidey.

http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/9854/gorgonbio.jpg

Originally posted by carver9
Gorgon is faster than Spidey.

http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/9854/gorgonbio.jpg So now we go back to using stats when they work for us and not when they don't? I'll keep that in mind with Wolverine.

Ok... current stats... not saying I agree with everything presented but it doesn't seem *too* bad.

Spiderman:
http://marvel.com/universe/Spider-Man_%28Peter_Parker%29

Gorgon:
http://marvel.com/universe/Gorgon_%28Tomi_Shishido%29

Has Spiderman higher at current.

But using the typical "feat" argument, his feats don't triump Spiderman's at all.

But on my opinion, I think it is really close, Gorgon and Spiderman utilize different movements. Spiderman is more air based than Gorgan and more acrobatic, where Gorgon is more ground based.

Overall, Spidey just isn't equipped to deal with most of Wolverine's opponents, imo. He needs more offensive capability and a great deal more durability.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Many street levelers do speed of thought feats, and remember webbing isn't like bullets, it is more like water from a fire hose, it spreads.

Now which is easier to hit someone with, something that spreads or something that doesn't?

Not to mention he will be fighting someone else to occupy him, if even for a few seconds. Not saying it is easy, but it is possible. He has to have the leverage to cut and swords are long and the leverage points are different.

are you on crack or something? 5 people were shooting machine gun fire at gorgon at the same time and he was diflecting all that with 1 arm are you crazy? you are trying to compare spider-man webbing to that????? GTFO of here

Originally posted by TheKahn
Overall, Spidey just isn't equipped to deal with most of Wolverine's opponents, imo. He needs more offensive capability and a great deal more durability. Wolverine and Spiderman's opponents would give each other a tough time, not mentioning joke characters.

Sabes gives him a fight, Daken would lose the majority, so would LD, Omega Red would Win.

The ones Spiderman would lose too, Wolverine would lose too, pretty much like Classic Venom and Carnage.

The thing comes in with his speed and dodging, his offense is find for the lower end of Wolverine's villains and webbing works fine too.


Originally posted by Superman>>Thor
are you on crack or something? 5 people were shooting machine gun fire at gorgon at the same time and he was diflecting all that with 1 arm are you crazy? you are trying to compare spider-man webbing to that????? GTFO of here Are you a troll or something? Oh right you are, I have something special for that, stupidity can't be treated normally, it has to be put out.

I won't even waste too much of my time owning and humiliating you thoroughly before you get banned. Bullets job all the time, it's not even up for discussion. You'd better ask somebody. Now a quick lesson:

And no I wasn't trying to compare webbing to that, see if you had an IQ of over 40 you would have realize the difference between a comparison and a contrast.

Let me help you.

Contrast: to compare in order to show unlikeness or differences; note the opposite natures, purposes, etc., of: Contrast the political rights of Romans and Greeks.

Now that *that* is out of the way I thought you would know the difference between something that spreads and doesn't have a consistent structure compared to something that does. Not to mention webbing stays there and can be snared. Many difference, does that penetrate your thick skull enough?

Here let this help. Spiderman has caught a bullet before, he's dodged one *after* it's been fired.

Check this out numbskull.... bullets are so good they can't hit Gambit either (note, to walk you through, isn't quite as fast as Spiderman, nor does he have his exotic abilities), never mind many conventional high velocity bullets are faster than sound.

http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/5858/gambit01239ar.jpg

But oh wait, we all know that hand speed is faster than body movement speed, that's obvious, so using that same instrument Gambit could do the same!


Oh wait, there's more...

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j241/Badabing_2006/Marvel/Marvel%20Scans/Untitled-Scanned-03-5.jpg


Look at the reaction time and precision used to web bullets as they travel *in* mid air, he actually aimed and did it, not just twirl something around.

Man, I need to start posting feats more often, I forgot how dumb most people are... oh wait...

Lightning is light speed right, well he dodges that too, that is much more impressive than sound speed right? Right? I mean hey it happened...

http://s58.radikal.ru/i160/0901/9c/3766a671bf17.jpg

Gone before the shot goes there...

http://i015.radikal.ru/0901/9d/b40ee62fefa6.jpg


Now if your reading comprehension worked well enough to realize how much of a fool you made of yourself, maybe you'd see my argument wasn't even Spiderman stomping Gorgon or anything of the sort, I said that in my first post. I was arguing something else.

Now sit down when grown folks are talking.

Stops at 4.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Lightning is light speed right, well he dodges that too, that is much more impressive than sound speed right? Right? I mean hey it happened...

http://s58.radikal.ru/i160/0901/9c/3766a671bf17.jpg



Not canon.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Not canon.

Plus lightning doesn't travel at the speed of light. The Guinness Book of Answers indicates a maximum speeds around 87,000 miles per second or 313,000,000 mph if my math isn't too rusty (roughly half the speed of light). Not that it matters much with Spiderman given the advanced warning his spider-sense gives him.

Originally posted by TheKahn
Plus lightning doesn't travel at the speed of light. The Guinness Book of Answers indicates a maximum speeds around 87,000 miles per second or 313,000,000 mph if my math isn't too rusty (roughly half the speed of light). Not that it matters much with Spiderman given the advanced warning his spider-sense gives him.



Couldn't have said it better.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
who said it was christian god?

Just said that god exists, there are many gods. Though TOAA is generaly consider god.
God is the Christian God. I don't see TOAA being all ol' Testament on Earth.

Spider-Man talked with God

spider-man can bfr juggernaut

Originally posted by Doctor-Alvis
God is the Christian God. I don't see TOAA being all ol' Testament on Earth.

I know a lot of Hindus, Muslims, Jews, and Wiccans who would disagree with you on that.


Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Spider-Man talked with God

Never mention that era of Spiderman's history again













Seriously, I've been a Spiderman fan for nearly all my life and that entire BND storyline killed the character for me. I can't even read it anymore.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Spider-Man talked with God

Spider-man gave God a good advice

Originally posted by Parmaniac
What's that?

Brand New Day. It follows One More Day were Spiderman and MJ made a deal with Mephisto

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Spider-man gave God a good advice

Brand New Day story arc. It's where he made a deal with Mephisto to save Aunt May's life in exchange, he'd lose a bunch of his abilities, and he lost MJ's love. Now they're no longer together, he's not as powerful as he used to be and Aunt May is still old as crap. Lots of spidey grew upset because it undid a lot of Spider-Man stories, like Norman Osborn no longer being dead and everyone forgetting Spidey's secret identity since he made it public during the Civil War arc.

Now I'm not sure if you didn't know what Brand New Day was, or if you just weren't sure what BND stood for.

If Peter didn't make that deal, aunt May wouldn't have sex with Jameson' father!

Originally posted by TheKahn
Brand New Day. It follows One More Day were Spiderman and MJ made a deal with Mephisto

yeah it came to my mind after I've posted but tbh there's not much left from that event except that he and MJ don't know each other, I mean all the stuff seems to be altered and not retconned (However that is possible...) for example: the clone saga still happend because it's again in the comics with the complete history etc. So I hope Marvel in a way retconned the retcon without mentioning it.

Retconned = altered OR erased

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Retconned = altered OR erased

Oh I always thought that it means they totally take away what happend but yeah now that I think about it you're right

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Not canon. It wasn't? Ah well, doesn't matter. He has dodged lightning before though. I could just revert to lasers, which he dodges fine with or without SS and those travel just at light speed.

Everyone content?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
It wasn't? Ah well, doesn't matter. He has dodged lightning before though. I could just revert to lasers, which he dodges fine with or without SS and those travel just at light speed.

Everyone content?

I have that comic somewhere. Marvel Adventures Spider-Man. Another universe.

Do you have a scan showing Spider-Man just standing here in a non-dodging position while the lightning bolt is reaching him and the next panel showing him dodging it? If not, then we have to assume it was aim-dodging.

Anyhow, lasers arguably job to high street lvs/low metas even more than bullets. I'd be interested to see some scans with Spidey (aim)dodging them with his SS turned off, though.

They'd travel at light speed only in vacuum awesome

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
I have that comic somewhere. Marvel Adventures Spider-Man. Another universe.

Do you have a scan showing Spider-Man just standing here in a non-dodging position while the lightning bolt is reaching him and the next panel showing him dodging it? If not, then we have to assume it was aim-dodging.

Anyhow, lasers arguably job to high street lvs/low metas even more than bullets. I'd be interested to see some scans with Spidey (aim)dodging them with his SS turned off, though.

They'd travel at light speed only in vacuum awesome But you miss my point, it's all jobbing really. I was just using that same "bullets and lasers" dodging argument back. I don't believe that any non Flash character could dodge one.

But that's how lightning works, it's there one second and then it isn't? He obviously wouldn't see it if Storm fired it at him. I have been trying to explain for years what aim dodging was, and some people finally get it.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
But you miss my point, it's all jobbing really. I was just using that same "bullets and lasers" dodging argument back. I don't believe that any non Flash character could dodge one.

But that's how lightning works, it's there one second and then it isn't? He obviously wouldn't see it if Storm fired it at him. I have been trying to explain for years what aim dodging was, and some people finally get it.

Ah. Sorry, I was too lazy to read previous posts.

Thing is, Gorgon's speed impressed Wolverine. And Elektra. And Secret Warriors. This is the way he's written. On average he's faster than Peter.


He would see the gesture, though.

Wolverine dodged Living Lightning with a smile on his face

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Ah. Sorry, I was too lazy to read previous posts.

Thing is, Gorgon's speed impressed Wolverine. And Elektra. And Secret Warriors. This is the way he's written. On average he's faster than Peter.


He would see the gesture, though.

Wolverine dodged Living Lightning with a smile on his face I think their speed is quite close but utilized differently. I can be impressed by an infants scribble drawing, but that isn't concrete enough. Obviously Spiderman has a much bigger career using speed, and has impressed a longer list of people. To me that is kinda a cheap way of arguing though. Which is why I take feats *and* characterization into consideration in these.

Spiderman is more of an acrobat than anything, Gorgon uses his speed on the ground. Our opinions just differ on the matter.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
I think their speed is quite close but utilized differently. I can be impressed by an infants scribble drawing, but that isn't concrete enough. Obviously Spiderman has a much bigger career using speed, and has impressed a longer list of people. To me that is kinda a cheap way of arguing though. Which is why I take feats *and* characterization into consideration in these.

Spiderman is more of an acrobat than anything, Gorgon uses his speed on the ground. Our opinions just differ on the matter.

Bad choice of words. They were shocked and getting their asses handed to them.

Yes, a much bigger career. That means a lot of low and mediocre showings which need to be taken into consideration, too... so we can know on what average level he operates. And that average level is way below Gorgon if you ask me.

So, in other words - Spidey's more agile, but Gorgon has better combat speed?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Bad choice of words. They were shocked and getting their asses handed to them.

Yes, a much bigger career. That means a lot of low and mediocre showings which need to be taken into consideration, too... so we can know on what average level he operates. And that average level is way below Gorgon if you ask me.

So, in other words - Spidey's more agile, but Gorgon has better combat speed? Nothing Spiderman has done, and really when an opponent first sees someone that typically happens, like even when Spiderman fights a "slower" opponent. I'd argue someone like Carnage being faster.

Well that's just it, if someone has a relatively short career without many showings it is easy to say they are high showings. You have to look at characters, Gorgon being a villain goes up against teams? How many times has Spiderman gone against teams? Against much higher level characters than Gorgon and left the fight untouched. What about character? How he holds back, and doubts himself? How he has dodged lasers from Iron Man at point blank? What about Civil war when he blitzes characters without them reacting when he *wants* to? Of course you also have FF and secret wars, where Nightcrawler was shocked.

We used stats currently and it was in Spiderman's favor, but I felt that was unfair to use alone, feats might be too, characterization has to be taken into consideration as well.

You are probably right with more on handspeed considering Gorgon is more trained in using that area with weapons, but Spiderman's handspeed is totally different and he moves his body differently. Faster in different ways perhaps?

Nice talk, but I have to go, or I'll never get anything done, later for now.

Keep in mind I'm not saying he takes Gorgon for the majority in a normal fight either as well. Just saying.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
So now we go back to using stats when they work for us and not when they don't? I'll keep that in mind with Wolverine.

Ok... current stats... not saying I agree with everything presented but it doesn't seem *too* bad.

Spiderman:
http://marvel.com/universe/Spider-Man_%28Peter_Parker%29

Gorgon:
http://marvel.com/universe/Gorgon_%28Tomi_Shishido%29

Has Spiderman higher at current.

But using the typical "feat" argument, his feats don't triump Spiderman's at all.

But on my opinion, I think it is really close, Gorgon and Spiderman utilize different movements. Spiderman is more air based than Gorgan and more acrobatic, where Gorgon is more ground based.

You cant use marvel stats, its all jacked up. It has gladiator stats higher than galactus.

Use Peters stats from the marvel handbook and it has him listed as a 3. Even without using that, we have Wolverine saying that he never faced anyone this fast AND saying that no one is that fast (and wolverine has faced spiderman). Then we have Elektra saying the same thing.

Gorgon is MUCH faster than peter, MUCH, faster, and in a fight, peter might wouldnt make it past two panels.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Nothing Spiderman has done, and really when an opponent first sees someone that typically happens, like even when Spiderman fights a "slower" opponent. I'd argue someone like Carnage being faster.

Well that's just it, if someone has a relatively short career without many showings it is easy to say they are high showings. You have to look at characters, Gorgon being a villain goes up against teams? How many times has Spiderman gone against teams? Against much higher level characters than Gorgon and left the fight untouched. What about character? How he holds back, and doubts himself? How he has dodged lasers from Iron Man at point blank? What about Civil war when he blitzes characters without them reacting when he *wants* to? Of course you also have FF and secret wars, where Nightcrawler was shocked.

We used stats currently and it was in Spiderman's favor, but I felt that was unfair to use alone, feats might be too, characterization has to be taken into consideration as well.

You are probably right with more on handspeed considering Gorgon is more trained in using that area with weapons, but Spiderman's handspeed is totally different and he moves his body differently. Faster in different ways perhaps?

Nice talk, but I have to go, or I'll never get anything done, later for now.

Keep in mind I'm not saying he takes Gorgon for the majority in a normal fight either as well. Just saying.

C-Masters, its pretty obvious that gorgon is faster than Spidey and just as strong, if not, stronger.

Originally posted by carver9
You cant use marvel stats, its all jacked up. It has gladiator stats higher than galactus.

Use Peters stats from the marvel handbook and it has him listed as a 3. Even without using that, we have Wolverine saying that he never faced anyone this fast AND saying that no one is that fast (and wolverine has faced spiderman). Then we have Elektra saying the same thing.

Gorgon is MUCH faster than peter, MUCH, faster, and in a fight, peter might wouldnt make it past two panels. Spiderman has superhuman speed not enhanced, and those stats aren't perfect either, I thought you knew that...

Man, Spiderman has said Wolverine is faster than he, and then said nobody is faster, Wolverine has said Spiderman can break his neck, Spiderman has said he's 40x faster than a human. People always say things.

What about Civil War? Secret Wars, blah blah blah... same old thing.

I'm nor arguing the two in head up normal fight, of course he loses, the thread stips do allow him a minute chance though, was all I was saying.

What strength feats do Gorgon have beyond Spiderman (refresh my memory).

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Spiderman has superhuman speed not enhanced, and those stats aren't perfect either, I thought you knew that...

Man, Spiderman has said Wolverine is faster than he, and then said nobody is faster, Wolverine has said Spiderman can break his neck, Spiderman has said he's 40x faster than a human. People always say things.

What about Civil War? Secret Wars, blah blah blah... same old thing.

I'm nor arguing the two in head up normal fight, of course he loses, the thread stips do allow him a minute chance though, was all I was saying.

What strength feats do Gorgon have beyond Spiderman (refresh my memory).

I know Spiderman has Super human speed but again, we are talking about a guy that moves faster than the speed of thought and someone that slaps bullets out of the airl like he was playing base ball.

I know what people say but when everyone that face gorgon say this "there is no one that fast", its pretty obvious that his speed is on a different level, especially if he blitz a speedster.

Civil War, Secret wars, nothing in there proving that Spiderman is even a notch close to what gorgon is.

Well, we have gorgon running through both Elektra and Wolverine at the same time EASILY. Then we have gorgon STOMPING elektra, actually toying with her, without her even landing a lick, and yet again, he did it easily.

Spiderman might need a 3rd party, especially if gorgon has his blades. I can see spidey trying to bounce at gorgon and with gorgon speed, he just turn around and cut spiderman in half.

Originally posted by carver9
I know Spiderman has Super human speed but again, we are talking about a guy that moves faster than the speed of thought and someone that slaps bullets out of the airl like he was playing base ball.

I know what people say but when everyone that face gorgon say this "there is no one that fast", its pretty obvious that his speed is on a different level, especially if he blitz a speedster.

Civil War, Secret wars, nothing in there proving that Spiderman is even a notch close to what gorgon is.

Well, we have gorgon running through both Elektra and Wolverine at the same time EASILY. Then we have gorgon STOMPING elektra, actually toying with her, without her even landing a lick, and yet again, he did it easily.

Spiderman might need a 3rd party, especially if gorgon has his blades. I can see spidey trying to bounce at gorgon and with gorgon speed, he just turn around and cut spiderman in half. You sure about those speed feats. Blitzing several characters at once, Thor, etc etc...

He's not going to win the featwar using your logic. But again I'm arguing webbing, and where are the strength feats?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
You sure about those speed feats. Blitzing several characters at once, Thor, etc etc...

He's not going to win the featwar using your logic. But again I'm arguing webbing, and where are the strength feats?

Wasnt those clones and if we are using thor then I could easily bring up Wolverine blitzing Thor recently and Thor mentioning that Wolverine is to fast.

Spiderman bouncing around gorgon would get him dropped fast. very fast. Its not a safe tactic to use against someone like him.

So you dont thiink gorgon could EASILY dodge webbing and lets not forget, gorgon is a telepath, he'll know Spidermans every move before he does it.

I cant argue on the strength feats, so I'm going to leave that alone.

Precog helps Spiderman, and Thor is obviously not a good showing logically, but whoring on feats Spiderman proved that Thor couldn't see him. Also you have Firelord (I know it isn't a good showing but going by this logic it works).

Anyways Gorgon has done neither of those right? You realize it takes more precision to actually shoot a bullet with web *and* stop it in midair? He sees them ins low motion.

Webbing is slower, but it isn't the same as a bullet because it is consistent and like a flame or water, one limb is all that is needed, you have two spinners and he is quite good with them able to web buildings and bridges rather fast.

He's bounced around Venom and Carnage, and they would wreck Spiderman. But nevertheless, my point is the webbing can work, I don't see why you are making my argument more than what it is.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Precog helps Spiderman, and Thor is obviously not a good showing logically, but whoring on feats Spiderman proved that Thor couldn't see him. Also you have Firelord (I know it isn't a good showing but going by this logic it works).

Anyways Gorgon has done neither of those right? You realize it takes more precision to actually shoot a bullet with web *and* stop it in midair? He sees them ins low motion.

Webbing is slower, but it isn't the same as a bullet because it is consistent and like a flame or water, one limb is all that is needed, you have two spinners and he is quite good with them able to web buildings and bridges rather fast.

He's bounced around Venom and Carnage, and they would wreck Spiderman. But nevertheless, my point is the webbing can work, I don't see why you are making my argument more than what it is.

LOL , my bad.

What I'm arguing against is that webbing isnt going to touch gorgon; hes to fast for that.

Him bouncing around venom and carnage means nothing. Wolverine has bounced around venom on plenty of occasions, they dont use there speed like wolvy and spidey.

The moral of my story is Gorgon OWNED wolverine and elektra at the same time. Gorgon OWNED elektra without her even landing a lick. Gorgon CRUSHED wolverine and embarrassed him every time they faced. Then we have EVERYONE that Gorgon fought saying that no one is that fast and these are people that seen and fought against/with some of the most powerful/fastest people on marvel earth.

Spiderman along with whomever his other partner would get STOMPED by gorgon. Then if you add him being a telepath, knowing spidermans every move, its a complete massacre.

Of course a villian displayed will give heroes trouble, hell DS took out several members of the JL. Carnage and Venom are faster than Spiderman, and Carnage uses his.

Gorgon has high superhuman abilities, Elektra does not, Elektra has beaten Wolverine though..... Wolverine outsmarted Gorgon, and didn't Cap do the same?

Well that is PIS, no way is he faster than characters like quicksilver. He's damned fast, but...

Gorgon isn't faster than a bullet.


Blah blah blah, circle circle circle.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Of course a villian displayed will give heroes trouble, hell DS took out several members of the JL. Carnage and Venom are faster than Spiderman, and Carnage uses his.

Gorgon has high superhuman abilities, Elektra does not, Elektra has beaten Wolverine though..... Wolverine outsmarted Gorgon, and didn't Cap do the same?

Well that is PIS, no way is he faster than characters like quicksilver. He's damned fast, but...

Gorgon isn't faster than a bullet.


Blah blah blah, circle circle circle.


HHHHMMM, I think gorgon reflexes could be faster than QS and I also think that gorgon is faster than a bullet.

Here we have gorgon in a tree looking at wolverine fight from a far distance.

http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/3919/gorgonpreparingtostrike.jpg

Then we have gorgon instantly running behind wolverine stabbing him in the back before wolverine could react. So he ran all the way from the tree to stab wolverine, who possess super speed, in the back before he even had the time to react.

That look like some quicksilver sh** to me.

http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/9845/sneakattack1.jpg
http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/4935/sneakattack2.jpg

Then read what wolverine say while being stabbed.

Ok but they aren't analogous to what is going on in the forum, different situations for each.

You do actually believe he's faster than characters like QS and Flash?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Ok but they aren't analogous to what is going on in the forum, different situations for each.

You do actually believe he's faster than characters like QS and Flash?

LOL, not the flash but QS, I think his reflexes is on par with him. The guy has some amazing speed feats.

Can quicksilver move faster than the speed thought?

Originally posted by carver9
LOL, not the flash but QS, I think his reflexes is on par with him. The guy has some amazing speed feats.

Can quicksilver move faster than the speed thought?

Not sure, but if I recall my old my old X-Factor correctly I think QS "thinks" or perceives the world in an accelerated rate (somewhat contributing to his impatience and general *******-ishness) so he might actually be able move faster than a normal person can think.

Correct, like Flash their thought processes are much, much faster, hence speedlitzes on telepaths.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Correct, like Flash their thought processes are much, much faster, hence speedlitzes on telepaths.

i think that's true of most people with superhuman speed.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Correct, like Flash their thought processes are much, much faster, hence speedlitzes on telepaths.

I agree but we seen scans of gorgon thought process compared to humans and he completed and did entire things before a group of hand ninjas even noticed him or had the time to attack. So his thought process is on another level also.

http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/2715/webbingcagesmuv106.jpg

Here we have Spider-man imprisoning a Speedster in a webbing cage...

Originally posted by Parmaniac
http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/2715/webbingcagesmuv106.jpg

Here we have Spider-man imprisoning a Speedster in a webbing cage...

AAAANNNNDDDD?

That was classic Spidey and that feat wasnt impressive.

Wolverine has went h2h with speedster (speed demon), TWICE, and he still commented on no one is as fast as the gorgon.

Originally posted by carver9
AAAANNNNDDDD?

That was classic Spidey and that feat wasnt impressive.

Wolverine has went h2h with speedster (speed demon), TWICE, and he still commented on no one is as fast as the gorgon.

1. what do you mean by classic Spidey?

2. Wolverine wasn't keeping up with Speed Demon he just figured out where he would pop up next BIG difference, I already stated that the last time you posted that

3. It is impressive cause this guy was already running and Spidey was fast enough to web up a complete cage before he could fled.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
1. what do you mean by classic Spidey?

2. Wolverine wasn't keeping up with Speed Demon he just figured out where he would pop up next BIG difference, I already stated that the last time you posted that

3. It is impressive cause this guy was already running and Spidey was fast enough to web up a complete cage before he could fled.

Classic spidey as in the same classic spidey that was untouchable and the same classic spidey that matched the entire xmen physically and dominated them. Classic spidey was like precrisis superman, unbeatable.

Ok, you have speed demon running at full pace and wolverine bouncing around keeping up with him. He outsped speed demon that was running with super speed. In order for him to jump IN FRONT of him with a punch he would need to BEAT him to that destination which is what he did.

Its not impressive because as soon as he tried to run the webbing was already there.

Originally posted by carver9
Classic spidey as in the same classic spidey that was untouchable and the same classic spidey that matched the entire xmen physically and dominated them. Classic spidey was like precrisis superman, unbeatable.

Ok, you have speed demon running at full pace and wolverine bouncing around keeping up with him. He outsped speed demon that was running with super speed. In order for him to jump IN FRONT of him with a punch he would need to BEAT him to that destination which is what he did.

Its not impressive because as soon as he tried to run the webbing was already there.

precrisis Supes was depowered after the crisis (of course) Spidey never really had something like that except the Morlun evolve or die stuff wich was 1. long after that and 2. only his new gained powers where retconned there was no sign of a strength/sped upgrade etc.

post the scan again please

Yeah, so Spidey with his webbing was faster than a Speedster, simple really

Originally posted by Parmaniac
precrisis Supes was depowered after the crisis (of course) Spidey never really had something like that except the Morlun evolve or die stuff wich was 1. long after that and 2. only his new gained powers where retconned there was no sign of a strength/sped upgrade etc.

post the scan again please

Yeah, so Spidey with his webbing was faster than a Speedster, simple really

Spidey was at the top of his game during the beginning; you should know this.

You have one instance of him OWNING the entire xmen, then you have another instance of him saying right after that, that wolverine is faster than him.

Originally posted by carver9
Spidey was at the top of his game during the beginning; you should know this.

And how long in your opinion is "the beginning"? The comic where that feat is from is from 1994.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
precrisis Supes was depowered after the crisis (of course) Spidey never really had something like that except the Morlun evolve or die stuff wich was 1. long after that and 2. only his new gained powers where retconned there was no sign of a strength/sped upgrade etc.

post the scan again please

Yeah, so Spidey with his webbing was faster than a Speedster, simple really

Here ya go, you have speed demon running and Wolverine keeping up with him. No matter how much timing anyone have, you would have to have some kind of Super speed to keep up with a speedster and land a punch.

http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/1830/strategyte6.jpg

Then we have this.

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/948/speedballfj1mw3.jpg

Originally posted by Parmaniac
And how long in your opinion is "the beginning"? The comic where that feat is from is from 1994.

It doesnt matter, the feat wasnt impressive.

Wait so we're saying that classic Spiderman is unbeatable?

Originally posted by carver9
Here ya go, you have speed demon running and Wolverine keeping up with him. No matter how much timing anyone have, you would have to have some kind of Super speed to keep up with a speedster and land a punch.

http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/1830/strategyte6.jpg

Then we have this.

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/948/speedballfj1mw3.jpg

Highly arguable I think you overinterpret that scan, it seems more that the artist doesn't wanted to draw lots of panels instead he drew Speed Demon running and Wolverine trying to hit him, otherwise it would be ratarded that Wolverine states: "I figure out WHERE they're gonna pop up NEXT" it's not really hard to figure out where someone pops up next who's running straight forward unless you're a complete retard
but even if you really want to use it here you have this

http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/1778/speedkeepingupwithspeed.gif

to the second one here you have this:

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/4769/agilityavoids5superhuma.jpg

Originally posted by carver9
It doesnt matter, the feat wasnt impressive.

I take that as a confession

but here's another one
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/1210/scan0007.jpg
http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/7540/scan0008t.jpg
http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/7130/scan0010a.jpg
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/2450/scan0013p.jpg

And just to cake it all up so that gorgon wont be brought up again against spiderman, two different levels. Here ya go:

Gorgon chopping up some hand ninjas before they can even react, creating after images.

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/2563/origin3.jpg

This proves that hes faster than a bullet. Slapping bullets out of the way without even breaking a sweat.

http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/456/gorgonvselektra2.jpg

Wolverine comments on his speed again and THEN hes defeats wolverine and elektra and they surprised attacked him.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/9397/gorgonvswolverineelektr.jpg

THEN he beats up some hand ninja including wolverine but thats not the point of this scan, look how he takes the hand ninjas out, look at the speed that is displayed.

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/9397/gorgonvswolverineelektr.jpg

Another speed feat, take out a group of shield agents before they even got the chance to move a muscle and he's creating those lovely after images again.

http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/3632/gorgonvsshield1.jpg

This scan and the one before it, he teleport to the building IN FRONT OF SOME SHIELD AGENTS. Grab elektra, have a convo with her telepathically, and then he snaps her neck. He does all of this before the agents even notice him and again, they were right behind him.

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/2107/telepathy2.jpg

Then he deflects bullets again like its roses coming at him in slow motion.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Wait so we're saying that classic Spiderman is unbeatable?

I think so

It's good stuff.

Crazy how Spidey "dodged" Justice's telekinesis.

Originally posted by carver9
I think so I liked how Spiderman has been a Superhero who wasn't overpowered but just right.

But your argument would be faulty to the debate as he is reverted to his classic levels, despite being statistically higher, his best showings were classic.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Highly arguable I think you overinterpret that scan, it seems more that the artist doesn't wanted to draw lots of panels instead he drew Speed Demon running and Wolverine trying to hit him, otherwise it would be ratarded that Wolverine states: "I figure out WHERE they're gonna pop up NEXT" it's not really hard to figure out where someone pops up next who's running straight forward unless you're a complete retard
but even if you really want to use it here you have this

http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/1778/speedkeepingupwithspeed.gif

to the second one here you have this:

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/4769/agilityavoids5superhuma.jpg



I take that as a confession

but here's another one
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/1210/scan0007.jpg
http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/7540/scan0008t.jpg
http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/7130/scan0010a.jpg
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/2450/scan0013p.jpg

Those bullets wasnt moving any where close to bullet speed. Spidey had a entire convo before the bullet even came back to him along with the other guy. Its a good durability feat though, him grabbing bullets.

The other feats, I dont get why you posted them.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
I liked how Spiderman has been a Superhero who wasn't overpowered but just right.

But your argument would be faulty to the debate as he is reverted to his classic levels, despite being statistically higher, his best showings were classic.

Naah, back then no one couldnt even TOUCH spiderman; he was truly unbeatable.

I think they overpowered him back then but to each there own.

I think when writers say that they are putting him back to his classic levels, I honestly think that they are talking about his strength.

Originally posted by carver9
Naah, back then no one couldnt even TOUCH spiderman; he was truly unbeatable.

I think they overpowered him back then but to each there own.

I think when writers say that they are putting him back to his classic levels, I honestly think that they are talking about his strength. That was probably how they had meant him to be, but that is obviously very boring so they don't write him like that... he wouldn't be a wuss on the forum nor would he be unbeatable.

He is reverted to his classic self though, it's a huge retcon.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
That was probably how they had meant him to be, but that is obviously very boring so they don't write him like that... he wouldn't be a wuss on the forum nor would he be unbeatable.

He is reverted to his classic self though, it's a huge retcon.

Firelord couldnt even land a solid lick off of spiderman back then.

Hell, there was a scene where a spiderman clone ran through the entire Avengers that included thor, vision, iron man, etc... and that clone had the same powers as spiderman.

Spiderman was pretty much unbeatable and untouchable.

And you knew that and put Gorgan up against it?

He also handled the FF and Xmen. Honestly he is much more anti-team. He is designed to fight against higher numbers, much like Wolverine is anti-brick IMO.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
And you knew that and put Gorgan up against it?

He also handled the FF and Xmen. Honestly he is much more anti-team. He is designed to fight against higher numbers, much like Wolverine is anti-brick IMO.

We are talking about classic Spidey not current Spidey.

Current Spidey has had problems with Cap, Wolvy, Sabertooth, etc.... and Gorgon is>>everyone that I named speed wise, skill wise, etc....

Gorgon speed is on another level and Wolverine admitted this.

Yea, Wolverine has "had problems" with a deer.

When he cuts loose he goes back more to his classic self, on the forum he wouldn't just be some scrub. Did you see the Civil War scan when he blitzed several guys, did you see when he dodged those lasers?

He is as capable as ever. And Spiderman *is* on another level of speed, it's what he does.


*Has an urge to start a "true" classic Spiderman fad on the boards*

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Did you see the Civil War scan when he blitzed several guys, did you see when he dodged those lasers?

I finally found that one in the comic cause Battlehammer was argueing it here it is in a higher resolution:

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/9470/agilitycivilwar07.jpg

Only Blizzard isn't looking at him

Exactly, he is still as anti-team as before.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Yea, Wolverine has "had problems" with a deer.

When he cuts loose he goes back more to his classic self, on the forum he wouldn't just be some scrub. Did you see the Civil War scan when he blitzed several guys, did you see when he dodged those lasers?

He is as capable as ever. And Spiderman *is* on another level of speed, it's what he does.


*Has an urge to start a "true" classic Spiderman fad on the boards*

Well his showings kind of discredit everything you just said and as for speed, gorgon>>Spiderman.

Its kind of vague for you to use classic Spidey anyway since we have proof of Spiderman saying that wolverine is faster than him.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Exactly, he is still as anti-team as before.

Wolverine is an anti team but that still doesnt change the fact that gorgon speed is on another level.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Yea, Wolverine has "had problems" with a deer.
no he hasent, that some huge misconceptions on your part

Originally posted by Parmaniac
I finally found that one in the comic cause Battlehammer was argueing it here it is in a higher resolution:

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/9470/agilitycivilwar07.jpg

Only Blizzard isn't looking at him
You can clearly see that only mister fantastic and bishop were looking at him, everyone else is clearly facing another dirrecting and he sucker shots them.

Please don't post those huge images.


Originally posted by Battlehammer
You can clearly see that only mister fantastic and bishop were looking at him, everyone else is clearly facing another dirrecting and he sucker shots them.
Only you see that...

Originally posted by Battlehammer
no he hasent, that some huge misconceptions on your part

Has Radioactive Man fallen or what?

He went from being able to take hits from Thor's hammer to being dropped by Spidey and a guard w/a gun.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
You can clearly see that only mister fantastic and bishop were looking at him, everyone else is clearly facing another dirrecting and he sucker shots them.

http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/9096/agility2.jpg

1. Look at his legs and his upper body he was looking into his direction und AFTER he got kicked his upper body turned sideways

2. Radioactive Man was firing at him so it speaks pretty much for itself

yeah Blizzard wasn't looking at him I agree on this.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/9096/agility2.jpg

1. Look at his legs and his upper body he was looking into his direction und AFTER he got kicked his upper body turned sideways

2. Radioactive Man was firing at him so it speaks pretty much for itself

yeah Blizzard wasn't looking at him I agree on this.

I disagree it looks to me that both samson and radioactive man were staring straight a head not towards spiderman, but the many other combatants and spiderman hitting them from the side while he was running towards mr fantastic. Thats how I see it. I think people are putting more stock into it then it worth. It also make little sense for them to be all line up going after a single target.........

1. Look at his legs and his upper body he was looking into his direction und AFTER he got kicked his upper body turned sideway

2. Radioactive Man was firing at him so it speaks pretty much for itself

yeah Blizzard wasn't looking at him I agree on this.

Are you comparing this to what Gorgon did?

Dammit, stop posting it huge, thumbnail it, it ruins the page on the screen, lol.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Dammit, stop posting it huge, thumbnail it, it ruins the page on the screen, lol.

How do I thumbnail pics?

Originally posted by carver9
And just to cake it all up so that gorgon wont be brought up again against spiderman, two different levels. Here ya go:

Gorgon chopping up some hand ninjas before they can even react, creating after images.

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/2563/origin3.jpg

This proves that hes faster than a bullet. Slapping bullets out of the way without even breaking a sweat.

http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/456/gorgonvselektra2.jpg

Wolverine comments on his speed again and THEN hes defeats wolverine and elektra and they surprised attacked him.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/9397/gorgonvswolverineelektr.jpg

THEN he beats up some hand ninja including wolverine but thats not the point of this scan, look how he takes the hand ninjas out, look at the speed that is displayed.

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/9397/gorgonvswolverineelektr.jpg

Another speed feat, take out a group of shield agents before they even got the chance to move a muscle and he's creating those lovely after images again.

http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/3632/gorgonvsshield1.jpg

This scan and the one before it, he teleport to the building IN FRONT OF SOME SHIELD AGENTS. Grab elektra, have a convo with her telepathically, and then he snaps her neck. He does all of this before the agents even notice him and again, they were right behind him.

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/2107/telepathy2.jpg

Then he deflects bullets again like its roses coming at him in slow motion.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Dammit, stop posting it huge, thumbnail it, it ruins the page on the screen, lol.
agreed lol.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Dammit, stop posting it huge, thumbnail it, it ruins the page on the screen, lol.

I fixed it, now are you comparing spiderman speed to gorgons?

Yep, they just utilize it differently.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Yep, they just utilize it differently.


Majority of his showings revolves around his spider senses. His showings is no where close to what I showed you, especially his running speed. Gorgon blitzed wolverine before wolverine even noticed him and gorgon was like a mile away.

Spiderman doesn't run often because he doesn't need to. Spiderman doesn't use his spidersenses majorly in the offensive.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Spiderman doesn't run often because he doesn't need to. Spiderman doesn't use his spidersenses majorly in the offensive.



The feats between the two are still completely different.


Do you think that Spiderman can evade Elektra without her even touching him?

And I know for a FACT that spiderman cant run as fast as Gorgon did when he blitzed wolverine. That was some quicksilver crap.

I'm not saying that Spiderman is slow because he is fast as he** but gorgon and Spiderman speed is different.

Thats why metas tend to say, "no one is that fast".

Originally posted by carver9
The feats between the two are still completely different.


Do you think that Spiderman can evade Elektra without her even touching him?

And I know for a FACT that spiderman can run as fast as Gorgon did when he blitzed wolverine. That was some quicksilver crap.

I'm not saying that Spiderman is slow because he is fast as he** but gorgon and Spiderman speed is different.

Thats why metas tend to say, "no one is that fast". Yea well Spiderman has already proven he can do that, will it genrally happen in a crossover match? No, but then again they show him look like that against lower characters, and he holds back. Gorgon doesn't have that problem.

"Classic Spiderman is unbeatable, Classic Spiderman is unbeatable."

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Yea well Spiderman has already proven he can do that, will it genrally happen in a crossover match? No, but then again they show him look like that against lower characters, and he holds back. Gorgon doesn't have that problem.

"Classic Spiderman is unbeatable, Classic Spiderman is unbeatable."

He has proven that he can dodge some people but people like elektra tends to tag him almost every time they fight. Look at the cap vs Spiderman fight, cap was a step ahead of him the entire time and cap and gorgon speed isnt even comparable.

Then look at the spidey vs daken fight, BEFORE he used the pheromones, he blitzed spiderman with spiderman saying "hes as fast as his father". Look at the daredevil fights or the fight that he had with dead pool.

Or THIS fight.

http://s715.photobucket.com/albums/ww156/ankur2113/?action=view&current=Spider-Man609005.jpg

Kaine wouldnt have laid a hand or even seen gorgon. The fight would have ended that panel.

Again, its not safe to use classic spidey since he commented on wolverine being faster than him and was in denial afterwards.

Now we have wolverine and Elektra sneak attacking him, ripping him to shreds, whippin that a**. Wolverine teleports out of no where and grabs him and claw him.

http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/9397/gorgonvswolverineelektr.jpg
http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/9397/gorgonvswolverineelektr.jpg

We see him on the ground injured but guess what, he still blitz two of the fastest street/meta with ease. They didnt even get the chance to react. He takes both elektra and Wolverine out in a couple of panels off pure speed alone, before they even had the chance or opportunity to react. This is something that Spiderman wouldnt be able to do either.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/9397/gorgonvswolverineelektr.jpg

Whippin that a**.

Lol.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Whippin that a**.

Lol.

i'd say even solo he stops @ gorgon

Originally posted by carver9
Now we have wolverine and Elektra sneak attacking him, ripping him to shreds, whippin that a**. Wolverine teleports out of no where and grabs him and claw him.

http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/9397/gorgonvswolverineelektr.jpg
http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/9397/gorgonvswolverineelektr.jpg

We see him on the ground injured but guess what, he still blitz two of the fastest street/meta with ease. They didnt even get the chance to react. He takes both elektra and Wolverine out in a couple of panels off pure speed alone, before they even had the chance or opportunity to react. This is something that Spiderman wouldnt be able to do either.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/9397/gorgonvswolverineelektr.jpg You shouldn't show them getting hit as a feat. Spiderman said, "Noone was faster", and remember this is classic Spiderman, he can't lose.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
You shouldn't show them getting hit as a feat. Spiderman said, "Noone was faster", and remember this is classic Spiderman, he can't lose.

I shouldnt show who getting hit, gorgon, well he got sneak attacked.

Now if you are referring to Wolverine and Elektra then they basically got blitzed before they had any time to react.

Read what Wolverine say, "damn hes fast".

The point of my post is that hes faster than Spiderman; way faster.

He hits elektra and then hit wolverine before wolverine even moved a muscle (look at him standing in the same pose as he was when elektra got tanked).

Originally posted by carver9
I shouldnt show who getting hit, gorgon, well he got sneak attacked.

Now if you are referring to Wolverine and Elektra then they basically got blitzed before they had any time to react.

Read what Wolverine say, "damn hes fast".

The point of my post is that hes faster than Spiderman; way faster. Hundreds of characters have commented on Spiderman's speed, he's stomped more than two people at once.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Hundreds of characters have commented on Spiderman's speed, he's stomped more than two people at once.

I'm not saying that people dont comment on his speed but I have yet to see someone like Wolverine, Cap, Elektra, top tier fighters say ANYTHING about his speed.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Hundreds of characters have commented on Spiderman's speed, he's stomped more than two people at once.

I'm pretty sure there was a instance where elektra stabbed spiderman in the shoulder. She couldnt even graze her body or even touch Gorgons boots or his hair through their entire tussle.

Originally posted by carver9
I'm not saying that people dont comment on his speed but I have yet to see someone like Wolverine, Cap, Elektra, top tier fighters say ANYTHING about his speed. He's had true superhumans say things about his speed. But I'll look into that for you.