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Elaine at the height of her powers runs a gauntlet. She gets to rest and fully nourish her strenght after each fight. PIS, CIS and jobbing are all off.

Gauntlet:

1- Fully Powered Tyrant
2- Imperiex
3- Phoenix Force
4- Goblin Force
5- Secret Wars Galactus, Death, and Eternity
6- Abraxas
7- The Anti-Monitor(CoIE) and Oblivion
8- Mr.Mxy
9- The Ultimator
10- Mandrakk
11- The Living Tribunal
12- Pre-retcon MM
13- Pre-retcon Beyonder
14- Primal Monitor

who stops her?

Either stops at 10 or 14 or clears it.

13 and 14 seem the same to me

You do realize Elaine was god at the height of her power.

Considering that we can maybe say that PM and Pre-ret Beyonder stalemate her at best.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Either stops at 10 or 14 or clears it. How the hell does she get past PM? or Beyonder for that matter?

Originally posted by kgkg
You do realize Elaine was god at the height of her power.

Considering that we can maybe say that PM and Pre-ret Beyonder stalemate her at best. She wasn't equal to the Presence. She was only god of one universe if im not mistaken. Just like Sise-neg

Originally posted by galactusischere
She wasn't equal to the Presence. She was only god of one universe if im not mistaken. Just like Sise-neg Wrong.

ill say stalemate 13 and 14

Originally posted by kgkg
Wrong.

Was it stated that she was = to the presence himself?

Originally posted by galactusischere
Was it stated that she was = to the presence himself?

Originally posted by galactusischere
Was it stated that she was = to the presence himself?
Well she replaced him but you're right, I don't know if it was ever stated. I think she was Michael's power+Lucifer's power which would make her more powerful than anything other than the Presence himself.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Well she replaced him but you're right, I don't know if it was ever stated. I think she was Michael's power+Lucifer's power which would make her more powerful than anything other than the Presence himself.

Were Mike and Lucifer > Mandrakk or Ultimator?
No. People over estimate her just like Sise-neg. Sise-neg only became one universe.

Originally posted by galactusischere
Were Mike and Lucifer > Mandrakk or Ultimator?
No. People over estimate her just like Sise-neg. Sise-neg only became one universe.
Mike and Lucy were pretty damn powerful. The Endless were all terrified of Lucifer and they're multiversal abstracts.

Originally posted by galactusischere
Was it stated that she was = to the presence himself? No but it was clear that god had left Elaine as the ruler of the his creation when he left.
http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/7950/godj.jpg

"Your actions will determine if you become me" - and thats exactly what happend.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Mike and Lucy were pretty damn powerful. The Endless were all terrified of Lucifer and they're multiversal abstracts.

And Mxy was terrified of Ultimator. And you know the story with Mandrakk alot better than me. WIth that said, do you seriously believe that Mike+Lucy>Ultimator or Mandrakk or Beyonder or Molecule Man or Primal Monitor or Living Tribunal?

Together they are just as powerful

Originally posted by kgkg
No but it was clear that god had left Elaine as the ruler of the his creation when he left.
http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/7950/godj.jpg

"Your actions will determine if you become me" - and thats exactly what happend.

It wasn't stated that she would get ALL of hes powers. Plus that wouldn't put her beyond Beyonder or Primal Monitor still.

Originally posted by galactusischere
And Mxy was terrified of Ultimator. And you know the story with Mandrakk alot better than me. WIth that said, do you seriously believe that Mike+Lucy>Ultimator or Mandrakk or Beyonder or Molecule Man or Primal Monitor or Living Tribunal?
Ultimator really wasn't all that impressive. Mxy beat her after tanking her blast.

Mike+Luxy would be at least equal to PR Beyonder/Molecule Man/Mandrakk/Living Tribunal. PM not so much.

Originally posted by iceman24567
Together they are just as powerful
Not really. Theres still the Spectre who happens to be the wrath of god and probably some other beings/items that I don't know about that "complete" the Presence. Though I might be wrong, I don't really read any DC other than some JLA comics

Originally posted by kgkg
No but it was clear that god had left Elaine as the ruler of the his creation when he left.
http://img682.imageshack.us/i/godj.jpg/

"Your actions will determine if you become me" - and thats exactly what happend. aint that Vertigo??

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Ultimator really wasn't all that impressive. Mxy beat her after tanking her blast.

Mike+Luxy would be at least equal to PR Beyonder/Molecule Man/Mandrakk/Living Tribunal. PM not so much.

Beyonder was stated to be MILLIONS of times more powerful than THE MULTI-VERSE(at the time equal to OMNI-VERSE) COMBINED. So LT + Abstracts + Ultimate Nullifier + other beings of the whole multi-verse other than Molecule Man x 1000000s.

Living Tribunal had the power to create two beings and make them the guardians of mega-verses casually.

Molecule man created a barrier more powerful than the Multi-verse(Omni-verse) with ease that was easily shattered by Beyonder.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Ultimator really wasn't all that impressive. Mxy beat her after tanking her blast.

Mike+Luxy would be at least equal to PR Beyonder/Molecule Man/Mandrakk/Living Tribunal. PM not so much. Ultimator dint try ot kill mxy (the only way he kill imps is eat them thats why mxy had to run away)

Originally posted by galactusischere
It wasn't stated that she would get ALL of hes powers. Plus that wouldn't put her beyond Beyonder or Primal Monitor still. Yes but neither did Beyonder or PM was said to have all of gods power as well.

All those characters was God-like compared to rest of creation or called God itself.

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
aint that Vertigo?? Yes. Elaine Belloc is a Vertigo character

Originally posted by kgkg
Yes. Elaine Belloc is a Vertigo character yeah so Elaine Beloc became Presence...BUT vertigo Presence aint the real DC Presence (he not omnipotent wtf not even omnisient )

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
yeah so Elaine Beloc became Presence...BUT vertigo Presence aint the real DC Presence (he not omnipotent wtf not even omnisient )
Wrong.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Wrong. Vertigo Presence IS NOT omnipotent/omnisient check it uself he himself says it onpanel

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Mike and Lucy were pretty damn powerful. The Endless were all terrified of Lucifer and they're multiversal abstracts.

Most of them yes, Destiny seemed to hold his own pretty well though.

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
Vertigo Presence IS NOT omnipotent/omnisient check it uself he himself says it onpanel
I've seen that scan and it doesn't prove He isn't omnipotent/omniscient within the confines of His creation. It only proves that His creation (and He Himself) is not all there is. I always took the other things that effect him to be the writer himself.

Originally posted by kgkg
No but it was clear that god had left Elaine as the ruler of the his creation when he left.
http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/7950/godj.jpg

"Your actions will determine if you become me" - and thats exactly what happend.

Agreed, not many can match The Word, Michael and Lucifer.

13 via stalemate.

Originally posted by galactusischere
Elaine at the height of her powers runs a gauntlet. She gets to rest and fully nourish her strenght after each fight. PIS, CIS and jobbing are all off.

Gauntlet:

1- Fully Powered Tyrant
2- Imperiex
3- Phoenix Force
4- Goblin Force
5- Secret Wars Galactus, Death, and Eternity
6- Abraxas
7- The Anti-Monitor(CoIE) and Oblivion
8- Mr.Mxy
9- The Ultimator
10- Mandrakk
11- The Living Tribunal
12- Pre-retcon MM
13- Pre-retcon Beyonder
14- Primal Monitor

who stops her?

This list is a little bit out of order IMHO. Elaine should make it pretty easy till 8. 8 is the dead end if it is WF Mxy. Else she goes on till 10 where she stops if it is the first Mandrakk or goes on if it's the second one. 13 and 14 Are the defintive End however.

I don't see Mxy winning, even if this was WF Mxy, he won't do nary a scratch to her.

She would most likely stop at 14. Else, she clears.

Stops at 13

Originally posted by galactusischere

Living Tribunal had the power to create two beings and make them the guardians of mega-verses casually Which was just a nod at the Marvel vs DC story. And it mentions his 'hooded spectral ally' helping him do it, which just so happened to be another nod to his counterpart in that story- the Spectre.

Originally posted by Juntai
Which was just a nod at the Marvel vs DC story. And it mentions his 'hooded spectral ally' helping him do it, which just so happened to be another nod to his counterpart in that story- the Spectre.

I know but, seriously Spectre is nothing to the LT. Even when hes backed up he isn't nearly as powerful.

And whats with Mandrakk>LT/Beyonder/Molecule Man crap?

Originally posted by galactusischere
I know but, seriously Spectre is nothing to the LT. Even when hes backed up he isn't nearly as powerful.

Why do you think that? What are LT's biggest fighting feats? IIRC his ultimate Jugdment is an Supernova and he lost against protege.
Spectre fought an amped CoiE AM and was stated more then once to posess infinite energies. He also challanged ZH Parallax. Sure Spectre has his own series and he appears in comics regularly, so he needs some low showings as well but his best showings are good enough to make him LT's equal, IMO.

Originally posted by galactusischere
And whats with Mandrakk>LT/Beyonder/Molecule Man crap?

Pre or post recton?

pre-rec Beyonder = WF Mxy IMO.

Originally posted by galactusischere
I know but, seriously Spectre is nothing to the LT. exacly

LT aint gonna let himself regulerly get owned by a 5D imps thats for sure

Originally posted by galactusischere
I know but, seriously Spectre is nothing to the LT. Even when hes backed up he isn't nearly as powerful.

When hes backed up he should be .


Originally posted by SoulDevourer


exacly

LT aint gonna let himself regulerly get owned by a 5D imps thats for sure

But he was owned by a gun made by Reeds??

Originally posted by kevdude

But he was owned by a gun made by Reeds?? dat gun aint canon


edit> thats the story where Galactus more powerfull then LT+all other abstracts right?

Elaine stops at a stalemate with anyone like 10, 13, or 14

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
dat gun aint canon


edit> thats the story where Galactus more powerfull then LT+all other abstracts right?

All Lt showings even those from What If are canon uhuh

rofl

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Why do you think that? What are LT's biggest fighting feats? IIRC his ultimate Jugdment is an Supernova and he lost against protege.
Spectre fought an amped CoiE AM and was stated more then once to posess infinite energies. He also challanged ZH Parallax. Sure Spectre has his own series and he appears in comics regularly, so he needs some low showings as well but his best showings are good enough to make him LT's equal, IMO.



Pre or post recton?

pre-rec Beyonder = WF Mxy IMO.

CoIE AM/Zero Hour Parallax=LT now?
LT got owned by Protege who happened to be the new One Above All. He had the ability to copy powers WITHOUT any limit.

Pre-retcon Beyonder was MILLIONS of times more powerful than the multi-verse(at the time omniverse) COMBINED.
So LT+abstracts and multi-verse x MILLIONS.

WF Mxy would easily go down to the LT.

Originally posted by kevdude
When hes backed up he should be .


Yea, thats why hes got owned by imps, Anti-Monitor, AND ZH Parallax? GEB owned him too, but he was the other half of the Prsence so that low feat is disqualified but what about the ones above?
Seriously Spectre isn't even 50% of the LT at full power.

And as much as I would like that story to be cannon...it isn't.

Originally posted by galactusischere
CoIE AM/Zero Hour Parallax=LT now?
LT got owned by Protege who happened to be the new One Above All. He had the ability to copy powers WITHOUT any limit.

Pre-retcon Beyonder was MILLIONS of times more powerful than the multi-verse(at the time omniverse) COMBINED.
So LT+abstracts and multi-verse x MILLIONS.

WF Mxy would easily go down to the LT.
You really think WF mxy would go down against LT easily?

^Again, what are LT's greatest battlefeats? Who has he defeated to be above the Spectre?

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
^Again, what are LT's greatest battlefeats? Who has he defeated to be above the Spectre? On the other side of the coin... who has LT lost to to be put below Spectre?

Originally posted by Blanket
On the other side of the coin... who has LT lost to to be put below Spectre?

Protege defeated him and his ultimate Judgement (a Supernova) failed to kill Korvac.
Except of this, I never said he is below Spectre, IMO they are peers (at full power, backed up by their bosses). I just don't think that LT > Spectre, I think LT = Spectre .

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Protege defeated him and his ultimate Judgement (a Supernova) failed to kill Korvac.
Except of this, I never said he is below Spectre, IMO they are peers (at full power, backed up by their bosses). I just don't think that LT > Spectre, I think LT = Spectre . protege was potentialy = TOAA thats how he can copy just about any1 (he was ment to evolve into TOAA or somethin right?)
and he can do better then a supernova lol


prob is Specter almost never has full backin of Presence anywayn

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
protege was potentialy = TOAA thats how he can copy just about any1 (he was ment to evolve into TOAA or somethin right?)
and he can do better then a supernova lol


prob is Specter almost never has full backin of Presence anywayn

So Scathan the Celestial over > TOAA

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Protege defeated him and his ultimate Judgement (a Supernova) failed to kill Korvac.
Except of this, I never said he is below Spectre, IMO they are peers (at full power, backed up by their bosses). I just don't think that LT > Spectre, I think LT = Spectre . Protege never defeated LT. LT stood there like a retard watching a kid get beat up.

Meh, the supernova was all the way back then... and it was just a nova, nothing more.

K, good. Just the way you put it made it seem different. I think at full power, they're equal, but most times, Spectre is far below LT (considering all the low feats/shit).

Originally posted by Blanket
K, good. Just the way you put it made it seem different. I think at full power, they're equal, but most times, Spectre is far below LT (considering all the low feats/shit).

I agree.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
So Scathan the Celestial over > TOAA i said "potentialy"

Protege wasnt at OAA lvl...yet

Originally posted by Blanket
Protege never defeated LT. LT stood there like a retard watching a kid get beat up.

Meh, the supernova was all the way back then... and it was just a nova, nothing more.

K, good. Just the way you put it made it seem different. I think at full power, they're equal, but most times, Spectre is far below LT (considering all the low feats/shit).
The one time that I can see that the Spectre could have ever been at full power and thus LT's equal was in American Gothic where he actually managed to move the GEB. The fact that he was able to effect (if however slightly) a Supreme Being shows mad power. His appearance in COIE is probably him at 75% power, I don't think the Presence ever really wanted him to kill the AM, just prevent him from destroying everything. There's also the time he briefly merged with the Source but I don't think its quantifiable in any way.

also one time he remove mxys powers or somethin...he prolly had decent backin from Presence then


anyway it almost never happen & hes on his own most o the time. LT at least is consistent

So Michael and lucifer are also above LT with that logic. Same for WF Mxy and Ultimator.

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
also one time he remove mxys powers or somethin...he prolly had decent backin from Presence then


anyway it almost never happen & hes on his own most o the time. LT at least is consistent When he had no backing...

Niggas puttin' Spectre on par with LT.

Do not recall LT getting embarrassed by Parallax.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Niggas puttin' Spectre on par with LT.

Do not recall LT getting embarrassed by Parallax.
If the LT got off his ass once in a while like the Spectre he'd probably have a much less spotless record.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
If the LT got off his ass once in a while like the Spectre he'd probably have a much less spotless record.

Name the people that can or could beat LT. All of the people who did are or were nearly or completely omnipotent. Parallax, Mxy and AM weren't.

Originally posted by galactusischere
Name the people that can or could beat LT. All of the people who did are or were nearly or completely omnipotent. Parallax, Mxy and AM weren't.
WF Mxy could beat the LT. He'd turn the LT into a bobblehead.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
WF Mxy could beat the LT. He'd turn the LT into a bobblehead. nah LT woud judge mxy for cosmic misdemanors, guilty as charge & turn him into 2D (make him flat hehe)
good punishment for 5D imp ^^

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
nah LT woud judge mxy for cosmic misdemanors, guilty as charge & turn him into 2D (make him flat hehe)
good punishment for 5D imp ^^
Did you read World's Funnest?

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Did you read World's Funnest?

And LT would turn himself back.
What did he do that could suggest he could even harm the LT in the slightest?
LT can destroy the omni-verse with a thought.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Did you read World's Funnest? yeah and 4th wall BS dont count

Originally posted by galactusischere
And LT would turn himself back.
What did he do that could suggest he could even harm the LT in the slightest?
LT can destroy the omni-verse with a thought.
Mxy was destroying the multiverse for fun. He did what the Am did and more except as it was shown at the end of the story it was just something he and Bat-Mite did every Tuesday. The crossfire of their battles were killing multiple versions of the Spectre. Mxy never takes anything seriously, he even destroyed the 5th Dimension in that story.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Mxy was destroying the multiverse for fun. He did what the Am did and more except as it was shown at the end of the story it was just something he and Bat-Mite did every Tuesday. The crossfire of their battles were killing multiple versions of the Spectre. Mxy never takes anything seriously, he even destroyed the 5th Dimension in that story.
I know that the DC Multi-verse is bigger than Marvel's but how are those feats that u mentioned beyond the LIVING TRIBUNAL? LT can also destroy the MU multi-verse and recreate it for fun. Even Galactus can do that. LT>the Nemesis/Alien Entity who happen to be the creators of all reality.

There are multiple versions of the Spectre...there is only one LT.

Long story short, you have to be beyond the omniverse to challenge the LT.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Mxy was destroying the multiverse for fun. He did what the Am did and more except as it was shown at the end of the story it was just something he and Bat-Mite did every Tuesday. The crossfire of their battles were killing multiple versions of the Spectre. Mxy never takes anything seriously, he even destroyed the 5th Dimension in that story. and a MEGAverse is nothin to LT. ok so LT never does anythin for fun but that dont make him less powerful, just less fun ^^

so we know mxy can destroy any universes up to 5D. ima say he cant destroy Ultimators dimension for exemple (cos its 10D)


btw werent the 5D imps afraid of AM? iirc they locked out the 5th dimension because of the damage AM was making

Originally posted by galactusischere
I know that the DC Multi-verse is bigger than Marvel's but how are those feats that u mentioned beyond the LIVING TRIBUNAL? LT can also destroy the MU multi-verse and recreate it for fun. Even Galactus can do that. LT>the Nemesis/Alien Entity who happen to be the creators of all reality.

There are multiple versions of the Spectre...there is only one LT.

Long story short, you have to be beyond the omniverse to challenge the LT.
Galactus can't destroy one universe for fun.

Originally posted by galactusischere
I know that the DC Multi-verse is bigger than Marvel's depends. after COIE DCU was 52 universes compared to...infinity in MU?

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Galactus can't destroy one universe for fun. The Ultimate Nullifier can. easily. and is an aspect of Galactus.
If the UN can easily, then imagine what the LT can do. Seriously tens of Mxys wouldn't be enough to touch LT

Originally posted by galactusischere
The Ultimate Nullifier can. easily. and is an aspect of Galactus.
If the UN can easily, then imagine what the LT can do. Seriously tens of Mxys wouldn't be enough to touch LT
Feats say different.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Feats say different. LT is the cosmic powerhouse, the judge of all reality and right at the top of the food chain. He rarely even appears in a comic.
With that said Thanos with the IG easily defeated all of the abstracts(616 Eternity=multi-eternity as found out in the Abraxas saga) with ease. Magus with an incomplete IG stopped the UN's blast and reverted it. And Warlock with all that power knew that he would be helpless against the LT's final judgement and action.

You can go ahead and say that the IG was only universal but, in the Infinity saga it was shown to be multi-versal.

I love with when these cosmic thread all turn into Spectre vs LT