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Which duo wins?

IT'S HAMMER TIME!
http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae259/the_ninjak/Forum/299109143_feefd92893.jpg
SUPES DIES!
http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae259/the_ninjak/Forum/Death_of_Superman_TPB-168-169-170.jpghttp://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae259/the_ninjak/Forum/triple-h002.jpg
AND DIANA AND THOR MAKE OUT WHILE LOIS CRIES OVER SUPE'S LIFELESS BODY.

lol @ the random ass Triple H pic

Team Two wins, though.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank


Team Two wins, though. why?

Originally posted by Starscream M
why?

Well, Diana is clearly the most skilled out of everyone present. While it could be said she's the physically weakest person here in terms of strength/durability, her agility and skills round out her weaknesses and make her a good enough match for either of the Hammer Bros, especially without their hammers. Superman isn't a slouch in that department, either.

Adding all powers/equipment to each team makes things pretty even and as is, I don't see Team Two steamrolling anyway.

Whats with HHH?

Team 2. Like Jake said, WW may be the weakest one here, but her agility, experience, and skills make up for it. So with that said, I can see BRB being the weakest.

Thor vs Superman, Imo, I give it to Superman.

WW vs BRB, I give it to WW 7-8/10

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Well, Diana is clearly the most skilled out of everyone present. While it could be said she's the physically weakest person here in terms of strength/durability, her agility and skills round out her weaknesses and make her a good enough match for either of the Hammer Bros, especially without their hammers. Superman isn't a slouch in that department, either.

Adding all powers/equipment to each team makes things pretty even and as is, I don't see Team Two steamrolling anyway. ummm Thor and Beta Ray Bill have their hammers

Originally posted by Starscream M
ummm Thor and Beta Ray Bill have their hammers

so you neuter one team more than another?

Originally posted by -Pr-
so you neuter one team more than another?

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Team 2. Like Jake said, WW may be the weakest one here, but her agility, experience, and skills make up for it. So with that said, I can see BRB being the weakest.

Thor vs Superman, Imo, I give it to Superman.

WW vs BRB, I give it to WW 7-8/10

Beta Ray Bill is far from being the weakest link but in this scenerio I can see Supes winning against Thor more than not and I can see Wonder Woman beating BRB.

I agree with your post but BRB isnt the weakest link, I just give Wonder Woman the edge due to her being the fastest person on the battlefield.

I would give her the majority against anyone in this battle with these rules in place.

Originally posted by -Pr-
so you neuter one team more than another? which team am I neutering more?

Team 1 wins.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Team 1 wins.

Why?

Originally posted by carver9
Why? Because either beat WW or Superman.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Because either beat WW or Superman.

I disagree, I would give Thor OR Beta Ray the majority over either if they had their powers but in this scenerio, I can see DC side prevailing.

The reason I say this is because Supes is faster and even though Thor would get some licks, Supes would land more.

Beta Ray Bill and Wonder Woman.

Wonder Woman is the key factor, she is the fastest, better fight, just as strong and just as durable.

Her speed and her skills are above them all which gives her a huge advantage. We have already seen a demonstration of this. Superman is fast as hell but he even lost her during combat when he punched her from the Sun to earth. She winked out on him and came behind him with a hit to the ear.

Originally posted by carver9
I disagree, I would give Thor OR Beta Ray the majority over either if they had their powers but in this scenerio, I can see DC side prevailing.

The reason I say this is because Supes is faster and even though Thor would get some licks, Supes would land more.

Beta Ray Bill and Wonder Woman.

Wonder Woman is the key factor, she is the fastest, better fight, just as strong and just as durable.

Her speed and her skills are above them all which gives her a huge advantage. We have already seen a demonstration of this. Superman is fast as hell but he even lost her during combat when he punched her from the Sun to earth. She winked out on him and came behind him with a hit to the ear. Thor is far more powerful and has the reflexes to more than beat Supes handily.

How is she just as strong as Beta Ray?

Bill is tagging her and she can't take too many blows before she goes down.

Viking style brawling ftw.

Team Two.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Team Two.

Originally posted by -Pr-
so you neuter one team more than another? I wouldn't one side gets neutered more than the other cause I'm guessing if the Hammer boys get to keep their weapons then so Wonder Woman.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Because either beat WW or Superman.


at first i thought it was without their hammers. that would have really tipped the scales over to team 2. but even with their hammers team 2 still wins. Wondy is superior to all 3 in melee when it comes to skill. i would think Thor is second. even if she is considered by many the least strongest of the 4, she is not that far apart from them. wondy is still considered a peer. plus team 2 should have the speed advantage even with team one's hammers available.


team 2 wins
6.5/10

Originally posted by Starscream M
ummm Thor and Beta Ray Bill have their hammers

I figured "pure melee fight" meant strictly H2H as far as this thread goes.

With Mjolnir and Stormbreaker in play, Team One should win, imo. They'll play hell trying to get through Diana's defenses especially if she still has the Aegis bracelets, but Superman is going to get hit eventually by at least one of the enchanted weapons. And his magic vulnerability/disadvantages against magic (compared to everyone else present) coupled with the striking power either Thor or BRB can unleash give them the hard earned win.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
at first i thought it was without their hammers. that would have really tipped the scales over to team 2. but even with their hammers team 2 still wins. Wondy is superior to all 3 in melee when it comes to skill. i would think Thor is second. even if she is considered by many the least strongest of the 4, she is not that far apart from them. wondy is still considered a peer. plus team 2 should have the speed advantage even with team one's hammers available.


team 2 wins
6.5/10 So? She is less durable and the weakest of all three. She goes down quickly when they start bashing into her head and the same goes for Superman though it will definitely take a longer time than against WW.

Originally posted by Starscream M
which team am I neutering more?

The DC one.

Originally posted by Newjak
I wouldn't one side gets neutered more than the other cause I'm guessing if the Hammer boys get to keep their weapons then so Wonder Woman.

but she can't use her lasso or tiara. and superman can't use ranged attacks.

Bill survived Galactus trying to squash him like a bug, along with wrestling with Stardust barehanded with cosmic energy all over his body.

And Stardust may be one of the weaker heralds, but even the weakest herald can bust planets. That's something Superman and WW can't do with their bare hands..

Originally posted by cdtm
Bill survived Galactus trying to squash him like a bug, along with wrestling with Stardust barehanded with cosmic energy all over his body.

And Stardust may be one of the weaker heralds, but even the weakest herald can bust planets. That's something Superman and WW can't do with their bare hands..

Superman, I'd wager could. Diana? Probably not.

Originally posted by -Pr-
The DC one.



but she can't use her lasso or tiara. and superman can't use ranged attacks. ok, and thor can't use any of his many energy powers (lighting, godblast, antiforce blast, soul suck, etc)

Team two for the win. Superman and Wonder Woman are superior to Thor and Beta Ray Bill. In my honest opinion, both Clark and Diana are physically stronger than the hammer brothers. Thor and BRB are far more versatile, but given Diana's weapons and Superman's awesomeness they are by far the better duo. People also tend to forget that Diana has tanked nukes, blows etc without using her vambraces..

Originally posted by quanchi112
So? She is less durable and the weakest of all three. She goes down quickly when they start bashing into her head and the same goes for Superman though it will definitely take a longer time than against WW.

how can they easily bash her head when she will most likely deflect or dodge many of those attempts? you may say they have the ability to deal with her speed, but you have to couple her speed with her superior fighting ability. plus i'm pretty sure she has her aegis bracelets along with her. she would be able to deflect a bunch of hammer shots. unless im wrong, when it comes to superman they can't lace their hammer shots with mystic lightning. i dont think that's allowed in this fight. gotta wait for the OP to clarify that. if i'm correct, the magic weakness of supes is out the door.

Mjolnir and Stormbreaker are inherently magic, though. Even without charging the weapons with mystical energies, it's still enchanted by skyfather lvl magic.

Pure melee means the hammer twins lose lightning and godblasts, Superman loses heat vision and freeze breath, and Diana... isn't allowed to throw her tiara any more but can still use it in close Also she can't use the Aegis bracer's new shock function. She's easily the least-gimmed of the four.



Her impact durability is in the same class as Superman's, and her strength is pretty close to his too.

You downplay WW a lot but she's pretty darn powerful and tough. What slight disadvantages she has are easily made up for by her advantages.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Mjolnir and Stormbreaker are inherently magic, though. Even without charging the weapons with mystical energies, it's still enchanted by skyfather lvl magic.


that still lessens the effect on Supes dont you think? a mystic lightning based hammer shot on Supes is way more damaging to him than a regular one. plus even though Supes may be less invulnerable to magic, his overall invulnerability is just so high that i don't think it will give him that much of a disadvantage fighting Thor or BRB. the bottom line for me is I think team 1 is more neutered than team 2. this is because Thor is almost always portrayed jumping into battle by flailing his hammer everywhere. it is only when he really gets serious that his open powerset comes out. weather manip, mystic lightning, godblast, etc. etc. when it comes to a melee fight, that is where team 2 really excels. you just gotta give them the slight nod. when it comes to strength and durability, it's almost a wash. team 2 wins cause they have the speed advantage.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
that still lessens the effect on Supes dont you think? a mystic lightning based hammer shot on Supes is way more damaging to him than a regular one. plus even though Supes may be less invulnerable to magic, his overall invulnerability is just so high that i don't think it will give him that much of a disadvantage fighting Thor or BRB. the bottom line for me is I think team 1 is more neutered than team 2. this is because Thor is almost always portrayed jumping into battle by flailing his hammer everywhere. it is only when he really gets serious that his open powerset comes out. weather manip, mystic lightning, godblast, etc. etc. when it comes to a melee fight, that is where team 2 really excels. you just gotta give them the slight nod. when it comes to strength and durability, it's almost a wash. team 2 wins cause they have the speed advantage.

Good points, but the striking power of Thor w/ Mjolnir and BRB w/ Stormbreaker are pretty insane. Granted, Superman's fists and Diana's are powerful as well, but when you take people that are already in their class strength wise, and give them a melee weapon which further increases that striking power, things get a bit murky. I think Superman will be able to dodge and press his speed advantage for only so long until he ends up getting tagged by one of the hammers, which will effect him greater than his fist would effect either Thor or BRB.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Good points, but the striking power of Thor w/ Mjolnir and BRB w/ Stormbreaker are pretty insane. Granted, Superman's fists and Diana's are powerful as well, but when you take people that are already in their class strength wise, and give them a melee weapon which further increases that striking power, things get a bit murky. I think Superman will be able to dodge and press his speed advantage for only so long until he ends up getting tagged by one of the hammers, which will effect him greater than his fist would effect either Thor or BRB.


fine fine... >=/
ill change my 6.5/10
team 2 still wins though

5.8/10

Thor solos.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I figured "melee fight" meant strictly H2H as far as this thread goes. melee doesn't have any connotation to anything other than CQC. knives, bats, etc is allowed, just no firearms and the like. "pure" ..... i guess they have to clarify themselves in lake minnatonka first or something ... *shrugs*

Wonder Woman could loan Clark an axe or something

Imagine Thor and BRB swinging their hammers at the same time, connecting on opposite sides of supe`s head.
Kersplat!

http://righttruth.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/01/05/headexplode.jpg

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Thor solos.

that would be Orion
anyway no exotic powers I see it as an even fight (due to Supe's weakness to magic).

also lol at WW beating Bill 8/10

Originally posted by Starscream M
ok, and thor can't use any of his many energy powers (lighting, godblast, antiforce blast, soul suck, etc)

and yet still has a massive hammer.

a massive magic hammer...

Originally posted by -Pr-
and yet still has a massive hammer. ok, so normally in a thor vs superman match, who would you say wins?

Originally posted by Warlord
a massive magic hammer...

Originally posted by -Pr-
and yet still has a massive hammer.

i think the OP wanted Thor to keep his melee weapon , but all the susequent powers assosiated with it are gone. (projected powers) Afterall it IS a melee weapon and if he hits he gets to put the hurt on team 2, but how many times have we seen Thor down a rwal threat WITHOUT the use of ranged/energy attacks? Not much, i think it's fine that the hammer bros keep the hammers, they're not shooting magical lightning ffs, they're swinging dodgable hits at to faster opponents. Sure their hits count for more, but then that why this is a match and not a slaughter, team 2 has speed aswell as the ability to KO.

I have to say that half Thor fights I remmber were just melle ones. And yes real threats were included.

But I understand what you mean and I agree. It is a close fight. However the hammers retain their magic origin and should affect superman's invulnerability in a degree. T2 has the speed advantage, while T1 has the weapon advantage which would not matter that much if Captain Marvel was in Supaerman's place for example.

Still it's a split for me

Team 1 wins without their hammers trough strength, skill, damage soak and Viking attitude! Mr underpants and Ms star spangled butt get smacked down.

Superman and Wonderwoman.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Thor solos.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Superman's fists and Diana's are powerful as well, but when you take people that are already in their class strength wise, and give them a melee weapon which further increases that striking power, things get a bit murky.

That is how I analyzed this as well. It's not the mystical aspect of the hammers that I was concerned about (although that plays a role as well). It's the fact that you have 2 people with weapons vs 2 people without them. Makes up close confrontations a little more difficult. I think Diana with all her skill and training would be able to adapt, but even using the Tiara as a h2h weapon, she'd still have a disadvantage in reach. Give Diana her sword and have her lend Superman her axe. hehehe

If this were strictly, H2H I would give it to Team 2. With the hammer brothers retaining their weapons, I think it's a split.

Originally posted by Sasaraixx
That is how I analyzed this as well. It's not the mystical aspect of the hammers that I was concerned about (although that plays a role as well). It's the fact that you have 2 people with weapons vs 2 people without them. Makes up close confrontations a little more difficult. I think Diana with all her skill and training would be able to adapt, but even using the Tiara as a h2h weapon, she'd still have a disadvantage in reach. Give Diana her sword and have her lend Superman her axe. hehehe

If this were strictly, H2H I would give it to Team 2. With the hammer brothers retaining their weapons, I think it's a split.

yeah but i think team 2 will get hits more often than team one will. with team 1's hammers some of team 2's speed may be negated, but they will still have the speed advantage. i still lean towards team one slightly. wondy should be able to block some of those shots with her wrist bands. (shields)

Originally posted by Starscream M
ok, so normally in a thor vs superman match, who would you say wins?

Superman.

Originally posted by Juk3n
i think the OP wanted Thor to keep his melee weapon , but all the susequent powers assosiated with it are gone. (projected powers) Afterall it IS a melee weapon and if he hits he gets to put the hurt on team 2, but how many times have we seen Thor down a rwal threat WITHOUT the use of ranged/energy attacks? Not much, i think it's fine that the hammer bros keep the hammers, they're not shooting magical lightning ffs, they're swinging dodgable hits at to faster opponents. Sure their hits count for more, but then that why this is a match and not a slaughter, team 2 has speed aswell as the ability to KO.

i have no problem with them keeping the hammers. the only problem is that the opposition have and can regularly use ranged attacks (lasso, tiara, hv etc). besides, the hammer is always going to hurt more than thor's fist.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Superman.

ok, that's why I'm confused you're saying I neutered the DC team.

I basically took away antiforce, godblast, lightning, etc from thor and just hv and freeze breath from superman. So if anything, I neutered thor far more than I did Superman.