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The Sith Empire of the Old Republic vs Palpatine's Galactic Empire. Who wins the fight?

Sheer numbers alone, this isn't even close.

there is no faction in the star wars mythos that can beat the empire in conventional warfare

Despite the fact the Sith Empire has an abundant supply of Sith Lords?

sith lords are not turbo-laser proof.

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
sith lords are not turbo-laser proof.

I assume you have proof that Capital-Grade weapons have been brought to bare against a Sith Lord in an anti-personell manner and have succeeded in killing Sith Lord?

True, but they could be used as battlefield commanders. Stormtroopers wouldn't stand a chance against them in combat. I'm not arguing for the Sith Empire taking sides, but dozens of powerful Force wielding soldiers could tip the balance of power.

Originally posted by Darth Truculent
Despite the fact the Sith Empire has an abundant supply of Sith Lords?

This apparently wasn't enough to conquer the entire republic as they had to settle for half, fighting a republic that was nearly destroyed 300 years earlier. As much as I love the True Sith and the storyline if it was standalone, the only thing impressive about them is the mystery surrounding the Emperor and the Dark Council.

Originally posted by Letum Lettow
I assume you have proof that Capital-Grade weapons have been brought to bare against a Sith Lord in an anti-personell manner and have succeeded in killing Sith Lord?

admittedly nommm

Ms. Marvel, despite having a vagina, is correct in this instance.

The real Empire is "the most powerful tyrannical regime in galactic history" (the official databank), "the largest military build-up in galactic history" (the Ultimate Visual Guide), and is ruled by history's most powerful and knowledgeable Force user, who has at his command dozens of dangerous and powerful dark side adepts.

Sith Lords would annihilate a lot of stormtroopers, but as General Kota says, "the Emperor's army is infinite."

People, don't be retarded.

The Sith Emperor cloaks himself, disables PalpaAbramoff's security, sneaks into the Royal Bedroom, and blitzes the crappier emperor.

The Galactic empire dies.

So the Sith Empire, allied with the Mandalorians, aided with dozens of powerful dark side wielding Force users couldn't defeat the Galactic Empire? The same empire that was defeated by the rag tag group of illequiped Rebel Alliance?

the rebels didnt defeat the empire, they just sped up its demise. the empire defeated itself

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
admittedly nommm

Exactry

Originally posted by Gideon
Ms. Marvel, despite having a vagina, is correct in this instance.

The real Empire is "the most powerful tyrannical regime in galactic history" (the official databank), "the largest military build-up in galactic history" (the Ultimate Visual Guide), and is ruled by history's most powerful and knowledgeable Force user, who has at his command dozens of dangerous and powerful dark side adepts.

Sith Lords would annihilate a lot of stormtroopers, but as General Kota says, "the Emperor's army is infinite." Originally posted by Darth Truculent
So the Sith Empire, allied with the Mandalorians, aided with dozens of powerful dark side wielding Force users couldn't defeat the Galactic Empire? The same empire that was defeated by the rag tag group of illequiped Rebel Alliance?

Shut your mouths or Lightsnake and Numan(That was the idiot trolls name right) will return!

Eminence
People, don't be retarded.

The Sith Emperor cloaks himself, disables PalpaAbramoff's security, sneaks into the Royal Bedroom, and blitzes the crappier emperor.

The Galactic empire dies.

You do realize that HWKN will probably try to argue this thanks to you?



It's possible, just highly unlikely. And certainly not in conventional warfare.



Didn't General Tagge mention to Tarkin in ANH that "the Rebel Alliance is too well equipped?"

Someone is pissed off . . .

You have a point there Gideon. When I mean by illequiped, Alliance capital vessels in a fleet action can't go broadside to broadside. An SD is too well shielded and has better firepower. Groundforces, the Alliance doesn't have AT-AT or AT-ST. The best weapon is the X-Wing due to it's shielding. Something the TIE fighter doesn't.

Not LS.

So, if the Emperor's henchmen Vader was attacked by say, 4 Sith Empire Sith Lords, would he emerge victorious or defeated? If he is killed, Palpatine's best man has been killed. Then what?

Originally posted by Darth Truculent
So the Sith Empire, allied with the Mandalorians, aided with dozens of powerful dark side wielding Force users couldn't defeat the Galactic Empire? The same empire that was defeated by the rag tag group of illequiped Rebel Alliance?

Not in a conventional fight, they got a lot of planets to defect as well as finally decapitating the Empire. Even then, once decapitated it took a significant time to put down.

Galactic Empire worlds aren't going to defect to the Sith Empire except out of fear, and that goes both ways. As long as Palpatine can keep from getting offed, which I think he can, then the GE takes it.


Hm, I wonder how the Sith Empire would do against the later Krayt Sith Empire. They're more in the same ballpark, never gaining total domination like the Galactic Empire did.




Depends on the quality of the Lords, and Palpatine would probably capture and turn a SE Lord to be his new apprentice.

Originally posted by Darth Truculent
So, if the Emperor's henchmen Vader was attacked by say, 4 Sith Empire Sith Lords, would he emerge victorious or defeated? If he is killed, Palpatine's best man has been killed. Then what?

Depends if he's pissed enough to simply use his TK to crush them into meat patties.

Originally posted by Q99
Not in a conventional fight, they got a lot of planets to defect as well as finally decapitating the Empire. Even then, once decapitated it took a significant time to put down.

Galactic Empire worlds aren't going to defect to the Sith Empire except out of fear, and that goes both ways. As long as Palpatine can keep from getting offed, which I think he can, then the GE takes it.


Hm, I wonder how the Sith Empire would do against the later Krayt Sith Empire. They're more in the same ballpark, never gaining total domination like the Galactic Empire did. What the Old Sith Empire lacked in raw force capability they can likely makeup for in their more practical applications of the darkside with their Magitech and Alchemy.

On the ground, it's likely that Krayt doesn't have access to the manpower and morale to keep superiority. Even worse is that unless a similar betrayal by a foreigner occurs, the Old Sith have a massive force multiplier in Sadow's illusions. Illusions that could fight....

Originally posted by Gideon
Originally posted by Blaxican_Hydra
Escape 81 give some reasons please. All you did in that last argument is say over and over again that Sadows forces are better, but you didn't actually give any proof . I gave tactics and even gave an example to back up my statement. You have not. I can say: Rotj Luke is better than Marka Ragnos over and over again until I'm blue in the face but mu opinion will be moot unless I give some actual reasoning. /quote]

Sadow > Sidious. If you want proof, go back and look at Wesker's posts. Sidious's feats are nothing new to Sadow, who can replicate those and then some of his own.

Now, Stormtroopers possess superior technology, granted. But Massassi are empowered by the Dark Side. They are augmented by it. Palpatine's men are flesh-and-blood human without any other Force assistance other than Palpatine's Battle Meditation - which, wouldn't ya know - Sadow can do as well.

In melee combat, the Massassi slaughter the stormtroopers. And, now, the kicker!

Sadow is on the defensive. That means all he has to do is sit and wait. Palpatine is coming for him. So, that means that the Stormtroopers advantage of blasters won't be much good when they're in arm's reach of the Massassi.

Sadow > Sidious

Massassi > Stormtroopers



Hahahaha. Stupid Gideon. I will forever bring up this post to ruin your credibility at the most oppertune moments, because I have no concept of character development or progression.

Does the Sith Empire have access to Sadow's illusions?

In short, a war of attrition . . . who runs out of weapons, men and systems first?

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
Hahahaha. Stupid Gideon. I will forever bring up this post to ruin your credibility at the most oppertune moments, because I have no concept of character development or progression.

My credibility is not tarnished. I was flawed before the Light of the Snake healed me and erased my sins.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Does the Sith Empire have access to Sadow's illusions? We are discussing the Old Sith Empire of Sadow's time....

There was little to indicate his shit was completely spectacular. That little meditation chamber of his was likely as proven tech as blasters were in the Republic.

By all evidence and by the fact the mere Sith Trinkets are artifacts powerful enough to start jedi on the warpath, I would say the old siht have some damn impressive Magitech available and that most powerful lords could produce what he did. Maybe on less planets but still.

Also, I forget where, but there is some old fluff that says that while the Sith Empire was much smaller than ther Republic, it was also much wealthier. Apparently, they used Sith Alchemy as adhoch molecular/atomic manufacturing or some such. Given what making Sith Holocrons require and the commonality of those that date from the times of Sadow Ragnos and such, I think the Sith could resort to building and creating beasts and monsters and equipment with just the darkside nad raw materials. We know that the 2nd Great Schism, the guys that found the Stih Speices, basically used alhemy to bring the very ground beneath them to life to fight for them along with some weird Techno-organic Sith Spell. Plus the Muur Talisman and its effects could be recovered if the Ancient guys have the records of what Muur did with it. They also have a greater chance of restraining Muur while using his Raks to their own ends due to an unbroken chain of Achemical and Drak side knowledge that stretches for thousands of years.

No, it's too late. You said all that stuff four years ago so that means that it's still important and worth mentioning today.


Originally posted by Gideon
Hydra -

1. Sidious doesn't need to get within ten feet of Sadow. Sadow can use a Force Storm just like Sidious. Sidious will die, one way or another.

2. Again, Sadow can handle AT-ATs if his men can't. If Sidious can handle fleets, lol, then Sadow can handle mere AT-ATs. Again, in melee combat - Stormtroopers have no chance.

3. Watch LOtR again. The humans at Minis Tirith were horribly outnumbered, and they still held their own. Sidious's men are equal in numbers to Sadow. Sadow is more powerful. That point is moot. So, I'm glad you play Starcraft. It does not make you a master tactition.

IKC -

I'm not arguing moot points. I'm arguing valid ones. And, we both share the same belief. Sadow owns Sidious.

Tdtd -

Palpatine's not a master military tactition. If he was, he wouldn't need to have the twelve Grand Admirals or Vader to lead his military forces. I'm sure he's not stupid when it comes to tactics, but Sadow was a warlord. If Palpatine is a strategist at anything, it'd be political. Not warfare.


Hahahaha, you goon. I expect a written apology on my desk by this evening. Fufufufufufu.

Originally posted by Letum Lettow
What the Old Sith Empire lacked in raw force capability they can likely makeup for in their more practical applications of the darkside with their Magitech and Alchemy.

On the ground, it's likely that Krayt doesn't have access to the manpower and morale to keep superiority. Even worse is that unless a similar betrayal by a foreigner occurs, the Old Sith have a massive force multiplier in Sadow's illusions. Illusions that could fight....

Krayt's got a very large chunk of the GE. He can't use it as freely since he has both Fel's loyalists and Galactic Alliance remnants to worry about, but take them out of the picture and he'd have a whole lot of manpower freed up.


Btw, aren't we talking about the Sith Emperor's Sith's Empire, quite awhile after Sadow?

This does not embarrass me! I fully admit and accept the nature of my wicked ways prior to Lightsnake's arrival. But then he converted me, and I began to campaign with him to convert the foolish and the ignorant.

Sadow can use Force storms?

you're dumb

Originally posted by Q99
Krayt's got a very large chunk of the GE. He can't use it as freely since he has both Fel's loyalists and Galactic Alliance remnants to worry about, but take them out of the picture and he'd have a whole lot of manpower freed up.


Btw, aren't we talking about the Sith Emperor's Sith's Empire, quite awhile after Sadow? That would change things.


The Old Sith Empire used the darkside in ways that the Chaos of 40k use the warp, but its toned down and controllable. Directable. It doesnt have some of the more pesky, world ending drawbacks...unless you count what Nihilus did to himself....

LS was an arrogant prick.

Letum: I keep expecting us to mention a member, and you will be all of the sudden be like: "WAIT!!! THAT WAS ME!!!" you are the one who can't remember your original SN, right?

He had to be.

To survive.

When you have people like dumb ass Illustrious running around saying things like "Exar Kun is the fastest lightsaber duelists in the mythos and if you disagree you lack reading comprehension", it forces you to take drastic measures.

....LS was not an arrogant prick.

Originally posted by truejedi
Letum: I keep expecting us to mention a member, and you will be all of the sudden be like: "WAIT!!! THAT WAS ME!!!" you are the one who can't remember your original SN, right?

Maybe, I didn't post often, just lurked invisibly. I did return several months ago but someguy by the the name of Darksnake or something had reached memetic status and I had other things on my mind so... shrugs.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
He had to be.

To survive.

When you have people like dumb ass Illustrious running around saying things like "Exar Kun is the fastest lightsaber duelists in the mythos and if you disagree you lack reading comprehension", it forces you to take drastic measures.

Originally posted by Gideon
....LS was not an arrogant prick.

Lightsnake was an arrogant prick and made the place unfunny and less hilarious and interesting. But it was needed as the wankery of the Old Sith HAD gotten out of hand. Of course, the purging of interesting and fun memebers always happenes on forums against flaming stubborn tards and forums who apparently would rather have stubborn tards than a few insults...

Originally posted by Letum Lettow

Lightsnake was an arrogant prick and made the place unfunny and less hilarious and interesting. But it was needed as the wankery of the Old Sith HAD gotten out of hand.
okay, this much I can agree to. I wasn't part of the wankery, tbh. I didn't debate much. For my first year or two I was an Episode 3 forum member mostly, and then the L&E universe. By the time I became a vs. regular, the wankery members had gone, and just LS being arrogant and a prick was left.

Originally posted by Gideon
Ms. Marvel, despite having a vagina, is correct in this instance.
Notice Gideon's irrational hatred of female genitalia and more hints of his homoeroticism. Hmm.




That aside, I completely agree with him (and Ms. Marvel.) The Sith Emperor had a thousand effing years to plan the downfall of the Republic, and still couldn't get it done. That is fail on an epic level. All he would have had to do is recruit some Ewoks and appoint them to his Council and they could've gotten the job done with far less prep time. Hell, after his first death Palpatine nearly conquered the galaxy again with just a few years to regroup his forces. And had he teamed up with Thrawn instead of secretly undermining him, he would have completely succeeded. Also, regardless of some of the feats in the CG trailers, the Force-users of that era seemed pathetically weak. I mean, Grandmaster Zym was killed by a wrist-rocket from a bounty hunter. Others (Sith) in the comics seem equally inept. Palpatine, Vader, Jerec, Mara Jade, and I'm positive a host of others of the Empire-era are certainly more powerful than the supposed Sith Lords of the Dark Council. Not to mention the vast materiel and manpower edge that the Empire enjoys, technological superiority, etc....

Galactic Empire stomps this. And Palpatine introduces the "Sith Emperor" to the terrible might of his pimp hand.

The Sith Emperor faced competent foes with a large stnding military.

Palpatine didn't.

It evens the scale somewhat, but not enough.

truejedi
LS was an arrogant prick.
If by LS you really do mean Lightsnake, you must be confused. He's one of the few people here who's consistently been neither arrogant nor a prick, and considering how people treated him when he joined it's a wonder he was always as civil as he was.

And when you took off in '07 or whenever, wasn't it because of Gideon?

I guess I've caught him on an off-year or two then.

Originally posted by Eminence
If by LS you really do mean Lightsnake, you must be confused. He's one of the few people here who's consistently been neither arrogant nor a prick.

I'm sure one of you can actually elaborate.

The threads required to linked to are apparently gone forever.

Right.

elaborate on what? prick, or arrogant?

Originally posted by Letum Lettow
The Sith Emperor faced competent foes with a large stnding military.
Unless you have actual evidence, I'm not buying this.

The Sith Emperor's cronies faced little to zero resistance in the Outer Rim and were only seriously opposed at Bothawui in the Mid Rim, ten years into the war. Gnost-Dural even says that the Old Republic was completely unprepared for the Sith invasion. And judging by how the first decade of the war turned out, I'm forced to buy his opinion of events.

He was arrogant only when he was wrong. It would be blatantly obvious when he would commit non-sequitur after non-sequitur and come up with ridiculous assertions that didn't come close to hitting home.

I don't mind someone being wrong, what I did mind was the insult attached to the end of each paragraph. Not only to me, but to every other member he ever disagreed with as well.

It would go something like:

You are wrong because......... Moron

You are stupid because......... Idiot

Your point was a waste of time, and you shouldn't have bothered because........ retard.

I got tired of that.

I've disagreed with him.

A lot.

If you can actually point me to a particular instance I can obviously buy the idea that he has been a prick - perhaps even without provocation - but given the fact that only you and someone who joined three months ago enthusiastically characterize him as such you'll forgive me for being dubious.

I'm not saying Lightsnake couldn't be arrogant or prickish, but I believe it's misleading to identify him as such. He was remarkably patient and tenacious with those who attacked him, though he did lose his temper and become reckless in his debates (usually by way of citations and clarity).

That said, he really did change the way this forum thought (for the better).

Originally posted by Gideon
I'm not saying Lightsnake couldn't be arrogant or prickish, but I believe it's misleading to identify him as such. He was remarkably patient and tenacious with those who attacked him, though he did lose his temper and become reckless in his debates (usually by way of citations and clarity).

That said, he really did change the way this forum thought (for the better).

Please keep your man crush isolated to your feelings diary.

I'm kinda glad the whole attacking thing has kind of run its course anyway. There are a few ancient members who still attempt to belittle the debator as well as the debate on a regular basis, but for the most part, we have moved on from that.

And I know sometimes, in some situations, its deserved, but when established members are attacking other established members, it just weakens the argument, doesn't enhance it.

It's amazing how no matter what happens, these threads always go off topic.

Originally posted by truejedi
I'm kinda glad the whole attacking thing has kind of run its course anyway. There are a few ancient members who still attempt to belittle the debator as well as the debate on a regular basis, but for the most part, we have moved on from that.

And I know sometimes, in some situations, its deserved, but when established members are attacking other established members, it just weakens the argument, doesn't enhance it.

Most people join forums because they're insecure, antisocial, or both. Others join the forums because they're just too damn popular in real life and need a getaway to "slow down".

Oh no, Doc, considering the sheer crap thrown at LS nad the firestorms he had to deal with, IT IS a wonder he was as civil as he was. See, while it saddens that Swirly Girl and crowd are gone, their purging for bashing and flaming was inevitable. The Ante's were amusing but out of control.

Go ahead, look up most of the old crowd, the main reason they got banned was flaming/bashing. The only reason people forget this is because of troll-puppets that constantly were a plague during that era.

LS was an arrogant douchebag, a good debater and the patience of a saint, but the point stands. What LS got was just because he was the one guy going " Wait, maybe we should look at it from a burden of hard proof perspective and be honest with ourselves. The Old Sith had awesome Magitech, sure, but without that...they weren't really that extraorodinary."

And thus he was antagonistic to the sites popular view from the beginning.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
It's amazing how no matter what happens, these threads always go off topic. We like to remember when the SWVS forum was at its Golden Age while REX was simultaneously threatening to have it shut down... You know, back when he had that avatar of the dude holding a drink? Back when, Serga?Sorga? Something was still around/got banned. The good old days of endless and infinite Numan socks. Back when the million post thread in otf was still optimistic....


Ahh..fond, aweful memories.

Who are you again.

Yeah, if you remember who you were on good terms with and when it was you left I can probably find out who you were, assuming you aren't a sock of someone banned in the past two years.

lol, its like a sad little quest.

Numan wasn't Neb, right? Neb came later.

Numan isn't Neb.

Up until I left a year ago I was on good terms with Numan, who still has an account on here.

I'm on good terms with Neb as well but that's because he's grown up.

Originally posted by Eminence
Yeah, if you remember who you were on good terms with and when it was you left I can probably find out who you were, assuming you aren't a sock of someone banned in the past two years.

I was on so-so terms with everybody. Those who knew me. See, it was just funny to watch the ensuing chaos. I mostly hung around...everywhere.... I just kinda drifted along, posting stuff. See, at the time, I was busy trolling a rather...vitriolic website....

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
Numan isn't Neb.

Up until I left a year ago I was on good terms with Numan, who still has an account on here.

I'm on good terms with Neb as well but that's because he's grown up. Hmmm, he should be old enough to not be banned for the age thing. At least by now.

Hoe many socks did he make before he stopped? wasn't it like 8-9?

I've no problem with Neb as a member at this point. He is just wrong about some of his assumptions about Bane, and that's no crime. But Rex is the boss. Probably as a grudge against him by now, and after years of Neb flouting the rules, I certainly can't blame him for that.

I'm not sure you realize, TJ. I'm every account on this site.

I've been arguing with myself since Rex slipped up. I banned/deleted everyone's account and then resumed the conversations without them. We are one. Nebaris is legion.

I was talking about Numan's socks.

Oh and speking of Neb, ironically, the final strwa that got him banned the first time was something he couldn't have accomplished without modetard help. IE changing his name the way he did.

Can we talk about me, plz?

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
I'm not sure you realize, TJ. I'm every account on this site.

I've been arguing with myself since Rex slipped up. I banned/deleted everyone's account and then resumed the conversations without them. We are one. Nebaris is legion.

Neb is RN is Agent Smith. Scary. I thought I was still myself, and now I see its not true. Equally scary.

my favorite time on this forum was August 09 when all of the brand new KOTOR fans arrived. Evilbigfoot, Jamefril, some guy with Kenobi(Craig) as his Avatar. They were delicious Noobs. We scared them all away in a few days and they hated us.

It was the "Let's use our imagination" movement. We squashed it in less than a week. HWKA would have loved it.

Originally posted by Letum Lettow
I was talking about Numan's socks.

Oh and speking of Neb, ironically, the final strwa that got him banned the first time was something he couldn't have accomplished without modetard help. IE changing his name the way he did.

What got him banned the first time was changing his name to mine and taking my signature lol.

Exactly, but he needed modetard help to do that right? Or am I remembering wrong?

You changed your name so damn much youu should have been banned for that alone.

IT WAS ANNOYING. AND APPARENTLY I WASN'T AROUND FOR THE WORST O IT!

IMAGINATION

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
IMAGINATION Huh?

Spite, Galactic Empire stomps the Sith Empire into dust.

25,000 star destroyers vs what, a few hundred several milenia year old star destroyers?

In ground combat, AT-ATs and other ground technology would be far superior to anything the Sith Emipre would have.

Industrially, the Galactic Empire has access to an entire galaxy, vs the Sith Empire which never conquered the galaxy. Although if this is Revan's or Malak's Sith Empire with the Star Forge, then the Sith Empire might actually have an advantage in this category. But the Star Forge isn't invincible and can be captured, and the Galactic Empire has the Death Star and other even more powerful superweapons such as the Sun Crusher.

One on one, no known military in Star Wars history can defeat the Galactic Empire in a conventional war (except possibly for, say, the Celestial), although I still stand by the idea that the NJO by NJO/DN/LOTF/etc. could concievably defeat the Galactic Empire by well planned assassination.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
Spite, Galactic Empire stomps the Sith Empire into dust.

25,000 star destroyers
Wow, really? That's a huge number. I haven't read much stuff set between 18 BBY and 4 ABY, but the Imperial Remnant at least had no where near those numbers.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Wow, really? That's a huge number. I haven't read much stuff set between 18 BBY and 4 ABY, but the Imperial Remnant at least had no where near those numbers.
Civil War took a huge chunk. Both directly and indirectly due to infrastructure being fought over and destroyed. Imagine how quickly the casualties mounted up when Sector Governors and Fleet Admirals starting going at each other. That's just the beginning. Maintenance, fuel, ammo, consumables, these things cost money. Money which was in short supply. So while I would estimate that at least 20-30% of total fleet strength was offed in fighting one way or another, and maybe 10-15% were abandoned due to lack of maintenance or the fact that while some of them could normally be repaired, the damage sustained in combat made them unsafe in, I'm guessing that the majority of the fleet was lost due to inability to feed all the ****ers in those ships without loot and plunder or chopping up the ships.


For an example, look at the size of Russia sub force now vs Cold War.
A better example is how many tanks they maintained during the late 70/80s vs how many T-80's and T-90's they have today. Now imagine that along with a fall and collapse, you have epic scale civil war.

Most ships have to be focused on controlling territory after all. Rebels will strike whereever ships are not so you need ships everywhere.

Okay, but when you have about forty Star Destroyers (including Vader's Super-Star Destroyer) at the Battle of Endor, twenty-five thousand seems a bit of a stretch.

Writers often have wildly divergent senses of scale

And hey, with a Super SD (which is worth many ISDs) and the DS there, even those 40 were plenty in almost any realistic scenario.

Originally posted by Q99
Writers often have wildly divergent senses of scale 3 million clones...

One clone per planet...

Well, the Star Destroyers and military in general were basically tasked of keeping the Empire together. Sure, the Rebels were a threat, but the Emperor still couldn't just strip away his military from the planets.

Strangely, if you look at the history of the ancient old republic, they resemble more of a combo of the GE, the Fel Empire and the Imperial Knights than the PT- Era Republic and Jedi Order....

The 3million Clones could just be a rapid response force that gets shuttled everywhere while while non-clones due the majority of the fighting. Although a better explanation is that 3 million units meant 3 million regiments or divisions.

Also, remember, the Rebel Fleet wasn't actually that large, just mobile.

Are you ((The_Anomaly)) or Quinlan Vos or Generic Hero or Jollyjim311?

i bet he is jollyjim!! jollyjim was a lurker who posted a lEEtile bit.

I miss Jolly_Jim.

Do you know who I miss? Jollybill311. He was my nemesis. What ever happened to that guy?

IDK. I forgot.

Originally posted by kill7r
Do you know who I miss? Jollybill311. He was my nemesis. What ever happened to that guy?
Reported, Neb. For the last time, I am not a sock. (Well, except for being every poster, I am not a sock.)

Reported for sock interaction.

Be banned, Nemesis. And you are clearly not retired, so shut up.

Huh?

Alright, I AM a sock but it's merely because I ****ing forgot my damn account so that should be moot. It's a new account like the one Blaxy has but instead of being locked out, I just forgot my damn account and its been a ****ing long time sense I was active anyways...

Oh..nevermind....

Ok, some investigative stuff from the 2nd battle bar wrought this.


reborn_213=jollyjim311

Also, just clicking Red Nemesis=Jbill311

so there

But you're JollyJim!

Hold up, I'll check his last posts...

Nov 4th, 2007=Last post

Jun 15th, 2009=Last online

Nope, not him.

However, Nactous apparently was a nut.

Auto-Note (Apr 23rd, 2009 09:23 PM) User banned by Captain REX, permanently

Reason: Stalking moderators through the internet in an effort to unnerve them, immediately causing trouble upon returning from ban. See ya.

So what the hell was this!?

Originally posted by Eminence
Reported for sock interaction.

Be banned, Nemesis. And you are clearly not retired, so shut up.
What are you talking about?

Question is, what are you talking about?

How do we know that Red Nemesis isn't a sock? He could be one of Lord Lucien or someone, and the user just did a VERY good job of keeping it a secret. Heck, how do we know that ANYBODY here isn't a sock? What if all of you are all the same user, and KMC is just made up of me and another user?

No one wants to be my sock. I don't wash my feet very often.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
How do we know that Red Nemesis isn't a sock? He could be one of Lord Lucien or someone, and the user just did a VERY good job of keeping it a secret. Heck, how do we know that ANYBODY here isn't a sock? What if all of you are all the same user, and KMC is just made up of me and another user?

Well you're obviously a sock.

Originally posted by Eminence
People, don't be retarded.

The Sith Emperor cloaks himself, disables PalpaAbramoff's security, sneaks into the Royal Bedroom, and blitzes the crappier emperor.

The Galactic empire dies.

LOL.

I know that this is apparently a joke, but this is a poor way of making fun of me, mainly because unlike my argument, you don't have any evidence that any of the sith in the Sith Empire had the ability to cloak themselves to a level in which they can fool Sidious. Also, even if they succeeded I'm not sure if the Sith Empire has enough military power to defeat even a fragmentated Empire.

Originally posted by Letum Lettow
Depends if he's pissed enough to simply use his TK to crush them into meat patties.

Yeah, didn't Vader beat like 7 Jedi at once? Besides, Vader's death wouldn't spell a victory of the Sith Empire, although Sidious's death MIGHT if the Sith Empire can capitalize on it.

They'll have to kill his clone bodies to or the point of killing Palps is pointless...

While I a strong Revan Fanboi, I have to admit sheer probability is with the Empire. While the KOTOR Sith Order may have several fairly competent leaders (Revan, Malak, Karath, etc al.), numerically they are facing an enemy that grossly outnumbers and likely technologically outpaces them. If we assume a 1:1 kill ratio or even a 3:1 kill ratio in favor of the KOTOR Order, the Empire will still win from sheer attrition.

The Star Forge will HELP a lot but unless we see the use of droids on those ships we have little reason to believe the KOTORites will be able to get crews together to take advantage of the SF's power at anywhere near decent levels. In addition, in a straight up fight between Revan or possibly even Malak and Vader the latter is probably going to loose, Sideous cannot be underestimated in any way, shape, form, thickness, width, age, or length. The man IS one of the most- if not THE most- powerful DS users we know of in Canon, and he is a master manipulator.

The only real hope the KOTOR Order has is:

1. They are able to adapt and use Imperial technology and shift it into mass production while keeping their own unique advantages unique (it will not help them if the Empire suddely is able to get access to the old Sith lore that was lost in the interlude between the two).

2. Play a very, VERY careful game of inciting the Empire to rot within by using patsies like say the Canonical rebels as help against the Empire.

3. Above all, KEEPING REVAN IN CHARGE. Revan may or may not be an equal of Sideous, but nobody else in the KOTOR Sith Order is even close. If Malak gets control of the war machine, it is effectively all over for them because Malak's gross lack of strategic and tactical finesse and pathetic PR handling will probably do exactly what it did in KOTOR and rally the people around the Central Government, which makes #2 collapse as people flock to the "enemy you know" and assume that Sideous is the lesser of two evils (no doubt helped by the old bastard's skillful manuevering and propaganda) much like the people of the Soviet Union rallied to Stalin against the Axis whom were if anything even worse than the Red Czar.

4. Strategic planning and tactical luck practically unseen in all of canon.

Since it is highly, HIGHLY unlikely we are unable to get all of those (and even WITH them it would still be very close run) I must give this to the Empire.

*sIDIOUS

sIDIOUS WAS BELOVED BY HIS SUBJECTS; HE REMAINED POPULAR UP TO HIS DEATH. hE WILL NOT BE UNDONE BY A SMEAR CAMPAIGN.

Revan and his fleet against Thrawn and his fleet would probably be highly entertaining to read about.

I smell a fanfic coming on.

Red Nemesis:

EXACTLY. Just couple that with even his OPPONENTS realizing he may well be the lessor of two evils and mix.

Enyalus: ANOTHER one?

Originally posted by Tortoise Herder
Enyalus: ANOTHER one?
I hadn't realized it had already been done. lol

Actually, the sith Empire might get the Alliance to Restore the Republic on their side, although this is a little sketchy since the Rebel Alliance might be skeptical about joining forces with a sith Empire. If an alliance if formed however, they can use the Star Forge to replicate the Rebel Alliance's relatively advanced technology in vast quantities, evening the numerical odds. That, combined with Revan's tactical and strategic genius, might give the sith Empire a very slight chance of victory.

The Galactic Empire still wins in most cases though.