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Was the battle at the beginning of rots a fair display of Kenobi's ability in battle? who would win:

-Saber?
-Force?
-All out?

obi wan ftw!
saber: obi wan
force: dooku
all out: i wanna say obi wan but not sure

Dooku wins all three with ease.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Dooku wins all three with ease.
Dooku wins sabers but not with ease... But the other 2, yeah.

idk the sabers battle is arguable, but yeah im gna say dooku for the other two

Dooku.

Dooku. Unequivocally.

Obi ftw

Wurd up on that.

actually obi wan will definitely win the saber battle. he has a practically unbreakable defense, being able to block 20 strikes per second

o.O

In a sheer fencing match, yeah, he could probably hold out indefinitely against the Count, but I don't see him beating Dooku.

Didn't Obi-Wan lose to Dooku?

Depends on what movie you saw.

yeah, he lost in an all-out battle. but im talking about a saber battle. sure, dooku is a great duelist, but he doesnt hav any extraordinary talents that would make me believe he could win in a saber battle, such as being able to block 20 strikes per second. if you watched rots, you would hav noticed that in the battle between obi wan, anakin and dooku, dooku was only able to penetrate obi wans defenses by using the force.

Dooku trained and sparred with General Grievous regularly. Dooku was one of the most prolific and talented duelists of all time.

Please don't hurt my brain no mo'.

Originally posted by Gideon
Depends on what movie you saw.

I think he lost to Dooku in all of them.

N
I think he lost to Dooku in all of them.

I'm told there's a movie where Obi-Wan is tied for the greatest duelist in the PT.

Originally posted by DrunknClockwork
You know, you can't simply use force attacks whenever you want while you're in the middle of lightsaber combat. You have to create an opening and in order to create an opening you have to outduel your opponent.
Plus, in ROTS he also had Anakin against him. So the faster he could get rid of Kenobi the more energy he would have left to face Anakin and try to bring him to the dark side. So it was certainly more advantageous to flick his wrist (which led to Kenobi being unconscious under some steel walkway a couple of seconds later) than tiring more and more in a lightsaber duel against the two Jedi.
In AOTC he DID beat him in a strict lightsaber duel, because he simply had time to do so thanks to Anakin being as stupid as bread.

Originally posted by DrunknClockwork
Watch the scene again. He blocked Kenobi's and Anakin's attack and then forcefully broke the clinch thus creating a small opening against both of them. Now, since it's not easy to decapitate someone WHILE you apply a precise kick on another one, he then proceeded to apply a force choke on Kenobi in order to render him immobile for the small time that he shifted his focus on Anakin.
If Anakin hadn't been there, then Kenobi would've lost his head.

Originally posted by Gideon
I'm told there's a movie where Obi-Wan is tied for the greatest duelist in the PT.

Return of the Jedi?

Originally posted by Gideon
Dooku was one of the most prolific and talented duelists of all time. where did you find this?

Originally posted by Derelite
where did you find this?

ROTS
DR
AOTC
LOTJ

ok where does it say that he was one of the greatest duelists ever? im not saying he isn't, you just need to back yourself up

ROTS
DR
AOTC
LOTJ

I just told you where.

thats not telling me anything bud. you need to giv me a quote

I'm not going through those books now to give you an exact quote and page number. Suffice to say, see this thread: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f6/t408023.html

EDIT:

"The best of all would be the strongest student, yes? Wisest? Most learned in the ways of the Force? Best of all, Dooku would be! Our greatest student! Our greatest failure."

DR

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3447/3218170672_70f484307c.jpg

ok you got me. but im still sticking with obi wan for the saber battle. otherwise dooku would win the other two

Pffffttt...I can't believe this is even debatable. Obi-Wan became a very powerful Jedi by the start of ROTS. In saber combat, Obi-Wan's Soresu would be able to defend against Dooku's Makashi. His precise cuts could be easily parried by Kenobi's solid style.

As for the Force, Dooku is probably more powerful, but it wouldn't be enough to kill Obi-Wan.

All-out, I'd say Obi-Wan would win. Dooku knocked out Kenobi because he had the chance to do so. Obi-Wan is more of a lightsaber duelist than a Force user, so he was easily susceptible to an attack from Dooku. It's called a lucky blow. Not all duels come down to pure skill, like how Obi-Wan defeated Darth Maul, even though Darth Maul was slightly better than him in dueling.

EGF refers to him as one of the greatest duelists in the order's history.

EGC claims he and Yoda were the only ones who ever beat Windu at sparring

DR says that aside from Yoda, only Windu would have been his equal.

AOTC states that he is the master of Makashi.

Originally posted by Shoes
EGF refers to him as one of the greatest duelists in the order's history.

EGC claims he and Yoda were the only ones who ever beat Windu at sparring

DR says that aside from Yoda, only Windu would have been his equal.

AOTC states that he is the master of Makashi.

Mace Windu states that Obi-Wan is the master of Soresu. Count Dooku beat Mace Windu before Mace Windu developed the Vaapad style. Revenge of the Sith states somewhere that Obi-Wan's Soresu was more than match for Dooku.

Originally posted by Anakin4Ever
Mace Windu states that Obi-Wan is the master of Soresu. Count Dooku beat Mace Windu before Mace Windu developed the Vaapad style. Revenge of the Sith states somewhere that Obi-Wan's Soresu was more than match for Dooku.

I recall Dooku beating Kenobi, and then proceeding to fight Anakin. Your infallible logic is contradicted by G-canon.

I don't recall Dooku beating Obi-Wan in a lightsaber duel any time after Obi-Wan became a Soresu master.

Don't have ROTS on me, but I think that Dooku was ready to kill him at one point, but was saved by Anakin. I may be wrong.

In sabers? Possibly. Many of the scenes in the novel are suspect to hell and back, though. At one point in that fight Dooku tries to jump on a table and it collapses under his fat ass or something? Meh.

(Aside from the obvious unraveling of the entire OT saga)

In the ROTS movie, when Dooku had Kenobi in the Force grip, why couldn't Dooku just Force pull Kenobi onto his saber and end it there? Could Kenobi seriously deflect that while he was being choked? Dooku could have ample time to do so, it would have taken the same amount of time as that silly CG display of pulling a balcony onto Kenobi's body after tossing him.

Originally posted by Shoes
EGF refers to him as one of the greatest duelists in the order's history.

EGC claims he and Yoda were the only ones who ever beat Windu at sparring.
What are EGF and EGC? Power of the Jedi Sourcebook points out that he and Yoda were the only duelists who ever beat Windu in a lightsaber match.

Yeahh. As i stated before i believe, the only reason dooku knocked out obi wan was because he used the force. In a sabers only battle, obi wan would win. In fact, my opinion towards the all-out battle is changing too. Perhaps dooku was lucky when he got him at the beginning of rots..

Originally posted by Derelite
Yeahh. As i stated before i believe, the only reason dooku knocked out obi wan was because he used the force. In a sabers only battle, obi wan would win. In fact, my opinion towards the all-out battle is changing too. Perhaps dooku was lucky when he got him at the beginning of rots.. indeed

lulz

You'd need to prove that it was luck at work; Dooku took on two highly trained Jedi Masters and, through superior skill and experience, casually removed one from the equation entirely. There is absolutely nothing -- zilch, zero, nada -- to suggest that Kenobi could hang with the Count in a 1v1 scenario.

A strict lightsaber match would probably take forever, but Dooku isn't the aggressively stupid person that Skywalker was.

Obi-Wan is no slouch when it comes to using the force, a lot of people don't give him due credit. But that aside, nothing points to him being Dooku's equal or superior in a strict force battle. At the very least, Dooku has shown much more impressive in combat feats with the force.

I think that as far as lightsaber technique/skills are concerned though, I could see Obi-Wan definitely being a strong contender against him.

so...
saber: obi wan
force: dooku
all-out:???

kodiak430
all-out:???

haermm

Really?

We saw what happened in an all out; Kenobi couldn't defeat Dooku even with Anakin Skywalker at his side.

What on Earth makes you think this is actually a question that requires contemplation?

Originally posted by Gideon
lulz

You'd need to prove that it was luck at work; Dooku took on two highly trained Jedi Masters and, through superior skill and experience, casually removed one from the equation entirely. There is absolutely nothing -- zilch, zero, nada -- to suggest that Kenobi could hang with the Count in a 1v1 scenario.

A strict lightsaber match would probably take forever, but Dooku isn't the aggressively stupid person that Skywalker was.
This. All of it. Yes.

Anyone thinking otherwise needs to rewatch ROTS.

Gideon, you have defeated me. I have nothing that proves Obi-Wan is better than Count Dooku, and I am far too lazy to look anything up.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
Obi-Wan is no slouch when it comes to using the force, a lot of people don't give him due credit.

Name 2 notable force feats he has demonstrated.

Originally posted by Shoes
Name 2 notable force feats he has demonstrated.

1) Manipulated the midichlorians in Mallie Marek's womb (he raped her) to create Galen Marek.

2) Used the rare Transfer Force technique on Emperor Palpatine, giving all of Obi-Wan's massive power to Sidious...which is how Palpatine becomes so monstrously powerful in DE.

...

Originally posted by Enyalus
1) Manipulated the midichlorians in Mallie Marek's womb (he raped her) to create Galen Marek.

2) Used the rare Transfer Force technique on Emperor Palpatine, giving all of Obi-Wan's massive power to Sidious...which is how Palpatine becomes so monstrously powerful in DE.

Makes sense to me.

Obi-Wan might be able to hold his own against Dooku in the saber match. Might.

Other than that, Dooku stomps.

Originally posted by kodiak430
Gideon, you have defeated me. I have nothing that proves Obi-Wan is better than Count Dooku, and I am far too lazy to look anything up.

Add your name to the list of victims.