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Instead of Mustafar, this battle is in the Geonesis areana. Who wins the epic fight? The bloodlusted new Sith or the respected Jedi Master? Discuss.

Obi-Wan

Anakins mind state coupled with the fact that Kenobi knew his style well screwed him

Yeah, Mustafar itself played little in to Kenobi's control of the duel. He'd had no idea the layout of the facility, while Vader did. And Kenobi still controlled the direction.

Vader will lose again.

Kenobi FTW.

Originally posted by truejedi
Kenobi FTW.

Obi-Wan Kenobi will still tire Vader out long enough to finish him off.

Vader. He was pwning him in the ROTS movie until Obi Wan got the high ground sa GL could find a way to get Vader into a suit. And don;t say something about the novelizations, since they are besed off the movies

Originally posted by Zack Skywalker
Vader. He was pwning him in the ROTS movie until Obi Wan got the high ground sa GL could find a way to get Vader into a suit. And don;t say something about the novelizations, since they are besed off the movies Tough shit little man, the novelizations are free to determine a psyche and situational mindset for characters so long as it doesn't interfere with what's presented in the movies. Vader was an emotional train wreck and Kenobi used that to his leverage.

Without any environmental obstacles to aid either of them, this would result in a VERY long battle, me thinks... I'd give Obi-Wan the nod due to the sheer defense/stamina ratio his form offers in comparison to Anakin's.

Obi Wan still wins...

especially since we all know what happens in ep 4-6

Originally posted by Galan007
Without any environmental obstacles to aid either of them, this would result in a VERY long battle, me thinks... I'd give Obi-Wan the nod due to the sheer defense/stamina ratio his form offers in comparison to Anakin's.

Does he have infinite force reserves?

Also, I believe that Anakin will have more control, because Obi-Wan won't bring Padme.

the way the novel makes it seem like Kenobi was in control makes it hard to believe Anakin could pull off a win.

Revenge of the Sith's screenplay and novelization confirm the fact that the longer a fight progresses, unlike Kenobi and Dooku, Anakin will only become more ferocious and powerful; other duelists (even prodigious ones ) typically become fatigued. Absent Skywalker's psychological turmoil, it is conceivable that Skywalker could eventually become powerful enough to simply overwhelm Kenobi's defenses and kill him outright.

Originally posted by Shoes
Also, I believe that Anakin will have more control, because Obi-Wan won't bring Padme. Padme brought Obi-Wan, actually... Regardless, her physical presence on the battlefield had pretty much nothing to do with Obi-Wan winning.

Galan007
Padme brought Obi-Wan, actually... Regardless, her physical presence on the battlefield had pretty much nothing to do with Obi-Wan winning.

Skywalker was clearly (and probably irretrievably) psychologically damaged by the time of his duel with Kenobi. Circumstance compelled him to go from being the Jedi's greatest hero to their greatest butcher; in an hour's time, he went from defending the Republic to slaughtering children, his former students and mentors, and generally being a Grade A Douchebag all in the name of love. The movie shows this emotional turmoil on Mustafar when, after the CIS leaders are killed, AnaVader is crying. Do you see Maul, Dooku, or Palpatine shedding tears? lulnotlikely.

Skywalker's power is clearly dictated by mindset and mental stability; Revenge of the Sith makes this perfectly clear. Dooku, in particular, is able to disrupt his access to such power through mere taunts. But when Palpatine reinforces his confidence, Skywalker is capable of slaughtering a man who is leagues beyond Kenobi.

So absent such psychological damage, Skywalker stands an excellent chance of winning. He's stronger, moar powerful, and moar skilled.

Exactly. But if Obi wan brings Padme again...., Anakin could still win. In the movie it seemed like Anakin had a advantage the whole fight

ZS
Exactly. But if Obi wan brings Padme again...., Anakin could still win. In the movie it seemed like Anakin had a advantage the whole fight

That's an issue of appearances only. If you examine things superficially, then it will always seem as those who are on the offensive have an advantage. In reality, Kenobi's lightsaber form, mindset, and tactics have always been geared towards defense; he didn't try to go on the offensive, so it's hard to say that Skywalker had the advantage.

I see what you're saying. it looks like they have the advantage. But if it is two offensive duelists, this works. I still give anakin the edge thhroughout the fight since when Obi wan attacked it was easilly fended off by anakin but when Anakin did Obi wan had a hard time

Hmmmm.. never brought this up before, but when Anakin fought Dooku, every time He lost it emotionally, he became stronger. Reining in his emotions and being clear-headed, as people seem to be advocating he do here, made him weaker, and Dooku was able to turn the fight against him (albeit briefly). Why should Anakin being under-control emotionally help him fight better? His raw emotions were the seat of his power. I would think he would be weaker if he were working to keep himself under control.

Originally posted by Gideon
Skywalker was clearly (and probably irretrievably) psychologically damaged by the time of his duel with Kenobi. Circumstance compelled him to go from being the Jedi's greatest hero to their greatest butcher; in an hour's time, he went from defending the Republic to slaughtering children, his former students and mentors, and generally being a Grade A Douchebag all in the name of love. The movie shows this emotional turmoil on Mustafar when, after the CIS leaders are killed, AnaVader is crying. Do you see Maul, Dooku, or Palpatine shedding tears? lulnotlikely.

Skywalker's power is clearly dictated by mindset and mental stability; Revenge of the Sith makes this perfectly clear. Dooku, in particular, is able to disrupt his access to such power through mere taunts. But when Palpatine reinforces his confidence, Skywalker is capable of slaughtering a man who is leagues beyond Kenobi.

So absent such psychological damage, Skywalker stands an excellent chance of winning. He's stronger, moar powerful, and moar skilled. How does any of this pertain to my post? All I said is that Padme's physical presence didn't have much to do with Anakin losing.

Anywho, unless Palpatine is present in this match to reinforce Anakin's confidence, then I personally think he'd be going through the same inner conflict/turmoil you just described. Thus Obi-Wan wins (after a very long/hard battle.)

It's not about just being angry or about being clear headed, it's about directing his emotions. The mode that Anakin was in when he killed Dooku did have anger, but it wasn't just an angsty mad at the world half crying type of anger, which is how he was when he fought Obi-Wan and Dooku the first time. When he killed Dooku he was pissed but that anger was being directed specifically at Dooku. He was angry, but focused.

Galan007
How does any of this pertain to my post?

Because Padme was very obviously the one thing that made Skywalker lose his focus. Prior to that, he was kicking ass and taking names.

^ Emotionally, yes, she had a lot to do with his downfall.

But like I've said a few times now, I was referring solely to her physical presence on Mustafar.

Galan007
But like I've said a few times now, I was referring solely to her physical presence on Mustafar.

Right.

Let's recap, shall we? Skywalker, since Attack of the Clones, has been the more skilled and more powerful duelist compared with Kenobi. After Windu's death, Skywalker is in a position to utilize the power and anger necessary to own the likes of Count Dooku (who's milez beyond Kenobi). During the siege against the the Temple, Skywalker was toppling mammoth statues with the Force and casually sparring with the likes of Cin Drallig. You've read the novelization; you see how Palpatine had planted seeds of doubt in Anakin the entire time about Padme's loyalties -- when Skywalker saw Padme physically appear with Kenobi, you're telling me it didn't affect his already fragile psyche?

Originally posted by Gideon
Right.

Let's recap, shall we? Skywalker, since Attack of the Clones, has been the more skilled and more powerful duelist compared with Kenobi. After Windu's death, Skywalker is in a position to utilize the power and anger necessary to own the likes of Count Dooku (who's milez beyond Kenobi). During the siege against the the Temple, Skywalker was toppling mammoth statues with the Force and casually sparring with the likes of Cin Drallig. You've read the novelization; you see how Palpatine had planted seeds of doubt in Anakin the entire time about Padme's loyalties -- when Skywalker saw Padme physically appear with Kenobi, you're telling me it didn't affect his already fragile psyche?

Did it affect him? Certainly. Do I think these obvious feelings of rage toward Obi-Wan would have necessarily weakened Anakin, though? Nah. If anything I'd think anger/rage would have fueled him.

Imo, what hindered Anakin the most was: a.) he was very conflicted about his turn to the dark side, and b.) he was fighting his former master (who was like family. Literally.)

So... the very reason for his descent to the dark side shows up with someone with whom he shared a complicated love-hated relationship (and that was prior to the whole dark side thing) and... you find that empowering?

ur weerd

Originally posted by Gideon
So... the very reason for his descent to the dark side shows up with someone with whom he shared a complicated love-hated relationship (and that was prior to the whole dark side thing) and... you find that empowering?

ur weerd Only the rage/anger-esque feelings he clearly displayed towards Obi-Wan after he showed up with his woman.

Ur still weird. Rage and hate r nuthin less u no how to use em

^ Pfft, that's the easy part.