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For this Gauntlet, all opponents have their stats reduced to Sam's level. Also, any special abilities they may have are negated, while weapons and equipment are removed.
This a purely H2H gauntlet and is simply a gauntlet of MA skill.

Fights take place in a 60 feet by 60 feet room. BFR is not an option

Sam Fisher must face off against each of these opponents. Sam gets a week of rest and preparation between each round, and is given a brief description/analysis of each opponent's style, along with one or two accompanying videos.

1. Dante (DMC4)

2. Jin Kazama (T6)

3. Ryu (SFIV)

4. Terry Bogard

5. Solid Snake

I'm reallly inclined to say he loses at Jin. Even with equal physical stats, Jins dedicated his entire life and combat repuitar to learning just martial arts, compared to Sam who, while talented, has his skills stretched out across a more broad spectrum.

Pffft. They use Kyokushin in MMA. It doesn't work fo' real.

Jin gets rocked. 131

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
For this Gauntlet, all opponents have their stats reduced to Sam's level. Also, any special abilities they may have are negated, while weapons and equipment are removed.
Removing stats, special abilities and equipment? So the people he's fighting really aren't the people he's fighting?

Snake kills Sam before he can finish the fight with Dante, then proceeds to kill everyone on the gauntlet.

Only Snake can match up with Sam Fisher and who wins, I do not know as I've only played the first Splinter Cell.

Snake trashes Sam.

Snake's the only one he's really got a chance against in the gauntlet. Snake uses the most basic and telegraphed moves ever.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
Snake's the only one he's really got a chance against in the gauntlet. Snake uses the most basic and telegraphed moves ever. Anyone on the gauntlet would rock Dante, stats equaled.

Jin lays him out.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
I'm reallly inclined to say he loses at Jin. Even with equal physical stats, Jins dedicated his entire life and combat repuitar to learning just martial arts, compared to Sam who, while talented, has his skills stretched out across a more broad spectrum.

Though Jin stopped using his Mishima-Ryu/Kazama style medley and instead learned Kyokushin Karate around 3 years ago. Granted, he's a natural when it comes to Martial Arts.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Anyone on the gauntlet would rock Dante, stats equaled.

Jin lays him out.

Forgot Dante was there.

Sam was in the Navy SEALs and they do teach Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu in the SEALs.

Are Snake's stats lower too out of curiosity?

Because he is already a "normal human" and whatnot.

This thread sucks man.

Is Snake banned from the whole "backflipping concrete slabs" thing?

so why the fvck was this thread created if noone can do half of the abilities they have?

Because then it all comes down to how talented the person is at fighting, XMr. WinterX. I don't know about the rest, but I think he would beat Snake. Why last on the list, I'm still trying to figure out.

Originally posted by XMr. WinterX
so why the fvck was this thread created if noone can do half of the abilities they have?

I'm quite sure Fisher would stand a chance against Dante with his abilites haermm

Originally posted by Q'Anilia
Because then it all comes down to how talented the person is at fighting, XMr. WinterX. I don't know about the rest, but I think he would beat Snake. Why last on the list, I'm still trying to figure out.


Because his H2H capabilities > ?

Well, that's the joke, I think. His H2H abilities suck.

You put a period after "think".

I did.

That made your statement make you look like a foolish fool

So's your face

Atleast I have an avatar.


Look at this loser who doesn't even have an avatar.

Where is he? I'll throttle 'em.

He's in the post above me.


Let em' have it.

I'm gonna find out where he lives, than kill 'em. Then, I'm going to pick some flowers.

DSFARGEG

You two are like confused twins.

Happy feet!


Wombo combo!

THAT AIN'T FALCO!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Sam doesn't really make it past anyone here, lowered stats or not. Snake's already a human, and he already kicks Fisher's ass up and down the playground, "equaled stats" don't do enough to actually change his clearly superior combat feats. Dante's fighting ability is dependant almost entirely on his powers, so without them, he's the only one Sam might put a number on. And I really don't feel the need to go into why any of the listed fighting game characters win possibly with the most ease.

Sam would wipe the floor with Snake in H2H.

He wouldn't even land a hit Snake has better hand to hand feats while in a rapidly aging condition where his "stats" are by chance worse than Fisher's.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
Sam would wipe the floor with Snake in H2H.

Except for he wouldn't.

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
He wouldn't even land a hit Snake has better hand to hand feats while in a rapidly aging condition where his "stats" are by chance worse than Fisher's.

He doesn't. What MA feats does he have that doesn't involve anything having to do his genetic upgrades or PIS like him being able to keep up with people who can deflect bullets? Look at the way he fights. His punches and kicks are ridiculously telegraphed. He's an "MA God" who can beat anyone within his universe; most of the people in his universe don't actually fight very well though. In a contest where Snake doesn't have the seemingly super human durability that he has in his games, or the uncanny ability to keep up with people multitudes faster than him, he's getting his ass kicked, because his technique, which is basically just uppercuts, jabs, and throws, sucks.

Telegraphed? lol. And what makes your subjective appraissal accurate? What are you basing this on--gameplay animation?

Simple stuff works best anyway. Sam isn't a flashy fighter either, otherwise he'd die.

Neither do any impractical kung fu bullshit. Both are more grapplers than anything else.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Telegraphed? lol. And what makes your subjective appraissal accurate? What are you basing this on--gameplay animation?

Simple stuff works best anyway. Sam isn't a flashy fighter either, otherwise he'd die.

Neither do any impractical kung fu bullshit. Both are more grapplers than anything else.

Fortunately for me I guess, you haven't really made an argument, so much as said that everything I've said is true but it doesn't matter.

Telegraphed moves work best? Okay... that's like the crux of your argument here but I'm not even really sure how to respond to it, lol. "No they don't?" lol

You say its telegraphed with no means of justification. Hey, Sam telegraphs as well, I can see everything he does!!!!111. It's a meaningless appraisal because something like 'skill' in a creative medium is not as easily quantified as speed or strength, more specifically when its cross universe debates like this.

Simple moves work best, just as Sam is simple, so is Snake. It's just that Snake has impressive showings of combat feats against people far superior to him in physical capability. This is often weakly relegated to terms of PIS . And no, his genes aren't upgraded or anything. He's just a clone, a weaker clone mind you, of a regular human soldier (albeit an excellent one)

Originally posted by CosmicComet
You say its telegraphed with no means of justification. Hey, Sam telegraphs as well, I can see everything he does!!!!111.

Which just means that you don't actually know what telegraphed means.



No, it's actually not that difficult if you have eyes.


Haha, oh dear. The child's typo feelings have been hurt! How old are you? Six? Also, I edited like 3 minutes before you posted. So, yeah. Stop doing silly things.



No they don't.

See why just making declarative statements is dumb? Provide proof please. Substantiation.

That aside, I am curious about your reasoning for saying that. If the "simple stuff works best", then what was the point is creating... everything else?



What makes you think Sam is simple? If you compare his attacks to Snake's he's much more advanced. You don't need to be a world class martial artist to notice that.



Ah, so he is not super human in any way, shape, or form. Yet you think that him being fast enough and strong enough to hang with people who can deflect bullets... is not PIS? Interesting. Expand on that.

Originally posted by XMr. WinterX
so why the fvck was this thread created if noone can do half of the abilities they have?

Don't tell me. You do not read Opening Posts in threads you post in, am I correct? Otherwise, you would not have asked this question, as the answer is in the OP.

Sam Fisher's a regular human, albeit, a peak human.
The rest are all super-human to varying extents. They'd annihilate Sam if I were to give them their full abilities. That would be what we like to call 'spite'.

The main purpose of this thread was to gauge whether or not Sam Fisher could beat other Martial Artists, if we were to look at only Martial Art/CQC skill.

Truth be told, I wanted to make it a thread where we see whether or not Sam could beat each of the opponents listed (i.e. a non-gauntlet thread), but I'm not sure if that sort of a thread is allowed.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
This thread sucks man.

I love you too.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
Which just means that you don't actually know what telegraphed means.

Justify it. You don't get to say one multi-syllable word and feel entitled to a valid point because you said it first. What is telegraphed about Snake's maneuvers? You can't base this shit on silly gameplay animations, you'd have to do it by cutscenes. In which Snake hasn't been clowned/easily intercepted by anyone technique wise, other than Naked Snake being clowned by The Boss initially, who TAUGHT him everything he knows.


Eyes would tell you that Snake is able to take down and engage more guards in a far quicker amount of time.



Yeah I edited as well. I've never got the impression that you were a particularly bright fellow, so it just irks me when people try to feign things and fail at it. Don't do it again.



What are you talking about? His parkour abilities? That's not a combat feat. It's a stealth feat.

Sam does nothing that Snake doesn't. Snake incorporates Judo-esque throws, crisp striking, various joint locks and quick transitions between the two h2h ranges as well as well gun and knife combinations.



It seems you've been persuaded by the over-dramatic matrix esque-cutscenes of the Twin Snakes game on gamecube. Silicon Knights redid the first game in a ridiculous fashion. The original MGS1, 2, 3 and 4 did not show Snake in cutscenes doing things that ridiculous in such a stylized fashion.

He deals with huge threats with a mixture of general skill/stealth, extreme weapon knowledge(both his own and enemies), terrain knowledge, and amazing in-battle awareness being able to clearly keep track of number of rounds fired, reload time etc. Oh, and a little bit of CIS once in awhile. As was the case with the Grey Fox fight--whose suit was also continuously messing up.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Simple moves work best

What? No.

Stop me if I'm wrong, but isn't Sam Fisher: More experienced, better trained, adept martial artist and gorgeous?

Simple moves do work best though, which is why styles like boxing have dominated MMA as a whole.

Snake has been fighting all his life, and against threats that would laugh Sam Fisher out of the room.

That said, I actually DON'T know what the word telegraphed means, and demand an explanation from Blax before I respond to any of his posts. estahuh

Snake's life is shorter than Sam's though, and he too has been fighting all his life. This fight is Snake versus Sam on equal terms though, nothing superhuman, no tech.

H2h.

In Snake's short life (Not that short though, 42), he has dealt with alot moar than Sam Fisher has, and despite being only a peak human at the best of times, has regularly fought superhuman foes in H2H and won.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Simple moves do work best though, which is why styles like boxing have dominated MMA as a whole.

Snake has been fighting all his life, and against threats that would laugh Sam Fisher out of the room.

That said, I actually DON'T know what the word telegraphed means, and demand an explanation from Blax before I respond to any of his posts. estahuh

Basically, Snake does moves that you can see coming and react to before he finishes the attack.

Sam can win all the fights on the ground, he was a SEAL and Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu is a part of the Navy SEAL H2H training. As far as I know, none of those guys in the gauntlet knows any ground fighting martial arts.

Originally posted by SpadeKing
Sam was in the Navy SEALs and they do teach Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu in the SEALs.

I'm not going to debate if Sam can run the gauntlet, but that's not a good argument man... considering it takes alot of BJJ masters around 10 years or more to get a black belt in BJJ. Grace Jiu Jitsu is no joke, and although the Seals do learn it, they learn the basics mostly.

Originally posted by Kaibs
I'm not going to debate if Sam can run the gauntlet, but that's not a good argument man... considering it takes alot of BJJ masters around 10 years or more to get a black belt in BJJ. Grace Jiu Jitsu is no joke, and although the Seals do learn it, they learn the basics mostly.

Sam was doing spec-ops type things from the late 1970s until 1996 before thrid echelon, I'm positive that is enough time for him to reach black belt skill. Also it depends on how much you put into the martial arts training, considering Sam's H2H abilities he trained a lot with his martial arts, though it is obviously more specific in Krav Maga. They teach basics for whatever MA they train in all the U.S. military, just depends how far you want to take your skills in it.

Besides all that, Special forces are trained to a much higher degree in martial arts and depending on the mission type it could alter and Sam takes silent/non-lethal weapons so his MA skills are definitely higher than he is given credit obviously.

Throwing out the names of styles doesn't really count as evidence though.

Originally posted by SpadeKing
Basically, Snake does moves that you can see coming and react to before he finishes the attack.

Sam can win all the fights on the ground, he was a SEAL and Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu is a part of the Navy SEAL H2H training. As far as I know, none of those guys in the gauntlet knows any ground fighting martial arts.

FTR, Snake was a Green Beret before he was with FOXHOUND, and I'm pretty sure the Green Berets learn some super awesome martial arts.

So yeah.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
He doesn't. What MA feats does he have that doesn't involve anything having to do his genetic upgrades or PIS like him being able to keep up with people who can deflect bullets? Look at the way he fights. His punches and kicks are ridiculously telegraphed. He's an "MA God" who can beat anyone within his universe; most of the people in his universe don't actually fight very well though. In a contest where Snake doesn't have the seemingly super human durability that he has in his games, or the uncanny ability to keep up with people multitudes faster than him, he's getting his ass kicked, because his technique, which is basically just uppercuts, jabs, and throws, sucks.

Most of the people he fights are borderline superhuman, much less can they "not fight very well". His genetic upgrades are hardly a factor given that he was given recessive genes in the first place. Snake's CQC alone is second to, if not equal to Big Boss (and don't forget that Big Boss went through his entire mission in a condition that Para-Medic described as being such that he shouldn't even have been out of the hospital after having been thrown from a ****ing bridge), who too, has better showings of H2H combat than Fisher, and Snake had gotten by in his missions neglecting it until MGS4, and don't ty and argue that CQC is nothing but punches and kicks, let alone 'telegraphed'. Like I said, his entire set of showings in MGS4 don;t involve any genetic upgades since his genetics are what were slowly weakening him by then in the first place, yet he still singleghandedley bested an entire roomful of resistance fighters.

Even Ocelot circa MGS4 would do Fisher in in a fist-fight.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Throwing out the names of styles doesn't really count as evidence though.

That's why I included the part about the training

I'm just throwing out the name of styles that he should have trained in while in those different organizations and the fact that the amount of emphasis of the training depends on the mission and style of it. He goes in with silent or non-lethal weapons, he will train more on his martial arts.

Also the less ground fighting they know, the worse off they are, even in a video game there isn't much in getting around that.

Originally posted by FinalAnswer
FTR, Snake was a Green Beret before he was with FOXHOUND, and I'm pretty sure the Green Berets learn some super awesome martial arts.

So yeah.

True, though it would probably be no different from what Sam has learned except it may have it's own special MA like other branches in the military.

IIRC the only MA Fisher's confirmed to practice (at least regularly) is Krav Maga, the style taught to the Israeli Army.

I know, that and along with Navy SEALs CQB which is probably S.C.A.R.S. Those are just the two we ever see him use.

so why is Dante here if he hasnt really shown much H2H combat in his series? If this were to have guns it would have a different story.

Snake outclass Fisher in every area. He was bred for combat since his birth.
Low level superhuman vs generic tough american guy is a bit unfair.

Originally posted by XMr. WinterX
so why is Dante here if he hasnt really shown much H2H combat in his series? If this were to have guns it would have a different story.

If Dante were to have his guns, with stats equal to Sam, Sam would still annihilate him awesome

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
If Dante were to have his guns, with stats equal to Sam, Sam would still annihilate him awesome Probably not actually.

Stats equaled means equal reflexes.

Dante's guns can probably blow Sam in half with a grazing blow.

Originally posted by TH3_V01D
Snake outclass Fisher in every area. He was bred for combat since his birth.
Low level superhuman vs generic tough american guy is a bit unfair.

Which is why everyone on here has their stats lowered to Sam's level, wouldn't be fair to fight a guy whose arm you can break and he'll just snap it back in place and be ready to go.

ohh well atleast we know that Dante is a pretty damn good gunslinger

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Justify it. You don't get to say one multi-syllable word and feel entitled to a valid point because you said it first. What is telegraphed about Snake's maneuvers? You can't base this shit on silly gameplay animations, you'd have to do it by cutscenes. In which Snake hasn't been clowned/easily intercepted by anyone technique wise, other than Naked Snake being clowned by The Boss initially, who TAUGHT him everything he knows.

The Boss's fighting is just as poor. As is Ocelot's if you by their final fight in GotP. Hell, bring up any cutscene with him doing his CQC and I'll show you how basic and hammed up it is.




Due to the fact that he can absorb bullets and runs around with assault rifles, yeah.




Don't do what?




No. His actual fighting skills. Like, him being a master of krav maga, for example.



I feel like we're going in circles here. Could you provide some scenes showing Snake's prowess please?




1. How does that reflect his MA skills, then, if he wins those battles due to elements that don't involve MA? And 2. You're going to seriously play semantics with me and argue that it's not PIS but it's CIS? CIS is a derivative of PIS.

1. Dante (DMC4) The only reason Dante would be able to win is with his demon powers, so he loses, BADLY!

2. Jin Kazama (T6) I am not familiar with tekken, but since its a hand to hand fighting game...id say he would crush sam

3. Ryu (SFIV)same as Jin

4. Terry Bogard same yet again

5. Solid Snake Solid snake is just INSANE h2h.

so pretty much, sam beats dante, and looses to everyone after BADLY!

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
The Boss's fighting is just as poor. As is Ocelot's if you by their final fight in GotP. Hell, bring up any cutscene with him doing his CQC and I'll show you how basic and hammed up it is.




Due to the fact that he can absorb bullets and runs around with assault rifles, yeah.




Don't do what?




No. His actual fighting skills. Like, him being a master of krav maga, for example.



I feel like we're going in circles here. Could you provide some scenes showing Snake's prowess please?




1. How does that reflect his MA skills, then, if he wins those battles due to elements that don't involve MA? And 2. You're going to seriously play semantics with me and argue that it's not PIS but it's CIS? CIS is a derivative of PIS.

-Just, no. First and foremost, when you have a women whose combat skills are enough that an electrically amped Soviet Colonel who makes Ivan Drago look like Gary Daniels is clearly intmidated by, if not possibly scared shitless of her, you have a fighter well beyond poor, especially continuing to consider how she constantly bested her student who casually soloed an handful of elite soldiers armed only with a tranq gun which he only shot once. This same student who taught everything he knew to Snake, who during a rapidly deteriorating state had just as handily bested nearly as many if not more soldiers in even less time. The entire first of five to seven minutes of Ocelot's fight with Snake had him tossing Snake to the ground pretty handily until he managed to get in the zone as well; even beyond CQC techniques, they were virtually even at that point, and still dishing out things that Fisher has yet to take from anyone of their fighting caliber. Your entire argument is still short of being virtually grounded, and in no small part that there's yet to be a valid example from you on what exactly justifies Snake's combat as being telegraphed. Best yet, show US where you consider any of any character's showings as being telegraphed without the obvious intention of dramatic effect (which is a usual given of the series, and a very major factor in TTS' cinematics, while still effectively the very clearly superior aspects of Snake's physical capabilities, and like I said, even in a state probably weaker than Sam's stats, he has showings that punk him entirely), because more often than not, they're more than likely not even putting forth an effort in their fighting, being that some of the only times they ever did was when fighting eachother.

-And beyond the gameplay instances you just stated, in which CC's point still stands; better showings against better adversaries, by virtue of there actually BEING showings.

-Savin' that for CC, not my bizz.

-Fisher can be a master of whatever he wants; Snake's still-superior showings of combat in more dire scenarios against larger numbers in often less-than-stellar condition only screams that his combat prowess is still better, be it through his freestyle martial arts or his CQC of which his best showings are in MGS4, where he's in probably his worst conditions physically. All that proves is his "stats" hardly play into his skill and his ability to effectively utilize CQC.

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
-Just, no. First and foremost, when you have a women whose combat skills are enough that an electrically amped Soviet Colonel who makes Ivan Drago look like Gary Daniels is clearly intmidated by, if not possibly scared shitless of her, you have a fighter well beyond poor, especially continuing to consider how she constantly bested her student who casually soloed an handful of elite soldiers armed only with a tranq gun which he only shot once. This same student who taught everything he knew to Snake, who during a rapidly deteriorating state had just as handily bested nearly as many if not more soldiers in even less time. The entire first of five to seven minutes of Ocelot's fight with Snake had him tossing Snake to the ground pretty handily until he managed to get in the zone as well; even beyond CQC techniques, they were virtually even at that point, and still dishing out things that Fisher has yet to take from anyone of their fighting caliber.


http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/InformedAbility





Sorry, but, "No, you show us yours" isn't an actual answer to my request.



I've already addressed this.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/InformedAbility





Sorry, but, "No, you show us yours" isn't an actual answer to my request.



I've already addressed this. 1. It's not informed if they actively displays it.

2. Actually considering you're the one who came in here saying that Snake's moves are telegraphed, it is in fact up to you to prove it, Burden of Proof fallacy.

3. Then show us when.

Engine you forget that soviet colonel has tank busting punches, Fisher NEVER fought in H2H against like him, Heck the main villians from Double agent is just a pack of bums.

He would be DEAD in the MGS verse.

The only combat capable villian was that clow Grinko from the original SC.

Snake feats:

Taking a bullet from sniper wolf like nothing
Rapelling dodging fire from a Combat Chopper
Fighting in H2H with Ninja who would mop the floor with spiderman
Dodging a bullet in the olga battle
Beating a inmortal superhuman
Survive being microwaved

And there is more, hell the guy bring down a Military superpower by himself in Metal Gear 2 solid snake

Originally posted by NemeBro
1. It's not informed if they actively displays it.

Duh. I wouldn't have posted the link if he had.



Thanks, Mom.



Go read my posts and find out. I'm not going to bust my ass arguing with three people because they're all bringing up the same things and not reading what I previously stated.

I'll give you a hint, thoguh. Because the three of you are repeating each other, you can find it in the last part of each of my replies.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
Duh. I wouldn't have posted the link if he had.



Thanks, Mom.



Go read my posts and find out. I'm not going to bust my ass arguing with three people because they're all bringing up the same things and not reading what I previously stated.

I'll give you a hint, thoguh. Because the three of you are repeating each other, you can find it in the last part of each of my replies. 1. That butt hurt much son? estahuh

2. Don't BAW to me just because yer debatinz not that gut.

3. This is my first post towards you, moron. 131

That post was full of *******-ish butthurt, yeah. Sorry about that. I'm just in a bad mood because I just got home from work and I'm beat. I'll mess with you foo's tomorrow. Not in the mood today.

Lol.

I was actually joking.

Originally posted by TH3_V01D
Engine you forget that soviet colonel has tank busting punches, Fisher NEVER fought in H2H against like him, Heck the main villians from Double agent is just a pack of bums.

He would be DEAD in the MGS verse.

The only combat capable villian was that clow Grinko from the original SC.

Snake feats:

Taking a bullet from sniper wolf like nothing
Rapelling dodging fire from a Combat Chopper
Fighting in H2H with Ninja who would mop the floor with spiderman
Dodging a bullet in the olga battle
Beating a inmortal superhuman
Survive being microwaved

And there is more, hell the guy bring down a Military superpower by himself in Metal Gear 2 solid snake

Some people just don't read the rules in the matches

That's because even besides those feats based on his normally superior physical ability, Snake still has better showings and achievements, which also goes for Big Boss throughout 90% of MGS3 based on dialogue.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/InformedAbility





Sorry, but, "No, you show us yours" isn't an actual answer to my request.



I've already addressed this.

-That speaks more for Fisher than anyone in MGS. The logic in and of itself was always a flawed one to begin with anyway. At least when actually using it to compare certain characters.

-Nor is groundlessly saying "His/her capabilities are utterly moot and impractical based on my observation of only the inaccurate/irrelevant showings" an actual argument in the first place.

-Hardly, cuz And you're still wrong.

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
That's because even besides those feats based on his normally superior physical ability, Snake still has better showings and achievements, which also goes for Big Boss throughout 90% of MGS3 based on dialogue.

All those feats due to superior physical ability.

He manages to best opponents physically far superior to him through superior physical ability?

Sam dusnt hav to do it cuz evryone is inferior to his superiorness estahuh

i love that this is now a debate about snakes abilities compared to sams. Which i always thought was pretty obvious who is superior in this aspect. just listen to Otocon, he understands.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvqWDhUxvyk

Sam fisher is a master of Krav maga
I don't think any of these people baring Snake have martial prowess to fight someone with those skills.

you mean besides the people from the fighting games? ya know, the ones that specialize in hand to hand fighting, and are epic at it?

agreed with tzeentch. get out of snakes asses dickasses

snakes hth moves and reflexes are ridiculously slow as fuk

even john mcclane, carl fredricksen and mcdojo students are too fast for snake, since they would easily dodge snakes punches and punch snakes skull off instantly

come back when snake can beat a overweight taekwondo instructor called kyle

anyone who thinks snakes fight in mgs4 is decent by movie standards doesnt deserve to live

saying snake is faster than mcclane or daniel larusso is like a tretaplegic 90 years old would beat usain bolt in a dash race

Originally posted by menokokoro
i love that this is now a debate about snakes abilities compared to sams. Which i always thought was pretty obvious who is superior in this aspect. just listen to Otocon, he understands.



but snake isn't even good as john mcclane or king from nanatsu no taizai. because tzeentch said that snake has the most basic and telegraphed moves ever

and daniel and dre would beat mcclane and king in hth

your arguments are invalid here

Originally posted by TH3_V01D
Engine you forget that soviet colonel has tank busting punches, Fisher NEVER fought in H2H against like him, Heck the main villians from Double agent is just a pack of bums.

He would be DEAD in the MGS verse.

The only combat capable villian was that clow Grinko from the original SC.

Snake feats:

Taking a bullet from sniper wolf like nothing
Rapelling dodging fire from a Combat Chopper
Fighting in H2H with Ninja who would mop the floor with spiderman
Dodging a bullet in the olga battle
Beating a inmortal superhuman
Survive being microwaved

And there is more, hell the guy bring down a Military superpower by himself in Metal Gear 2 solid snake

Originally posted by NemeBro
1. It's not informed if they actively displays it.

2. Actually considering you're the one who came in here saying that Snake's moves are telegraphed, it is in fact up to you to prove it, Burden of Proof fallacy.

3. Then show us when.

Originally posted by NemeBro
1. That butt hurt much son? estahuh

2. Don't BAW to me just because yer debatinz not that gut.

3. This is my first post towards you, moron. 131

but snake isnt even good as nathan drake or joel given Tzeentch said that snake has the most BASIC and TELEGRAPHED moves EVER dickasses

either drake or joel would dance around snakes slow and telegraphed as phuck hits and proceed punch snakes skulls off in less than 5 secs lul

if snake isnt even faster than mcclane or mcdojo students them drake and joel are too fast for him

daniel and miyagi are too much for snake to handle

Originally posted by Tzeentch
That post was full of *******-ish butthurt, yeah. Sorry about that. I'm just in a bad mood because I just got home from work and I'm beat. I'll mess with you foo's tomorrow. Not in the mood today.

youre not wrong man. its just those dickass motherphuckers who cannot accept the fact that snake and john are poor fighters who cannot beat daniel larusso. watch again snakes moves are RIDICULOUSLY BASIC and TELEGRAPHED in comparison to mcclane

mcclane punches snakes head off into the sun in half a picosecond. too fast too much for slow ass snake

Originally posted by menokokoro
i love that this is now a debate about snakes abilities compared to sams. Which i always thought was pretty obvious who is superior in this aspect. just listen to Otocon, he understands.



but tzeentch said that snake has the most basic and telegrpahed moves ever

john mcclane and joel are too much for snake to fight

your arguments are invalid here

Originally posted by TH3_V01D
Dodging a bullet in the olga battle

O_o

no he didnt. he dodged the aim that was telegraphed as ****

then why FinalStar86, Enemybird and Dexx on ComicVine said that snake didn't dodged it mother****er

watch again if snake was moving fast enough to dodge that bullet he should have moved out of bullet's patch before the bullet reached him

mr miyagi casually catched a arrow, and arrows travels at 260mph. miyagi would be too fast for snake to tag even with a gun