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If you had to be one, who would it be

1. comic world
2. real world

Superman
Captain Marvel.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Superman
Captain Marvel.

Hm, I think I'll answer the same.

Superman's more versatile, but Marvels don't age when transformed, it's effectively immortality too.

Superman in both and easily at that.

^Agreed. This questions actually becomes "Would I rather have

1. immortality without having to hybernate for it?
or
2. more powers and abilities with the ability to exceed any herald level being by sundipping?

1. Superman
2. Superman

Originally posted by h1a8
^Agreed. This questions actually becomes "Would I rather have

1. immortality without having to hybernate for it?
or
2. more powers and abilities with the ability to exceed any herald level being by sundipping?


only real powers supes has over marvel is heat vision, and it hasnt been a huge factor in their fights. marvel also has the ability to re heal by transforming to billy then back to marvel. However thats dangerous. his magical lighting is dangerous to supes. However the writers write billy horribly when he uses the lightning bolt.

For cris sake billy has the wisdom of soloman. How many times is he going to forget to hold on tight to his opponent as the lighting bolt comes down. this grabbing billy and throwing him into his own lighting is retarded lol.

however if both combatants are going all out id go with supes. BA would be a better fight for supes he hits harder.

Comic world... Supes

Real World... (if there are other super powered beings around)... Captain Marvel.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Superman
Captain Marvel.

Captain Marvel in both.

Originally posted by zeel
only real powers supes has over marvel is heat vision, and it hasnt been a huge factor in their fights.

Don't forget frost breath and perhaps more importantly, all the super-senses.

I think he's faster too.

1) Probably Captain Marvel. Supes has just too many damn weaknesses that are constantly being exploited. If it's not kryptonite or magic then someone's always shining a red light on him or sucking out his solar energy or he's been away from a red sun for too long.

2) Maybe Supes. Supes has some more interesting powers I would like to use like heat/x-ray/micro/telescopic vision, super-hearing etc. But on the other hand CM has virtual immortality and doesn't need to recharge.

Captain Marvel two shoots him in both

You know the immortality argument is nice but there are many times where it's been hinted that provided he gets constant sun Superman is also semi-immortal.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
You know the immortality argument is nice but there are many times where it's been hinted that provided he gets constant sun Superman is also semi-immortal.

They go back and forth on it. He does age in a lot of versions, KC Superman was noticeably quite older even with heavy sunlight.

Originally posted by Q99
They go back and forth on it. He does age in a lot of versions, KC Superman was noticeably quite older even with heavy sunlight.
He looked older, but not nearly to the extent that Bruce Wayne looked older. He was also stronger and healthier than ever.

I would conquer the earth if i had the power of CM

Originally posted by amnesia
I would conquer the earth if i had the power of CM
You could do that with Superman as well.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
You could do that with Superman as well.


Guaranteed immortality.

ive read a bio where they described captain marvel as an amalgam of superman and classic strange, they said he has dr strange level magic but never uses them

Originally posted by Omega Vision
You know the immortality argument is nice but there are many times where it's been hinted that provided he gets constant sun Superman is also semi-immortal. Semi-immortal is underselling it. Superman is immortal in the truest sense of the world. In fact, you might say he is superior to most immortals, in the sense that he will actually outlive universes

http://i593.photobucket.com/albums/tt19/Max_Eisenhardt/th_SupermanOutlivingUniverse.jpg

Originally posted by Omega Vision

Forgot about that.

Also isn't there a comic that shows Superman as the last surviving person on Earth when the sun turns into a red giant? http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/ff102/Wally_Respect2/blackflash15.jpg

Superman has also been stated to be one of the last creatures ever to feel pain.

1: Captain marvel(cuz I don't want to be a posterboy pussy)

2: Superman cuz i'm stronger.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
1: Captain marvel(cuz I don't want to be a posterboy pussy

How is that a good reason at all?

Originally posted by Omega Vision
How is that a good reason at all? At first I was thinking
1: supes
2: Cap

but after I thought about it a little I like what I said more

You're quite dumb.

No, people aren't banned according to their level of intelligence, unfortunately.

I wouldn't have the authority to ban you, even if that was the case.

Originally posted by amnesia
No, his IQ is over 200! Its OVER 9000!!!!!

Superman wins.

Marvel in both.

Especially for the real world for the simple fact that I'd still be able to experience being a human, but with the ability to destroy anything ever if I felt like it.

hmm in some comics it shows that CM ages, that Batman one where Cm works for luthor or summin, and in POS annual he's old like the wizard

but isn't BA like 5000 yrs old but still in his prime

too may inconsistencies

Originally posted by Omega Vision
You know the immortality argument is nice but there are many times where it's been hinted that provided he gets constant sun Superman is also semi-immortal.

He is very close to it. As long as he's under a yellow sun, he won't age, just get older. I think that supes would win in both. Captain Marvel and Black adam are very powerful, on supes level of performance in strength,durability,and speed.

Supes is just a little more extreme, especially in speed where they are lightining fast but he's a good bit faster. Clocked at 2,000 miles per second once racing wally west. That's over 7,000,000 mile per hour. Black adam clocked at mach 500 and slowing due to stress of exertion while racing another fllash, Jay Garrick. That's almost 400,000 miles per hour. However any one very powerful as you are doesn't have to be exactly the same and defeat you as in this case. Although variety of super senses is also an advantage supes has in his overall package.

if I choose Superman in the real world do i have to wear my undies in the outside as well ?

Originally posted by ankur29
hmm in some comics it shows that CM ages, that Batman one where Cm works for luthor or summin, and in POS annual he's old like the wizard

but isn't BA like 5000 yrs old but still in his prime

too may inconsistencies

Billy is still alive at least in the 90th century. Thunder from the Reboot Legion got her powers from him then. I think he's still got the job in DC One Million too, hundreds of thousands of years after that.

I think looking old is just part of the job of being in charge of the rock- he has a grey hair now and he will still have grey hair in a million years. After all, a Marvel's body is based on an idealization of themselves. CM is Billy's image of himself as an adult, Mary likewise, and Freddies' is himself but healed.



Unlike Superman, where even in timelines where he lives uber-long people're surprised by it (it's not like every Kryptonian is still alive in DC 1 Mil, just him), the Marvels I believe have been explicitly called immortal while transformed.




To be fair, that may be a Crisis reference.

Originally posted by chomperx9
if I choose Superman in the real world do i have to wear my undies in the outside as well ?
It's more like you get the privilege of wearing your underwear as outerwear.

CM in both.

1. No real weaknesses to exploit.

2. I don't want to be frigging immortal, that would be boring, but were I to remain in my super powered form I would be immortal anyway. I like the fact that I have a choice.

Originally posted by zeel
only real powers supes has over marvel is heat vision, and it hasnt been a huge factor in their fights. marvel also has the ability to re heal by transforming to billy then back to marvel. However thats dangerous. his magical lighting is dangerous to supes. However the writers write billy horribly when he uses the lightning bolt.

For cris sake billy has the wisdom of soloman. How many times is he going to forget to hold on tight to his opponent as the lighting bolt comes down. this grabbing billy and throwing him into his own lighting is retarded lol.

however if both combatants are going all out id go with supes. BA would be a better fight for supes he hits harder.

Superman has HV, freeze breath, blow breath , x-ray vision, microscopic vision (can instantly know if someone has AIDS), telescopic vision (can see light years away), can turn intangible, can t-vo, can sun dip to be astronomically more powerful than Marvel, super hearing, resistance to mental attacks.

Marvel has better resistance to magic and no kryptonite or red radiation weakness. Marvel is also immortal. But can be mind controlled and be forced to change back to Billy and get killed.

IMO, its about more useful powers vs. Immortality. If I don't want to live forever anyway I would go with Superman. If I want to live forever (even after the Universe dies) then I would choose Marvel.

Barring Immortality Superman's value is more in real life than in comics. This is because he has NO WEAKNESSES or other beings with powers to fight against in real life.

Superman, in both cases! This is basically a no brainer, imo.

See, the thing is, for all of Captain Marvels strengths, he has to put up with gods screaming in his ear all the time.

That would drive me insane, having a bunch of arrogant, overbearing deities questioning my every move, reading my every thought. Hell, it cost Billy his relationship with Stargirl.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
CM in both.

1. No real weaknesses to exploit.

2. I don't want to be frigging immortal, that would be boring, but were I to remain in my super powered form I would be immortal anyway. I like the fact that I have a choice.

If there is a x% chance of you dying while in mortal form. Then you would most likely die the Ceiling time you change. X becomes pretty high when the government knows this.

With that said,

1. CM is more vulnerable to heat and mind attacks than Superman is . A very hot and powerful energy blast or mind rape can fell you.

2. As CM you will die in about Ceiling changings to mortal form.

Originally posted by cdtm
Superman, in both cases! This is basically a no brainer, imo.

See, the thing is, for all of Captain Marvels strengths, he has to put up with gods screaming in his ear all the time.

That would drive me insane, having a bunch of arrogant, overbearing deities questioning my every move, reading my every thought. Hell, it cost Billy his relationship with Stargirl. Didn't know this. Good points. CM loses points there.

Originally posted by Q99
Billy is still alive at least in the 90th century. Thunder from the Reboot Legion got her powers from him then. I think he's still got the job in DC One Million too, hundreds of thousands of years after that.

I think looking old is just part of the job of being in charge of the rock- he has a grey hair now and he will still have grey hair in a million years. After all, a Marvel's body is based on an idealization of themselves. CM is Billy's image of himself as an adult, Mary likewise, and Freddies' is himself but healed.





nice

Originally posted by CosmicComet


2. I don't want to be frigging immortal, that would be boring, but were I to remain in my super powered form I would be immortal anyway. I like the fact that I have a choice.
You could still kill yourself if you wanted by flying into a Red Sun.

Originally posted by h1a8
If there is a x% chance of you dying while in mortal form. Then you would most likely die the Ceiling time you change. X becomes pretty high when the government knows this.

With that said,

1. CM is more vulnerable to heat and mind attacks than Superman is . A very hot and powerful energy blast or mind rape can fell you.

2. As CM you will die in about Ceiling changings to mortal form. What in the **** are you talking about?

Originally posted by h1a8
If there is a x% chance of you dying while in mortal form. Then you would most likely die the Ceiling time you change. X becomes pretty high when the government knows this.

With that said,

1. CM is more vulnerable to heat and mind attacks than Superman is . A very hot and powerful energy blast or mind rape can fell you.



weakness to heat???

Originally posted by h1a8
If there is a x% chance of you dying while in mortal form. Then you would most likely die the Ceiling time you change. X becomes pretty high when the government knows this.

With that said,

1. CM is more vulnerable to heat and mind attacks than Superman is . A very hot and powerful energy blast or mind rape can fell you.

2. As CM you will die in about Ceiling changings to mortal form. Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
What in the **** are you talking about? If he didn't spend this much time on these forums, I'd swear he was trolling you all.

sneer

Originally posted by ankur29
weakness to heat???

No he doesn't have a weakness to heat. I'm saying that Superman can take higher temperatures than him. Both are highly resistant though.

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
What in the **** are you talking about?

The ceiling function is known as the least integer greater than the number X. For example, Ceiling=3.

If the probability of you dying when changing to mortal form is 1% then within 100 times you have a high chance of dying. This can be expressed as Ceiling=100 (thus the 100 times).

If the government knows who u r then the probability of dying goes up.
You must stay CM almost indefinitely just to live a long time.

Originally posted by h1a8
The ceiling function is known as the least integer greater than the number X. For example, Ceiling=3.

If the probability of you dying when changing to mortal form is 1% then within 100 times you have a high chance of dying. This can be expressed as Ceiling=100 (thus the 100 times).

If the government knows who u r then the probability of dying goes up.
You must stay CM almost indefinitely just to live a long time. Why does Billy have a probability of dying when changing to his form?
Has anyone ever died when possessing this power?

Why does the chance of dying go up just because the government knows who you are?
Scratch that, why would the government know, and if they tried to kill me once, they'd be toast. I suspect they wouldn't outright kill a magical being far above them if he did no wrong, as well, if you want to play the retard game.

^ Tread carefully. He's far better at that game than you could possibly imagine. ahah

I'll go Masterbruce all over h1's ass.

Superman no doubt.

Originally posted by shokosugi
Superman no doubt. Magic > Superman

Originally posted by h1a8
Superman has HV, freeze breath, blow breath , x-ray vision, microscopic vision (can instantly know if someone has AIDS), telescopic vision (can see light years away), can turn intangible, can t-vo, can sun dip to be astronomically more powerful than Marvel, super hearing, resistance to mental attacks.

Marvel has better resistance to magic and no kryptonite or red radiation weakness. Marvel is also immortal. But can be mind controlled and be forced to change back to Billy and get killed.

IMO, its about more useful powers vs. Immortality. If I don't want to live forever anyway I would go with Superman. If I want to live forever (even after the Universe dies) then I would choose Marvel.

Barring Immortality Superman's value is more in real life than in comics. This is because he has NO WEAKNESSES or other beings with powers to fight against in real life.


Show me some examples of supermans HV doing serious damage to captian marvel. No not scans of it hurting someone els but captian marvel. As far as mind control goes i agree. superman has much better will power then cap. It seems captian marvel can be mind controled by just about everyone.

Originally posted by h1a8
No he doesn't have a weakness to heat. I'm saying that Superman can take higher temperatures than him. Both are highly resistant though.


what proof do you have of t his, im not saying your wrong but do you have proof that marvel and supes both confronted some super heat or energy source and marvel couldnt stand it but supes did??

overall i would rather be billy the magic construct body is based on the persons idealized version of themselves also it can be altered by conscious focus of an image..

billy looks like marvel b/c its how he envisioned his dad and himself being an adult an amalgam.


members of his family recognize the eerie similarity of marvel and billy's dad.

so, i would never age and stay young in my magic form and my original body would be in some form of stasis..

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
Why does Billy have a probability of dying when changing to his form?
Has anyone ever died when possessing this power?

Why does the chance of dying go up just because the government knows who you are?
Scratch that, why would the government know, and if they tried to kill me once, they'd be toast. I suspect they wouldn't outright kill a magical being far above them if he did no wrong, as well, if you want to play the retard game.

No! I'm referring to when he changes to Billy the mortal form.

Originally posted by h1a8
No! I'm referring to when he changes to Billy the mortal form. K...

Why does Billy have a probability of dying when changing to his form?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
If he didn't spend this much time on these forums, I'd swear he was trolling you all.

sneer

Thats why I just LOL at him and his bullshit.

Comic world = Superman. Immense versatility, vast powers and the ability to amp. What's not to like?

Real world = Captain Marvel. Being able to not squish your gf like a bug accidentally IRL when you're being intimate is a big deal. And with no other superhumans around, you'll rule the world. Though you DO have quite a vulnerability here when you're being intimate with someone.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
ive read a bio where they described captain marvel as an amalgam of superman and classic strange, they said he has dr strange level magic but never uses them

Let's remember Captain Marvel predates Doctor Strange by more than twenty years. He's not an amalgam of anyone (no matter that lawyers for Superman argued the opposite through the 1940's.)

In both cases for me, it's Captain Marvel. It's like Superman himself puts it in KINGDOM COME - Billy is the one who knows how it feels to walk in two worlds. So I could change into a herald level being when I wanted, and go back to being normal when I wanted. And immortality isn't out of the question for me, either. And I would trade some of Superman's powers - heat & x-ray & microscopic vision, super breath - for that experience, plus the Wisdom Of Solomon and the ability to be a vessel for even greater power, like being empowered so much by the Shadowpact to go one on one with the Spectre.
Superman gets more pressure inside the comics world to be the posterboy for all heroes. Captain Marvel doesn't have to deal with that.


And what is this trolling B.S. that CM is vulnerable to dying if he changes too often?...Or to heat?

Here in Power Of Hope, he punches holes inside a volcano to safely release lava.

Originally posted by roughrider
Let's remember Captain Marvel predates Doctor Strange by more than twenty years. He's not an amalgam of anyone (no matter that lawyers for Superman argued the opposite through the 1940's.)

In both cases for me, it's Captain Marvel. It's like Superman himself puts it in KINGDOM COME - Billy is the one who knows how it feels to walk in two worlds. So I could change into a herald level being when I wanted, and go back to being normal when I wanted. And immortality isn't out of the question for me, either. And I would trade some of Superman's powers - heat & x-ray & microscopic vision, super breath - for that experience, plus the Wisdom Of Solomon and the ability to be a vessel for even greater power, like being empowered so much by the Shadowpact to go one on one with the Spectre.
Superman gets more pressure inside the comics world to be the posterboy for all heroes. Captain Marvel doesn't have to deal with that.


And what is this trolling B.S. that CM is vulnerable to dying if he changes too often?...Or to heat?

Here in Power Of Hope, he punches holes inside a volcano to safely release lava.

Physically, Billy really should be at least on Supermans level all around, if not superior thanks to his power sources.

One interesting thing about Marvel in the post crisis era, is almost every writer has him equal or superior to superman face to face, yet they tend to downplay his effectiveness in other situations.. For example, all was lost in Final Crisis until Superman showed up. And in Genesis, energy Superman was thinking how he could have soloed the entire group of New Gods they were facing (And he HAS soloed most of Apokolips in the past), yet Captain Marvel is right there and not really being of much use..

He was also pretty useless in Giffen's JLA, being unable to accomplish basic goals like reign in Guy Gardner, getting knocked out by a Royal Flush Gang robot that Blue Beetle and Booster Gold managed to defeat, and being possessed and forced to fight Martian Manhunter, and being knocked out by him to boot..

War of the Gods? Basically a pawn.

Kingdom Come? He punked Superman a little, and saved the heroes, but he was basically a pawn.

I guess what I'm saying, is most writers seem interested in is using Cap as competition for Superman, but don't give him enough proper portrayals on his own merits.. He's rarely the "big hero" he should be.

Originally posted by cdtm


I guess what I'm saying, is most writers seem interested in is using Cap as competition for Superman, but don't give him enough proper portrayals on his own merits.. He's rarely the "big hero" he should be.

qft

CM has so much potential
DC have really messed up with him

Originally posted by h1a8
If there is a x% chance of you dying while in mortal form. Then you would most likely die the Ceiling time you change. X becomes pretty high when the government knows this.

With that said,

1. CM is more vulnerable to heat and mind attacks than Superman is . A very hot and powerful energy blast or mind rape can fell you.

2. As CM you will die in about Ceiling changings to mortal form.
I'm pretty sure you need an IQ of less than 60 to understand this post. Stop using formulas that have no bearings on any comic discussion.

Originally posted by ankur29
qft

CM has so much potential
DC have really messed up with him

Because even though he's superior in power overall to Superman,
Superman is the poster boy.

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
K...

Why does Billy have a probability of dying when changing to his form?

There's always a chance of getting hit by a stray bullet or car, being blown up, etc. This is common sense no?

Originally posted by mykke
I'm pretty sure you need an IQ of less than 60 to understand this post. Stop using formulas that have no bearings on any comic discussion. False! CM's only advantage over Superman in the real world is his immortality. I showed that this is not really a big advantage if one changes to mortal form often.

Good God, does the BS ever stop? Oh wait, ignore.....heh thats works.

Originally posted by roughrider
Because even though he's superior in power overall to Superman,
Superman is the poster boy.

Superman is superior to CM in everyway except magical resistance, weakness to kryptonite and red solar radiation, potential immortality.

Superman is stronger, faster, more durable, and has more powers.

Originally posted by h1a8
Superman is superior to CM in everyway except magical resistance, weakness to kryptonite and red solar radiation, potential immortality.

Superman is stronger, faster, more durable, and has more powers.
actually this is not true
captain marvel has superman level strength durability and everything else
and because he has the power of zeus he can amp his own abilities
i think it was in that war of the gods or something were it was said
but he can use the power of zeus to amp his abilities, writers seem to dont want to use his full potential. captain marvel has magic powers also which some editor said was on par with doctor strange from marvel

Originally posted by h1a8
There's always a chance of getting hit by a stray bullet or car, being blown up, etc. This is common sense no? So, the risks of real life?

Except no. What kind of world do you live in? Getting hit by a stray bullet, getting blown up?
At the slightest sign of danger, you yell Shazam, and you become impervious. You get hurt, Shazam. You're working on something dangerous, Shazam. It goes on, and on. Unless you get your head cut off by the many ninjas that live in our world, you're going to be fine.
Your chances of dying go down by far if you have the power of a God in our universe. Slim to none.

be pretty cool to walk into a large crowd and yell SHAZAM! and a giant bolt of lightning strikes down on you from the sky and then you become a super powered champion

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
So, the risks of real life?

Except no. What kind of world do you live in? Getting hit by a stray bullet, getting blown up?
At the slightest sign of danger, you yell Shazam, and you become impervious. You get hurt, Shazam. You're working on something dangerous, Shazam. It goes on, and on. Unless you get your head cut off by the many ninjas that live in our world, you're going to be fine.
Your chances of dying go down by far if you have the power of a God in our universe. Slim to none.

There is a BIG difference between small chance and NO CHANCE. It is a fact of small chance and completely false of NO CHANCE.

The chance will increase if the government or terrorists, etc. knows about him. They will try to snipe him or blow him up (like a suicide bomber).

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
actually this is not true
captain marvel has superman level strength durability and everything else
and because he has the power of zeus he can amp his own abilities
i think it was in that war of the gods or something were it was said
but he can use the power of zeus to amp his abilities, writers seem to dont want to use his full potential. captain marvel has magic powers also which some editor said was on par with doctor strange from marvel

The power of Zues is the lightning, nothing more. Prove what you are talking about.

Superman holds back both consciously and subconsciously. That is why he seems peers to not only CM but beings who can't lift beyond 10,000 tons.
Superman is more durable. This is a fact.

Lastly, CM has the strength of Hercules (by writer's intent).

WW is stated in D.C. comics to be stronger than Hercules. Superman is stronger than her and thus stronger than CM. Superman has greater feats as well.

the lightning comes from the rock of eternity(the source)


dc hercules have had his strength cut in half to share with his roman half
cap has the full strength of hercules and is further amped by the power of zeus

Cap lifts far over 10,000 tons
not to mention hercules busted supermans face up

Marvel takes a majority over supes. That is just how it goes

I''d be Superman for both, although I already resemble him in real life both looks and personality.

^ You wear your underwear outside your pants and you're tortured because you can't conceive with women?

peaches

Low-blow? Low-blow.

excellent

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ You wear your underwear outside your pants and you're tortured because you can't conceive with women?

peaches

Low-blow? Low-blow.

excellent
As far as excuses for not getting any are concerned "I can't because I'd kill the woman in the process" is a pretty good one.

^ Not the most recent explanation I understood from reading his comics.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Not the most recent explanation I understood from reading his comics.
Is the new explanation because Kryptonians are a different species and thus incompatible?

Because if so that's a rare example of comic books dodging the half-human hybrid trope.

Originally posted by h1a8
There is a BIG difference between small chance and NO CHANCE. It is a fact of small chance and completely false of NO CHANCE.

The chance will increase if the government or terrorists, etc. knows about him. They will try to snipe him or blow him up (like a suicide bomber). I said slim to none.
There is a smaller chance of you dying with Captain Marvel's powers then there is of you dying now, substantially. Thanks for ignoring what I wrote though.

Like I said, what kind of world do you live in?
Also, you'd have to be you to let anyone find out who you are.

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
So, the risks of real life?

Except no. What kind of world do you live in? Getting hit by a stray bullet, getting blown up?
At the slightest sign of danger, you yell Shazam, and you become impervious. You get hurt, Shazam. You're working on something dangerous, Shazam. It goes on, and on. Unless you get your head cut off by the many ninjas that live in our world, you're going to be fine.
Your chances of dying go down by far if you have the power of a God in our universe. Slim to none.

Police man bothering you about drinking, texting, smoking weed, and driving without a license? Shazam!

FBI invading your polygamy crib? Shazam!

Your girlfriend cheated on you? Shazam!

Have a lifelong dream of building an entire house out of human bodies? Shazam!

Hell with Captain Marvel, I'd clearly rather be Black Adam..

Originally posted by Q99
Don't forget frost breath and perhaps more importantly, all the super-senses.

I think he's faster too.


what is frost breath going to do to billy? ya i think supes is a bit faster but most definetly not enough to blitz him. Super hearing and sight what is this going to do to billy?

Originally posted by zeel
what is frost breath going to do to billy? ya i think supes is a bit faster but most definetly not enough to blitz him. Super hearing and sight what is this going to do to billy?

When he used freeze breath against Darkseid, it basically equaled a free hit.

That's also how Superboy Prime used it. Even if Cap can instantly break out of it, if Supes right in his face he could hit him while he's breaking free..

And regular super breath is a good combo breaker. Supes used it to throw Cap off in their first Pre Crisis fight, and Supergirl used it effectively against Mary Marvel.

As for super vision, it's a good tactical power. He can see in dark places, or see through solid objects. PC Superman used it to mask himself in a cloud against Captain Thunder (Captain Marvel clone), then froze him inside the cloud using freeze breath (Of course, it didn't hold him.)

Originally posted by h1a8
Superman is superior to CM in everyway except magical resistance, weakness to kryptonite and red solar radiation, potential immortality.

Superman is stronger, faster, more durable, and has more powers.


have to agree superman is SLIGHTLY superior to marvel in all catagories and is a peer to marvel. Until supes gets a sundip or a rage spike (theses are amps) unfair to compare a amped superman to a non amped marvel.

For example we all know that a rageing lunatic superman with a 5day sundip would get smoked by dov captian marvel =)


supermans biggest advantage over billy is his intelligence. Wisdom of soloman....what ever billy fights like a newb alot and is not the best fighter skill wise i think.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ You wear your underwear outside your pants and you're tortured because you can't conceive with women?

peaches

Low-blow? Low-blow.

excellent



I don't care if I can get a girl pregnant, as long as I can get what I want. ... And as for the underwear comment, I don't typicaly wear them unless I want to show off.

Originally posted by cdtm
Superman, in both cases! This is basically a no brainer, imo.

See, the thing is, for all of Captain Marvels strengths, he has to put up with gods screaming in his ear all the time.

That would drive me insane, having a bunch of arrogant, overbearing deities questioning my every move, reading my every thought. Hell, it cost Billy his relationship with Stargirl.

As opposed to Superman apparently being within earshot of everyone on Earth, and even some distance into space? Can you imagine how much discipline it would take to shut those voices out, even for a little while?

If you are the caretaker of the Rock Of Eternity, you have to keep the deadly sins silent. But you are just the herald of the caretaker, as Marvel traditionally is, then the voices just come when you need them.

Originally posted by h1a8
Superman is superior to CM in everyway except magical resistance, weakness to kryptonite and red solar radiation, potential immortality.

Superman is stronger, faster, more durable, and has more powers.

knew someone was gonna say this, i disagree but DC don't really use CM enough so he could have feats to match SM
SM, is the poster boy he will always be the one beating DS etc no CM
However every appearance that CM has had with SM they are stated as physical equals much like thor and herc


Originally posted by h1a8


Superman holds back both consciously and subconsciously. That is why he seems peers to not only CM but beings who can't lift beyond 10,000 tons.
Superman is more durable. This is a fact.

Lastly, CM has the strength of Hercules (by writer's intent).

WW is stated in D.C. comics to be stronger than Hercules. Superman is stronger than her and thus stronger than CM. Superman has greater feats as well.

so much wrong with that

CM is stronger than WW too

CM is very strong too able to lift easily above 100,000 tons

Originally posted by ankur29
POS#17

Strength:
Lifts and pushes a spacecraft with one hand:

http://i980.photobucket.com/albums/ae289/ankur2292/th_POS-017-14.jpg


Strength, lifts a sinking ocean liner (these things are normally 100,000 tons minus the water !) :

http://i980.photobucket.com/albums/ae289/ankur2292/th_POS-021-18.jpg http://i980.photobucket.com/albums/ae289/ankur2292/th_POS-021-20.jpg

Originally posted by aztec
I don't care if I can get a girl pregnant, as long as I can get what I want. ... And as for the underwear comment, I don't typicaly wear them unless I want to show off.

You wear underwear to show off??

Dude a tube sock in your undies is not showing off

Originally posted by roughrider
As opposed to Superman apparently being within earshot of everyone on Earth, and even some distance into space? Can you imagine how much discipline it would take to shut those voices out, even for a little while?

If you are the caretaker of the Rock Of Eternity, you have to keep the deadly sins silent. But you are just the herald of the caretaker, as Marvel traditionally is, then the voices just come when you need them.

Good point, super hearing would SUCK.

Unless he could control it, somehow.

But the xray vision would be fun.

isn't marvel a lot more indestructible?

^yes he is

Originally posted by 753
isn't marvel a lot more indestructible?
By what? Marvel has better HF by far and better magical resistance but otherwise they're pretty much even. In scenario two it won't really matter since neither Superman nor Cap can be killed by anything we possess in the real world. Unless Cap is in Billy Batson form in which case he's as vulnerable as any 10 year old.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
By what? Marvel has better HF by far and better magical resistance but otherwise they're pretty much even. In scenario two it won't really matter since neither Superman nor Cap can be killed by anything we possess in the real world. Unless Cap is in Billy Batson form in which case he's as vulnerable as any 10 year old. That's my point, with the whole thing about his body being a magical construct that reflects his idea of what he should look like, it snaps right back into place even after being turned inside out. He bounces back from attacks that would outright destroy SM like the time a singularity was opened inside him - of course he can still get koed by pounches, but that's comics.

Originally posted by 753
That's my point, with the whole thing about his body being a magical construct that reflects his idea of what he should look like, it snaps right back into place even after being turned inside out. He bounces back from attacks that would outright destroy SM like the time a singularity was opened inside him - of course he can still get koed by pounches, but that's comics.

Yeah. Only in comics will one find that punches that at best crumble a few surrounding buildings, will have effect on beings that can travel through Black Holes.

Supes and Cap should be able to punch each other forever without either being hurt. At least it used to be that way with Cap/Black Adam.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Yeah. Only in comics will one find that punches that at best crumble a few surrounding buildings, will have effect on beings that can travel through Black Holes.

Supes and Cap should be able to punch each other forever without either being hurt. At least it used to be that way with Cap/Black Adam.

As well as Superboy and Mon El.

I guess writers decided that made for kind of boring fights, although in Caps case they gave an excuse that his powers weakened outside his universe. No real reason to believe that changed, even while Supermans powers waned in the 80's..

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
the lightning comes from the rock of eternity(the source)


dc hercules have had his strength cut in half to share with his roman half
cap has the full strength of hercules and is further amped by the power of zeus

Cap lifts far over 10,000 tons
not to mention hercules busted supermans face up

Prove that Hercules strength is split in half between Roman and Greek. If that is the case then CM is closer to SM in strength than I thought.

Prove that the power of Zues amps his other abilities. I thought I read that it gives him the power of lightning.

Originally posted by ankur29
knew someone was gonna say this, i disagree but DC don't really use CM enough so he could have feats to match SM
SM, is the poster boy he will always be the one beating DS etc no CM
However every appearance that CM has had with SM they are stated as physical equals much like thor and herc




so much wrong with that

CM is stronger than WW too

CM is very strong too able to lift easily above 100,000 tons

D.C. says that WW is stronger than Hercules. Plus she has feats that calculates her to exerting an Earth weight of force.

Don't on panel feats prove he's above her strength wise?

CM's Hercules is different than WW's Hercules from what I remember.

Regardless, CM's strength does not only come from Hercules. Atlas contributes to his strength too by default.

Yes, CM is above WW in strength.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
CM's Hercules is different than WW's Hercules from what I remember.

Regardless, CM's strength does not only come from Hercules. Atlas contributes to his strength too by default.

Yes, CM is above WW in strength. We go by writer's intentions. Otherwise we would be in the land of the speculation.
Writer's clearly portray CM to have the strength of Hercules (by his origins). Otherwise they wouldn't have used the name HERCULES nor HIS IMAGE.

Atlas only gives CM stamina as stated and intended by writers.




Originally posted by iceman24567
Don't on panel feats prove he's above her strength wise? That's why WW is stronger. She has feats that show her exerting at least an Earth weight of force. Does CM have any better quantifiable feats than this?

Originally posted by h1a8
We go by writer's intentions. Otherwise we would be in the land of the speculation.
Writer's clearly portray CM to have the strength of Hercules (by his origins). Otherwise they wouldn't have used the name HERCULES nor HIS IMAGE.

Atlas only gives CM stamina as stated and intended by writers.


Exactly. We go by writers intentions. Which are the exact intentions exhaustively telling and showing us how equal Supes and Cap are supposed to be at every turn. Seeing as they are the ones stalemating for a couple of hours in arm wrestling contests, Marvel being the one able to hold Eclipso possessed Supes with a full nelson with the latter being unable to break out of it, and Supes gushing in a shocked manner how powerful CM is while they are fused while CM is pretty non-chalant about being fused with Supes.

All the while Superman can be seen casually ***** slapping Wonder Woman to another side of the room.

No, Atlas does not only provide Stamina. He has referred on panel before to his strength before as coming from both Hercules and Atlas. Herc probably provides most of it.

Not doubting you, but do you know the issue or story where Superman/Captain Marvel fuse?

I'd like to see that one. I know they switched power sets pre crisis, and Supes, and while Supes grumbled about Caps lack of super senses, Cap basically downplayed Supes strength by saying his missed his powers, but "your powers aren't exactly chopped liver."

Originally posted by h1a8
D.C. says that WW is stronger than Hercules. Plus she has feats that calculates her to exerting an Earth weight of force.

DC also made it clear that the Hercules that bestows Captain Marvel with a portion of his strength is different from the Hercules that appears in the Wonder Woman comics.

Marvel can also amp his strength by using the strength of Atlas or even the power of Zeus.

Captain Marvel will more than likely always be portrayed as an equal of Superman in strength.

1. Superman

2. Superman. I want to die one day, imagine living through everyone that you love die, and having no next of kin? I'd hate it, but that's me.

Originally posted by Stoic
1. Superman

2. Superman. I want to die one day, imagine living through everyone that you love die, and having no next of kin? I'd hate it, but that's me.

You could bestow powers to people.

You'd end up with a power downgrade, but presumably the immortality applies.

Wonder what happens if you keep giving powers to people..? Say, to everyone in town. Or everyone in a state... Eventually, will the power split be so great you'll actually be WEAKER then your human form?

like i said, hercules power is split in half with his roman counter part
the one in wonder woman comics is either the greek or roman half
while cap has the full power of hercules
i will look for scans hold on

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Exactly. We go by writers intentions. Which are the exact intentions exhaustively telling and showing us how equal Supes and Cap are supposed to be at every turn. Seeing as they are the ones stalemating for a couple of hours in arm wrestling contests, Marvel being the one able to hold Eclipso possessed Supes with a full nelson with the latter being unable to break out of it, and Supes gushing in a shocked manner how powerful CM is while they are fused while CM is pretty non-chalant about being fused with Supes.

All the while Superman can be seen casually ***** slapping Wonder Woman to another side of the room.

No, Atlas does not only provide Stamina. He has referred on panel before to his strength before as coming from both Hercules and Atlas. Herc probably provides most of it. Yes and no. It is true that Supes and CM are peers ONLY WHEN Supes has the mental blocks on. A full nelson doesn't decide who's stronger. A weaker can keep a stronger in a full nelson if it is done right.


D.C. made it clear that Supes is holding back subconsciously as well as consciously. These mental blocks is preventing him from showing his full strength.

You must prove the Atlas strength thing because on panel it strictly states STAMINA.

And slapping someone around doesn't prove being stronger although Superman is stronger than WW.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
DC also made it clear that the Hercules that bestows Captain Marvel with a portion of his strength is different from the Hercules that appears in the Wonder Woman comics. Lies. They did no such thing.
I read trials of Shazam. There is only one Hercules, otherwise why would writers used his exact name and image to mean strength?

No he can't. Atlas only grants stamina and Zues only the power of lightning.

Because Superman will always be shown to have mental blocks.
I agree they are peers when it comes to the mental blocks but when those blocks are off Superman is far superior.

Originally posted by Stoic
1. Superman

2. Superman. I want to die one day, imagine living through everyone that you love die, and having no next of kin? I'd hate it, but that's me.
Again if it comes to it you can fly into a red sun.

Originally posted by h1a8
Lies. They did no such thing.
I read trials of Shazam. There is only one Hercules, otherwise why would writers used his exact name and image to mean strength?

No he can't. Atlas only grants stamina and Zues only the power of lightning.

Because Superman will always be shown to have mental blocks.
I agree they are peers when it comes to the mental blocks but when those blocks are off Superman is far superior. did you not read the comic where captain marvel went toe to toe with a bloodlusted superman and even restrained him and knocked him out?

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
did you not read the comic where captain marvel went toe to toe with a bloodlusted superman and even restrained him and knocked him out?
Which comic are you referring to?

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
did you not read the comic where captain marvel went toe to toe with a bloodlusted superman and even restrained him and knocked him out?

If you mean when he was Eclipsed, Cap never knocked him out.

He restrained him, but in the end he's the one who got knocked out.

well it still proves that superman dont have mental blocks when fighting cap

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Which comic are you referring to? eclipso

Originally posted by CosmicComet

Yes, CM is above WW in strength.

About the only time they matched up toe-to-toe they were even, btw.

do you see wonder woman going Pure H2H with superman with out no gear and stalemating?

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
do you see wonder woman going Pure H2H with superman with out no gear and stalemating?

She took Supermans best blows, including being knocked from the sun to the Earth, and kept fighting. And eventually won.

So yes, I could see her doing that if she fights smart.

The bracers are helpful since she's not as durable as CM, but it's not like gear makes her any stronger.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
do you see wonder woman going Pure H2H with superman with out no gear and stalemating?

She can beat the **** outta Superman without any weapons if she wanted to. She proved this in Sacrifice. She was seriously holding back while taking blows from a sun amped non holding back Superman.

An advanced combo with pressure point strikes can beat Superman.

captain marvel wins

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_39-VfFoO9u0/SHOXPHE66OI/AAAAAAAAAM8/l3csuFQqjns/s1600/Cesar%2B-%2BShazam%2Bvs%2BSuperman.jpg
http://comiccoverage.typepad.com/comic_coverage/images/2008/01/26/justice_3.jpg
http://users.syd.eastlink.ca/~mdalesandro/MyWebs/S_KingdomCome3.jpg
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/54/78240-13592-captain-marvel_super.jpg

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
captain marvel wins

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_39-VfFoO9u0/SHOXPHE66OI/AAAAAAAAAM8/l3csuFQqjns/s1600/Cesar%2B-%2BShazam%2Bvs%2BSuperman.jpg
http://comiccoverage.typepad.com/comic_coverage/images/2008/01/26/justice_3.jpg
http://users.syd.eastlink.ca/~mdalesandro/MyWebs/S_KingdomCome3.jpg
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/54/78240-13592-captain-marvel_super.jpg

You are a troll and a moron.

Originally posted by Q99
About the only time they matched up toe-to-toe they were even, btw.

Oh, I'm sorry. I must have missed the part in that fight where Billy and Diana locked up in a test of strength and were stalemating...lol.

Also, Cap took on a possessed Diana and J'onn along with a couple of others and did well.

Marvel easy... his magical nature should be enough especially when the likes of dracula and banshee can hurt him and they dont even rack up to his herald lvl strength..

if the vamp teeth logic isnt enough reason... marvel can zues amp and charge his punch

by the way i like the one where marvel is getting head from supes... nice scans

Originally posted by h1a8
The power of Zues is the lightning, nothing more. Prove what you are talking about.

Superman holds back both consciously and subconsciously. That is why he seems peers to not only CM but beings who can't lift beyond 10,000 tons.
Superman is more durable. This is a fact.

Lastly, CM has the strength of Hercules (by writer's intent).

WW is stated in D.C. comics to be stronger than Hercules. Superman is stronger than her and thus stronger than CM. Superman has greater feats as well.


your superman holding back stories are old, yes superman is stronger more durable and faster by a SMALL margin. this is no cake walk for supes as some people like to portray it.

As far as the captian marvel's potential goes ampping himself with the poweres of the gods. could you imagine if zeus and the rest of the gods decided to share even more of their abilities with cap? As it stands cap has a TINY,TINY,TINY fraction of their abilities. cap has the potential to out power dozens of supermen if the gods deamed it so. Yes even against sun dipped supermen and non holding back supermen.

Originally posted by zeel
your superman holding back stories are old, yes superman is stronger more durable and faster by a SMALL margin. this is no cake walk for supes as some people like to portray it.

As far as the captian marvel's potential goes ampping himself with the poweres of the gods. could you imagine if zeus and the rest of the gods decided to share even more of their abilities with cap? As it stands cap has a TINY,TINY,TINY fraction of their abilities. cap has the potential to out power dozens of supermen if the gods deamed it so. Yes even against sun dipped supermen and non holding back supermen. Sundipped Superman is more powerful than any Skyfather. He overpowered the begotten Imperiex force.

With that said, u have no proof to what you say. Writers portray CM has having the strength of Hercules, the power of Zues (explained through lightning), Stamina of Atlas (not strength), Wisdom of Solomon, speed of mercury, and invulnerability of Achilles.

No one can overwrite the writers intentions with speculation.

Superman in both. I really don't want to have to transform in to a sixteen year old just so i can blend in.

Also, sun-dipped Superman proved he was better than Marvel.

Doesn't every punch from Captain Marvel penetrate Superman's defenses? Basically every hit gives him a major charlie horse. Am I right?

Originally posted by h1a8
Sundipped Superman is more powerful than any Skyfather. He overpowered the begotten Imperiex force.

With that said, u have no proof to what you say. Writers portray CM has having the strength of Hercules, the power of Zues (explained through lightning), Stamina of Atlas (not strength), Wisdom of Solomon, speed of mercury, and invulnerability of Achilles.

No one can overwrite the writers intentions with speculation.


What if a Sky Father started casting magic spells on him, and ripped the sun amping right out of him, who would he be more powerful then?

Originally posted by h1a8


No one can overwrite the writers intentions with speculation.

writer's intention in almost every single appearance by the pair is that SM is CM's physical equal in every way, stop your double standards

and on top CM has magic to boot

They are equals.

CM has the advantage of Magic, but SM can amp through sun-dipping.

Originally posted by h1a8
Sundipped Superman is more powerful than any Skyfather. No he is not. His only 'feat' to support this is the projection of another characters feats and hyperbolic power level description upon SM coupled with the assumption that the entirety of the power making up the imperiex force was actually used up in opposing SM moving the warworld through a boom tube, which is pathetic. SM was nowhere near the power the IF possesed and couldn't possibly overcome it on his own, hence the combined efforts of all the other characters to BFR its energies to the big bang.

Originally posted by 753
No he is not. His only 'feat' to support this is the projection of another characters feats and hyperbolic power level description upon SM coupled with the assumption that the entirety of the power making up the imperiex force was actually used up in opposing SM moving the warworld through a boom tube, which is pathetic. SM was nowhere near the power the IF possesed and couldn't possibly overcome it on his own, hence the combined efforts of all the other characters to BFR its energies to the big bang.
I really don't think there's any more evidence to argue that the IF wasn't using all it's power pushing against Supes than there is to argue that it was.

And really why wouldn't Brainiac push all his available power into resisting Supes' attempts to bfr him? Now I'm not agreeing with H1a8 that sundipped Superman > any Skyfather but in terms of raw strength Sundipped Superman was off the charts. He'd be at least Trans tier.

You also have little basis in saying that there's no way that Sundipped Superman could match the Imperiex Force when the only showing we have of him is doing something to that effect. I don't think it's as clear cut as Sundipped Superman >= Big Bang, but he was >= the portion of the Big Bang that Brainiac 13 was able to utilize. Which considering what he threatened to do with it was most likely quite a lot.

Originally posted by h1a8
Sundipped Superman is more powerful than any Skyfather. He overpowered the begotten Imperiex force.

With that said, u have no proof to what you say. Writers portray CM has having the strength of Hercules, the power of Zues (explained through lightning), Stamina of Atlas (not strength), Wisdom of Solomon, speed of mercury, and invulnerability of Achilles.

No one can overwrite the writers intentions with speculation.


AH i see so a sundipped supes is greater then ODIN yes?

Originally posted by zeel
AH i see so a sundipped supes is greater then ODIN yes?

Oh yeah.....hes > LT because characters like LT or Galactus has never shown any type of speed and only Flash is faster but lacks the strength. They all get Combo to KOed!

Originally posted by Omega Vision
I really don't think there's any more evidence to argue that the IF wasn't using all it's power pushing against Supes than there is to argue that it was.

And really why wouldn't Brainiac push all his available power into resisting Supes' attempts to bfr him? Now I'm not agreeing with H1a8 that sundipped Superman > any Skyfather but in terms of raw strength Sundipped Superman was off the charts. He'd be at least Trans tier.

You also have little basis in saying that there's no way that Sundipped Superman could match the Imperiex Force when the only showing we have of him is doing something to that effect. I don't think it's as clear cut as Sundipped Superman >= Big Bang, but he was >= the portion of the Big Bang that Brainiac 13 was able to utilize. Which considering what he threatened to do with it was most likely quite a lot.

I can accept trans level.

Considering the collective effort it took to atempt to resist and then BFR the IF, I think it's safe to assume SM couldn't do it on his own against the force in direct combat even with the amp.

Yes, he overcame what brainiac was using of the force.

Originally posted by Stoic
Doesn't every punch from Captain Marvel penetrate Superman's defenses? Basically every hit gives him a major charlie horse. Am I right?

In short, no.

Originally posted by ankur29
http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/592786-s_b_04_17_super.jpg

Off of the top of my head I'd say Captain Marvel, he just seems a little bit neater, unique, and more interesting.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Off of the top of my head I'd say Captain Marvel, he just seems a little bit neater, unique, and more interesting.
None of which would determine how happy you'd be as him relative to Superman.

Swamp-Thing is neat, unique, and interesting and I wouldn't want to be Swamp-Thing.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
None of which would determine how happy you'd be as him relative to Superman.

Swamp-Thing is neat, unique, and interesting and I wouldn't want to be Swamp-Thing. why not? chicks dig it

Originally posted by 753
why not? chicks dig it
Hrm.

mhmm

I'd get my swamp tendrils into so much poon. 131

Originally posted by ankur29
writer's intention in almost every single appearance by the pair is that SM is CM's physical equal in every way, stop your double standards

and on top CM has magic to boot
Diana was shown to be equals to CM as well.
But
NO! They seem equals because Superman holds back subconsciously through mental blocks. It was explained by D.C. writers. Call it a retcon if you want but its proof. Add the fact that CM has Superman's weakness which evens things out. That means if Superman didn't have any magical weakness he would stomp CM everytime.

Superman has more powers too. He can punch, HV, freeze breath all at the same time. Even if they had the same physicality, Superman would still stomp if he really fought at his best. Superman can just do far more useful things.

CM's advantages is non weakness to magic and kryptonite, ability to have sex with human women without killing them (by changing to mortal form), and immortality.

Superman's advantages is ability to sun dip and exceed most heralds and more powers (more versatile).


Originally posted by Stoic
What if a Sky Father started casting magic spells on him, and ripped the sun amping right out of him, who would he be more powerful then? That would work if Superman just stood there and let the skyfather do that, assuming the skyfather could do that of course and that it would be an instant process (might take several hours to achieve).

More powerful doesn't mean who would win but who can exert more force at one time.

Originally posted by ankur29
Can you give me the name and the issue #? Id love to read that story.

Originally posted by SamZED
Can you give me the name and the issue #? Id love to read that story.

It's Superman/Batman #3 or #4, iirc.