Starfire VS Cheetah

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AsbestosFlaygon
Fight takes place in the amazon jungles of Themyscera.

No BFR.

Bloodlust ON, so both combatants can go to their peak levels if necessary.

SasuOna
Cheetah is pretty high up there in terms of speed though so I'm not too sure who's faster.
Starfire should be able to take this with her blasts.

Q99
Originally posted by SasuOna
Cheetah is pretty high up there in terms of speed though so I'm not too sure who's faster.
Starfire should be able to take this with her blasts.

I'd say Barbara's quite a bit faster.

If Cheetah can get Star into melee, even briefly, she should win.

Konton
Cheetah.

tideoftime
Cheetah, definitely. Kory can get a couple wins with some lucky shots and solid blows, but Barbara is *much* faster than Kory, and at least as strong (in terms of combat purposes), and at least as durable. Kory has ranged attacks and can fly, but without BFR as an option, it really won't help her much against someone as fast and deadly as Barbara (who, due to bloodlust being on, won't "play with her food", as she might otherwise do and therefore leave open the possibly of more wins for Kory).

Konton
Well... if bloodlust is on I see Kory taking some wins if she can avoid the initial blitz.

Not sure if Barbara can tank the nova blast.

Q99
The nova blast is Star's best chance to win, but she only gets one of those and she's drained after. I don't think normal starbolts will do.

If Barbara gets in melee range once, she's going to tail-grab Starfire and bring her down and not let up until it's over.

complexbrother
Starfire.

tideoftime
Originally posted by complexbrother
Starfire.

Pre-Crisis versions of each, sure... Starfire vs. Pre-C Cheetah curbstomps...

80's-90's -- If Kory could get some solid starbolts on Barbara, then she could get good wins, but Barbara was still much faster, and would win the majority (though not a slam).

2000's-- Barbara, definitely. Even though Kory is orders of magnitude more powerful than she was 3 decades ago, Barbara is nearly as fast as the Flash now (and has been for 5-6+ years). Novablast makes for a win, and another win comes from lucky shots and then *unmercifully* not letting up for even a fraction of second, but the majority goes to Cheetah. Too fast, and at least as strong/durable as Kory. Now, if BFR were allowed (which OP said it wasn't), then that opens the door for Kory to get wins via taking Barbara into space (*if* she can get a solid grip on her, which is not at all a given), but otherwise...

AsbestosFlaygon
So you guys are saying Cheetah wins the match definitely in melee?

Is Starfire CL100 now? Cause if she isn't, I think she's going to feel a lot of pain from Cheetah's punches.

She still has the advantage of flight though, so I don't think this would be a curbstomp.

tideoftime
Originally posted by AsbestosFlaygon
So you guys are saying Cheetah wins the match definitely in melee?

Is Starfire CL100 now? Cause if she isn't, I think she's going to feel a lot of pain from Cheetah's punches.

She still has the advantage of flight though, so I don't think this would be a curbstomp.

(Preface: I *hate* how people use the old Marvel "Class" system -- it's been outdated for 2 decades, and is a *very* poor descriptor for superhero strength ranges... *seriously*... The old DC MEG scale is much better -- if a touch outdated, itself -- for dealing with stength ranges and such...)

*****

Sorry -- had to get that out of my system...

*****

If we're going to use the Class scaling, then yeah: Kory is Cl100, and has been for about the past decade or so. She's not as strong as Donna, and certainly not Kara, but she's at least comparable to Cassie, if not stronger, which puts her at CL100+, as Cas can lift more than 100 tons, herself.

But anywho: Barbara wins the majority. Kory gets a win for Nova Blast, a win for some (very) lucky blasts immediately backed by unrelenting physical assault, and maybe another win for using absolutely *every* combat trick/skill-finesse in close-combat she's ever gleaned from the Warlords and her time with the Titans, and grabbing hold of Barbara and not letting go... no matter how torn-up she gets as claws/fangs fillet her like a fish/side of beef... BFR, though, makes it a split fight...

Konton
While I still respectably disagree with your Donna/Kory strength scaling, tide, I otherwise agree with your post. However, I would put slightly less emphasis on Kory being drained after her nova blast. During the Outsiders run she used it in battle to one-shot Indigo/Braniac's ship and still had enough immediate energy to fly ahead of her fellow flying teammates to pursue a physical assault, despite commenting on how she would otherwise be unable to let loose once more at the time.

Q99
Originally posted by AsbestosFlaygon
So you guys are saying Cheetah wins the match definitely in melee?

Yes.



She's maybe a low-class 100.




Though even if she tries that, Barbara's likely to dish out quite a bit worse. She uses grab-and-smack tactics too.

CosmicComet
Originally posted by tideoftime
(Preface: I *hate* how people use the old Marvel "Class" system -- it's been outdated for 2 decades, and is a *very* poor descriptor for superhero strength ranges... *seriously*... The old DC MEG scale is much better -- if a touch outdated, itself -- for dealing with stength ranges and such...)

*****

Sorry -- had to get that out of my system...

*****


What was the old DC system?

And yeah, Marvel's class system description has inadequacies. Because according to the wording, Spiderman would be a class 100.

-Pr-
Originally posted by Q99
I'd say Barbara's quite a bit faster.

If Cheetah can get Star into melee, even briefly, she should win.

tideoftime
Originally posted by Konton
While I still respectably disagree with your Donna/Kory strength scaling

Much of Kory's "strength" is due to her being a much more ferocious fighter than most, particularly Donna; back in the day (80's), Donna was much stronger than Kory, by more than an order of magnitude, but Kory's upgrades have narrowed that to a relative margin. In a fight, they are essentially equal, with Donna have a strength edge and a speed advantage, and Kory having the edge in combat skill and being just brutal when push comes to shove; however, I would bet actual money that if they sat down and armwrestled, or had to do a straight "who can move the bigger building", Donna would win. Not by any considerable degree (the armwrestling would take awhile, and the relative weight difference is just marginal) -- Kory, Donna, and Ms. Martian are in the same general ranges of strength. But Kory is much closer to Donna now than ever in the past, and like I said, they can perform a number of comparable strength feats, more or less...

tideoftime
Originally posted by CosmicComet
What was the old DC system?

And yeah, Marvel's class system description has inadequacies. Because according to the wording, Spiderman would be a class 100.

The old MEG scale covered a much wider range of weight/force, and actually better represented what was being *displayed* in comics (not just DC, but comics in general) in terms of strength feats than Marvel's Class scale (A classic example that I, myself, used back in the 80's: She-Hulk, in the early years, was scaled at Cl50-75, but displayed greater feats on a regular basis, such as when she and Spiderman first met in an old Team-Up, where she threw a loaded Brink's truck several city blocks, into the harbor -- that would have required a strength level at least an order of magnitude greater, and more.)

Doesn't really matter, I suppose, except in cases where people need to keep in mind that thinking in terms of 10, 50, or 100 tons as *meaning* anything, in terms of most super-strong characters, is pointless; for displayed feats, there is almost no functional difference between someone with "50 tons" of strength, and somebody with "100 tons" of strength: they're both going to perform similar feats, and many really strong characters are so far above those numbers that it is actually irrelevant to even bring them up (in fact, in the old MEG scale, 50-100 tons was in the same scale point - 12- and not differentiated at all, for the reasons I just mentioned). Another example: at different points in his scaled history, Superman was scaled at 25, 35, and 50; late 70's to mid-80's, the 50 represented being able to move mountains all but effortlessly, and (with great strain, or sun-boost) be able to nudge/shift smaller planetary bodies, even including the Earth; late 80's (*especially* during Byrne's tenure) through the 90's, he scaled at 25, meaning he could move approaching 1 million tons without undue strain, with more being possible, but uncertain; from 2000 (and the last relative scaling figures), he leveled at 35, making him strong enough to move medium sized mountains again, but not quite back to his classic Pre-Crisis levels again (and still, un-amped, not up to Silver Age Superman, or Superboy Prime...).

Prep-Man
Cheetah.

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