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Browsing some old treads I see DE Palps is thought to be a beast, but how beastly is he? Can Sidious take down Vader and Caedus?

Setting: Naboo Plains
1. Lightsaber
2. Force
3. All-out

From the showings of TFU games, vader is a tank, an absolute damage soak with force tk pretty much unrivaled.

Caedus has the highest showings of stamina, pain threshhold, and ability to feed off of his pain, suffering.

I give this to the team.

Caedus's showing against Luke makes me give it to the team. CLOSE though, Vader becomes mostly a non-factor, but JUST enough to give it to the team.

Why? Sidious can use his ridiculous DE force lightning to take care of Vader, then win a more difficult fight against CAedus.

Vader is 80% of Sidious... Not sure how he is going to be a non-factor.

And as tfu game and novels has shown, force lightening means very little versus vader.

As for why it effected him in the movie, I'm not sure, maybe it was due to vader wanting to lose, to die, for redemption, so he didn't use the force to protect himself?

It was probably because it's Sidious' lightning which is the strongest form of Force Lightning.

But can Sids just insta-kill Vader in a combat scenario? In RotJ Vader wasn't going for a fight, he just went to shaft Sids (literally).
Plus there's Caedus. What if Vader attacks Sids with his uber TK and Caedus goes for a lightsaber fight?
I am not sure Sids, even as of DE, is so superior in the force to take them both easily, considering they are also both force beats.

Originally posted by Board Walker
And as tfu game and novels has shown, force lightening means very little versus vader.
In that game, yes

In Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader, Palpatine points out that with one finger he could short circuit the panel on Vaders chest that kept him alive, one zap and Vader would only live for a few moments, the TFU had to make lightning less effective so you would actually have a boss fight instead of a zap i win

Originally posted by Pwned
In Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader, Palpatine points out that with one finger he could short circuit the panel on Vaders chest that kept him alive, one zap and Vader would only live for a few moments.
I don't rember that. Can you post the passage?

The tfu novels level of canon is above dark lord isn't it? In that he takes levels of force lightening from marke, who arguably has some of the most powerfullightening shown in the mythos yet.

Thus there is a confliction of canon, and wouldn't tfu novel have the higher canon? Thus its word takes precedence?

Idk what type of canon either are, but if you asked me i would have said they were equal, and went with Dark Lord cuz Sidious said it, and im pretty sure he had the most powerful lightning in the mythos, Marek disintegrated troopers, but im not sure that was lightning

The unrevised canon status of Dark Empire is S Canon actually.

What is the tfu novels' canon?

C Canon

And Dark Lord? C as well, or lower?

Originally posted by NCRotCA
The unrevised canon status of Dark Empire is S Canon actually.
No it's not. Quit making shit up.

And Dark Lord is C-canon as is TFU.

Edit: I also checked Dark Lord and saw nothing of the sort Pwned. Please post the passage if it actually exists.

So then what? DO they cancel eachother out or go with the more logical sense of electricity shorting it out?


Its a huge factor here, if Vader can be mortally wounded in less than half a second after the start of the fight, itll change it all

Yes, it is. It was made before an active, wide effort had been made to fit everything into continuity. S-Canon.

Please post the damn passage so if we can actually see that the conflict exists.

Regardless Sidious's lightning is more powerful and Darth Vader could have easily upgraded his suit.

Also Darth Vader can deflect lightning with his lightsaber... So no it won't be an insta-win like some claim.

Originally posted by NCRotCA
Yes, it is. It was made before an active, wide effort had been made to fit everything into continuity. S-Canon.

No not really. It was relased at around the same time that the Thrawn Triliogy came out which was when the continuity began to be constructed. Regardless, S-canon becomes C-canon if refrenced in another c-canon source and Dark Empire has been refrenced many times.

Cant find exact passage this second, give me a day, but its while Vader is on Coruscant talking to the Emporer, he it does say "He deployed his hands like claws, as if to summon and cast lightning"
Like i said, give me a day ill find it

All right found it.

"Interesting that you refrain from calling me your Master."

Vader inclined his head to Sidious. "I meant nothing by it, my Master. "

Sidious sneered. "Perhaps you wish you could strike me down, is that it?"

"No, Master."

"What stops you from doing so? Obi-Wan was once your Master, and you were certainly prepared to kill him. Even if you failed."

Vader clenched his right hand. "Obi-Wan did not understand the power of the dark side."

"And you do?"

"No, Master. Not yet. Not fully."

"And that's why you don't try to strike me down? Because I possess powers you lack?" Sidious lifted his arms, hands deployed like claws, as if to summon and hurl Sith lightning. "Because you know that I could easily overwhelm the delicate electrical systems of your suit."

Vader stood his ground. "I don't fear death, Master."

Sidious grinned maliciously. "Then why go on living, my young apprentice?"

Vader looked down at him. "To learn to become more powerful."

Sidious lowered his hands. "Then I ask you one final time, Lord Vader. Why not strike me down?"

"Because you are my path to power, Master," Vader said. "Because I need you."

Sidious narrowed his eyes and nodded. "Just like I needed my Master-for a time."

"Yes, Master," Vader said finally. "For a time."

"Good. Very good." Sidious smiled in satisfaction. "And now you are ready to release your anger."

I really wouldn't take that too literally, it seems more like an exageration on Sidious's part.

If it turns out tfu canons is higher then darklord, then lightening > vader, is likely going out the window.

Considering the ammount of lightening and punishment vader takes, and then after the explosion proceeds to get right back up unhampered, even though his mask, helmet is missing, exposing his pale face with blue eyes.

TFU is not more canon than the Dark Lord...

Thanks ares, i didnt really have alot of time tonight up until like now, was doing homework and the last problems were easier than the rest XD

Do game mechanincs count as canon?

Also, does it specifically say that Vader was blasted with lightning and kept coming with no visible effects?

Game mechanics are not canon.

And I have not read the book, but in the cutscenes, which are canon, Starkiller blasts Vader with an ungodly amount of lightning. That said Sidious's lightning is clearly more powerful as it does kill him in RotJ, however it's important to note that Vader wasn't trying to defend himself at that time.

This is of course DE Sidious whose lightning is even more ungodly than Starkillers......

Wasnt it the clone who blasted him?

Also, how much hit his lightsaber? I noticed Starkillers lightning tends to be so effective because he focuses it into one small arc, which, compressing shit tends to add more power to it in the spot it hits, Sidious sprays his a bit so its harder to block

I guess it comes down to whether or not the lightning hits the control panel, if it does Vader is dead

Originally posted by Pwned
This is of course DE Sidious whose lightning is even more ungodly than Starkillers......
Of course.


Yes, but he was hit by lightning in the first novel as well.


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At about 4:56...


Not really.

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Well, if it short circuits the board, Vader can only breath unassisted for a few moments, after which he would die of asphyxiation

It also describes his style as "Ancient and designed to protect his center, as Grevious was forced to do"

During Vaders duel with Shryne, Shryne even realizes that if he cuts the panel, Vader will die

Of course, im arguing pretty much solely from that book so far, it contains plenty of insights into Vaders mind and style

Watch ANH, he holds the lightsaber to protect his center still

What are you even saying? Regardless, Vader tanks Sidious's lightning for around seven seconds. I'm not sure how Palpatine's going to be able to just shock him for that long while Caedus is here. Not to mention Vader can also defend himself...

True

Main thing im saying is, if Sidious catches Vader off guard and blows the circuits in his suit, Vader, as we all know, is screwed

I doubt it would happen, but there is the chance Sidious would just lightning blitz them, hoping to do whatever damage he could

Doesnt he know how to force himself into taking over the body of others, like Bane could try to do?
Or could he just transfer his mind to other bodies?

Originally posted by Board Walker
If it turns out tfu canons is higher then darklord, then lightening > vader, is likely going out the window.

Considering the ammount of lightening and punishment vader takes, and then after the explosion proceeds to get right back up unhampered, even though his mask, helmet is missing, exposing his pale face with blue eyes. There's no "higher" level amidst C-canon. Just discrepancies with no answer. Sidious' line was likely just posturing to keep Vader at heel.


The Force Unleashed novel has Vader being zapped by Marek, and if the the second novel follows it's corresponding game, he's gonna get an even worse treatment. Vader can take Lightning, just not Palpatine's (RotJ). Amp it up to Dark Empire, even less so. But people often forget that lighstabers can "absorb" Force Lightning (AotC). With Vader's natural Force affinity, brute strength and pain threshold, and his lightsaber, and and a powerful partner, and Palpatine's gonna need more than just Lightning. He has superior speed and technical abilities with a saber though...

I'd give this to the team. Luke circa DE defeated a cloned Palpatine in their rematch, and if Caedus is hovering around LotF Luke... with Vader by his side...


Team for sure. Maybe Vader dies, or maybe some digits and helmets are lost, but the Team wins.

If Sidious spends a few seconds trying to shock Vader, he's going to eat a lightsaber from Caedus. Caedus is an undeniable BEAST.