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First stone stare in effect.


second fight stone stare not in effect.




who wins and why. They both have standard equipment.

why even have the first scenario? come on...you know it's utter spite.

Second fight...still Gorgon. He's way too skilled for Ares.

Why is it spite? The stone stare didn't work on Ares' son. I'm willing to bet it won't do shit to Ares either.

Oh, and Ares wins.

Originally posted by Starscream M
why even have the first scenario? come on...you know it's utter spite.

Second fight...still Gorgon. He's way too skilled for Ares.

Honestly wait and see. I not be the least bit surprised if people trying to argue it not working on Ares. I mean I agree with you that it more or less would be a spite in the first fight, but people will argue it, because it did not work on Ares son.

It's like you're a mind reader.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Why is it spite? The stone stare didn't work on Ares' son. I'm willing to bet it won't do shit to Ares either.

Oh, and Ares wins. Gorgon is much more skilled, much faster, and much much smarter. He's basically fighting a semi-retard in Ares. Sure Ares axe is much much bigger...but that's basically his only advantage.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Honestly wait and see. I not be the least bit surprised if people trying to argue it not working on Ares. I mean I agree with you that it more or less would be a spite in the first fight, but people will argue it, because it did not work on Ares son. ok regardless if the stare works or not, Ares is still not in gorgon's league per my reasoning above.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Why is it spite? The stone stare didn't work on Ares' son. I'm willing to bet it won't do shit to Ares either.

Oh, and Ares wins.
Ares is not his son, nor has the same powers. I honestly think it did not work due to the nature of eaches ability, they seem to cancel eachother out. But perhaps that just me.




I completely disagree, I think Gorgon would put Ares down. He much faster and his sword can do some major damage.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
It's like you're a mind reader.
I almost went one step further and said rage will argue against it lol. I can even guess your next arguement, that Ares son kept pace with Gorgon so Ares is at least as fast oh and Ares feat against X-men (which i think is by deffinition pis to be honest).

perhaps I can read minds.

Ares is a God ZOMG!!!!!!! the stone stare wont work on him.

Originally posted by The Nuul
Ares is a God ZOMG!!!!!!! the stone stare wont work on him.
lol and I expected several of these arguements to come forth soon though with out the sarcasm.

From now on, I'm going to use Alex as the point of comparison because that's the only point of comparison available:

Originally posted by Starscream M
Gorgon is much more skilled, much faster, and much much smarter. He's basically fighting a semi-retard in Ares. Sure Ares axe is much much bigger...but that's basically his only advantage.


Gorgon was clearly not much more skilled than Alex. I don't have the comic on hand, but from what I remember Alex was portrayed as less skilled if anything. IIRC, Ares mocked his fighting abilities and kicked his ass easily when he got mad.

His not much faster than Ares either apparently.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Ares is not his son, nor has the same powers. I honestly think it did not work due to the nature of eaches ability, they seem to cancel eachother out. But perhaps that just me.

What would Alex's powers have to do with his resistance to the stone stare? He has the ability to show people their greatest fears. Not exactly the requirements for resisting being turned into stone.

What on earth gave you that idea? Gorgon's immunity to Alex's powers was attributed to him not fearing anything.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
I completely disagree, I think Gorgon would put Ares down. He much faster and his sword can do some major damage.

Again: Not much faster than Alex = Not much faster than Ares

Ares has an impressive healing factor as well. Impalement won't stop him and if you think his cutting off Ares' head etc. I'm not going to even bother debating.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
I almost went one step further and said rage will argue against it lol. I can even guess your next arguement, that Ares son kept pace with Gorgon so Ares is at least as fast oh and Ares feat against X-men (which i think is by deffinition pis to be honest).

perhaps I can read minds.

I'd assume you'd know what I was going to argue. We had this debate in a thread like 3 days ago.

Course, maybe it is telepathy.

rage, gorgon was faster than both elektra and wolverine.

K.

I have no illusions. Gorgon will be faster than Ares if the two fight in a comic. Even more skilled. Cut his physical capabilities by 2/3's and he'd be matching him with skill/speed. It's how modern writers do shit.

Edit: I'm going to have to finish this either tomorrow -if I find the time- or later on in the week.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus




What would Alex's powers have to do with his resistance to the stone stare? He has the ability to show people their greatest fears. Not exactly the requirements for resisting being turned into stone.

What on earth gave you that idea? Gorgon's immunity to Alex's powers was attributed to him not fearing anything.

That how I saw it when I read there fight. to me it seem there powers cancled eachother out. There was not such statement or implications that Gods were immune. I dont think they are, I simply think Alex is immune, but it is debatable since it really hard to proof absolute on either side.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus

: Not much faster than Alex = Not much faster than Ares

Ares has an impressive healing factor as well. Impalement won't stop him and if you think his cutting off Ares' head etc. I'm not going to even bother debating.
ABC logic is unusable and bad logic. Alex speed was potrayed more impressive then I have ever seen it. His speed was played up, quite a bit. Gorgon has shown consistent spiderman level speeds and faster which neither alex or Ares has shown on anything remotely resembling a consistent level. Ares has one impressive speed feat and it could easily be classified as pis.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
K.

I have no illusions. Gorgon will be faster than Ares if the two fight in a comic. Even more skilled. Cut his physical capabilities by 2/3's and he'd be matching him with skill/speed. It's how modern writers do shit.

Edit: I'm going to have to finish this either tomorrow -if I find the time- or later on in the week.
....I not sure what your intentions are, but this came across as you acknowledging that Gorgon would be faster and more skilled in comics, but Ares should be, becuase he a god......but if he not shown to be he not. Being a god means nothing it a title which people seem to grasp as the end all be all, despite the fact many non gods could beat and even destroy many "gods". US Agent put it best when he said"there false gods, there simply meta humans like us which were mistaken as gods and worshiped as so, but there no more gods then we are". (or some such, that was the jist of it, his words were little meaners lol) Which is actual something I agree with on many levels.

also as for the modern writers stuff, that seems rather inaccurate since Ares best speed feat was written by a modern writer and nothing in his classic apearances is anything remotely impressive on a speed level. I dont find his classic self as a whole to be impressive at all.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
That how I saw it when I read there fight. to me it seem there powers cancled eachother out. There was not such statement or implications that Gods were immune. I dont think they are, I simply think Alex is immune, but it is debatable since it really hard to proof absolute on either side.

Again, why on earth would they cancel each other out? Gorgon's immunity to his powers was specifically attributed to his lack of fear. Why else would Alex be immune other than his half Olympian? Because he has some psionic based powers (So does Ares by the way)? Apply some common sense to the situation.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
ABC logic is unusable and bad logic. Alex speed was potrayed more impressive then I have ever seen it. His speed was played up, quite a bit. Gorgon has shown consistent spiderman level speeds and faster which neither alex or Ares has shown on anything remotely resembling a consistent level. Ares has one impressive speed feat and it could easily be classified as pis.

Unusable and bad logic? It's our only point of comparison between two characters and is pretty reasonable because as far as I know Alex has not received any power ups in speed, strength etc. As a matter of fact, it's Ares who had an off panel power up in regards to his physical strength and durability.

This is some pretty lulz worthy stuff I must say. Ares' best speed feat doesn't count, Alex was clearly much faster against Gorgon than he was against Ares....because....you want him to be?

Keep this up and I might have to concede.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
....I not sure what your intentions are, but this came across as you acknowledging that Gorgon would be faster and more skilled in comics, but Ares should be, becuase he a god......but if he not shown to be he not. Being a god means nothing it a title which people seem to grasp as the end all be all, despite the fact many non gods could beat and even destroy many "gods". US Agent put it best when he said"there false gods, there simply meta humans like us which were mistaken as gods and worshiped as so" (or some such, that was the jist of it, his words were little meaners lol)

Obviously reading is not your strong suit.

Gorgon would be faster and more skilled in comics because he has to be for their to be a fight. If he wasn't, Ares would rip his head off because his vastly superior physically (In regards to strength).

If Ares' physical strength and durability was reduced, his other attributes would be played up.

It's simply how the mechanics of comics work. Anyone whose read comics should know this.

First of all, Ares sucks balls and has shitty feats for a God.

More mind blowing debating.

Gorgon wins 8/10 and how many times do I have to say this "gorgon is faster than spiderman", so stop comparing the two.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Ares would rip his head off because his vastly superior physically (In regards to strength).

really?

tell me how strong Gorgon is.

Also, Ares isn't really that strong...he's like Venom level.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
More mind blowing debating.

And for a "God" what mighty feats that Ares has?

Logan would give him a helluva good fight and would prob win.

He has a respect thread.

Originally posted by Starscream M
really?

tell me how strong Gorgon is.

Also, Ares isn't really that strong...he's like Venom level.

Class 2 I believe.

I'd say his a fair bit above that. Nearly at the Hercules level of strength. Where I'd place beings like a hydrated Namor, Wonder Woman etc.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus

I'd say his a fair bit above that. Nearly at the Hercules level of strength. Where I'd place beings like a hydrated Namor, Wonder Woman etc. yet he lifts cap america level weights for a workout?

Originally posted by Starscream M
yet he lifts cap america level weights for a workout?

1. When? In Dark Avengers?
2. How does that prove anything? I've seen Thor and Superman lifting weights that looked like something Cap would be benching.

I was waiting so I could reply to Dum Dum one more time but it's late so I'm out.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus


Unusable andbad logic? It's our only point of comparison between two characters and is pretty reasonable because as far as I know Alex has not received any power ups in speed, strength etc. As a matter of fact, it's Ares who had an off panel power up in regards to his physical strength and durability.


Yes it bad logic to use one character feats for another character. Yes there is a rule against it on the forums. Becuase character A can beat character C means that A can beat B, however that is many times not the case.





Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
is some pretty lulz worthy stuff I must say. Ares' best speed feat doesn't count,
I seeing it easy to argue it being PIS. He never prior to that feat or since shown any speed remotely comparable to that feat........but now you want to assume it the norm?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
was clearly much faster against Gorgon than he was against Ares....because....you want him to be?

No becuase he has never display anything close to that level of speed before. Gorgon showed consisently crazy levels of speed neither of which Ares or Alex have consistently shown. SO what now Ares and his son can out react speedstirs, weave in and out of machine gun firer, deflect effortlessly countless bullets ect.


And you wanna trying to pretend I the one picking and choosing what I like and dislike? You taking both characters not on what they consistently shown but on one time feats which are well out side the consistently shown speed levels.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Obviously reading is not your strong suit.

Gorgon would be faster and more skilled in comics because he has to be for their to be a fight. If he wasn't, Ares would rip his head off because his vastly superior physically (In regards to strength).

If Ares' physical strength and durability was reduced, his other attributes would be played up.

It's simply how the mechanics of comics work. Anyone whose read comics should know this.

no need to be insulting.

No this is only the case really with gods, and thats becuase you believe them to be on levels they simply are not in combat speed and reflexes. There not shown that fast because they arnt. Consistently Ares display nothing remotely impressive in speed.

Now, real Gods like Thor or WW (at normal levels) would squash Gorgon like a bug. But this is Ares so...

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Yes it bad logic to use one character feats for another character. Yes there is a rule against it on the forums. Becuase character A can beat character C means that A can beat B, however that is many times not the case.

Okay, I'm going to try this one more time:

We're arguing whether or not the stone star will work on Ares. The being closest to Ares physically that it has been used on resisted it's effects. Logic dictates that Ares will also resist the effects. Alex is not superior to Ares physically. The powers not having an effect we're not attributed to something Ares lacks. It's almost certainly because Alex is a "God".

It's a pretty simply concept. It'd be up to you to prove the stone stare will work at this point and not vise versa.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
No becuase he has never display anything close to that level of speed before. Gorgon showed consisently crazy levels of speed neither of which Ares or Alex have consistently shown. SO what now Ares and his son can out react speedstirs, weave in and out of machine gun firer, deflect effortlessly countless bullets ect.

Lulz. Ares wasn't even a real character up until 4 years ago where he got his own miniseries, was fleshed out as a character, and then received an off panel power. Why the hell would there be a consistent showing of this level throughout his history?

A decade ago I would have laughed if you had told me Ares would rip open a hole through reality/space through sheer strength, and the X-men would be in awe of his power and resort to making a deal with Hela to stop him but it happened.

He just started out as a character. If and when he comes back, we'll once again see impressive feats sooner or later that people like you would argue are PIS.

P.S. I'm pretty sure Ares did react to a speedster or was at least able to harm one in his mini series. It was Hermes I believe.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
And you wanna trying to pretend I the one picking and choosing what I like and dislike? You taking both characters not on what they consistently shown but on one time feats which are well out side the consistently shown speed levels.

facepalm

Bottom line:

Ares' average speed is at least equivalent that to Alex. Alex is about as fast as Gorgon. No matter how much you b*tch about it, it isn't going to change.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
no need to be insulting.

No this is only the case really with gods, and thats becuase you believe them to be on levels they simply are not in combat speed and reflexes. There not shown that fast because they arnt. Consistently Ares display nothing remotely impressive in speed.

Kay.

There's really nothing worth debating there.

I'm out for real.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Okay, I'm going to try this one more time:

We're arguing whether or not the stone star will work on Ares. The being closest to Ares physically that it has been used on resisted it's effects. Logic dictates that Ares will also resist the effects. Alex is not superior to Ares physically. The powers not having an effect we're not attributed to something Ares lacks. It's almost certainly because Alex is a "God".
It's a pretty simply concept. It'd be up to you to prove the stone stare will work at this point and not vise versa.


bad I was referring to you trying to pretend Alex matchign Gorgon means Ares can in speed. I never stated anything or even implied that my last post had anything to do with stone stare. So you just went on about something I was not even argueing.


Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
. Ares wasn't even a real character up until 4 years ago where he got his own miniseries, was fleshed out as a character, and then received an off panel power. Why the hell would there be a consistent showing of this level throughout his history?

Nor was gorgon, in fact he has not been a real character untill pretty much the last two years if that and he shown consistent speed, comparable to his original appearances which took place several years ago.


Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
decade ago I would have laughed if you had told me Ares would rip open a hole through reality/space through sheer strength, and the X-men would be in awe of his power and resort to making a deal with Hela to stop him but it happened.

He just started out as a character. If and when he comes back, we'll once again see impressive feats sooner or later that people like you would argue are PIS.


It pis becuse he never displayed that level of speed prior or since even remotely close to it.

So Ares is now capable of weaving in an out of machine gun firer, deflecting machine gun firer easily, out reacting a speedstir ect? Despite the fact he only has a single impressive speed feat? are you serous?


Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
. I'm pretty sure Ares did react to a speedster or was at least able to harm one in his mini series. It was Hermes I believe.


I dont believe he did at all. I read it and don't recall that.


facepalm

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
line:

Ares' average speed is at least equivalent that to Alex. Alex is about as fast as Gorgon. No matter how much you b*tch about it, it isn't going to change.

Again basing one time feats as the norm. Honestly sad part is you trying to act like I am the one being rediculous, but in fact it you.

Your using one time events as if there the norm/ Alex nor Ares has ever displayed that type of consistent speed, that gorgon has or even close to it. But becuase Alex had one good showing which was also his death agaisnt gorgon now means Ares has comparable speed to Gorgon is absurd.

Originally posted by The Nuul
Now, real Gods like Thor or WW (at normal levels) would squash Gorgon like a bug. But this is Ares so...
If this was Thor I give it to him all day.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Kay.

There's really nothing worth debating there.

I'm out for real.
perhaps not, I mean your entire arguement for Ares relies on another characters feat and whats worse is you take single feat as the norm while ignoring the character consistent showing.

Hey why dont we both post each characters speed feats and see which one consistently shown faster guess what it not gunna be ares........


http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/9670/gorgonvselektra1.th.jpg http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/456/gorgonvselektra2.th.jpg http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/2303/gorgonvselektra3.th.jpg http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/5315/gorgonvselektra4.th.jpg http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/1527/gorgonvselektra5.th.jpg http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/2227/gorgonvselektra6.th.jpg http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/3789/gorgonvselektra7.th.jpg

Originally posted by Starscream M
He's basically fighting a semi-retard in Ares. Sure Ares axe is much much bigger...but that's basically his only advantage.

That a joke?

Ares takes this 7/10. The stone stare isn't going to work at all. Like Rage said, Alex being Olympian prevented the stare from working. Gorgon has died, there's nothing for him to fear. It wasn't because their powers canceled each other out.

Originally posted by The Nuul
First of all, Ares sucks balls and has shitty feats for a God.

Ares rips open a portal that Eden says only he controls who goes through.
http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/577/sw09003.th.jpghttp://img717.imageshack.us/img717/3394/sw09004.th.jpg

Being the personification of War, he exist in all times, allowing him attack Nate who was hiding in moments between time.
http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/th_Dark_X-Men_03_0012.jpg http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/th_Dark_X-Men_03_0015.jpg http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/th_Dark_X-Men_03_0016.jpg

Originally posted by Starscream M
really?

tell me how strong Gorgon is.

Also, Ares isn't really that strong...he's like Venom level.

More like Herc level.

Destructive force of ares's strength+axe:
http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/th_New-Avengers-058-pg-08.jpg

Beat A-Bomb
http://h.imagehost.org/t/0092/Hulk_13_015.jpghttp://h.imagehost.org/t/0983/Hulk_13_016.jpg http://h.imagehost.org/t/0197/Hulk_13_017.jpg http://h.imagehost.org/t/0496/Hulk_13_018.jpg http://h.imagehost.org/t/0299/Hulk_13_019.jpg http://h.imagehost.org/t/0094/Hulk_13_020.jpg http://h.imagehost.org/t/0995/Hulk_13_021.jpg

And you think that is herc level?

No.

It is over venom but it isnt herc.

I am interested in what relevences most of those feats posted even have with this debate let a lone make Ares win? All you did white witch was post ars respect thread with out giving single reason for there relevance's or why it makes Ares win.

Ripping open a portal is completely irrelevant to this fight, as is existing in all times. It cool and all but has nothing to do with this fight.

Originally posted by Gecko4lif
And you think that is herc level?

No.

It is over venom but it isnt herc.



And thats the thing about Ares that some people dont want to get. Hes not on Hercs level.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Ares takes this 7/10. The stone stare isn't going to work at all. Like Rage said, Alex being Olympian prevented the stare from working. Gorgon has died, there's nothing for him to fear. It wasn't because their powers canceled each other out.


No actually it because he the god of fear. Gorgon power is supposed to work like gorgon from mythology in which the stare petrifies the person into stone, which would be impossible to accomplish against the god of fear which is what explains his immunity. But as usual people try and play up gods and pretend that one of them doing something some how equates to all of them being able to.

Ares.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
No actually it because he the god of fear. Gorgon power is supposed to work like gorgon from mythology in which the stare petrifies the person into stone, which would be impossible to accomplish against the god of fear which is what explains his immunity.

In mythology, the person has to look at them. Gorgon can turn people into stone without looking at them. Also, it doesn't make sense because he turned to stone when Logan reflected his stare at him. Essentially you're arguing that he petrified himself and thus turned himself into stone? lol

The stone stare didn't work on Alex because he was a god. It's not going to work Ares either, who essential ripped apart a portal that Eden said under his control and step between time to attack Nate.



Except in Ares' case he's got feats to back him up on the matter.


Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
I am interested in what relevences most of those feats posted even have with this debate let a lone make Ares win? All you did white witch was post ars respect thread with out giving single reason for there relevance's or why it makes Ares win.

Ripping open a portal is completely irrelevant to this fight, as is existing in all times. It cool and all but has nothing to do with this fight.

How is it irrelevant when Eden claimed he was the only one to determine who goes through the portal and Ares proved him wrong? Either it's him being a god that allowed him to do that or it's his strength or both. Do you see guys like Luke Cage or Venom doing something like that? There's been no instances at all. Cool? Gorgon shattered godstalker against Alex's grasscutter. At best, Gorgon's strength did not over whelm Alex in the least bit. Ares would stomp Gorgon when there weapons clash. Unfortunate for Gorgon, Ares isn't going to go easy on him the way he did against his own son. Gorgon got put on his butt when Stonewall got pissed off; Ares is going to do it worse.

Originally posted by Gecko4lif
And you think that is herc level?

No.

It is over venom but it isnt herc.

Matching A-Bomb isn't? Ripping apart a portal isn't? He isn't Herc level but he was beating Herc's face in and choking him until Herc ripped the steel floor from his feet which sent him off the Hellicarrier. That Ares is going to have a problem with Gorgon.

Has the stone stare ever worked on a God before first of all? Because that would be necessary in order for there to be any sort of precedent for the claim that the stare would work on Ares. Generally, gods have immunity to numerous transmutational effects anyways. In this case however what makes it even more unlikely that it would work on Ares is that, it has failed to work on another God. So their is a precedent for its failure that has already been set. The burden of proof is therefore overwhelmingly on those saying it will work on Ares to provide proof that it will.

Only time Alex got Ares was when Ares let his guard down or tried to reason with his son. He could've snapped Alex's neck right there but held out. Gorgon is not going to get that kind of chance.
http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/5492/ares509.th.jpghttp://img262.imageshack.us/img262/7193/ares51112.th.jpghttp://img839.imageshack.us/img839/990/ares513.th.jpghttp://img338.imageshack.us/img338/3788/ares514.th.jpghttp://img811.imageshack.us/img811/401/ares515.th.jpg

Decent thread, I'm undecided.Originally posted by carver9
Gorgon wins 8/10 and how many times do I have to say this "gorgon is faster than spiderman", so stop comparing the two. Because you think he is comparable to Wonder Woman in speed and has Hulk level healing and is physically stronger than Spider-Man. Spider-Man and Gorgon are are comparable in speed but if you think he's blitzing everyone you're out of your mind. He has been cut way more times by Wolverine where Spider-Man has only been stabbed once. In a practice match... on accident.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Decent thread, I'm undecided. Because you think he is comparable to Wonder Woman in speed and has Hulk level healing and is physically stronger than Spider-Man. Spider-Man and Gorgon are are comparable in speed but if you think he's blitzing everyone you're out of your mind. He has been cut way more times by Wolverine where Spider-Man has only been stabbed once. In a practice match... on accident.

Here you go spamming again... we already discussed this c-master so stop saying it.

Like I said, gorgon is MUCH faster than spiderman, not wonder woman SPIDERMAN. I never depicted you as a spammer c-master. When was he stabbed by wolverine without being sneaked? Spiderman has been hit by people in wolvy tier of speed (or probably slower). He has been in a physical fight with king pin, hobgoblin, lizard, sabertooth, hell, hulk has hit him, cap, daredevil, silver samurai owned him in a couple of panels, and the list goes on and on.

Originally posted by carver9
Here you go spamming again... we already discussed this c-master so stop saying it.

Like I said, gorgon is MUCH faster than spiderman, not wonder woman SPIDERMAN. I never depicted you as a spammer c-master. When was he stabbed by wolverine without being sneaked? Spiderman has been hit by people in wolvy tier of speed (or probably slower). He has been in a physical fight with king pin, hobgoblin, lizard, sabertooth, hell, hulk has hit him, cap, daredevil, silver samurai owned him in a couple of panels, and the list goes on and on. Wolverine has tagged Gorgon several times. Spider-Man hasn't been. Spider-Man has blitzed teams, going by your logic he'd be slower but I didn't really say either was much slower, just comparable. But I guess he isn't Wonder Woman level of speed like Gorgon so you may have a point. Featwars blow.

Anyways, you'd actually be spamming first by bringing him in the thread. Have a nice day.