Skaar vs Firelord

CosmicComet

Originally posted by Stoic
Firelord does not fight in hyper speed like Goku, or Gladiator, his flight would simply bring him into contact with Skaar, and then he would get the beats. Like I said Skaar is immune to fire, and when he amps up with the Old Power it would be a wrap. Imagine Firelord taking a 100 trillion ton punch in the face... Not pretty.

Unless Skaar can react to a being flying at him at multiple times the speed of light, it doesn't really matter if Firelord doesn't have lightspeed agility.

The shortest distance between two points is always a straight line.

Those two points are Skaar and Firelord. Firelord flies at fullspeed at Skaar, and Skaar will not and should not be able to react. Firelord would fly right through him.

I've never really understood this 'travel speed vs fight speed' deal. It's only a problem if the guy cannot accelerate to his top speed in an instant and needs time to build up speed.

Stoic

The factor that you fail to recognize is that Firelord would not be blanketed with any sort of force field to shift the impact away from him when he made contact with Skaar, and you underestimate Skaars healing factor and general toughness. Skaar can armor up, which amps him to class 100 stats. Firelord does not, and never has been able to throw multiple hit combos. Firelord basically fights at slightly above human speeds. Skaar is also a hardened warrior despite his age, because all he has known is combat. No Firelord would lose, because this would turn into a slug it out. Yes he has flight speed, but no battle speed, so punch for punch, Skaar is going to out punch him.

quanchi112

Firelord wins.

Stoic

Originally posted by quanchi112
Firelord wins.

Correction, Firelord loses. There is absolutely nothing that Firelord could do to Skaar that would keep him down. However Skaar could put Firelord down permanently. Skaar beat the Juggernaut, and that was before Cain was depowered again. Cain would simply crush Kril.

carver9

I'm giving it to firelord but lol at the peeps that is saying that firelord can fight at light speed. I can only think of one character on kmc that fights anywhere close or above the speed of light going by on-panel showings and it ain't fire lord.

Stoic

Originally posted by carver9
I'm giving it to firelord but lol at the peeps that is saying that firelord can fight at light speed. I can only think of one character on kmc that fights anywhere close or above the speed of light going by on-panel showings and it ain't fire lord.

Who has Firelord beaten that is on Skaars level of power? Skaar would not only be hitting Kril with class 100 punches, but he would also be hitting him with seismic assaults the like that could shift a continent. The scan above of Drax hitting Kril was clearly not in the 100 trilion ton range, or Kril would flown out of orbit. Nah Skaar has the feats to put this match out.

quanchi112

Originally posted by Stoic
Correction, Firelord loses. There is absolutely nothing that Firelord could do to Skaar that would keep him down. However Skaar could put Firelord down permanently. Skaar beat the Juggernaut, and that was before Cain was depowered again. Cain would simply crush Kril. He beat him by outsmarting him which has no bearing on his battle with Firelord here. He's still a vicious child and Firelord has the power cosmic and experience on him. Firelord wins.

jalek moye

The trillion ton thing is being thrown around way too much. He only got that high from absorbing Worldbreaker hulk's footsteps. which isn't a normal occurance at all.

Stoic

Originally posted by quanchi112
He beat him by outsmarting him which has no bearing on his battle with Firelord here. He's still a vicious child and Firelord has the power cosmic and experience on him. Firelord wins.

Correction, he did outsmart him, but in no way was Cain overpowering him the way that Cain would overpower Kril. Firelord fights like a pansy, when he goes up against characters that fight like Skaar. For example when Morg punked him. Skaar would be all over him, and the Old Power is a force in the universe as well.

quanchi112

Originally posted by Stoic
Correction, he did outsmart him, but in no way was Cain overpowering him the way that Cain would overpower Kril. Firelord fights like a pansy, when he goes up against characters that fight like Skaar. For example when Morg punked him. Skaar would be all over him, and the Old Power is a force in the universe as well. Firelord has went rounds with Thor who'd walk the dog on Skaar. Morg would also beat Skaar and outsmarting a dumb juggs isn't helping him against firelord.

Stoic

Originally posted by quanchi112
Firelord has went rounds with Thor who'd walk the dog on Skaar. Morg would also beat Skaar and outsmarting a dumb juggs isn't helping him against firelord.

You're so wrong, I meant that Morg's style of combat is Kril's weak spot. Firelord is more of an energy wielder than a brawler, while Skaar would waste no time in cutting his head off. Besides Thor beat Firelord, would Thor beat Skaar who happens to be a little kid? Yes he would, but Skaar would get his licks in, he'd likely do better against Thor than Firelord did.

Skaar physically beat Cain with sheer might by punching him into outer space, Firelord would nevr be able to do that, and would be crushed in the process. Like I said Skaar is Kril's physical superior, possesses the Old Power which is a universal force on its own, and he is immune to fire. Firelord has flight and the power cosmic which he uses to hurl fire. Let's remove the fire because it won't hurt Skaar, he was born in fire.

Let's break it down.

Strength

Skaar vs Firelord = Skaar is stronger, and hits harder.

Power

Firelord vs Skaar = Firelord has the Power Cosmic which he uses to burn things up. This as I said above would have little effect on Skaar, as he is immune to fire. Skaar has the Old Power coupled with true class 100 stats which includes a high durability threshold, and would most certainly hurt Firelord if he hit him with 100 trillion tons of force.

Speed

Firelord vs Skaar = Firelord has flight and is faster than Skaar on these terms, but on the ground while not flying he is not a speedster like the Flash, Superman, Gladiator, Quick Silver, or any other number of characters. If he makes physical contact with Skaar, and it turned into a brawl, Skaar would rip him.

Skaar wins in all of the areas that matter, the only thing that Kril would be able to do is engage Skaar on a H2H basis, and he would lose. The differance between Skaar and Thor, is that Thor would use Mjnolnir to deflect Kril's blasts, while they would have little to no effect on Skaar.

celeyhyga17

Power Cosmic > Old Power

Firelord takes this for a large majority.

SuperiorTech

Firelord

janus77

Skaar, this really isn't about "Power Cosmic vs Old Power" (and they are both equally fundamental forces within the universe, it seems) but about a character whose attacks the opponent is immune to.

I can't see Firelord winning, but I can see Skaar ripping him to shreds with OP.

TheLordofMurder

If Firelord doesnt job and actually utilizes his powerset (his matter/energy manipulating powers in particular...which all of Galactus's heralds possess) then Skaar loses handedly...

quanchi112

Originally posted by Stoic
You're so wrong, I meant that Morg's style of combat is Kril's weak spot. Firelord is more of an energy wielder than a brawler, while Skaar would waste no time in cutting his head off. Besides Thor beat Firelord, would Thor beat Skaar who happens to be a little kid? Yes he would, but Skaar would get his licks in, he'd likely do better against Thor than Firelord did.

Skaar physically beat Cain with sheer might by punching him into outer space, Firelord would nevr be able to do that, and would be crushed in the process. Like I said Skaar is Kril's physical superior, possesses the Old Power which is a universal force on its own, and he is immune to fire. Firelord has flight and the power cosmic which he uses to hurl fire. Let's remove the fire because it won't hurt Skaar, he was born in fire.

Let's break it down.

Strength

Skaar vs Firelord = Skaar is stronger, and hits harder.

Power

Firelord vs Skaar = Firelord has the Power Cosmic which he uses to burn things up. This as I said above would have little effect on Skaar, as he is immune to fire. Skaar has the Old Power coupled with true class 100 stats which includes a high durability threshold, and would most certainly hurt Firelord if he hit him with 100 trillion tons of force.

Speed

Firelord vs Skaar = Firelord has flight and is faster than Skaar on these terms, but on the ground while not flying he is not a speedster like the Flash, Superman, Gladiator, Quick Silver, or any other number of characters. If he makes physical contact with Skaar, and it turned into a brawl, Skaar would rip him.

Skaar wins in all of the areas that matter, the only thing that Kril would be able to do is engage Skaar on a H2H basis, and he would lose. The differance between Skaar and Thor, is that Thor would use Mjnolnir to deflect Kril's blasts, while they would have little to no effect on Skaar. You need to see Firelord match up with Thor then. I mean Skaar was obviously nowhere near Juggs in terms of power that much was painfully evident.

Skaar outsmarted him which isn't the same thing as just hauling up and knocking him into orbit. You really didn't grasp the comic did you ?

Prove he's stronger.

Power cosmic does not translate into plain old fire. LOL.

You really have no clue about Firelord and more or less Skaar for that matter. Firelord has more experience, is faster, is more durable, and has the power cosmic which is far greater than old power.

SuperiorTech

http://thumbnails27.imagebam.com/11088/cd66a8110876380.jpg

Gecko4lif

Originally posted by Stoic
100 trillion tons of force.

You have no idea what your talking about do you?

King Castle

he thinks throwing a large number is superior then taking punches from some one that can devastate the planet...

i dont think he realizes that high 100+ tonner strength is still just high 100+ tonner strength.

all that means is skaar is in the high herald strength tier.

basically his feat just solidifies his placement without argument.

jalek moye

Originally posted by jalek moye
The 100 trillion ton thing is being thrown around way too much. He only got that high from absorbing Worldbreaker hulk's footsteps. which isn't a normal occurance at all.

All the other times prior to that he was never anywher enear that, not even when he tried to kill She Rulk an issue or two before hand.

WB Hulk caused so much sesmic activity that Skaar was able to redirect it into hmself and use it to strike. Which is why all the punches after that one were much less powerful.

zopzop

Guys you realize being "immune" to fire means nothing to Firelord right?

Firelord's "fire" isn't' really fire. It's a product of Galactus' Power Cosmic. You can't extinguish it with water, it doesn't require oxygen to "burn". It's not "fire".

Skaar being immune to fire won't help him vs Firelord's blasts. Not only is Firelord not "fire" he's the humanoid equivalent of a small star. He can manipulate heat, light, gravity, and the entire range of energy in the electromagnetic spectrum.

Also check the Firelord respect thread. Firelord has handled Thor way way better than the Silver Surfer has. He's casually swatted away Mjolnir as if it were a toy.

Skaar is gonna get hurt bad.

Ambient

Originally posted by zopzop
Guys you realize being "immune" to fire means nothing to Firelord right?

Firelord's "fire" isn't' really fire. It's a product of Galactus' Power Cosmic. You can't extinguish it with water, it doesn't require oxygen to "burn". It's not "fire".

Skaar being immune to fire won't help him vs Firelord's blasts. Not only is Firelord not "fire" he's the humanoid equivalent of a small star. He can manipulate heat, light, gravity, and the entire range of energy in the electromagnetic spectrum.

Also check the Firelord respect thread. Firelord has handled Thor way way better than the Silver Surfer has. He's casually swatted away Mjolnir as if it were a toy.

Skaar is gonna get hurt bad.

Originally posted by SuperiorTech
http://thumbnails27.imagebam.com/11088/cd66a8110876380.jpg

WIN!!!

quanchi112

Black bolt z

mmm

If firelord fights like not an idiot he should win.

Stoic

Originally posted by quanchi112
You need to see Firelord match up with Thor then. I mean Skaar was obviously nowhere near Juggs in terms of power that much was painfully evident.

Skaar outsmarted him which isn't the same thing as just hauling up and knocking him into orbit. You really didn't grasp the comic did you ?

Prove he's stronger.

Power cosmic does not translate into plain old fire. LOL.

You really have no clue about Firelord and more or less Skaar for that matter. Firelord has more experience, is faster, is more durable, and has the power cosmic which is far greater than old power.

Prove that the Power Cosmic is greater than the Old Power. Galactus took one sip of it, and would have slept for thousands of years this knowledge alone should allow you to realize that the Old Power is a universal force. Prove that Skar would be affected by Firelord's blasts before Skaar could retaliate in kind. Firelord is not a speedster, if he went toe to toe with Skaar he would lose. Marvel handbooks stated that Firelord could press a maximum weight of 70 tons. Skaar unamped was stated to be able to press 90, but when he uses the Old Power to amp he becomes a true class 100. Is that proof enough for you? Probably not, but the figures are all there, and they clearly state that Skaar is stronger, and he's just a kid to boot.

How long did it take Thor to break through Firelord's defenses and have him on the ropes in their fight? Not too long. How many times has the Surfer jobbed to those less than he is? Respect threads are just that, they only highlight the characters best moments and ignore their worst. Using them as a means to debate a point is useless because they only tell half the truth.

Stoic

Originally posted by jalek moye
All the other times prior to that he was never anywher enear that, not even when he tried to kill She Rulk an issue or two before hand.

WB Hulk caused so much sesmic activity that Skaar was able to redirect it into hmself and use it to strike. Which is why all the punches after that one were much less powerful.

And yet he was able to move while harnessing that much force, let alone throw a punch. Skaar was clearly weighed down by the force in question. What does this say about his strength level? Betty isn't exactly a weakling in her Hulk form either.

jalek moye

Not saying hes weak but its quite clear that his old power ampring was clearly stronger form absorbing hulks footsteps. Which it even says he was absorbing in the comic

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Stoic
Prove that the Power Cosmic is greater than the Old Power.

Surfer pwnd Skaar and stripped him of the Old Power.
Galactus pwnd the whole freeakin Old Power planet.

Originally posted by Stoic
Galactus took one sip of it, and would have slept for thousands of years this knowledge alone should allow you to realize that the Old Power is a universal force.

It's like saying cocaine is more powerful than a nuke because a scientist who worked on the Manhattan project got addicted to it.

Galactus liking the taste of the Old Power had zero relevance about how powerful the Old Power is.

Originally posted by Stoic
Prove that Skar would be affected by Firelord's blasts before Skaar could retaliate in kind. Firelord is not a speedster, if he went toe to toe with Skaar he would lose.

Firelord can fly and can just blast Skaar before he can even get close enough to unleash anything.

Also, FYI, 100 trillion tons is nothing compared to the Planet busting power of the Galactus heralds (w/c even the weakest herald has demonstrated).

Originally posted by Stoic
Marvel handbooks stated that Firelord could press a maximum weight of 70 tons. Skaar unamped was stated to be able to press 90, but when he uses the Old Power to amp he becomes a true class 100. Is that proof enough for you? Probably not, but the figures are all there, and they clearly state that Skaar is stronger, and he's just a kid to boot.

We don't go by MU handbooks to determine power levels. And the PC has been shown to amp the strength of their users just as much as the OP has.

Skaar being a kid really has no relevance to this debate.

Originally posted by Stoic
How long did it take Thor to break through Firelord's defenses and have him on the ropes in their fight? Not too long. How many times has the Surfer jobbed to those less than he is? Respect threads are just that, they only highlight the characters best moments and ignore their worst. Using them as a means to debate a point is useless because they only tell half the truth.

Respect threads show what characters are capable of. Firelord has multiple feats that place him easily at herald level. Many of it has to do with him taking it to high heralds like Surfer or Thor. The only thing Skaar has is his 100 trillion ton feat, w/c IMO falls short of the mid-top end feats of the high heralds that Firelord has taken on.

quanchi112

Originally posted by Stoic
Prove that the Power Cosmic is greater than the Old Power. Galactus took one sip of it, and would have slept for thousands of years this knowledge alone should allow you to realize that the Old Power is a universal force. Prove that Skar would be affected by Firelord's blasts before Skaar could retaliate in kind. Firelord is not a speedster, if he went toe to toe with Skaar he would lose. Marvel handbooks stated that Firelord could press a maximum weight of 70 tons. Skaar unamped was stated to be able to press 90, but when he uses the Old Power to amp he becomes a true class 100. Is that proof enough for you? Probably not, but the figures are all there, and they clearly state that Skaar is stronger, and he's just a kid to boot.

How long did it take Thor to break through Firelord's defenses and have him on the ropes in their fight? Not too long. How many times has the Surfer jobbed to those less than he is? Respect threads are just that, they only highlight the characters best moments and ignore their worst. Using them as a means to debate a point is useless because they only tell half the truth. It's obvious it is based on how the old power just corrupts you and is only usable when on the ground anyways.

I don't have to prove that we've seen far less affect Skaar and we saw how weak he was in comparison to Juggs. He had to outsmart him which showed how less powerful he is against a heavy hitter such as Juggs.

Surfer also pwned Skaar like nothing in combat. Pc is far greater than the old power you'd have to be slow to think otherwise. Galactus was corrupted by the old power but he annihilated any in his way as would the Surfer.

Firelord has stalemated Thor before who is more powerful than Skaar by a mile, a better warrior, more experience, and in the hundred class.

You make no sense Skaar was not in the same league as the Surfer and neither was he against Juggs. He's just not up to par yet. You can't ignore respect threads either you really don't have a clue about Firelord and thought his fire was like normal fire. Getover your Hulk faimly lust this guy loses.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by quanchi112
You can't ignore respect threads either you really don't have a clue about Firelord and thought his fire was like normal fire.

I was thinking this as well. A LOT of ppl seems to have forgetten that Firelord's flame really isn't normal fire but cosmic flame (and thus would affect Skaar).

quanchi112

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
I was thinking this as well. A LOT of ppl seems to have forgetten that Firelord's flame really isn't normal fire but cosmic flame (and thus would affect Skaar). Him suggesting it's just regular flame shows he really don't know much if anything about Firelord.

Silent Guardian

With the old power Skaar is up their with Hulk and Juggs. I say 6/10 for Skaar.

Firelord is not the best he use to be.

quanchi112

Originally posted by Silent Guardian
With the old power Skaar is up their with Hulk and Juggs. I say 6/10 for Skaar.

Firelord is not the best he use to be. I don't see him being up there with either and with Juggs it was clear he had no chance unless he can outsmart him. In a forum you can't trick the guy into being your friend and then beating him.

Silent Guardian

Originally posted by quanchi112
I don't see him being up there with either and with Juggs it was clear he had no chance unless he can outsmart him. In a forum you can't trick the guy into being your friend and then beating him.

What has Firelord done since Annihilation? Has he done anything recently?

If Skaar uses the Old Power, he can boost his strength to levels so high, that he can break through the Juggernaut's armor. He sent Cain flying into the atmosphere, something that not even his father has accomplished.

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/5/57606/1203976-skaar_super.jpg

And he broke that Hulk Buster armor that the Hulk never busted before.

I think the surprise attack gets overplayed. His hit was really good.

His durability can also be increased to levels so high that only substances such as Titanium, Vibranium or Adamantium can penetrate his skin. I think he could endure the cosmic flame blasts for a little bit amped by the old power

As well as boosting most of his physical attributes to incredible levels, he can use the Old Power to manipulate the Earth (as long as he's touching the ground). Look what his brother did to Galactus. In my mind Old Power is up there with the power cosmic. Didn't Hiro Kala threaten to destroy earth, so he is around planet busting level. Therefore, potentially Skaar has it in him too.[

quanchi112

Originally posted by Silent Guardian
What has Firelord done since Annihilation? Has he done anything recently?

If Skaar uses the Old Power, he can boost his strength to levels so high, that he can break through the Juggernaut's armor. He sent Cain flying into the atmosphere, something that not even his father has accomplished.

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/5/57606/1203976-skaar_super.jpg

And he broke that Hulk Buster armor that the Hulk never busted before.

I think the surprise attack gets overplayed. His hit was really good.

His durability can also be increased to levels so high that only substances such as Titanium, Vibranium or Adamantium can penetrate his skin. I think he could endure the cosmic flame blasts for a little bit amped by the old power

As well as boosting most of his physical attributes to incredible levels, he can use the Old Power to manipulate the Earth (as long as he's touching the ground). Look what his brother did to Galactus. In my mind Old Power is up there with the power cosmic. Didn't Hiro Kala threaten to destroy earth, so he is around planet busting level. Therefore, potentially Skaar has it in him too. What does it matter what he's done since ? we saw when he did prior to and during we don't need to have current feats to judge these matches on alone while ignoring the past bazillion.

He tricked Juggs to keep his guard down and then when he didn't expect it launched him. It's like arguing WW Hulk beats strange based on him tricking him to turn tangible so he can break his hands. This trickery doesn't fly in the forums.

His brother poisoned him he didn't defeat him in battle. Surfer also schooled skaar quite easily and skaar tricked him too since he's a nice guy and all. Skaar isn't tricking firelord so he loses.

King Castle

i dont see how Hiro Kala has any bearing in this thread...

http://dailypop.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/hirokala_detail.jpg

Silent Guardian

Originally posted by quanchi112
What does it matter what he's done since ? we saw when he did prior to and during we don't need to have current feats to judge these matches on alone while ignoring the past bazillion.

He tricked Juggs to keep his guard down and then when he didn't expect it launched him. It's like arguing WW Hulk beats strange based on him tricking him to turn tangible so he can break his hands. This trickery doesn't fly in the forums.

His brother poisoned him he didn't defeat him in battle. Surfer also schooled skaar quite easily and skaar tricked him too since he's a nice guy and all. Skaar isn't tricking firelord so he loses.

I don't know Firelord was never known as the smart Herald.

Didn't Spider-Man trick him in their throw down issue? I don't recall it perfectly. Obviously I'm not going using that fight as an example of Fire Lord's abilities, but I'm pretty sure Spider-Man punked him before he laid the smack down on him.

And that Shi'ar guy tricked him into fighting the X-men. Its safe to say Firelord doesn't have Juggy's street smarts.

Skaar maybe young but he is pretty clever

jalek moye

Originally posted by Silent Guardian
What has Firelord done since Annihilation? Has he done anything recently?

If Skaar uses the Old Power, he can boost his strength to levels so high, that he can break through the Juggernaut's armor. He sent Cain flying into the atmosphere, something that not even his father has accomplished.

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/5/57606/1203976-skaar_super.jpg

And he broke that Hulk Buster armor that the Hulk never busted before.

I think the surprise attack gets overplayed. His hit was really good.

His durability can also be increased to levels so high that only substances such as Titanium, Vibranium or Adamantium can penetrate his skin. I think he could endure the cosmic flame blasts for a little bit amped by the old power

As well as boosting most of his physical attributes to incredible levels, he can use the Old Power to manipulate the Earth (as long as he's touching the ground). Look what his brother did to Galactus. In my mind Old Power is up there with the power cosmic. Didn't Hiro Kala threaten to destroy earth, so he is around planet busting level. Therefore, potentially Skaar has it in him too.

He only broke Banner's armor because it absorbed gamma and he was usning old power. Not because he was stronger then hulk. Unless there is a more recent example.

Also plenty of peopel have broken Juggs armor, and seeing as Cain was fallign when he got punched it's no wher enear as good as just flat out uppercutting him in the fight.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Silent Guardian
I don't know Firelord was never known as the smart Herald.

Didn't Spider-Man trick him in their throw down issue? I don't recall it perfectly. Obviously I'm not going using that fight as an example of Fire Lord's abilities, but I'm pretty sure Spider-Man punked him before he laid the smack down on him.

And that Shi'ar guy tricked him into fighting the X-men. Its safe to say Firelord doesn't have Juggy's street smarts.

Skaar maybe young but he is pretty clever

Wow. With all due respect, is there anything relevant in this post of yours that would actually have any bearing on the outcome of this fight? Everything you posted above is completely irrelevant. sad

quanchi112

Originally posted by Silent Guardian
I don't know Firelord was never known as the smart Herald.

Didn't Spider-Man trick him in their throw down issue? I don't recall it perfectly. Obviously I'm not going using that fight as an example of Fire Lord's abilities, but I'm pretty sure Spider-Man punked him before he laid the smack down on him.

And that Shi'ar guy tricked him into fighting the X-men. Its safe to say Firelord doesn't have Juggy's street smarts.

Skaar maybe young but he is pretty clever Firelord isn't an idiot like Cain Marko that's for sure.

I dunno that gets ignored on here but I never actually read it.

People can get tricked in comics but in a vs. thread he won't drop his guard and start having a heart to heart with Firelord like he did against Juggs is my point.

To use the old power he has to catch him on the ground, right ?

Silent Guardian

Originally posted by quanchi112

To use the old power he has to catch him on the ground, right ?

correct

quanchi112

Originally posted by Silent Guardian
correct Firelord usually doesn't stay on the ground.

Stoic

Originally posted by quanchi112
Firelord usually doesn't stay on the ground.

Unless he's fighting a grounded opponent, am I correct? When he fought Drax on the ground was he zipping around like Tinker Bell? When he fought Spiderman and was KO'd was he flying around? You keep talking in a forum setting this and that would not happen, while trying to say that you will not ignore the personality of the characters in question, yet you go on to ignore them all the same.

So let me get this straight, if Juggernaut is falling towards you this somehow makes him vulnerable? If this is the case, I guess if he fell from orbit it would kill him right? Downplaying Skaar's punching power is pretty devious, and has the taint of what people call an act of trolling.

For you to state that I favor the Hulk may be a true statement Quanchi, but I know when to say when the Hulk or a Hulk would lose. You on the other hand believe that Thanos would beat anyone, and I have never seen you admit that anyone under Galactus could beat him. When Morg was taking it to him, and nearly killed him, you may have even developed acute blindness, and somehow missed the panel showing that had Thanos not grabbed a weapon, that Morg would have killed him. Then again the pot has called the kettle black in the past.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Wow. With all due respect, is there anything relevant in this post of yours that would actually have any bearing on the outcome of this fight? Everything you posted above is completely irrelevant. sad

Just because someone states that Firelord would hurt Skaar with his cosmic flame does not make it a fact. The Power Cosmic is not magic, it's science, and therefore affects the fictional Marvel Universe differently than a blast of magical hellfire from the Ghost Rider would. Skaar would be just fine, because although the Power Cosmic is powerful, it is still fundamentally within the realms of physical science. I hope this clears thing up a bit so that people can stop using it as some form of a trump device. Besides who said that while in Old Power form that Firelord would ever get the chance to hurt Skaar?

quanchi112

Originally posted by Stoic
Unless he's fighting a grounded opponent, am I correct? When he fought Drax on the ground was he zipping around like Tinker Bell? When he fought Spiderman and was KO'd was he flying around? You keep talking in a forum setting this and that would not happen, while trying to say that you will not ignore the personality of the characters in question, yet you go on to ignore them all the same.

So let me get this straight, if Juggernaut is falling towards you this somehow makes him vulnerable? If this is the case, I guess if he fell from orbit it would kill him right? Downplaying Skaar's punching power is pretty devious, and has the taint of what people call an act of trolling.

For you to state that I favor the Hulk may be a true statement Quanchi, but I know when to say when the Hulk or a Hulk would lose. You on the other hand believe that Thanos would beat anyone, and I have never seen you admit that anyone under Galactus could beat him. When Morg was taking it to him, and nearly killed him, you may have even developed acute blindness, and somehow missed the panel showing that had Thanos not grabbed a weapon, that Morg would have killed him. Then again the pot has called the kettle black in the past.

Just because someone states that Firelord would hurt Skaar with his cosmic flame does not make it a fact. The Power Cosmic is not magic, it's science, and therefore affects the fictional Marvel Universe differently than a blast of magical hellfire from the Ghost Rider would. Skaar would be just fine, because although the Power Cosmic is powerful, it is still fundamentally within the realms of physical science. I hope this clears thing up a bit so that people can stop using it as some form of a trump device. Besides who said that while in Old Power form that Firelord would ever get the chance to hurt Skaar? He flies as well not saying he won't ever be on the ground but the guy is very fast and flies around a lot too.

He talked to juggs and got him to lower his guard and then tricked him. Did you miss that part ? Do you think he will become friends with firelord and then hit him when he turns around....seriously ?

Speculation and Thanos did grab a weapon and easily subdued Morg with one blast.

You have no grasp of the power cosmic and act like it's real or something. Someone already posted a scan where they state it's not like regular fire yet you ignore it.

Stoic

Originally posted by quanchi112
He flies as well not saying he won't ever be on the ground but the guy is very fast and flies around a lot too.

He talked to juggs and got him to lower his guard and then tricked him. Did you miss that part ? Do you think he will become friends with firelord and then hit him when he turns around....seriously ?

Speculation and Thanos did grab a weapon and easily subdued Morg with one blast.

You have no grasp of the power cosmic and act like it's real or something. Someone already posted a scan where they state it's not like regular fire yet you ignore it.

Thor stood and spoke to Cain as well before slamming Mjolnir full force into Cain's face, and this did nothing to Cain. Just the fact that Skaar punched Cain into orbit is a direct testament of his strength and durability. This however was downplayed as if it wasn't a feat at all. I never saw Colossus pull anything out of his ass like that. I'm sure your next statement will be about how Firelord's flames will hurt Skaar even though they aren't magical they are physical. So are you trying to say that Galactus is a magical being when time and agin it has been stated that he is a being of science? What's it gonna be?

jalek moye

He punched Cain into ordbit while he was fallign from the sky. While it's a feat but it's not like all of a sudden he's the strognest guy on earth because of that feat. When someone is in the air it's easier to knock them higher especially since the whoel point of that comic was showing how his unstoppability means nothing in the air. It wasn't him overpowering Cain at all, he didn't hurt cain just did another way of BFR.

Stoic

Originally posted by jalek moye
He punched Cain into ordbit while he was fallign from the sky. While it's a feat but it's not like all of a sudden he's the strognest guy on earth because of that feat. When someone is in the air it's easier to knock them higher especially since the whoel point of that comic was showing how his unstoppability means nothing in the air. It wasn't him overpowering Cain at all, he didn't hurt cain just did another way of BFR.

Oh I know this, but I also know that Firelord would feel a punch like that, and as is his character would fly back pissed to all heavens and get into a slug it out, and be trounced. Power Cosmic flame huh? I guess everyone forgot about the time when Hercules took a full Nova blast from Nova another PC user and walked through it without even losing his hair. What about when Drax walked through it like it was nothing? Is it possible that a guy that is immune to heat could also walk right through it?

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Stoic
I'm sure your next statement will be about how Firelord's flames will hurt Skaar even though they aren't magical they are physical. So are you trying to say that Galactus is a magical being when time and agin it has been stated that he is a being of science? What's it gonna be?

/facepalm

The flames aren't NORMAL flames. They are COSMIC flames. Able to affect those with immunities to fire. Read the freakin scan. Jeeeeeeeeeeez!

Prep-Man

What beings has Firelord affected with his cosmic flames?

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Prep-Man
What beings has Firelord affected with his cosmic flames?

Originally posted by SuperiorTech
http://thumbnails27.imagebam.com/11088/cd66a8110876380.jpg

Stoic

Originally posted by Prep-Man
What beings has Firelord affected with his cosmic flames?

The Silver Surfer. I'm not downplaying Kril, but to say that it's an auto win because he is a PC user is BS. On top of this Skaar is immune to heat. It may affect him but he would not take full damage, and with his HF dealing with the rest that got through what are his chances of weathering Firelord's blasts long enough to get in his own hits?

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Stoic
The Silver Surfer. I'm not downplaying Kril, but to say that it's an auto win because he is a PC user is BS. On top of this Skaar is immune to heat. It may affect him but he would not take full damage, and with his HF dealing with the rest that got through what are his chances of weathering Firelord's blasts long enough to get in his own hits?

Skaar's immunity to heat is irrelevant here as even those immune to heat (the Surfer) has been known to be hurt by Firelord's attacks.

Heralds have been know to destroy entire planets. Firelord has more than enough firepower to hurt Skaar sufficiently to take him down.

Firelord also flies and it is PURE PIS BS that he stood on the ground as Spiderman was beating on him as well as story-driven why he allowed himself to be beaten-on by Drax (where he wasn't even really fighting back til near the end). Forum rules dictate that he fights to the best of his abilities, thus it is more than likely he will blast Skaar from the air (like he did quite a few times during Annihilation).

Stoic

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Skaar's immunity to heat is irrelevant here as even those immune to heat (the Surfer) has been known to be hurt by Firelord's attacks.

Heralds have been know to destroy entire planets. Firelord has more than enough firepower to hurt Skaar sufficiently to take him down.

Firelord also flies and it is PURE PIS BS that he stood on the ground as Spiderman was beating on him as well as story-driven why he allowed himself to be beaten-on by Drax (where he wasn't even really fighting back til near the end). Forum rules dictate that he fights to the best of his abilities, thus it is more than likely he will blast Skaar from the air (like he did quite a few times during Annihilation).

Or he may be in character, Superman could blitz attack every opponent that he faces, and use his full array of powers in every fight, but he doesn't, and guys like Lobo, Eiling, Grundy, Konvikt... etc have beaten him. We can't just use the characters powers, and dismiss the characters mindset now can we? Firelord is a hot head, and when he does not get an insta win over his opponent he reverts to type. It is not irrelevant to say that a guy that is immune to heat could take Firelords blasts. The PC is a physical force it is not a magical one like Ghost Riders flames, or hell fire. No what you have stated is full of holes and pure speculation. There is absolutely no proof that his flame attack would hurt Skaar yet alone put him down, while ther is more proof that Skaar would weather such an assault and put Firelord through the paces. Skaar would win, because in the end it would be about character attitude and less about what the character could do. This would turn into a slug fest, and Kril would lose.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Stoic
Or he may be in character, Superman could blitz attack every opponent that he faces, and use his full array of powers in every fight, but he doesn't, and guys like Lobo, Eiling, Grundy, Konvikt... etc have beaten him. We can't just use the characters powers, and dismiss the characters mindset now can we? Firelord is a hot head, and when he does not get an insta win over his opponent he reverts to type. It is not irrelevant to say that a guy that is immune to heat could take Firelords blasts. The PC is a physical force it is not a magical one like Ghost Riders flames, or hell fire. No what you have stated is full of holes and pure speculation. There is absolutely no proof that his flame attack would hurt Skaar yet alone put him down, while ther is more proof that Skaar would weather such an assault and put Firelord through the paces.

A few items to think about:
-Firelord has engaged in ranged attacks more than he's engaged in hand-to-hand. Top of my mind, I can name 4 instances in Annihilation alone where he peppers his opponents form long range rather than engage in melee. Also, pointing out TWO instances where he's engaged in h2h wherein one is PURE PIS and the other is story-based is a poor way of debating.
-Surfer is about as immune to fire as Skaar is. At least feat-wise they've both been demonstrated to have the same level of heat resistance. Firelord's been able to affect him quite fine. Thing is, Firelord's flame attacks are more cosmic energy blasts that look like flame than they are actual flames. It is more logical for the cosmic flames to affect Skaar than it is to argue that they would not.
-Your argument is just ASSUMING that Firelord would engage in melee combat to allow Skaar to win. That, in itself, is a poor argument.

Originally posted by Stoic
Skaar would win, because in the end it would be about character attitude and less about what the character could do. This would turn into a slug fest, and Kril would lose.

Whaaaaaat? It's because of CIS that Skaar would win you mean? Don't think so. Pointing out 2 instances where Kril enganged in melee (especially since there is CONTEXT in both instances) doesn't establish his character as a melee slugger. That doesn't make sense at all.

Stoic

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
A few items to think about:
-Firelord has engaged in ranged attacks more than he's engaged in hand-to-hand. Top of my mind, I can name 4 instances in Annihilation alone where he peppers his opponents form long range rather than engage in melee. Also, pointing out TWO instances where he's engaged in h2h wherein one is PURE PIS and the other is story-based is a poor way of debating.
-Surfer is about as immune to fire as Skaar is. At least feat-wise they've both been demonstrated to have the same level of heat resistance. Firelord's been able to affect him quite fine. Thing is, Firelord's flame attacks are more cosmic energy blasts that look like flame than they are actual flames. It is more logical for the cosmic flames to affect Skaar than it is to argue that they would not.
-Your argument is just ASSUMING that Firelord would engage in melee combat to allow Skaar to win. That, in itself, is a poor argument.

Whaaaaaat? It's because of CIS that Skaar would win you mean? Don't think so. Pointing out 2 instances where Kril enganged in melee (especially since there is CONTEXT in both instances) doesn't establish his character as a melee slugger. That doesn't make sense at all.

Are you forgetting his battles with Thor, and how physical those battles became? That would be three more instances. What about Skaar makes you or anyone else believe that he is a static object that would remain still, and take a constant barrage of fire blasts? How much does anyone know about how the Old Power works? Could the Old Power deflect the Power Cosmic? Caiera was unaffected by cosmic based parasites known as the Spikes. How can anyone state that because Norrin was effected by Firelord's blasts that they would effect Skaar an Old Power user that uses it to amplify his personal body armor? He also has a very good healing factor like his fathers. As far as I'm concerned Skaar would do just fine against Firelord, and perhaps even cause Kril to doubt the effectiveness of his particular cosmic abilities.

We can't blindly compare Firelords gifts to the Surfer's, because they aren't the same. Nor should anyone blindly stumble onto the conclusion that because the Surfer could beat Skaar, that it gives Firelord, or Terrax, a free kick Skaar's @$$ pass. I simply don't buy it, firelord should not be able to hurt Skaar with his cosmic flame, simply because Skaar's resistance to this sort of attack is not due only to the fact that he is a gamma spawn, but it is also due to the Old Power that dwells within him, and would protect him from the PC like it would protect him from the cosmically powered spike parasites.

Skaar could also destroy a planet with his Old Power, just had to put that in there.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Stoic
Are you forgetting his battles with Thor, and how physical those battles became? That would be three more instances.

Thor can fly and can attack at range, thus his approach in fighting someone like Thor would be different from someone like Skaar (who cannot fly and needs to be on the ground).

If you and your opponent could fly, you would no doubt engage your opponent with ALL your abilities. If you could fly and your opponent could not, wouldn't you just use your ranged abilities?

Originally posted by Stoic
What about Skaar makes you or anyone else believe that he is a static object that would remain still, and take a constant barrage of fire blasts? How much does anyone know about how the Old Power works? Could the Old Power deflect the Power Cosmic? Caiera was unaffected by cosmic based parasites known as the Spikes. How can anyone state that because Norrin was effected by Firelord's blasts that they would effect Skaar an Old Power user that uses it to amplify his personal body armor? He also has a very good healing factor like his fathers. As far as I'm concerned Skaar would do just fine against Firelord, and perhaps even cause Kril to doubt the effectiveness of his particular cosmic abilities.

-And what makes you think Kril is this uber moron that would stand and trade wherein he can just (and has) simply blast Skaar from the sky?
-Not many knows except the writers, but what we DO know is that Skaar has been hurt by much less than planet smashing power that heralds have. Stating that the OP MIGHT somehow grant him the ability to deflect the PC is pure speculation.
-The Spikes don't have the PC so I don't know what relevance they have here. :-/
-And what has this "body armor" protected him from before? Post scans pls.
-The point is that we CANNOT treat the flames Firelord generates as standard heat/flame.
-Healing factor won't let him stay up against planet-busting power forever.
-Kril is not Gladiator, his power doesn't go up and down based on his confidence. That "doubting his effectiveness" statement has zero relevance here.

Originally posted by Stoic
We can't blindly compare Firelords gifts to the Surfer's, because they aren't the same. Nor should anyone blindly stumble onto the conclusion that because the Surfer could beat Skaar, that it gives Firelord, or Terrax, a free kick Skaar's @$$ pass. I simply don't buy it, firelord should not be able to hurt Skaar with his cosmic flame, simply because Skaar's resistance to this sort of attack is not due only to the fact that he is a gamma spawn, but it is also due to the Old Power that dwells within him, and would protect him from the PC like it would protect him from the cosmically powered spike parasites.

-Both Firelord and the Surfer gained their powers from Galactus, thus their powers have many similarities. Tho the Surfer is more adept and more powerful than Kril, doesn't mean we cannot draw parallels about HOW their power
s work.
-I only mentioned the Surfer instance because you asked for proof about the comparison between the PC and OP.
-MY point was that Galactus heralds have shown the power output to destroy planets. 100 trillion ton power is nothing compared to that. And it is due to POWER OUTPUT and the tactical advantaged of range and flight is what gives Firelord the easy win here.
-Again, the spikes =/= the PC. Last I heard, Galactus didn't empower a race of cosmic ticks with the Power Cosmic. :-/

Originally posted by Stoic
Skaar could also destroy a planet with his Old Power, just had to put that in there.

When has he done this? Pls present scans.

Solidus Black

Firelord is a herald of Galactus with countless powers. if he got into fisticuffs with Skarr and lost, he would deserve it.

I would like to think his molecular powers would be of some use to him

Firelord with sense should win

StiltmanFTW

Firelord: "Yyragh! He hits harder than SPIDER-MAN!!!"

Solidus Black

And as far as i know Firelord's flame isnt just "fire"

It is fire amplified by the power cosmic and it can give surfer pause

celeyhyga17

Firelord's showings during Annihilation showed he is almost exclusively a range fighter. I know this much, Skaar ain't beatin a range fighter with herald level fire power.

Solidus Black

^^This

Firelord can snipe and matter manipulate to his hearts content.

Skaar is pudding

Stoic

The Spikes were and are cosmically powered parasites. They were unable to infect an Old Power user.

Skaar could have destroyed the planet if he had not stopped when he was siphoning power from the tectonic plates.

When has Firelord ever destroyed a planet, show me scans please, because I never saw it.

Firelord has been defeated by far less than planet destroying powers, in Annihilation a space barge filled with thugs whooped his @$$.

Yes Spiderman punched him out. So if we're going to go solely on low showings we might as well use the entire can.

Flight has never given anyone a decisive victory so please don't cling to this tripe as a means of Firelord winning. Should I give examples of flyers losing to people who could not fly?

Dumb Drax with the Power Gem was unable to beat Professor Hulk, and he would have killed Firelord if they really went at it for a period of time. Skaar IMO would defeat Professor Hulk. Skaar is on the level. All of this talk about Firelord turning Skaar into mud is BS. Prove that his PC flames can hurt Skaar. The Surfer is not Skaar nor is he an Old Power user.

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by Stoic
The Spikes were and are cosmically powered parasites. They were unable to infect an Old Power user.

Skaar could have destroyed the planet if he had not stopped when he was siphoning power from the tectonic plates.

When has Firelord ever destroyed a planet, show me scans please, because I never saw it.

Firelord has been defeated by far less than planet destroying powers, in Annihilation a space barge filled with thugs whooped his @$$.

Yes Spiderman punched him out. So if we're going to go solely on low showings we might as well use the entire can.

Flight has never given anyone a decisive victory so please don't cling to this tripe as a means of Firelord winning. Should I give examples of flyers losing to people who could not fly?

Dumb Drax with the Power Gem was unable to beat Professor Hulk, and he would have killed Firelord if they really went at it for a period of time. Skaar IMO would defeat Professor Hulk. Skaar is on the level. All of this talk about Firelord turning Skaar into mud is BS. Prove that his PC flames can hurt Skaar. The Surfer is not Skaar nor is he an Old Power user.

-Spikes =/= Power Cosmic. Geez.

-Causing a chain reaction that MAY cause a planet to be destroyed =/= destroying a planet thru sheer power.

-He destroys a meteor the size of a small planet:
http://img42.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc199&image=79605_meteorr.jpg

-Ummm. If you're talking about him being KOd after he uses up the last of his energies to destroy the main mothership of the fleet AFTER he's drained himself from destroying the majority of the fleet as some sort of low durability showing for Firelord, then I don't really knw what to say here.... :-/

-Spiderman feat had CONTEXT (Firelord was weakened) AND is widely considered PIS. The fact that you bring it up shows the desperation of your argument.

-Actually, FLIGHT + RANGE can easily give one a decisive victory. Flight only loses its effectiveness when: A) the flyers are melee brawlers and must engage in melee combat. B) the nonflyer has a ranged attack. C) MAJOR PIS/CIS is invloved. None of w/c will be existing here. So HOW EXACTLY is Skaar winning this? Lemme guess, Firelord CONVENIENTLY lets him punch him in the face, right?

-Fact is, there is proof that points out that Kril's flames are not base fire/heat but are cosmically powered (and thus can affect heat/fire resistant targets). You insisting that Skaar's resistance to flame allows him immunity to something that is PROVEN to not be considered basic heat/fire is now simply desperate insistence.

quanchi112

Originally posted by Stoic
Thor stood and spoke to Cain as well before slamming Mjolnir full force into Cain's face, and this did nothing to Cain. Just the fact that Skaar punched Cain into orbit is a direct testament of his strength and durability. This however was downplayed as if it wasn't a feat at all. I never saw Colossus pull anything out of his ass like that. I'm sure your next statement will be about how Firelord's flames will hurt Skaar even though they aren't magical they are physical. So are you trying to say that Galactus is a magical being when time and agin it has been stated that he is a being of science? What's it gonna be? Yes, but Thor could take Cain head on a lot better than Skaar and Skaar gets more powerful as well so his amping doesn't really help him that much. WW Hulk took Juggs head on and easily sidestepped him after whipping him once and going through two teams.

No, it's a testament to him tricking him enough to gain the upper hand which isn't a valid reason on a vs. forum there is no story so no chance if them just talking before they engage each other.

It's the power cosmic which defies science so whether a writer deems them science in a comic or magical they still defy our knowledge of fire and the are still vastly hotter than the flames Skaar walked through.

zopzop

Originally posted by Stoic
On top of this Skaar is immune to heat.

Stoic, is it "immune to heat" or "immune to fire"? Just need to get a clarification on this.

SuperiorTech

Originally posted by zopzop
Stoic, is it "immune to heat" or "immune to fire"? Just need to get a clarification on this.

http://www.imagebam.com/image/e38dae97408879

zopzop

Originally posted by SuperiorTech
http://www.imagebam.com/image/e38dae97408879

So it's "immune to the effects of fire". So what about solar radiation, like that produced by stars (and available to Firelord)? That's not fire. I'm even more convinced now that Firelord would pwn him more often than not.

PS Thanks for that.

CosmicComet

Firelord flies at max speed thousands of times above the speed of light whilst shielding himself, Skaar will be unable to react and will explode.

K.

O.

psycho gundam

not sure what you guys were arguing about in the first few pages, firelord almost exclusively fires intense solar blasts at whomever he's up against.

skaar would be the one having to wade through it, not firelord coming to him.

and

Originally posted by Black bolt z
mmm

If firelord fights like not an idiot he should win.

lulz

janus77

Originally posted by zopzop
So it's "immune to the effects of fire". So what about solar radiation, like that produced by stars (and available to Firelord)? That's not fire. I'm even more convinced now that Firelord would pwn him more often than not.

PS Thanks for that.
I doubt any Hulk would be affected by solar (or any other) radiation.

but Skaar does have range attacks of his own (bolts of Old Power energy, I think) and the heat/fire of FL's flames should not affect Skaar too much.

I think it's too early to say one way or the other, given that we've only really established that Skaar is strong enough to knock the shit out of herald levellers (by going toe-to-toe for a few panels, with Hulk) and can definitely withstand their physical attacks (again, if he can take orbital tour punches from Hulk, that makes him friggin' durable).

aside from that we know he's immune to fire, can withstand being blown apart and can turn people/opponents to stone.

also, Firelord is nowhere near as powerful or effective as classic Surfer and Skaar battled current (more aggressive and powerful) Surfer for a fair while (though of course, Surfer held back and attempted to reason ..).

D_Dude1210

Originally posted by janus77
I doubt any Hulk would be affected by solar (or any other) radiation.

but Skaar does have range attacks of his own (bolts of Old Power energy, I think) and the heat/fire of FL's flames should not affect Skaar too much.

I think it's too early to say one way or the other, given that we've only really established that Skaar is strong enough to knock the shit out of herald levellers (by going toe-to-toe for a few panels, with Hulk) and can definitely withstand their physical attacks (again, if he can take orbital tour punches from Hulk, that makes him friggin' durable).

aside from that we know he's immune to fire, can withstand being blown apart and can turn people/opponents to stone.

also, Firelord is nowhere near as powerful or effective as classic Surfer and Skaar battled current (more aggressive and powerful) Surfer for a fair while (though of course, Surfer held back and attempted to reason ..).

Firelord's cosmic flame can be in the form of concussive force as well as heat/radiation. And I SERIOUSLY doubt that Skaar would be immune to it.

This is like you saying that the Surfer won't be able to hurt Skaar as well.

Let me seeee, the ONLY indicator you're using that Skaar would be able to beat herald levelers (like Firelord) is because he stood toe-to-toe with the Hulk? Seriously? This is all you got?

Firelord has been able to go toe-to-toe with the Surfer AND Thor. Both of whom operate at a higher level than the Hulk. Plus he has the tactical advantage of flight and a ranged attack. The ranged attacks Skaar's been able to demonstrate has been (IIRC) not that long ranged and really didn't do much.

Also, durability-wise, Firelord's been blasted clear out of a solar system. Beats orbital punches anyday.

The Surfer literally pimp-slapped Skaar and took his Old Power from him WHILE holding back and trying to reason with him. Firelord's done a WHOLE LOT better against the Surfer than Skaar ever did.

Honestly, I can't believe some ppl actually find a comparison here. I guess they look at the Spiderman PIS BS and automatically seriously lowvball Firelord based on that one dumb showing.

More Powerful. Just as durable. Faster. Tactical advantage of flight and a ranged attack. Honestly, this is a nonfight. Firelord wins 10/10.