Darth Maul vs. Darth Vader

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.



quanchi112
Who wins ?

Lord Lucien
We have a whole subforum dedicated to Star Wars versus matches.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
We have a whole subforum dedicated to Star Wars versus matches. Ah. Never been there before.

Rogue Jedi
Vader.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by quanchi112
Ah. Never been there before. Blasphemy!

But yeah, Vader in the Force and all-out department, but Maul in a Sabers-only match.

Rogue Jedi
Vader, presuit or postsuit?

truejedi
Thinking Vader wins either way actually.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Blasphemy!

But yeah, Vader in the Force and all-out department, but Maul in a Sabers-only match. How does Vader win ? what could he do with all his force powers that Maul couldn't account for with his skills with a light saber ?

Originally posted by truejedi
Thinking Vader wins either way actually. Based on ?

Rogue Jedi
Presuit Vader rapes Maul. Postsuit? Dunno.

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by quanchi112
Who wins ?

quan first set up some sort of scenario between the two..


Vader wins all out, but Maul wins in saber and MA skills

quanchi112
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Presuit Vader rapes Maul. Postsuit? Dunno. Just like he raped obi wan, right ?

quanchi112
Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
quan first set up some sort of scenario between the two..


Vader wins all out, but Maul wins in saber and MA skills All powers are available to them.

Pre suit.

Rogue Jedi
Originally posted by quanchi112
Just like he raped obi wan, right ? Just like Obi Wan raped Vader, right?

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by quanchi112
How does Vader win ? what could he do with all his force powers that Maul couldn't account for with his skills with a light saber ? Vader in the Expanded Universe has incredible skill with telekinesis. Maul's never been shown to have skill enough to counter someone of Vader's magnitude.

But if it came to just sabers, no offensive Force powers, Maul's got the speed, stamina, and unpredictable fighting style that will overwhelm Vader.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Just like Obi Wan raped Vader, right? He did win. He stalemated him and then Vader made such a critical stupid move. Vader is the luckiest character in star wars universe.

truejedi
ROTS era Kenobi never let anyone disarm him with a blade. As a swordsman, he is no slouch in defeating Anakin.

Rogue Jedi
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Vader in the Expanded Universe has incredible skill with telekinesis. Maul's never been shown to have skill enough to counter someone of Vader's magnitude.

But if it came to just sabers, no offensive Force powers, Maul's got the speed, stamina, and unpredictable fighting style that will overwhelm Vader. I'll go with the spicyweiner on this one.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Vader in the Expanded Universe has incredible skill with telekinesis. Maul's never been shown to have skill enough to counter someone of Vader's magnitude.

But if it came to just sabers, no offensive Force powers, Maul's got the speed, stamina, and unpredictable fighting style that will overwhelm Vader. This is movies only.

truejedi
Vader uses a lot more TK than Maul does in ROTS. We can give him a conclusive force win just using the movies.

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by quanchi112
All powers are available to them.

Pre suit.

ok..


QUOTE=13140115]Originally posted by Lord Lucien


But if it came to just sabers, no offensive Force powers, Maul's got the speed, stamina, and unpredictable fighting style that will overwhelm Vader.

yeah Maul certainly does

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by quanchi112
This is movies only. In your mind. But this properly belongs in the SWV forum, and there it's EU all the way.

But if you really wanna get technical, than yeah. Vader's too slow for Maul in the movies.

quanchi112
Originally posted by truejedi
Vader uses a lot more TK than Maul does in ROTS. We can give him a conclusive force win just using the movies. I seriously doubt tk would give him an advantage of someone as highly acrobatic and skilled as Maul.

Zampanó
Not over Mustafar Anakin.

Without the terrain caveat, AniVader would have demolished Kenobi. Maul is a much less conservative combatant, and the fight would last much less time.

truejedi
This is pre-suit Vader. He isn't too slow for Maul. Faster in his fight in ROTS than Maul is in his fight TPM (if you want to compare actual speed.)

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by quanchi112
I seriously doubt tk would give him an advantage of someone as highly acrobatic and skilled as Maul. One Force push sent an enraged Kenobi tumbling. Same shit can happen to Maul from an experienced Sith Lord like Vader.

quanchi112

truejedi
Originally posted by quanchi112
Not a chance. Maul took on two jedi's which included a younger obi but he beat them both.

That didn't happen to maul it happened to obi. Maul already crushed his master and fought two at once yet was still more than formidable enough to do so.


TPM Kenobi +QGJ are nowhere close to ROTS Anakin. Its not even a close comparison.

quanchi112
Originally posted by truejedi
TPM Kenobi +QGJ are nowhere close to ROTS Anakin. Its not even a close comparison. So what ? I think tp obi and qgj are greater than just rots obi. That's more than fair.

Maul took two on at once and won.

truejedi
Originally posted by quanchi112
So what ? I think tp obi and qgj are greater than just rots obi. That's more than fair.

Maul took two on at once and won.

TPM Kenobi and QGJ are greater than ROTS (I killed Grievous like a *****) Kenobi? That might be where your argument hit a hard place.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by quanchi112
Not a chance. Maul took on two jedi's which included a younger obi but he beat them both.

That didn't happen to maul it happened to obi. Maul already crushed his master and fought two at once yet was still more than formidable enough to do so. TPM Kenobi and Qui-Gon were utilizing a saber style not suited for such closed-in combat. Maul's double-bladed Juyo overwhelmed their Ataru. RotS Kenobi's Soresu (ultimate defensive form for which he was the all-time master of) wasn't enough to stop Vader's attacks. He only lived as long he did due to familiarity with Anakin's style. And he's a helluva more powerful/skilled/experienced than his TPM self.


Pre-suit Vader's ferocious Djem So saber style and ever-increasing strength as the the battle goes on (not to mention the power the Dark Side grants) will be too much for Maul to contend with. Only when Vader's been seriously hampered in the mobility department does Maul stand a good chance of beating him. Unless the Force is allowed offensively.

quanchi112
Originally posted by truejedi
TPM Kenobi and QGJ are greater than ROTS (I killed Grievous like a *****) Kenobi? That might be where your argument hit a hard place. Nah.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
TPM Kenobi and Qui-Gon were utilizing a saber style not suited for such closed-in combat. Maul's double-bladed Juyo overwhelmed their Ataru. RotS Kenobi's Soresu (ultimate defensive form for which he was the all-time master of) wasn't enough to stop Vader's attacks. He only lived as long he did due to familiarity with Anakin's style. And he's a helluva more powerful/skilled/experienced than his TPM self.


Pre-suit Vader's ferocious Djem So saber style and ever-increasing strength as the the battle goes on (not to mention the power the Dark Side grants) will be too much for Maul to contend with. Only when Vader's been seriously hampered in the mobility department does Maul stand a good chance of beating him. Unless the Force is allowed offensively. I didn't see anywhere near the athleticism from Vader anywhere pre suit like I did from Maul. Vader also seems to be far too emotional and make stupid decisions like he did against Obi. His impatience and anger will be his downfall.

I mean obi told him not to jump and he still did it anyways and was defeated through sheer stupidity because he's an emotional lunatic.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by quanchi112
Nah.

I didn't see anywhere near the athleticism from Vader anywhere pre suit like I did from Maul. Vader also seems to be far too emotional and make stupid decisions like he did against Obi. His impatience and anger will be his downfall.

I mean obi told him not to jump and he still did it anyways and was defeated through sheer stupidity because he's an emotional lunatic. Supposition on your part. This is why it's preferable to include the body of EU work or movie novelizations (which are G-canon, like the movies): they offer a greater insight to the characters' skills and mentalities.

Zampanó
Originally posted by quanchi112
Nah.

I didn't see anywhere near the athleticism from Vader anywhere pre suit like I did from Maul. Vader also seems to be far too emotional and make stupid decisions like he did against Obi. His impatience and anger will be his downfall.

I mean obi told him not to jump and he still did it anyways and was defeated through sheer stupidity because he's an emotional lunatic.
You are contradicting yourself.

The acrobatics on cables (while floating down the river) show more athleticism than Maul's fancy parkour moves. The Jump that you mention is an incredible display of Force strength and atheleticism.

Maul has a jump from platform to platform. He has a fancy kickflip. The two don't really compare.

truejedi
don't forget Vader's strength in overwhelming Dooku, and in climbing the elevator with two men on his back. That is definitly athleticism from him that we don't see from Maul.

Robtard
Pre-suit Vader showed a lot more against Master Obi than Maul did over Padawan Obi. So Vader, quiet handily wins here.

Burned-crispy-suited Vader, he rips Maul's twin-sabre from his grip and then calls him a stupid *******.

Kaibs
Please enlighten me how Maul would win? He lasted one movie, and didn't even have a total grasp on the force. Vader had total control of the force, and he would manhandle Maul. In the EU then Maul puts up more of a fight. But this is MVF. And that matters not.

Rogue Jedi
Originally posted by Robtard
Pre-suit Vader showed a lot more against Master Obi than Maul did over Padawan Obi. So Vader, quiet handily wins here.

Burned-crispy-suited Vader, he rips Maul's twin-sabre from his grip and then calls him a stupid *******. Why a spoon, cousin? Why not a knife?

quanchi112
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Supposition on your part. This is why it's preferable to include the body of EU work or movie novelizations (which are G-canon, like the movies): they offer a greater insight to the characters' skills and mentalities. I am not aware of those so I keep it just the movies.Originally posted by truejedi
don't forget Vader's strength in overwhelming Dooku, and in climbing the elevator with two men on his back. That is definitly athleticism from him that we don't see from Maul. Vader had much more screen time than Maul hence more feats.

Originally posted by Kaibs
Please enlighten me how Maul would win? He lasted one movie, and didn't even have a total grasp on the force. Vader had total control of the force, and he would manhandle Maul. In the EU then Maul puts up more of a fight. But this is MVF. And that matters not. Lasting one movie is horrible I mean horrible logic. It's like saying harry potter beats sauron because he lasted a few minutes.

Mastering the force doesn't equal auto win against a skilled opponent with a light saber such as Maul.

quanchi112

Kaibs
*facepalm* going by screen feats alone Vader wins. ANd the fact that you aren't even admitting that is sad. Vader not only has shown better lightsaber skills than Maul he's also done more with the lightsaber than maul. Even in the EU. So how's that for logic? I can see you come from the comic vs forum, but I'm sure they tell you to back your shit up with facts and feats. So do it. Please.

Zampanó
Number of feats is irrelevant. Maul's actual showings are, at best, those of a peak human. Anakin, however, is clearly above the range of things that can be done without some sort of magical or mystical assistance.

Anakin is better, even accounting for screentime.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Kaibs
*facepalm* going by screen feats alone Vader wins. ANd the fact that you aren't even admitting that is sad. Vader not only has shown better lightsaber skills than Maul he's also done more with the lightsaber than maul. Even in the EU. So how's that for logic? I can see you come from the comic vs forum, but I'm sure they tell you to back your shit up with facts and feats. So do it. Please. I already have. Maul was greater than two jedi at once a master and his apprentice. Vader was less than Obi just one master. Maul was never beaten in direct combat whereas Vader was beaten all the time and then saved.

Maul's double edged saber would be the end of vader. here vader doesn't get to be saved and come back like in the movies.

Kaibs
^... no.

First of all Qui Gon wasn't the greatest lightsaber user. Period. Obi Wan was still an apprentice which also means he didn't even master his skills yet. Therefore your point is void. Not to mention you're acting like Maul could defeat Vader while he's not only using his lightsaber but the force as well. Which is also an undoubtedly no.

Zampanó
I think that you are drastically underestimating the difference in ability between the two characters' opponents.

Qui-Gon was an old man. During the first fight with Maul he is winded after only a few blows. Kenobi in TPM was still only a padawan, if an advanced one. The two used a method of fighting poorly suited to their environment, and were fighting the first known Sith in millenia. There was not much call for practice against other lightsaber wielding foes.

Anakin and RotS Kenobi, however, were both in their prime. They both had a lot of practice against other Force users, such as Dooku or (in The Clone Wars, Ventress) as well as melee combatants like Grievous and his Magnaguards. In addition, the two were intensely familiar with each others' styles. They were both powerful enough to be on the Council, Kenobi legitimately and Anakin was at least plausible as a Master.

Kenobi's oldest incarnation was significantly more powerful and experienced than his younger self, but still stood no chance against Vader. (The environment was the deciding factor there, not skill.)

This really isn't even a contest.

Rogue Jedi
I have a theory on that fight.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Kaibs
^... no.

First of all Qui Gon wasn't the greatest lightsaber user. Period. Obi Wan was still an apprentice which also means he didn't even master his skills yet. Therefore your point is void. Not to mention you're acting like Maul could defeat Vader while he's not only using his lightsaber but the force as well. Which is also an undoubtedly no. I am afraid you're wrong. Qui Gon and Obi failed meaning a master and an apprentice couldn't tag team this guy into defeat.

Maul controlled his emotions and beat Obi due to him being emotional which is exactly what Vader is.

quanchi112

RE: Blaxican
That's because you don't know anything about Star Wars.

Rogue Jedi
Qui Gon WAS winded right before Maul killed him.

Robtard
Qui Gon was a hippie, not need to hate. Some Jedi are better fighters; some are better diplomats.

marwash22
Vader. Force choke. end of fight.

quanchi112
Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
That's because you don't know anything about Star Wars. I've backed up my case within the movies. You're still mad at me because of my video game superior debating it seems. You will get over it eventually. I hope.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Qui Gon WAS winded right before Maul killed him. Because Maul is a superior fighter to him and despite taking on both Maul was tiring them out.

Originally posted by marwash22
Vader. Force choke. end of fight. That wouldn't work against Maul or any capable sith or jedi. Against some bum human, sure.

marwash22
why wouldn't force choke work on Maul?

quanchi112
Originally posted by marwash22
why wouldn't force choke work on Maul? Because he's also killed in knowledge of the force. If this worked on everyone Vader could easily have taken out Obi with it. Doesn't work that way.

marwash22
So, it wouldn't work because Vader didn't use it against Obi? Okay sure, that logic isn't flawed at all.

quanchi112
Originally posted by marwash22
So, it wouldn't work because Vader didn't use it against Obi? Okay sure, that logic isn't flawed at all. Name one competent jedi or sith he used it against in the movies.

We've already seen dooku use powers against yoda and admit it had to come down to their skills with a light saber. The best users negate the knowledge of the force.

Darth Maul force pushed Obi to best him anyways. He can't do it anytime he has to wait till his guard is down like anything.

marwash22
Err, Mace was giving Palpatine the business with force lighting...
Palpatine pwned Yoda with force lighting twice...

You're making it seem like Force powers don't work on fellow Jedi/Sith when in fact, they work just the same as they do on regular people. Sure, it can be countered, but there's nothing to suggest that Vader couldn't choke Maul, or vice-versa for that matter.

quanchi112
Originally posted by marwash22
Err, Mace was giving Palpatine the business with force lighting...
Palpatine pwned Yoda with force lighting twice...

You're making it seem like Force powers don't work on fellow Jedi/Sith when in fact, they work just the same as they do on regular people. Sure, it can be countered, but there's nothing to suggest that Vader couldn't choke Maul, or vice-versa for that matter. Mace was reflecting it back and giving pal the business hence his deformity.

Palpatine caught him off guard at first but yoda countered and it ended up being another saber fight.

They do work when you catch them off guard. That's the entire point they are pretty highly skilled and have defenses against this sort of thing normal humans don't.

Kaibs
Originally posted by quanchi112
Because he's also killed in knowledge of the force. If this worked on everyone Vader could easily have taken out Obi with it. Doesn't work that way.

Since when was Maul ever "knowledgable" in the force as Vader was. That's ridiculous, and now you're bringing the EU into this conversation again which you can't do. Are you actually trying to say Maul was more poweful than Douku? Really? You really think Maul wouldn't fall to a force choke too? I don't understand how you can say these things when Maul in the movies showed absolutely nothing of the sort.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Kaibs
Since when was Maul ever "knowledgable" in the force as Vader was. That's ridiculous, and now you're bringing the EU into this conversation again which you can't do. Are you actually trying to say Maul was more poweful than Douku? Really? You really think Maul wouldn't fall to a force choke too? I don't understand how you can say these things when Maul in the movies showed absolutely nothing of the sort. I never said he was but I said he effectively used a force push to gain the advantage over Obi.

How am I bringing the eu into this conversation when I have never read a thing about star wars ?

No, I don't think a force choke would work you need to do so against someone not ready for it. You can't just force choke people into death at will if they are capable and maul was more than capable.

Kaibs
Originally posted by quanchi112
I never said he was but I said he effectively used a force push to gain the advantage over Obi.

How am I bringing the eu into this conversation when I have never read a thing about star wars ?

No, I don't think a force choke would work you need to do so against someone not ready for it. You can't just force choke people into death at will if they are capable and maul was more than capable.

Yeah, but Obi was also once again just an apprentice, and also once again like RJ stated Qui Gon was fatigued before he even faught Maul, not to mention since we're bringing the EU into play on somethings you shoudl also know Qui Gon was more in tuned with the force than honing his lightsaber skills. You talking about what Maul can do in earlier posts that weren't even in the movie is bringing the EU into discussion. And i'm pretty sure unlike Maul, Vader is more than capable of using the force and his lightsaber at the same time. And you still haven't answered my question about Douku.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Kaibs
Yeah, but Obi was also once again just an apprentice, and also once again like RJ stated Qui Gon was fatigued before he even faught Maul, not to mention since we're bringing the EU into play on somethings you shoudl also know Qui Gon was more in tuned with the force than honing his lightsaber skills. You talking about what Maul can do in earlier posts that weren't even in the movie is bringing the EU into discussion. And i'm pretty sure unlike Maul, Vader is more than capable of using the force and his lightsaber at the same time. And you still haven't answered my question about Douku. I brought up nothing about Maul that wasn't in the movies as I have never read anything eu about star wars ever.

We saw anakin use the force and obi met him head on. Anakin's emotions will be his downfall like they were the first time against Dooku and the first time against Obi.

He won't get the rematch he seems to need to beat competent saber users.

What question did I avoid ?

Kaibs
Originally posted by quanchi112
I brought up nothing about Maul that wasn't in the movies as I have never read anything eu about star wars ever.

We saw anakin use the force and obi met him head on. Anakin's emotions will be his downfall like they were the first time against Dooku and the first time against Obi.

He won't get the rematch he seems to need to beat competent saber users.

What question did I avoid ?

You act as if Maul has the personal connection to Anakin that Obi did... and his emotions aren't tied to Maul in any way shape or form... Douku was a better saber handler than Maul and he got his head cut off, he was also far vastly superior in the force tha Maul. Next you'er goin gto tell me that Maul could of killed Douku, or Yoda, or Obi Wan.

the ninjak
I reckon Vader murders Maul.

Kaibs
^ I reckon you're right.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Kaibs
You act as if Maul has the personal connection to Anakin that Obi did... and his emotions aren't tied to Maul in any way shape or form... Douku was a better saber handler than Maul and he got his head cut off, he was also far vastly superior in the force tha Maul. Next you'er goin gto tell me that Maul could of killed Douku, or Yoda, or Obi Wan. anakin was also emotional against dooku. It's not just against obi.

I disagree with Dooku being a better fighter than Maul and anakin got a second chance like he did against obi. he was soundly defeated only lucky he got another chance.

Maul can kill Dooku as well.

Kaibs
Originally posted by quanchi112
anakin was also emotional against dooku. It's not just against obi.

I disagree with Dooku being a better fighter than Maul and anakin got a second chance like he did against obi. he was soundly defeated only lucky he got another chance.

Maul can kill Dooku as well.

So let me get this straight, by your logic you're indicating Maul can go Toe to Toe with Yoda and live.

Welp this is where I'm done talking to you in this thread as well. Hopefully Sadako or Rob can get through to you. If not then you really know nothing about Star Wars. Which is fine.

Rogue Jedi
Dooku would rape Maul.

Sadako of Girth
Vader wins this as far as I see it on being way more powerful with the force, less flash, but more economical and elegant moves in lightsabre combat..

This economy of movement combined with the fact of Vader's "way bigger than Maul with killer reach" advantages,.
The length of his lightsabre blade + arm reach should well into Maul's territory, yet Maul has the advantage if Vader just sits back and lets the dude wail away with that fast twin bladed assault, cause the numbers game seems to dictate that longer that goes on, with Vader blocking him move for move, the more likely it is that Maul will find deadly strike.

I see Vader pressing forward with lots of short prescise little parries and attacks, cautting through Mauls more elaborate swings putting Maul on the back foot like Obi wan did after Qui-Gonn's
defeat...not giving Maul an inch, and any point at which Maul backs out of range, Vader could slam him with force attacks, be they pull/pushes/object attacks with heavy ass objects.

(Maul only ever flung 1 single small object on screen, into a door control panel, albeit reasonably quickly and seemingly expertly)

I think it'd be short, I think it'd be explosive, I think the former Tatooinian slave takes it on power, elegance/efficiency with the blade, together with being too much pressure for Maul to deal with in the end.

Also Vader has armour on most of his body that doenst stop Lightsabers completely if swung into it, but repells most of the damage.. (As seem by Luke's blow to Vader's shoulder in ESB, that rightfully would have gone straight through the arm and chest and effectively cut Vaders head and shoulders off with out it, judging by other LS wounds.)

Also, If Obiwan was able to exploit Maul's appetite for the suffering of his enemy, then Vader would be able to to an even greater extent too, I would assume, given that he seems to be a master of mindgames by OT times..

Robtard
This is pre-suit Vader, so it's Vader with all his sabre skills and athleticism. Maul will be on the defensive and it would likely be a short fight, ending with Maul-bits strewn about.

As I said on page 2 (or was it 1?), Vader matched Master Obi in sabre and Force skills, while Maul merely just beat Padawan Obi (Obi didn't out-fight Maul, even though he won). There's a massive level of skill between Padawan and Master, I think we can all agree on this one.

I'm also of the opinion that AOTC Anakin would do well against Maul, though likely not win in the end.

Sadako of Girth
Ahhh thank you Robtard. My bad. Thought it was suity Vader.

In that case you are exactly right, by my estimate..

Zampanó
Originally posted by quanchi112
It's funny how in one instance you say Qui Gon was an old man and then act like Obi Wan was in his prime when vader eventually beat him. Obi was older and stood there as vader bested him not even fighting back. That's laughable that vader could only best him when aged and not fighting back.

Vader has done nothing to suggest to me him beating Maul at all. His emotional outbursts play right into Maul's hands.

Did you miss the part where that post is talking about Darth Vader
BEFORE HE PUT ON THE SUIT?!

Sadako of Girth
I certainly did. lol

Kaibs
lol... I'm sure he did... But I mean it's pretty obvious that Anakin would destroy Maul. Even before he was in his suit, he had a pretty high grasp on the force, and his saber skills like we said were on par with Obi Wan's.

quanchi112

Robtard
Originally posted by quanchi112
Yoda didn't really beat anybody onscreen. he went toe to toe with Dooku and Palpatine but beat neither of them.


Considering you're of the opinion that Maul would maul Dooku, you must also be off the opinion that Maul would bring the hurt down upon Yoda and possibly Sidious, considering the opinion above.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Robtard
Considering you're of the opinion that Maul would maul Dooku, you must also be off the opinion that Maul would bring the hurt down upon Yoda and possibly Sidious, considering the opinion above. I don't think he'd maul Dooku I just think he would defeat him.


I dunno. I think he can more than stalemate him in the same manner Dooku did in the time allotted for their onscreen fight.

Robtard
Originally posted by quanchi112
I don't think he'd maul Dooku I just think he would defeat him.


I dunno. I think he can more than stalemate him in the same manner Dooku did in the time allotted for their onscreen fight.

I think you have a highly exaggerated view of Maul, all things considered. As I said above, Padawan Obi did well against Maul, though ultimately losing the fight and winning due to Maul's arrogance. Vader would have torn through Padawan Obi and Qui Gon Gin in under a minute.

Pretty sure Dooku was the one that ran from Yoda, that fight is hazy in my head though.

Yoda Vs Palpatine, Yoda had the upper-hand in that fight.

IIRC; when they meet:

-Sidious uses lighting and Yoda both defends and ultimately pushes it back against Sidious. Pretty much a stalemate, though Sidious tries to flee the room and Yoda cock-blocks him with lite sabre. It's very telling if one opponent tries to flee.

-The sabre duel was pretty much equals and it's Sidious who switches tactics by throwing senate-seats at Yoda, who again, defends/dodges and ultimately returns the attack in kind. Stalemate, but I'd give the slight edge to Yoda again, he was pushing the fight more.

-Sidious reverts back to his initial tactic of Force-lightning and Yoda yet again cock-blocks it; Sidious has a "wtf, I'm in f--king trouble here, yo" look on his face and luckily for Sidious, Yoda's return-blast of Sidious' lightning sends his 40lbs green ass flying down and the fight ends.

So while Yoda failed in his "I will kill the Sith" mission, he didn't lose the duel, he was the one pushing and had the upper-hand, had he not fallen down, all things point to Yoda being the better duelist.

Maul Vs Yoda wouldn't even be a duel, Yoda would cut him down in a couple seconds.

Edit: Should also be said that Yoda did all that while having a massive reach disadvantage, in body, arm and light-sabre.

Kaibs
Originally posted by Robtard
I think you have a highly exaggerated view of Maul, all things considered. As I said above, Padawan Obi did well against Maul, though ultimately losing the fight and winning due to Maul's arrogance. Vader would have torn through Padawan Obi and Qui Gon Gin in a matter of seconds.

Pretty sure Dooku was the one that ran from Yoda, that fight is hazy in my head though.

Yoda Vs Palpatine, Yoda had the upper-hand in that fight.

IIRC; when they meet:

-Sidious uses lighting and Yoda both defends and ultimately pushes it back against Sidious. Pretty much a stalemate, though Sidious tries to flee the room and Yoda cock-blocks him with lite sabre. It's very telling if one opponent tries to flee.

-The sabre duel was pretty much equals and it's Sidious who switches tactics by throwing senate-seats at Yoda, who again, defends/dodges and ultimately returns the attack in kind. Stalemate, but I'd give the slight edge to Yoda again, he was pushing the fight more.

-Sidious reverts back to his initial tactic of Force-lightning and Yoda yet again cock-blocks it; Sidious has a "wtf, I'm in f--king trouble here, yo" look on his face and luckily for Sidious, Yoda's return-blast of Sidious' lightning sends his 40lbs green ass flying down.

So while Yoda failed in his "I will kill the Sith" mission, he didn't lose the duel, he was the one pushing and had the upper-hand.

Maul Vs Yoda wouldn't even be a duel, Yoda would cut him down in a couple seconds.

Dooku did indeed run from Yoda.

DDxaI8DbZEE

To say Maul could do anything what Dooku did in this fight is hilarious.

Lord Lucien
This is why discussing on-screen feats sucks. It's all open to interpretation.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Robtard
I think you have a highly exaggerated view of Maul, all things considered. As I said above, Padawan Obi did well against Maul, though ultimately losing the fight and winning due to Maul's arrogance. Vader would have torn through Padawan Obi and Qui Gon Gin in under a minute.

Pretty sure Dooku was the one that ran from Yoda, that fight is hazy in my head though.

Yoda Vs Palpatine, Yoda had the upper-hand in that fight.

IIRC; when they meet:

-Sidious uses lighting and Yoda both defends and ultimately pushes it back against Sidious. Pretty much a stalemate, though Sidious tries to flee the room and Yoda cock-blocks him with lite sabre. It's very telling if one opponent tries to flee.

-The sabre duel was pretty much equals and it's Sidious who switches tactics by throwing senate-seats at Yoda, who again, defends/dodges and ultimately returns the attack in kind. Stalemate, but I'd give the slight edge to Yoda again, he was pushing the fight more.

-Sidious reverts back to his initial tactic of Force-lightning and Yoda yet again cock-blocks it; Sidious has a "wtf, I'm in f--king trouble here, yo" look on his face and luckily for Sidious, Yoda's return-blast of Sidious' lightning sends his 40lbs green ass flying down and the fight ends.

So while Yoda failed in his "I will kill the Sith" mission, he didn't lose the duel, he was the one pushing and had the upper-hand, had he not fallen down, all things point to Yoda being the better duelist.

Maul Vs Yoda wouldn't even be a duel, Yoda would cut him down in a couple seconds.

Edit: Should also be said that Yoda did all that while having a massive reach disadvantage, in body, arm and light-sabre. You speculate on how easily Vader could have beaten padawan obi. We have seen Maul easily best him and we saw him doing so because obi was too emotional which Vader is also known for.

Maul could stalemate him in the same time Dooku did is my point.

Yoda didn't win so who cares if he had the upper hand. Palpatine did just fine and held his own.

Palpatine had power throughout his empire he had everything to lose and only Yoda's death to gain. I probably favor Yoda over him in the end anyways.

You have zero proof as to suggest why he can cut Maul down in seconds when he didn't even defeat Dooku or Palpatine and we saw Maul stalk his opponents and tactically maul them.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
This is why discussing on-screen feats sucks. It's all open to interpretation. That's what makes it more fun.

Robtard
Originally posted by quanchi112
You speculate on how easily Vader could have beaten padawan obi. We have seen Maul easily best him and we saw him doing so because obi was too emotional which Vader is also known for.

Maul could stalemate him in the same time Dooku did is my point.

Yoda didn't win so who cares if he had the upper hand. Palpatine did just fine and held his own.

Palpatine had power throughout his empire he had everything to lose and only Yoda's death to gain. I probably favor Yoda over him in the end anyways.

You have zero proof as to suggest why he can cut Maul down in seconds when he didn't even defeat Dooku or Palpatine and we saw Maul stalk his opponents and tactically maul them.

Not so much speculation considering we have Maul Vs Master Qui Gon and Padawan Obi, Maul Vs Padawan Obi and Vader vs Master Obi fights to compare against.

Dooku didn't stalemate Yoda, Dooku had to flee, cos he knew he couldn't win the fight.

Yoda was the better duelist, that's the point. Had a fall not stopped the fight and allowed Sidious to flee to the safety of his clone army, Yoda would have won, considering how the fight was going.

I have zero proof? I have the films. Maul was the one being pushed back defensively against Qui Gon and Obi. While he killed Qui Gon when it went 1 Vs 1, it wasn't a rape and then a Padawan held up decently against him. Which as you pointed out, Obi wasn't in the best mental state as his master just got sliced. Add that up, a Master Obi Vs Maul would end with Maul in pieces.

Considering you agreed that Yoda would likely have won over Sidious(and the film implies this), you're not making any sense. Seems little more than "Maul is my favorite so he wins" type of debating.

Kaibs
Originally posted by Robtard
Not so much speculation considering we have Maul Vs Master Qui Gon and Padawan Obi, Maul Vs Padawan Obi and Vader vs Master Obi fights to compare against.

Dooku didn't stalemate Yoda, Dooku had to flee, cos he knew he couldn't win the fight.

Yoda was the better duelist, that's the point. Had a fall not stopped the fight and allowed Sidious to flee to the safety of his clone army, Yoda would have won, considering how the fight was going.

I have zero proof? I have the films. Maul was the one being pushed back defensively against Qui Gon and Obi. While he killed Qui Gon when it went 1 Vs 1, it wasn't a rape and then a Padawan held up decently against him. Which as you pointed out, Obi wasn't in the best mental state as his master just got sliced. Add that up, a Master Obi Vs Maul would end with Maul in pieces.

Considering you agreed that Yoda would likely have won Vs Palpatine, you're not making any sense. Seems little more than "Maul is my favorite so he wins" type of debating.


All you have to do is watch the god damn video on page 4 to see that Dooku clearly ran.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Robtard
Not so much speculation considering we have Maul Vs Master Qui Gon and Padawan Obi, Maul Vs Padawan Obi and Vader vs Master Obi fights to compare against.

Dooku didn't stalemate Yoda, Dooku had to flee, cos he knew he couldn't win the fight.

Yoda was the better duelist, that's the point. Had a fall not stopped the fight and allowed Sidious to flee to the safety of his clone army, Yoda would have won, considering how the fight was going.

I have zero proof? I have the films. Maul was the one being pushed back defensively against Qui Gon and Obi. While he killed Qui Gon when it went 1 Vs 1, it wasn't a rape and then a Padawan held up decently against him. Which as you pointed out, Obi wasn't in the best mental state as his master just got sliced. Add that up, a Master Obi Vs Maul would end with Maul in pieces.

Considering you agreed that Yoda would likely have won over Sidious(and the film implies this), you're not making any sense. Seems little more than "Maul is my favorite so he wins" type of debating. Vader lost against a fellow master. Maul fought one and an apprentice and won.

In the time allotted his stalemated and fled. Maul ca do exactly the same thing in the same amount of time.

Speculation.

Maul defeated them so who cares if he was being pushed back against two highly skilled opponents when he separated them he beat them, easily.

Padawan was beaten rather quickly as well and hi sanger was the reason he was beaten. Vader lost due to his impulsiveness and anger twice. He'd so so a third time.

vader hasn't beaten either of these opponets the first time he fought he needed a rematch. Vader is lucky not anywhere near the best with a saber.

Yoda would have likely won but in the time we saw him on screen if it was anything we saw it wasn't quick decisive victories by any means.

marwash22

quanchi112
Originally posted by marwash22
LMAO. i didn't know that.

mmm

this has now become a rape, imo. How so ? Vader was beaten all the time pre suit.

marwash22
Originally posted by quanchi112
How so ? Vader was beaten all the time pre suit. beaten by...

Dooku and Obi Wan... two people that would pwn the shit out of Maul.

Kaibs
nqydT7h3ZJE

Apprentice Obi Wan beat Darth Maul in about 1 Minute 15 Seconds.

Anakin faught MASTER JEDI Obi Wan for around 10-15 minutes.

Translating into what? OH WAIT... I think we all already know.

marwash22
Originally posted by Kaibs


Apprentice Obi Wan beat Darth Maul in about 1 Minute 15 Seconds.

Anakin faught MASTER JEDI Obi Wan for around 10-15 minutes.

Translating into what? OH WAIT... I think we all already know. exactly. Maul fought what was basiclly a padawan-Obi... Anakin lost to Prime-Obi and really only lost because Obi had the high ground. Before that it was prety much a stalemate.

Kaibs
Originally posted by marwash22
exactly. Maul fought what was basiclly a padawan-Obi... Anakin lost to Prime-Obi and really only lost because Obi had the high ground. Before that it was prety much a stalemate.


Well no. He would of lost eventually due to Obi Wan being the far superior Jedi. But the fact that he went that long to begin with shows that he has far more than enough to push Mauls shit in.

Robtard
Originally posted by quanchi112
Vader lost against a fellow master. Maul fought one and an apprentice and won.

In the time allotted his stalemated and fled. Maul ca do exactly the same thing in the same amount of time.

Speculation.

Maul defeated them so who cares if he was being pushed back against two highly skilled opponents when he separated them he beat them, easily.

Padawan was beaten rather quickly as well and hi sanger was the reason he was beaten. Vader lost due to his impulsiveness and anger twice. He'd so so a third time.

vader hasn't beaten either of these opponets the first time he fought he needed a rematch. Vader is lucky not anywhere near the best with a saber.

Yoda would have likely won but in the time we saw him on screen if it was anything we saw it wasn't quick decisive victories by any means.

The lightsabre and Force-duel where about equal, though Obi was ultimatley better. Vader lost cos he made a retarded leap, he could have easily just waited. You're also implying that all Masters are equal, just isn't so. See: Yoda. See: Mace. Do you really think Qui Gon would have held his own against Yoda, Mace or Obi as a master?

WTF? It wasn't a stalemate, Yoda proved to be the better and Dooku fled, else he end up like Obi and Anakin on the floor. Watch the clip.

Um, no. Watch the film. But you're also kinda agreeing that Yoda would have won, so again, you're tripping over your own argument.

Yes, Maul did defeat Qui Gon and a padawan, when he got lucky and they were separated. Vader defeated a Sith much older and more powerful than Maul and as a Padawan, he fared well against a that same Sith. Then when fighting a Master Jedi (who did decently against Maul as a Padawn), he puts up a great fight. How you conclude that Maul showed better is beyond reason and it's starting to show like blind favoritism.

Obi was beaten because he was a Padawan, though considering his status, he did well in the fight.

Anakin was a Padawan when he first fought Dooku and he fared well. So you're not making and sense here.

Except of course if you watch the film, you see that it's Sidious on the defensive and the one trying to flee.

marwash22
Originally posted by Kaibs
Well no. He would of lost eventually due to Obi Wan being the far superior Jedi. But the fact that he went that long to begin with shows that he has far more than enough to push Mauls shit in. heh. that's debatable; looked like an even battle to me. The determining factor if anything was wisdom, not really ability... Anakin got pwned because he was impatient/careless. Either way, Anakin beats Maul.

Kaibs
Originally posted by marwash22
heh. that's debatable; looked like an even battle to me. The determining factor if anything was wisdom, not really ability... Anakin got pwned because he was impatient/careless. Either way, Anakin beats Maul.

Yes, well that also translates into skill as well, as Obi Wan was more intuned with the force and knew that patience would help him win the day. But yeah it is a debatable. although in the end it will always go to Obi Wan since it was Obi Wan who walked away not in lava lol.

Kaibs
pSwy412nttI

Once again, to say Maul showed any showings such as either in this is once again nonsense. The showings he had in Episode I doesn't even compare. Considering these two were Master level Jedi, and showed WAY more fighting prowess than Qui Gon.

truejedi
well, the novel that ya'll don't like makes it pretty clear that Kenobi was in control of teh duel the entire way.

quanchi112
Originally posted by marwash22
beaten by...

Dooku and Obi Wan... two people that would pwn the shit out of Maul. Iyo not mine. Obi was already tactically defeated by Maul as was Qui Gonn.

Originally posted by Kaibs
nqydT7h3ZJE

Apprentice Obi Wan beat Darth Maul in about 1 Minute 15 Seconds.

Anakin faught MASTER JEDI Obi Wan for around 10-15 minutes.

Translating into what? OH WAIT... I think we all already know. Maul had him beaten and was overconfident it was the only reason he lost. Vader never had an advantage and despite obi telling him not to jump because let's face it vader's an emotional fool he still did so and was handily defeated because well he's a moron.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Robtard
The lightsabre and Force-duel where about equal, though Obi was ultimatley better. Vader lost cos he made a retarded leap, he could have easily just waited. You're also implying that all Masters are equal, just isn't so. See: Yoda. See: Mace. Do you really think Qui Gon would have held his own against Yoda, Mace or Obi as a master?

WTF? It wasn't a stalemate, Yoda proved to be the better and Dooku fled, else he end up like Obi and Anakin on the floor. Watch the clip.

Um, no. Watch the film. But you're also kinda agreeing that Yoda would have won, so again, you're tripping over your own argument.

Yes, Maul did defeat Qui Gon and a padawan, when he got lucky and they were separated. Vader defeated a Sith much older and more powerful than Maul and as a Padawan, he fared well against a that same Sith. Then when fighting a Master Jedi (who did decently against Maul as a Padawn), he puts up a great fight. How you conclude that Maul showed better is beyond reason and it's starting to show like blind favoritism.

Obi was beaten because he was a Padawan, though considering his status, he did well in the fight.

Anakin was a Padawan when he first fought Dooku and he fared well. So you're not making and sense here.

Except of course if you watch the film, you see that it's Sidious on the defensive and the one trying to flee. I am not implying all masters are equal I am saying the master Maul faced he crushed. That's impressive considering it was a handicapped fight to begin with.


No, I don't see qui Gonn winning but then again he's nothing to Maul either.

No, I am not and never once did I say Maul would beat Yoda I stated he could replicate surviving.


No, it's you showing blind favoritism not me. You speculate the entire team ignore the fact Vader was beaten twice and soundly at that. Vader only beat Dooku's 'ass after he fought him for the second time.

Obi was beaten rather quickly so no I don't see him doing well at all in the fight. His anger cost him the fight and the same would happen to Vader.

Anakin was dominated by Dooku as a padawan and he was lucky to have survived just like he was lucky to have survived against Obi. Someone always saves the emo.

Sidious had everything to lose and only had to survive Yoda had to kill him. Fleeing was smart.

truejedi
You are failing to acknowledge the substantial gap between QGJ and ROTS Kenobi... Until you acknowledge that (right now you are considering them near equal) anything we say will be denied by you, so I ask you this:

What did QGJ ever do in combat that was impressive?

ROTS Kenobi killed Grievous, and Defeated "the chosen one" Anakin Skywalker. (as well as 4 magnaguards)

What fight did QGJ ever win?

RE: Blaxican
"replicate surviving".

lol. Quan.

quanchi112
Originally posted by truejedi
You are failing to acknowledge the substantial gap between QGJ and ROTS Kenobi... Until you acknowledge that (right now you are considering them near equal) anything we say will be denied by you, so I ask you this:

What did QGJ ever do in combat that was impressive?

ROTS Kenobi killed Grievous, and Defeated "the chosen one" Anakin Skywalker. (as well as 4 magnaguards)

What fight did QGJ ever win? Fighting maul and being a master in general who tutored obi. I think it's obvious he wasn't a schlub.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
"replicate surviving".

lol. Quan. I've always laughed at you. smile

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by quanchi112
That's what makes it more fun. Blech.

Robtard
Originally posted by quanchi112
I am not implying all masters are equal I am saying the master Maul faced he crushed. That's impressive considering it was a handicapped fight to begin with.


No, I don't see qui Gonn winning but then again he's nothing to Maul either.

No, I am not and never once did I say Maul would beat Yoda I stated he could replicate surviving.


No, it's you showing blind favoritism not me. You speculate the entire team ignore the fact Vader was beaten twice and soundly at that. Vader only beat Dooku's 'ass after he fought him for the second time.

Obi was beaten rather quickly so no I don't see him doing well at all in the fight. His anger cost him the fight and the same would happen to Vader.

Anakin was dominated by Dooku as a padawan and he was lucky to have survived just like he was lucky to have survived against Obi. Someone always saves the emo.

Sidious had everything to lose and only had to survive Yoda had to kill him. Fleeing was smart.

Yeah you are when you ignore who was fighting who in these comparisons. Well yes, Maul was impressive; comparing it to the fight of Vader Vs Obi, it's not impressive at all. See.

Qui Gon did alright against Maul, wasn't a stomp. But ok.

Now you're switching the argument. This is concerning Yoda Vs Sidious. But now you're claiming that Maul is on par with Sidious, if he's to survive a duel with Yoda. Laughable.

A "no you" retort, brilliant. Anakin was beaten once by a Master when he was a Padawan, though he did fare well, something you ignore. Vader was beaten by Obi Won, who is far above Qui Gon and his Padawan self, though he arguably lost to rage/pride. See what I mean about your comparison of Masters being equal.

You also ignore that Maul ultimately lost to pride as well, while insisting that Vader's rage/pride will be a handicap here. See, blind favortism with a heafy helping of zero-objectivity. Obi lost to Maul cos he was a Padawan at the time, simple as that.

Anakin lost as a Padawan, he fared well oveerall, considering he was just a Padawan. Ignoring that he was jsut a Padawan in his first Dooku encounter won't make it change.

If Sidious could have killed Yoda, he would have, it's simple as that. He fled (second attempt at that) because he knew Yoda was superior, as Yoda had just shown him in three clashes.

Edit.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Robtard
Yeah you are when you ignore who was fighting who in these comparisons. Well yes, Maul was impressive; comparing it to the fight of Vader Vs Obi, it's not impressive at all. See.

Qui Gon did alright against Maul, wasn't a stomp. But ok.

Now you're switching the argument. This is concerning Yoda Vs Sidious. But now you're claiming that Maul is on par with Sidious, if he's to survive a duel with Yoda. Laughable.

A "no you" retort, brilliant. Anakin was beaten once by a Master when he was a Padawan, though he did fare well, something you ignore. Vader was beaten by Obi Won, who is far above Qui Gon and his Padawan self, though he arguably lost to rage/pride, something else you ignore. See what I mean about your comparison of Masters being equal. You also ignore that Maul ultimately lost to pride as well, while insisting that Vader's rage/pride will be a handicap here. See, blind favortism.

Obi lost to Maul cos he was a Padawan.

Anakin lost as a Padawan, he fared well oveerall, considering he was just a Padawan.

If Sidious could have killed Yoda, he would have, it's simple as that. He fled (second attempt at that) because he knew Yoda was superior, as Yoda had just shown him in three clashes. Maul stomped him. Soon as he was separated from his partner he died very quickly.

I am saying Maul would beat Dooku nowhere did I state he can stalemate either sidious or yoda.

Vader was beaten by someone who told him not perform the move which got him defeated. He is beyond moronic and emotional to be able to take on someone as cold and smooth as Maul.

No proof Obi as a master could beat Maul. None. We saw him utterly trounced by Dooku yet he beat and held his own against Vader. Hmmmm.

Sidious was trying but continuing the fight when he could die simply wasn't worth the risk so biding his time was a win for him and a loss for Yoda.

Robtard
Originally posted by quanchi112
Maul stomped him. Soon as he was separated from his partner he died very quickly.

I am saying Maul would beat Dooku nowhere did I state he can stalemate either sidious or yoda.

Vader was beaten by someone who told him not perform the move which got him defeated. He is beyond moronic and emotional to be able to take on someone as cold and smooth as Maul.

No proof Obi as a master could beat Maul. None. We saw him utterly trounced by Dooku yet he beat and held his own against Vader. Hmmmm.

Sidious was trying but continuing the fight when he could die simply wasn't worth the risk so biding his time was a win for him and a loss for Yoda.

Watch the fight again, it was a careful exchange of blows and Maul proved to be the better, it wasn't a stomp with Qui Gon doing jack and shit. Qui Gon seemed to have a stamina issue though; that's not an insult to his skills.

There's nothing in the films to suggest Maul would beat Dooku, so it seems like Maul fanboysim is what you base your ideas from. Page6, you said Maul could "stalemate" Dooku in the same fashion Dooku did to Yoda. Though it has been shown to you, Dooku ran, cos he lost. So you're contradicting yourself again.

So you're dictating the outcome of this fight on CIS/PIS? Fair enough, but why do you then ignore that the "cold and smooth" Maul lost in a moronic fashion as well and to a padawan no less? (Hint:Blind favoritism and zero-objectivity)

Except of course the fact that when Obi lost to Dooku it was EP2, but in Ep3 Anakin had grown in power enough to defeat Dooku ("I've doubled in strength" he said, or something like that), Are you suggesting Obi Wan hadn't grown more powerful as well, that he just stagnated? Laughable.

Watch the damn film again. Sidious was on the losing end; why he fled. He wanted Yoda dead, he wouldn't have hesitated to slaughter him, had he been capable. Yoda falling is what saved his wrinkled ass. Blaxican's opinion seems to be correct, you don't know Star Wars stuff very well. I suggest you watch all the films multiple times.

Edit: Simplest way to compare, watch both fight clips side-by-side. Vader and Obi simply do more and better than Maul, Qui Gon or Padawan Obi.

Kaibs
Originally posted by quanchi112
Maul stomped him. Soon as he was separated from his partner he died very quickly.

I am saying Maul would beat Dooku nowhere did I state he can stalemate either sidious or yoda.

Vader was beaten by someone who told him not perform the move which got him defeated. He is beyond moronic and emotional to be able to take on someone as cold and smooth as Maul.

No proof Obi as a master could beat Maul. None. We saw him utterly trounced by Dooku yet he beat and held his own against Vader. Hmmmm.

Sidious was trying but continuing the fight when he could die simply wasn't worth the risk so biding his time was a win for him and a loss for Yoda.

Maul stomped nobody... Why do you keep saying that, when he clearly did NOT stomp anyone. A roflstomp was when Anakin stomped Dooku in the ROTS. And You're saying he can beat Dooku which in abc logic follows you up by saying he could stalemate Yoda, since Dooku didn't die to Yoda in Episode II, Although it was clearly obvious YOda ws ****ing with Dooku the whole time. Cold and Smooth as Maul? Lol... alright. If Maul was so smooth he wouldn't of died to Obi Wan when he was a low ranking Jedi. IDK why you keep failing to acknowledge Mauls failure in knowledge of the force. Next you're going to say that Maul can absorb force lightning and shoot it back at people.

truejedi
Originally posted by quanchi112
Fighting maul and being a master in general who tutored obi. I think it's obvious he wasn't a schlub.

Not obvious at all. It can be if you supply proof.

Let's see: Your reasoning here is poor:

Fighting Maul means nothing. Anyone could fight maul. I could fight maul, it means nothing.

Being a master in general means nothing. That was a COUNCIL memberJEdi Master in AOTC getting shot with 3 shots by Boba Fett. He was lousy. A Jedi Master, and lousy. So QGJ being a master does not prove he was good at combat.

As far as tutoring Obi? Seriously? how is that pertinent at all?

You need to supply something that QGJ has achieved in combat: I know a LOT about star wars, and I have nothing for you. I remember this pair running from a pair of droids in TPM.

You are completely missing out on how much Kenobi improved between TPM and ROTS. He fought a war for 14 years. He went from a novice at Ataru to a master (the master) of Soresu.

There is no comparison.

Rogue Jedi
Darth Maul was like a big budget Hollywood movie. Looks good, nice effects, but has a plot that goes nowhere.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Robtard
Watch the fight again, it was a careful exchange of blows and Maul proved to be the better, it wasn't a stomp with Qui Gon doing jack and shit. Qui Gon seemed to have a stamina issue though; that's not an insult to his skills.

There's nothing in the films to suggest Maul would beat Dooku, so it seems like Maul fanboysim is what you base your ideas from. Page6, you said Maul could "stalemate" Dooku in the same fashion Dooku did to Yoda. Though it has been shown to you, Dooku ran, cos he lost. So you're contradicting yourself again.

So you're dictating the outcome of this fight on CIS/PIS? Fair enough, but why do you then ignore that the "cold and smooth" Maul lost in a moronic fashion as well and to a padawan no less? (Hint:Blind favoritism and zero-objectivity)

Except of course the fact that when Obi lost to Dooku it was EP2, but in Ep3 Anakin had grown in power enough to defeat Dooku ("I've doubled in strength" he said, or something like that), Are you suggesting Obi Wan hadn't grown more powerful as well, that he just stagnated? Laughable.

Watch the damn film again. Sidious was on the losing end; why he fled. He wanted Yoda dead, he wouldn't have hesitated to slaughter him, had he been capable. Yoda falling is what saved his wrinkled ass. Blaxican's opinion seems to be correct, you don't know Star Wars stuff very well. I suggest you watch all the films multiple times.

Edit: Simplest way to compare, watch both fight clips side-by-side. Vader and Obi simply do more and better than Maul, Qui Gon or Padawan Obi. Wrong. Maul beat him in moments. Rewatch the fight at no point in time did he ever have an advantage on Maul. This is sheer stompage.

No, I am not contradicting myself at all you are just not understanding what I mean which falls on you. The point is if Maul's goal was to survive as long as Dooku did before leaving the fight he could have. Dooku can't beat Yoda either so again my point makes total sense.

Maul was arrogant and was taunting. I doubt this situation would present itself again. There was also another lightsaber in the room which he won't have in a forum fight if he gets disarmed.

Obi wasn't a good matchup to Dooku he just had his number. While Dooku smashed obi obi was still a better matchup against vader than dooku was. It's how these characters matched up.

I never said he was capable of beating yoda I stated sidious didn't have to kill him. Yoda's mission was to kill him sidious' was to survive. Yoda failed.

I could care less what your opinion of me is I am correct and have backed up my case quite well.

I've seen vaderism before rear it's ugly head in the face of logic and reason.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Kaibs
Maul stomped nobody... Why do you keep saying that, when he clearly did NOT stomp anyone. A roflstomp was when Anakin stomped Dooku in the ROTS. And You're saying he can beat Dooku which in abc logic follows you up by saying he could stalemate Yoda, since Dooku didn't die to Yoda in Episode II, Although it was clearly obvious YOda ws ****ing with Dooku the whole time. Cold and Smooth as Maul? Lol... alright. If Maul was so smooth he wouldn't of died to Obi Wan when he was a low ranking Jedi. IDK why you keep failing to acknowledge Mauls failure in knowledge of the force. Next you're going to say that Maul can absorb force lightning and shoot it back at people. Maul stomped qui gonn and easily bested Obi.

No, Anakin thoroughly beat him in rots but dooku stomped him as a padawan.

I am saying Maul could do the same exact thing Dooku did and stalemate him for a time and then flee. I never meant like a true stalemate. Wow.

Yoda doesn't screw around he wanted to defeat him he doesn't show off he does what needs done. he's not some arrogant fool. You don't even grasp Yoda's character. laughing out loud

Robtard
Originally posted by quanchi112
Wrong. Maul beat him in moments. Rewatch the fight at no point in time did he ever have an advantage on Maul. This is sheer stompage.

No, I am not contradicting myself at all you are just not understanding what I mean which falls on you. The point is if Maul's goal was to survive as long as Dooku did before leaving the fight he could have. Dooku can't beat Yoda either so again my point makes total sense.

Maul was arrogant and was taunting. I doubt this situation would present itself again. There was also another lightsaber in the room which he won't have in a forum fight if he gets disarmed.

Obi wasn't a good matchup to Dooku he just had his number. While Dooku smashed obi obi was still a better matchup against vader than dooku was. It's how these characters matched up.

I never said he was capable of beating yoda I stated sidious didn't have to kill him. Yoda's mission was to kill him sidious' was to survive. Yoda failed.

I could care less what your opinion of me is I am correct and have backed up my case quite well.

I've seen vaderism before rear it's ugly head in the face of logic and reason.
Page:4
Originally posted by quanchi112
I dunno. I think he can more than stalemate him in the same manner Dooku did in the time allotted for their onscreen fight.
Originally posted by quanchi112
I am saying Maul would beat Dooku nowhere did I state he can stalemate either sidious or yoda.

The fact that you outright lie and claim you didn't say someone after you said it both funny and telling. Torn if you're just a fangoy-ranter or a troll or possibly a combo.

Anyhow, one just need watch Maul's fight and Vader's fight with Obi-Wan to see Vader's faster and more agile; even employs kicks multiple times. Actaully a solid fight and a good scene, if you pay attention, enjoy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSwy412nttI

quanchi112
Originally posted by truejedi
Not obvious at all. It can be if you supply proof.

Let's see: Your reasoning here is poor:

Fighting Maul means nothing. Anyone could fight maul. I could fight maul, it means nothing.

Being a master in general means nothing. That was a COUNCIL memberJEdi Master in AOTC getting shot with 3 shots by Boba Fett. He was lousy. A Jedi Master, and lousy. So QGJ being a master does not prove he was good at combat.

As far as tutoring Obi? Seriously? how is that pertinent at all?

You need to supply something that QGJ has achieved in combat: I know a LOT about star wars, and I have nothing for you. I remember this pair running from a pair of droids in TPM.

You are completely missing out on how much Kenobi improved between TPM and ROTS. He fought a war for 14 years. He went from a novice at Ataru to a master (the master) of Soresu.

There is no comparison. Watch the movie and see how he handled himself. It's one movie it won't take you long. We've all seen the movies and if you weren't impressed and think lucas portrayed him as a terrible unskilled jedi master then you got it wrong.

Fighting Maul a competent sith as long as he did shows a lot of skill. It's pretty obvious Maul was portrayed as a badass in the film.

See the above sentence.

I see nothing on screen to show me he could defeat Maul with the improvements he made.

I mean getting tossed around by Dooku twice shows me what ?


Him beating vader shows me two things. vader's an idiot an dlost to someone he should by all accounts beat.
Vader's emotions cost him the match.

Same thing happens here it happened to obi against maul. Maul doesn't lose his cool vader always was presuit.

Werewolf582
Lightsabers only goes to maul.

All out goes to Vader.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Werewolf582
Lightsabers only goes to maul.

All out goes to Vader. Based on ?

RJ 2.0
Originally posted by quanchi112
Maul stomped qui gonn and easily bested Obi.

No, Anakin thoroughly beat him in rots but dooku stomped him as a padawan.

I am saying Maul could do the same exact thing Dooku did and stalemate him for a time and then flee. I never meant like a true stalemate. Wow.

Yoda doesn't screw around he wanted to defeat him he doesn't show off he does what needs done. he's not some arrogant fool. You don't even grasp Yoda's character. laughing out loud Maul beat Jinn by wearing him down. Jinn was the better swordsman, but Maul knew what he was doing in the Naboo saber battle. As he fought them, he was always retreating, always towards the room blocked off by the laser gates. Maul knew that if he stood his ground and faced them together without retreating, odds are he would have lost, so he separated the master from the apprentice, wore the master down, killed him, then faced the apprentice alone.

Once Jinn was isolated, Maul was able to fight more aggressively.


As for him besting Obi in a saber battle, never happened. Obi Wan was all up in Maul's grill, backing him towards the laser gates, forcing Maul to go to force powers.




Rant complete.

quanchi112
Originally posted by RJ 2.0
Maul beat Jinn by wearing him down. Jinn was the better swordsman, but Maul knew what he was doing in the Naboo saber battle. As he fought them, he was always retreating, always towards the room blocked off by the laser gates. Maul knew that if he stood his ground and faced them together without retreating, odds are he would have lost, so he separated the master from the apprentice, wore the master down, killed him, then faced the apprentice alone.

Once Jinn was isolated, Maul was able to fight more aggressively.


As for him besting Obi in a saber battle, never happened. Obi Wan was all up in Maul's grill, backing him towards the laser gates, forcing Maul to go to force powers.




Rant complete. Qui gon had the benefit of fighting maul two on one and you say maul wore him down. laughing out loud

Who wouldn't try to fight someone one on one as opposed to two on one. ?

laughing out loud

He used tactics to separate them and defeated them both via skill

Force powers and sabers to hand in hand. Force powers were also used by Palpatine who was disarmed against Yoda but he still managed to get the better of him.


Maul won by disarming his opponent who went into a rage ala Rob style.

RJ 2.0
Originally posted by quanchi112
Qui gon had the benefit of fighting maul two on one and you say maul wore him down. laughing out loud

Who wouldn't try to fight someone one on one as opposed to two on one. ?

laughing out loud

He used tactics to separate them and defeated them both via skill

Force powers and sabers to hand in hand. Force powers were also used by Palpatine who was disarmed against Yoda but he still managed to get the better of him.


Maul won by disarming his opponent who went into a rage ala Rob style.

You watch TPM at all? You seriously didn't see that Jinn was tired out right before Maul killed him?

StealthRanger
This was necroed?

And Vader stomps. It'd be like asking who'd win between Vegeta and Raditz, or Angron and Ultramarine, or Raizen and Sazaku or, whatever

quanchi112
Originally posted by RJ 2.0
You watch TPM at all? You seriously didn't see that Jinn was tired out right before Maul killed him? Thrn his conditioning sucks since maul fought two Jedi at once. Maul should have been tired due to fighting two opponents simultaneously.

Nephthys
Well Qui-Gon was like, 3 times Mauls age.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Nephthys
Well Qui-Gon was like, 3 times Mauls age. Yoda is a lot older yet he wasn't gassed in the films. Think for a second, noob.

playa1258
This is still going? Vader is easily superior and would crush Maul.

quanchi112
Originally posted by playa1258
This is still going? Vader is easily superior and would crush Maul. Based on ?

Nephthys
Originally posted by quanchi112
Yoda is a lot older yet he wasn't gassed in the films. Think for a second, noob.

Yoda is considerably more powerful than Qui-Gon.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Nephthys
Yoda is considerably more powerful than Qui-Gon. Someone can be more powerful yet tire faster. Citing old age is hilariously ignoring what older Jedi and Sith can and have done on screen.

Nephthys
Not old age, older age. Maul is both younger and more powerful than Qui-Gon. So it's only natural that he tires slower. The Force empowers their bodies, so a more powerful person will tend to last longer than a weaker one.

playa1258
Originally posted by quanchi112
Based on ? His battle against Obi-wan, and numerous ones against Dooku. His feats from the TCW, ROTS.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Nephthys
Not old age, older age. Maul is both younger and more powerful than Qui-Gon. So it's only natural that he tires slower. The Force empowers their bodies, so a more powerful person will tend to last longer than a weaker one. Based off what is Maul more powerful ?

So you agree age doesn't matter at all and that comment was useless.

quanchi112
Originally posted by playa1258
His battle against Obi-wan, and numerous ones against Dooku. His feats from the TCW, ROTS. Vader lost skill wise against Obi whereas maul beat him.

Point proven.

Time Immemorial
It comes down to who was better trained..

Maul or Vadar..

Sidious said himself he was well trained and the Jedi would be no match for him.

Vadar was trained by Obi Wan.

Sideous>Obi Wan

Its not a large leap to think Maul could take Vadar.

quanchi112
Maul definitely wins. Far more athletic and dangerous with a saber than crybaby Vader.

playa1258
Originally posted by quanchi112
Vader lost skill wise against Obi whereas maul beat him.

Point proven.

No he didn't. He lost because of he was blinded by his rage and made arrogant move.

quanchi112
Originally posted by playa1258
No he didn't. He lost because of he was blinded by his rage and made arrogant move. Maul made Obi angry yet Vader was the one angry. Maul doesn't let his hatred blind him and better focuses it. He beat Obi while Obi beat Vader's ass.

playa1258
That is funny. I remember Maul tumbling down the shaft in two pieces. What you are failing to factor in is, Obi-wan being uniquely qualified to combat Vader. Being his trainer and mentor.

Maul will not have that same advantage and is just one of any reasons Maul will be killed.

playa1258
Originally posted by Time Immemorial
It comes down to who was better trained..

Maul or Vadar..

Sidious said himself he was well trained and the Jedi would be no match for him.

Vadar was trained by Obi Wan.

Sideous>Obi Wan

Its not a large leap to think Maul could take Vadar.

Captain America has trained Tony Stark in hth combat. Is Tony a better fighter than Batman?

quanchi112
Originally posted by playa1258
That is funny. I remember Maul tumbling down the shaft in two pieces. What you are failing to factor in is, Obi-wan being uniquely qualified to combat Vader. Being his trainer and mentor.

Maul will not have that same advantage and is just one of any reasons Maul will be killed. Due to taunting. Skill wise he disarmed and had Obi beaten. I remember Vader being burned alive and pouting sounding like Robtard screaming, I hate you.



Maul wins over the psychologically compromised Vader.

dadudemon
Originally posted by quanchi112
Due to taunting. Skill wise he disarmed and had Obi beaten. I remember Vader being burned alive and pouting sounding like Robtard screaming, I hate you.

laughing laughing laughing

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.