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Who takes it.

Orion

Orion and easily

Orion destroys him.

Orion wins but not a stomp.

Orion crushes!

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Orion crushes!

no way he crushes.
NP has gone up against heavyweights the likes of Orion.
His damage soak is stupid good.
I still give a majority to Orion.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
no way he crushes.
NP has gone up against heavyweights the likes of Orion.
His damage soak is stupid good.
I still give a majority to Orion.

Most of Nova's attacks will just be absorbed or negated through the Astro Force.

Orion obliterates Nova

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Most of Nova's attacks will just be absorbed or negated through the Astro Force.

this is not an out and out stomp. astro force aside, Nova is not a lightweight anymore. he has the entirety of the nova force at his discretion. at his best, he can eff with ure gravity like no one's business. his physical and energy damage soak is off the charts. a forum fight Nova can be tough to beat because of his grav based powers. he can also absorb energy and redirect it back at his opponents.

Gravity? Orion can control all the fundamental forces in the universe. And has way more experiencing in controlling energy and many tpes/formes of energy. See when he matched and contained energy destroying energies. Oblivion bomb.

are u telling me Orion can control gravity better than Nova Prime?

Not necessarily, but I think he could negate those attacks.

Pretty sure orions motherbox controls gravity better than nova without even factoring in the astro force

Originally posted by Gecko4lif
Pretty sure orions motherbox controls gravity better than nova without even factoring in the astro force


hmm...

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
are u telling me Orion can control gravity better than Nova Prime?

Definitely not, but he's routinely up against forces and foes who have the ability to summon the gravity of 'galaxies' enough to casually stop even Superman in his tracks. Even Apokolips' normal forces have gravity altering devices. Pretty common stuff.

Originally posted by Desaad
Definitely not, but he's routinely up against forces and foes who have the ability to summon the gravity of 'galaxies' enough to casually stop even Superman in his tracks. Even Apokolips' normal forces have gravity altering devices. Pretty common stuff.


all im saying is that its not an out and out stomp like some folks believe. NP has shown enough he belongs in the big leagues. he has also shown he can "rise" to the occasion when forced to do so like going up against Sphinx with 2 Ka stones and killing Annihilus.

Eh, different strokes. I think it's the same out and out stomp that it was when the Surfer went up against Nova -- ie, Nova had zero chance against him. That's what I expect here, for him to get utterly handled. Because I see the two of them as roughly on par.

And the whole 'rising the occasion' is a standard trope of every hero ever. It's just the way these things work. I could name a half dozen for probably every major character around.

Not saying it isn't to be taken into account, but that hardly is something unique, you know?

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
all im saying is that its not an out and out stomp like some folks believe. NP has shown enough he belongs in the big leagues. he has also shown he can "rise" to the occasion when forced to do so like going up against Sphinx with 2 Ka stones and killing Annihilus.


Desaad, how is Orion in the speed department combat wise? Could he nullify Nova from blitzing?

Originally posted by Desaad
And the whole 'rising the occasion' is a standard trope of every hero ever. It's just the way these things work. I could name a half dozen for probably every major character around.

Not saying it isn't to be taken into account, but that hardly is something unique, you know?


the point im trying to make is not that he is the only superhero who does this. the point making is the instances in which he's risen to the occasion are some pretty uber stuff.

Originally posted by dmills



Desaad, how is Orion in the speed department combat wise? Could he nullify Nova from blitzing?


trust me dmills. Orion is pretty darn fast. an initial blitz from NP can be negated or even be matched with a speed blitz of his own. (Orion that is) Orion is a beast.

He's solid enough that it doesn't tend to come into play when he's going up against characters like Lightray (who moves faster than light) and Superman (who is about as variable as Nova but at least as capable of moving at high combat speeds, if not moreso).

His actually demonstrated speed isn't anything astounding -- little showings here and there, catching bullets and throwing them back from behind the back, moving faster than anyone can see, etc -- but combined with his preternatural skill it's apparently sufficient enough that he's good to go against anyone.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
the point im trying to make is not that he is the only superhero who does this. the point making is the instances in which he's risen to the occasion are some pretty uber stuff.

Yeah, sure, cool. I'm just saying I don't see that as the average of what he's capable of -- and those kinds of showings are very 'normal'. GLs, Silver Surfer, Orion, Thor, Superman, Wonder Woman, etc have all done similar things against similarly absurd foes or odds.

What we do know is that, in general, against legit elite top tiers (Surfer, Xenith) Nova/Rich doesn't perform so well. And, lets be honest, Orion is in a lot of ways a combo of Surfer and Xenith.

Originally posted by Desaad
Eh, different strokes. I think it's the same out and out stomp that it was when the Surfer went up against Nova -- ie, Nova had zero chance against him. That's what I expect here, for him to get utterly handled. Because I see the two of them as roughly on par. You base this on that non fight? Besides, in TI they seemed to be portrayed on equal footing. At least in terms of how they got utterly stomped by Mar-vell

hmm... i disagree with np not performing well against xenith. a regular centurion who has an insignificant fraction of NP's power kept her at bay for a long period of time.

Originally posted by dmills
You base this on that non fight? Besides, in TI they seemed to be portrayed on equal footing. At least in terms of how they got utterly stomped byMar-vell

So you'd argue that Surfer didn't seem far and away more powerful/capable than Nova in their interaction? That seems like...denial to me, to be perfectly frank.

And getting stomped by the same villain doesn't mean they are on the same level, or else Spiderman and Thor are on the same level.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
hmm... i disagree with np not performing well against xenith. a regular centurion who has an insignificant fraction of NP's power kept her at bay for a long period of time.

But full on Nova could only win with bullshits and tricks, not with out and out power/strength/combat skill.

Anyway, what it comes down to is, for me, I don't see Nova as an elite top tier. Maybe he was and he never got the chance to show it, but either way he never demonstrated it to me.

I see Orion as a very, very elite top tier, along with Thor, and Silver Surfer and Green Lantern (Hal).

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
hmm... i disagree with np not performing well against xenith. a regular centurion who has an insignificant fraction of NP's power kept her at bay for a long period of time. I think what he means is that he would have preferred to see an out and out stomp, which would've put him firmly in the HH tier in a lot of eyes. But because DnA used that stupid psionic plot device it tarnished the win in many eyes.

Originally posted by Desaad
But full on Nova could only win with bullshits and tricks, not with out and out power/strength/combat skill.


why would he prolong a fight he knows he could end much faster? he's a hero after all. as sadistic as she may be, he wasnt gonna go on a prolonged fight to beat that shiet out of a crazy female. that was more of a scuffle not a battle.

Lots of excuses, and they might be more acceptable if he hadn't consistently demonstrated an inability or unwillingness to engage and defeat genuine top tier foes.

I don't know that he had even one under his belt, did he?

Originally posted by Desaad
Lots of excuses, and they might be more acceptable if he hadn't consistently demonstrated an inability or unwillingness to engage and defeat genuine top tier foes.

I don't know that he had even one under his belt, did he?


he still beat her didnt he? he stil used a part of his powerset to KO her @$$ in the end. ure actually the one making an excuse on how she lost.

Well he used part of his power set to defeat her via weakness exploitation, yeah. It was a nice bit of ingenuity, certainly, but again we're talking about POWER here. It's the type of win Spiderman gets against vastly superior foes all the time.

Originally posted by Desaad
So you'd argue that Surfer didn't seem far and away more powerful/capable than Nova in their interaction? That seems like...denial to me, to be perfectly frank.

And getting stomped by the same villain doesn't mean they are on the same level, or else Spiderman and Thor are on the same level. The dialogue gave that impression sure. But nothing that happened on panel imo. Neither did any serious damage and Nova got the better end of the one serious exchange they had. Do you deny that?

At any rate I like most consider Norrin at the top of the food chain of the HH. But in the end I think he beats Nova because quite honestly, he's just a horrible match up for Rich, much like Hal would be. People like Thor and Supes are elite HH as well, but Rich has the tools to beat either one if them imo. Styles make fights.

I was just BSing about that Mar-vell thing man lol!

he did beat an Annihilus after all when the Qbands abandoned him. he was left with just his own powers like the cosmic control rod.

Originally posted by Desaad
Lots of excuses, and they might be more acceptable if he hadn't consistently demonstrated an inability or unwillingness to engage and defeat genuine top tier foes.

I don't know that he had even one under his belt, did he? Who are all of these top tiers that you're referring to? To my knowledge he's fought Super Nova (above top tier) Glads, Kraa, Namor, Surfer (if you want to call it a fight) Thor (classic mind control hero on hero fight), Annihilus, a mature Technarch (prolly above top tier), Ego and Sphinx (both defiantly above top tier).

At the very worst he stalemated Thor and Glads, killed the bug (who was prolly above top tier in Annihilation), killed(?) Sphinx after fighting through his blasts, stalemated the Technarch, ko'd Ego etc. Point being that when he goes up against them he damn sure doesn't have a legit loss.

The Xenith fight isn't even worth the trouble. She proved to be little more then a nuisance in the end. The guy was literally reading his computer while she punched him lol.

Super Nova above Top Tier? Why?

At the worst his fights were stalemates against Thor and Gladiator? At worst they were Nova getting his ass kicked without doing anything to his opponents (Outside of absorbing Gladiator's heat vision thing but that put hurt him more than it did Gladiator IIRC)

It was made painfully clear that his was beneath Thor and Gladiator just as it was made clear that he was below Surfer.

His gotten more than one upgrade over the years, but it's always been rather clear that his below Top Tiers in power whenever I've seen him encounter them.

Haha. Dude, you need to take the Nova shades off.

Don't remember the Ego or Techarch fight (Didn't he just lobotomize Ego temporarily?) but if the rest of your post is any indication, shit was not impressive.

I do remember the Sphinx fight recently, and he had an impressive feat where he blocked Sphinx's attack for a few moments.

Edit: Not to mock Nova, as his formidable obviously, but his not going to be beating Top Tiers like Orion, Surfer, Thor etc. straight up. Just isn't happening from what I've seen. Using smarts, quick thinking, and versatility, possibly, but those kind of characters didn't survive as long as they have without having those traits as well. Nova legit Mid Herald at least.

He didnt fight a technarch iirc so much as just suicide bomb it

Can't believe no one's said this yet, but: ORION SOLOES

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Super Nova above Top Tier? Why?

At the worst his fights were stalemates against Thor and Gladiator? At worst they were Nova getting his ass kicked without doing anything to his opponents (Outside of absorbing Gladiator's heat vision thing but that put hurt him more than it did Gladiator IIRC)

It was made painfully clear that his was beneath Thor and Gladiator just as it was made clear that he was below Surfer.

His gotten more than one upgrade over the years, but it's always been rather clear that his below Top Tiers in power whenever I've seen him encounter them.

Haha. Dude, you need to take the Nova shades off.

Don't remember the Ego or Techarch fight (Didn't he just lobotomize Ego temporarily?) but if the rest of your post is any indication, shit was not impressive.

I do remember the Sphinx fight recently, and he had an impressive feat where he blocked Sphinx's attack for a few moments.

Edit: Not to mock Nova, as his formidable obviously, but his not going to be beating Top Tiers like Orion, Surfer, Thor etc. straight up. Just isn't happening from what I've seen. Using smarts, quick thinking, and versatility, possibly, but those kind of characters didn't survive as long as they have without having those traits as well. Nova legit Mid Herald at least.

The only thing laughable is the fact that you predictably come running in here at the first mention of your boy

On a serious note, dude those fights were stalemates no matter how you slice it period. Of course it was made obvious that Glads and Thor were above him back then. He wasn't anywhere near as powerful as he is now lol! Funny thing is that he still handled his business.

No you don't recall correctly. (The attack drained him, it was only to that point the second time he used it. As he got used to using energy absorption it became easier for him to do it). Glads was the one that got phucked up.

Look brah you can stop with the "Nova glasses" crap. I have my favs just as you have yours, but I call it like I see it. If I believe Dick can win I say so and try and give my reasons why. If I don't think he'd win then I'll say as much. And if I don't know what the hell I'm talking about when it comes to a given character (hint hint), then I stay out of it. Either way I'm no more of a Nova fan then you're a Thor fan or Pr is a Supes fan. Unless I'm phucking around, I try and provide reasons and facts as to why I say the shit I do. If I'm wrong I say that as well.

Originally posted by Gecko4lif
He didnt fight a technarch iirc so much as just suicide bomb it Nah you don't recall correctly. Nova was fighting the Technarch to give Tyro time to escape. Tyro is the one that suicide bombed it. I'll post the whole thing after I give my kid a bath.

Orion but not easily.

Orion is overall more powerful but Nova is easily more versatile.

Yeah, it's not an easy fight as some believe it to be.

Nova Prime is stronger than ever now, and Orion will need his Astro Force and Mother Box to win this match.

Orion does win eventually. Nova Prime is still not quite in the same league.. yet(?)

Originally posted by Gecko4lif
He didnt fight a technarch iirc so much as just suicide bomb it As promised..


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