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FC Gladiator
Silver Surfer
Super Skrull(+ Gem of Cyttorak)


VS.

Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Flash, Steel, Green Lantern ,and the Martian Manhunter

MM solos ermm

Batman vs F***ing Surfer, is this really up for discussion?

Batman would be in the van doing Intel....
And MM dies.....slow...

Originally posted by Hitman911
Batman would be in the van doing Intel....
And MM dies.....slow...


MM mind controls the two chumps and they g-bang dear Norrin.

Originally posted by Bentley
MM mind controls the two chumps and they g-bang dear Norrin. Is that b4 or after he's blasted into nothingness? Cuz once Kl'irt senses his presence.....furious bye bye

Originally posted by Hitman911
FC Gladiator
Silver Surfer
Super Skrull(+ Gem of Cyttorak)


VS.

Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Flash, Steel, Green Lantern ,and the Martian Manhunter

What's Batman going to do? Cheer from the sidelines

Seriously, is this even up for debate? Once the Surfer makes Superman his *****, and Gladiator or Super Skrull reduce the Manhunter to ash it's only a matter of time.

Super Skrull with virtually immunity to damage and defense vs mind attacks would be pretty stupidly powerful.

I know, right? He'd be just below J'onn's level.

Batman would just randomly walk in on Surfer's team and wipe the floor with them, so J'onn wouldn't even have to fight.

JLA wins handily.

Gladiator, Surfer and K'lrt win, mainly due to K'lrt being invincible

JLA wins.
Surfer and SS put up a good fight, Glads has no place being here.

Originally posted by Don Corleone
What's Batman going to do? Cheer from the sidelines no

he has a chat with surfer about what what the term "big guns" means after surfer kills the justice league.

Originally posted by Nihilist
JLA wins.
Surfer and SS put up a good fight, Glads has no place being here.

Hater...

Silver Surfer and his crew wins.

Originally posted by carver9
Hater...

Silver Surfer and his crew wins.

Even if he is, you can still hate something and still be right. Which he is.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Even if he is, you can still hate something and still be right. Which he is.

Lol...OMG...

Pr, he isn't right... not even close to being right.

Originally posted by carver9
Lol...OMG...

Pr, he isn't right... not even close to being right.

Yes he is.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Yes he is.

Please tell me you are playing?

Originally posted by carver9
Please tell me you are playing?

Nope.

His post:

Originally posted by Nihilist
JLA wins.
Surfer and SS put up a good fight, Glads has no place being here.

Means that Gladiator is the weakest on his team, which he is.

He's not doing well considering his team is outnumbered two to one, and he'll be the first to go down on his team.

So no, Nihilist is right, if slightly exagerrated.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Nope.

His post:



Means that Gladiator is the weakest on his team, which he is.

He's not doing well considering his team is outnumbered two to one, and he'll be the first to go down on his team.

So no, Nihilist is right, if slightly exagerrated.

The only way I would say that Glads would have a problem is if Supes attacks him from the beginning but if that's not the case, a double team with these peeps, he could handle. A good dose of heat vision or one of glads punches would rock martian manhunter. Look what black adam did to him with a single punch and going by all of the people gladiator has one shotted, I can't see mm doing any better along with anyone else (besides Supes).

If he can take on and defeat a galactic force that also consisted of Super humans and defeat them, he will not have a problem with a double team from these peeps. If he can hang and defeat some nova corps member with nothing but brute strength and speed, he will not have a problem here with a double team.

Originally posted by carver9
The only way I would say that Glads would have a problem is if Supes attacks him from the beginning but if that's not the case, a double team with these peeps, he could handle. A good dose of heat vision or one of glads punches would rock martian manhunter. Look what black adam did to him with a single punch and going by all of the people gladiator has one shotted, I can't see mm doing any better along with anyone else (besides Supes).

If he can take on and defeat a galactic force that also consisted of Super humans and defeat them, he will not have a problem with a double team from these peeps. If he can hang and defeat some nova corps member with nothing but brute strength and speed, he will not have a problem here with a double team.

He couldn't handle a double team from most of the people on that team at all. You're severly lowballing the JLA.

If weakness exploitation is allowed, Supes and MM are going to die very, very quickly, along with bats, leaving Flash, WW, GL, and Steel against the three. Flash and the lasso will get some wins, but I think team one will take this 7-7.5/10

Originally posted by -Pr-
He couldn't handle a double team from most of the people on that team at all. You're severly lowballing the JLA.

I also think Supes could handle a double team from certain individuals on that team depending on how they fight vs Supes. Gladiator doesn't hold back at all and imo he is faster and stronger than the peeps that's will be double teaming, including him being more durable.

Its not me lowballing them, I just think gladiator is that powerful, especially against people that tend to hold back more often than him.

Have a question... do you consider diana to be more durable than black bolt?

Originally posted by Simbon
If weakness exploitation is allowed, Supes and MM are going to die very, very quickly, along with bats, leaving Flash, WW, GL, and Steel against the three. Flash and the lasso will get some wins, but I think team one will take this 7-7.5/10

Weakness exploitation is a half-argument at best imo. It's not a definite win, assuming they can even exploit said weaknesses.

Originally posted by carver9
I also think Supes could handle a double team from certain individuals on that team depending on how they fight vs Supes. Gladiator doesn't hold back at all and imo he is faster and stronger than the peeps that's will be double teaming, including him being more durable.

Its not me lowballing them, I just think gladiator is that powerful, especially against people that tend to hold back more often than him.

Have a question... do you consider diana to be more durable than black bolt?

then you'd be wrong. Gladiator isn't that powerful (and i'm still waiting for feats to illustrate his supposed power level), and isn't one shotting most of that team.

i don't know enough about Black Bolt to judge how durable he is.

though if you're seriously about to argue that Gladiator could one shot Diana, you're going to have to bring some serious evidence to the table.

Ill post some feats when I get off of work.

The JLA wins.

Diana probably is more durable then BB.

Not by much though.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Diana probably is more durable then BB.

Not by much though.

I agree...

Has anyone seen the fight when an amped black bolt attacked gladiator and then the shiar crew shoots black bolt with an energy weapon that took the amp away and gladiator one punch ko him?

This happened during war of kings.

Diana is faster than Gladiator combat wise. She can get her bracers up to block the punch. He isn't getting through that shield.

Without her shield, she's been hit by a Superman that apparently "wasn't holding back" and survived. That tops anything Gladiator can hit her with.

Add in the mountains of other people she's taken shots from, and she's not getting one-shotted.

Saying she would is lowballing of the highest (lowest?) order.

even current wonder woman?

Originally posted by carver9
I agree...

Has anyone seen the fight when an amped black bolt attacked gladiator and then the shiar crew shoots black bolt with an energy weapon that took the amp away and gladiator one punch ko him?

This happened during war of kings. Ummm...no it didn't.

Unless there is some War of Kings Crossover I am unaware of.

Which War of kings did this happen in?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Diana is faster than Gladiator combat wise. She can get her bracers up to block the punch. He isn't getting through that shield.

Without her shield, she's been hit by a Superman that apparently "wasn't holding back" and survived. That tops anything Gladiator can hit her with.

Add in the mountains of other people she's taken shots from, and she's not getting one-shotted.

Saying she would is lowballing of the highest (lowest?) order.

This is where we disagree since I think Glads is physically superior to supes in EVERY way possible. His long fight against Supreme (who is an established pre crisis superman clone) proves that he is above supes physically.

To each his own.

JLA stomp, the marvel wankage is getting a little extreme here...u guys are seriously under estimating Hal, Barry and Diana.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
even current wonder woman?

lol of course not.

Originally posted by carver9
This is where we disagree since I think Glads is physically superior to supes in EVERY way possible. His long fight against Supreme (who is an established pre crisis superman clone) proves that he is above supes physically.

To each his own.

One fight doesn't prove anything, especially going by the rules of this forum.

And Current Superman fought the ACTUAL Pre-Crisis Superman and held his own. So there is that.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
JLA stomp, the marvel wankage is getting a little extreme here...u guys are seriously under estimating Hal, Barry and Diana. super skrull has gem of cytorrak (power of juggernaut)

Originally posted by -Pr-
lol of course not.



One fight doesn't prove anything, especially going by the rules of this forum.

And Current Superman fought the ACTUAL Pre-Crisis Superman and held his own. So there is that.


Its pretty much ALL of his feats that make me believe he is above Supes but honestly, I don't want to talk about those 2 being over the other because I have a feeling its going to lead to me receiving a warning. I never stated that superman wasn't powerful because all in all, he is.

Originally posted by Starscream M
super skrull has gem of cytorrak (power of juggernaut)

your point, he can still be mind raped

Originally posted by carver9
Its pretty much ALL of his feats that make me believe he is above Supes but honestly, I don't want to talk about those 2 being over the other because I have a feeling its going to lead to me receiving a warning. I never stated that superman wasn't powerful because all in all, he is.

the ones you posted were nothing Superman couldn't do or hadn't exceeded, though.

You keep saying "going by feats" Gladiator is more powerful.

WHAT FEATS?

the ones where you just disregard most of the Superman ones because they'll make mister mohawk look bad?

Yes, Gladiator is powerful. Yes, he's a force to be reckoned with, but there is NOTHING in his library that puts him above current Suprman. Zero if you've read both characters, and you obviously haven't read enough Superman.

Either that or it's just blind fanboy hate. I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt here.

Originally posted by Starscream M
super skrull has gem of cytorrak (power of juggernaut)

he can still be bfr'd or psychically attacked.

JLA Wins.

Green Lantern and Diana vs Silver Surfer

Superman and Steel vs Gladiator

Martian Manhunter and Flash vs Super Skrull


Batman sacrifices himself, his death will give the JLA a 50% stats boosts and bloodlust. Believe it.

Originally posted by Placidity
JLA Wins.

Green Lantern and Diana vs Silver Surfer

Superman and Steel vs Gladiator

Martian Manhunter and Flash vs Super Skrull


Yes. If I was calling teams I'd swap Flash and Steel (invisible forcefields are good against Flash), but it's pretty solid in any case.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Diana is faster than Gladiator combat wise. She can get her bracers up to block the punch. He isn't getting through that shield.

Without her shield, she's been hit by a Superman that apparently "wasn't holding back" and survived. That tops anything Gladiator can hit her with.

Add in the mountains of other people she's taken shots from, and she's not getting one-shotted.

Saying she would is lowballing of the highest (lowest?) order.

Diana wouldn't get one-shotted by glads, but unless she pulled a lasso win she would lose; while she might block punches with her bracers, Gladiator would beat her via wrestling attacks. Still, not a great match-up for Glads as it would be a long fight.

In terms of Glads' strength and durability, I think Carver's reasoning (and correct me if I'm wrong, Carver), is that whereas Superman's power exists somewhere between his high and low feats, if Gladiator's low-feats are due to low-confidence, then at high-confidence Gladiator's "average" power is higher than Superman's (which I think is true), but ONLY if the thread stipulates "full-confidence" Gladiator, which it does not.

Originally posted by Simbon
Diana wouldn't get one-shotted by glads, but unless she pulled a lasso win she would lose; while she might block punches with her bracers, Gladiator would beat her via wrestling attacks. Still, not a great match-up for Glads as it would be a long fight.

In terms of Glads' strength and durability, I think Carver's reasoning (and correct me if I'm wrong, Carver), is that whereas Superman's power exists somewhere between his high and low feats, if Gladiator's low-feats are due to low-confidence, then at high-confidence Gladiator's "average" power is higher than Superman's (which I think is true), but ONLY if the thread stipulates "full-confidence" Gladiator, which it does not.


well isnt full-confidence kind of a hyperbole? it dificult to properly gauge, its like saying full potential iceman or some other crap

Originally posted by Simbon
Diana wouldn't get one-shotted by glads, but unless she pulled a lasso win she would lose; while she might block punches with her bracers, Gladiator would beat her via wrestling attacks. Still, not a great match-up for Glads as it would be a long fight.

In terms of Glads' strength and durability, I think Carver's reasoning (and correct me if I'm wrong, Carver), is that whereas Superman's power exists somewhere between his high and low feats, if Gladiator's low-feats are due to low-confidence, then at high-confidence Gladiator's "average" power is higher than Superman's (which I think is true), but ONLY if the thread stipulates "full-confidence" Gladiator, which it does not.

I have literally zero issue with Gladiator beating Diana. It could happen. I just take exception to people lowballing characters to the point that they come out with something like "x gets one-shotted".

and it's always the same damn characters too.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
well isnt full-confidence kind of a hyperbole? it dificult to properly gauge, its like saying full potential iceman or some other crap

Of course, I totally agree. There are a lot of these: Full-confidence Gladiator, full-strength Galactus, full-potential Iceman, non-jobbing Apocalypse...

I am frankly astonished that no one has yet introduced full-anger Hulk yet; just ways people have of putting characters in fights where they can ignore low-showings.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I have literally zero issue with Gladiator beating Diana. It could happen. I just take exception to people lowballing characters to the point that they come out with something like "x gets one-shotted".

and it's always the same damn characters too.

Yeah, I don't think anyone under skyfather is going to one-shot Diana. Not even those with "sky-father stength".

Originally posted by Simbon
Diana wouldn't get one-shotted by glads, but unless she pulled a lasso win she would lose; while she might block punches with her bracers, Gladiator would beat her via wrestling attacks. Still, not a great match-up for Glads as it would be a long fight.

In terms of Glads' strength and durability, I think Carver's reasoning (and correct me if I'm wrong, Carver), is that whereas Superman's power exists somewhere between his high and low feats, if Gladiator's low-feats are due to low-confidence, then at high-confidence Gladiator's "average" power is higher than Superman's (which I think is true), but ONLY if the thread stipulates "full-confidence" Gladiator, which it does not.

This is EXACTLY what I am saying and he really doesn't have any low end showing if yu actually look at it. One instance is him taking on the fantastic four and him pounding on cap shield but even then, he one shotted thing and basically destroyed the fantastic four and the xmen/skrulls.

Then we have the cannonball instance but again, he was annihilating cannonball and cannonball along with glads admitted that glads was toying with him.


The rest of his showings is beastly.

I will post some in a minute.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
well isnt full-confidence kind of a hyperbole? it dificult to properly gauge, its like saying full potential iceman or some other crap Iceman is always at full potential Gladz could only hope and dream to be in the same league as Robert Drake. Gladz has a pic of Iceman as his wallpaper . Swap Gladz with Iceman and team one wins otherwise the Jla ferociously dismantles these chumps

Originally posted by -Pr-
the ones you posted were nothing Superman couldn't do or hadn't exceeded, though.

You keep saying "going by feats" Gladiator is more powerful.

WHAT FEATS?

the ones where you just disregard most of the Superman ones because they'll make mister mohawk look bad?

Yes, Gladiator is powerful. Yes, he's a force to be reckoned with, but there is NOTHING in his library that puts him above current Suprman. Zero if you've read both characters, and you obviously haven't read enough Superman.

Either that or it's just blind fanboy hate. I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt here.



he can still be bfr'd or psychically attacked. people just don't like big blue because he's perhaps the only DC flagship bigger than batman.

Supes is far beneath Glads.

Going from memory,

Glads has busted a planet.

Kal has busted a moon.

Glads has gone at 100 FTL, kept up with a ship in hyperspace, and intereacted with people cut off from the timestream on sheer speed.

Kal is a hair slower than Jay Garrick.





This is all irrelevant since Surfer can solo of course.

Originally posted by moonknight11
Supes is far beneath Glads.

Going from memory,

Glads has busted a planet.

Kal has busted a moon.

Glads has gone at 100 FTL, kept up with a ship in hyperspace, and intereacted with people cut off from the timestream on sheer speed.

Kal is a hair slower than Jay Garrick.





This is all irrelevant since Surfer can solo of course. Per the forums rules your post is 100% wrong

Originally posted by carver9
This is where we disagree since I think Glads is physically superior to supes in EVERY way possible. His long fight against Supreme (who is an established pre crisis superman clone) proves that he is above supes physically.

To each his own.
I agree. People shouldn't underestimate Gladiator. Anyone that can move an entire planet by himself is not to be taken lightly. Combine that with Surfers power cosmic and a Cyttorak powered Super Skrull the JLA would be cannon fodder. K'lirt or Gladiator could take out Manhunter, Surfer takes out Superman, and the Green Lantern (he's done it before). Either of the three could take out Steel or Flash. Gladiator or Surfer would take out Wonder Woman, as for Batman, unless he has a "turn the Marvel heros into mere humans" gadget on his utility belt then he's doesn't have a prayer.

We dont use crossovers as evidence of anything.

Originally posted by iceman24567
Per the forums rules your post is 100% wrong




Nope.

Originally posted by moonknight11
Nope. This post just proves you didnt read the rules good job

Originally posted by Simbon
Diana wouldn't get one-shotted by glads, but unless she pulled a lasso win she would lose; while she might block punches with her bracers, Gladiator would beat her via wrestling attacks. Still, not a great match-up for Glads as it would be a long fight.

In terms of Glads' strength and durability, I think Carver's reasoning (and correct me if I'm wrong, Carver), is that whereas Superman's power exists somewhere between his high and low feats, if Gladiator's low-feats are due to low-confidence, then at high-confidence Gladiator's "average" power is higher than Superman's (which I think is true), but ONLY if the thread stipulates "full-confidence" Gladiator, which it does not. Ummm Yes it does my friend....."FC Gladiator" = Full Confidence Gladiator. That means there is NO thought in his mind that says he shouln't Pwn any and everyone on the field.
Also no one will bfr Klr't.... 1. The gem would amp the base strength of the Thing making him>>>>>>Juggy as far as strength. 2. He can fly 3. The only one that can see him coming is Kal who im sure will be occupied.
4. Unlike the other clowns on the Marvel team Kli'rt wont hold back which spell a yukky mess for the JLA....
5. Superman would HAVE to address him leaving the rest of his team in GRAVE Danger....

Originally posted by iceman24567
This post just proves you didnt read the rules good job

I must have missed the rule about Superman always getting an autowin


Anyway would you like to prove me wrong?

Originally posted by moonknight11
I must have missed the rule about Superman always getting an autowin


Anyway would you like to prove me wrong? I don't have to if you use Gladz one time going 100X the speed of light in hyper space feat it's obvious you are going to high ball him and it's also obvious Surfer won't be soloing them burden to prove anything is on you my friend

^ FC Glads?

Originally posted by Deadline
^ FC Glads? Do you think FC Gladz can go 100X the speed of light in this fight on forums?

Originally posted by iceman24567
Do you think FC Gladz can go 100X the speed of light in this fight on forums? hyperspace is just a plot device of sorts to allow characters to go fast as shit without tearing the universe/a nearby celestial object to shreds

shifting into it is a conscious decision (for the most part)

Originally posted by psycho gundam
hyperspace is just a plot device of sorts to allow characters to go fast as shit without tearing the universe/a nearby celestial object to shreds

shifting into it is a conscious decision Ok mr smarty pants

Originally posted by iceman24567
Do you think FC Gladz can go 100X the speed of light in this fight on forums?

I guess the problem is that he went that speed travelling not fighting.

Originally posted by iceman24567
Do you think FC Gladz can go 100X the speed of light in this fight on forums?


do you think Iceman will ever be more than a B level backgroud X-Man ?

Originally posted by Deadline
I guess the problem is that he went that speed travelling not fighting. Hmm yeah your right in a battle i suppose it doesn't matter
Originally posted by Sin I AM
do you think Iceman will ever be more than a B level backgroud X-Man ?
What did i tell you about sassyin me woman sneer
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v207/iceman2456/pimp-hand-superman-pimphand-demotivational-poster-1215028437.jpg

Its kinda hard to call this one without more information on their environment. If they are in an inhabited town, i think this fight tips in the marvel teams favor drastically. Superman has shown before that he isn't all that fast when it comes to fighting either. He has also shown that he is foolish enough to stand toe-to-toe with one of the few enemies he fights that is strong enough to even hurt him, and guess what, he died, rather horribly. All-in-all, id say that Gladiator and supes duke it out until the surfer and skrull can kill the other members of the team. Once its three on one, Supes falls like the rest.

The biggest fight breaker here is the surfer. The seriously underestimated fighter can travel through stars and blackholes, he can fire projectiles powerful enough to destroy entire planets. He is also able to travel extremely quickly. The combination is devastating, he'll be quick enough to catch the flash, and his projectiles strong enough to kill anybody in the JLA.

It would be a good fight, but Team Marvel takes it.

Originally posted by carver9
Hater...

Silver Surfer and his crew wins. No hatin involved, Glads is weaker than Surfer all round by a long way and is weaker than SuperSkrull with the Cyttorak gem plus his other powers put him above Glads making him the weakest of the three.

JLA win, too many guys to deal with when it ends up with just only 2 of the 3 left standing

Originally posted by DarkestSonata
Its kinda hard to call this one without more information on their environment. If they are in an inhabited town, i think this fight tips in the marvel teams favor drastically. Superman has shown before that he isn't all that fast when it comes to fighting either. He has also shown that he is foolish enough to stand toe-to-toe with one of the few enemies he fights that is strong enough to even hurt him, and guess what, he died, rather horribly. All-in-all, id say that Gladiator and supes duke it out until the surfer and skrull can kill the other members of the team. Once its three on one, Supes falls like the rest.

The biggest fight breaker here is the surfer. The seriously underestimated fighter can travel through stars and blackholes, he can fire projectiles powerful enough to destroy entire planets. He is also able to travel extremely quickly. The combination is devastating, he'll be quick enough to catch the flash, and his projectiles strong enough to kill anybody in the JLA.

It would be a good fight, but Team Marvel takes it.
I completely disagree. Superboy Prime is faster than Surfer by a large degree and even he was puddy in a Flash's speed force dump. Wonder Woman and Superman would kick Gladiator's ass. Too bad Martian Manhunter defeats Glads and SS with in the first few seconds of the fight.

Originally posted by Nihilist
No hatin involved, Glads is weaker than Surfer all round by a long way and is weaker than SuperSkrull with the Cyttorak gem plus his other powers put him above Glads making him the weakest of the three.



Hes still very useful.

Originally posted by Deadline
Hes still very useful. How is he useful against DC's most powerful telepath? At least Surfer has good Telepathic resistance. Gladiator nor SS have any TP resistance what so ever.

Originally posted by DianaFan
How is he useful against DC's most powerful telepath? At least Surfer has good Telepathic resistance. Gladiator nor SS have any TP resistance what so ever.

I could see a FC Gladiator with tp resistance, also MM will be fighting SS with cyk gem.

Originally posted by Deadline
I could see a FC Gladiator with tp resistance, also MM will be fighting SS with cyk gem.


Huh? Why? J'onz can tp blast everyone at once.

Okay.


Reed Richards built a device that allowed him to speed himself and other up through time-dilation. He, Thor, and the rest of the FF spent more than two weeks in between a fraction of a second. Glads was able to interact with them and fight the hypersped up thor. Show me a comparable Superman feat. If you don't you have lost the debate. I'll wait.


Silver Surfer has : gone Lightyears in seconds(multiple times), searched the earth in a handful of seconds, traveled through time on sheer speed, and shrugged off a black hole. Show me a comparable Superman/Superboy Prime feat. I'll wait.

Huh... Anyone with nanosecond reaction times (read: Quasar, for example) is faster than a week in a fraction of a second.

Wikipedia: "One nanosecond is to one second as one second is to 31.7 years."

Originally posted by moonknight11
Okay.


Reed Richards built a device that allowed him to speed himself and other up through time-dilation. He, Thor, and the rest of the FF spent more than two weeks in between a fraction of a second. Glads was able to interact with them and fight the hypersped up thor. Show me a comparable Superman feat. If you don't you have lost the debate. I'll wait.


Silver Surfer has : gone Lightyears in seconds(multiple times), searched the earth in a handful of seconds, traveled through time on sheer speed, and shrugged off a black hole. Show me a comparable Superman/Superboy Prime feat. I'll wait. I don't even understand what you want to debate so i lose?

Originally posted by iceman24567
I don't even understand what you want to debate so i lose?




So I give you speed feats, ask you for speed feats, and you don't know what's going on? Oh dear.

Originally posted by Bentley
Huh... Anyone with nanosecond reaction times (read: Quasar, for example) is faster than a week in a fraction of a second.

Wikipedia: "One nanosecond is to one second as one second is to 31.7 years."

I'll put this way. The Tech Reed used pretty much separated them form the timeline. Gladiator overcame the time barrier on sheer speed. Akin to how Flash and Sufer travel through time on sheer speed.

Originally posted by moonknight11


So I give you speed feats, ask you for speed feats, and you don't know what's going on? Oh dear. lol ok what the hell do you want from me?

Originally posted by Bentley
Huh? Why? J'onz can tp blast everyone at once.

I know, nevermind.

Originally posted by moonknight11
I'll put this way. The Tech Reed used pretty much separated them form the timeline. Gladiator overcame the time barrier on sheer speed. Akin to how Flash and Sufer travel through time on sheer speed.

Oh, so there was a time barrier to break? I may have the issue, can you give me the issue number so I can get the context of the feat?

Why is this moonknight guy commenting on travel speed as if it matter in this fight? Well the trio can use their average herald level flight speed to run away i guess

Originally posted by iceman24567
Why is this moonknight guy commenting on travel speed as if it matter in this fight? Well the trio can use their average herald level flight speed to run away i guess

he thinks its equal to combat speed perhaps?

Originally posted by Sin I AM
he thinks its equal to combat speed perhaps? Looks so poor kid referencing and posting irrelevant things

lol WHAT DOES IT ALL MEAN!!!

Superman has scanned earth instantly with both his hearing and his vision. At different times.

He's flown far faster than light.

Superman has existed inside a black hole for a considerable amount of time, and then flew out of it. Under his own power.

Superman has taken planet busting shots and tanked them fine.

The JlA is also a team. Very well versed in group combat. All of them have very high speed feats. Flash can also speed his entire team up so fast that they can come up with a whole plan before the other team can form thought. You also have Manhunter who can link his team. The JLA can fight as one superfast unit without uttering one word to each other. MM's telepathy or Diana's lasso take out SS. Superman can take out Gladiator on his own. Infinite man was some crazy god killer abstract type and Superman actually put up as good a fight as Orion did in Death of New Gods. I doubt Gladiator has any feat that outs him anywhere near Infinite man. Silver Surfer can beat anyone on Jla but, depending on who, would take a long time. He would have to exaust Green Lantern to beat him. Not likely given this is a team fight.

I wonder who that was.....

Originally posted by DarkestSonata
Its kinda hard to call this one without more information on their environment. If they are in an inhabited town, i think this fight tips in the marvel teams favor drastically. Superman has shown before that he isn't all that fast when it comes to fighting either. He has also shown that he is foolish enough to stand toe-to-toe with one of the few enemies he fights that is strong enough to even hurt him, and guess what, he died, rather horribly. All-in-all, id say that Gladiator and supes duke it out until the surfer and skrull can kill the other members of the team. Once its three on one, Supes falls like the rest.

The biggest fight breaker here is the surfer. The seriously underestimated fighter can travel through stars and blackholes, he can fire projectiles powerful enough to destroy entire planets. He is also able to travel extremely quickly. The combination is devastating, he'll be quick enough to catch the flash, and his projectiles strong enough to kill anybody in the JLA.

It would be a good fight, but Team Marvel takes it.
Finally a person that makes an intelligent argument, but lets not forget Surfers matter and energy manipulating powers.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
I wonder who that was.....

i don't remember.

Originally posted by DianaFan
I completely disagree. Superboy Prime is faster than Surfer by a large degree and even he was puddy in a Flash's speed force dump. Wonder Woman and Superman would kick Gladiator's ass. Too bad Martian Manhunter defeats Glads and SS with in the first few seconds of the fight.
Just how pray tell, does a character as weak against heat and fire like the Manhunter is, going to beat someone that is not only stronger, but can also fire heat vision that is hotter than a star?

Originally posted by Brockalizer
Just how pray tell, does a character as weak against heat and fire like the Manhunter is, going to beat someone that is not only stronger, but can also fire heat vision that is hotter than a star? Doesn't he not have that weakness anymore?

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Doesn't he not have that weakness anymore?
The mere though of facing off against two humans like Batman, the Flash, and a woman would send Gladiators confidence through the roof. Even if by some miracle the Manhunter was able to beat Gladiator, Super Skrull with Cytorak is not only exponentially more powerful, but also TP resistant. The JLA has to many weak links. Seriously what are Flash Batman and Steel going to contribute? Flash's speed counted for jack shit against Doomsday, Steel could be melted to slag, and as for Batman do I even have to say it?

Originally posted by Brockalizer
Just how pray tell, does a character as weak against heat and fire like the Manhunter is, going to beat someone that is not only stronger, but can also fire heat vision that is hotter than a star?

he's not weak against heat in general, and his weakness to fire has been somewhat redefined.

Originally posted by Brockalizer
The mere though of facing off against two humans like Batman, the Flash, and a woman would send Gladiators confidence through the roof. Even if by some miracle the Manhunter was able to beat Gladiator, Super Skrull with Cytorak is not only exponentially more powerful, but also TP resistant. The JLA has to many weak links. Seriously what are Flash Batman and Steel going to contribute? Flash's speed counted for jack shit against Doomsday, Steel could be melted to slag, and as for Batman do I even have to say it?

You seriously don't know what Flash is going to contribute?

Originally posted by Brockalizer
The mere though of facing off against two humans like Batman, the Flash, and a woman would send Gladiators confidence through the roof. Even if by some miracle the Manhunter was able to beat Gladiator, Super Skrull with Cytorak is not only exponentially more powerful, but also TP resistant. The JLA has to many weak links. Seriously what are Flash Batman and Steel going to contribute? Flash's speed counted for jack shit against Doomsday, Steel could be melted to slag, and as for Batman do I even have to say it? You do realize of any hero Flash is one of the top sufferers of PIS. Just as batman cannot unleash the batkick for all problems in comics neither can flash use the extent of his powers. If he did story would read as follows.
The great city/planet <insert name here> was attacked by <insert villain name> the Flash <take your pick of which one> heard of their plight. He ran top speed faster than anything else in the universe breaking the speed force barrier and unleashed an unlimited number of infinite mass punches at <insert villain name> who was then instantly slaughtered by the trillions of blows reigning down on him each moving fast enough to break the speed force barrier. The end.

Originally posted by Brockalizer
The mere though of facing off against two humans like Batman, the Flash, and a woman would send Gladiators confidence through the roof.


lol come on guy? humans, really? is that the level you put Flash, Bruce, and Diana? Bruce is there for tactical purposes only, there is no need for him to engage anyone, and as soon as Kallark hits WW and she DOESNT GET ONE-SHOTTTED, she chokes him out with her lasso, his confidence will plummet. I think its highly probable that even coming in contact with it will cause him lose strength.

IMO i wouldnt even have Glads engage Clark. It would be WW, her h2h is superior and she has the strength, speed, stamina and durability to go toe-to-toe. Basic knowledge stip gives SM the heads up to stay clear of Norrin who imo would have his hands busy with Hal. that leaves Steel, Flash, MM time to deal with the Skrull with SM providing an assist to Diana as needed. Team 1 isnt even a "team" they are a group of individuals...whereas the JLA are tried and true.

Originally posted by Hitman911
Ummm Yes it does my friend....."FC Gladiator" = Full Confidence Gladiator. That means there is NO thought in his mind that says he shouln't Pwn any and everyone on the field.
Also no one will bfr Klr't.... 1. The gem would amp the base strength of the Thing making him>>>>>>Juggy as far as strength. 2. He can fly 3. The only one that can see him coming is Kal who im sure will be occupied.
4. Unlike the other clowns on the Marvel team Kli'rt wont hold back which spell a yukky mess for the JLA....
5. Superman would HAVE to address him leaving the rest of his team in GRAVE Danger.... Only Kal can deal with the invisible unstoppable "Force"... That leaves the Team at a disadvantage....imo

The Superman Kool Aid drinkers would distort logic to find a way for Superman to triumph over the entire Marvel Universe in a fight on a planet made of Kryptonite orbiting a red sun. The JLA is much like most of the DC Universe gayer than a leather pinata. Batman prefers the company of young boys. Martian Manhunter looks like the bastard son of Kermit the Frog and Elton John. Green Lantern has a nice flashy pride ring. Flash has a bright flaming red suit to match his flaming desires and as for Superman. Well the Man of Steel couldn't be a bigger homo if he came with AIDS and a death certificate. Lois Lane is just window dressing, Elton John married a woman once, it didn't change the fact that he likes to "swab the poop deck".

Originally posted by Brockalizer
The Superman Kool Aid drinkers would distort logic to find a way for Superman to triumph over the entire Marvel Universe in a fight on a planet made of Kryptonite orbiting a red sun. The JLA is much like most of the DC Universe gayer than a leather pinata. Batman prefers the company of young boys. Martian Manhunter looks like the bastard son of Kermit the Frog and Elton John. Green Lantern has a nice flashy pride ring. Flash has a bright flaming red suit to match his flaming desires and as for Superman. Well the Man of Steel couldn't be a bigger homo if he came with AIDS and a death certificate. Lois Lane is just window dressing, Elton John married a woman once, it didn't change the fact that he likes to "swab the poop deck".

So you're a bigot and a troll? Nice.

You should quit while you're ahead.

i lol'd

Originally posted by Bentley
Huh? Why? J'onz can tp blast everyone at once. IIRC shiar imperial guard has tech based tp blockers. cytorrak gem comes with helmet against psy attacks and the force-field to stack upon SS's own imensely powerfull force-fields, so taking that helmet off (and figuring it out) will be extremely tough. I don't see anyone getting mindraped.

how's jonnz fire resistances these days? I actually believe he's the first to go down here after batman.

fight could go either way. the JLA has the big number advantage, but also more weaknesses to exploit. an indestructible klrt and the SS would be a scary duo too.

So the gem has Jugg's helmet? I didn't see that mentioned anywhere so I thought it wasn't there. Considering that MM doesn't necesarily solos ermm

The Imperial Guard's psychic dampeners have been breached by everyone and their mother though, just to bring three examples: Cassandra Nova, Cancerverse Professor X and Phoenixless Rachel. It's within J'onz capabilities to mind-rape Kallark.

Kallark has never fell to a mind rape. He has been mind blasted and he did resist it so the only thing jon could possibly do is temporarily stun him which would then send kallark on a rage.

If each opponent has knowledge of the other, I see no reason for kallark to blitz jon from the beginning since he would be an annoyance to the team.

Originally posted by carver9
Kallark has never fell to a mind rape. He has been mind blasted and he did resist it so the only thing jon could possibly do is temporarily stun him which would then send kallark on a rage.

If each opponent has knowledge of the other, I see no reason for kallark to blitz jon from the beginning since he would be an annoyance to the team. cassandra nova pulverized his confidence by showing him the empire in ruins and easily crushed him in battle, but i cant recall if she actually mindraped him directly

since when does the gem come with the helmut?

Originally posted by 753
cassandra nova pulverized his confidence by showing him the empire in ruins and easily crushed him in battle, but i cant recall if she actually mindraped him directly

does that not qualify?

Originally posted by Sin I AM
since when does the gem come with the helmut? ? how does it not?

Originally posted by -Pr-
does that not qualify? It might, I cant recall if she actually reached inside his mind or just told him to look at the state of the empire with his supervision and that made him crack. powerwise, she crushed him though

Originally posted by moonknight11
Future version? Hrm, must investigate further. You haven't even read the storyline you're using to support the character? Shocking.

ermmnone

Originally posted by moonknight11
Anyhow that feat you just posted outstrips everything current supes has done(like barely keeping up with lightspeed jay garrick).
(1). That isn't current Superman. It's the Superman from almost a decade ago. And Superman wasn't barely keeping up with Jay Garrick, he was at least as fast as him before Jay stole his speed. And it was written by Geoff Johns, who has a hard-on for Flashes.
(2). Jay Garrick directly admitted that current Superman is faster than him.
(3). I somewhat doubt you know what current Superman is capable of, since you don't even read the character you're supporting.
(4). Gladiator doesn't have anything comparable to that either way.

How about I turn this upside down? The feats you're bringing up for Gladiator, decades old ones, outstrip everything current Gladiator has done.

Originally posted by moonknight11
Gladiator has had fights in between nanosecs anyway so idk why that is so far above glads. You seem to mis-remember your argument. This wasn't me showing a feat that outstrips everything Gladiator has done in his entire history - this is me showing a feat that surpasses the one you brought up - and for which you asked one that is superior otherwise we've "lost the argument". Which I did.

But since you brought up Gladiator's 'nanosecond fights', then yes, what I brought up also outstrips that particular instance.

Originally posted by moonknight11
Are you referring to the time Supes held a tiny black hole in his hand, or the time he struggled to escape a black hole? Both of those times supes was straining. Surfer wasn't even affected by going right through the hole. haermm

Having problems concentrating on what your arguments were? Again. Read what I adressed - you making your argument based on travel speed - eg. "Silver Surfer has : gone Lightyears in second". Unless this was a pathetic attempt at dodging your lack of further argumentation on that point, in which case I can't even say well played.

You should take lessons on the art of dodging from a veteran poster here - quanchi, and then get back to me.

Originally posted by moonknight11
http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/7694/silversurferannual0508tc4.jpg
Except that, that is exactly what the art implies. He flew off and returned. Yes, the art implied he flew off and returned. Not that he flew off and physically looked for what he was searching, instead of using his high-end tracking cosmic senses and capabilities. That is just your wishful thinking. Which you're welcomed to, if it makes you feel better, but it isn't any kind of valid argument.

Originally posted by moonknight11
Also, I'm sure you're aware of the Infinity Gauntlet snatch? The one he failed to do?

Originally posted by moonknight11
Both of which surpass Supes btw. I'll let Raoul:
Originally posted by -Pr-
Superman has existed inside black holes for a considerable amount of time, and then flew out of it. Under his own power.

I did smile at you saying that rookie Green Lanterns are more durable than Superman, though.

It just goes to show that your stance is based on rational, well-thought arguments.

Originally posted by moonknight11
As opposed to the incredibly strong current version which can't even tank the weight of a planet? And the Superboy that has more low-end feats than 3.5 sentrys? I take it you're playing the "I use the highest feats for Gladiator and take the lowest feats for the character he is up against" game? That's trolling.

because the helmut isnt standard for each person who weilds the gem, it must be created....it hardly matters becauseit takes litle force to remove it

Originally posted by 753
It might, I cant recall if she actually reached inside his mind or just told him to look at the state of the empire with his supervision and that made him crack. powerwise, she crushed him though

she ploughed through the entire imperial guard too; psi resistance doesn't seem to be their forte.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
because the helmut isnt standard for each person who weilds the gem, it must be created....it hardly matters becauseit takes litle force to remove it all users I recall manifested it. it will not be easily removed behind SS's force-fields (with infinite stamina to back them up) + cytorrak's forcefields and MMH would have to figure that out anyway.

Originally posted by -Pr-
she ploughed through the entire imperial guard too; psi resistance doesn't seem to be their forte. undeniably, she wrecked them all. I think she and was already crushing gladiator even before the mindrape that may or may not have taken place

Doesn't the Cyttorak gem ALSO supply the Unique Psi-immune armor that juggs has to it's user?

Originally posted by carver9
Kallark has never fell to a mind rape. He has been mind blasted and he did resist it so the only thing jon could possibly do is temporarily stun him which would then send kallark on a rage.

If each opponent has knowledge of the other, I see no reason for kallark to blitz jon from the beginning since he would be an annoyance to the team.


Kallark isn't the fastest character here, Flash is.

With enemies on this level Kallark can get as mad as he wishes, he already has full confidence... A short stun may be his doom (he's by far the weakest character in team 1).

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Doesn't the Cyttorak gem ALSO supply the Unique Psi-immune armor that juggs has to it's user? yes, it makes the outfit

Well, no way can the JLA win then. With Psi-immunity, I don't see any one of them ever putting down Super JuggerSkrull.

I also don't see Super Juggerskrull tagging the flash.

Eternal stalemate?

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Well, no way can the JLA win then. With Psi-immunity, I don't see any one of them ever putting down Super JuggerSkrull.

I also don't see Super Juggerskrull tagging the flash.

Eternal stalemate? he could blanket the field with invisible force fields and expand them. flash has his own exotic attacks as well.

Originally posted by 753
he could blanket the field with invisible force fields and expand them. flash has his own exotic attacks as well.

Yeah, he could prolly try BFR on Superjuggerskrull. But as I think the Cyttorak enchantment+flight will play havoc with any attempts at BFR other than teleportation.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Well, no way can the JLA win then. With Psi-immunity, I don't see any one of them ever putting down Super JuggerSkrull.

I also don't see Super Juggerskrull tagging the flash.

Eternal stalemate? Flash's speed didn't mean a whole lot when fighting Doomsday, so I doubt that it'll do any good fighting three characters that are pretty damn close if not possible superior to Doomsday. Super Skrull would just need to create a force field over a large enough area and keep shrinking it until Flash has been rendered immobile.

They can easily speedforce bump SS...

Diana can cut his helmet (and him) using her magical tiara (SS would regenerate but mind-rape would be viable).

The troll is funny.

Originally posted by Bentley
They can easily speedforce bump SS...

Diana can cut his helmet (and him) using her magical tiara (SS would regenerate but mind-rape would be viable).

Not thru the invincible Juggernaut force field, she's not.

Originally posted by Bentley
They can easily speedforce bump SS...

Diana can cut his helmet (and him) using her magical tiara (SS would regenerate but mind-rape would be viable). how would she get past his force-fields? cytorrak gives him infinite stamina to hold them up, so pounding away to wear his mind out wont work. not to mention he has cytorrak's force-field in adition to his own. would speedforce bumping require physical contact?

The Cyttorak enchantment has made it so that once he's moving forward, nothing can stop him. Basic rule.

Once SS moves forward via flight, nothing can slow him down or deflect him.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
The Cyttorak enchantment has made it so that once he's moving forward, nothing can stop him. Basic rule.

Once SS moves forward via flight, nothing can slow him down or deflect him. good point, would speed steral even work against a character with infinite momentum?

Originally posted by 753
how would she get past his force-fields? cytorrak gives him infinite stamina to hold them up, so pounding away to wear his mind out wont work. not to mention he has cytorrak's force-field in adition to his own. would speedforce bumping require physical contact?


Lasso would work wouldn't it? Vibrating through the shield or phasing may work too, at least three characters in JLA can do it.

Originally posted by 753
good point, would speed steral even work against a character with infinite momentum?


Infinite power for Flash

Originally posted by Bentley
Lasso would work wouldn't it? Vibrating through the shield or phasing may work too, at least three characters in JLA can do it.

Who on the jla has vibrated through a force field besides flash? Even using flash feat it took some time to do it and if the god blast couldn't get past jugs force field (magical attack) no one on the opposing team wouldn't either.

Then let's not forget that with this upgrade, skrull is just as strong or possibly stronger than the peeps he is going against so even if they did get through the forcefield, they might get stomped. Skrull could have 2 forcefields up... I can't see ANYONE on that team getting past it.

Originally posted by Bentley
Lasso would work wouldn't it? Vibrating through the shield or phasing may work too, at least three characters in JLA can do it. the lasso would work, but it would need contact. not sure about vibrating through the shield, as it has no empty spaces for them to sqeeze through. this is remarkbly inconsistant in comics though. I know the SS can phase throguh them, but he doesnt do it thrgouh hyperspeed vibration

Originally posted by carver9
Who on the jla has vibrated through a force field besides flash? Even using flash feat it took some time to do it and if the god blast couldn't get past jugs force field (magical attack) no one on the opposing team wouldn't either.

Then let's not forget that with this upgrade, skrull is just as strong or possibly stronger than the peeps he is going against so even if they did get through the forcefield, they might get stomped. Skrull could have 2 forcefields up... I can't see ANYONE on that team getting past it.


Theoretically Flash could speedforce bump before SS can react, but that wouldn't be in character would it?

Originally posted by 753
the lasso would work, but it would need contact. not sure about vibrating through the shield, as it has no empty spaces for them to sqeeze through. this is remarkbly inconsistant in comics though. I know the SS can phase throguh them, but he doesnt do it thrgouh hyperspeed vibration

Then we have the jla doing all of this prep to take out SS but we are forgetting, there are other people on the opposing team... 2 powerful peeps.

Anyone on T1 is faster than any JLA member.

Originally posted by The Nuul
Anyone on T1 is faster than any JLA member.

Originally posted by Bentley
Theoretically Flash could speedforce bump before SS can react, but that wouldn't be in character would it?

Nope. CIS/CIP and all that.

Would be like me arguing that SS shrinks to microverse size from the get-go, enter some1's brain and open black holes....

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Nope. CIS/CIP and all that.

Would be like me arguing that SS shrinks to microverse size from the get-go, enter some1's brain and open black holes....


That's how people think Surfer fights around here though

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Nope. CIS/CIP and all that.

Would be like me arguing that SS shrinks to microverse size from the get-go, enter some1's brain and open black holes.... He wouldn't get to do that, since Superman will punch him hard enough that his ken doll parts will fall off, within the first instants of the battle.

Originally posted by Bentley
That's how people think Surfer fights around here though Minus the shrinking part, because some of them realize that would indeed be an idiotic move.

Originally posted by Bentley
Lasso would work wouldn't it? Vibrating through the shield or phasing may work too, at least three characters in JLA can do it. not all forcefields are the same. cytorrak's ff's are mystical in nature, I don't think they can be physically bypassed.

Originally posted by Starscream M
not all forcefields are the same. cytorrak's ff's are mystical in nature, I don't think they can be physically bypassed.


I understand that Jugg's forcefield may not be breached that way, but Sue's might.

Originally posted by Bentley
I understand that Jugg's forcefield may not be breached that way, but Sue's might. oh ok...yeah, sue's def could be breached

There's absolutely no proof that J'onn's phasing, at the very least, wouldn't work.

no indication that it would either

I don't need to fetch off an instance of where this was tried on Juggernaut's forcefield and it worked. You need to show one where it didn't, otherwise it's a feasible tactic.

I know all this rational, logic based arguments are not something you're familiar with, but it's all quite simple, even for someone like you.