BBC- Women in Canada 'Proud' to be sluts!!!!

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Daemon Seed
Women in North America have been marching over the use of the word "****". But why does the word have the power to arouse so much passion?

Thousands of women in the US and Canada have marched in response to a Toronto police officer's comment that women should try not to dress like "sluts" to avoid being raped or victimised.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-13333013

Robtard
*moves to Canada*

O Canada!
Our home and native land!
True patriot love in all thy sluts command.

With glowing hearts we see shaft rise,
The True North strong and free!

From far and wide,
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

God keep our land glorious and free!
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

Daemon Seed
Originally posted by Robtard
*moves to Canada*

*joins you*

Robtard
Never understood why people have a problem with sluts, sure you don't want your daughter to be one and you don't want to marry one, but sluts are the shit.

inimalist
its not true

/shrug

Lord Lucien
One man makes a not-to-erroneous statement and thousands of women march in protest.

Whoever said feminism was dead?

Robtard
Originally posted by inimalist
its not true

/shrug

Sluts aren't "the shit"? sad

inimalist
Originally posted by Robtard
Sluts aren't "the shit"? sad

no, canadian girls aren't loose, unfortunately

Existere
I guess I get why the comment peeves all these women, but I can't help but feel like they're completely misconstruing their own point here by walking around saying they're 'proud to be slutty'.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by Existere
I guess I get why the comment peeves all these women, but I can't help but feel like they're completely misconstruing their own point here by walking around saying they're 'proud to be slutty'. It's like all the "protesters" at the G20 summit. Many aren't there to protest anything, they just like showing up for these just cuz.

Robtard
Originally posted by inimalist
no, canadian girls aren't loose, unfortunately

Guess I'll go to Brazil then.

Daemon Seed
Originally posted by Existere
I guess I get why the comment peeves all these women, but I can't help but feel like they're completely misconstruing their own point here by walking around saying they're 'proud to be slutty'.

Well East coast girls are hip I really dig the styles they wear.
But I can't wait to be back in Can-ada to sluttiest sluts of all...
I wish they all could be canada-adian sluuuts!

Symmetric Chaos
Is siut french for **** or does the woman in the lead picture just have bad spelling?

edit: maybe she was trying to get around the word filter...

Existere
She doesn't really care. She was just there to whip her hair and get on bbc.

Deja~vu
Originally posted by inimalist
no, canadian girls aren't loose, unfortunately Can't they walk around topless and it's all legal over there?? confused

skekUng
There is a difference between just Canada or just America or just Mexico and 'North America'.

-Pr-
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
One man makes a not-to-erroneous statement and thousands of women march in protest.

Whoever said feminism was dead?

thumb up

The Rover
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
One man makes a not-to-erroneous statement and thousands of women march in protest.

Whoever said feminism was dead?

That was a very erroneous statement - one's appearance should not be used to minimize the fact that they were victimized.

Originally posted by Deja~vu
Can't they walk around topless and it's all legal over there?? confused

It's legal, but no one does it... :'(

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by The Rover
That was a very erroneous statement - one's appearance should not be used to minimize the fact that they were victimized. Word you're looking for is "insensitive". Which it was.

The Rover
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Word you're looking for is "insensitive". Which it was.

I might have been looking for "utterly stupid" or "repulsive." What kind of jackass in such a public position would say a thing, and think he could get away with it?

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by The Rover
I might have been looking for "utterly stupid" or "repulsive." What kind of jackass in such a public position would say a thing, and think he could get away with it? An idiot with little ability to observe when something is inappropriate to say in public. But his sentiment and the gist of what he was saying is not incorrect.

inimalist
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Word you're looking for is "insensitive". Which it was.

your not really trying to argue that a woman's attire is a primary cause of sexual assault...?

I thought it was sarcastic...

Bardock42
Originally posted by Daemon Seed
But why does the word have the power to arouse so much passion?


Because it degrades women and tries to shame them for their sexual desires.

-Pr-
Originally posted by inimalist
your not really trying to argue that a woman's attire is a primary cause of sexual assault...?

I thought it was sarcastic...

I don't think anyone was arguing that it was, as that would be lunacy.

Deja~vu
Originally posted by The Rover

It's legal, but no one does it... :'(

Yeah sooooooooooo sad. laughing out loud

I used to go over there a lot and I've never seen anything wrong with how anyone was dressed. No topless either. Just good ol Cunuks, eh?

Liberator
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
One man makes a not-to-erroneous statement and thousands of women march in protest.

Whoever said feminism was dead?

You sound like you have some dislike of the feminist movement, is this true?

inimalist
Originally posted by -Pr-
I don't think anyone was arguing that it was, as that would be lunacy.

then how could not dressing like a **** prevent victimization?

Daemon Seed
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
An idiot with little ability to observe when something is inappropriate to say in public. But his sentiment and the gist of what he was saying is not incorrect.

True.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by inimalist
your not really trying to argue that a woman's attire is a primary cause of sexual assault...?

I thought it was sarcastic... You're really not suggesting that I even hinted at the use of the word "primary". Are you?


Most men can see a woman who is dressed "like a sl/ut" and simply acknowledge that fact alone, maybe with an accompanying catcall or "Daaamn!" But there are men out there who lack conscience or inhibition to the point that such... visual enticement is just the sort of excuse or reason they need to take that step in to sexual assault. That cop was not wrong---if you want to keep your outfit from enticing assault, don't dress the part. Extreme lengths? You betcha. Should women sacrifice their freedom of choice of dress in the name of security? Their choice. The cop could have also said that to avoid getting caught in the rain and making their shirts see-through, women should stay indoors. He still wouldn't have been factually wrong. Just stupid for saying it.


Originally posted by Liberator
You sound like you have some dislike of the feminist movement, is this true? Damn right. Those there women-folk shouldn't have the right to vote or be considered persons or have equal status as men. That's exactly what I was trying to say.

inimalist
lol, what evidence do you have to suggest that attire play any part in assault then?

Liberator
Originally posted by inimalist
lol, what evidence do you have to suggest that attire play any part in assault then?

I'm interested to hear this as well.

Bardock42
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
You're really not suggesting that I even hinted at the use of the word "primary". Are you?


Most men can see a woman who is dressed "like a sl/ut" and simply acknowledge that fact alone, maybe with an accompanying catcall or "Daaamn!" But there are men out there who lack conscience or inhibition to the point that such... visual enticement is just the sort of excuse or reason they need to take that step in to sexual assault. That cop was not wrong---if you want to keep your outfit from enticing assault, don't dress the part. Extreme lengths? You betcha. Should women sacrifice their freedom of choice of dress in the name of security? Their choice. The cop could have also said that to avoid getting caught in the rain and making their shirts see-through, women should stay indoors. He still wouldn't have been factually wrong. Just stupid for saying it.

Thing is that the "revealingly dressed women get raped more" claim behind what he said is not based on fact but on your assumption, his assumption, and our victim blaming society's assumption, while the "it tends to not rain inside a house" has years of physical data backing it up.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by inimalist
lol, what evidence do you have to suggest that attire play any part in assault then? None. If there are 100 prospective rapists nearby and dressing modestly only deters one of them, then it still deterred one of them. And don't twist my use of "deterred" to mean "repelled". I don't have the power (or know-how) to conduct such a test, but I'm willing to bet that of all the men in the country who have it in them to rape a woman, at least one of them would refrain if a prospective target is dressed modestly. I'm sure you'll disagree and provide the results of a test that does exist that'll prove me wrong.


The cop was an idiot for saying it, but do you honestly believe that of all the millions of men--none of them are enticed by select ensembles?

kgkg
"Don't tell us how to dress tell men not to rape"
O snap.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by kgkg
"Don't tell us how to dress tell men not to rape"
O snap. That's actually good advice. Should probably make it mandatory to learn in school.

inimalist
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
The cop was an idiot for saying it, but do you honestly believe that of all the millions of men--none of them are enticed by select ensembles?

I wouldn't say it is impossible, but the things that are known to motivate assault have little to do with the person being assaulted. errr, ok, thats not really correct, but even in random attacks (the vast minority of such cases), its stuff like a woman not being aware of her surroundings, being alone, etc. Random attacks are much more about the opportunity presenting itself and a woman ending up at "the wrong place at the wrong time", which can totally be her own fault, but I can't fathom what her attire would have to do with it. A girl wearing a short skirt versus bluejeans isn't really presenting a better opportunity for an attack.

I guess what we define as an assault is important. I imagine getting groped on the bus or in a club might be related to looking slutty, and that is bad and all, but serious rape/sexual assault, I'm not so sure at all.

Peach
Except for the fact that guys catcall and assault women, no matter how they're dressed. Clothing plays no part in it - hell, sexual desire plays no part in it. It's a power thing. Women who are dressed 'modestly' get harassed and assaulted just as often as women who don't. I got harassed the other day while walking into work, FFS.

http://www.rainn.org/get-information/statistics/sexual-assault-offenders

And considering the fact that more than half of assaults take place in either the victim's home or the home of a friend or neighbor, and the majority of rapists are known to the victim (relative, friend, neighbor, etc), suggests that something as petty as what the woman was wearing had no effect. The whole idea that most sexual assaults and rapes happen because a woman is grabbed off the street by a random stranger is very rare. It happens, but it's very rare.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by inimalist
I wouldn't say it is impossible, but the things that are known to motivate assault have little to do with the person being assaulted. errr, ok, thats not really correct, but even in random attacks (the vast minority of such cases), its stuff like a woman not being aware of her surroundings, being alone, etc. Random attacks are much more about the opportunity presenting itself and a woman ending up at "the wrong place at the wrong time", which can totally be her own fault, but I can't fathom what her attire would have to do with it. A girl wearing a short skirt versus bluejeans isn't really presenting a better opportunity for an attack.

I guess what we define as an assault is important. I imagine getting groped on the bus or in a club might be related to looking slutty, and that is bad and all, but serious rape/sexual assault, I'm not so sure at all. I'm sure in either form of assault, there's an attacker out there who is initially prompted by the miniskirt, low-cut top, knee-highs etc. I doubt very much that it's the actual motivator in any case, but I'm sure it... eggs them on sometimes.

And that's my point---what the cop said doesn't feel literally incorrect (and I have no way of qualifying whether it actually is or not). But he's still an asshat for saying it---he must've known how it would fly with the people who see only emotions and insinuations.

siriuswriter
"Don't tell me how to dress, tell men not to rape."

/thread

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I'm sure in either form of assault, there's an attacker out there who is initially prompted by the miniskirt, low-cut top, knee-highs etc. I doubt very much that it's the actual motivator in any case, but I'm sure it... eggs them on sometimes.

And that's my point---what the cop said doesn't feel literally incorrect (and I have no way of qualifying whether it actually is or not). But he's still an asshat for saying it---he must've known how it would fly with the people who see only emotions and insinuations.

I'm sure there are serial killers egged on by red heads. Anyone stupid enough to be to tell them to dye their hair deserves whatever he gets.

Peach
Originally posted by siriuswriter
"Don't tell me how to dress, tell men not to rape."

/thread

Seriously.

But that would just make too much ****ing sense, and we can't have that!

inimalist
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I'm sure in either form of assault, there's an attacker out there who is initially prompted by the miniskirt, low-cut top, knee-highs etc. I doubt very much that it's the actual motivator in any case, but I'm sure it... eggs them on sometimes.

And that's my point---what the cop said doesn't feel literally incorrect (and I have no way of qualifying whether it actually is or not). But he's still an asshat for saying it---he must've known how it would fly with the people who see only emotions and insinuations.

I accept that your emotional response to the officer's words might be to blame women for actions done to them, but what he said is essentially literally incorrect, regardless of how you feel about it.

It'd be like saying wearing baggy jeans eggs on people to jump you. Whether or not someone is out to jump people and the targets they pick are influenced by so many much more important factors that it is nonsensical to pick that one out.

Like, if you were wearing a blue shirt at the mall, and some guy shot you because he thought he was the baddest hardcore blood on the street, that is your fault? I mean, you should have known better than to wear blue, because someone out there might kill you for it...

and that is a poor example for me to use anyways, because in that scenario your clothing is a motivator, whereas there is nothing to suggest it is a motivator in sexual assault.

Lord Lucien
Hence:

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I doubt very much that it's the actual motivator in any case



Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
I'm sure there are serial killers egged on by red heads. Anyone stupid enough to be to tell them to dye their hair deserves whatever he gets. Yup.

0mega Spawn
Originally posted by Daemon Seed
Toronto police officer's comment that women should TRY not to dress like "sluts" to avoid being raped or victimised.

hes just saying if you're dressed like a **** odds are you'll get treated as a **** laughing

8K1KHqi9bXc

Lord Lucien
I knew I'd heard that from a black man before.

0mega Spawn
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I knew I'd heard that before. what's wrong with saying it like that?

Lord Lucien
Way to edit the best part of my post: black man!

0mega Spawn
laughing out loud you yearn for black men don't you?

must be hard repressing such geyness

Lord Lucien
It is. My joy and happiness for the black man is hard to restrain. But for the sake of social norms, I persist.

0mega Spawn
I figured that
just come out the closet. your dad has laughing

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
I figured that
just come out the closet. your dad has laughing Took ya long enough.

0mega Spawn
please leave me outta you homosexual fantasies

Mindship
"Historically, the term 'slu.t' has carried a predominantly negative connotation... whether dished out as a serious indictment of one's character or merely as a flippant insult, the intent behind the word is always to wound, so we're taking it back," a statement on the SlutWalk website reads. "'Slu.t' is being re-appropriated."

So...'slu.t' is going to become for women like what '*****' has for African-Americans?

0mega Spawn
***** & the N word are two different words
***** is the equivalent of dude where as the N word is a racial slur
being that caucasians pronounce their E's & R's saying ***** sounds like the N word rather than *****

boom cleared that up

Peach
And a lot of people like to try and use it on here to get around the fact that the actual word is censored which - hey, guess what! Is going to get you in trouble.

--

Anyway, there are a few problems that many women have with sl*t, wh*re, and other words like that. Number one, it's seen as this horribly bad thing for women to have sexual desires and sleep with people, yet it's practically congratulated in men, and women are constantly insulted for it. Yes, there is "manslut" and "manwhore", but note that they have to actually specify that they're talking about a guy there, because the default for the words is to be used against women. It's a double standard.

Second is the fact that the way a lot of people act, women simply cannot win with anything they do. If a guy asks a woman to sleep with him, and she says okay, then they're easy. If she says no, then she's either 1) a frigid b!tch, 2) a prude, or 3) easy and too busy sleeping with everyone else. Note that oftentimes these things conflict with each other.

And third is the fact that so many guys use it as if it's some sort of defense for assaulting/raping women. "She's dressed like a sl*t so obviously she wanted attention", "she sleeps with everyone so she would have agreed anyway", and so on. Look, I don't care if someone goes out in nothing but a towel - that does not give anyone else the right to touch, harass, or assault them. Period. It's not up to you to decide what sort of attention someone may want, and you are not entitled to anyone paying you any attention in return when you decide that you want to give it.

Like the picture in the article said, except in more detail - don't tell women how they should and shouldn't be dressing and shame them for making their own choices. Teach men to keep their hands to themselves, to not harass and assault women, and that they are not entitled to anything.

0mega Spawn
wow then why isn't it censored?

did you even read what i posted about?

two different words & all that jazz


edit - and you censored bypassed in your post. while I never even typed a censored word
why be a hypocrite?

Mindship
Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
***** & the N word are two different words
***** is the equivalent of dude where as the N word is a racial slur
being that caucasians pronounce their E's & R's saying ***** sounds like the N word rather than *****

boom cleared that up So you're saying that 'n---a' was Not a 're-appropriation' of 'n---er'? It has a completely independent origin?

Well, there goes my hopes for Jewboy.

0mega Spawn
Originally posted by Mindship
So you're saying that 'n---a' was Not a 're-appropriation' of 'n---er'? It has a completely independent origin?

Well, there goes my hopes for Jewboy.

of course its a re-appropriation
just saying they're different words still

King Kandy
Originally posted by Peach
And a lot of people like to try and use it on here to get around the fact that the actual word is censored which - hey, guess what! Is going to get you in trouble.

--

Anyway, there are a few problems that many women have with sl*t, wh*re, and other words like that. Number one, it's seen as this horribly bad thing for women to have sexual desires and sleep with people, yet it's practically congratulated in men, and women are constantly insulted for it. Yes, there is "manslut" and "manwhore", but note that they have to actually specify that they're talking about a guy there, because the default for the words is to be used against women. It's a double standard.

Second is the fact that the way a lot of people act, women simply cannot win with anything they do. If a guy asks a woman to sleep with him, and she says okay, then they're easy. If she says no, then she's either 1) a frigid b!tch, 2) a prude, or 3) easy and too busy sleeping with everyone else. Note that oftentimes these things conflict with each other.

And third is the fact that so many guys use it as if it's some sort of defense for assaulting/raping women. "She's dressed like a sl*t so obviously she wanted attention", "she sleeps with everyone so she would have agreed anyway", and so on. Look, I don't care if someone goes out in nothing but a towel - that does not give anyone else the right to touch, harass, or assault them. Period. It's not up to you to decide what sort of attention someone may want, and you are not entitled to anyone paying you any attention in return when you decide that you want to give it.

Like the picture in the article said, except in more detail - don't tell women how they should and shouldn't be dressing and shame them for making their own choices. Teach men to keep their hands to themselves, to not harass and assault women, and that they are not entitled to anything.
I totally agree. I think the total disrespect towards female sexuality is one of the worst traits of our culture. The fact that people even are considering the outfit's role here is ridiculous.

It also goes the other way, though. Males raping females is considered a serious crime, but if a female rapes a male it is basically a joke to people. And is hardly considered a crime at all.

Mindship
Originally posted by Peach
Anyway, there are a few problems that many women have with sl*t, wh*re, and other words like that. Number one, it's seen as this horribly bad thing for women to have sexual desires and sleep with people, yet it's practically congratulated in men, and women are constantly insulted for it. Yes, there is "manslut" and "manwhore", but note that they have to actually specify that they're talking about a guy there, because the default for the words is to be used against women. It's a double standard.

Second is the fact that the way a lot of people act, women simply cannot win with anything they do. If a guy asks a woman to sleep with him, and she says okay, then they're easy. If she says no, then she's either 1) a frigid b!tch, 2) a prude, or 3) easy and too busy sleeping with everyone else. Note that oftentimes these things conflict with each other.

And third is the fact that so many guys use it as if it's some sort of defense for assaulting/raping women. "She's dressed like a sl*t so obviously she wanted attention", "she sleeps with everyone so she would have agreed anyway", and so on. Look, I don't care if someone goes out in nothing but a towel - that does not give anyone else the right to touch, harass, or assault them. Period. It's not up to you to decide what sort of attention someone may want, and you are not entitled to anyone paying you any attention in return when you decide that you want to give it.

Like the picture in the article said, except in more detail - don't tell women how they should and shouldn't be dressing and shame them for making their own choices. Teach men to keep their hands to themselves, to not harass and assault women, and that they are not entitled to anything. In principle, I wholly agree. However, in practicality...

Women obviously have the right to dress as they wish, and if a man attacks them because of it, he bears the responsibility for his choices and behavior, not her. What she is responsible for are her choices and behavior, which sometimes will manifest as poor judgment or a lack of common sense.

If a women jogs through Central Park alone at night (as is her right), she does Not deserve to be attacked. Nonetheless...

If I walk through a dangerous neighborhood, I do Not deserve to be attacked. Nonetheless...

Sexuality is power, and yes, with power comes responsibility. And exercising rights without responsibility ("I can do whatever I want, nah, nah, nah"wink, IMO, opens the door to trouble.

It's been my experience that older women are more aware of this than younger women.

RE: Blaxican
I hate this thread.

Liberator
Originally posted by Peach
And a lot of people like to try and use it on here to get around the fact that the actual word is censored which - hey, guess what! Is going to get you in trouble.

--

Anyway, there are a few problems that many women have with sl*t, wh*re, and other words like that. Number one, it's seen as this horribly bad thing for women to have sexual desires and sleep with people, yet it's practically congratulated in men, and women are constantly insulted for it. Yes, there is "manslut" and "manwhore", but note that they have to actually specify that they're talking about a guy there, because the default for the words is to be used against women. It's a double standard.

Second is the fact that the way a lot of people act, women simply cannot win with anything they do. If a guy asks a woman to sleep with him, and she says okay, then they're easy. If she says no, then she's either 1) a frigid b!tch, 2) a prude, or 3) easy and too busy sleeping with everyone else. Note that oftentimes these things conflict with each other.

And third is the fact that so many guys use it as if it's some sort of defense for assaulting/raping women. "She's dressed like a sl*t so obviously she wanted attention", "she sleeps with everyone so she would have agreed anyway", and so on. Look, I don't care if someone goes out in nothing but a towel - that does not give anyone else the right to touch, harass, or assault them. Period. It's not up to you to decide what sort of attention someone may want, and you are not entitled to anyone paying you any attention in return when you decide that you want to give it.

Like the picture in the article said, except in more detail - don't tell women how they should and shouldn't be dressing and shame them for making their own choices. Teach men to keep their hands to themselves, to not harass and assault women, and that they are not entitled to anything.

Right on Peach.

FistOfThe North
i don't believe the way a woman dresses no matter how provacative means she'll get raped or cause rape in the vast majority of cases. nuns and librarians get raped. rape isn't about the sex or how sexy you dressed. it's about dominance.

but to me a **** is and always will be a ****. they can never have that word "back". i don't think it was ever there's to begin with. most likely a man invented the word. (the females' natural sense of auto entitlement to any and everything just because she sits when she pees is what happened there, with "wanting the word back"wink just like a man can be a ****. that you're castigated because of it hey, blame that on history and human nature.

Bardock42
Originally posted by FistOfThe North
i don't believe the way a woman dresses no matter how provacative means she'll get raped or cause rape in the vast majority of cases. nuns and librarians get raped. rape isn't about the sex or how sexy you dressed. it's about dominance.

but to me a **** is and always will be a ****. they can never have that word "back". i don't think it was ever there's to begin with. most likely a man invented the word. (the females' natural sense of auto entitlement to any and everything just because she sits when she pees is what happened there, with "wanting the word back"wink just like a man can be a ****. that you're castigated because of it hey, blame that on history and human nature.

Do you feel the same about "n****r"

FistOfThe North
Originally posted by Bardock42
Do you feel the same about "n****r"

a stupid question meant to incite, but i'll humor you. the answers no. i highly doubt black people want the word back. they didn't even invent it in the first place. your race did. i could keep going on and on with the contrast in between the two but i won't. i'll just assume you can see the enormous differece in the 2 cases and can put simple math together correctly instead of trying to get a rise.

Bardock42
Is it that sl*t still has enormous real world applications, while nig*er is almost universally shunned? Is that the difference?

Daemon Seed
Originally posted by Mindship
In principle, I wholly agree. However, in practicality...

Women obviously have the right to dress as they wish, and if a man attacks them because of it, he bears the responsibility for his choices and behavior, not her. What she is responsible for are her choices and behavior, which sometimes will manifest as poor judgment or a lack of common sense.

If a women jogs through Central Park alone at night (as is her right), she does Not deserve to be attacked. Nonetheless...

If I walk through a dangerous neighborhood, I do Not deserve to be attacked. Nonetheless...

Sexuality is power, and yes, with power comes responsibility. And exercising rights without responsibility ("I can do whatever I want, nah, nah, nah"wink, IMO, opens the door to trouble.

It's been my experience that older women are more aware of this than younger women.

Excellent post mate.

Mindship
Originally posted by Daemon Seed
Excellent post mate. I'm on a roll.

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