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Fight takes place in the Naboo Palace's reactor room.

http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/4268/eeb449680ff0279b381115l.th.jpg


Legacy Krayt (pre-rez)

vs.

TPM Maul.
Season 3 Savage.

Sabers
Force
All out



2nd scenario: same stips, except it will be Legacy War (post-rez) Krayt.


Who wins?

Hard to say. As a whole, Krayt didn't accumulate very many feats (especially in the area of lightsaber combat.) Aside from toying with Cade, and slaying numerous Imperial Knights, I'd say his best feat in that area was his battle with post-RotS Obi-Wan. During that battle, Krayt (then still A'Sharad) appeared to be more than a match for Kenobi in the saber department. In fact, Kenobi only 'won' after he became visibly angry and used a force attack to rip A'Sharad's arm off (cheap.) Don't know if that's really enough to give him the edge against the likes of Maul AND Savage in a duel, though.

However, in the force and all-out battles, Legacy Krayt almost certainly wins. Legacy War Krayt would dominate even more so.

Really? Thats interesting, I didn't know Krayt was that powerful. Savage Opress's new feats a pretty good, but I suppose he does have the major handicap of not being able to block FLightning yet. I can see that being a gamebreaker.

That's kind of what I was thinking. Using force lightning was Krayt's go to.

You'd think he would have tried to use his lightsaber at least once.

?

Force only is the one in which the pair is in the biggest trouble. Maul's got pretty much no force feats, and Opress has good TK but as mentioned no defense against lightning (all the more-so with no saber).

And of course, post-rez Krayt has Cade's shatterpoint power and can kill with a touch. He was also using force illusion to show Cade a vision of the future but I don't know if that was new or something he always had. Might've been always considering how it's Wyyrlock's speciality and Wyyrlock had to have learned it from someone.

So in a force battle it's not remotely fair

Originally posted by Galan007
Aside from toying with Cade, and slaying numerous Imperial Knights,

The best example of which was the first time when he was surrounded by four and it took four attacks to kill the lot of them, with only the Emperor's cousin so much as dodging one blow. No surprise, no catching off-guard, he just owned them.

Originally posted by Galan007
? Lightsabers block Lightning.

Something which Savage apparantly hasn't figured out yet because Dooku was zapping him time after time and he didn't do jack to stop him.

True dat.

"How does one defeat against such POWA!!?"

"Put your lightsaber in front of it, dumb f*ck."

Although one has to also use the force to bend the lightning into the saber.

^ You really think that's what Kenobi did to Dooku's lightning in AotC?

Sure. Otherwise it was complete luck that none of the arcs bent around his saber.

I don't think I've ever equated Force Lightning with real electricity.

Originally posted by ares834
Sure. Otherwise it was complete luck that none of the arcs bent around his saber. Meh, I just don't see AotC Kenobi being powerful enough with the force to bend Dooku's lightning to his will.

I think he simply put his saber in front of the oncoming lightning, and it was absorbed. Done.

Various sources have the lightning arcing around a saber such as Deceived and make mention of the Jedi using the force to bend the lightning into the saber.

Post the quote, plz. Because neither AotC or RotS mentions the Jedi having to use the force to 'bend' force lightning into their sabers. Like I mentioned above: when a lightsaber is placed in front of force lightning, it is simply absorbed or reflected... Just like a blaster bolt (in the sources I'm familiar with, at least.)

"Malgus interposed his lightsaber, drew the lightning to it, and started walking toward Adraas. The power swirled around the red blade, sizzling, crackling, pushed against Malgus, but he strode through it. The skin of his hands blistered but Malgus endured the pain, paid it as the price of his cause." pg 246.

Originally posted by Galan007
Post the quote, plz. Because neither AotC or RotS mentions the Jedi having to use the force to 'bend' force lightning into their sabers. Like I mentioned above: when a lightsaber is placed in front of force lightning, it is simply absorbed or reflected... Just like a blaster bolt (in the sources I'm familiar with, at least.)

AotC and RotS do not have to explicitly (or implicitly for that matter) mention this for it to be a fact. As mentioned by ares, there are numerous sources stating that this is the case, thereby making it canon, seeing as how it does not contradict any GL material.

AotC Kenobi absorbed Dooku's Lightning with ease. Savage definitely had the power too. I guess it was just more convenient that he was stupid.

In saber to saber combat team 2.

No restrictions goes to krayt.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
AotC Kenobi absorbed Dooku's Lightning with ease. Savage definitely had the power too. I guess it was just more convenient that he was stupid.

Of course he has the "power" to do so, just not the 'knowledge' to apply said power.

Originally posted by ares834
"Malgus interposed his lightsaber, drew the lightning to it, and started walking toward Adraas. The power swirled around the red blade, sizzling, crackling, pushed against Malgus, but he strode through it. The skin of his hands blistered but Malgus endured the pain, paid it as the price of his cause." pg 246.

This also happens in the new Old Republic comic. The protagonist isn't strong enough to arc the lightning of the Emperors apprentice into his lightsaber blade so instead it completely destroys the lightsaber hilt and fvcks up his arms.

I'd say Lightsabers, there's a mixed result, it depends on how well the two can work together since neither can stand up to him alone, and also pre-rebirth he has the Vong armor (so sabers only is the only situation where pre-rez is stronger).

Originally posted by Jinsoku Takai
As mentioned by ares, there are numerous sources stating that this is the case, thereby making it canon, seeing as how it does not contradict any GL material. ...And there are also sources that don't mention it. Just saying.

Originally posted by Galan007
...And there are also sources that don't mention it. Just saying.

?
There is no contradiction. If it were simply a matter of bringing one's lightsaber up in the direction of the lightning and holding still, Dooku should have blown Obi-Wan's weapon right out of his hand, given that it was sufficient enough to hurl a grown man off his feet and across the hangar. There's clearly a channeling of energy on part of the Force user redirecting the lightning.

Originally posted by RagingBoner
?
There is no contradiction. I'm not saying there's a contradiction. I'm just saying that it doesn't seem like some sources intended to have the lightning being manipulated into the saber before it could be effectively blocked.

Personally, I don't think AotC Obi-Wan was powerful enough with the force to manipulate Dooku's lightning in any way/shape/form... But that's just my opinion.

Originally posted by RagingBoner
given that it was sufficient enough to hurl a grown man off his feet and across the hangar. In the novelization, I believe it was stated that Dooku used lightning in conjunction with force grab/push, to hurl Anakin across the room.

Indeed, no matter how powerful the lightning it doesn't hurl a man sideways.

Originally posted by Galan007

Personally, I don't think AotC Obi-Wan was powerful enough with the force to manipulate Dooku's lightning in any way/shape/form... But that's just my opinion.

Bringing it to the saber is a relatively minor course correction. I can buy it.

Remember that Dooku was toying with him. He could have easily killed him but he didn't. I doubt he was going all out even slightly.

Originally posted by Q99
Bringing it to the saber is a relatively minor course correction. I can buy it. You are more then welcome to that opinion. Personally, I have doubts that GL's intention was to have Kenobi manipulate Dooku's lightning before he could effectively block it with his lightsaber. After all, the lightning Dooku used in that particular instance was very concentrated/bolt-like... It didn't have any arcs of energy spewing from it that needed to be 'drawn in'.

To me, it seemed like the intention was to have Kenobi block it just as he would a blaster bolt. /shrug

Well maybe in that specific case it wasn't necessary, but against wider lightning it is.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
In saber to saber combat team 2.

No restrictions goes to krayt. Annoying FANBOY

Originally posted by Q99
Well maybe in that specific case it wasn't necessary, but against wider lightning it is. I can agree with that.

krayt wins cuz he took on like 19 jedi in the x wing comics

Originally posted by Galan007
You are more then welcome to that opinion. Personally, I have doubts that GL's intention was to have Kenobi manipulate Dooku's lightning before he could effectively block it with his lightsaber. After all, the lightning Dooku used in that particular instance was very concentrated/bolt-like... It didn't have any arcs of energy spewing from it that needed to be 'drawn in'.

To me, it seemed like the intention was to have Kenobi block it just as he would a blaster bolt. /shrug

Opinions carry little weight when discussing matters of canon. You've been here a long time G007; you should know this.

Its not just Savage Opress who could not block Dooku's FL. Ventress + 2 nightsisters together could not defend against it either. And of course Ventress was wayyy more powerful than AOTC Obi-Wan.

Dooku obviously didn't go all out with the Force against AOTC Obi-Wan. He could have taken him out very easily ROTS style if he did. (Although theres also the possibility that Dooku's power in the Dark Side was still increasing during the clone wars).

Dooku wasn't trying to kill or even overly hurt him. Rememer he just nicked him twice. He could have killed Kenobi right then and there but didn't, instead going for the huge-ass windup with Anakin very obviously going to leap in the way. If you look at his blow he's just going to kind of chop into him, its bizarre. He was also only using one hand with the lightning. He wasn't even trying to overpower him.

I think he might've viewed them as warm-ups before the real Yoda fight, and wanted to save himself for that.

Originally posted by Q99
I think he might've viewed them as warm-ups before the real Yoda fight, and wanted to save himself for that.

Except he had no idea Yoda was coming to battle him.

Originally posted by Jinsoku Takai
Opinions carry little weight when discussing matters of canon. You've been here a long time G007; you should know this. Agreed. In this case, however, it's a very logical opinion...

If writers intend for something to be happening, they make it know that the something in question is happening - very rarely are key plot points left up to personal interpretation. That said, if it was never stated that AotC Obi-Wan blocked Dooku's beam-like lightning via force pulling it into his lightsaber, why should I assume that's what happened, or what was intended? Because completely unrelated sources have characters doing so? Nah. Different writers clearly have differing opinions where this subject is concerned.

So? Those different interpretations are still canon unless they directly conflict each other. Nothing says that Obi-Wan wasn't pulling the lightning into his blade and other sources indicate that doing so is an integral part of the technique. So he was.

It wasn't stated in the movie that Windu was using Vaapad against Sidious, but other sources indicate that he was. So he was.

N.
It wasn't stated in the movie that Windu was using Vaapad against Sidious, but other sources indicate that he was. So he was.

Good man.

At the 28:50 mark, those who seek answers to the question concerning Force lightning and lightsabers shall find what they seek.

Originally posted by Nephthys
So? Those different interpretations are still canon unless they directly conflict each other. Nothing says that Obi-Wan wasn't pulling the lightning into his blade and other sources indicate that doing so is an integral part of the technique. So he was.

It wasn't stated in the movie that Windu was using Vaapad against Sidious, but other sources indicate that he was. So he was.

cheers

Originally posted by Nephthys
So? Those different interpretations are still canon unless they directly conflict each other. Nothing says that Obi-Wan wasn't pulling the lightning into his blade and other sources indicate that doing so is an integral part of the technique. So he was.

It wasn't stated in the movie that Windu was using Vaapad against Sidious, but other sources indicate that he was. So he was. You misunderstand. I'm not saying it isn't canon, I'm just saying that imo it wasn't intended in that particular scene based on what was shown.

Dooku's lightning was concentrated into a bolt-like surges of energy, which had no extra arcs spewing it that would have needed to be drawn in. That said, there's no reason why Obi-Wan would have needed to do more than simply place his lightsaber in it's path for it to be absorbed... Just like a blaster bolt.

This praise pleases me.

Originally posted by RagingBoner
At the 28:50 mark, those who seek answers to the question concerning Force lightning and lightsabers shall find what they seek.

Awesome. We've finally got some actual confirmation on this.

"It's not really as simple as just holding it up and the lightning is attracted to your blade. It takes some amount of focus to do that"

-Dave Filoni regarding blocking Force lightning.

Thanks Boner!

You are welcome, my faithful sex slavesservants.

Its pretty sad that you listen to those things though. Just sayin'.

Originally posted by Galan007
You misunderstand. I'm not saying it isn't canon, I'm just saying that imo it wasn't intended in that particular scene based on what was shown.

Dooku's lightning was concentrated into a bolt-like surge of energy, which had no extra arcs spewing it that would have needed to be drawn in. That said, there's no reason why Obi-Wan would have needed to do more than simply place his lightsaber in it's path for it to be absorbed... Just like a blaster bolt.

I don't really care about that to tell the truth but I'd wager it took some energy to focus it on that blade the way it did. The bolts were definately curving up to hit the saber when they just as easily could have gone down and hit Kenobi in the legs or something.

Looks to me like he pulled the bolts off to the side and onto his lightsaber. Either way, it's canon FACT that the way to block FL is to redirect the bolts to the lightsaber.

lIWm1GSHJ2o

N.
Its pretty sad that you listen to those things though. Just sayin'.

It's pretty sad that you live in a country the ass of which my country would kick.

The existence of nukes means that neither of us will get out of that war without a bruised behind me'thinks.

Originally posted by Jinsoku Takai
"It's not really as simple as just holding it up and the lightning is attracted to your blade. It takes some amount of focus to do that"

-Dave Filoni regarding blocking Force lightning.

Thanks Boner! No one ever said the lightning is "attracted to the blade." srsly

Originally posted by Jinsoku Takai
Looks to me like he pulled the bolts off to the side and onto his lightsaber. Huh? You must be watching a different clip then I did. I only saw Obi-Wan block Dooku's lightning by placing his saber directly in it's path.

N.
The existence of nukes means that neither of us will get out of that war without a bruised behind me'thinks.

'Merica's invincible.


We have moar than you and you're just a pissant island. We launch two nukes and all that's left of you is cookie crumbles.

So? It's not like we don't have enough nukes to wipe you out either.

N,
So? It's not like we don't have enough nukes to wipe you out either.

NO YOU DONT BECAUSE 'MERICA IS INVINCIBLE SO U LOSE HAHAHA

Originally posted by RagingBoner
NO YOU DONT BECAUSE 'MERICA IS INVINCIBLE SO U LOSE HAHAHA

It's canon.

JT
It's canon.

Nuh-uh. We have James Bond. James Bond would solo half the USA while 'solo'ing the other half and you know it!

N.
Nuh-uh. We have James Bond. James Bond would solo half the USA while 'solo'ing the other half and you know it!

If Roger Moore, then yes. If Sean Connery, then no.

Roger Boore sucks. Sean and Daniel ftw!

Originally posted by Nephthys
Nuh-uh. We have James Bond. James Bond would solo half the USA while 'solo'ing the other half and you know it!

Yeah well we have Rambo, the A-team, and Steven Seagal.

N.
Roger Boore sucks. Sean and Daniel ftw!

Roger Moore does not suck.

Originally posted by RagingBoner
If Roger Moore, then yes. If Sean Connery, then no. ohhh














g-asskick

You silly Americans and your silly preferences for sucky things.



Doctor Who and Sherlock Holmes >

Also we have Batman now.

Originally posted by Nephthys

Doctor Who and Sherlock Holmes >



MacGruber?

mmm

....Damn, you got me.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Its pretty sad that you listen to those things though. Just sayin'.



More sad than discussing verses threads? Really?

Yes. It's at least 20% sadder*.






*My Little Pony reference ftw!