Originally posted by Nephthys
Someone else mucking up doesn't reflect badly on Light
It does too. It reflects badly on him because he chose someone who mucked up and didn't plan on it.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Actually iirc Misa kinda fvcked up his plans when she was brought in.
L would have eventually caught him. He couldn't kill L and he couldn't use anyone else to kill him at the time. There really wasn't anything Light could have done to stop L from catching Kira.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Who he manipulated to his own ends. That counts in his favor.
Light manipulated Mikami huh? Not really. Light didn't get Mikami to serve him through any charm or anything. Mikami was just perfectly accepting of Kira then and there. Light did use Mikami though, obviously.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Very small.
Found them there camera's for him.
Originally posted by Nephthys
What did she do?
Kill Mello?
Originally posted by Nephthys
Meh.
COSMIC!
Originally posted by Nephthys
I fail to see how that's supposed to impress em. It just shows that Near got to where he was with Mello's help even more than I previously remembered.
Near was aware of a capable 3rd parties abilities and personality. He then capitalized on said 3rd party to further his position. Light does the same thing.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Thats legitimate, and I give him props for that. But in the case where Mello saved his ass he didn't instruct her to tell him that. He wasn't intending to have Mello act. Mello acted by himself.
And Light didn't instruct Rem to kill L. Light didn't instruct Misa to get the eyes again. Only real difference is Near couldn't predict Mello's actions. Neither could Light for that matter. And that is why Near considered Mello so helpful. And no, Near didn't tell him to save his ass. But he did allow Lidner to tell Mello when he was planning on facing Kira.
Originally posted by Nephthys
I would. Light didn't get his ass saved by someone elses actions. Everything that happened bar Mikami's **** up happened by his designs. He alone manipulated everyone around him. Near, not so much.
Remu? And not really. Everything that happened except for Mello went as he had predicted.
Originally posted by Nephthys
I strongly disagree. Near's initial plan would have been a total failure if it had not been for Mikami fvcking up.
Light lost because of pure luck.
I don't believe I said it wasn't. Near himself put Light into a position where he could not act and thus had to form his plan blind. Because Light was in that position, Near could change his plan and completely ruin Light.
Fitting, considering how far he got through luck.
Originally posted by Nephthys
This part just indicates Near's failings in the deductive process. I'm not too bothered about it, but the failings exist.
Light's plan was fantastic. He accurately predicted what Near would do. Again, it was just luck and Mikami.
Why is not predicting that rule was fake a failing? It can't be test for one and for two it doesn't matter whether it is fake or not.
So fantastic it failed when the smallest variable got in the way. Mikami was Kira's follower. Mikami's failures will reflect badly on Kira, which is what happened.
Originally posted by Nephthys
No. An example would be if in a sword fight, Light beat L straight up, by using what he had available in order to succeed. On the other hand, Near beat Light because Mello walked up behind him and smacked him, or rather because Lights sowrd broke. Would you consider Near the superior swordsman because Lights sword broke, o because he had the help of another combatant? Because I sure as shit wouldnt.
Light beat L straight up? lol no. L was certainly ready to prove the 13 day rule was fake and that Light was Kira. The only reason it happened was because Rem, who L would never factor in as an enemy. So the scenario where Mello slapped Light in the back of the head works better for L. I do like the broken sword scenario because that is what happened. And actually, I would. Light was the one who left his sword in the hands of someone else and expected it to be perfect for the fight. He didn't notice or predict that tiny crack in the blade. The smartest person is someone who can make sure their plan will work. Near could. Light couldn't.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Near even explicitly says that he wasn't enough and that it was only because of Mello that he won. You can't argue differently.
I don't believe I'm trying to?
Originally posted by Nephthys
Oh, well it appears that you would say that then.
Light is the superior chef. Just because Mikami knocked his dish over doesn't stop that from being a thing that is true.
And so you admit that Light is in fact smarter then? You just like Near more. I'm cool with that, just as long as you admit it.
Say what? :O
Actually, Light arguably isn't the chef in my scenario. He didn't do the baking, he just made the recipe and ordered Mikami to make. And considering Mikami is the chef and it was Mikami that bumped into the table causing the dish to suck, it means Light picked an incompetent chef.
That may be the case. But I don't think so personally. And yes, obviously I prefer Light. Even more than L actually.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Also I don't see how you can say Near's above Light but not above L considering Light beat L.
Well I dunno about Light beating L. All he did was predict Rem would kill him. Besides, it wasn't as if L was on even ground with Light as far as knowledge of the Death Note goes. Near knew about the Death Note before creating the SPK after all, whereas L only knew about it a few days before his death.