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I just wanted to see what you guys think was going to have the biggest opening night, wknd, etc. On the one hand you have the avengers which will be the first movie, correct me if i'm wrong where they take characters from other movies and collaborate them in one. You then have the dark knight returns, which will be the last of the trilogy of chris nolan and seeing how according to viewers it got only better, the third should be even more.

I think Uwe Boll's effort at that time will beat both movies.

I'm guessing he'll make a sick Dead Space flick

No superhero movie is going to have more hype than tdkr.

Originally posted by Scarlet315
the dark knight returns, which will be the last of the trilogy of chris nolan and seeing how according to viewers it got only better, the third should be even more.

Exactly like the X-Men "trilogy"

One reason that "The Dark Knight" made so much money is because the guy playing the Joker (Heath Ledger) died in real life before it was released. Like it or not, that raised HUGE publicity/curiosity for the movie.

Now, it just so happens the movie was worth every penny it made (it was great), but still, TDKR won't make as much as The Dark Knight did.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
One reason that "The Dark Knight" made so much money is because the guy playing the Joker (Heath Ledger) died in real life before it was released. Like it or not, that raised HUGE publicity/curiosity for the movie.

Now, it just so happens the movie was worth every penny it made (it was great), but still, TDKR won't make as much as The Dark Knight did.

WOM had more impact.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
One reason that "The Dark Knight" made so much money is because the guy playing the Joker (Heath Ledger) died in real life before it was released. Like it or not, that raised HUGE publicity/curiosity for the movie.

I doubt it. Brandon Lee died during The Crow but its not like that made it one of the biggest movies of all time.

The movie sold itself. Heath certainly helped a lot in that his acting was was fantastic.

Also the quality of Batman Begins helped sell The Dark Knight.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
I doubt it. Brandon Lee died during The Crow but its not like that made it one of the biggest movies of all time.

The movie sold itself. Heath certainly helped a lot in that his acting was was fantastic.

Also the quality of Batman Begins helped sell The Dark Knight. You're really not comparing "The Crow" to "The Dark Knight", are you? Really?

The Crow did get a boost from Lee's death. But not as big a boost. It just flat wasn't a great movie. It was/is a cult classic, nothing more. Dark Knight was actually a good movie. It did get a huge amount of additional press from Ledger's death. I remember it clearly. It still would have sold a ton without it. But I remember all the freaks dressed up like Joker while waiting in line for the movie...only time I've ever seen that.

I'm personally more psyched for the Avengers as it's incredibly ambitious to showcase Marvel's premier heroes in a single film. That being said, TDKR is likely going to get more hype from coasting on the previous films success alone.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I'm personally more psyched for the Avengers as it's incredibly ambitious to showcase Marvel's premier heroes in a single film. That being said, TDKR is likely going to get more hype from coasting on the previous films success alone.

Yeah likewise. I even think that the avengers will do better than the titantic or whatever movie is suppose to have had the highest opening. I mean this movie even before production is in its own class and i'm paraphrasing what c. hemsworth said 'having all these characters already being set up so you could get a feel about what they are about and then putting them in a film together.' It's gonna be bananas is what im trying to say. Don't get me wrong, i think the dark knight, dc even is good too. Though marvel is my favorite i still love flash comics, green lantern comics, i thought the movie wasn't bad either. I even like the flashpoint series. What they are doing with the dark knight is a good move too with bane. I was actually hoping for someone like killer croc, but bane is good too.

I hope they don't add useless comedy like IM 2. That was one of the main reasons I didn't like the film. Scarlet Johanson wasn't very good as well. But that was mainly because of the script.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I hope they don't add useless comedy like IM 2. That was one of the main reasons I didn't like the film. Scarlet Johanson wasn't very good as well. But that was mainly because of the script.

Yeah i know. The thing that sucked most about SJ was that she didnt have an accent. I mean don't get me wrong she was hot as hell. Definetly have the physique and all that, just dont know why they decided to let her keep her american accent. Movie wouldve been alot better, she wouldve been a lot hotter if they gave her i think russian accent.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
You're really not comparing "The Crow" to "The Dark Knight", are you? Really?

The Crow did get a boost from Lee's death. But not as big a boost. It just flat wasn't a great movie. It was/is a cult classic, nothing more. Dark Knight was actually a good movie. It did get a huge amount of additional press from Ledger's death. I remember it clearly. It still would have sold a ton without it. But I remember all the freaks dressed up like Joker while waiting in line for the movie...only time I've ever seen that.

Because we saw scenes of him as the Joker in scenes and trailers, and we could see he was awsome in it. Hell I was propa hyped to see it myself.

Like I said his ACTING helped make the movie so damn huge. That added to word of mouth about how great the first movie was. Not Heath's death. A comic book movie doesn't make a Billion dollars because someone died LOL

And btw Crow was a damn good movie. Not good enough to be one of the greatest of all time... But Dark Knight was, Thats why it made money.

Oh and Brandon Lee dying on set was big news. Especially considering the way his dad died.

I'm more excited for The Avengers just for the sheer novelty of it,but I think Batman will probably fair better.

Originally posted by Scarlet315
Yeah likewise. I even think that the avengers will do better than the titantic or whatever movie is suppose to have had the highest opening.

Lol It took 11 years for a movie to beat Titanic, and that was another James Cameron film. Avengers has no hope of that kind of success.

It would be a massive hit if it can beat Iron Man at the box office, but I wuldn't get your hopes up of that even.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Lol It took 11 years for a movie to beat Titanic, and that was another James Cameron film. Avengers has no hope of that kind of success.

It would be a massive hit if it can beat Iron Man at the box office, but I wuldn't get your hopes up of that even.

It's not going to be Titanic but it stands a far better chance than most film's in my opinion. Hell, if they threw Wolverine and Spiderman in then I'll bet you it could surpass Titanic. But as it stands though, Iron Man going to be in this and that alone will bring big numbers. You're looking at Downey, Johanson, and Jackson who're all big stars. Hensworth and Evans is another reason for the female demographic to go see it. If Captain America does Thor number, the Avengers have good chance of beating TDKR.

Just saw the star line up for TDKR, man that's a bunch of good actors. Not A-list stars but definitely some A-list actors. This could be an interesting showdown. The Avengers cast has the star named actors and interesting characters while the Dark Knight Rises has the quality actors and Christopher Nolan as their director. Iron Man, Thor, Captain America, and Hulk over shadow Batman, Catwoman, Bane, and Ra's Al Ghul in recognition. The Joker is and will always be one of comicdom's most infamously known character to the public. He's not in this; hence, the TDKR would be lucky to reach the height of the Dark Knight.

My prediction is that the Avengers beat the Dark Knight Rising worldwide in sales. Both will be good movies, but the Dark Knight Rising is going to be the better movie without a doubt.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Like I said his ACTING helped make the movie so damn huge. That added to word of mouth about how great the first movie was. Not Heath's death. A comic book movie doesn't make a Billion dollars because someone died LOL Ok, you're completely right. The news and all the other forms of media rampantly discussing his death and how it may have been related to the film's dark setting/joker's mood had NOTHING to do with it. Obviously you are right and I'm just not remembering things correctly.
Crow was a good movie, nothing more. Honestly, this is completely a matter of opinion. But if we're going off ratings, the critics agree that it's not as good as you are trying to make it sound.
Yes, it was big news. But Brandon Lee was not an A list actor at the time. Ledger was. In fact Ledger was on the verge of becoming a top 5 actor probably. Dark Knight would have no doubt propelled him to the top. There is a huge difference between the two, and the amount of press they got. I was there for both.

Top 5 actor? I guess there is no accounting for taste. Ledger wasn't THAT big and he did help the movie, but WOM was bigger than Ledger's death. Not to mention that Batman Begins helped the interest as well.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Top 5 actor? I guess there is no accounting for taste. Ledger wasn't THAT big and he did help the movie, but WOM was bigger than Ledger's death. Not to mention that Batman Begins helped the interest as well. LOL, oh NOES?!?!? Now you're trolling me in this thread too? Gasp?!

Notice I said PROBABLY after my top five actor comment. I don't think he is/would be by my opinion. But getting payed/drawing big roles? Probably. Unless you take probably to mean 100% fact. Judging by your logic in past posts, I'd guess you do.

I troll nobody!

I'm really looking forward to Avengers. I couldn't care less about The Dark Knight Rises. A lot of people love Batman so that will most likely do better.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
You're really not comparing "The Crow" to "The Dark Knight", are you? Really?

The Crow did get a boost from Lee's death. But not as big a boost. It just flat wasn't a great movie. It was/is a cult classic, nothing more. Dark Knight was actually a good movie. It did get a huge amount of additional press from Ledger's death. I remember it clearly. It still would have sold a ton without it. But I remember all the freaks dressed up like Joker while waiting in line for the movie...only time I've ever seen that.
I'd watch The Crow over and over again before putting myself through The Dark Knight again.

Just saying.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
It's not going to be Titanic but it stands a far better chance than most film's in my opinion. Hell, if they threw Wolverine and Spiderman in then I'll bet you it could surpass Titanic.

You see I actually think that would make it worse. The more random heroes you put in one movie the less chance of it working. I actuallu think they've done a decent enough job from the individual movies in making it believable that these guys are in the same world(and in the Avengers cartoon for that matter). But the more you add, the less believable its gna get.

You see its not like the X-Men where they're all mutants so you can have however many superpowered people as you want. And its got a great story behind it for why they're together.

But even in X-Men when you get too many of them, the story starts suffering.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
But as it stands though, Iron Man going to be in this and that alone will bring big numbers. You're looking at Downey, Johanson, and Jackson who're all big stars. Hensworth and Evans is another reason for the female demographic to go see it. If Captain America does Thor number, the Avengers have good chance of beating TDKR.


First of all I personally dnt see Captain America being a big hit. You can hold me to that later.

Secondly your making a HUGE mistake thinking an all star cast is gna sell the movie. No it will NOT! It will just help the marketing a little.

Ghost Rider had Nicholas Cage and Eva Mendes. Didn't really help. Incedible Hulk had Edward Norton and Liv Tyler. Again where did that get the movie?!

It will HAVE to be a damn good movie to make as much as you guys are expecting. Dnt expect the Stars and Characters to do that alone.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
Ok, you're completely right. The news and all the other forms of media rampantly discussing his death and how it may have been related to the film's dark setting/joker's mood had NOTHING to do with it. Obviously you are right and I'm just not remembering things correctly.
Crow was a good movie, nothing more. Honestly, this is completely a matter of opinion. But if we're going off ratings, the critics agree that it's not as good as you are trying to make it sound.
Yes, it was big news. But Brandon Lee was not an A list actor at the time. Ledger was. In fact Ledger was on the verge of becoming a top 5 actor probably. Dark Knight would have no doubt propelled him to the top. There is a huge difference between the two, and the amount of press they got. I was there for both.

If I remember correctly the hype was more to do with how good Heath's acting was in that movie, something we had a taste of in the trailers, but the movie itself surpassed all our expectations.

And A-List actor?? Dude I didnt even know Heath by name until TDK. There was hype that his performance in this would defo have put him in the A-List category though, and guess what? It would have! The film was Brill! Heath's acting Fantastic!

And Do you have any idea how difficult it is for a movie to make a Billion dollars? Lol Ok you keep believing a movie which kids cant even watch, made more than any Spiderman movie, any Star Wars movie, All Harry Potter movies and 2 Lord of the Rings movies just because the poor guy died! Lol..

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
If I remember correctly the hype was more to do with how good Heath's acting was in that movie, something we had a taste of in the trailers, but the movie itself surpassed all our expectations.First of all, you can't tell how good acting is based off of trailers. If that were the case, there would never be a bad movie; or at least very few. Secondly, the hype WAS about his death BEFORE the movie came out. They weren't praising his acting until people had seen the movie.
Well, you'd be one of the few. Most people knew Heath Ledger very well at that point in his career. 10 things I hate about you, The Patriot, A Knight's Tale, Brokeback Mountain, The Imaginarium of Dr. Parnassus.....and many more. He was definitely a star; one on the way to becoming a superstar.
Kids can't watch? Kids can't watch what? Half the people in every theater I wen't to for that movie were kids. And I never said it was JUST because he died. I said his death raised a lot of controversy/curiosity/interest for the movie. And as Prep-man likes to say, it raised WORD OF MOUTH as well. The movie would have sold tons regardless, but his death certainly helped.

Ghost Rider had Nicholas Cage and Eva Mendes. Didn't really help. Incedible Hulk had Edward Norton and Liv Tyler. Again where did that get the movie?!

It will HAVE to be a damn good movie to make as much as you guys are expecting. Dnt expect the Stars and Characters to do that alone.

You see that's where the avengers is going to be different. I think it's partially b/c of the advertising and the way marvel studios have done it so far is genius. They first give you the individual movies with each character standing on its own. Then putting them together, i mean even non comic book fans would want to see something like this where if marvel studios advertised right, would be curious as to how iron man is now standing next to thor or what is hulk doing fighting chris from the captain america movie. I still think its going to be huge.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
You see I actually think that would make it worse. The more random heroes you put in one movie the less chance of it working. I actuallu think they've done a decent enough job from the individual movies in making it believable that these guys are in the same world(and in the Avengers cartoon for that matter). But the more you add, the less believable its gna get.

They're a group of people with powers. It's a super hero team. How is that not believable? You might as well argue that the LOTR isn't believable because of the orges, elfs, sorcerrors, and living forest exist in the same world. If the film is weak, it's because of having to handle the on time screen of so many heroes and not because it's hard for viewers to believe they co-exist in the same universe.



You think people are going to be like "uh shit they all have different backgrounds from which they got they're powers. Unbelievable, too farfetch, I won't go see this movie. But hey, let's go see that Star Wars movie with all the different races of aliens, androids, people with abilities to tape into this mystical force that allows that them precognition, shoot lightning out there hands, telekenesis, and all the other crap."



I'll hold you to that.



LMAO, Cage and Mendez? Cage is a has been and never had the star power of Jackson or even Johanson. You think those two mean much to box office numbers? Norton and Tyler is even less popular. Ghost Rider isn't Captain America in the least. The character is even less well known. Iron Man is less well known than Captain America who's actually had a movie before this along with more cultural references then Iron Man before his film came out. Downey and IM's special effects is what brought in the numbers. IM had little name recognition to the public before hand. But you show kids clips of the movie with that armor and you tell the adult crowd that Downey is back to being an actor and starring as a superhero/cocky billionaire and people bought that up.



It has enough star power, character interest, and special effects to beat out TDKR. But yeah, it needs a good story to keep it going.

Originally posted by Mindset
No superhero movie is going to have more hype than tdkr.

Really all that matters.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
They're a group of people with powers. It's a super hero team. How is that not believable? You might as well argue that the LOTR isn't believable because of the orges, elfs, sorcerrors, and living forest exist in the same world. If the film is weak, it's because of having to handle the on time screen of so many heroes and not because it's hard for viewers to believe they co-exist in the same universe.



You think people are going to be like "uh shit they all have different backgrounds from which they got they're powers. Unbelievable, too farfetch, I won't go see this movie. But hey, let's go see that Star Wars movie with all the different races of aliens, androids, people with abilities to tape into this mystical force that allows that them precognition, shoot lightning out there hands, telekenesis, and all the other crap."



I'll hold you to that.



LMAO, Cage and Mendez? Cage is a has been and never had the star power of Jackson or even Johanson. You think those two mean much to box office numbers? Norton and Tyler is even less popular. Ghost Rider isn't Captain America in the least. The character is even less well known. Iron Man is less well known than Captain America who's actually had a movie before this along with more cultural references then Iron Man before his film came out. Downey and IM's special effects is what brought in the numbers. IM had little name recognition to the public before hand. But you show kids clips of the movie with that armor and you tell the adult crowd that Downey is back to being an actor and starring as a superhero/cocky billionaire and people bought that up.



It has enough star power, character interest, and special effects to beat out TDKR. But yeah, it needs a good story to keep it going. true, story does need to be good.

I say Avengers mainly for the scale of epicness. Its true about what was mentioned about TDK. Ledgers death raised much hype about the movie and his role before it was even out.

Avengers are going to have the WOW factor in Thor, Hulk and Ironman being on film together. That alone is going to give many ppl goosebumps. Also, TDKR doesnt have that villain that draws the crowd such as a Joker. The only thing the Batman movie has going for it, is that "its the Batman after TDK".

Not saying that both wont be good. Its just that Avengers is going to be super epic based off the roster alone.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
LMAO, Cage and Mendez? Cage is a has been and never had the star power of Jackson or even Johanson. You think those two mean much to box office numbers? Norton and Tyler is even less popular. Ghost Rider isn't Captain America in the least. The character is even less well known. Iron Man is less well known than Captain America who's actually had a movie before this along with more cultural references then Iron Man before his film came out. Downey and IM's special effects is what brought in the numbers. IM had little name recognition to the public before hand. But you show kids clips of the movie with that armor and you tell the adult crowd that Downey is back to being an actor and starring as a superhero/cocky billionaire and people bought that up.

Im going to have to disagree with that. Ed Norton more than anyone else mentioned was a huge pickup for them. He has many classic movies and probably more star power than anyone mentioned. Liv is also highly recognized moreso id say compared to Eva or Downy Jr.

Ironman less well known that Cap? Yes, Cap may have had the movie's first, but Iron man has probably been more consistent which is possibly why his (blockbuster)movie came out first. Cap has been slowly pushed moreso to the forefront since Civil War, but before that, its been IM as part of Marvels big 4 (along with Wolvie, Hulk, Spidey) for the last 16 years.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
They're a group of people with powers. It's a super hero team. How is that not believable? You might as well argue that the LOTR isn't believable because of the orges, elfs, sorcerrors, and living forest exist in the same world. If the film is weak, it's because of having to handle the on time screen of so many heroes and not because it's hard for viewers to believe they co-exist in the same universe.
You think people are going to be like "uh shit they all have different backgrounds from which they got they're powers. Unbelievable, too farfetch, I won't go see this movie. But hey, let's go see that Star Wars movie with all the different races of aliens, androids, people with abilities to tape into this mystical force that allows that them precognition, shoot lightning out there hands, telekenesis, and all the other crap."

Lord of the Rings and Star Wars are set in far off fantasy worlds. The normal rules are all out the window when that happens.

And yes I do think "having different backgrounds" like you put it will effect the way people see it. If you dnt understand its the background of a character that makes a good film, then you dnt understand what a good film is.

You cant just put random superheros together and expect it to work.



Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
I'll hold you to that.

You can. The scene when he comes in shooting looks so stupid. Dnt expect a massive hit. Theres no real hype or eagerness for a Captain America movie.




Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
LMAO, Cage and Mendez? Cage is a has been and never had the star power of Jackson or even Johanson. You think those two mean much to box office numbers? Norton and Tyler is even less popular. Ghost Rider isn't Captain America in the least. The character is even less well known. Iron Man is less well known than Captain America who's actually had a movie before this along with more cultural references then Iron Man before his film came out. Downey and IM's special effects is what brought in the numbers. IM had little name recognition to the public before hand. But you show kids clips of the movie with that armor and you tell the adult crowd that Downey is back to being an actor and starring as a superhero/cocky billionaire and people bought that up.

Are you kidding me? Cage, Norton and Tyler are HUGE stars, much bigger than anyone in The Avengers movie.

Stars just help with the advertising, they dnt sell the movie itself.

Look how many stars were in Oceans 12 and Oceans 13. By your theory they should have been the biggest movies of all time.

But I agree with you that Iron Man made it big due to Downey. But not because he's some big A-Lister star. It was because of his ACTING in the movie. And the Dircetor did a really good job, and it had a damn good story and character build up. Thats what makes a good movie, and helps make a box office success.



Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
It has enough star power, character interest, and special effects to beat out TDKR. But yeah, it needs a good story to keep it going.

Theres no way its gna beat TDKR unless by some shock TDKR turns out to be awful.

Seriously your expectations are too high for Avengers. Star Power and special effects aint gna do it. Like Downey himself said this is a seriously ambitious project. Why's he saying that? Because its actually a big risk, which could easily go either way. Flop or Hit. But certainly not a guaranteed Hit.

Cage in the 90's was pretty big. Just as big as Jackson, if not more so with his Oscar win. He may be washed up (he takes bad rolls, because of money problems), but he's a good actor when he wants to be.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Cage in the 90's was pretty big. Just as big as Jackson, if not more so with his Oscar win. He may be washed up (he takes bad rolls, because of money problems), but he's a good actor when he wants to be.

Yep, take a look at Kick-Ass.

I gotta say I'm interested the DKR simply because of Bane. He is one of my favorite Batman villains and it will be nice to see him done right.

But I'm more interested to see how the Avengers do. I think they did the coolest thing ever by giving all the main title characters a separate movie for character development. It removes the whole problem most big cast movies have with not giving enough screen time for every character to flesh out. This way you already know what you need to know about each character.

Plus with almost all the development angles out of the way you should be able to focus more the story and character interactions instead of bloated screen time.

Its hard for me to say which will do better. With the right marketing Avengers could get the bigger opening based on concept. Iron Man, Thor, Hulk, plus the personal actors fanbases. It could prove to bring in a good sized demographic.

On fanbase though Batman will still reign supreme because its Batman, but Bane isn't a mainstream big name Villain so that could hurt the movie appeal. The Joker was a no brainer you had to go see him especially after seeing the tailors.

If I had to go on gut opinion I actually think Avengers will do better. It could be marketed as something extremely fresh which always helps.

I'm really curious as to why people are thinking Avengers is going to make more money. TDKR is flying off the success of TDk and Inception both of which totally outsold the Ironmans and Thor. I mean TDKR made over 1000 million... The Iron Mans made around 600 each.

Originally posted by ares834
I'm really curious as to why people are thinking Avengers is going to make more money. TDKR is flying off the success of TDk and Inception both of which totally outsold the Ironmans and Thor. I mean TDKR made over 1000 million... The Iron Mans made around 600 each.

I have no idea. Marvel fans getting over excited about Avengers I guess.

Originally posted by ares834
I'm really curious as to why people are thinking Avengers is going to make more money. TDKR is flying off the success of TDk and Inception both of which totally outsold the Ironmans and Thor. I mean TDKR made over 1000 million... The Iron Mans made around 600 each. Riding off the success of a previous film isn't always a guaranteed thing. Plus the villain they chose just won't be as big a drawl as the Joker. Of course it is still Batman.

The Avengers is going to be drawing from different markets even if some of them overlap, people who wouldn't go see Thor but will go see Iron Man will still go to see Avengers.

Of course the DKR could beat Avengers but my personal feeling is that the Avengers has the better chance. It will seem fresher, and bigger imo.

Originally posted by Newjak Riding off the success of a previous film isn't always a guaranteed thing. Plus the villain they chose just won't be as big a drawl as the Joker. Of course it is still Batman.

It's not only going to ride off the sucess of TDK but also Inception. Both of which outsold the Iron Mans. Considering the rave reviews and popularity that TDK garnered I honestly see no hope for the Avengers unless TDKR is a massive flop.

Furthermore Nolan is the director right now.



The overlap for these two films is likely enormous. I would say that almost 90% of the people who saw Thor would have seen Iron Man (yes this is pure speculation but I don't know anyone who saw Thor that didn't see IM in theaters.)



I'm excited for Acengers as well. However, I know far more people that are excited for TDKR than Avengers. TDKR appeals to a very wide audiance of many ages. The Iron Man/Thor films seem to mostly appeal to the teenagers and comic fans. I have no doubt that both will make a massive profit and do extremley well... But TDK is currently the 7th highest selling movie ever (not adjusted for inlflation) while IM 2 is all the way back in 54th.

Originally posted by ares834
It's not only going to ride off the sucess of TDK but also Inception. Both of which outsold the Iron Mans. Considering the rave reviews and popularity that TDK garnered I honestly see no hope for the Avengers unless TDKR is a massive flop.

Furthermore Nolan is the director right now.



The overlap for these two films is likely enormous. I would say that almost 90% of the people who saw Thor would have seen Iron Man (yes this is pure speculation but I don't know anyone who saw Thor that didn't see IM in theaters.)



I'm excited for Acengers as well. However, I know far more people that are excited for TDKR than Avengers. TDKR appeals to a very wide audiance of many ages. The Iron Man/Thor films seem to mostly appeal to the teenagers and comic fans. I have no doubt that both will make a massive profit and do extremley well... But TDK is currently the 7th highest selling movie ever (not adjusted for inlflation) while IM 2 is all the way back in 54th. Just because Nolan directed Inception doesn't mean that Inception's reception .... will translate towards the TDKR.

Also I'm not just talking about the movie character's themselves. I'm talking about fans of Robert Downing Jr will go see Avengers, so will fans of Chris Evans, Scarlett Jo... They'll all go see it.

Of course like I said I could be wrong and I don't necessarily disagree with alot of points but I could easily see the Avengers being the summer blockbuster movie if marketed right which I think they will.

Like I said I don't really have facts to support just a gut feeling that people may view the Avengers as a big draw.

And should TDKR be bigger it wouldn't surprise me.

Originally posted by Newjak
Scarlett Jo... Don't you ever cut short Scarlett Johansson's name again! sneer

Originally posted by Badabing
Don't you ever cut short Scarlett Johansson's name again! sneer I didn't want to misspell her last dur

Originally posted by Newjak
I didn't want to misspell her last dur

I forgive you then.

Originally posted by Badabing


I forgive you then. Thank you Bada

How have you been man?

Originally posted by Newjak
Thank you Bada

How have you been man? Doing good. Just trying to work, be at the gym and have a social life. How about you?



And not to keep off topic, I have high hopes for the Avengers movie. Thor did better than it thought. We'll have to see how Cap does. But I think the next Batman will be a blockbuster.

Originally posted by Badabing
Doing good. Just trying to work, be at the gym and have a social life. How about you?



And not to keep off topic, I have high hopes for the Avengers movie. Thor did better than it thought. We'll have to see how Cap does. But I think the next Batman will be a blockbuster. I'm getting ready to start a new job in Columbus Oh. That has me excited.

As for the topic

I hope the new Batman is really really awesome cause bane is a personal favorite of mine.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Lord of the Rings and Star Wars are set in far off fantasy worlds. The normal rules are all out the window when that happens.

LMAO, and the comic book universe isn't? This is an Avengers universe, not an Iron Man universe featuring other heroes.



Luckily for Marvel, the house of ideas put the top four heroes in their own movies before putting this movie out. This is on top of the number of books, tv series, old movies, and cartoons. That's why they pushed Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes out. The only people who don't haven't been explored in movies are Fury (if you disregarded the 90s flick), Widow, and Hawkeye who don't really have powers to begin with. So this difference in background isn't much, especially for three people who's background can be covered in a few flash backs.



Oh please, how is that stupid other than your opinion? What made it stupid? You mean Cap busting through along with what is the Howling Commandos at his side? If anything, that scene just stokes fans of recent Secret Warriors. And I'm not worried, you'll be eating those words.



LMAO, in the 90s for Cage and Tyler maybe. Norton isn't a huge star; he's an awesome actor for sure but not he doesn't have the star power comparable to Downey or Jackson. Maybe if Ghost Rider appeared in the 90s would Cage's star power brought in the audience but he was already washed up when he starred in GR so bringing it up as a point against Downey and Jackson's star power is moot.



LMAO. Oceans 12 stars were playing super heroes and cartering to the kids and young adults crowd? I'm confused I think you missed where I said the star power and characters of this movie is going to bring in the numbers. It's a superheroes genre, basically action & sci-fi, so it's going to perform better than Oceans 12.



Where did I say it's solely based on star power? You're funny.

Really? So how come Batman Begin did so shitty compared to say Iron Man and say Thor? Nolan has proven to be a great director but there's no good villain in TDKR. What have have is Ra's Al Ghul from BB and how well did he sell? Now you've got Catwoman and Bane. None of them are comparable to Joker and we'll have to see if any of their acting is even close to Health Ledger's Joker. It's going to have to be damn good in terms of story for it come be like TDK. So yeah, the Avengers to can take them if they had a solid story as well. It's not going to be as good as Nolan that's for sure but they have a better group of characters to work with.



Of course it's not a guarantee hit but if they do it right then yeah they can pull off big numbers.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Really? So how come Batman Begin did so shitty compared to say Iron Man and say Thor?

Because Batman Begins was the first Batman film after the shitty Batman & Robin.

But the quality movie Batman Begins was (far superior to Iron Man or Thor) helped set up the success of TDK.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing


Where did I say it's solely based on star power? You're funny.

Here:

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Downey and IM's special effects is what brought in the numbers.

Ok you put in special effects as well. LOL..

Oh and your friggin hilarious thinking Robert Downey is a bigger star than Edward Norton or Nicholas friggin Cage LOL LOL.. He's only big and in the spot light a bit nowdays because of his success in Iron man, that fact alone aint gna make Avengers even close to TDKR.

Even the way its going to effect that town's economy by offering more jobs shows how big this movie is gonna be.

http://comicbookmovie.com/fansites/MarvelFreshman/news/?a=41282

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Because Batman Begins was the first Batman film after the shitty Batman & Robin.

But the quality movie Batman Begins was (far superior to Iron Man or Thor) helped set up the success of TDK. Someone should take you and your fanboy logic, toss you in a magic lamp and bury you away for thousands of years. Then, no one will be smart enough or remember enough upon your discovery to know that you are horribly, terribly wrong.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Because Batman Begins was the first Batman film after the shitty Batman & Robin.

But the quality movie Batman Begins was (far superior to Iron Man or Thor) helped set up the success of TDK.

I like how you can't say Begins was great on its own without referencing the previous franchise... says a lot really. And to add to that Nolan really hasn't done anything different from the previous franchise except put it across in a more serious (dare I say, boring?) way. He still puts Batman in heavy rubber, has the love interest/villains be the focal point of the movie, has his Batman be reckless with killing and not saving people, reveals Batman's identity (to said girlfriends) and other characters etc.

As for Begins being better than Iron Man - as a character study - yes. But as a movie it isn't because Iron Man has better pacing, dialogue , action and the humour (in the first IM at least) doesn't seem forced while in Begins it is very forced and sort of uncomfortable at times.

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/MarvelFreshman/news/?a=42030

Forget Dark Knight, i think Avengers will do better than Harry Potter!

I hope the Avengers is good. What a let down it would be if it sucks after all these other movies that build up to it. And it has a chance to make tons of money since it will draw in those that liked the Iron Man movies, those who liked Thor, those who like Capt. America, etc. Sequels often make tons of movies even if they are crap just because of the reputation of the previous movie. This is going off the reputation of many movies that were successful. I don't think we have ever seen anything put together like this in the film industry.

That said, I still think Dark Knight Rises will be better than the Avengers.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
Someone should take you and your fanboy logic, toss you in a magic lamp and bury you away for thousands of years. Then, no one will be smart enough or remember enough upon your discovery to know that you are horribly, terribly wrong.

Fanboy Logic saying Batman begins was better than Iron Man and Thor? Lol.. I think its quite obvious who the fanboy is here..

Batman Begins is the movie that set up The Dark Knight..

Hey guess what most people say the best Pirates of The Carribean movie was? Any guesses? The first one! Curse of the Black Pearl! And yet its the only POTC movie not to make approx a billion!

Guess which Transformers movie most people think was the best? Any guesses? The First one! And yet the sequels have done better!

Guess which Iron Man movie people think is by far the best?? Any guesses?? Yes thats right the First one! And yet the sequel was more successful at the box office.

Do you know why?? Well let me explain it to you. The Original movies in all those above franchises that Iv mentioned we're so well recieved by people, that it set up the hype, excitement and anticipation for the sequels.

There you see you learn something new every day : )

Dnt let your Marvel fanboyism effect your intellect. Batman Begins was a classic. In the top 5 Superhero movies of all time. Dnt get me wrong though, Iron Man is close. Thor? Top 10 at best.

Originally posted by Lord Shadow Z
I like how you can't say Begins was great on its own without referencing the previous franchise... says a lot really.

Lol! Its true. Do you not know how these things work? Incredible Hulk with Edward Norton was a damn good movie, but it Flopped? Why? Because it followed the terrible Ang Lee movie. Thats just how these things work.

Originally posted by Lord Shadow Z
And to add to that Nolan really hasn't done anything different from the previous franchise except put it across in a more serious (dare I say, boring?) way. He still puts Batman in heavy rubber, has the love interest/villains be the focal point of the movie, has his Batman be reckless with killing and not saving people, reveals Batman's identity (to said girlfriends) and other characters etc.

Oh yeah all Nolan did was create the biggest superhero franchise of all time! Nothing that creative! LOL

Originally posted by Lord Shadow Z
As for Begins being better than Iron Man - as a character study - yes. But as a movie it isn't because Iron Man has better pacing, dialogue , action and the humour (in the first IM at least) doesn't seem forced while in Begins it is very forced and sort of uncomfortable at times.

Thats just your opinion, and a very subjective one at that.

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JakeLester/news/?a=42060

I have to admit the trailer was cool. Guess the competition continues...

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Lol! Its true. Do you not know how these things work? Incredible Hulk with Edward Norton was a damn good movie, but it Flopped? Why? Because it followed the terrible Ang Lee movie. Thats just how these things work.



Oh yeah all Nolan did was create the biggest superhero franchise of all time! Nothing that creative! LOL



Thats just your opinion, and a very subjective one at that. [/QUOTE


1. Then that doesn't say anything positive about the movie if its only liked because its different to a previous interpretation. That gives it no basis to be successful on its own two feet. I would say Hulk 'flopped' because superheroes with transformations (like Hulk) are confusing to make work on film. Do we give Hulk more time or Banner? Look at Fantastic Four, they had to make up excuses to allow Mike Chiklis to act as himself for a bit.

2. By using all the elements I mentioned from the previous franchise. Nothing original to his own interpretation except how he fleshed his particular path to the story but the components remained the same. From the TDK trailer alone you can see he blatantly copies a sequence from '89. That doesn't make him creative at all, especially as we know his policy of dumbing down the fantastical elements of Batman.

3. Of course, I meant to word it more like an opinion.

i will predict that the avengers will have an $90 million opening weekend, while the dark knight rises opens up $ 180 million +

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
i will predict that the avengers will have an $90 million opening weekend, while the dark knight rises opens up $ 180 million +

Yeah, i agree. 90-100 Million for Avengers. Possibly a bit more, but TDKR will have more. It's the most anticpiated movie by far.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Yeah, i agree. 90-100 Million for Avengers. Possibly a bit more, but TDKR will have more. It's the most anticpiated movie by far.

yep and i am looking forward to what should be a great, great, great 2 and 1/2 hour film

Originally posted by Lord Shadow Z



1. Then that doesn't say anything positive about the movie if its only liked because its different to a previous interpretation.


The Movie made over a Billion Dollars at the box office, and was loved by critics and movie goers world-wide. Its just a great franchise which was boosted by both movies awsomeness.

Originally posted by Lord Shadow Z
That gives it no basis to be successful on its own two feet. I would say Hulk 'flopped' because superheroes with transformations (like Hulk) are confusing to make work on film. Do we give Hulk more time or Banner? Look at Fantastic Four, they had to make up excuses to allow Mike Chiklis to act as himself for a bit.

Hey Incredible Hulk was a damn good movie.. The transformation thing is whats always worked with Hulk.. There was a lot of hype for the first Ang Lee movie but it was just a big disappointment, so the hype was lost then for the Edward Norton Hulk.

Oh and as for Fantastic Four franchise gone wrong, there were a lot of problems with those movies.

Originally posted by Lord Shadow Z
2. By using all the elements I mentioned from the previous franchise. Nothing original to his own interpretation except how he fleshed his particular path to the story but the components remained the same. From the TDK trailer alone you can see he blatantly copies a sequence from '89. That doesn't make him creative at all, especially as we know his policy of dumbing down the fantastical elements of Batman.


Lol Most Movie Goers would disagree. But hey to each his own. I Loved Iron Man and the Incredible Hulk, and I liked Thor too, so I hope Avengers is great, but I just dnt realistically see it competing on Dark Knight's level.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
The Movie made over a Billion Dollars at the box office, and was loved by critics and movie goers world-wide. Its just a great franchise which was boosted by both movies awsomeness.


Hey Incredible Hulk was a damn good movie.. The transformation thing is whats always worked with Hulk.. There was a lot of hype for the first Ang Lee movie but it was just a big disappointment, so the hype was lost then for the Edward Norton Hulk.

Oh and as for Fantastic Four franchise gone wrong, there were a lot of problems with those movies.


Lol Most Movie Goers would disagree. But hey to each his own. I Loved Iron Man and the Incredible Hulk, and I liked Thor too, so I hope Avengers is great, but I just dnt realistically see it competing on Dark Knight's level.


1. Then why is the Batman reboot happening so soon after TDKR? For fun? And your second sentence is also an opinion, something which you called me out for.

2. I never said IH was a bad movie, I enjoyed it but it does have the problem of flipping between Banner and Hulk and with actor ego it can not be all equal screen time. Why do think they hired Ruffalo for Avengers? Because Norton probably wouldn't have enjoyed being essentially less than a bit part in Avengers.

3. Then they would be wrong, it's a complete fact that he (Nolan) has used the same elements from the previous franchise - nothing new. And I think with a film like Avengers who are essentially showcasing 4 top superheroes, and others, are going to be bringing in more individual fanbases together in one place than just Batman on his own. A Batman that has in essence been castrated conceptually with all of his talents and interesting villains in the comics downplayed in this franchise.

Avengers is still essentially a comic book film despite how epic the scale and roster is. Just that.

The Dark Knight Rises is coming off arguably the greatest sequel ever and is honestly a film that attracts a broader audience. Adults who aren't into comics as much will see it, hardcore comic fans will definately see it, as well as kids.

Avengers will definately get 2/3 of those but I doubt regular movie goers will take a shot at Avengers over a Nolan directed Batman film. Not to mention, this is the conclusion to a series so Batman has that going for itself.

Avengers could very well become the most profited Marvel movie. But I still think Batman is bound to make more opening day, weekend, and overall with it being the better movie and all among other things.

Both will be awesome no doubt.

Originally posted by Lord Shadow Z
1. Then why is the Batman reboot happening so soon after TDKR? For fun? And your second sentence is also an opinion, something which you called me out for.



Because Christopher Nolan and Christian Bale are not making anymore, and its too huge a movie franchise now to just let go.

Also Nolan said his Batman is in his own Universe with no other superheroes, so a reboot of Batman will probably tie in to an eventual Justice League movie.

But I personally do think its a mistake to reboot the franchise again so quickly.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Because Christopher Nolan and Christian Bale are not making anymore, and its too huge a movie franchise now to just let go.

Also Nolan said his Batman is in his own Universe with no other superheroes, so a reboot of Batman will probably tie in to an eventual Justice League movie.

But I personally do think its a mistake to reboot the franchise again so quickly.

I agree, Batman is a huge draw and that is probably the main reason, along with a possible Justice League movie but they will have to display the new Batman with a more comic-oriented look and feel. This means they will have to come up with something truly new if they want to differentiate itself from previous interpretations.

I wouldn't say a mistake because some people do want a different look but I will say it was crass of WB to bring out the news of a reboot before TDKR has even been released and absorbed by fans.

Finally, it was a pleasure debating with you, I hope you enjoy TDKR when it comes out .

Not sure which movie will be better (My heart says that Avengers will be far more enjoyable/fun), but going off of the trailers?

Avengers trailer>>>>>>TDKR trailer.

Gary Oldman wheezing on a bed is far less interesting than Thor throwing Mjolnir at the audience.

I can't wait to see the theatrical trailer of TDKR. Is the Avengers teaser up?

Dark knight will be a better movie for sure, but avengers will win the numbers game...,easily,IMO.

Originally posted by jinXed by JaNx
Dark knight will be a better movie for sure, but avengers will win the numbers game...,easily,IMO. Lol, FOR SURE?

No, that is not certain. Unless you've seen both already and know the outcome. TDKR is going to have to work against the 3rd movie syndrome (Spidey 3, X-men 3, Superman 3, Batman Forever....need I go on?).

Whereas Avengers has been building up for years and people cannot wait to see how it's going to play out.

Marvel Studios really hasn't let me down so far, so to say that one will definitely be the better movie at this point is foolish.

"Ghost Rider: Spirit of Vengeance" will do better than both .


Just kidding xD.

I doubt the difference between these movies will be much. But no matter which movie makes more money, both will probably be the highest-grossing films of their respective comic industry. TDKR will be DC's highest-grossing film and Avengers will be Marvel's highest-grossing film. Both movies have huge potential to rise above the other one. From the way I see it, the chance of TDKR doing better than Avengers is 50/50 and same thing can be said for Avengers. We'll just have to wait and see.

However, I am interested to see which movie does better than the other one critically wise and gets better reception. This is going to be the biggest movie battle that Marvel and DC had so far. I have a feeling that there will be tons of debates on forums like these over which movie is superior and to an extent, there might be a few fanboy wars (especially on YouTube). But I am looking forward to both movies and I think both movies will be great, regardless of which one is better than the other. But poor Spider-Man . He stands no chance next year.


I also want to point out something. As I said earlier, both movies have equal potential to top the other one at the box office and reception wise. Isn't it interesting how Batman ALONE is able to keep up with the Avengers at the box office? You have an entire team of superheroes from Marvel having to compete against ONE superhero from DC and this one character will be an actual challenge for them at the box office. The conclusion is: Batman alone is able to be on par with the 7 of Marvel's most popular characters at the same time. This just speaks volumes of how epic of a character Batman is .

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
TDKR is going to have to work against the 3rd movie syndrome (Spidey 3, X-men 3, Superman 3, Batman Forever....need I go on?)

I don't think TDKR will have problems due to it being a third movie. You have to keep in mind that not only Chris Nolan hasn't made a bad movie so far (every single movie he made was well received critically wise; I know that there are a few people out there that dislike some of his movies but for every movie he made, the majority of his audience liked it) but he has also said that he refuses to do another Batman movie unless it is equally as good as TDK or better. So if this movie is bad or mediocre/average, it wouldn't have been made in the first place. In the worst case scenario, TDKR will be a great movie but just not as good as TDK. And that is the WORST case scenario. In the best, it will take TDK's spot as the best comic book movie and/or be on par with Avengers or even better.

Also keep in mind that every third movie failed due to the studio intervening with the director's vision and plan or due to a big change occuring in the franchise. Here are some examples:
1) Spider-Man 3 sucked because Sony did not let Raimi do what he wanted to do and forced him to do Venom.
2) X-Men 3 sucked because the director left/was replaced.
3) Superman 3 sucked because the director left.
4) Batman Forever did a complete change in everything in the franchise (tone, character personalities, etc.) because the first director left.

So unless Warner Bros intervened with anything in Nolan's plans and didn't let him do what he wanted to do (which we know didn't happen), then I doubt TDKR will suffer from the 3rd movie syndrome.

"The Dark Knight Rises" will be a sequel to a world we know. "The Avengers" will be a cinema first, combining movies that have been coming out yearly since 2008.

You can't say for sure that TDKR will perform better than TDK. This one doesn't have Ledger's death going for it, or Joker for that matter.

Originally posted by spidermanrocks
Isn't it interesting how Batman ALONE is able to keep up with the Avengers at the box office?While likely, that is not certain yet. Neither movie is out and therefore box office "Facts" are speculation at best. That is because almost all of Marvel's movies lately have
A) Been Good
And B) Sold well

DC's ONLY trick right now is Batman. That's it. Superman has been MIA, Green Lantern was a bomb both critically and financially...they don't have anything BUT Batman.

Actually, Spider-man's first 3 movies (Raimi films) made 2.5 Billion dollars. In 3 movies. Batman's entire FRANCHISE (6 films) has made 2.6 Billion. Double Spidey's numbers and you're at 5 Billion. That puts Spider-man above Batman bud. No, it speaks volumes of how epic Christopher Nolan is. Batman is awesome, don't get me wrong. But all the credit in the world for the new Bats' success goes to Nolan's amazing knack for making movie masterpieces.

They pushed back Man of Steel until 2013, but so far has a phenomenal cast of stars.

Originally posted by spidermanrocks
4) Batman Forever did a complete change in everything in the franchise (tone, character personalities, etc.) because the first director left.



I could say the same thing about Batman Returns, which is very different tonally from '89. Or TDK being said to be less theatrical and starker than Begins.

More than that Forever did not change anything in the franchise to a great degree. The tone did get lighter and more flamboyant but still had many moments when it was played serious and introspective; especially the Bruce/Dick/Alfred scenes and the various set-pieces throughout the movie. '89 and Returns both had silly and outrageous things in them and they don't garner as much criticism that Forever gets.

People say Nicholsons' Joker was reminiscent of Romero and that's okay; then Carrey does a Riddler reminiscent of Gorshin and that's not okay. De Vito does a horribly different Penguin and it's overlooked but Tommy Lee Jones is hated for doing a 'different' Two-Face (when much of the film he plays it straight and only descends into goofy mode in a few scenes).

Originally posted by Prep-Man
They pushed back Man of Steel until 2013, but so far has a phenomenal cast of stars. Phenomenal? Kevin Costner is beyond his prime. Henry Cavil is alright. And alot of his credibility is coming from a movie that's not even out yet (Immortals). Amy Adams is hot, but phenomenal? Really, it's a solid cast. But nothing more.

This feels like Superman Returns to me. Movie in development forever with a solid cast. We'll see if it can overcome the "Superman hasn't had a good movie since Superman 2" syndrome.

It has Nolan directing. You have to have faith in it for that, atleast, if nothing else.

Originally posted by Darth Martin
You can't say for sure that TDKR will perform better than TDK. This one doesn't have Ledger's death going for it, or Joker for that matter.

Ledger's death was only responsible for the opening weekend and the first week or two after that. That is it. From that point on, the movie's greatness was responsible for the rest. I don't remember anyone talking about how great the movie is because it was Ledger's last performance. Everyone just talked about how great the movie is. Period. I even know people that have seen The Dark Knight in theatres 2 or 3 times (some even more). People wouldn't watch the same movie in theatres more than once just because an actor died. They saw it many times in theatres because it was a phenomenal film. I rewatched the movie 2 months after it came out (in theatres). And the theatre was still packed with people (almost completely). And even I saw it for a second time, I STILL heard people that they wanted to see it (if they haven't seen it) or see it again (if they did). From the moment the first trailer (not teaser; trailer) came out, everyone knew that that was the movie to see. And it was so popular that it was actually re-released in theatres in January 2009 here in Ontario (I don't know about US or other states in Canada). And going back to Ledger as an actor, he wasn't that famous of an actor before TDK. I'm not saying that he was an unknown but at the same time, he wasn't a well-known actor capable of attracting a large audience either. He was a B-list actor.

I doubt Ledger's death was responsible for all of that. Was he ONE of the main reasons to why made all that money? Of course. But was his death THE reason to why the movie did well? No. That is complete bullcrap. TDK had a gross of a bit over a billion dollars. If Ledger wouldn't have died, it would have made about $100-250 million less than it actually did IMO. Not that big of a difference.


TDKR has The Dark Knight and Inception going for it, which will help the movie a lot. Both movies were ridiculously loved by the audience. People (both comic book fans and non-comic fans) know that TDKR will be by the same creators of TDK and Inception and will obviously walk in theatres next summer expecting the same level of quality to be presented again. In the worst case scenario, TDKR will make a bit less than TDK.

Stop your ranting. I myself am an avid fan of The Dark Knight. I saw it three times in the cinema.

I never said Ledger's death was the sole reason. I said it was a reason. A pretty big one too. Not the biggest, but a significant one.

The Dark Knight Rises will not have that going for it this time. Period.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
While likely, that is not certain yet. Neither movie is out and therefore box office "Facts" are speculation at best. That is because almost all of Marvel's movies lately have
A) Been Good
And B) Sold well

DC's ONLY trick right now is Batman. That's it. Superman has been MIA, Green Lantern was a bomb both critically and financially...they don't have anything BUT Batman.

Even if Avengers does beat TDKR, I doubt the difference will be much. It's not like Avengers will completely stomp TDKR at the box office and vice versa. I doubt that one of these movies will sell twice as much or more than the other one. And I said that it was likely that both have an equal chance of beating the other one. It's definitely not certain yet.

And Batman is enough. He's that awesome . LOL. But on a serious note, I would like to see other DC heroes get a good movie on the silver screen. I was very dissapointed with Green Lantern.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb Actually, Spider-man's first 3 movies (Raimi films) made 2.5 Billion dollars. In 3 movies. Batman's entire FRANCHISE (6 films) has made 2.6 Billion. Double Spidey's numbers and you're at 5 Billion. That puts Spider-man above Batman bud.

There are two reasons for that:
1) The live-action Batman movies before Begins all sucked monkey balls (although I haven't seen the 60s movie yet)
2) Ticket price inflation occured at the beginning of the new century. So it's not really fair to compare a movie before 2000 with a movie after 2000. If you check the list for the highest grossing selling films, over 80% of the movies on that list are movies that were released in 2000 or after. Is it because of an increase in movie popularity? Movies have been very popular since they were first created. And there isn't even a movie before 1977 on the list. Why? Due to the price of a ticket increasing.

Originally posted by Darth Martin
Stop your ranting. I myself am an avid fan of The Dark Knight. I saw it three times in the cinema.

I never said Ledger's death was the sole reason. I said it was a reason. A pretty big one too. Not the biggest, but a significant one.

The Dark Knight Rises will not have that going for it this time. Period.

I know you haven't said that but I know that there are MANY people on these forums and on the internet overall that do think that. My post was more addressed to all the people in general that think Ledger's death was the sole reason to the movie making all that money. Just in case they're stumbling by this thread and then they read my post. I even met someone once who said that TDK wouldn't have even made half the money it did make if it was for Ledger's death. THAT is what I completely disagree with (the ironic part is that the guy was a hardcore fan of The Crow. lol)

Well, you never know. This movie can sell itself on being made by the same creators of TDK and Inception. The general audience loved those movies to death. So I would say that TDKR does have a chance to beat TDK. I'm not saying it's certain. But you can't say it's impossible either. Toy Story 3, Pirates 2, and Alice In Wonderland already beat TDK at the box office. And Inception came close ($824 million compared to TDK's $1 billion) So it is a possibility.

Box office numbers don't matter. I'm more concerned about the quality of the film. TDK>>>>>Toy Story 3, Pirates, and Alice in Wonderland.

Originally posted by Darth Martin
Box office numbers don't matter. I'm more concerned about the quality of the film. TDK>>>>>Toy Story 3, Pirates, and Alice in Wonderland.

I know, right? There are message boards just for box office speculation. Do people really care about this stuff so much? Kinda sad, IMO, but to each his own.

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/rorschachsrants/news/?a=43176#comments

movie is gonna be bananas!!!

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb


DC's ONLY trick right now is Batman. That's it. Superman has been MIA, Green Lantern was a bomb both critically and financially...they don't have anything BUT Batman.

Superman Returns and Green Lantern just showed DC dnt have a clue what they're doing on the big screen as of late..

Superman should have been a guaranteed hit, just look at the success of Smallville, the Character is still damn popular. Singer just made more of a Rom Com than an action movie. He rightly got fired.

Im even a bit iffy about the remake.. They're using Zod? Really? Do they only get their ideas from Superman 1 and 2?? But im hoping it works. At least if they use Zod for the first, then there should be some decent action and story and for a sequel they would Have2 use a new villain.

Neway my point is look how much they spent on both GL and Supes Return? They're not budgeting right. Avengers is going have a smaller budget than either of those movies.

Plus they need to work on their story boarding and Direction if they want comic book heroes to come to life successfully on the big screen.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
Actually, Spider-man's first 3 movies (Raimi films) made 2.5 Billion dollars. In 3 movies. Batman's entire FRANCHISE (6 films) has made 2.6 Billion. Double Spidey's numbers and you're at 5 Billion. That puts Spider-man above Batman bud. No, it speaks volumes of how epic Christopher Nolan is. Batman is awesome, don't get me wrong. But all the credit in the world for the new Bats' success goes to Nolan's amazing knack for making movie masterpieces.

Thats because there was very little hype for Batman Begins. And yet still $350 million was a solid figure for the time. Probably at least $400 mill in today's terms.

But just think how much Batman Begins would have made if it had the kind of hype Spiderman 1 or TDK? The Quality of Batman Begins actually contributed a lot to the hype around TDK.

Actually, both movies have things working against them:

3rd movie blues for Batman

Avengers is trying to split time between RDJ, Sam Jackson, Chris Evans, Chris Hemsworth, AND Mark Ruffalo....let alone the villains...

I can see where it's going to be very difficult for both films to get good critical reviews.

I think TDKR will break DH2 weekend record.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
Lol, FOR SURE?

No, that is not certain. Unless you've seen both already and know the outcome. TDKR is going to have to work against the 3rd movie syndrome (Spidey 3, X-men 3, Superman 3, Batman Forever....need I go on?).

Whereas Avengers has been building up for years and people cannot wait to see how it's going to play out.

Marvel Studios really hasn't let me down so far, so to say that one will definitely be the better movie at this point is foolish.

Yeah, for sure. Both Thor and Captain America were sub-par lackluster movies. Considering that they are just comic book movies they're not bad but they certainly werent memorable. The only two good movies from marvel studios so far is the first Iron Man and the Incredible Hulk. This is what im basing my opinion off of, that and the incredible writing, acting, pacing and action of both, Begins and TDK. Those two movies were full packages that had very deep character development. Thor and Captain America had little to none. I agree with you though, the Hype around the Avengers will be bigger and will garner more sales.

I have no faith in any writer to properly write a well balanced story of the Avengers for a two, two and half hour movie. There is just to much involved.

Originally posted by jinXed by JaNx
Yeah, for sure.Again, you're speculating. While you may, and probably are right in thinking TDKR will be a better REVIEWED movie, you still don't know. Perhaps you should look up the meaning of "knowing" in the dictionary. You don't know, and frankly you sound foolish in thinking you do.This is by your standards. Opinion. Thor has been pretty highly praised for what it did, and Captain America is also gotten good reviews. Both scored considerably higher than Green Lantern, which wasn't horrible but wasn't very good.Again, this is your opinion. I'll always remember Thor for his fights against the Frost Giants and Anthony Hopkins' and Tom Hiddleston's amazing portrayals of Odin and Loki. And Cap dive bombing that plane after beating Red Skull to save America is also memorable. LOL! You say the Hulk was better than Thor and Cap? This should debunk any argument you have right there. That movie's audience rating isn't even as high as Thor or Cap's critical rating...Now there I'll agree with you. BB and TDK were 2 amazing films. And DC can thank their lucky stars that Chris Nolan decided to direct the Batman reboot. He's a master filmmaker, and quickly positioning himself to be the best. Very untrue. Captain America had a ton, you really felt for him at the end when he destroyed any chance of a relationship with Agent Carter. And Thor? Are you kidding?! The family drama between Loki, Thor and Odin was the best part of the movie. Very powerful stuff, with Hiddleston receiving high praise by critics and fans alike...so yah, totally disagree there. Not necessarily, both will rake in huge money no doubt, but I'm not sure that Avengers is going to win. Notice how I said "I'm not sure" (see first point)
It will be a challenge, that's for sure. In fact it is definitely the most daunting task of the two movies. It's even worse than the 3rd movie blues that Batman faces. So if Avengers IS the better movie, that's a huge accomplishment.

Poll I found on Boxoffice

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/forums/viewtopic.htm?t=91641&sid=d8c364ef9128d2f10ffafe4877a8c95c

I have NO doubt that TDKR is going to absolutely kill at the box office; and deservedly so. Christopher Nolan is one of the best directors in the business, and he has risen Batman from the movie grave. The success of TDK alone is going to propel it to huge numbers.

The only chance that The Avengers has is that
A) Each movie for the respective heroes was good to great.
B) What Marvel is doing with The Avengers is unprecedented. There will be alot of hype surrounding it and that might keep it close.

do u think it will break ho ow weekend?

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Poll I found on Boxoffice

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/forums/viewtopic.htm?t=91641&sid=d8c364ef9128d2f10ffafe4877a8c95c

That's crazy I'm a marvel fan of course but i do like Batman comics, cartoon. All the other polls i've seen shown Avengers being perdicted as leading compared to other flicks or closely tied with TDKR. But time will tell of course. Anyway new info on the bat.

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/debbiedowner/news/?a=43322

Originally posted by Scarlet315
That's crazy I'm a marvel fan of course but i do like Batman comics, cartoon. All the other polls i've seen shown Avengers being perdicted as leading compared to other flicks or closely tied with TDKR. But time will tell of course. Anyway new info on the bat.

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/debbiedowner/news/?a=43322

What other polls are you talking about?

Regardless, the guys on Box Office Mojo probably know what they are talking about more than others.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
do u think it will break ho ow weekend? Frankly, I don't believe that either film is going to set the record, at least not long term. Maybe TDKR can break an opening weekend record...Mabye even Avengers.. but that's doubtful. The Dark Knight came out before the economic crash, and that certainly helped it's sales. There has only been one comic film to break the 300 Million dollar mark (American box office) since TDK IIRC (Iron Man 2), and that's just a testament to the fact that people are VERY choosy with their money in regards to movies these days. If movies like Batman and Robin were still making 200 million+, it'd be different.

The only thing TDKR has against it, is 3-D ticket prices, but other than that, I can see it breaking the record.

Nolan would be smart to just skip 3-d all together honestly. It hasn't done anyone a lot of good lately. Hopefully Avengers won't be in 3-d, or if it is, it needs to be better than Cap's 3-d.

Originally posted by ares834
What other polls are you talking about?

Regardless, the guys on Box Office Mojo probably know what they are talking about more than others.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.303883-Poll-Dark-Knight-Rises-v-The-Avengers

http://www.hisstank.com/forum/movies-dvd-television/125957-dark-knight-rises-vs-avengers-who-will-win-2012-movie-fight.html

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/rorschachsrants/polls/?poll=1587&view=results

It's crazy but would you believe that these polls that i've been did in fact have the avengers leading in some but now has tdkr leading by a nose. Still despite Nolan's skills at producing great batman flicks, i still think the avengers will take it. For reasons that i stated before and while checking an interview done with whedon he seemed like a grown up geek that wanted this as much as most of us comicbook readers. I think he can deliver.

Two of those are asking which one will you prefer not which one will make more money. And these polls arn't testing your average citizen but comic fans. So ultimatley, not a very reliable source. And the one that did ask which will make more money had only 26 votes.

Edit: Not saying it can't win. But IMO it's facing a massive uphill battle.

I wasn't looking for polls specfic to which would make more money, but just polls comparing which flick people are most anticipating. Those polls so far could reflect a +/- possible attendance by people once those movies come out. But regardless of that and what the stats are with these current polls, i'm gravitating more toward avengers. An opinion of course and if tdkr does come out on top i wouldnt be surprised either.

Iv talked to different people about this and You'd be surprised how many regular movie goers do not even know there is a super hero team called "The Avengers"..

Of course with all us comic book fans here on these boards there will be much more anticipation for a project as ambitious as The Avengers, and when its being released there will be intrigue from a much wider audience about a movie starring the main characters from all these great Marvel films (2 of them huge box office smashes)..

But still overall the odds are with TDKR imo.. Of course when it comes to final box office performance, the results will largely be dependant on how entertaining both movies actually are.

I still think The Avengers is going to have the bigger draw.

I think people will be intrigued, plus you have all the characters from the different movies, and all the success from those movies.

TDKR has what Bane and Catwoman, and the success of the previous movie.

I could be wrong but I think Avengers is gonna look fresher and more appealing across the masses.

I dont know which movie will receive the bigger draw but im willing to bet that Batman will have the most anticipation. Batman seems to have a broader appeal than the avengers. Ive noticed that Batman appeals widely not only to comic fans but also non comic fans. The only people that will be anticipating Avengers will be comic fans.

Originally posted by Newjak

I think people will be intrigued, plus you have all the characters from the different movies, and all the success from those movies.


You have to remember the biggest success from those other movies was Iron Man 2 which made around 600 mill. And there will be a huge overlap in the audiences who watched IM, Thor e.t.c

Originally posted by jinXed by JaNx
I dont know which movie will receive the bigger draw but im willing to bet that Batman will have the most anticipation. Batman seems to have a broader appeal than the avengers. Ive noticed that Batman appeals widely not only to comic fans but also non comic fans. The only people that will be anticipating Avengers will be comic fans.

Exactly. Comic book fans like us will have more anticipation for The Avengers. But the wider audience will have more expectations from TDKR. But like I already said the final box office figures will also depend on how entertaining each movie actually is to the wider audience.

It's too close to call. Batman fans and movie fans have been anticipating where the series goes after the climatic ending of TDK; I still might give it the opening weekend edge.

oh yeah i dont doubt batman will take opening weekend...,as long as their marketing campaign is as cunning, broad and interesting as it was for TDK. The only thing that, IMO, will give avengers better numbers is children. If i were still a kid i would probablt want to see the avengers a lot more than batman but odds are...,the kids that drag their parents to see avengers will do the same for batman

Originally posted by jinXed by JaNx
oh yeah i dont doubt batman will take opening weekend...,as long as their marketing campaign is as cunning, broad and interesting as it was for TDK. The only thing that, IMO, will give avengers better numbers is children. If i were still a kid i would probablt want to see the avengers a lot more than batman but odds are...,the kids that drag their parents to see avengers will do the same for batman

Can kids watch Batman? Didn't TDK have an adult rating??

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Can kids watch Batman? Didn't TDK have an adult rating??


that doesn't matter... when i saw the dark knight kids as young as 8 were in the theater

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
that doesn't matter... when i saw the dark knight kids as young as 8 were in the theater

Ah rite.. Im In the UK. Kids could'nt watch it in theatres here.

I wanna go with the dark knight rises but it seems lately that the 3rd movie dont be as good as the 2nd so i'm going with avengers i mean the hype is way bigger imo plus like me theres a ton of people that has been waiting for the avengers movies for a long time avengers takes it i'm looking foward to the avengers more than tdkr but i'm going to see both of them anyway

Originally posted by Scarlet315
I just wanted to see what you guys think was going to have the biggest opening night, wknd, etc. On the one hand you have the avengers which will be the first movie, correct me if i'm wrong where they take characters from other movies and collaborate them in one. You then have the dark knight returns, which will be the last of the trilogy of chris nolan and seeing how according to viewers it got only better, the third should be even more.

I believe the Dark Knight Rises will trump the Avengers. Because it will be an overall better movie and won't have a cluster&*%$# of characters, I think word will spread about the Avengers flaws and the audience will dwindle as the weekend goes on.

I predict the Avengers will have box office numbers around the amount IronMan, Thor, and Captain America took in...

Originally posted by Jack Angel
I wanna go with the dark knight rises but it seems lately that the 3rd movie dont be as good as the 2nd so i'm going with avengers i mean the hype is way bigger imo plus like me theres a ton of people that has been waiting for the avengers movies for a long time avengers takes it i'm looking foward to the avengers more than tdkr but i'm going to see both of them anyway

Very true in most cases, but they said the same thing about TDK, citing sequels that didn't perform as well as the first (obviously those critics were proven wrong).

Plus, it's Christopher Nolan we're talking about. He's said to have put a lot of thought into the final installment, and I have a feeling he'll exceed expectations...

Dark Knight Rises is going to murder the Avengers. Marvel is even releasing the film earlier because they're scared of DRK.

Or they could just be trying to hit the first blockbuster spot of the summer

dkr will be better and gross more

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
You have to remember the biggest success from those other movies was Iron Man 2 which made around 600 mill. And there will be a huge overlap in the audiences who watched IM, Thor e.t.c



Granted, but the first Iron Man was a hit, even if the 2nd was a bit disappointing (at least for me), the Hulk knowledge of a potential audience can take into account 2 films, however fractured and disparate they were - also the television series which was immensely popular with almost anyone having seen it. Cap and Thor are quite similiar in terms of exposure on film at least, with Cap probably edging it because his appeal and the confusion between Marvel's Thor and the Norse myth is still an issue.

But even so that lack of Cap and Thor will only inflame the fans who want to see more of them so you could see it that way. Plus, in the future things could change with regards to the line-up of the Avengers if they get certain characters back they could just change the line-up now and again, giving some other characters a shot.

Batman is popular right now but knowing this is the last (and with the 8-year jump within TDK to TDKR), the fans may just be a bit fed up with the fast-forward then adrupt halt to the story.

Avengers will make more money.

Loki: I have any army

Stark: We have a hulk

And thats why Avengers wins

Does anyone think Spiderman might beat Avengers or TDKR??

It does have a good history at the box office, is more famous than any of the Avengers, and the Trailer looks pretty exciting imo.

Dark knight rises will blow them all out of the water.

More excited for the Avengers and ASM than TDKR. I have no doubt TDKR will be a good movie, but I'm not psyched for it.

Originally posted by darthmaul1
Dark knight rises will blow them all out of the water.

Most probably. But you can never know for sure with these things.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
More excited for the Avengers and ASM than TDKR. I have no doubt TDKR will be a good movie, but I'm not psyched for it.

Most of us comic book fanboys are more psyched for The Avengers. But your general movie fan is more looking forward to TDKR.

Originally posted by darthmaul1
Dark knight rises will blow them all out of the water.


agreed, i do think the avengers will do very very well, but the amazing spiderman i think will do well but not that well

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
agreed, i do think the avengers will do very very well, but the amazing spiderman i think will do well but not that well

Same here, don't get me wrong i'm looking forward to the avengers and maybe spiderman, but i thinkg the dark knight just appeals to more people and non comic book fans cause it's more grounded in reality.
Let's face it with enough money and the proper connections anyone can become batman.

I have a feeling I will have the opposite reaction from the TDKR than most people. I thought the Dark Knight was a massive let down and nothing I've seen so far from TDKR has even slightly impressed me (that trailer was awful and the football scene was some grade A Stephen Sommers crap out of GI Joe or something). My expectations couldn't be lower for the movie, I wouldn't be shocked if I am pleasantly surprised by the final product. I suspect people who thought that The Dark Knight was the second coming of Christ, and are going into this movie with huge expectations will be disappointed though. Batman should still easily take the top spot for genre films this summer, unless Avengers blows up.

Right now I'm most excited for ASM. It had the best trailer so far. I'm thinking Spider-man will pull a X-Men First Class and be the best superhero movie of the summer despite low original expectations and a terrible first trailer.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I suspect people who thought that The Dark Knight was the second coming of Christ

No lie, I lol'd.

You've obviously met some of the people I'm talking about. They are the worst. Most of them aren't even comic book fans. Whenever someone finds out I like comics they always want to talk about how great The Dark Knight is and how awesome Heath Ledger was as the Joker... and then I have tell them that they are wrong and break their little hearts.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
You've obviously met some of the people I'm talking about. They are the worst. Most of them aren't even comic book fans. Whenever someone finds out I like comics they always want to talk about how great The Dark Knight is and how awesome Heath Ledger was as the Joker... and then I have tell them that they are wrong and break their little hearts.

I have, yeah, lol.

Like when TDK first came out, I really did enjoy it for what it was worth. In hindsight, after the Ledger praise (which he does deserve due to his acting), and the "hype" died down, I do think Batman Begins was the better film. TDK had some plot holes that I normally would have called out, but the whole Ledger thing and the fact that we were getting Joker and Two-Face, arguably two of his most popular rogues are more recognizable than Ra's al Ghul, helped to put those out of my mind for a time.

I think it was a good movie and it certainly made Hollywood take pause when it came to superhero movies, but it wasn't perfect. It doesn't help that some people who don't follow comics regularly watch the film and then try to lecture people who do their shit on who Batman is as a character. And of course, you have people who just hate on it for the sake of hating. I find myself a fan of the series and of the movie in question, but I don't see them in Bat shaped lens, either.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I have, yeah, lol.

Like when TDK first came out, I really did enjoy it for what it was worth. In hindsight, after the Ledger praise (which he does deserve due to his acting), and the "hype" died down, I do think Batman Begins was the better film. TDK had some plot holes that I normally would have called out, but the whole Ledger thing and the fact that we were getting Joker and Two-Face, arguably two of his most popular rogues are more recognizable than Ra's al Ghul, helped to put those out of my mind for a time.

I think it was a good movie and it certainly made Hollywood take pause when it came to superhero movies, but it wasn't perfect. It doesn't help that some people who don't follow comics regularly watch the film and then try to lecture people who do their shit on who Batman is as a character. And of course, you have people who just hate on it for the sake of hating. I find myself a fan of the series and of the movie in question, but I don't see them in Bat shaped lens, either.

My general rule of thumb is that any movie with Eric Roberts in it is bad. Sorry Dark Knight.

Seriously though, Dark Knight is a fine movie. That is to be expected because outside of maybe Momento, Nolan hasn't made a bad film. But I loved Batman Begins. Loved it. It was so pumped for The Dark Knight that it was inevitable that I was going to be let down... and I was. Which is what I feel is going to happen for a lot of people with TDKR. Lower your expectations people.

Ledger did a great job and whoever he was playing was a terrific villain... but he wasn't the Joker.

Momento was Nolan's best movie...

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
My general rule of thumb is that any movie with Eric Roberts in it is bad. Sorry Dark Knight.

WHAT!!!! how can you say that?? he was in Sharktopus!!


Originally posted by srankmissingnin

Seriously though, Dark Knight is a fine movie. That is to be expected because outside of maybe Momento, Nolan hasn't made a bad film. But I loved Batman Begins. Loved it. It was so pumped for The Dark Knight that it was inevitable that I was going to be let down... and I was. Which is what I feel is going to happen for a lot of people with TDKR. Lower your expectations people.

Ledger did a great job and whoever he was playing was a terrific villain... but he wasn't the Joker.

Different strokes for different folks. i feel these movies are made for and have to appeal to a broader audience, not just the comic book fans.
I had a couple of batman comics as a kid so i don't know all the ins and outs of the characters, so my experince come from the campy tv show and cartoons. i liked the first 2 batman movies but like Nolans better just because it seems to be more serious.
Maybe IF they reboot the franchise again to start up a justice league batman they can make it more comic book like? I don't know.
I like the joker on the batman arkham games. For you Ledger may not of been the joker from the comics or where ever but i think every outlet has a different version wich give the watcher or reader a different experince each time. which is good.

Someone mentioned about the plot holes in TDK please let me know what u feel they were. i can't remember anything unlike the disappearing batmobile in BB (more of a technical error) where he shuts the lights off and the cops loose him for a bit.

Originally posted by darthmaul1
Let's face it with enough money and the proper connections anyone can become batman.

Not to change the topic of this thread but I would like to address this since I've heard this before many times. Despite Batman having no superpowers like us, no one can really become Batman either.

Batman isn't just James Bond in a bat suit, as some people would like to think. He is literally the perfect human. He has trained his body and his mind to the maximum human capacity. Basically, a swimmer (for example) spends his whole life training to have the perfect body for swimming. A runner trains to achieve the peak level in running, endurance, stamina, etc. Batman can do everything. If the Batman of the comics existed in our world, he would be the best swimmer in the world, the best gymnast in the world, the best rope-climber in the world, the best martial artist in the world, and he would pretty much be the best at every physical activity there is. No human can train themselves to be the best at every physical aspect. A human may be able to train themselves to be the best in the world in one particular field (example: being the best swimmer in the world) but no one can really be the best at everything.

On top of the physical stuff, Batman is also at the maximum mental level. On top of being the world's greatest detective, he is also one of the best scientists in the world, one of the best geologists in the world (example: he can pick up some soil and say "This soil comes from this part of the world" by just examining it), and the list goes on and on. It would take years to become the world's greatest detective, let alone become one of the best scientists in the world, etc.

In conclusion, no one can really become Batman in real life due to there being too many requirements. And even IF someone somehow became Batman in real life, their body would shut down after a couple of weeks of crime-fighting if they do what Batman in the comics does night after night.

what are everyone's feelings toward a 3 hour Avengers movie and a 4 hour Batman movie???


http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/nailbiter111/news/?a=56703


obviously a few things will get cut, however Nolan doesn't cut too much from his films if anything at all?

4 hours is way to long for the theatre. It better get cut to under 3 hours IMO.

I'll take a 3 hours Avengers movie.

Considering TDK dragged I won't sit through 4 hrs of DKR without an intermission.

3hrs Avengers.

Don't get too excited for Avengers being three hours long... Whedon cut it down to 2 hours and 15 minutes.

Originally posted by ares834
Don't get too excited for Avengers being three hours long... Whedon cut it down to 2 hours and 15 minutes.

Still, not too bad.

Originally posted by ares834
Don't get too excited for Avengers being three hours long... Whedon cut it down to 2 hours and 15 minutes.

Should be a sweet Director's Cut.

My friends n I are already planning to go to midnight 3D IMAX Avengers premier. Atleast 3 of us are taking off work early to go. Possibly 5. Still dunno how many others are coming we don't work with.

I can see why Avengers would need to be long. They have to get all the characters together first, build a team dynamic and that's before the main plot starts.

The Avengers movie will do better imo and honestly I think it deserves to do better. DC needs to get on the ball with making good movies. They missed a HUGE opportunity with Green Lantern. While GL was a decent movie, it's rewatch value is simply the scenes on OA.

This is going to be the first time we've seen anything like the Avengers and I'm way more psyched to see it than TDKR. I believe TDKR will be a decent movie, and I'll give it a chance because I do trust Nolan, but refusing to put the Joker back in, and Bane's voice, Catwoman's costume, etc. are gigantic turnoffs for me.

And anyone who says that Heath's death didn't help the movie generate money and interest are in denial. Guess what happened after Michael Jackson's death?? People went out and bought his music. So to say that Heath's death didn't make the movie all the more inticing is just ridiculous.

Originally posted by Odekahn

And anyone who says that Heath's death didn't help the movie generate money and interest are in denial. Guess what happened after Michael Jackson's death?? People went out and bought his music. So to say that Heath's death didn't make the movie all the more inticing is just ridiculous.

I don't think anyone ever stated that, rather they claimed that his death wasn't the only reason it became huge. Just look at Inception, the movie became huge despite the fact that no one died and that it isn't based on some highly popular book. Nolan's hot right now and TDKR will likely draw in a huge amount of money, unless it sucks.

Avengers will no doubt make an assload of money and be a great film, but it's going to be an uphill battle against TDKR.

Originally posted by ares834
I don't think anyone ever stated that, rather they claimed that his death wasn't the only reason it became huge. Just look at Inception, the movie became huge despite the fact that no one died and that it isn't based on some highly popular book. Nolan's hot right now and TDKR will likely draw in a huge amount of money, unless it sucks.

Avengers will no doubt make an assload of money and be a great film, but it's going to be an uphill battle against TDKR.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER

Like I said his ACTING helped make the movie so damn huge. That added to word of mouth about how great the first movie was. Not Heath's death. A comic book movie doesn't make a Billion dollars because someone died LOL

And btw Crow was a damn good movie. Not good enough to be one of the greatest of all time... But Dark Knight was, Thats why it made money.

Oh and Brandon Lee dying on set was big news. Especially considering the way his dad died.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
I doubt it. Brandon Lee died during The Crow but its not like that made it one of the biggest movies of all time.

The movie sold itself. Heath certainly helped a lot in that his acting was was fantastic.

Also the quality of Batman Begins helped sell The Dark Knight.

It sure seems like Heath's death is being minimized here. It helped TDK greatly. And of course that's not the only reason the movie was huge. It was a great film, but Heath's death was a pretty big factor for it doing as well as it did imo.

Originally posted by Odekahn
It sure seems like Heath's death is being minimized here. It helped TDK greatly. And of course that's not the only reason the movie was huge. It was a great film, but Heath's death was a pretty big factor for it doing as well as it did imo.

I never said it didn't effect sales AT ALL. But I do think your exaggerating how much Heath's death affected box office receipts.

Have you not talked to general movie fans? (not comic book nerds like us).. People really loved that movie. And everyone really admired Heath's acting in it.

Incidentally I just saw a movie review program on tv a few hours ago. All the movie experts are saying TDKR is THE Movie to watch out for this year. Of course so much anticipation for a movie can also lead to disappointment (The Phantom Menace comes to mind).

On another note scenes like Hulk catching Iron Man makes me think Avengers is going to appeal more to superhero fans and kids. Whilst TDKR audiences are going to be all adult movie fans.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
I never said it didn't effect sales AT ALL. But I do think your exaggerating how much Heath's death affected box office receipts.

Have you not talked to general movie fans? (not comic book nerds like us).. People really loved that movie. And everyone really admired Heath's acting in it.

Incidentally I just saw a movie review program on tv a few hours ago. All the movie experts are saying TDKR is THE Movie to watch out for this year. Of course so much anticipation for a movie can also lead to disappointment (The Phantom Menace comes to mind).

On another note scenes like Hulk catching Iron Man makes me think Avengers is going to appeal more to superhero fans and kids. Whilst TDKR audiences are going to be all adult movie fans.

Again, how many people loved Michael Jackson's music? A lot of people, and the sales of his albums after his death skyrocketed. TDK got an insane amount of plublicity from Heath's death, and I'm not knocking the movie at all. It's actually my favorite movie (not just comic book movie), but the death did have a large impact. It got people talking, it got people interested... hell, my gf never even saw Begins, but went to see TDK because of everything that was going on.

Just like if Hulk Hogan were to die tomorrow, his name would skyrocket to the top of Twitter and Google search. His matches would be on the front page of youtube because people would want to see them and they would flock to the wrestling business. If a famous author... oh let's say George R. R. Martin died just after completing his final book that hadn't been released yet, do you not think that it would have a dramatic increase on the sales of his book once released? What about if the writer of Harry Potter died? And we're talking about Heath Ledger... an actor whose face people know and whose movies people loved.

Yes, TDK was an amazing movie, but TDKR isn't going to have the turnout that TDK had. It will still be a blockbuster, but it will fall way short of what TDK made. And when it does... will that be proof enough for you that Heath's death was a major factor?

The Dark Knight Rises is almost certainly going to surpass The Dark Knight. I dunno if it will be as good, I have a lot of faith in Nolan but, it just going to be so tough to top TKD n Bane isn't really the greatest villain choice. But as I said I have a lot of faith in Nolan n Hardy is one of the best actors of his generation imo. Regardless its almost certainly surpassing TKD if just on hype n legacy alone.

Still I feel very confident Avengers will beat it n all this summer. There's just so many contributing factors. This will combine fans of action movies n superpowers n of Thor Ironman Hulk Cap as well as comics in general plus this has never been done before n Whedon is writing n bringing all that cred n Disney has the resources to nearly out market anything. It also has so many possibilities for sequels n spin offs. Avengers has the potential to be just the tip of a very large ice burg. Where as TDKR is the ending of the ONLY thing DC's got going for them in that genre.

Regardless of how good they actually are make no mistake atleast opening weekend they're both gonna do incredible. N believe me I'm convinced they'll both be good movies at the least but likely incredible both. Avengers just has far more factors helping to boast sales imo

I don't think Avengers or TDKR will beat TDK in overall box office, but it could be close.