Spiderman (no webbing) vs. Logan (no claws)

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Gadabout
Spiderman w/o his webbing vs. Wolverine w/o his claws
Fight takes place in Central Park
Speed and power vs. blunt force and regeneration-who wins

Harbinger
No webbing even to swing onto different edifices in the park?

Logan. He's taken harder hits than Parker's and kept going, and even if he can't drop Spidey with one blow, he can win a battle of attrition. He's skilled enough to tag Spidey (especially with no SS), and he'll do damage when he does.

cdtm
Parkers no slouch in durability, he's taken hits from Hulk. The lack of claws really hurt Wolverines damage output here.

Even if Logan can take more, a LOT more, Spidey has a pretty significant agility edge over him.

Enough to go against entire teams and do well, like the Fantastic Four and the Xmen (And a lot of what he did in those encounters could be done without his webbing, if not all of it, like webbing up Sue Richards)

Harbinger
True, but Spidey still can't really do anything to drop Logan here. With no webbing, he can't even take wins via incapicitation.

Claws lower Wolverine's damage output insofar as he can't one-shot Parker with one well placed blow. Adamantium-weighted blows are still going to take their toll on Spidey, and with no precog, chances are that he'll be feeling a lot of them.

Spidey's got the speed/mobility edge, but at some point, he's going to have to take the battle to Logan to land some blows. This battle doesn't favor him because he'd have to essentially wail on Logan for an extended period to drop him.

cdtm
Originally posted by Harbinger
True, but Spidey still can't really do anything to drop Logan here. With no webbing, he can't even take wins via incapicitation.

Claws lower Wolverine's damage output insofar as he can't one-shot Parker with one well placed blow. Adamantium-weighted blows are still going to take their toll on Spidey, and with no precog, chances are that he'll be feeling a lot of them.

Spidey's got the speed/mobility edge, but at some point, he's going to have to take the battle to Logan to land some blows. This battle doesn't favor him because he'd have to essentially wail on Logan for an extended period to drop him.

True, although Spidey's done ok against comparably reinforced characters.

But, any chance Spidey can take a few just flat out overpowering him? Wrestle him to the ground and wail on him or something?

Is it something he'd do in a comic for even 1 or 2 wins? (I remember him using a strangle hold on Fisk. That might not go well for Logan, unless he doesn't need to breath.)

Sr J-Bieb
True but I just read the "True but" parts of everyone's post and I agree that Spider-Man wins.

Harbinger
Originally posted by cdtm
True, although Spidey's done ok against comparably reinforced characters.

But, any chance Spidey can take a few just flat out overpowering him? Wrestle him to the ground and wail on him or something?

Is it something he'd do in a comic for even 1 or 2 wins? (I remember him using a strangle hold on Fisk. That might not go well for Logan, unless he doesn't need to breath.) IMO, Peter would have to cut loose to take some wins given the stips here. Then, he could potentially bull rush Logan and start wailing on him. But hell, even then it might not work given the skeleton. Wolvie's routinely taken blows from guys well above his weight class and not been KOed, so Spidey's nothing he hasn't dealt with before. Given that, I don't see Spidey being able to "overpower" Logan.

Mindset
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
True but I just read the "True but" parts of everyone's post and I agree that Spider-Man wins. lol

carver9
An angry Spiderman has already wailed on Wolverine with no effect.

Tha C-Master
He's also wailed on him with effect and tossed him out of a window.

Starscream M
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
tossed him out of a window. not relevant here

cdtm
Originally posted by carver9
An angry Spiderman has already wailed on Wolverine with no effect.

He had an effect.

"He's starting to get the message and stay down. But I can't wipe that smirk off his face.", is the jist of it.

Harbinger
Wasn't Peter beating Logan's head into a headstone at the time?

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by carver9
An angry Spiderman has already wailed on Wolverine with no effect.

could someone post a scan?

carver9
Originally posted by cdtm
He had an effect.

"He's starting to get the message and stay down. But I can't wipe that smirk off his face.", is the jist of it.

I'm referring to marvel knights #13.

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by carver9
I'm referring to marvel knights #13.

The one where spidy gets mad about wolverine "hitting on" mary jane?

i remember that fight wolverine won via claws.

Sr J-Bieb
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
The one where spidy gets mad about wolverine "hitting on" mary jane?

i remember that fight wolverine won via claws. I just noticed your gamertag.

If someone sends you tasteful pictures of their anus and balls then just let it happen. It's just nature

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
I just noticed your gamertag.

If someone sends you tasteful pictures of their anus and balls then just let it happen. It's just nature

haha! well they say you can't fight nature.....

Uriel005
Btw does anyone have scans of people hurting themselves punching logan. I mean come on throwing a couple of shots to Logan's skull by a 10 tonner with an average durability lower than his output (which btw is hitting with much more force than 10 tons as it isn't a press lift) should break spidey's hand. The small Canadian takes it unless Spidey wants this to turn into a stalemate where he drops from exhaustion.

Kid Kurdy
Spider-Man can strangle him. Logan is nowhere strong enough to free himself.

He can also throw Logan a few times against a wall. That will slow him down, and he can strangle him afterwards.

Or he places a bulldozer on him.

Lots of options actuall.

Really, Logan without his claws is nothing special, but Spider-Man without his web is still more dangerous.

namorsubby
People should really be more more worried about how logan is gonna deal pete sufficient damage with his fists, not vice versa.

Spiderman ftw.

JakeTheBank
Spider-Man

Tha C-Master
Originally posted by Starscream M
not relevant here Sure it is, it means he can hurt him and use the environment to his advantage. It also means he's fast enough to do so.

Juk3n
Originally posted by carver9
An angry Spiderman has already wailed on Wolverine with no effect.

Spider-man wasn't going all out, the damn headstone didnt even shatter under those "angry" blows, spidey was holding back else he would have smashed wolverine into a crater in the floor or something - at least shatter the blocks he was up against.

wildernesss
logan's superior h2h fighting skills & spider-man's lack of spider-sense give logan a slight advantage here.

6/10 for logan

SamZED
Originally posted by Juk3n
Spider-man wasn't going all out, the damn headstone didnt even shatter under those "angry" blows, spidey was holding back else he would have smashed wolverine into a crater in the floor or something - at least shatter the blocks he was up against. He's talking about MK 13 where Spider-man attacks Logan on a training session. But he wasnt trying to KO Logan there, only hurt him. He was hitting him in the shoulders and back mostly. One doesnt get koed from that.

Scoobless
Originally posted by Harbinger
IMO, Peter would have to cut loose to take some wins given the stips here. Then, he could potentially bull rush Logan and start wailing on him. But hell, even then it might not work given the skeleton. Wolvie's routinely taken blows from guys well above his weight class and not been KOed, so Spidey's nothing he hasn't dealt with before. Given that, I don't see Spidey being able to "overpower" Logan.

No claws = Spidey winning via choke-out.

inimalist
without claws, spidey takes it

Parmaniac

BlackZero30x
....can anyone post scans of the "headstone" incident.

marmilado
Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
Spider-Man can strangle him. Logan is nowhere strong enough to free himself.

He can also throw Logan a few times against a wall. That will slow him down, and he can strangle him afterwards.

Or he places a bulldozer on him.

Lots of options actuall.

Really, Logan without his claws is nothing special, but Spider-Man without his web is still more dangerous.

sorry but your post is very dumb, logan is a very skilled martial artist and will free himself without any trouble at all from spider mans grip, hell a good old kick to the balls would do the trick he already took spider-man that way

Kid Kurdy
Originally posted by marmilado
sorry but your post is very dumb, logan is a very skilled martial artist and will free himself without any trouble at all from spider mans grip, hell a good old kick to the balls would do the trick he already took spider-man that way
Logan fighting (or wrestling) Spider-Man is like a toddler fighting a gorilla.

And are you forgetting that Wolverine also has nuts to kick ? Spider-Man kicks a lot harder than Wolverine on his best day.

Black bolt z
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
The one where spidy gets mad about wolverine "hitting on" mary jane?

i remember that fight wolverine won via claws. How many fights does wolverine not have claws in? You'd just have to use your imagination.

marmilado
Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
Logan fighting (or wrestling) Spider-Man is like a toddler fighting a gorilla.

And are you forgetting that Wolverine also has nuts to kick ? Spider-Man kicks a lot harder than Wolverine on his best day.

spider-man doesnt fight like that you point out him doing things he doesnt do its like giving him skills he doesnt have, anyway wolverine is overall the better fighter and who said they are going to wrestle adamantium fist to spider-mans head will do a lot of damage seriously spider-man never had a good durability he always got broken arms ribs and such his durability sucks and wolverine took out with punches beings like wendigo and rougehouse

Starscream M
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Sure it is, it means he can hurt him and use the environment to his advantage. It also means he's fast enough to do so. he doesn't have that environment here...ie high building

also, not sure it was an indication of reflexes...wasn't logan taken by surprise?

Starscream M
Originally posted by Kid Kurdy


And are you forgetting that Wolverine also has nuts to kick ? Spider-Man kicks a lot harder than Wolverine on his best day. logan doesn't have balls

Kid Kurdy
Originally posted by Starscream M
logan doesn't have balls
That explains a lot.

Kid Kurdy
Originally posted by marmilado
spider-man doesnt fight like that you point out him doing things he doesnt do its like giving him skills he doesnt have, anyway wolverine is overall the better fighter and who said they are going to wrestle adamantium fist to spider-mans head will do a lot of damage seriously spider-man never had a good durability he always got broken arms ribs and such his durability sucks and wolverine took out with punches beings like wendigo and rougehouse
So many errors, so little time...

Let's just say you underestimate Spider-Mans durability and you overestimate Logans strength.

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Black bolt z
How many fights does wolverine not have claws in? You'd just have to use your imagination.

well i was just saying that in this particular situation that incident isn't reliable because no claws allowed in this fight. In that fight spider-man wasn't beastly but was holding the edge until he got stabbed. like stated above he used his elbow and the like.

SamZED
Originally posted by marmilado
spider-man doesnt fight like that you point out him doing things he doesnt do its like giving him skills he doesnt have, anyway wolverine is overall the better fighter and who said they are going to wrestle adamantium fist to spider-mans head will do a lot of damage seriously spider-man never had a good durability he always got broken arms ribs and such his durability sucks and wolverine took out with punches beings like wendigo and rougehouse Sorry but I disagree. You use high showings of Wolverine's durability but low of Spider-man's. One could say that Logan's been put down by a hit from a gorilla and Spider-man hits harder than a gorilla. But that is also a low showing.

Spider-man has withstood punches from the likes of Namor, Hulk, classic Juggernaut. Then there's Morlun who not only a class 100 (arguably) but also drains ones lifeforce with a punch. Spider-man's been trading blows with him for a long amount of time.

marmilado
Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
So many errors, so little time...

Let's just say you underestimate Spider-Mans durability and you overestimate Logans strength.

spider-man got his arm broken by freakin jigsaw nuff said, wolverine on the other hand knocked out rougehouse and wendigo with his fists alone , spider-man got bruised by thugs hitting him with metal pipes... spider-mans durability always sucked, even in his mainstream series he got hospitalized by rhino and by morlon he is always bleeding and hurt because his durability sucks

SamZED
Originally posted by marmilado
spider-man got his arm broken by freakin jigsaw nuff said, wolverine on the other hand knocked out rougehouse and wendigo with his fists alone , spider-man got bruised by thugs hitting him with metal pipes... spider-mans durability always sucked, even in his mainstream series he got hospitalized by rhino and by morlon he is always bleeding and hurt because his durability sucks Originally posted by SamZED
Sorry but I disagree. You use high showings of Wolverine's durability but low of Spider-man's. One could say that Logan's been put down by a hit from a gorilla and Spider-man hits harder than a gorilla. But that is also a low showing.

Spider-man has withstood punches from the likes of Namor, Hulk, classic Juggernaut. Then there's Morlun who not only a class 100 (arguably) but also drains ones lifeforce with a punch. Spider-man's been trading blows with him for a long amount of time.
Also Jigsaw was artist's mistake. Spider-man oneshotted him several issues later. And his arms a strong enough to support a freaking tank, you're gonna tell me a human's gonna snap it?

marmilado
Originally posted by SamZED
Also Jigsaw was artist's mistake. Spider-man oneshotted him several issues later. And his arms a strong enough to support a freaking tank, you're gonna tell me a human's gonna snap it?

pressure and blunt force are different things, spider-man broke his arm twice by falling off a building, got his arm broken by jigsaw who is at best at the very besttt a peak human for some reason and one shotting him doesnt change the fact he broke spider-mans arm , thats not low showings for spider-man thats how he always been, thugs with metal pipes always hurt him , gargan scorpion broke his ribs with his tail, lizard once broke his arm , he got his ribs broken by a car hit, seriously man spider-mans durability isnt that good at all i would say his durability is like captain americas and we all saw what wolverine can do to him so case closed

Aakla
Wasn't there a comic where Spiderman and Wolverine where fighting and Spiderman grabbed Wolverine's head and bent it back, and Wolverine said that if spiderman used all his strength he could snap his neck. But wolverine doubted that Spiderman was a killer. or something like that?

Spiderman is pretty strong also, can't he lift like 10 tons or something along those lines? add his speed and spidey sense to that and there isn't much wolverine could do Spiderman really.

IMO the only thing that is stopping Spiderman from mauling Wolverine inside of 2 panels is, 1 Spiderman is a good guy and 2 Wolverine is one of Marvel's top characters and people would lose their mind.

A real fight between Spiderman and Wolverine would go pretty much how it did when they fought during the secret wars. Before that issue I always thought of Spiderman as a Saturday cartoon hero, and pretty much a joke. When he took out the X-men in like 1 page, he went from a joke to a badass.

SamZED
Originally posted by marmilado
pressure and blunt force are different things, spider-man broke his arm twice by falling off a building, got his arm broken by jigsaw who is at best at the very besttt a peak human for some reason and one shotting him doesnt change the fact he broke spider-mans arm , thats not low showings for spider-man thats how he always been, thugs with metal pipes always hurt him , gargan scorpion broke his ribs with his tail, lizard once broke his arm , he got his ribs broken by a car hit, seriously man spider-mans durability isnt that good at all i would say his durability is like captain americas and we all saw what wolverine can do to him so case closed Once again, it wasnt Jigsaw, the writer confirmed it. Pressure and blunt force are different things? Spider-man has COUGHT a falling helicopter, a thrown truck, he's been hit by Juggernaut like 10 times, supported buildings, been hit with tons of rocks and didnt have a single broken bone. But Jigsaw is gonna snap his hand? One has to be high to not see that its a low showing. Both Scoprion and Lizard are class 10+ characters. Fine, you wanna use that kind of logic. In Wolverine Origins Logan was beating up an ordinary human for several minutes and confirmed on panel that he's not holding back. Several minutes of beating and that ordinary middleage guy wasnt dead, so how's he supposed to hurt Spider-man? See how lowballing works both ways?

Also

Originally posted by marmilado
sorry but your post is very dumb, logan is a very skilled martial artist and will free himself without any trouble at all from spider mans grip

http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/5576/spidermanwolverine04003.th.jpg

SamZED
Originally posted by Aakla
Characters tend to do better against teams than when they're fighting 1 on 1. The graveyard fight imo portrayed their abilities pretty accurately. Especially Logan's durability and Parker's speed.

Kid Kurdy
Originally posted by marmilado
spider-man got his arm broken by freakin jigsaw nuff said, wolverine on the other hand knocked out rougehouse and wendigo with his fists alone , spider-man got bruised by thugs hitting him with metal pipes... spider-mans durability always sucked, even in his mainstream series he got hospitalized by rhino and by morlon he is always bleeding and hurt because his durability sucks
What are you talking about ? Spider-Man has totally owned Rhino with only his fists at least 2 or 3 times.

And hey, if you want low showings, Wolverine has been humiliated by a deer.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by SamZED
Also Jigsaw was artist's mistake. Spider-man oneshotted him several issues later. And his arms a strong enough to support a freaking tank, you're gonna tell me a human's gonna snap it?

A mini tank uhuh

I'll reply to the rest of your posts later, right now I'm too exhausted from last 10+ hours studying for stupid misdemeanour law and other shit.

Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
What are you talking about ? Spider-Man has totally owned Rhino with only his fists at least 2 or 3 times.

And hey, if you want low showings, Wolverine has been humiliated by a deer.

Not really, he wanted to get hit and played the possum. Nice fail though. Keep it up, Kurdy.

SamZED
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
A mini tank uhuh
Which was size of a normal tank and which he yanked with a webline making it even more impressive. uhuh

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW

I'll reply to the rest of your posts later, right now I'm too exhausted from last 10+ hours studying for stupid misdemeanour law and other shit.

I do not even know that word but it sounds like me not knowing this is for the best.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by SamZED
Which was size of a normal tank and which he yanked with a webline making it even more impressive. uhuh


I do not even know that word but it sounds like me not knowing this is for the best.

Yeah, they even said what model that was and it's not exactly light...

It's a lesser criminal act. You know, like drinking in the public or driving too fast.

SamZED
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yeah, they even said what model that was and it's not exactly light...
This is a mini-tank.
http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/7890/8mcawcdtbcca42t0jmca7mh.th.jpg

Spider-man lifted Metal Gear Rex.cool

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW

It's a lesser criminal act. You know, like drinking in the public or driving too fast. Ah I see. 10 frikin hours of that?

Kid Kurdy
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Not really, he wanted to get hit and played the possum. Nice fail though. Keep it up, Kurdy.
laughing laughing laughing

Yeah right.

He "wanted to get hit". I have to remember that one.

Kid Kurdy
Look at him fly. All part of the plan of course.

Kill Rudolph kill !!

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by SamZED
This is a mini-tank.
http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/7890/8mcawcdtbcca42t0jmca7mh.th.jpg

Spider-man lifted Metal Gear Rex.cool

Ah I see. 10 frikin hours of that?

laughing out loud

Of that and international human rights law. Trust me, it sucks... but that's what you get when you do stuff like that on the last minute...

Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
laughing laughing laughing

Yeah right.

He "wanted to get hit". I have to remember that one.

You read the story? No? I see, Turdy.

marmilado
spider-man supporting tanks and shit like that was long time ago in the 70s 80s eras you know the same old era when the thor fanboys show all kind of powers thor never used again smile , during that era writers didnt established the characters as they are and sometimes you saw shit like that, but ever since spider-man was portrayed solidly and by solidly i mean bleeding, broken, hurt ... overall his durability always was his weakest link he got hurt and injured by thugs and got his arms broken so many freakin times ... so to speak the truth the majority of spider-man showings is when his durability sucks and all those old ones are just PIS

and about that scan are you saying wolverine = ordinary human wrestler?i dont think so

its like the shorty wana thug thing you know it goes all around like this and that but overall if it aint no sugar it aint no spice either

Kid Kurdy
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
You read the story? No? I see, Turdy.
Sure, and I remember clearly that he was sneaking up the Demon Deer because he wanted to show to Shamans pupil how to sneak up a deer without getting your head caved in.

You know, becoming one with nature and such.

Kid Kurdy
Originally posted by marmilado
spider-man supporting tanks and shit like that was long time ago in the 70s 80s eras
Wrong. When fighting together with Paladin, he was throwing tanks.

Spider-Man had lots and lots of strength feats after the 80s.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
Sure, and I remember clearly that he was sneaking up the Demon Deer because he wanted to show to Shamans pupil how to sneak up a deer without getting your head caved in.

You know, becoming one with nature and such.

He wanted to test him and see what he'd do if he got hurt.

It's not like he hasn't sneaked up on a deer before or something...

http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/2271/deersneakyy8.th.jpg

marmilado
Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
Sure, and I remember clearly that he was sneaking up the Demon Deer because he wanted to show to Shamans pupil how to sneak up a deer without getting your head caved in.

You know, becoming one with nature and such.

logan got hit on purpose to see how his student will react and then beat him to the point he made there first showing him how you shouldnt believe everything you see because the things are not always as they seem.... use context

marmilado
Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
Wrong. When fighting together with Paladin, he was throwing tanks.

Spider-Man had lots and lots of strength feats after the 80s.

such as.....

Kid Kurdy
Originally posted by marmilado
such as.....
So you're saying you haven't read Spider-Man for the last 20 years ?

Bye.

Kid Kurdy
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW

http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/2271/deersneakyy8.th.jpg
Marvel Team-Up Spider-Man and Wolverine - 1982

Probably one of the worst comics in history.

Just saying.

KuRuPT Thanosi
You know when Jinzin and Skank aren't in a wolverine thread he really has no chance. Spiderman for the convincing win then

Kid Kurdy
Originally posted by marmilado
logan got hit on purpose to see how his student will react and then beat him to the point he made there first showing him how you shouldnt believe everything you see because the things are not always as they seem.... use context
Nonsense.

He was sneaking up Bambi on Steroids, Charles however made a sound, this startled the deer and it kicked Logan. He even said "Aw, nuts" before he was sent flying.

There is nothing that suggests Wolverine knew he was going to get kicked. Nothing. He couldn't know Charles was going to frighting the deer, which made it kick Logan.

SamZED
Originally posted by marmilado
spider-man supporting tanks and shit like that was long time ago in the 70s 80s eras you know the same old era when the thor fanboys show all kind of powers thor never used again smile , during that era writers didnt established the characters as they are and sometimes you saw shit like that, but ever since spider-man was portrayed solidly and by solidly i mean bleeding, broken, hurt ... overall his durability always was his weakest link he got hurt and injured by thugs and got his arms broken so many freakin times ... so to speak the truth the majority of spider-man showings is when his durability sucks and all those old ones are just PIS

and about that scan are you saying wolverine = ordinary human wrestler?i dont think so

its like the shorty wana thug thing you know it goes all around like this and that but overall if it aint no sugar it aint no spice either I see your point, but Spider-man is not one of those characters who had insane feats decades ago and no longer have them. His strength was established a long time ago and he constantly demonstrated feats to back it up. Just recently he yanked a huge truck with his webline, he leveled an entire building while being underwater (and im talking few months ago). Same goes for his durability. If anything's PIS its those instances you've mentioned as they're vast minority compared to tons of crazy durability feats.

As for the scan, that's not an ordinary human wrestler, that is in fact Wolverine himself.

SamZED
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
laughing out loud

Of that and international human rights law. Trust me, it sucks... but that's what you get when you do stuff like that on the last minute...
sad Been there..

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by SamZED
As for the scan, that's not an ordinary human wrestler, that is in fact Wolverine himself.

Silence.

As for the thread, Wolverine wins sneer

SamZED
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Silence. Right. Sorry. Forgot there are people who havent read it yet.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW

As for the thread, Wolverine wins sneer uhuh

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by marmilado
such as.....

Strength feats after the 80s

a bus
http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/6553/feat1strenghtvi6.jpg

holding up the bugle
http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/3802/feat46strength2yb1.jpg


catching the helicopter
http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/9494/feat30strength2iq1.jpg

swinging a van on his web line...not as impressive as some but i thought it worth mentioning
http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/6128/feat16strength2ra6.jpg

next two are together.
http://img240.imageshack.us/img240/8555/feat2fight4strength1tu9.jpg
http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/2246/feat2fight5strength2va8.jpg

this one just because it's funny
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/7870/feat6strengthgp5.jpg

kicked brb into a wall....meaning he more then budged brb with a kick
http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/3483/feat30strengthnp2.jpg

OneDumbG0
Originally posted by marmilado
spider-man got his arm broken by freakin jigsaw nuff said On this, Count Nefaria drained Spider-Man of his powers temporarily. I was always under the impression that was the reason Jigsaw snapped his arm so easily.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by SamZED
Right. Sorry. Forgot there are people who havent read it yet.

Oh not that... I've read it and it got released, what, seven months ago? It's just that I'm not allowing you to speak of that... particular incident mad

I mean, it's worse than Secret Wars. What if somebody like C-Master saw it? Have mercy.

SamZED
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Oh not that... I've read it and it got released, what, seven moths ago? It's just that I'm not allowing you to speak of that... particular incident mad

I mean, it's worse than Secret Wars. What if somebody like C-Master saw it? Have mercy. laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing
My bad LOL.

Parmaniac
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
this one just because it's funny
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/7870/feat6strengthgp5.jpg If I would go Carver on the Wolverine front I would use this as evidence that Spider-man completely "blitz-dominates" him.

Could you give me the issue numbers to all the other feats? Would appriciate it.

Parmaniac
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Oh not that... I've read it and it got released, what, seven moths ago? It's just that I'm not allowing you to speak of that... particular incident mad

I mean, it's worse than Secret Wars. What if somebody like C-Master saw it? Have mercy. 7 moths ago? That's a damn long time more than half an ant.

Uriel005
Originally posted by SamZED
Which was size of a normal tank and which he yanked with a webline making it even more impressive. uhuh


I do not even know that word but it sounds like me not knowing this is for the best. A modern Abrams tank weighs in at around 60 tons. But if you want to go for a lighter tank a WWII t 34 weighs in at about 27-30 tons.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Parmaniac
7 moths ago? That's a damn long time more than half an ant.

I guess that's what I get for being a grammar nazi myself on other boards in the past sad

Parmaniac
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
I guess that's what I get for being a grammar nazi myself on other boards in the past sad http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20081201204915/uncyclopedia/images/7/75/Grammar_Nazi_Logo.jpg

Starscream M
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
I guess that's what I get for being a grammar nazi myself on other boards in the past sad it actually wasn't a grammar error. it was a spelling error.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Starscream M
it actually wasn't a grammar error. it was a spelling error.

Grammar nazis correct spelling mistakes, too.

I knew I'd get that kind of response from someone like you though facepalm Just die already, Starscream.




































stick out tongue

Parmaniac
Originally posted by Starscream M
it actually wasn't a grammar error. it was a spelling error. Grammar error located, FIRE!

Originally posted by Starscream M
It actually wasn't a grammar error. It was a spelling error. Fixed biscuits

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Parmaniac
If I would go Carver on the Wolverine front I would use this as evidence that Spider-man completely "blitz-dominates" him.

Could you give me the issue numbers to all the other feats? Would appriciate it.

i got these scans from Project Fanboy

http://forums.projectfanboy.com/showthread.php?7974-Spider-Man-Respect-Thread

It's where i go when i need a scan i can not find or post myself.

Parmaniac
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
i got these scans from Project Fanboy

http://forums.projectfanboy.com/showthread.php?7974-Spider-Man-Respect-Thread

It's where i go when i need a scan i can not find or post myself. Isn't taht the thread Dark Crawler made once?

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Parmaniac
Isn't taht the thread Dark Crawler made once?

I wanna say yes but don't quote me on it because i could be wrong.

Mindset
Yes.

Tha C-Master
Originally posted by Starscream M
he doesn't have that environment here...ie high building

also, not sure it was an indication of reflexes...wasn't logan taken by surprise? He has trees and other high places.

He was right in his face. Seeing that people say he's a "trained fighter" and "faster" than Spider-Man, it should be no problem for him.Originally posted by SamZED
Characters tend to do better against teams than when they're fighting 1 on 1. The graveyard fight imo portrayed their abilities pretty accurately. Especially Logan's durability and Parker's speed. Spider-Man is more built to take on teams though, he has consistently done better against multiple people by dodging and confusing them. Also he makes them work against each other.

The graveyard fight was ok, but him doubting his speed and not even breaking that stone with his "hardest hits" was silly.Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Oh not that... I've read it and it got released, what, seven months ago? It's just that I'm not allowing you to speak of that... particular incident mad

I mean, it's worse than Secret Wars. What if somebody like C-Master saw it? Have mercy. Me? Doesn't make me any difference. Your side is the one talking about it. Just entertainment to me folks.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
He's also wailed on him with effect and tossed him out of a window.
When did he wail on him with effect? In Marvel Knights wolverine pretty much called him a whine ***** while taking Spiderman onslaught. Also what does throwing Wolverine out a window matter? when wolverine was completely fine?

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
He has trees and other high places.

He was right in his face. Seeing that people say he's a "trained fighter" and "faster" than Spider-Man, it should be no problem for him.
What does beign a train fighter have to do with him being taken by surprised? He was literrally kidding and spiderman flipped out and attacked him out of no were...........



WHo said he was faster then Spiderman?



also why do you say peope say wolverine a "trained fighter", as if it not true? The way you word it, implies your not sold on the notion.

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
When did he wail on him with effect? In Marvel Knights wolverine pretty much called him a whine ***** while taking Spiderman onslaught. Also what does throwing Wolverine out a window matter? when wolverine was completely fine?

his point (i think) is that spider-man throwing him out of a window would indicate that Peter has the speed and/or reflexes to get the jump on logan. Someone who has shown faster then sight reflexes to get just tossed out the window like that would be able to counter an attack like that unless the person doing the throwing was faster. I mean logan was looking right at pete. it's not like he had his back turned to him.

as for marvel knights everyone(even you a wolverine supporter)should be able to see that spidy was NOT fighting to his best in that fight. For goodness sakes if he fought like that against over half of his villains he would get beaten every time. Peter was blinded with rage and i HOPE we all can agree a lot of spider-mans fighting comes from his ability to think a head which was hindered in this particular incident.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
his point (i think) is that spider-man throwing him out of a window would indicate that Peter has the speed and/or reflexes to get the jump on logan.
In a fight? How could one come to such a conclusion based off that incident?



Originally posted by BlackZero30x

Someone who has shown faster then sight reflexes to get just tossed out the window like that would be able to counter an attack like that unless the person doing the throwing was faster.
No, he need to be around the same speed. Even a slower person could accomplish sucha feat against a talking unsuspecting opponent.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x
I mean logan was looking right at pete. it's not like he had his back turned to him.
Yes and? He also had his hands to his side and was talking, to an ally in an allies base. Your serously trying to over play what happen.

You also realise Wolverine done worse to spiderman, like when Spiderman attempted to grab Wolverine and he spung around an slammed him into a tree before spiderman could react.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x
as for marvel knights everyone(even you a wolverine supporter)should be able to see that spidy was NOT fighting to his best in that fight. For goodness sakes if he fought like that against over half of his villains he would get beaten every time. Peter was blinded with rage and i HOPE we all can agree a lot of spider-mans fighting comes from his ability to think a head which was hindered in this particular incident.
Do you even know what incident I am refferring to? What does spiderman fighting his foes, have anythign to do with Wolverine shrugging off his best shots?


Please don't talk to me about even anything when your trying to pass a non fight off as evidence of spiderman superior speed when it was far from it.

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
In a fight? How could one come to such a conclusion based off that incident?No, he need to be around the same speed. Even a slower person could accomplish sucha feat against a talking unsuspecting opponent. yes I concede your point a slower person could have done that but are you going to tell me wolverine can't counter surprise attacks? OR that he never has?

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Yes and? He also had his hands to his side and was talking, to an ally in an allies base. Your serously trying to over play what happen. No he was being cocky imo because he knew peter was pissed and he kept on "poking" him so to speak.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
You also realise Wolverine done worse to spiderman, like when Spiderman attempted to grab Wolverine and he spung around an slammed him into a tree before spiderman could react.
and when did i ever state the match wouldn't be close? I never said it would be a stomp.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Do you even know what incident I am refferring to? What does spiderman fighting his foes, have anythign to do with Wolverine shrugging off his best shots? I think so Marvel Knight #13? The one where peter was mad at logan already for "hitting on" mary jane? That's the one i was speaking of.


Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Please don't talk to me about even anything when your trying to pass a non fight off as evidence of spiderman superior speed when it was far from it. Id love not to talk to you but your just a great sweet talker...i have to keep coming back for more wink haha! seriously though this takes me back to the question above.

carver9
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
his point (i think) is that spider-man throwing him out of a window would indicate that Peter has the speed and/or reflexes to get the jump on logan. Someone who has shown faster then sight reflexes to get just tossed out the window like that would be able to counter an attack like that unless the person doing the throwing was faster. I mean logan was looking right at pete. it's not like he had his back turned to him.

as for marvel knights everyone(even you a wolverine supporter)should be able to see that spidy was NOT fighting to his best in that fight. For goodness sakes if he fought like that against over half of his villains he would get beaten every time. Peter was blinded with rage and i HOPE we all can agree a lot of spider-mans fighting comes from his ability to think a head which was hindered in this particular incident.

You are contradicting yourself. You are saying that Wolverine should have been fast enough to dodge Spiderman befor getting tossed out of the window (during a none fight scenerio).

With that said, why wasn't Spiderman fast enough to dodge, Wolverine claw swipe during Marvel Knights #13? You said that if the person is fast enough, he should be able to counter attack before getting hit. Spiderman was looking right at Wolverine before getting stabbed just like Wolvy was looking right at Spiderman before getting tossed out the window.

SamZED
Both incidents arent the best examples to argue speed imo.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
yes I concede your point a slower person could have done that but are you going to tell me wolverine can't counter surprise attacks? OR that he never has?


Yes and? How is that irrelevent to ally in ally base randomly attacking him based off a joke with his guard down? Have you even read the issue in question? In the next pannel wolverine walks by the window and says "no one can take a joke".

He clearly did no expect spiderman to grab him and throw him out a window.


Originally posted by BlackZero30x
No he was being cocky imo because he knew peter was pissed and he kept on "poking" him so to speak.
He was making a joke, like he stated on pannel. Which peter done repeatedly to wolverine, who never randomly assaulted him.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x

and when did i ever state the match wouldn't be close? I never said it would be a stomp.
never said you did, I said the evidence your trying to pass off, is not evidence of anything, and it sad your attempting to make it as such. Wolverine has done worse to spiderman in similar circumstance, but you don't see any wolverine support bring it up.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x

I think so Marvel Knight #13? The one where peter was mad at logan already for "hitting on" mary jane? That's the one i was speaking of.

Issue was 14 I believe or 15. However I was not talking about the fight, I was talking about when Spiderman flipped his shit and went at Wolverine who just allowed Spiderman to beat on him becuase he felt bad for stabbing him.


Originally posted by BlackZero30x

Id love not to talk to you but your just a great sweet talker...i have to keep coming back for more wink haha! seriously though this takes me back to the question above.
lol

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by carver9
You are contradicting yourself. You are saying that Wolverine should have been fast enough to dodge Spiderman befor getting tossed out of the window (during a none fight scenerio).

With that said, why wasn't Spiderman fast enough to dodge, Wolverine claw swipe during Marvel Knights #13? You said that if the person is fast enough, he should be able to counter attack before getting hit. Spiderman was looking right at Wolverine before getting stabbed just like Wolvy was looking right at Spiderman before getting tossed out the window.

You know carver I love you man! lol

I thought i stated clearly that spider-man was not fighting near the best of his ability in that fight? if that can't be seen by the wolvie side then this argument is gonna become another hulk vs superman....

Point is im not saying they arn't closely matched im saying spider-man would win especially in this particular situation

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by SamZED
Both incidents arent the best examples to argue speed imo.

Honestly think there a huge difference between a sparing match and the window incident. At least in the sparing match your fighting. WIndow incident was one guy flipping out and attacking unprepared opponent. Window incident is much more akin to the woods incident when Wolverine slammed Spiderman into the tree during the wendigo arc in my opinion.

KuRuPT Thanosi
Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
You know when Jinzin and Skank aren't in a wolverine thread he really has no chance. Spiderman for the convincing win then

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Me? Doesn't make me any difference. Your side is the one talking about it. Just entertainment to me folks.

You do love referencing SW a lot though, don't you? Don't tell me you didn't enjoy that little scene from Astonishing mini... uhuh

Originally posted by SamZED
Both incidents arent the best examples to argue speed imo.

Wolverine one is, because Spidey was actually trying to evade him then.

Just because it was a sparring doesn't mean he was holding back his "dodging ability", for God's sake.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
You know carver I love you man! lol

I thought i stated clearly that spider-man was not fighting near the best of his ability in that fight? if that can't be seen by the wolvie side then this argument is gonna become another hulk vs superman....

B]
And wolverine was?

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi

honestly why do you even bother posting? most of your post are retard nonsense .

You do realise they have no been on genius. honestly the way you jump to conclusion base off the most miniscule crap is astounding.

carver9
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
You know carver I love you man! lol

I thought i stated clearly that spider-man was not fighting near the best of his ability in that fight? if that can't be seen by the wolvie side then this argument is gonna become another hulk vs superman....

Point is im not saying they arn't closely matched im saying spider-man would win especially in this particular situation

I love you too man (no homo... f***, I take it back, it is homo).

So Wolverine was fighting serious when he was tossed out the window huh? He basically went berserk on Spiderman. confused

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
Really, Logan without his claws is nothing special

rolling on floor laughing

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Yes and? How is that irrelevent to ally in ally base randomly attacking him based off a joke with his guard down? Have you even read the issue in question? In the next pannel wolverine walks by the window and says "no one can take a joke".

He clearly did no expect spiderman to grab him and throw him out a window.



He was making a joke, like he stated on pannel. Which peter done repeatedly to wolverine, who never randomly assaulted him.


never said you did, I said the evidence your trying to pass off, is not evidence of anything, and it sad your attempting to make it as such. Wolverine has done worse to spiderman in similar circumstance, but you don't see any wolverine support bring it up.


Issue was 14 I believe or 15. However I was not talking about the fight, I was talking about when Spiderman flipped his shit and went at Wolverine who just allowed Spiderman to beat on him becuase he felt bad for stabbing him.



lol

i know what you mean but i don't feel it's really believable that wolverine has never once countered a surprise attack. My point in a nutshell is simply that peter was walking through through him and kept walking past. The way they made this "window Incident" look (IMO)was as if you or me were walking past a trash can and tossed a piece of trash away with little to no effort. But like i said the actual throwing was not shown so it's hard to really tell. Also this was all me interpenetrating what i thought C-Master had meant anyways.

ahh i c...I was actually speaking of the fight.

SamZED
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Honestly think there a huge difference between a sparing match and the window incident. At least in the sparing match your fighting. WIndow incident was one guy flipping out and attacking unprepared opponent. Window incident is much more akin to the woods incident when Wolverine slammed Spiderman into the tree during the wendigo arc in my opinion. I dont think Logan was suprised. He wasnt simply teasing, he was pretty much provoking Pete. Pushing and pushing to see how long before he snaps. Their relationship was pretty tense at the time. And while its true you're fighting on a sparring, there's no way you'd expect anything like that to happen. That's why I think they both aren't the best examples.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Wolverine one is, because Spidey was actually trying to evade him then.

Just because it was a sparring doesn't mean he was holding back his "dodging ability", for God's sake. Havent you heard of term "taken by surprise"? Pete didnt believe Logan would actually go ahead and try to stab him with adamantium claws during a TRAINING sparring. That makes a HUGE difference. So if you wanna count this you might as well count the window thing. Logan knew what he was doing and what might happen when he provoked Pete.

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
And wolverine was?

no no definitely not but on previous pages i even credited wolverine for the stab but noted that if wolverine had no claws in that incident it would have turned out differently considering wolverine did nothing in retaliation except for the for-mentioned stab.

im heading home...i'll post more in a little bit lol

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by SamZED
Havent you heard of term "taken by surprise"? Pete didnt believe Logan would actually go ahead and try to stab him with adamantium claws during a TRAINING sparring. That makes a HUGE difference. So if you wanna count this you might as well count the window thing. Logan knew what he was doing and what might happen when he provoked Pete.

He didn't believe...? confused

Logan leaped at him with claws out few panels before that. Parker smashed him against the wall with his webs, did he actually think Logan would calm down if he did that? What the f**k?

Parmaniac
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
He didn't believe...? confused

Logan leaped at him with claws out few panels before that. Parker smashed him against the wall with his webs, did he actually think Logan would calm down if he did that? What the f**k? The whole crew was suprised of Wolverines stupidity to stab a team mate.

SamZED
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
He didn't believe...? confused

Logan leaped at him with claws out few panels before that. Parker smashed him against the wall with his webs, did he actually think Logan would calm down if he did that? What the f**k? "I can't believe you stabbed me", "you'd never stab me" need I go on? Wolverine always jumps with his claws, doesnt mean he goes for the kill every time. And Spider-man despite their difference really did not think Logan would ever do that. Not on a sparring that is.

Aakla
Whats to stop Spider-man from just ripping Wolverine's arms off and walking away? His bones are covered by Adamantine but the stuff holding his bones together isn't.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by SamZED
I dont think Logan was suprised. He wasnt simply teasing, he was pretty much provoking Pete. Pushing and pushing to see how long before he snaps. Their relationship was pretty tense at the time. And while its true you're fighting on a sparring, there's no way you'd expect anything like that to happen. That's why I think they both aren't the best examples.


Pushing someone buttons does not make you prepared to be attacked. Spiderman constantly pushes button, but does not think he team jsut going to assault him. Think that quite a stretch to say Wolverien thought Spiderman the constantly pushing bottuns would flip out if someone else turn the tables. If Wolverine thought spiderman would attakc him why would he have his hands on his hips, talking, and then state "no one can take a joke"

There is huge leaps and bounds between the window incident and the sparing match, and I not even sure how one could debate that.


Also through out that entire arc, it was spiderman talking shit to wolverine, not the other way around. That was pretty much the only thing wolverine said to spiderman.

Parmaniac
Originally posted by Aakla
Whats to stop Spider-man from just ripping Wolverine's arms off and walking away? His bones are covered by Adamantine but the stuff holding his bones together isn't. His limbs are connected with small adamantium hooks.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Parmaniac
The whole crew was suprised of Wolverines stupidity to stab a team mate.

And what was he supposed to do with his claws, beat Parker with the flat of the blades...? Silver Samurai style?

He still held back. Could have cut him in half or at least cut out the major organs... or simply penetrate him deeper embarrasment

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
i know what you mean but i don't feel it's really believable that wolverine has never once countered a surprise attack.
He has, many times, but again how is that relevent here?





Originally posted by BlackZero30x

My point in a nutshell is simply that peter was walking through through him and kept walking past. The way they made this "window Incident" look (IMO)was as if you or me were walking past a trash can and tossed a piece of trash away with little to no effort. But like i said the actual throwing was not shown so it's hard to really tell. Also this was all me interpenetrating what i thought C-Master had meant anyways.


Yes and? Again how does that go against the fact WOlverine was taken by surprised by a teammate.....also how much do you think 300 pounds is to spiderman?

Parmaniac
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
And what was he supposed to do with his claws, beat Parker with the flat of the blades...? Silver Samurai style? http://img849.imageshack.us/img849/6048/otherrespect4spidermanw.th.jpg

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by SamZED
"I can't believe you stabbed me", "you'd never stab me" need I go on? Wolverine always jumps with his claws, doesnt mean he goes for the kill every time. And Spider-man despite their difference really did not think Logan would ever do that. Not on a sparring that is.

You realize that an accidental move of his hand can kill someone like Spidey, right? So he has to be cautious all the time, even during a freakin sparring session erm

Dum Dum Dugan
Spiderman had that coming, does anyone else remember how much of a prick Spiderman was to Wolverien through out that arc.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Parmaniac
http://img849.imageshack.us/img849/6048/otherrespect4spidermanw.th.jpg

I really hope he was killing the Brood/zombies/Marvel version of Clayface made out of shit prior to that scene.

Dum Dum Dugan
Funny he use that scan, becuase in that arc Wolverine by spidermans own admission killed whole bunch of people before he could react. stick out tongue

Parmaniac
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
You realize that an accidental move of his hand can kill someone like Spidey, right? So he has to be cautious all the time, even during a freakin sparring session erm Wolverine is very skilled in using his claws

0bGHfhEIrkY&feature=feedrec_grec_index

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
He has, many times, but again how is that relevent here?







Yes and? Again how does that go against the fact WOlverine was taken by surprised by a teammate.....also how much do you think 300 pounds is to spiderman?

it's relevant because if he has shown the ability to react fast enough to counter a surprise attacks in the past why could he not counter spider-man?

the weight and surprise wasn't the point. the point was how much effort would you expect you would need to just toss a piece of trash. normally(for me at least) im not even really thinking about it. that's how little effort it takes. Im not saying pete wasn't thinking about it but the way it was portrayed was as just that. when i read that, it came off to me like pete put little to no effort into that attack.

so taking that wolvie was off guard and pete was putting no effort into it.....then it would not be to far off in saying that peter putting thought and effort into it would have resulted the same even if wolverine would have been on guard. That argument can be taken with a grain of salt though because of other feats by both characters.

as to your question 300lb? considering as much as he has lifted and held up...not to mention his weight class would suggest 300lbs is something he would be lifting with 2 fingers. making my analogy pretty right on imo....

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
it's relevant because if he has shown the ability to react fast enough to counter a surprise attacks in the past why could he not counter spider-man?

becuase the circumstances were completely different. Honestly do you read your arguements?

Originally posted by BlackZero30x

the weight and surprise wasn't the point. the point was how much effort would you expect you would need to just toss a piece of trash. normally(for me at least) im not even really thinking about it. that's how little effort it takes. Im not saying pete wasn't thinking about it but the way it was portrayed was as just that. when i read that it came off to me like pete put little to no effort into that attack.

Again how much do you think 300 pounds is to spiderman? Hell 300 pounds is lighter to spiderman then a piece of trash is to you, which is what I don't think your grasping.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x

so taking that wolvie was off guard and pete was putting no effort into it.....then it would not be to far off in saying that peter putting thought and effort into it would have resulted the same even if wolverine would have been on guard.
you just love grasping at straws don't you?

Originally posted by BlackZero30x

That argument can be taken with a grain of salt though because of other feats by both characters.
No it taken with a grian of salt, becuase it foolish arguement based on circumstances. Wolverine did not expect his teammate to randomly attack him, fact.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x

as to your question 300lb? considering as much as he has lifted and held up...not to mention his weight class would suggest 300lbs is something he would be lifting with 2 fingers. making my analogy pretty right on imo....
yes which has nothing to do with speed, but strength, which is completely irrelevent to are debate.


Honestly read your arguements, your contradict yourself.

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
becuase the circumstances were completely different. Honestly do you read your arguements?


Again how much do you think 300 pounds is to spiderman? Hell 300 pounds is lighter to spiderman then a piece of trash is to you, which is what I don't think your grasping.


you just love grasping at straws don't you?


No it taken with a grian of salt, becuase it foolish arguement based on circumstances. Wolverine did not expect his teammate to randomly attack him, fact.


yes which has nothing to do with speed, but strength, which is completely irrelevent to are debate.


Honestly read your arguements, your contradict yourself.

i have made one solid argument the entire time i have been debating with you and it was merely the amount of effort spider-man put in to that "throw" so how am i contradicting myself? Effort is kind of a universal word. It doesn't always mean the amount of force put into it. Effort would be the combination of the amount of strength, amount of thought, and/or actually trying to throw someone out a window. and the scene simply made it seem like pete walked by and pushed him with one arm. Indicating not only not trying or not putting much strength into it but piratically no thought. Meaning no effort.

if you mean where i said "Im not saying pete wasn't thinking about it but the way it was portrayed was as just that. when i read that it came off to me like pete put little to no effort into that attack." That was me stating this was my opinion of the whole incident. I thought that was clear. if not then my bad.

but if you want i can take a minute gather my thoughts and re-state everything in a more clarifying way?

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
i have made one solid argument the entire time i have been debating with you and it was merely the amount of effort spider-man put in to that "throw" so how am i contradicting myself? Effort is kind of a universal word. It doesn't always mean the amount of force put into it. Effort would be the combination of the amount of strength, amount of thought, and/or actually trying to throw someone out a window. and the scene simply made it seem like pete walked by and pushed him with one arm. Indicating not only not trying or not putting much strength into it but piratically no thought. Meaning no effort.

No it dident. Your just adding your on context. It happen completely off pannel. The fact he walk away after wards, some how calculates to him causual doing it now?

you seem to have very skewed views when it comes to spiderman

Originally posted by BlackZero30x

if you mean where i said "Im not saying pete wasn't thinking about it but the way it was portrayed was as just that. when i read that it came off to me like pete put little to no effort into that attack." That was me stating this was my opinion of the whole incident. I thought that was clear. if not then my bad.

Your opinion seem very bias to me. Your trying to make a non fight into a statement for spidermans speed, when it nopt at all.


Originally posted by BlackZero30x

but if you want i can take a minute gather my thoughts and re-state everything in a more clarifying way?
I don't care, I think your arguement is reiduclous and based off bias wishful thinking.

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
No it dident. Your just adding your on context. It happen completely off pannel. The fact he walk away after wards, some how calculates to him causual doing it now?

you seem to have very skewed views when it comes to spiderman


Your opinion seem very bias to me. Your trying to make a non fight into a statement for spidermans speed, when it nopt at all.




I don't care, I think your arguement is reiduclous and based off bias wishful thinking.

ok well i understand your argument style now. you will split up a paragraph and argue it in your way. making points or allowing you to argue against something out of context anyways. i have stated how many times already it was done off panel? so next time tell me something i don't know. Next I have stated that this INCIDENT from my view point seemed as if spider-man put very little effort into it. Finally i even said this evidence could be taken with a grain of salt....so how is this me "trying to make a non fight into a statement for spidermans speed"???

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
ok well i understand your argument style now. you will split up a paragraph and argue it in your way. making points or allowing you to argue against something out of context anyways. i have stated how many times already it was done off panel? so next time tell me something i don't know. Next I have stated that this INCIDENT from my view point seemed as if spider-man put very little effort into it. Finally i even said this evidence could be taken with a grain of salt....so how is this me "trying to make a non fight into a statement for spidermans speed"???
So why ar eyou even arguing with me if you admitt it not evidence?

SamZED
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
You realize that an accidental move of his hand can kill someone like Spidey, right? So he has to be cautious all the time, even during a freakin sparring session erm
And Wolverine is so accurate with his claws he can perform bar mitzvah on a fly if he wanted to and Spider-man knows that. AND he believed Logan would never go for the stab, hence no need to worry about it.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Pushing someone buttons does not make you prepared to be attacked. Spiderman constantly pushes button, but does not think he team jsut going to assault him. Think that quite a stretch to say Wolverien thought Spiderman the constantly pushing bottuns would flip out if someone else turn the tables. If Wolverine thought spiderman would attakc him why would he have his hands on his hips, talking, and then state "no one can take a joke"

There is huge leaps and bounds between the window incident and the sparing match, and I not even sure how one could debate that.


Also through out that entire arc, it was spiderman talking shit to wolverine, not the other way around. That was pretty much the only thing wolverine said to spiderman. What SM does, I wouldnt call it pushing someone's buttons, he jokes most of the time and chooses childish subjects like weight, looks etc and nobody on the team takes that seriously anyway. While Logan picked a very ticklish subject. He was dissing Pete's wife and their relationship. Its way diferent from making "fat jokes". I dont thing he knew Spider-man is gonna try to toss him out of the window but i do believe he expected some kind of agressive reaction, maybe an attack even. You can feel the tension on that page even. I just dont believe Logan thought Pete is just gonna walk away after that. Holding his hands that way is just a way of saying "So? what are you gonna do about it?". Ofcourse he wouldnt stand there with his claws poped ready for a fight. That'd make him look paranoid.

There is, but there's a much bigger gap between a sparring match and a real fight. Imo making conclusions about speed based on that is not much better than using that very windw incident as an argument.

KuRuPT Thanosi
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
honestly why do you even bother posting? most of your post are retard nonsense .

You do realise they have no been on genius. honestly the way you jump to conclusion base off the most miniscule crap is astounding.

That's Irony at its finest coming from you.. the whole.. "why do you bother posting.. most of your post are retard nonsense" However, I would add.. taking scans out of context while keeping wolverine's nuts in your mouth...

Gamora still owns Wolverine by being better in every area.. sorry bud.

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
So why ar eyou even arguing with me if you admitt it not evidence?

because my originating post was me replying what i thought C-Master was meaning. after that you asked what i meant or said you didn't understand or something like that so i explained the argument. if i was going to argue a point with you in this fight it would be spider-man wining via strength by way of subduing him and the like.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That's Irony at its finest coming from you.. the whole.. "why do you bother posting.. most of your post are retard nonsense" However, I would add.. taking scans out of context while keeping wolverine's nuts in your mouth...

Gamora still owns Wolverine by being better in every area.. sorry bud.
When did I take a scan out of context? please enlighten me.






yes and? what was the point of saying this? seems odd, like your mixing me up with someone else.

KuRuPT Thanosi
I'm not talking about in this thread.. I'm talking about past threads where you have done just that.

You feel like Gamora beats Wolverine?

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
I'm not talking about in this thread.. I'm talking about past threads where you have done just that.

You feel like Gamora beats Wolverine?
Yea and im asking you to prove it, becuase it bullshit. Common champ, please quote me posting a scan out of context please.





yes. clearly you have me screwed up with someone else

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by SamZED
And Wolverine is so accurate with his claws he can perform bar mitzvah on a fly if he wanted to and Spider-man knows that. AND he believed Logan would never go for the stab, hence no need to worry about it.

What SM does, I wouldnt call it pushing someone's buttons, he jokes most of the time and chooses childish subjects like weight, looks etc and nobody on the team takes that seriously anyway. While Logan picked a very ticklish subject. He was dissing Pete's wife and their relationship. Its way diferent from making "fat jokes". I dont thing he knew Spider-man is gonna try to toss him out of the window but i do believe he expected some kind of agressive reaction, maybe an attack even. You can feel the tension on that page even. I just dont believe Logan thought Pete is just gonna walk away after that. Holding his hands that way is just a way of saying "So? what are you gonna do about it?". Ofcourse he wouldnt stand there with his claws poped ready for a fight. That'd make him look paranoid.

There is, but there's a much bigger gap between a sparring match and a real fight. Imo making conclusions about speed based on that is not much better than using that very windw incident as an argument.
I disagree 100%. He never made an agressive jester to spiderman at all. It was a joke by Wolverine own admission. Not to mention during that same arc spiderman was saying numerous things to wolverine, who never attacked him. Why would he think Spiderman would assault him? He clearly dident, which is why he was completely off his guard. Also Logan pulled his claws out numerous times, this idea that he fear to look paranoid, is a huge strech.



No really, not in terms of speed it not. It much larger gap between a person cheap shotting an ally and a fight, then a sparring match and a real fight. Also the whole point of sparring is to improve reaction time, speed and put skill into action.

Though there is a difference between sparing match and a fight, it not nearly as large as what happen in the window incident. That should be quite easy to see.

Starscream M
dum dum, are you arguing logan wins?

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Starscream M
dum dum, are you arguing logan wins?
No im argueing the window feat being irrelevent.


also argueing that window feat is not remotely comparable to the sparing match (though I agree that also not a good indicator of how a fight would go).


Honestly more annoyed at the fact that window incidents brought up by spiderman supports quite a bit over the years and yet "wolverine fans are the worst" despite the fact we never try passing such incident like that as evidence, such as when Wolverine slammed spiderman into a tree when he attempted to prevent him to leave or what happen in new son ect. (not refferring to sam at all)

Starscream M
Oh I agree with you then that the window event is irrelevant.

who do you think wins?

Mindset
Spiderman wins.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by SamZED
And Wolverine is so accurate with his claws he can perform bar mitzvah on a fly if he wanted to and Spider-man knows that. AND he believed Logan would never go for the stab, hence no need to worry about it.

No, he doesn't know a thing. Remember Dr Strange and Hellstorm scene?

A stab from adamantium blades is actually safer than a swipe when dealing with someone with so erratic moves (that are gonna get Parker killed sooner or later, as Cap said). Even with unintentional swipes Parker can get sliced in pieces. With stabs, Logan can control how deep his claws are gonna penetrate. He hurt Puny Pete too much by an accident, but still he didn't sink his claws all the way in. Now imagine a mistake with a swipe...

"Sorry webs, had no idea you would follow up that move with a backflip kick and I sorta-kinda cut your damn leg off. Stuff happens, now grow up and get me a beer."

stick out tongue

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Starscream M
Oh I agree with you then that the window event is irrelevant.

who do you think wins?
Im not sure, to be honest, im leaning towards spiderman at the moment if he fights smart, but im iffy.

Mindset
Hmm I bet spiderman could heal reattached limbs.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Mindset
Hmm I bet spiderman could heal reattached limbs.
based on evil face

BlackZero30x
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Im not sure, to be honest, im leaning towards spiderman at the moment if he fights smart, but im iffy.

i may quote you on this and place it under my sig stick out tongue

Mindset
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
based on evil face Humans can do it, with surgery, and Spiderman has much better healing.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by BlackZero30x
i may quote you on this and place it under my sig stick out tongue
do it up, believe bada has similar quote on his.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Mindset
Humans can do it, with surgery, and Spiderman has much better healing.
with or with out surgery?

SamZED
Heh I doubt he can reattach limbs, but he was shown healing machinegun wounds over night, deep cuts etc.

PS: Did you guys see that book where Deadpool learnt to "animate his seperated limbs"? lol

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
I disagree 100%. He never made an agressive jester to spiderman at all. It was a joke by Wolverine own admission. Not to mention during that same arc spiderman was saying numerous things to wolverine, who never attacked him. Why would he think Spiderman would assault him? He clearly dident, which is why he was completely off his guard. Also Logan pulled his claws out numerous times, this idea that he fear to look paranoid, is a huge strech.



No really, not in terms of speed it not. It much larger gap between a person cheap shotting an ally and a fight, then a sparring match and a real fight. Also the whole point of sparring is to improve reaction time, speed and put skill into action.

Though there is a difference between sparing match and a fight, it not nearly as large as what happen in the window incident. That should be quite easy to see. There was a huge scandal involving MJ and Logan saw Pete is POed and basically kept calling his wife stupid. If that's not a provocation, I dont know what is. But point taken, he wasnt prepared for a battle, true. But Spider-man wasnt prepared for Logan going for the stab as well.

Ok, there's a difference, not arguing that. But tell me, do you believe that one person all of a sudden stabbing another person during training is a good example to make conclusions about speed? Especially when we have examples of them actually fighting?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
No, he doesn't know a thing. Remember Dr Strange and Hellstorm scene?

A stab from adamantium blades is actually safer than a swipe when dealing with someone with so erratic moves (that are gonna get Parker killed sooner or later, as Cap said). Even with unintentional swipes Parker can get sliced in pieces. With stabs, Logan can control how deep his claws are gonna penetrate. He hurt Puny Pete too much by an accident, but still he didn't sink his claws all the way in. Now imagine a mistake with a swipe...

"Sorry webs, had no idea you would follow up that move with a backflip kick and I sorta-kinda cut your damn leg off. Stuff happens, now grow up and get me a beer."

stick out tongue What scene? You mean the one where Logan stabbed Strange? LOL While admit it was funny, I dont see how it has anything to do with this situation.

Logan didnt want to stab Pete but it wasn't an accident. He simply got carried away. Hence everyone's reaction. (I like saying "hence" makes me seem smart). But that wouldnt matter in a fight. Logan is not "accidently" swiping SM's head off if Pete is actually ready for him. Whch wasnt the case during the sparring. And that backflip will just hit the target.stick out tongue

Cap knows jack.stick out tongue He fights using skill and it works for him, but Spider-man fights better when relying solely on his istincts, its when he starts thinking too much is when he usually gets in trouble. I actually think spider sense has a lot undescovered potential. He can basically tune it to anything he wants but for some reason they never developed that ability in comics..

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by SamZED
Heh I doubt he can reattach limbs, but he was shown healing machinegun wounds over night, deep cuts etc.

PS: Did you guys see that book where Deadpool learnt to "animate his seperated limbs"? lol

There was a huge scandal involving MJ and Logan saw Pete is POed and basically kept calling his wife stupid. If that's not a provocation, I dont know what is. But point taken, he wasnt prepared for a battle, true. But Spider-man wasnt prepared for Logan going for the stab as well.



It should not be the end all be all, but it should be factor in (just as any encounter, but certainly should not be anyones major point of there arguement or anything like that). There was fighting (training session) and they were heated at one another. Spiderman did not look to be pulling punches either when he whipped Wolverine into the wall and started talking shit. Wolverine then got serious, but context suggested Spiderman was the one to bring it to that level first. He also tried to dodge Wolverien attack and got hit.

Also it not as if there other fights don't support Wolverine be able to tagg Spiderman.


It more evidence that Wolverine can tank Spidermans blows then it is for any speed feat.

also I just notice I quoted the wrong part of your post lol

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by SamZED
What scene? You mean the one where Logan stabbed Strange? LOL While admit it was funny, I dont see how it has anything to do with this situation.

Logan didnt want to stab Pete but it wasn't an accident. He simply got carried away. Hence everyone's reaction. (I like saying "hence" makes me seem smart). But that wouldnt matter in a fight. Logan is not "accidently" swiping SM's head off if Pete is actually ready for him. Whch wasnt the case during the sparring. And that backflip will just hit the target.stick out tongue

Cap knows jack.stick out tongue He fights using skill and it works for him, but Spider-man fights better when relying solely on his istincts, its when he starts thinking too much is when he usually gets in trouble. I actually think spider sense has a lot undescovered potential. He can basically tune it to anything he wants but for some reason they never developed that ability in comics..

Just an example of Pete not knowing shit... to quote Logan, he popped claw only a little.

If he didn't hold back, claws would be sticking outwards Parker's back. I know you like saying "hence" stick out tongue If backflip hits the target, then Parker breaks his foot. Ha!

Now he doesn't have SS and thus Wolverine dim maks him in the nuts. He'd actually do that instead of going for the chest like Pete did with Hobby cool

SamZED
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
It should not be the end all be all, but it should be factor in (just as any encounter, but certainly should not be anyones major point of there arguement or anything like that). There was fighting (training session) and they were heated at one another. Spiderman did not look to be pulling punches either when he whipped Wolverine into the wall and started talking shit. Wolverine then got serious, but context suggested Spiderman was the one to bring it to that level first. He also tried to dodge Wolverien attack and got hit.

Also it not as if there other fights don't support Wolverine be able to tagg Spiderman.


It more evidence that Wolverine can tank Spidermans blows then it is for any speed feat.

also I just notice I quoted the wrong part of your post lol lol that's ok.

TBH I didnt see no indication that he tried to dodge, Logan just attacked and hit him. The context also makes it clear that he didnt see or expect Logan to do anything like that. Even confirmed that on panel. And while Spider-man wasnt gentle himself, all he tried to do is web him up to a wall, its not like gutting someone is a natural responce to that. IMO this incident can be used but only in a "one is just sparring, while the other is going for the stab" kind of scenario, but not in an real all out (to the death) kind of battle.

You mean, after the attack? Pete was mostly going for his back and shoulders tbh. That hurts like hell but dont get you koed. Not that I think SM can ko him with a few hits, I dont.

Ofcourse Wolverine can tag Spider-man, but other fights indicate its extremely hard if Pete puts his mind to it. Definitely not something Logan can do with a single swipe 20 seconds after the beginning of the fight. Would take a long tough battle.

Tha C-Master
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
When did he wail on him with effect? In Marvel Knights wolverine pretty much called him a whine ***** while taking Spiderman onslaught. Also what does throwing Wolverine out a window matter? when wolverine was completely fine? Which wasn't at his best and it was after Wolverine stabbed him.

He was fine later. So what?Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
What does beign a train fighter have to do with him being taken by surprised? He was literrally kidding and spiderman flipped out and attacked him out of no were...........



WHo said he was faster then Spiderman?



also why do you say peope say wolverine a "trained fighter", as if it not true? The way you word it, implies your not sold on the notion. The ability to predict and react and whatnot.

Carver has implied it.

I think people overstate it.

SamZED
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Just an example of Pete not knowing shit... to quote Logan, he popped claw only a little.

If he didn't hold back, claws would be sticking outwards Parker's back. I know you like saying "hence" stick out tongue If backflip hits the target, then Parker breaks his foot. Ha!

Now he doesn't have SS and thus Wolverine dim maks him in the nuts. He'd actually do that instead of going for the chest like Pete did with Hobby cool Which wuld've still be a training session hence not usable in a vs all out fight. evil face

More like snap his neck, as Logan already twice confirmed Pete could do it with ease.stick out tongue

Van Dame and Parker are the only MA nmasters who can perform a Dim Mak.miffed He already defeated Batroc the Leaper. You hear me? BATROC THE FRIKKIN LEAPER!!!!

Mindset
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
with or with out surgery? Maybe with minimal medical attention. Like just stitch it back together.

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