Wrecker vs. Spider-Man

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Take a look at KM's scans not uch to argue, I hope you don't want to claim Wolverine would have beaten him.

Of course I agree that Wrecker shitstomps him no expression

What lead you to believe that I don't? Did you even read my post, Parm?

Wolverine has one-shotted him, FYI (Mungi - I know you'll disagree with this as you did before, sure you're entitled to your opinion and all, but that's the way Adam Kubert draws... it's not just mask that got clawed).

Spidey, on the other hand, got raped every single time he faced him. Worse than by Westcott when he was at the age of twelve... Spider-Man and Power Pack one-shot...

-K-M-

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Wolverine has one-shotted him, FYI (Mungi - I know you'll disagree with this as you did before, sure you're entitled to your opinion and all, but that's the way Adam Kubert draws... it's not just mask that got clawed).

Even if you don't agree that his mask was cut instead of his skin, where did we see him ko'ed?

Parmaniac

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Of course I agree that Wrecker shitstomps him no expression

What lead you to believe that I don't? Did you even read my post, Parm?
Of course not, I never do.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Wolverine has one-shotted him, FYI (Mungi - I know you'll disagree with this as you did before, sure you're entitled to your opinion and all, but that's the way Adam Kubert draws... it's not just mask that got clawed). That was 1 panel if we're talking about the same instant (a pipc from a newspaper article).

zopzop

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Take a look at KM's scans not uch to argue, I hope you don't want to claim Wolverine would have beaten him.

He didn't really hurt Wolverine though, but Wolverine tore him up. Wrecker did tool Cage, Spider-man, and Spider-woman though. Well technically he didn't tool Spider-woman but her Venom Blasts did nothing.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by -K-M-
Even if you don't agree that his mask was cut instead of his skin, where did we see him ko'ed?

Heh. Knew you'd say this.

Yes, you're right, we didn't see him unconscious. He did have closed eyes and dropped the crowbar, though. But yeah, we can't say for sure it was a one-shot. Not nearly enough info from a single panel.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Of course not, I never do.
That was 1 panel if we're talking about the same instant (a pipc from a newspaper article).

That wasn't a newspaper article... those captions were just meant by the writer to be here. So we could see how Wolverine's typical week looks like. Noob.

Originally posted by zopzop
He didn't really hurt Wolverine though, but Wolverine tore him up. Wrecker did tool Cage, Spider-man, and Spider-woman though. Well technically he didn't tool Spider-woman but her Venom Blasts did nothing.

He did tool her when her durability and fighting skills were boosted.

edit: Wolverine I mean! stick out tongue

Sorry.

-K-M-

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Heh. Knew you'd say this.

Yes, you're right, we didn't see him unconscious. He did have closed eyes and dropped the crowbar, though. But yeah, we can't say for sure it was a one-shot. Not nearly enough info from a single panel.

I'm so adorable love

zopzop

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW

He did tool her when her durability and fighting skills were boosted.

edit: Wolverine I mean! stick out tongue

Sorry.

You lost me big grin

Oh and Wrecker wins 10/10.

StiltmanFTW

And Parm - correct me if I'm wrong - but isn't that single panel more impressive than anything Parker's done vs. Wrecker? shocklaugh

Prove me wrong if you can, too tired to check for myself.

Originally posted by zopzop
You lost me big grin

Oh and Wrecker wins 10/10.

Didn't pay attention to that part of your post aaaaand my reply's gone completely off-topic.

Agreed. How do you think Parker would fare against Loki? In a pure h2h battle that is. Just curious.

Parmaniac

zopzop

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
And Parm - correct me if I'm wrong - but isn't that single panel more impressive than anything Parker's done vs. Wrecker? shocklaugh

Prove me wrong if you can, too tired to check for myself.

Didn't pay attention to that part of your post aaaaand my reply's gone completely off-topic.

Agreed. How do you think Parker would fare against Loki? In a pure h2h battle that is. Just curious.

IMHO, Loki is too confusing to call. In some of his appearances you can't tell if he's magically boosted or not. ASSuming no magic at all, just his normal Asgardian physical stats. I think Peter has a small chance. But I think Wolverine would do MUCH MUCH better.

edited a typo

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by zopzop
IMHO, Loki is too confusing to call. In some of his appearances you can't tell if he's magically boosted or not. ASSuming no magic at all, just his normal Asgardian physical stats. I think Peter has a small chance. But I think Wolverine would do MUCH MUCH better.

edited a typo

That's what I think, too. You believe Loki was amped when he literally ignored all of Parker's blows?

zopzop

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
That's what I think, too. You believe Loki was amped when he literally ignored all of Parker's blows?

Again with Loki, it's hard to tell. But I'd guess yeah. He is a Trickster God after all.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by zopzop
Again with Loki, it's hard to tell. But I'd guess yeah. He is a Trickster God after all.

Exactly, it's hard to say. We should consider that he treated him literally as nothing, though. Why would one prepare with spells against someone so beneath his notice?

Anyway, it's not clear and I don't think my thread should be closed uhuh Every thread with Spidey facing a character equal to/above Loki's weight class (Wrecker...) should be closed if we follow that example.

I hope Bada won't go Zeus on me for discussing it here.

Parmaniac

I can't remember posting in this thread.

Bentley

Wrecker dominates.

Now that I think of it, Wrecker should've been a Worthy on Fear Itself.

SamZED

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
And Parm - correct me if I'm wrong - but isn't that single panel more impressive than anything Parker's done vs. Wrecker? shocklaugh
We've seen Wrecker stream roll the New Avengers including Logan and Parker. Do you believe one panel of Logan stabbing him means much? Or a proof he's >> Spider-man? See, Wolverine stabbed the Wrecker, Iron Fist raped the entire wrecking crew, Spider-man defeat Iron Fist, so Spider-man >>>> Wolverine. durslide stick out tongue

Originally posted by zopzop
IMHO, Loki is too confusing to call. In some of his appearances you can't tell if he's magically boosted or not. ASSuming no magic at all, just his normal Asgardian physical stats. I think Peter has a small chance. But I think Wolverine would do MUCH MUCH better.

edited a typo Its safe to say he was amped. Loki is tough but he's not more durable than Thor or BRB and they both felt Pete's attacks.

Dum Dum Dugan

Originally posted by SamZED
We've seen Wrecker stream roll the New Avengers including Logan and Parker. Do you believe one panel of Logan stabbing him means much? Or a proof he's >> Spider-man? See, Wolverine stabbed the Wrecker, Iron Fist raped the entire wrecking crew, Spider-man defeat Iron Fist, Captain America defeat Spiderman, Wolverine Defeat Captain America, so Wolverine>>>>>>>Spiderman durslide stick out tongue

.
fixed

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by SamZED
We've seen Wrecker stream roll the New Avengers including Logan and Parker. Do you believe one panel of Logan stabbing him means much? Or a proof he's >> Spider-man? See, Wolverine stabbed the Wrecker, Iron Fist raped the entire wrecking crew, Spider-man defeat Iron Fist, so Spider-man >>>> Wolverine. durslide stick out tongue

Its safe to say he was amped. Loki is tough but he's not more durable than Thor or BRB and they both felt Pete's attacks.

I loved how Parker was a non-factor in that fight.

Not stabbing. Clawing his freakin jaw off no expression

Dum Dum Dugan

That scans of Spidy fight Loki, I believe he also in that same arc fought Thor. His Punches were rather ineffective against Thor as well, if not mistaken, however he was also to fast for Thor to make contact with, for the most part.

SamZED

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
That scans of Spidy fight Loki, I believe he also in that same arc fought Thor. His Punches were rather ineffective against Thor as well, if not mistaken, however he was also to fast for Thor to make contact with, for the most part. Spider-man has too many showings of either hurting or at least effecting class 100 characters with his attacks. I doubt Loki's durabiity without amp is so much greater than all the people Pete's punches worked against.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
I loved how Parker was a non-factor in that fight.

Not stabbing. Clawing his freakin jaw off no expression

He's never beaten him.

Maybe Thor and BRB instances are just PIS then? Loki didn't cast a forcefield spell or anything, discredited Parker from the very beginning. According to him Parker is slow, dense, weak and not even super-powered. Hard to disagree with the guy.

And I'm 99% sure it was written by JMS, who wanked Spidey harder than you or Parm. It was under his pen when he destroyed a building with his punches or held his breath underwater for 30 minutes. The only one who was a factor at all was Skrull Spider Woman. All others did was distract him.

My A>B>C logic stil beats your A>B>C logic.

Thor, BRB, Hulk etc etc etc they all felt Pete's attacks dozens of times. Even classic Juggernaut complimentined his attacks. Loki's durability without amping isnt beyond those guys.

Man, it must suck being outwrestled by a "slow, dense, weak and not super-powered" guy. evil face

He destroyed buildings more than on one occasion. Spider-man doesnt get wanked. Every awesome showing he has is legitimate and accurate to his abilities. That's why you secretly love him so much. stick out tongue

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by SamZED
Spider-man has too many showings of either hurting or at least effecting class 100 characters with his attacks. I doubt Loki's durabiity without amp is so much greater than all the people Pete's punches worked against.

The only one who was a factor at all was Srull Spider Woman.

My A>B>C logic stil beats your A>B>C logic.

Thor, BRB, Hulk etc etc etc they all felt Pete's attacks dozens of times. Loki's durability without amping isnt beyond those guys.

Man, it must suck being outwrestled by a "slow, dense, weak and not super-powered" guy. evil face

He destroyed buildings more than on one occasion. Spider-man doesnt get wanked. Every awesome showing he has is legitimte and accurate to his abilities. That's why you secretly love him. stick out tongue

No. Luke and Logan actually brought something to that fight. Wolverine did a lot of damage and just kept coming at him. Parker was just like his namesake. An insect. Well, to be fair he did trap him in the web at the end... but that's it.

It sucks even more than getting outkung-fu'd by some nonames from Chinatown... sad

SamZED

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
No. Luke and Logan actually brought something to that fight. Wolverine did a lot of damage and just kept coming at him. Parker was just like his namesake. An insect. Well, to be fair he did trap him in the web at the end... but that's it.

It sucks even more than getting outkung-fu'd by some nonames from Chinatown... sad

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/NewAvengers7_19.jpg Yes clearly Logan did so much better than Pete. no expression

Two attacks from behind was it. Spider-man was the one who webbed him up, not to mention distracted with webbing several times allowing Spider Skrull and Luke to land some hits and got a hit in himself.

Spider Skrull is the only one who made any real difference.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by SamZED
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/NewAvengers7_19.jpg Yes clearly Logan did so much better than Pete. no expression

Two attacks from behind was it. Spider-man was the one who webbed him up, not to mention distracted with webbing several times allowing Spider Skrull and Luke to land some hits and got a hit in himself.

Cool. How does it change what I said? roll eyes (sarcastic)

Blindside or not, Wolverine actually was a factor in that fight seeing as he was able to hurt him. Parker was just a minor distraction if anything. After he got tossed he apparently hid in the freakin closet and showed up when the others did dirty work. How super heroic of him.

Parmaniac

You should thank Spidey for using his weebing on his eyes that your beer drinking boy was able to hit him. smile

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by SamZED
Spider Skrull is the only one who made any real difference.

Veranke on her own would be useless.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by Parmaniac
You should thank Spidey for using his weebing on his eyes that your beer drinking boy was able to hit him. smile

Parker can only web up someone face properly when it happens to be his teammate ermm

Parmaniac

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Parker can only web up someone face properly when it happens to be his teammate ermm Apperantly Wolverine can only hit Wrecker when he's distracted by someone else.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Apperantly Wolverine can only hit Wrecker when he's distracted by someone else.

See, Spidey ain't even good for that.

Parmaniac

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
See, Spidey ain't even good for that. Fail

SamZED

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Cool. How does it change what I said?

Blindside or not, Wolverine actually was a factor in that fight seeing as he was able to hurt him. Parker was just a minor distraction if anything. After he got tossed he apparently hid in the freakin closet and showed up when the others did dirty work. How super heroic of him. Ow yay. He has adamantium claws so he managed so scratch Wreckers back. SUCH a huge factor that was, hell desided the outcome of the entire fight. roll eyes (sarcastic)

zopzop

Judging by those scans, and ONLY those scans, Wolverine and Cage at least drew blood. That's more than Spider-man did during that fight.

Wrecker did not hurt Wolverine at all, BFRing for a few minutes isn't exactly that impressive. Wolverine, however, tore him up. What would have happened if those were the Wrecker's eyes or his spinal cord? Dead or paralyzed Wrecker, is what.

I can't stand Wolverine, he's over exposed, but the combination of : healing factor, indestructible skeleton, and sharp indestructible claws means he's a nightmare to any brawler type hero.

SamZED

Originally posted by zopzop
Judging by those scans, and ONLY those scans, Wolverine and Cage at least drew blood. That's more than Spider-man did during that fight.

Wrecker did not hurt Wolverine at all, BFRing for a few minutes isn't exactly that impressive. Wolverine, however, tore him up. What would have happened if those were the Wrecker's eyes or his spinal cord? Dead or paralyzed Wrecker, is what.

I can't stand Wolverine, he's over exposed, but the combination of : healing factor, indestructible skeleton, and sharp indestructible claws means he's a nightmare to any brawler type hero. We're not arguing who's better suited to fight bricks in general. We're talking about that particular fight. And I dont see Wolverine bringing anything to the table that made any kind of difference for the outcome of the battle. Not more than Spider-man that's for sure..

Dum Dum Dugan

Originally posted by SamZED
Ow yay. He has adamantium claws so he managed so scratch Wreckers back. SUCH a huge factor that was, hell desided the outcome of the entire fight. roll eyes (sarcastic)

Spider-man's distractions were way more effective in that fight then making a cheap shot and getting BFRed twice second time into a dumpster. Wolverine could've as well stayed home, nothing would've changed. Spider-man's distractions is what made all the attacks possible.
I disagree. Wolverine actually did pretty significant damage with his attack.

Also it was spiderwoman who allowed them to win.

Dum Dum Dugan

Originally posted by SamZED
We're not arguing who's better suited to fight bricks in general. We're talking about that particular fight. And I dont see Wolverine bringing anything to the table that made any kind of difference for the outcome of the battle. Not more than Spider-man that's for sure..
Niether did much of anything in terms of being relevent in the victory.

zopzop

@SamZED

Dude Wolverine was completely unhurt and actually causing Wrecker to scream in pain while drawing blood. The Wrecker had to BFR him and even that didn't work.

Wolverine came back a few minutes later and tore into Wrecker again. It was shown on panel that Wolverine can hurt Wrecker....badly. IF, and notice I said IF, Wolverine slashed the Wrecker's eyes, slashed his throat, or jammed his claws into the Wrecker's heart, the Wrecker would be dead or maimed no?

Spider-man only hurt Wrecker by slamming a tricycle on his skull roll eyes (sarcastic)

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by SamZED
Ow yay. He has adamantium claws so he managed so scratch Wreckers back. SUCH a huge factor that was, hell desided the outcome of the entire fight. roll eyes (sarcastic)

Spider-man's distractions were way more effective in that fight then making a cheap shot and getting BFRed twice second time into a dumpster.

No, but him cutting the shit out of Garthwaite near the end was quite a significant factor.

Parker's distractions allowed NA to do what exactly? Luke to love-tap Wrecker and Veranke to tickle him with a venom blast?

It's not a BFR when you get back to the battlefield under your own power.

Originally posted by SamZED
Wolverine could've as well stayed home, nothing would've changed. Spider-man's distractions is what made all the attacks possible.

The worst part is that you actually believe it.

Parmaniac

Originally posted by zopzop
Judging by those scans, and ONLY those scans, Wolverine and Cage at least drew blood. That's more than Spider-man did during that fight.

Wrecker did not hurt Wolverine at all, BFRing for a few minutes isn't exactly that impressive. Wolverine, however, tore him up. What would have happened if those were the Wrecker's eyes or his spinal cord? Dead or paralyzed Wrecker, is what.

I can't stand Wolverine, he's over exposed, but the combination of : healing factor, indestructible skeleton, and sharp indestructible claws means he's a nightmare to any brawler type hero. Where did Cage drew blood? Wolverine by slashing and SW by hitting him with his crowbar and his lip was bleeding big deal. Spider-man was hitting his head and hurted him.

Because Wrecker wasn't really fighting Wolverine he threw him away like a pest. Ironically Wolverine attacked his spine and did nothing more than a scratch and wasn't even able to hit him without proper distraction from someone else on the team.

The fight is pretty pathetic for someone who is well known as a Brick Buster tbh.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by zopzop
@SamZED

Dude Wolverine was completely unhurt and actually causing Wrecker to scream in pain while drawing blood. The Wrecker had to BFR him and even that didn't work.

Wolverine came back a few minutes later and tore into Wrecker again. It was shown on panel that Wolverine can hurt Wrecker....badly. IF, and notice I said IF, Wolverine slashed the Wrecker's eyes, slashed his throat, or jammed his claws into the Wrecker's heart, the Wrecker would be dead or maimed no?

Spider-man only hurt Wrecker by slamming a tricycle on his skull roll eyes (sarcastic)

He tore Wrecker's jaw on another occasion, causing him to fall and drop the crowbar.

zopzop

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Where did Cage drew blood?

When he punched him in the face? Look at his face after Cage punched him and before Wolverine came back from his little trip. His lip and nose are bloodied.

Parmaniac

Originally posted by zopzop
When he punched him in the face? Look at his face after Cage punched him and before Wolverine came back from his little trip. His lip and nose are bloodied. Cool unfortunately that's not blood just saliva and on the following panels there was no blood in his face.

EDIT: Maybe it is blood later there are weird drops in his face but that's highly arguable.

zopzop

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Cool unfortunately that's not blood just saliva and on the following panels there was no blood in his face.

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/newavengers8_p11.jpg

Red saliva running down a nostril and clinging the side of his mouth?

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/newavengers8_p16-17.jpg

Red saliva dripping from a nostril?

So it was red saliva that was seeping from the wounds Logan was inflicting too?

Parmaniac

Originally posted by zopzop
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/newavengers8_p11.jpg

Red saliva running down a nostril and clinging the side of his mouth?

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/newavengers8_p16-17.jpg

Red saliva dripping from a nostril?

So it was red saliva that was seeping from the wounds Logan was inflicting too? It's not red it's black and even if, fine he drew blood Cage is what now? Class 100? Bendis wrote him like that hell I wouldn't be suprised if he would have soloed the Wrecker.

zopzop

Originally posted by Parmaniac
It's not red it's black and even if, fine he drew blood Cage is what now? Class 100? Bendis wrote him like that hell I wouldn't be suprised if he would have soloed the Wrecker.

Nah, Wrecker owned Cage. But Cage at least hit him hard enough to hurt him and draw blood. Wrecker would have killed Cage if he was solo.

Parmaniac

Originally posted by zopzop
Nah, Wrecker owned Cage. But Cage at least hit him hard enough to hurt him and draw blood. Wrecker would have killed Cage if he was solo. Yeah but my point is Cage under Bendis' pen went up the ladder he had retarded strength feats like lifting a big fat fully loaded truck and jogging it to a meeting point with no effort, he thunderclapped and has done one of these Hulk jumps, he jumped on a 3 or 4 story building from the street with a single leap. Let him draw blood on Wrecker no biggy. Or he jumped out of the Avengers tower onto the street with no harm at all.

StiltmanFTW

Parmaniac

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Didn't he own Dirk later in NA series? Smashed him with some car or something. Tbf, Strange distracted him. Maybe, I can't remember anything like that though. I wouldn't be suprised though the whole Wrecking Crew became pretty lame, nothing of the NA7 Issue was left in Wrecker when the Dark Reign started they became lame (and stupid, considering that 2 (?) of them are actual scientists) henchmen of the Hood, ironically a bunch of other lame Z-list villains got revamped pretty cool in Dark Reign Punisher.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Maybe, I can't remember anything like that though. I wouldn't be suprised though the whole Wrecking Crew became pretty lame, nothing of the NA7 Issue was left in Wrecker when the Dark Reign started they became lame (and stupid, considering that 2 (?) of them are actual scientists) henchmen of the Hood, ironically a bunch of other lame Z-list villains got revamped pretty cool in Dark Reign Punisher.

You want me to look for the issue?

Only Thunderball is. Crew always liked to job.

SamZED

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Niether did much of anything in terms of being relevent in the victory. That's what I said. Stilt here thinks Logan won the fight all by himself.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
No, but him cutting the shit out of Garthwaite near the end was quite a significant factor.

Parker's distractions allowed NA to do what exactly? Luke to love-tap Wrecker and Veranke to tickle him with a venom blast?

It's not a BFR when you get back to the battlefield under your own power.

The worst part is that you actually believe it. That's not the worst. Your attempts to prove that Wolverine is better than Spider-man in every possible way is. And you use some kind of twisted A>B>C logic to do it. And that logic works both ways. For example, where was Logan when heroes fought the upgraded Daredevil? Was resting under a column, while Spider-man did all the work. By your logic that makes him what? Inferior?
Again, what Wolverine did during the fight with Wrecker had nothing to do with the outcome of the fight.

Originally posted by zopzop
@SamZED

Dude Wolverine was completely unhurt and actually causing Wrecker to scream in pain while drawing blood. The Wrecker had to BFR him and even that didn't work.

Wolverine came back a few minutes later and tore into Wrecker again. It was shown on panel that Wolverine can hurt Wrecker....badly. IF, and notice I said IF, Wolverine slashed the Wrecker's eyes, slashed his throat, or jammed his claws into the Wrecker's heart, the Wrecker would be dead or maimed no?

Spider-man only hurt Wrecker by slamming a tricycle on his skull roll eyes (sarcastic)

You make it sound as if it was a tough battle. HAD to bfr Wolverine? He didnt HAVE to bfr him, he simply tossed him away, he treated him as minor annoyance, same as he treated everybody else on the team. As for not being hurt, he has a HF to take care of that. So what? Yes, Wolverine can cause major damage to wrecker, key point - he didnt. Making what he did no more uselfull than what Spider-man did. Wolverine drew blood, Spider-man provided distraction allowing fake Spider Woman and Luke to get their hits in, and webbed him up in the end. But it was the Skrull who made the real difference.

Parmaniac

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
You want me to look for the issue?

Only Thunderball is. Crew always liked to job.
Nah not necessary, if it was Bendis Cage did it IIRC Spider-man once said Cage stalemated Galactus or something.

Yeah but I hoped after NA7 that at least for a while they would have their moments like against the Defenders *points at KMs Respect Thread* usually I always liked the Crew, perfect for double paged action loaded issues, like in Hulk recently.

Parmaniac

I wonder if we can still use feats of several heroes cause of Secret Invasion.

I mean it will be a pain in the ass picking out useable feats by determining when the undermining started.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by SamZED
That's what I said. Stilt here thinks Logan won the fight all by himself.

You came to that conclusion by me saying that he was a big factor in that fight?

Originally posted by SamZED
That's not the worst. Your attempts to prove that Wolverine is better than Spider-man in every possible way is. And you use some kind of twisted A>B>C logic to do it. And that logic works both ways. For example, where was Logan when heroes fought the upgraded Daredevil? Was resting under a column, while Spider-man did all the work. By your logic that makes him what? Inferior?
Again, what Wolverine did during the fight with Wrecker had nothing to do with the outcome of the fight.

Thing is, it wasn't the first time Parker screwed up against Garthwaite. Beating the shit out of Parker is Wrecker's hobby he does when he wants to forget about Thor and relax.

Nothing? Lol? Him making Wrecker drop his crowbar had nothing to do with the outcome of the fight?

SuperiorTech

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Yeah but my point is Cage under Bendis' pen went up the ladder he had retarded strength feats like lifting a big fat fully loaded truck and jogging it to a meeting point with no effort, he thunderclapped and has done one of these Hulk jumps, he jumped on a 3 or 4 story building from the street with a single leap. Let him draw blood on Wrecker no biggy. Or he jumped out of the Avengers tower onto the street with no harm at all.

I use to argue with people claiming that Bendis wanked cage I agreed that he give him a lot of spotlight but if you look at his original mini where he got his upgrade and Heroes for Hire v2 right after he had lot of high end feats stuff I would argue were on the same level or better than what he was doing when Bendis got his hands on him.

I am talking about the early stuff what he has Cage doing now is pretty ridiculous no way to really defend it.Then again Cage has never been written constantly even when he was at his original strength.One time his has his hands full with the like of Montain Marko next minute he damaging Iron-man's armor and punching holes in Dooms.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Nah not necessary, if it was Bendis Cage did it IIRC Spider-man once said Cage stalemated Galactus or something.

Yeah but I hoped after NA7 that at least for a while they would have their moments like against the Defenders *points at KMs Respect Thread* usually I always liked the Crew, perfect for double paged action loaded issues, like in Hulk recently.

Yea it was Bendis.

Well, Dirk no-sold (upgraded) IF's punch... and shrugged off Bendispower Clint's attacks, then owned him.

In Suicide Kings they weren't bad either.

You're talking about Let the Battle Begin one-shot? Bulldozer finally got his five minutes...

Parmaniac

Nah I wasn't refering to an apperance of teh Crew in a Hulk book just comparing them with Hulk cause he has these action loaded issues on very constant base but now where you mention it that fight was fun it was the same issue where Hulk used Thor's hammer to shove his face in wasn't it? Ah pure gold for Rage of Olympus laughing out loud

SamZED

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW

Nothing? Lol? Him making Wrecker drop his crowbar had nothing to do with the outcome of the fight? Owes it all to the pheromones. If it wasnt for them he would've been bfred again, but this time into Australia.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Thing is, it wasn't the first time Parker screwed up against Garthwaite. Beating the shit out of Parker is Wrecker's hobby he does when he wants to forget about Thor and relax. So? PISless Wrecker is a beast, a team wrecker and that very fight made it clear that both Spider-man and Wolverine have no buiseness fighting him 1 on 1. And even then Spider-man put up a fight against the wrecking crew on few occasions all by himself. So I ask again, what's your point? Logan's claws can cut him so he's the champon of everyone? Stilt, if I ever start to hate Wolverine its gonna be your fault. And if the day when I start to hate Wolverine ever comes I swear I'll find you and stab with a spoon.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Nah I wasn't refering to an apperance of teh Crew in a Hulk book just comparing them with Hulk cause he has these action loaded issues on very constant base but now where you mention it that fight was fun it was the same issue where Hulk used Thor's hammer to shove his face in wasn't it? Ah pure gold for Rage of Olympus laughing out loud

Yep. I bet Rage still has nightmares.

What really cracked me up was what Hulk did to Wrecker...

http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/1830/hltbb.jpg

Parmaniac

I don't even want to know what Wrecker did with Hulk off panel over the years "You teach Hulk good" laughing out loud

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by SamZED
Owes it all to the pheromones. If it wasnt for them he would've been bfred again, but this time into Australia.

Maybe. Maybe not. But I never said Veranke's role in that fight wasn't important or even crucial.

Originally posted by SamZED
So? PISless Wrecker is a beast, a team wrecker and that very fight made it clear that both Spider-man and Wolverine have no buiseness fighting him 1 on 1. And even then Spider-man put up a fight against the wrecking crew on few occasions all by himself. So I ask again, what's your point? Logan's claws can cut him so he's the champon of everyone? Stilt, if I ever start to hate Wolverine its gonna be your fault. And if the day when I start to hate Wolverine ever comes I swear I'll find you and stab with a spoon.

He was doing great, but NA kept coming at him...

My point? You said the only factor in that fight was Skrull Queen and I disagreed. I disagreed because if that were true she'd handle Wrecker herself.

Fact: Wolverine with his soul being intact appeared to make short work of Wrecker.

My beer gut will protect me, I believe.

SamZED

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Maybe. Maybe not. But I never said Veranke's role in that fight wasn't important or even crucial.

He was doing great, but NA kept coming at him...

My point? You said the only factor in that fight was Skrull Queen and I disagreed. I disagreed because if that were true she'd handle Wrecker herself.

Fact: Wolverine with his soul being intact appeared to make short work of Wrecker.

My beer gut will protect me, I believe. If that's your point, im not gonna argue. Heck, i'll admitt I was wrong. It was a team effort.

But when you start with the "character A did better against charact C than character B did against character C is a proof that character A is >>> character B" things are gonna get ugly.

You were warned.

http://img806.imageshack.us/img806/4194/spoon.png
stick out tongue

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by SamZED
If that's your point, im not gonna argue. Heck, i'll admitt I was wrong.

But when you start with the "character A did better against charact C than character B did against character C is a proof that character A is >>> character B" things are gonna get ugly.

You were warned.

http://img806.imageshack.us/img806/4194/spoon.png
stick out tongue

It's like congratulating only the one who became a mother and ignoring the obvious "contribution" from her man.

Veranke got DVP'd by Logan and Cage and thus we have a newborn baby (Wrecker). No DNA tests, so both guys are considered his dad. Is my point clear now? stick out tongue

SamZED

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
It's like congratulating only the one who became a mother and ignoring the obvious "contribution" from her man.

Veranke got DVP'd by Logan and Cage and thus we have a newborn baby (Wrecker). No DNA tests, so both guys are considered his dad. Is my point clear now? stick out tongue

But this is not Spidey/Wolverine thread. I'm not trying to make a legitimate argument for that battle in this thread. Just feeling happy for Parker's failure, nothing more. And I already corrected myself that he immobilized him at the end.

Against my degree of invulnerability you need Tick's spoon.

http://i53.tinypic.com/fof6yx.jpg lol yeah its clear and even makes sense in a weord kind of way..

But breaking a bycicle on someone's head is not a failure, its an auto WIN. Taking a nap under a column, that's a failure miffed

.

And unless you're pre-retconned Beyonder Tick's spoon wont be needed.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by SamZED
lol yeah its clear and even makes sense in a weord kind of way..

But breaking a bycicle on someone's head is not a failure, its an auto WIN. Taking a nap under a column, that's a failure miffed

.

And unless you're pre-retconned Beyonder Tick's spoon wont be needed.

Bendis used to write some good fighting scenes, like that Wrecker battle. He got worse over the years, imo.

True. Settle for an adamantium spoon then.

SamZED

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Bendis used to write some good fighting scenes, like that Wrecker battle. He got worse over the years, imo.

True. Settle for an adamantium spoon then.
Yeah, Bendis is pretty good when he doesnt wank his fav characters,

As for adamantium.. shifty

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFutWATCPg0#t=0m34s (fastforward to 34 seconds)

Parmaniac

Originally posted by SamZED
Yeah, Bendis is pretty good when he doesnt wank his fav characters,

As for adamantium.. shifty

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFutWATCPg0#t=0m34s (fastforward to 34 seconds) Considering taht it's fanmade that's pretty damn good, at least the first part laughing out loud

SamZED

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Considering taht it's fanmade that's pretty damn good, at least the first part laughing out loud

Oh those guys arent amatures, "barelypolitical" is very good. Should see their Batman parodies.

Batman vs Wolverine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1O6EPYYuzLc
Batman pwned http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks8PZ8X6Yo8&feature=relmfu

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by SamZED
Yeah, Bendis is pretty good when he doesnt wank his fav characters,

As for adamantium.. shifty

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFutWATCPg0#t=0m34s (fastforward to 34 seconds)

Not what I mean. He got lazy. Look at Siege or the battle with Apocalypse. Most stuff takes place off-panel.

Can't stand it, too embarassing laughing out loud

I know this channel, watched Batman videos before. Pure gold.

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by SamZED
Its safe to say he was amped. Loki is tough but he's not more durable than Thor or BRB and they both felt Pete's attacks. For the record, Loki wasn't amped. He's just that durable.

SamZED

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Not what I mean. He got lazy. Look at Siege or the battle with Apocalypse. Most stuff takes place off-panel.

Can't stand it, too embarassing laughing out loud

I know this channel, watched Batman videos before. Pure gold. Yeah, the ending of Siege seemed kinda rushed.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
For the record, Loki wasn't amped. He's just that durable. More durable than BRB or Hulk?

cdtm

Originally posted by SamZED
Yeah, the ending of Siege seemed kinda rushed.

More durable than BRB or Hulk?

Guy bounced back from an attack by Surter, amped on the COAW, casually took getting decapitated, schooled Surfer...

So maybe.

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by SamZED
More durable than BRB or Hulk? Savage Hulk has made Spider-Man's punches look equally feeble too when he asserts his durability:

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/th_HulkvsSpiderman74.jpg http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/th_HulkvsSpiderman75.jpg

Spidey knocking Hulk ad Beta Ray Bill off-balance when they're caught off-guard is one thing. But when characters of this class assert their durability, class 20 punches aren't going to do the job. Besides, Loki's taken a barrage of Thor punches/kicks with a snarl, Spidey just isn't in his class.

SamZED

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Savage Hulk has made Spider-Man's punches look equally feeble too when he asserts his durability:

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/th_HulkvsSpiderman74.jpg http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/th_HulkvsSpiderman75.jpg

Spidey knocking Hulk ad Beta Ray Bill off-balance when they're caught off-guard is one thing. But when characters of this class assert their durability, class 20 punches aren't going to do the job. Besides, Loki's taken a barrage of Thor punches/kicks with a snarl, Spidey just isn't in his class. There are at least half a dozen instances where Spider-man's punches effected Hulk when he was ready for them. They didnt do any real damage ofcourse but he could never take them without fliching like Loki did. Im not saying Spider-man should've cracked his ribs or something, but he should've registered them at least.

Originally posted by cdtm
Guy bounced back from an attack by Surter, amped on the COAW, casually took getting decapitated, schooled Surfer...

So maybe. If that's the case ok then. But I could swear ive seen Thor do a lot of damage to Loki with just a couple of punches.

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by SamZED
There are at least half a dozen instances where Spider-man's punches effected Hulk when he was ready for them. They didnt do any real damage ofcourse but he could never take them without fliching like Loki did. Im not saying Spider-man should've cracked his ribs or something, but he should've registered them at least. You need to reread his fights with Spider-Man. Caught off-guard or off-balance (because of Spidey's banter/agility), and Spidey maybe does something. Otherwise, Hulk shrugs them off easily. And he's done that more times than you think (or care to remember):

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/th_HulkvsSpiderman02.jpg http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/th_HulkvsSpiderman20.jpg http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/th_HulkvsSpiderman24.jpg Originally posted by SamZED
If that's the case ok then. But I could swear ive seen Thor do a lot of damage to Loki with just a couple of punches. It's Thor, there's a huge difference.

Parmaniac

Loki is a very versatile legit herals level character what's the big deal here?

Rage.Of.Olympus

I'm pretty sure recently Hercules no sold a barrage from Spider-Man unharmed and Peter hurt his hands.

On the other hand, Parker was managing to hurt Masterson with his blitz. For whatever it's worth though, under DeFalco's pen as well, Dargo Ktor no sold attacks from 2099 Spider-Man and the webslinger hurt himself in the process.

The thing about Masterson is that he can go from being a completely useless whiny little b*tch to a beast depending on how confident he's feeling that day. For example, a blow from Ulik had a significant affect in their first bout, but in their second, it was much less noticeable in terms of damage. Take that as you will.

SamZED

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
You need to reread his fights with Spider-Man. Caught off-guard or off-balance (because of Spidey's banter/agility), and Spidey maybe does something. Otherwise, Hulk shrugs them off easily. And he's done that more times than you think (or care to remember):
.
I remember them pretty well, but I cant be bothered to post every instance where Spider-man's attacks effects class 100 characters because there are literally several dozen examples. And im not talking about "cought off-guard or off-balance" kind of attacks. But here are some examples where class 100 chars clearly feel heal attacks.

http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/5656/feat17fight2vj4.jpg
http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/1396/feat10fight1nu0.jpg
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/6105/feat10fight4yc8.jpg
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/3610/feat11fight1gk6.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/8066/feat11fight2sg9.jpg
http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/3522/feat20fight4mv9.jpg
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/8274/feat33fight6vv0.jpg
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/3589/feat41fight1qs9.jpg
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/3068/feat41fight2jl8.jpg
http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/7456/feat41fight4vn3.jpg
http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/139/feat41fight5tr3.jpg

Once again, I know he can't possibly do any real damage to Loki, but the fact that his attacks couldnt even make him flinch suggest Loki was either amped or it was a poor showing for Spider-man.

SamZED

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Loki is a very versatile legit herals level character what's the big deal here? I know and not saying that his attacks should damage Loki. But at Spider-man's best he should at least register them.

Rage.Of.Olympus

Hold on, wasn't the Loki scene written by JMS? The guy wrote a crazy powerful Spider-Man. I remember in particular the scene where he fought the Gamma Irradiated Mobster who was in Hulk's strength class or whatever. Had him going head to head and everything. Or when he punked Iron Man. I remember loling when he had Peter claim that he had found a way to finally kill the Hulk for good.

Anyways, my point is that I find it highly unlikely that JMS would lowball Spider-Man. It'd be like once in a blue moon, and he certainly wouldn't have made it consistent. Which Spider-Man's inferiority to Loki was.

Parmaniac

Ironically he completely defeated Hulk in the fight that was shown on the Tv screen in the bar.

And no I don't think something like this should happen.

Parmaniac

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I also lol'd when he had Peter claim he had found a way to finally kill the Hulk for good. And what's so funny about it?

Rage.Of.Olympus

It seemed like he was going out of his way to show that Peter could take down the Hulk. I remember counting all the Hulk references at one point. There was like half a dozen I think.

SamZED

Meh I think he was just showing off for MJ.

Parmaniac

The thing is he never said he can choke the life out of Hulk he said something like you said "he found a way", as in creating a device taht drains gamma radiation or something. Considering that he is and always was a genius level intellect character I think it's well in his capabilities.

As for direct confrontations, Hulk should always win (and except for 1 time he always has).

EDIT: In most cases in don't give that much for character statements anyways.

Wolverine was dead serious when he said Spider-man can break his neck and kill him.

Rage.Of.Olympus

Originally posted by SamZED
Meh I think he was just showing off for MJ.

Really? Because if I remember the scene correctly, it had a very serious/grim tone. Earlier on, they discussed it and it was very conflicting IIRC because killing the Hulk meant killing an innocent man.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by Parmaniac
As for direct confrontations, Hulk should always win (and except for 1 time he always has).

You're forgetting about that time when Pete had Captain Universe powers.

Wrecker is Loki's physical superior, ain't he? I mean, why would Loki take his power if he wasn't? Maybe the stats stacked? But I think that would make "Wrecking Loki" superior to Thor and he said that with Dirk's power he was Thor's physical equal...

Rage.Of.Olympus

Loki basically drained the power of the entire Wrecking Crew, adding their physical might to his own so as to even the playing field. Unfortunately, when Thor got enraged/pushed to the edge....it didn't help too much.

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Loki basically drained the power of the entire Wrecking Crew, adding their physical might to his own so as to even the playing field. Unfortunately, when Thor got enraged/pushed to the edge....it didn't help too much.

Thanks, that's what I wanted to know. Crazy feat.

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by SamZED
I remember them pretty well, but I cant be bothered to post every instance where Spider-man's attacks effects class 100 characters because there are literally several dozen examples. And im not talking about "cought off-guard or off-balance" kind of attacks. But here are some examples where class 100 chars clearly feel heal attacks.

http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/5656/feat17fight2vj4.jpg
http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/1396/feat10fight1nu0.jpg
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/6105/feat10fight4yc8.jpg
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/3610/feat11fight1gk6.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/8066/feat11fight2sg9.jpg
http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/3522/feat20fight4mv9.jpg
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/8274/feat33fight6vv0.jpg
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/3589/feat41fight1qs9.jpg
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/3068/feat41fight2jl8.jpg
http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/7456/feat41fight4vn3.jpg
http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/139/feat41fight5tr3.jpg

Once again, I know he can't possibly do any real damage to Loki, but the fact that his attacks couldnt even make him flinch suggest Loki was either amped or it was a poor showing for Spider-man. Reread those scans again, because the vast majority of them involve Spider-Man attacking while the opponent is off guard or off-balance. Look at the first one you posted even. Hulk lunged for Peter, missed and hasn't even gained a solid footing yet by the third panel, which is exactly when Spidey jump kicks him -- and didn't do any damage. Amped Professor Hulk is lashing out and not trying to soak punches. Every single one of the last four involves either Spidey hitting Masterson from behind, or kicking/punching him when he's trying to talk him down or help him, or using his agility to keep him off-balance.

That is exactly what I'm talking about.

And Loki wasn't amped. He didn't have anything to amp him in the entire storyline. Any suggestion to the contrary is misinformation.

SamZED

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Really? Because if I remember the scene correctly, it had a very serious/grim tone. Earlier on, they discussed it and it was very conflicting IIRC because killing the Hulk meant killing an innocent man. Well, if we're being serious.. give Spider-man enough time and enough resources he should be able to easilly get rid of Hulk for good. Reed should be able to do that with 3 minutes prep. PIS/CIS is the only thing stoppig him.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Reread those scans again, because the vast majority of them involve Spider-Man attacking while the opponent is off guard or off-balance. Look at the first one you posted even. Hulk lunged for Peter, missed and hasn't even gained a solid footing yet by the third panel, which is exactly when Spidey jump kicks him -- and didn't do any damage. Amped Professor Hulk is lashing out and not trying to soak punches. Every single one of the last four involves either Spidey hitting Masterson from behind, or kicking/punching him when he's trying to talk him down or help him, or using his agility to keep him off-balance.

That is exactly what I'm talking about.

And Loki wasn't amped. He didn't have anything to amp him in the entire storyline. Any suggestion to the contrary is misinformation. I honestly dont get how can you look at all those scans and say they all involve Hulk being unbalanced or not ready or whatever. The first scan, yeah Ill give you that. Maybe. Even there he saw it coming and was ready for it, they were in the middle of a fight. As for the rest of the scans, most of them just show Spider-man punch hard enough to make them flinch or move from the attack. Same with Masterson, there's no "context" to excuse the attacks clearly having some effect. And as I said those are just few out of many many scans where Spider-man proved he can punch hard enough for class 100 to at least register the attacks. But Loki taking his punches that way.. even if its not an amp then its definitely a poor showing for Spider-man compared to his average ones and not counting his best ones..

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by SamZED
I honestly dont get how can you look at all those scans and say they all involve Hulk being unbalanced or not ready or whatever. The first scan, yeah Ill give you that. Maybe. Even there he saw it coming and was ready for it, they were in the middle of a fight. As for the rest of the scans, most of them just show Spider-man punch hard enough to make them flinch or move from the attack. Same with Masterson, there's no "context" to excuse the attacks clearly having some effect. And as I said those are just few out of many many scans where Spider-man proved he can punch hard enough for class 100 to at least register the attacks. But Loki taking his punches that way.. even if its not an amp then its definitely a poor showing for Spider-man compared to his average ones and not counting his best ones.. Is Hulk off-balance from just having sailed across a room (his left foot isn't even planted)? Yes. Was Spider-Man leaping in and out of an enraged Professor Hulk who was mindlessly flailing around? Yes. Was Masterson kicked from behind? Yes. Was Masterson rushing over to help Spider-Man and unexpectedly but received a punch to the face (Eric's own fault, but still)? Yes. Was Masterson kept off balance from Spider-Man's attack/agility style? Yes.

It wasn't a low showing by Spidey. Spider-Man isn't in their class. And when these characters assert their durability and soak up punches without being caught off-guard or off-balance, his attacks are mere nuisances.

zopzop

Holy crap, Spider-man almost pulled a "Firelord win" vs Masterson Thor, till Thor let loose with that thunderblast. Kinda hard to deny he was hurting him, Masterson Thor said so on panel.

Loki was probably "amped" by his own magics, that could be one way to explain it. Because physically I don't think he's in Thor or Hulk's league.

Stupid inconsistencies in comics......... confused

StiltmanFTW

Stupid Spider-man.

zopzop

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Stupid Spider-man.

LOL laughing

Give him some credit smile

He tries to hold his own vs physically superior opponents and does OK, but he's no Wolverine!

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by zopzop
Holy crap, Spider-man almost pulled a "Firelord win" vs Masterson Thor, till Thor let loose with that thunderblast. Kinda hard to deny he was hurting him, Masterson Thor said so on panel.

Loki was probably "amped" by his own magics, that could be one way to explain it. Because physically I don't think he's in Thor or Hulk's league.

Stupid inconsistencies in comics......... confused

Fact that it bore such a resemblance to SMvFL is an indication of its overall worth.

Loki wasn't amped. There is no inconsistency as beings on this level who aren't caught off-guard or off-balance treat Spidey's blows like nuisances. Loki can survive being battered by an amped Seth, take a torrential beatdown from Thor's fists with a snarl, shrug off Mandarin's blasts as easily. Loki is not physically weak.

SamZED

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Is Hulk off-balance from just having sailed across a room (his left foot isn't even planted)? Yes. Yes, ok. I can agree about this scan.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Was Spider-Man leaping in and out of an enraged Professor Hulk who was mindlessly flailing around? Yes. Was Masterson kicked from behind? Yes. Was Masterson rushing over to help Spider-Man and unexpectedly but received a punch to the face (Eric's own fault, but still)? Yes. Was Masterson kept off balance from Spider-Man's attack/agility style? Yes. No to all. That's like saying Tyson knocked me down because he was moving around me to fast or counterattacked me while I was trying to hit him, otherwise I would've taken the punch no problem. Hulk was attacking, Masterson tried to fight back. And yet Spider-man's punches/kicks clearly had effect on them. The fact that he was moving, using his agility or attacking while they were trying to throw a punch doesnt make it any less legit, that's how all fights go. Otherwise one could use that same logic for any other fight. Not to mention I can post a dozen more exampes.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0

It wasn't a low showing by Spidey. Spider-Man isn't in their class. And when these characters assert their durability and soak up punches without being caught off-guard or off-balance, his attacks are mere nuisances. Ofcourse he's not in their class, I never said he is and admitted he cant do any real damage to them. But he doesnt have to be in their class to make a class 100 feel his attacks. The Loki example is not a rule but an exception.

SamZED

My point exactly. Its either that "amp" or (since there's no proof) a low showing, because he does that ALL the time. And if the looks on their faces isnt enough, in some of those instances characters he fights admit he hurt them on panel. No way around it.

StiltmanFTW

Sam...

1:00 - 1:05 (Elrond's line)

5w8yWQwHSaI

SamZED

For some reason it wont work for me. sad

StiltmanFTW

Direct link maybe?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5w8yWQwHSaI

zopzop

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Fact that it bore such a resemblance to SMvFL is an indication of its overall worth.

Firelord could have killed Spider-man at anytime by using an omni-directional blast and admitted it on panel. But there was no "honor" in that. Eric had no qualms about unleashing such a blast. Hence Firelord lost, but Eric fended Spider-man off.

By "amped" by his magics, I didn't mean he was using some outside force or plot device, I merely meant he did something with his magic and that's it. Like when he survived being beheaded by Baldur.

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by SamZED
No to all. That's like saying Tyson knocked me down because he was moving around me to fast or counterattacked me while I was trying to hit him, otherwise I would've taken the punch no problem. Hulk was attacking, Masterson tried to fight back. And yet Spider-man's punches/kicks clearly had effect on them. The fact that he was moving, using his agility or attacking while they were trying to throw a punch doesnt make it any less legit, that's how all fights go. Otherwise one could use that same logic for any other fight. Not to mention I can post a dozen more exampes.What. The. Hell. How is Spider-Man ambushing Masterson Thor with a jump-kick from behind NOT catching him off-guard? How is Spider-Man punching Masterson Thor unexpectedly when he's only trying to help NOT catching him off-guard? This is ridiculous. Spidey bounces around with his agility to keep people off-balance. I don't even know why I'm arguing this. He can't go toe to toe with Hulk or Thor or Loki. He's tried, he's ineffective. Originally posted by SamZED
Ofcourse he's not in their class, I never said he is and admitted he cant do any real damage to them. But he doesnt have to be in their class to make a class 100 feel his attacks. The Loki example is not a rule but an exception. It's the comic. And it's happened often. And there is a completely viable and cogent explanation for it. Deal with it however you like.Originally posted by zopzop
Firelord could have killed Spider-man at anytime by using an omni-directional blast and admitted it on panel. But there was no "honor" in that. Eric had no qualms about unleashing such a blast. Hence Firelord lost, but Eric fended Spider-man off.

By "amped" by his magics, I didn't mean he was using some outside force or plot device, I merely meant he did something with his magic and that's it. Like when he survived being beheaded by Baldur. SPvFL is PIS.

Loki's shrugged off Extremis Iron Man punches, Stormbreaker shots to the chin, etc. all immediately. He's wrecked buildings with a single punch. Loki's not physically weak. Loki's never increased his durability via magic. And projecting that onto the scene is wholly needless.

zopzop

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
SPvFL is PIS.

How is it PIS, he was about to repeat it on Eric/Thor but Eric/Thor went ahead and omniblasted, unlike Firelord. Face it, Eric/Thor was about to go down till he nuked.

Loki is a premier magic user, you don't think he uses his powers to enhance his physical stats?

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by zopzop
How is it PIS, he was about to repeat it on Eric/Thor but Eric/Thor went ahead and omniblasted, unlike Firelord. Face it, Eric/Thor was about to go down till he nuked.SPvFL is PIS. Masterson Thor was also given the worst loss of his career by Loki. Masterson Thor =/= Thor. Originally posted by zopzop
Loki is a premier magic user, you don't think he uses his powers to enhance his physical stats? For size-shifting, yes. He wasn't size-shifting there. If he does it on-panel, I'm not going to question it.

I'm not going to assume that's what he did when there's no indication he did it, no evidence he's done it ever, and the durability feat is in line with his past ones and Spider-Man's helplessness is consistent with foes of this level who aren't caught off-guard or off-balance.

SamZED

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
What. The. Hell. How is Spider-Man ambushing Masterson Thor with a jump-kick from behind NOT catching him off-guard? How is Spider-Man punching Masterson Thor unexpectedly when he's only trying to help NOT catching him off-guard? This is ridiculous. Spidey bounces around with his agility to keep people off-balance. I don't even know why I'm arguing this. He can't go toe to toe with Hulk or Thor or Loki. He's tried, he's ineffective. "What the hell" exactly. Does this look like a kick from behind? (second scan)
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/3589/feat41fight1qs9.jpg
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/3068/feat41fight2jl8.jpg
Masterson sees Spider-man, he's warned that Spider-man is about to attack. The fact that he didnt want to fight doesnt change the fact that he was READY for the attack as Spider-man pretty much announced he's about to attack. And it still both hurt and dropped him off his feet. You're making up some kind of context that just isnt there. Hulk attacks, Spider-man jumps and punches him in the face. It makes Hulk cringe and cause his head to turn around. That's all there is. No context or explanation. And there are dozen of simillar examples. You cant chulk them all up to not being ready or being off-balance.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0

It's the comic. And it's happened often. And there is a completely viable and cogent explanation for it. Deal with it however you like. Ill start by not pretending that there's some kind of explanation that really isnt there. Call them how I see them. http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/1396/feat10fight1nu0.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/8066/feat11fight2sg9.jpg
A kick to the face, Hulk feels it. Not damaged, but FEELS it. That's 100% clear from the scan. Dont see a reason why Loki shouldnt feel it at all.

Rage.Of.Olympus

Fun fact: Masterson Thor vs. Spider-Man and Firelord vs. Spider-Man were both written by the same guy, DeFalco.

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by SamZED
"What the hell" exactly. Does this look like a kick from behind? (second scan)
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/3589/feat41fight1qs9.jpg
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/3068/feat41fight2jl8.jpg
Masterson sees Spider-man, he's warned that Spider-man is about to attack. The fact that he didnt want to fight doesnt change the fact that he was READY for the attack as Spider-man pretty much announced he's about to attack. And it still both hurt and dropped him off his feet. You're making up some kind of context that just isnt there. Hulk attacks, Spider-man jumps and punches him in the face. It makes Hulk cringe and cause his head to turn around. That's all there is. No context or explanation. And there are dozen of simillar examples. You cant chulk them all up to not being ready or being off-balance. I have no idea what kind of footing or stance Masterson Thor had prior to that second jump kick. And neither do you. He's still trying to reason with Spider-Man. He continues to reason with him and still doesn't expect Spider-Man to punch him when he tries to assist him later on. So Masterson being totally prepared and not possibly being caught off-guard or off-balance after the initial hit is garbage. Masterson was being dense in that fight. His own fault. Originally posted by SamZED
Ill start by not pretending that there's some kind of explanation that really isnt there. Call them how I see them. http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/1396/feat10fight1nu0.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/8066/feat11fight2sg9.jpg
A kick to the face, Hulk feels it. Not damaged, but FEELS it. Dont see a reason why Loki shouldnt. Right. Somehow, Loki amped himself off-panel is you not pretending that there's some kind of explanation there really isn't there.

I'm sorry you can't accept that Spider-Man can use his spider-agility to keep a rampaging mindless Hulk off-balance or a dumb-as-bricks Masterson Thor off-balance. Because we certainly see when Spider-Man has failed to even budge Savage Hulk and Loki and Incredible Hercules among others when they assert their durability and aren't off-guard or off-balance.

Half your scans proved my point exactly. The other half you just can't admit that Spider-Man uses his agility to keep bricks off-balance. If you think that's beyond his capabilities, that's your issue, not mine.

SamZED

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Fun fact: Masterson Thor vs. Spider-Man and Firelord vs. Spider-Man were both written by the same guy, DeFalco. I know Firelord is not the most popular fight, its a definition of PIS on this forum. But if you've read it its not all bad. The fight laster for how long 3 issues? Firelord was holding back, Spider-man punched him several hundred times after dropping a building on his head, getting him ran over by a train and blowing him up twice. Compared to soe PIS moments like BP's armbarring Surfer, ts not that bad. Not to mention not the only example.

Parmaniac

zopzop

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Yeah when I reason with people I also usually raise a hammer and run towards them.

laughing

Priceless

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Yeah when I reason with people I also usually raise a hammer and run towards them. Yeah, when I'm totally prepared to beat the crap out of someone I also usually scream, "My what-? B-but we're not--!" or "No! Wait--! You don't under--"

SamZED

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I have no idea what kind of footing or stance Masterson Thor had prior to that second jump kick. And neither do you. He's still trying to reason with Spider-Man. He continues to reason with him and still doesn't expect Spider-Man to punch him when he tries to assist him later on. So Masterson being totally prepared and not possibly being caught off-guard or off-balance after the initial hit is garbage. Masterson was being dense in that fight. His own fault. Right. Somehow, Loki amped himself off-panel is you not pretending that there's some kind of explanation there really isn't there.

I'm sorry you can't accept that Spider-Man can use his spider-agility to keep a rampaging mindless Hulk off-balance or a dumb-as-bricks Masterson Thor. Because we certainly see when Spider-Man has failed to even budge Savage Hulk and Loki and Incredible Hercules among others when they assert their durability and aren't off-guard or off-balance. Man, seriously? The stance? We have a scan where Masterson is ready for the attack, Spider-man kicks him and he falls and admits it hurt. Its all there, but you refuse to accept it because you doubt his footing or stance? How the hell should it be drawn and how many times mentioned on panel for you to see that the attack simply hurt him? Because this "we dont know what footing he had" can be used to excuse every punch in comicbook history. And please read my posts, I said either amped OR (since there's no evidence of amp) more likely just a low showing for Spider-man, and since 95% of the time he hits class 100 characters (including Hulk, Thor, Surfer and many many others) they feel it, its safe to say its a low showing.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Yeah when I reason with people I also usually raise a hammer and run towards them. laughing

And then try to take their head off with a hit.
http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/7456/feat41fight4vn3.jpg

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by SamZED
Man, seriously? The stance? We have a scan where Masterson is ready for the attack, Spider-man kicks him and he falls and admits it hurt. Its all there, but you refuse to accept it because you doubt his footing or stance? How the hell should it be drawn and how many times mentioned on panel for you to see that the attack simply hurt him? Because this "we dont know what footing he had" can be used to excuse every punch in comicbook history. And please read my posts, I said either amped OR (since there's no evidence of amp) more likely just a low showing for Spider-man, and since 95% of the time he hits class 100 characters (including Hulk, Thor, Surfer and many many others) they feel it, its safe to say its a low showing.You have no idea what Masterson's stance is at the beginning of the next comic. I know you want the first page of the next comic to literally be the next panel. But considering he's swinging in on a webline and he hasn't spun one in the last panel of the previous comic, we have no idea what happened between them. The fact that Masterson wasn't ready for Spider-Man's sucker-punch later on already proves he's got no heart for the fight.

95%? When half the scans are sucker-shots and the other half he's bounding around with agility? Whatever. Originally posted by SamZED
laughing

And then try to take their head off with a hit.
http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/7456/feat41fight4vn3.jpg He's lashing out as a consequence of being sucker-punched. You would too. That's why he says, "CUT THAT OUT! I'm only trying to help you!" Stop pretending like Masterson was legitimately fighting Spider-Man hard.

Mindset

Spiderman phucked him up.

Parmaniac

If you put so much importance into his words/thoughts read what he says/thinks on this page
http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/139/feat41fight5tr3.jpg

(last 4 panels) adresses pretty much everything

Mindset

awwwwwwwwwww snap

SamZED

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
You have no idea what Masterson's stance is at the beginning of the next comic. I know you want the first page of the next comic to literally be the next panel. But considering he's swinging in on a webline and he hasn't spun one in the last panel of the previous comic, we have no idea what happened between them. The fact that Masterson wasn't ready for Spider-Man's sucker-punch later on already proves he's got no heart for the fight.

95%? When half the scans are sucker-shots and the other half he's bounding around with agility? Whatever. He's lashing out as a consequence of being sucker-punched. You would too. That's why he says, "CUT THAT OUT! I'm only trying to help you!" Stop pretending like Masterson was legitimately fighting Spider-Man hard. Yes is the case in 95% of the time, there are half a dozen Spider-man respect threads and dozen upon dozen fights against class 100 bricks, see for yourself. Fighting or not doesnt effect his durability especially if he's ready for the attack. And especially when Spider-man announces "IM TAKING YOU DOWN" before attacking. But seriously, whatever man. I dont need nor want to argue. I have the scans that show all these class 100 characters get hurt by Spider-man's punches even though they're ready for them. There's no denying it and no amount of "they were off-balance" and "he was using his agility" or "we dont know what footing he had" excuses will change that they CLEARLY felt his attacks. Fact.

Parmaniac

I'm not arguing the Loki scene or anything just that it's obvious that Spider-mans hurted Masterson even if the stuff you claim is true which I personally doubt the last 4 panels make all of this null and void.

He says he wants to hit him but can't grab him and before he smacks the ground he says he has no other choice or Spider-man would knock him out.

Just for the record I'm not giving SM a single win over Masterson on the forum just summerizing what apparently happens on panel.

zopzop

Originally posted by Mindset
awwwwwwwwwww snap Originally posted by Mindset
Spiderman phucked him up.

LOL stop instigating. laughing

OneDumbG0

Originally posted by SamZED
Fighting or not doesnt effect his durability especially if he's ready for the attack. Right. So you show me scans of him hitting people from behind or off-balance. Fine job.

If you're expecting it and bracing, some 5 yr old isn't going to be pushing you back with their pinky. If you've only got one foot on the ground, they are going to push you. If you don't know where they're pushing, because he's got spider-agility and is bouncing all around you and you can't even track him, they are going to push you.

Same concept. The idea that Spider-Man can't keep a brick off-balance is retarded. The idea that Loki, Thor, Hulk, Herc can't brace and remain unbudged is retarded. The idea that neither of those two things could happen in comics (even when it does happen on-panel) is double-dip retarded.

SamZED

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Right. So you show me scans of him hitting people from behind or off-balance. Fine job.

If you're expecting it and bracing, some 5 yr old isn't going to be pushing you back with their pinky. If you've only got one foot on the ground, they are going to push you. If you don't know where they're pushing, because he's got spider-agility and is bouncing all around you and you can't even track him, they are going to push you.

Same concept. The idea that Spider-Man can't keep a brick off-balance is retarded. The idea that Loki, Thor, Hulk, Herc can't brace and remain unbudged is retarded. The idea that neither of those two things could happen in comics (even when it does happen on-panel) is double-dip retarded. I showed you 8 scans of him hitting class 100 bricks, them cringing, being pushed and even outright admitting it hurt. I posted those scans and there are dozen more posted in respect threads. I got that backing me up. You got your doubts about footing, stance and other retarded excuses that controdict on-panel evidence of them clearly feeling the hits. thumb up

Yeah, think im gonna go with low showing for the Loki incident.

Badabing

Stiltman, your little hissy fits and protests are noted as is your dislike for all things Spider-Man. But a spite thread is a spite thread regardless. Mods can only close threads they happen to see, which are reported or if a poster sends a PM.

I thought my message was clear enough when I closed your last spite/bait thread, but I guess not. Your next attempt to make some sort of misguided point by creating a spite/bait thread will result in a warning.

Closed.