Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Fight on Apokolips.

No BFR.

Who wins?

You already know where this is going...

Hmm...

Given that Darkseid can control the path the Omega Effect travels, and he's likely strong enough to grapple with Thor and not submit, I say Thor gets Omega beams to the grillpiece more times than not.

Get mad Rage.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_gwkPKDdORFo/Sgj9wH7J6TI/AAAAAAAAAps/WKutKyswBc8/s320/Hammer+Falls.jpg

Thor wins.

Thor 8/10

lol at Thor taking a majority.

DarkseidOriginally posted by MF DELPH


Get mad Rage.

Originally posted by ares834
lol at Thor taking a majority.

Thor stomps.

Originally posted by carver9
Thor stomps. Elaborate vile fiend.

Thor gets a mudhole stomped in his ass

thor stands prolly a little better chance against darksied then supes does. Provided superman ,darksied and thor are all written well and there is no hokie dokie fanboy bullshit writeing going on. darksied should still win though, however his low showings against supes at times makes people wonder.

Originally posted by ares834
lol at Thor taking a majority. Darkseid's only chance against Thor is his omega beams and with Thor's hammer it's negated.

Thor wins.

Get at me haters.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Darkseid's only chance against Thor is his omega beams and with Thor's hammer it's negated. Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Thor wins.

Get at me haters. Players unite!

Thor FTW, not because he's blond either XD

Darkseid 8-9/10

Darkseid toys with him

Darkseid at his best I'd put around level with Odin.

the thing is I think Thor is uniquely propositioned to deal with Darkseid...far better than other heralds would imo ie Surfer

his Mjolnir can affectively negate the Omega Beam and that allows thor to go up close and melee against Darkseid

Originally posted by Starscream M
the thing is I think Thor is uniquely propositioned to deal with Darkseid...far better than other heralds would imo ie Surfer

his Mjolnir can affectively negate the Omega Beam and that allows thor to go up close and melee against Darkseid

Or send his Omegas back at him or blast him but yeah, Thor can bring this fight up close and personal... something that Darkseid does not want.

Omega Sanction FTW.

Originally posted by Uriel005
Darkseid at his best I'd put around level with Odin.

Originally posted by carver9
Or send his Omegas back at him or blast him but yeah, Thor can bring this fight up close and personal... something that Darkseid does not want.
He can't send the OE back at DS if he can't catch it. He's not Wonder Woman and the OE generally isn't a straight beam.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
He can't send the OE back at DS if he can't catch it. He's not Wonder Woman and the OE generally isn't a straight beam.

It doesnt need to be blasted straight at thor for him to absorb it though.

Originally posted by Naija boy
It doesnt need to be blasted straight at thor for him to absorb it though.
Is there a precedent for him absorbing something like the OE?

Originally posted by Omega Vision
He can't send the OE back at DS if he can't catch it. He's not Wonder Woman and the OE generally isn't a straight beam.

Thor's blocked enough energy attacks -even at a point blank range- that I think he'd manage to block the Omega Effect if put in the same situation as Diana. As a matter of fact, didn't he do just that during the crossover? Then again, I remember him also getting hit while in the air. It should be noted though that he was only briefly stunned and that was before they became glorified heat vision.

For the record, Mjolnir can draw energy to it from all directions.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Thor's blocked enough energy attacks -even at a point blank range- that I think he'd manage to block the Omega Effect if put in the same situation as Diana. As a matter of fact, didn't he do just that during the crossover? Then again, I remember him also getting hit while in the air. It should be noted though that he was only briefly stunned and that was before they became glorified heat vision.

For the record, Mjolnir can draw energy to it from all directions.
Which crossover?

Marvel vs DC? All I remember is Darkseid fighting Thor and two other high level Marvel heroes while Thanos fought Captain Marvel and two other high levels from DC.

The first time DS was hit by his own OE he made all Superman-Darkseid fights look idiotic by demonstrating that while weakened and winded he could just bfr Superman with a gesture...

I truly despise a lot of the people who wrote Darkseid after Kirby.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Is there a precedent for him absorbing something like the OE? If hv can redirect it and so can WW's bracers why can't Thor's hammer ?

it's true that mjolnir can just warp the energy to it, but thor doesnt do this often. Im also fairly certain DS could separate him from the hammer long enough to connect with the beams. DS should win

my main concern about the chratcer however is that it has become difficult to separate his jobbing from an unspoken depowerement over the years, that retarded showing with HV blocking the OE for instance. is the OE just nto what it used to be? if it were up to me, if SS SM and thor went up against him, he should still come out on top, that is the powerlevel that fits the charatcer concept. too bad they gotta wank SM to new heights and make it seem like he could kill DS any time he wanted to

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Is there a precedent for him absorbing something like the OE? well there's glory's blast and the bomb that would destroy 20% of the universe.

@753

You do realize your opinion is irrelevant. We argue based off of what the writers give us we don't say who we think wins and ignore who does win. That's fanboy logic at it's core. The most ironic thing is we have seen various writers pen them as equals so it wasn't one showing that changed anything here which could be called a fluke.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Which crossover?

Marvel vs DC? All I remember is Darkseid fighting Thor and two other high level Marvel heroes while Thanos fought Captain Marvel and two other high levels from DC.

The first time DS was hit by his own OE he made all Superman-Darkseid fights look idiotic by demonstrating that while weakened and winded he could just bfr Superman with a gesture...

I truly despise a lot of the people who wrote Darkseid after Kirby.

Yup, that one. IIRC, Thor just floated around doing pretty much nothing like he does at times when writers want him to be in the battle but not actively participating.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Yup, that one. IIRC, Thor just floated around doing pretty much nothing like he does at times when writers want him to be in the battle but not actively participating.
Fights involving more than a few characters at a time are hard to do.

There's always the heavy risk of succumbing to 'take them on one at a time' syndrome.

Look at martial arts movies, often times unless you have amazing choreography you end up having at least one scene where the resident badass beats three or more guys at once thanks to his enemies taking him on one or two at a time rather than just swarming him.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Which crossover?
Marvel vs DC?



Originally posted by Omega Vision
I truly despise a lot of the people who wrote Darkseid after Kirby.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Fights involving more than a few characters at a time are hard to do.

There's always the heavy risk of succumbing to 'take them on one at a time' syndrome.

Look at martial arts movies, often times unless you have amazing choreography you end up having at least one scene where the resident badass beats three or more guys at once thanks to his enemies taking him on one or two at a time rather than just swarming him.

It happens to Thor more often than other characters I've noticed. Sometimes he literally just floats there while Captain America and co. are giving it all they've got. Comes off as a real jerk or idiot.

Originally posted by quanchi112
@753

You do realize your opinion is irrelevant. We argue based off of what the writers give us we don't say who we think wins and ignore who does win. That's fanboy logic at it's core. The most ironic thing is we have seen various writers pen them as equals so it wasn't one showing that changed anything here which could be called a fluke. lmao at you calling someone out on fanboy logic and I did not use my opinion of how he should be portrayed as evidence that DS would win, I was merely stating it.

I did however present the manner through which he could and probably would get around mjolnir's power absorption, however. as for the several authors who portrayed them as equal, several others have portrayed him as SM's superior and he has a history of feats above the top tier class

Originally posted by 753
lmao at you calling someone out on fanboy logic and I did not use my opinion of how he should be portrayed as evidence that DS would win, I was merely stating it.

I did however present the manner through which he could and probably would get around mjolnir's power absorption, however. as for the several authors who portrayed them as equal, several others have portrayed him as SM's superior and he has a history of feats above the top tier class How he should be portrayed is subjective how he is portrayed is not. It's simply looking at the facts. If you can't see the difference and the fact you are trying to dismiss showings is beyond me.

Recently he hasn't been his superior Superman has beaten him three times by my count. Superman also has superior feats and is far better at melee combat.

Originally posted by quanchi112
How he should be portrayed is subjective how he is portrayed is not. It's simply looking at the facts. If you can't see the difference and the fact you are trying to dismiss showings is beyond me. yes it subjective, thanks for stating the obvious, I never claimed otherwise and never used my opinion as evidence of him beating thor. what feat did I dismiss?

superior feats to what? his superiority in cqc can be overcome by the rest of DS's powerset.

http://images.wikia.com/marvelanimated/images/c/ce/Thor_Dead_HV.jpg

Originally posted by 753
yes it subjective, thanks for stating the obvious, I never claimed otherwise and never used my opinion as evidence of him beating thor. what feat did I dismiss?

superior feats to what? his superiority in cqc can be overcome by the rest of DS's powerset. So you admit your own personal feelings on the matter are irrelevant.

Superman's speed and hv can counter Seid's omega beams and guess what already have.

The funny thing is having oneshot/kill/defeat beams pigeonhold the writer so of course we are going to see Darkseid fail time and time again.

Thor absorbs the Omega Effect, amps it up, and nukes Darkseid all the way to the Dark Dimension...

Thor 10/10...


I do agree, however, that the combination of Superman wankage plus the apparent depowerment of Darkseid over the years have really taken a toll on Darkseids status as a character...

I truly do feel that hes supposed to be a legit Skyfather level character, but the way he is typically portrayed, he's a Low Trans at best...

Originally posted by quanchi112 So you admit your own personal feelings on the matter are irrelevant.
on the matter of who wins between him and thor? yes, i never used my opinion of how he should be portrayed as evidnce of who would win. you either missundertood or misrepresented my post that's just the absurdity of it, why cant they remove heat from existence? this is true, he'd probably be better off without them

Originally posted by 753
on the matter of who wins between him and thor? yes, i never used my opinion of how he should be portrayed as evidnce of who would win. you either missundertood or misrepresented my post that's just the absurdity of it, why cant they remove heat from existence? this is true, he'd probably be better off without them So you agree based on the evidence Thor deflects or absorbs the oe.

I dunno but the writer has established that hv can negate it when coupled with speed.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So you agree based on the evidence Thor deflects or absorbs the oe.

I dunno but the writer has established that hv can negate it when coupled with speed. like I originally said, thor rarely uses mjolnir's power to suck an energy attack out of the air into it, instead relying on raising the hammer and blocking the blasts. that is why he gets blasted so often. furthermroe, DS can manage to keep him away from the hammer - specally given thor's propensity to throw the thing arround - long enough to tag him with the OE. so there are ways to get arround its energy absorption

Originally posted by 753
like I originally said, thor rarely uses mjolnir's power to suck an energy attack out of the air into it, instead relying on raising the hammer and blocking the blasts. that is why he gets blasted so often. furthermroe, DS can manage to keep him away from the hammer - specally given thor's propensity to throw the thing arround - long enough to tag him with the OE. so there are ways to get arround its energy absorption It's far more likely that Thor deflects the blast back onto Darkseid or just blocks it. When he tosses his hammer Darkseid is going to be taking it head on. I honestly think this is definitely a heavy majority for Thor since the oe can be negated here. Darkseid's reliance on it against characters on this level has really hurt his standing.

Thor

Darkseid, being on Apokolips gives him access to so much unreal tec it's not even funny, even without the tec he should be able to make easy work of Thor.

Originally posted by Starscream M
the thing is I think Thor is uniquely propositioned to deal with Darkseid...far better than other heralds would imo ie Surfer

his Mjolnir can affectively negate the Omega Beam and that allows thor to go up close and melee against Darkseid


good point thors hammer will come in handy when it comes to darksieds Omega beams.

Originally posted by The Gambit
Darkseid, being on Apokolips gives him access to so much unreal tec it's not even funny, even without the tec he should be able to make easy work of Thor. Which tech that he has on his own person ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Which tech that he has on his own person ?

Why need it be on his person?

Thor wins.

Originally posted by The Gambit
Why need it be on his person? If it isn't en he doesn't get to use it in vs. threads.

Originally posted by Uriel005
Darkseid at his best I'd put around level with Odin.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Based on ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
If it isn't en he doesn't get to use it in vs. threads.

Rules say otherwise.

Standard equipment section.



OP says Apokolips for this scenario, so he has access to equipment in Apokolips. Darkseid wins.

Originally posted by The Gambit
Rules say otherwise.

Standard equipment section.



OP says Apokolips for this scenario, so he has access to equipment in Apokolips. Darkseid wins. No, it has to be used regularly or on his person. But you know what since I'm a nice guy what specifically did you have in mind that he'd use from apokolips.

Current Darkseid loses, obviously. Post Crisis Darkseid before he got butchered has enough feats to make it a fight and then some (He easily captured Superman and Infinity Man with some Omega's, for one, and the Omega's were shown as ignoring obstacles and acting intelligently, as well as capable or traveling through time and space..)

And for the hell of it, some opinions on PC Seid:

Darkseid from The Great Darkness Saga obviously wins.

Original Kirby Darkseid may win or lose depending on whether he tries facing Thor down mano y mano, or if he fights cheap. He took down Infinity Man with the cheapness, Boom Toobing right behind him and hitting him with the full OE before he could respond. And, the OE cleaned up the Forever People, tracking them down and sending them through time.

However, this version of Seid also has zero combat feats, and in fact ran from direct confrontation with his son, Darkseid. So likely, Thor beats Kirby 'Seid down.

That said, Kirby Darkseid is bigger then mere wins and losses. He's, by far, the coolest Darkseid ever.

One of my favorite Kirby Darkseid moments:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v330/CDTM3000/MrMiracleAvalon18-20.jpg

DS wins this easy. The only reason superman has defeated DS is because he starts to fight like a brick. He beats or bfrs regular superman with ease if he uses all of his powers. Thor is not Superman's physical equal. He won't be able to beat DS in a fist fight. If Thor goes exotic with his powers, so does DS. DS is Skyfather level, no way is thor in the same class unless we bring up King Thor.

Originally posted by Diesldude
DS wins this easy. The only reason superman has defeated DS is because he starts to fight like a brick. He beats or bfrs regular superman with ease if he uses all of his powers. Thor is not Superman's physical equal. He won't be able to beat DS in a fist fight. If Thor goes exotic with his powers, so does DS. DS is Skyfather level, no way is thor in the same class unless we bring up King Thor. Superman actually bfr'd Seid along with a host of baddies before. The comics contradict your points. Thor won't be using his fist his hammer which contains more power than Superman's fists. Skyfather characters don't lose to DD in two panels. Just sayin.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Superman actually bfr'd Seid along with a host of baddies before. The comics contradict your points.

He bfr'd DS because he was fighting like a brick, and not using his versatility.

Darkseids battlefield removed Superman numerous times, via the OE and Boom Tube. If he wanted to, he could have sent him into the heart of a red sun or in the middle of the universe where he'd suffocate, instead of back to Earth.

Originally posted by cdtm
He bfr'd DS because he was fighting like a brick, and not using his versatility.

Darkseids battlefield removed Superman numerous times, via the OE and Boom Tube. If he wanted to, he could have sent him into the heart of a red sun or in the middle of the universe where he'd suffocate, instead of back to Earth. What you think he can do or would do takes a back seat to what he has done. More often than not Superman goes toe to toe with him and Darkseid uses any tactics he can to save himself from Superman.

You also argued it's in character for Seid to fight like a brick against Superman and we don't argue powerset only here.

Originally posted by quanchi112
What you think he can do or would do takes a back seat to what he has done. More often than not Superman goes toe to toe with him and Darkseid uses any tactics he can to save himself from Superman.

What has has done, is bfr'd Superman, and had him at his mercy on several occasions, including imprisonment which he later released him from. That's not opinion, that's fact.

And the Apokolip's Now and Superman/Batman storyline clearly had Darkseid fighting like a brick. I don't know where you get he used any and all tactics, considering his main tactic was "beat down", which is very un Darkseid like.

Originally posted by cdtm
What has has done, is bfr'd Superman, and had him at his mercy on several occasions, including imprisonment which he later released him from. That's not opinion, that's fact.

And the Apokolip's Now and Superman/Batman storyline clearly had Darkseid fighting like a brick. I don't know where you get he used any and all tactics, considering his main tactic was "beat down", which is very un Darkseid like. That's not the norm though the norm is both guys beating on each other. Like I said Superman bfr'd Seid and others before and did so without effort.

Seid's tactic is his omega beams and when they fail against an elite tier he tends to fail.

Originally posted by quanchi112
That's not the norm though the norm is both guys beating on each other. Like I said Superman bfr'd Seid and others before and did so without effort.

Seid's tactic is his omega beams and when they fail against an elite tier he tends to fail.

It's been normal since OWAW, perhaps.. But relative to post crisis history, there's plenty of examples to back up Darkseid bfring Superman being a viable tactic.

Off the top of my head, Darkseid used to OE's to 'port Superman to Apokolips for their first meeting, bfr'd him with a boom tube during their early post crisis battle, sent his OE to teleport Superman and Infinity Man into imprisonment (And Superman claimed the OE was too fast to avoid), bfr'd him when Superman went to confront Darkseid about a Superman body being in his tomb (Which was caused by Brainiac, for the record). That's four examples off the top of my head of Darkseid 'porting Superman against his will, with at least two examples under combat conditions (Although one of them is merely Superman trying to escape the things, but imo that = combat conditions, as he was actively trying to avoid them.)

By contrast, you have Superman/Batman and Apokolips Now where they slug it out. Two hand to hand brawls doesn't make this a norm by any means..

Originally posted by cdtm
It's been normal since OWAW, perhaps.. But relative to post crisis history, there's plenty of examples to back up Darkseid bfring Superman being a viable tactic.

Off the top of my head, Darkseid used to OE's to 'port Superman to Apokolips for their first meeting, bfr'd him with a boom tube during their early post crisis battle, sent his OE to teleport Superman and Infinity Man into imprisonment (And Superman claimed the OE was too fast to avoid), bfr'd him when Superman went to confront Darkseid about a Superman body being in his tomb (Which was caused by Brainiac, for the record). That's four examples off the top of my head of Darkseid 'porting Superman against his will, with at least two examples under combat conditions (Although one of them is merely Superman trying to escape the things, but imo that = combat conditions, as he was actively trying to avoid them.)

By contrast, you have Superman/Batman and Apokolips Now where they slug it out. Two hand to hand brawls doesn't make this a norm by any means.. Those aren't recent examples. Sure seid can and has done it but most of the time and there have been many fights to draw from they trade blows with seid at some point relying on his omega effect/beams for the win.

It does make sense. In superman/batman they fight physically three times. In owaw they fight physically twice. In Superman's comic he bfr's Seid easily. In (an) they fight physically. That's just off the top of my head and look at the examples.

Thor only wins if you limit DS to his low end showings.

Now, if you want to play fair you'd use Darkseid's high end vs Thor's high end, and Darkseid would win.

Or you could use low end vs. low end, and Darkseid would win.

But if you want to cheat, and go low vs. high, then Thor might have a chance.

By low end showings, do you mean current showings?

I mean his weakest applicable showings.

Darkseid doesn't break a sweat against anyone under Superman. He consistently pulls out feats far above Thor.

Which would be his most current showings, right?

Who only uses current showings?

How gimped would Odin, Thor, or Hulk be if they couldn't cite any silver age feats? Lots of other characters, too.

There worse thing to ever happen to poor Darkseid was running into Clark, it's like Galactus running into Reed.

Originally posted by Cogito
Thor only wins if you limit DS to his low end showings.

Now, if you want to play fair you'd use Darkseid's high end vs Thor's high end, and Darkseid would win.

Or you could use low end vs. low end, and Darkseid would win.

But if you want to cheat, and go low vs. high, then Thor might have a chance.

Well said. The lowballing of Darkseid here is ridiculous.

Originally posted by cdtm
Who only uses current showings?

How gimped would Odin, Thor, or Hulk be if they couldn't cite any silver age feats? Lots of other characters, too. Hulk would be just fine

Originally posted by Cogito
Thor only wins if you limit DS to his low end showings.

Now, if you want to play fair you'd use Darkseid's high end vs Thor's high end, and Darkseid would win.

Or you could use low end vs. low end, and Darkseid would win.

But if you want to cheat, and go low vs. high, then Thor might have a chance. If we go high end Thor still wins. What higher end showings of Darkseid puts him above Thor ?

^ SF Darkseid...

Originally posted by Uriel005
^ SF Darkseid... That isn't under his own power. I could say RK Thor.