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Which team prevails???

Tough, but I think Windu's presence would put a damper on the Sith. Oppress might powerhouse through him though.

Lucien
Oppress might powerhouse through him though.

uhuh

no

Originally posted by axel_jovan
^ Yeah, NO WAY Opress is powerhousing Mace.



Im not convinced after his showings in CW..

Sure he lacks certain skill and refinement (for now), but still managed to overpower Anakin and Obi-Wan simultaneously.. Im not sure Mace could do that.

He threw them back, but they proceeded to get up and fight back just fine.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNFx3YW7h00

3:33

They dnt look just fine.. They look like they're both being overpowered simultaneously even in Sabers. Something Dooku's never been able to do at least.

And thats after being chucked 20 feet back with the Force at 3:08.

And then going down again at 4:46 with a bunch of Destroyer Droids..

That looks like they're just fine??

Bayhunter - What's up with you and Cin Drallig? CD has proven NOTHING at all.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER

They dnt look just fine.. They look like they're both being overpowered simultaneously even in Sabers. Something Dooku's never been able to do at least.

And thats after being chucked 20 feet back with the Force at 3:08.

And then going down again at 4:46 with a bunch of Destroyer Droids..

That looks like they're just fine??

Uh, I've seen the fight without it being spliced up for a video, recently. They aren't being overpowered in sabers. Yes, they're backing up and being shoved a bit, but they never look worried or in danger from his swordplay in the slightest. The first Force Push is about the only thing he did that looked like it hurt, and that can be chalked up to surprise, I don't think they were expecting it. The second one, they were distracted by droids and it was more diffuse.

He has a lot of power so they're being cautious, but they've been far more *threatened* by Dooku. Anakin even took a pause and turned his back to push a battledroid at him at one point.

I would bet either of them over him in a serious fight to the finish.

Power really doesn't believe Opress could take either Dooku or Windu, he's simply trying to get you all to believe that he believes it. Your cunning serves you well, DP, but I have a +6 bonus for perception. sneer

Dooku was handling Anakin and Obi-Wan relatively well until Anakin tapped into his reservoirs of anger, so I don't see why the younger and more physically imposing Mace Windu would be unable to do the same.

Opress is a beast, but he lacks the skill to defeat Dooku or Windu alone.

Originally posted by SlightlyFlaccid


Dooku was handling Anakin and Obi-Wan relatively well until Anakin tapped into his reservoirs of anger, so I don't see why the younger and more physically imposing Mace Windu would be unable to do the same.

Actually as per the CW Dooku struggles against Anakin alone(In Sabers at least).

In ROTS even when Obi-Wan was temporarily out of the fight Anakin constantly had Dooku on the defence.

The only time Dooku handled Anakin in ROTS was the kick to the floor.

And although Dooku was able to Force push Obi-Wan around, Dooku has never been able to Force Push Both Obi-Wan and Anakin simultaneously, let alone as far back and with the kind of Force Savage did.

Also Opress was Forcing both Anakin and Obi-Wan backwards in Sabers, whilst again Dooku would struggle just to force Anakin backwards (in sabers).

Originally posted by SlightlyFlaccid
Opress is a beast, but he lacks the skill to defeat Dooku or Windu alone.

And yet he did manage to overpower Dooku physically in close combat (even before his power boost)..

The main advantage that Dooku seems to have keeping Savage at Bay(for now) is his Force Lightning, a weapon Mace obviously doesn't have the advantage of.

Originally posted by Q99
Uh, I've seen the fight without it being spliced up for a video, recently. They aren't being overpowered in sabers. Yes, they're backing up and being shoved a bit, but they never look worried or in danger from his swordplay in the slightest. The first Force Push is about the only thing he did that looked like it hurt, and that can be chalked up to surprise, I don't think they were expecting it. The second one, they were distracted by droids and it was more diffuse.

Jeez and people say I Lowball!

Originally posted by Q99
He has a lot of power so they're being cautious, but they've been far more *threatened* by Dooku.

Debatable.

Originally posted by Q99
Anakin even took a pause and turned his back to push a battledroid at him at one point.

Sounds like a worried move to me.

Originally posted by Q99
I would bet either of them over him in a serious fight to the finish.

What you would put money on Anakin or Obi-Wan alone to defeat Savage? Ur kidding me? Yeah cause thats what I would think when One Guy sends two opponents flying back simultaneously, that he must not be a match for either of them


Double quoted by accident

Let's also not forget than Opress *and* Ventress together couldn't touch Dooku with sabers.

I'm not lowballing, I'm just pointing out that while he has power, he's not highly skilled in it's use and this has been reflected in how all of his more skilled opponents react to him. Obi-wan and Anakin didn't looked intimidated, they looked calm and focused, and shoving someone a bit when sabers are locked doesn't indicate an ability to win a fight.



Turning your back to someone in a fight is never a worried move

It means you're sufficiently not worried to the point of being willing to divert your attention.



Sending someone flying back does not decide a fight, and it's the greatest thing he's accomplished, and almost always when the opponent is distracted. It is his only strong trick that he can pull off reliably.

He sent Dooku flying too, but it's also really clear that Dooku would murder him in a fight.

Don't see why Opress would overpower a more experienced Mace. Savage couldn't even get close to Dooku when he and Ventress teamed up to take him down, and only showed his potential when both Dooku and Ventress had turned on him (force choking both of them, IIRC). Even after then, he was rendered a non-factor in the fight by both Dooku and Ventress.

Mace can take any individual member of team two; given that Maul's the biggest threat given his skill and experience, I'd wager that Mace fights and neutralizes him with ease. Given his skill and Vaapad, I don't see why he couldn't solo Opress/Ventress at that point, given how Dooku was tooling both of them prior to Savage's brief outburst.

Originally posted by Harbinger
Don't see why Opress would overpower a more experienced Mace. Savage couldn't even get close to Dooku when he and Ventress teamed up to take him down,

Originally posted by Q99
Let's also not forget than Opress *and* Ventress together couldn't touch Dooku with sabers.

He actually was able to physically overpower Dooku in close combat. Whilst the only weapon that kept Savage at bay was Dooku's Force Lightning, a weapon Mace does not have.

Originally posted by Harbinger
and only showed his potential when both Dooku and Ventress had turned on him (force choking both of them, IIRC). Even after then, he was rendered a non-factor in the fight by both Dooku and Ventress.



Dooku ran away from that "non-factor".. Being forced back by the combined force powers of Dooku and Ventress proves nothing in terms of Dooku's superiority.

Originally posted by Q99
Sending someone flying back does not decide a fight, and it's the greatest thing he's accomplished, and almost always when the opponent is distracted. It is his only strong trick that he can pull off reliably.

How exactly were Obi-Wan and Anakin (together mind you) caught off guard?? As for the greatest thing he accomplished, Id say that was sending Anakin, Obi-Wan plus 3 Destroyer droids Flying back.

When have either Obi-Wan or Anakin(not ROTS Anakin) ever showed the power to do anything like that, or deal with someone with that kind of power??

Also Id say driving them both back in Sabers is a pretty good feat. Who else has that feat against those 2 together?? (in sabers only) Dooku sure doesn't.


Originally posted by Q99
He sent Dooku flying too, but it's also really clear that Dooku would murder him in a fight.

???? It was actually Savage who came close to murdering Dooku and Ventress together!

However before Savage's power boost Dooku was able to manhandle him with his FL, again a weapon Mace does not have.

Given the ease with which Dooku tooled Ventress in that encounter, I doubt Dooku ran from Oppress because he was genuinely afraid that Savage would take him down. Remember that Dooku was surprised that Ventress had gotten into the trapdoor after he tried to escape. Does that mean that Dooku was afraid that Ventress could beat him? Seems more likely that he simply wanted to avoid the confrontation because he'd have had to expend energy to best both of them, not because he was afraid of Oppress.

Oppress briefly getting the upper hand on Dooku in that fight doesn't mean that he would always success, and it definitely doesn't mean that it'd work on Mace given the latter's trump card in Vaapad.

Underestimated the power in his charge maybe? They got back up uninjured before he was able to do anything about it.

He's the thing about Opress- he's able to shove almost anyone. The skilled opponents, always get up because a shove isn't a win, he never gets past their guard. Compare to Dooku, who was able to zap him pretty much at will in their fight.

All the strength in the world doesn't help you if you can't actually land a damaging blow.



They deal with people who have that kind of power all the time. Remember Dooku's big lifting feats when training Savage.



Savage and Ventress were fighting as a team, and not able to win like that. Opress did his thing when Dooku and Ventress were focusing entirely on each other.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
He actually was able to physically overpower Dooku in close combat. Whilst the only weapon that kept Savage at bay was Dooku's Force Lightning, a weapon Mace does not have.



Dooku ran away from that "non-factor".. Being forced back by the combined force powers of Dooku and Ventress proves nothing in terms of Dooku's superiority.



How exactly were Obi-Wan and Anakin (together mind you) caught off guard?? As for the greatest thing he accomplished, Id say that was sending Anakin, Obi-Wan plus 3 Destroyer droids Flying back.

When have either Obi-Wan or Anakin(not ROTS Anakin) ever showed the power to do anything like that, or deal with someone with that kind of power??

Also Id say driving them both back in Sabers is a pretty good feat. Who else has that feat against those 2 together?? (in sabers only) Dooku sure doesn't.




???? It was actually Savage who came close to murdering Dooku and Ventress together!

However before Savage's power boost Dooku was able to manhandle him with his FL, again a weapon Mace does not have. "When have either Obi-Wan or Anakin(not ROTS Anakin) ever showed the power to do anything like that, or deal with someone with that kind of power??"
please dont make me list them.

Originally posted by Harbinger
Remember that Dooku was surprised that Ventress had gotten into the trapdoor after he tried to escape. Does that mean that Dooku was afraid that Ventress could beat him?

Nooo... When he saw Ventress had followed him by herself he wasn't afraid one little bit.. He says to her "You are no match for me without your monster"

But im really not basing this on Dooku's fear.

Originally posted by Harbinger
Seems more likely that he simply wanted to avoid the confrontation because he'd have had to expend energy to best both of them, not because he was afraid of Oppress.



Thats possible.. Which is why im not basing this on Dooku's fear alone, but on Savage's fight/feats after that included.

The fact is after Savage's power boost, Dooku never had the advantage over Savage, and Savage's feats after that were ones Dooku has never managed.

Originally posted by Q99



They deal with people who have that kind of power all the time. Remember Dooku's big lifting feats when training Savage.



You'll have to define "all the time" for me.

Despite Dooku's lifting feats, he's never sent Obi-Wan and Anakin flying back together with a Force Wave, or put anything close to 3 Destroyer droids plus battle droids plus 2 Jedi down with a force wave.

And he's never forced both Obi-Wan and Anakin back in Sabers.

Originally posted by Naga Sado

please dont make me list them.

LOL.. Please DO!