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Let's make a poll and end the argument once and for all. Galactus takes on Odin.

No gear for either means non gungir, odinsword, or destroyer armor etc. For Odin.
No worldship, ultimate nullifier etc for galactus.

Big G no prob

Odin can do it. He's taken on other galaxy busters before and won. Odin for the slight majority. 6/10.

Before 2001, I'd say Odin for the overwhelming majority. But since then Galactus seems to have stepped up his game.

Then vote for Odin in the poll zopzop if you think he wins and let's just see which way the majority slides.

Whoops, I knew I forgot something. Done and done.

.

Originally posted by rotiart
Let's make a poll and end the argument once and for all. Galactus takes on Odin.

No gear for either means non gungir, odinsword, or destroyer armor etc. For Odin.
No worldship, ultimate nullifier etc for galactus.

And how well fed is Galactus?

Arguments don't end by majority vote.

Odin elicits 8.3% confidence in participating voters so far.

Originally posted by zopzop
Odin can do it. He's taken on other galaxy busters before and won. Odin for the slight majority. 6/10.

Before 2001, I'd say Odin for the overwhelming majority. But since then Galactus seems to have stepped up his game.

In all honesty, Odin did that in times past (and even then I truly believe it was hyperbole), but I really think we will never see Odin perform a feat on par with that (under his own power) ever again...

^ Destructive feats notwithstanding, when has Odin ever recreated an entire planet simply by walking around in empty space?

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
In all honesty, Odin did that in times past (and even then I truly believe it was hyperbole), but I really think we will never see Odin perform a feat on par with that (under his own power) ever again...

I don't know LoM. You seen the solicits for the upcoming throwdown? Don't fill me with too much confidence concerning Galactus.

Yeah, they seem to be heading back towards to Asgardian wanking again...

I like the Asgardians...I really do...but Odin shouldnt be capable of beating Galactus without a plot device of some sort.

But what I think doesnt matter as it really does seem like Odin is going to give Galactus a much more difficult fight than I ever imagined...

Galactus stomps.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Yeah, they seem to be heading back towards to Asgardian wanking again...

I like the Asgardians...I really do...but Odin shouldnt be capable of beating Galactus without a plot device of some sort.

But what I think doesnt matter as it really does seem like Odin is going to give Galactus a much more difficult fight than I ever imagined...

what makes you think so? and going by on-panel feats, odin should NOT be far behind galactus imo.....

Galactus should be able to punch Odin's face off.

Originally posted by rotiart
Let's make a poll and end the argument once and for all. Galactus takes on Odin.

Guys. This is how arguments are ended once and for all.



Sorry. But lulz.

Galactus punches Odin's face off

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Yeah, they seem to be heading back towards to Asgardian wanking again...


It's not really wanking if it's been going on since......forever. Not too long ago during "The Reigning" saga, the ENTIRE COUNCIL ELITE couldn't stop Odinforce Thor from taking over the planet Earth (and this is with Strange helping them).

Originally posted by zopzop
It's not really wanking if it's been going on since......forever. Not too long ago during "The Reigning" saga, the ENTIRE COUNCIL ELITE couldn't stop Odinforce Thor from taking over the planet Earth (and this is with Strange helping them).

Except it hasn't. The Pantheons have been demoted to below the cosmic beings since Kirby introduced Galactus in 1968. He intended him to surpass the regular gods.

Galactus is the third force of the universe between Eternity and Death. It takes a powerful universal cosmic being to take on even a moderately well fed Galactus. That's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay above any skyfather, even Odin. Even if Odin had the Destroyer armour it would make no difference. Galactus 10/10.

Originally posted by Power Cosmic II
Except it hasn't. The Pantheons have been demoted to below the cosmic beings since Kirby introduced Galactus in 1968. He intended him to surpass the regular gods.

Except it has. Until recently, THOR'S freaking feats shxt all over Galactus'.

Ignoring the Chaos War fiasco, in the last few years Galactus FINALLY has feats befitting his supposed stature in the cosmos : the galaxy wiping feat while starving/near death, the last one standing vs the Galactus Engine in Thanos Imperative, etc...

Originally posted by The Dark Cloud
Galactus is the third force of the universe between Eternity and Death. It takes a powerful universal cosmic being to take on even a moderately well fed Galactus. That's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay above any skyfather, even Odin. Even if Odin had the Destroyer armour it would make no difference. Galactus 10/10.

Let's make a bet, to anyone on this thread who thinks Galactus walks all over Odin (with the Destroyer armor no less!), if Odin holds his own or wins, change your avatars to something Odin related.

If Odin wins ONLY through a plot device or gets crushed by Galactus (with or without the Destroyer Armor), I'll change my avatar to something Galactus related.

The avatar change has to last 30 days, then you can change back. Deal?

Originally posted by zopzop
Let's make a bet, to anyone on this thread who thinks Galactus walks all over Odin (with the Destroyer armor no less!), if Odin holds his own or wins, change your avatars to something Odin related.

If Odin wins ONLY through a plot device or gets crushed by Galactus (with or without the Destroyer Armor), I'll change my avatar to something Galactus related.

The avatar change has to last 30 days, then you can change back. Deal?

I'm not changing my avatar (sorry, I'm too much of a Kate fan), but I will acknowledge if a majority say Odin in the Destroyer though I still think they'll be wrong. A well fed G is above the Celestials (Scathan and Tiamut not whistanding), and you know what they did to the Destroyer.

I am agreeable to that...

*shakes zopzop's hand*

Didn't doom with Galactus' powers (during secret wars) definitively beat Odin?

that's probably as close as we're going to see a full power galactus vs. odin fight.

Galactus should win, but I don't think its a massive stomp based on feats as a whole.

I don't even think they are going to fight but one thing I do agree with that was said by LOM in this thread. All of those insane "classic" feats that we use to get from these characters, they will never happen again.

That's why using classic feats is a bad idea since the characters have changed ssssooooo much.

Originally posted by carver9
I don't even think they are going to fight but one thing I do agree with that was said by LOM in this thread. All of those insane "classic" feats that we use to get from these characters, they will never happen again.

That's why using classic feats is a bad idea since the characters have changed ssssooooo much.

You'd both have a point except that Odin's most impressive feat didn't occur till the mid 90s. The multiverse shaking, dead galaxies (plural) shattering, long dead stars throughout the universe re-igniting, universe threatening fight happened in the 90s not during his "classic" years.

if galactus is weak, odin can win

galactus written like he should wins

Originally posted by Power Cosmic II
Except it hasn't. The Pantheons have been demoted to below the cosmic beings since Kirby introduced Galactus in 1968. He intended him to surpass the regular gods.

wut? there was no clear superior that early on. not sure where you got that piece of misinformation, but please, show me.

Galactus wins.

Page me when Odin:

- One shots three star systems while weakened
- Beats Mephisto in his own realm
- Stalemates Tenebrous while weakened
- Stalemates Agamotto in his own realm

Big G wins.

Originally posted by zopzop
You'd both have a point except that Odin's most impressive feat didn't occur till the mid 90s. The multiverse shaking, dead galaxies (plural) shattering, long dead stars throughout the universe re-igniting, universe threatening fight happened in the 90s not during his "classic" years.

90's feats were also like classic feats as well. Recently, things has changed. It rare to finding feats resembling classic feats, especially the type of feats that Odin and Thor had.

Originally posted by leonidas
wut? there was no clear superior that early on. not sure where you got that piece of misinformation, but please, show me.

your disagreeing with it doesn't make it "misinformation"



-Marvel Chronicle, a Year by Year history



-Jack Kirby talking about creating Galactus and the Silver Surfer.

Originally posted by zopzop
Except it has. Until recently, THOR'S freaking feats shxt all over Galactus'.


Please pass the pipe.

Originally posted by Harbinger

Page me when Odin:

- One shots three star systems while weakened
- Beats Mephisto in his own realm
- Stalemates Tenebrous while weakened
- Stalemates Agamotto in his own realm

Big G wins.

Page me when Galactus:

- Creates multiple stars from the energy he produces during a battle
- Imprisons a billion billion beings from a thousand different worlds within a single spell
- Stalemates and later defeats a galaxy-sized entity capable of swallowing planets in the palm of his hand
- Produces a son who has beaten Mephisto in his own realm

http://cl.ly/1s2j1D351n0m3W130O3m/Image_2011.07.02_11_25_38_AM.png

Originally posted by leonidas
wut? there was no clear superior that early on. not sure where you got that piece of misinformation, but please, show me.

eh, it's been clearly determined that earth's pantheons were scared shitless of celestials, and totally unable to stop them.

Remember the destroyer was constructed using the lifeforce of every skyfather on earth, plus all of the asgardians combined (except Thor). It couldn't kill even one of them.

Full potential galactus is a peer to eternity and death, and most certainly outranks the celestials. Add to that what we've seen what the ultimate nullifier can do (obliterate the entire marvel multiverse in the blink of an eye) and it's not hard to come to the conclusion that Galactus at his peak should be a good deal stronger than any member of earth's pantheons.

edit: one could even argue that way back in Galactus' first appearance, the only thing that stopped galactus consuming the planet WAS the ultimate nullifier. If Odin, Zeus, or any of the earth bound gods were capable of stopping him then either they or the watcher would have stepped in. no one did.

Originally posted by Power Cosmic II
your disagreeing with it doesn't make it "misinformation"



-Marvel Chronicle, a Year by Year history



-Jack Kirby talking about creating Galactus and the Silver Surfer.

cool. i like that first quote and its a good source.

doesn't really change the fact that on panel, early on, there was no clear superior. as time has progressed, galactus and the other cosmics have--seemingly--usurped the place of the skyfathers, but in the late 60's there was still doubt about who was the more powerful between odin and galactus. thor himself was capable of harming galactus back then, never mind odin. guess we'll learn just how far things have progressed shortly when odin finally meets galactus.

http://cl.ly/2j3U0H2Q1f310x3O2330/Image_2011.07.02_11_32_33_AM.png

Originally posted by Space M ummy
eh, it's been clearly determined that earth's pantheons were scared shitless of celestials, and totally unable to stop them.

we're talking much earlier on than this. that celestial scene was, imo, the scene that set the cosmics apart from the skyfathers. prior to that, there was still a question as regards relative power levels. that scene was, frankly, embarrassing.



pure speculation. 'full potential galactus' is a myth. no one has seen it, so we don't know what that really means. as far as a peer to death and eternity--that speaks to his station, not his power.



yeah, the un is a confusing issue, imo. it is most certainly NOT in character for him to use it, regardless and i don't think it should be factored in to any forum fight.

Originally posted by Wodenson
http://cl.ly/2j3U0H2Q1f310x3O2330/Image_2011.07.02_11_32_33_AM.png

Thor says:

http://cl.ly/2Y2x3V2n1J0G09342n10/Image_2011.07.02_11_41_56_AM.png

Odin responds:

http://cl.ly/2X1f122e3I0W1J050t1R/Image_2011.07.02_11_43_17_AM.png

It's clear that Lee and Kirby saw them as peers, with a possible edge to Odin.

Originally posted by leonidas
we're talking much earlier on than this. that celestial scene was, imo, the scene that set the cosmics apart from the skyfathers. prior to that, there was still a question as regards relative power levels. that scene was, frankly, embarrassing.

not really, again you can go back to Galactus' first appearance where the watcher states the only thing capable of stopping galactus was the ultimate nullifier. If Odin, Zeus, etc were stronger, or even on par- why not appeal to them instead? Why get galactus to "promise" not to eat the planet instead of just beating him senseless?

The only explanation is that galactus was intended to be superior to the earthbound gods, and stoppable only via a plot device.



one would think that even having a "station" equivalent to the concepts of death and eternity would speak to a significant level of power. but it's not worth debating here.



It doesn't have to be in character for him to use it, since the UN has been stated by marvel to be another aspect of his powers, you must include it when making the determination of how powerful galactus actually IS.

it's not in character for the flash to IMP an opponent a million times right off the bat, but no one is going to argue that flash couldn't, or that it "shouldn't count" as part of his powerset.

What the UN is capable of is beyond anything Odin has been able to do so far on panel, and since its been defined as "just another part of galactus" that means that galactus' overall power exceeds odin's. It's not in CHARACTER for Galactus to use it (he only has once or twice that I'm aware of), but if it ever WERE used on him, Odin would not be able to resist it, and would be obliterated.

Therefore, Galactus is more powerful than Odin.

Originally posted by Wodenson
http://cl.ly/2j3U0H2Q1f310x3O2330/Image_2011.07.02_11_32_33_AM.png

Just a shame that Odin, in connection with the scan, got completely thrashed on panel by Doom who held the power of Galactus.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Just a shame that Odin, in connection with the scan, got completely thrashed on panel by Doom who held the power of Galactus.

It's such a shame that Doom had the power of Galactus plus half a dozen OTHER artifacts boosting him, one of which was the Cosmic Cube.

And it's a shame that Galactus went down before the power of the Cosmic Cube much easier than Odin did against Doom with Galactus Power + Cosmic Cube.

http://cl.ly/2k3S351X3u0Y2M2f1T1W/Image_2011.07.02_1_06_19_PM.png

Originally posted by Wodenson
It's such a shame that Doom had the power of Galactus plus half a dozen OTHER artifacts boosting him, one of which was the Cosmic Cube.

And it's a shame that Galactus went down before the power of the Cosmic Cube much easier than Odin did against Doom with Galactus Power + Cosmic Cube.

http://cl.ly/2k3S351X3u0Y2M2f1T1W/Image_2011.07.02_1_06_19_PM.png

And it's shame that Doom commented on that the Cosmic Cube in itself was but a fraction of the power he would obtain when he stole the power of Galactus. It's further a shame that it wasn't anywhere near the power of half a dozen artifacts. It was The orb from the Watcher, the Sacred Helix of Randac, the cosmic cube and the Cosmic Control Rod, of these the only one that increased his power was the Cosmic cube, which according to Doom was nothing in comparison with Galactus own power.

It's further a shame that the cube in itself wasn't used during the steal of the power from Galactus, but instead the equipment that was also used to drain the Surfer was used, The cosmic energy harness something...

Doom was amped by much more than Galactus power so that feat doesn't count for Galactus.

Originally posted by Utrigita
And it's shame that Doom commented on that the Cosmic Cube in itself was but a fraction of the power he would obtain when he stole the power of Galactus.

Yeah, a fraction of the total power he would have when he stole Galactus' power. Which is absolutely correct.



O rly?

http://cl.ly/412u2O3S363h3v2d110Y/Image_2011.07.02_1_16_50_PM.png

Originally posted by Wodenson
Yeah, a fraction of the total power he would have when he stole Galactus' power. Which is absolutely correct.



O rly?

http://cl.ly/412u2O3S363h3v2d110Y/Image_2011.07.02_1_16_50_PM.png

Which means that in Doom's eyes (the guy with all the knowledge in the universe) the power of Galactus was much greater then the power the cosmic cube had.

Yes rly.

Earlier Doom mentioned how he used the Cosmic Cube, harnessed and controlled by the Cosmic Rod from Annihilus to transport him across the universe to Galactus destination, that was it. Further Reed explains that it's through the Orb from the Watcher that Doom gains the knowledge on how to steal Galactus power, if the cosmic cube itself was all that was need, it wouldn't have been required to bring the Harness, and if the cosmic cube powers was far greater then Galactus, why bother trying to steal them in the first place? And if Odin's power was equal to Galactus why travel across the universe to get Galactus' power?

Originally posted by Utrigita
Which means that in Doom's eyes (the guy with all the knowledge in the universe) the power of Galactus was much greater then the power the cosmic cube had.

That's not what it means. It means exactly what Doom said. That the power Doom had accumulated was less than what it would be with Galactus power added on top of it.



I never said that the Cosmic Cube itself was all that was needed, but the fact that Reed was able to steal Galactus' power from Doom at the end of the story suggests that it was. Maybe Doom needed the additional security to ensure his plan was successful.

I also never said that the Cosmic Cube was greater than Galactus (even though the story alludes to it being greater), but Doom was trying to achieve the highest power level possible.



Maybe because Galactus was an easier mark, all by his lonesome, without an all-seeing god watching his back.

Originally posted by Wodenson
That's not what it means. It means exactly what Doom said. That the power Doom had accumulated was less than what it would be with Galactus power added on top of it.



I never said that the Cosmic Cube itself was all that was needed, but the fact that Reed was able to steal Galactus' power from Doom at the end of the story suggests that it was. Maybe Doom needed the additional security to ensure his plan was successful.

I also never said that the Cosmic Cube was greater than Galactus (even though the story alludes to it being greater), but Doom was trying to achieve the highest power level possible.



Maybe because Galactus was an easier mark, all by his lonesome, without an all-seeing god watching his back.

Lets see, Doom says that the power of the Cosmic Cube is matchless, and then he states that the power that will come at his disposal when he steals Galactus power, will make the power he has at that point of time before the steal, a fraction of his overall power, so the power of Galactus is in Doom's eyes significantly above what power the cosmic cube has.

Or maybe the Cube functioned as a conviniently plot device. If the power of the Cosmic Cube was above the power of Galactus, going after Galactus power in the first place would seem illogical, especially for a person with the amount of knowledge that Doom had at his disposal at that point of time.

And that he obtained by gaining the power of Galactus, the power of Galactus which made the power of the cosmic cube seem like like a fraction in comparison, which points towards that a very large majority of the power used to defeat Odin came from the power of Galactus, furthermore the fact that Doom doesn't register that he drops the Cosmic Cube, makes it arguable if he was indeed even using it active after having obtained Galactus power.

Or maybe because the power that Galactus had was much greater then the power Odin had?

Originally posted by Utrigita
Lets see, Doom says that the power of the Cosmic Cube is matchless, and then he states that the power that will come at his disposal when he steals Galactus power, will make the power he has at that point of time before the steal, a fraction of his overall power, so the power of Galactus is in Doom's eyes significantly above what power the cosmic cube has.

Your attempt to mangle sentence structure not withstanding, Doom essentially said that his power would grow after he absorbed the energy from Galactus.



A plot device which stole/defeated the power of Galactus twice in the same story.



Reed Richards quite clearly stated that they were dealing with far more than the power of the Galactus.



Or maybe Galactus' power is that much easier to steal, since it was done twice in one storyline, and I don't know how many times since.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
not really, again you can go back to Galactus' first appearance where the watcher states the only thing capable of stopping galactus was the ultimate nullifier. If Odin, Zeus, etc were stronger, or even on par- why not appeal to them instead? Why get galactus to "promise" not to eat the planet instead of just beating him senseless?



why doesn't batman call superman when the joker is on a rampage? c'mon. it was an ff book. you really think they'll cross to thor and ask for help? but what happened when thor DID meet galactus.....?



or that the whole thing took place in the ff and x-overs were hardly common place back then.....



significant level? sure. never said he didn't. just wanted to be sure that because he's considered a 'cosmic' that it does NOT necessarily follow that his power=death/eternity. saturnyne is the OMNIVERSAL MAJESTRIX. an UBER station--and she has basically NO power. station=/=power in all cases.



in the forum it absolutely does count. unless someone is talking cis-free adn arguing just powersets.



that issue HAS come up. fact is that flash has used similarly powerful hits many times however. g has only ever emplyed the un ONE time. prior to that he was afraid of it and there was no indication it was part of him at all. does the abraxas arc count as a retcon? maybe. i think we need to see at least one more demonstration to support it though. i'm still on the fence as regards to galactus and the un. i accept the arc, and what it means, but at the same time i certainly am not comfortable (after only a single showing that was refuted in ALL prior showings) to say he can simply use the un whenever he wants.....



in an alternate universe, the un destroyed eternity, effortlessly. i'd say that is beyond odin.... that was never the issue. galactus' more common place power levels are.



maybe. we'll see coming up just how far beyond him he is. perhaps it will be born out that he is well beyond odin. but maybe not. and i'll guarantee the un will not be playing any role in things....

Originally posted by Utrigita
Lets see, Doom says that the power of the Cosmic Cube is matchless, and then he states that the power that will come at his disposal when he steals Galactus power, will make the power he has at that point of time before the steal, a fraction of his overall power, so the power of Galactus is in Doom's eyes significantly above what power the cosmic cube has.

Or maybe the Cube functioned as a conviniently plot device. If the power of the Cosmic Cube was above the power of Galactus, going after Galactus power in the first place would seem illogical, especially for a person with the amount of knowledge that Doom had at his disposal at that point of time.

And that he obtained by gaining the power of Galactus, the power of Galactus which made the power of the cosmic cube seem like like a fraction in comparison, which points towards that a very large majority of the power used to defeat Odin came from the power of Galactus, furthermore the fact that Doom doesn't register that he drops the Cosmic Cube, makes it arguable if he was indeed even using it active after having obtained Galactus power.

Or maybe because the power that Galactus had was much greater then the power Odin had?

c'mon u, that scene was so muddled with so many different powers, you know it can't be used to prove...... anything really.

Originally posted by leonidas
c'mon u, that scene was so muddled with so many different powers, you know it can't be used to prove...... anything really.

Yes I know, as we have discussed it before I just found the scan that Wodenson presented as taken a bit out of context given what happened after the statement, and that was merely what I commented upon. But true it's muddled and to a large degree selfcontradicting.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Yes I know, as we have discussed it before I just found the scan that Wodenson presented as taken a bit out of context given what happened after the statement, and that was merely what I commented upon. But try it's muddled and to a large degree selfcontradicting.

Originally posted by Wodenson
Your attempt to mangle sentence structure not withstanding, Doom essentially said that his power would grow after he absorbed the energy from Galactus.



A plot device which stole/defeated the power of Galactus twice in the same story.



Reed Richards quite clearly stated that they were dealing with far more than the power of the Galactus.



Or maybe Galactus' power is that much easier to steal, since it was done twice in one storyline, and I don't know how many times since.

That is true, what you fail to take into consideration is that Doom draws a line between before and after he gains Galactus power. And Doom sees the power he has before Galactus power, as a fraction of the power he will gain when he steals Galactus power.

The reason I see it as a plot device is, Doom is selfconflicting concerning his actual use of the Cosmic Cube concerning the theft, at one instance he says it's merely being used as a transportation device, the next it's a factor in stealing the power, which is a direct contradiction to what Reed tells us later, in that brief mentioning of the different Artifacts the Cosmic Cube isn't, iirc, mentioned as the Item that enables Doom to steal Galactus power, the Ultimate Machine is. Furthermore as already mentioned, if the Cosmic Cube is already more powerful then Galactus why even attempt to gain Galactus power in the first place?

Which they also was, but how big a part of that power was Galactus own Reed didn't elaborate on the slightest. He mentions the other artifacts, but also mentions that it's indeed with Galactus power that Doom obtains Ultimate power, and also hints at that Doom's goal all along was to get Galactus power. And again if you look at Doom's sentence before he rushes towards Galactus, Doom sees the power that he has before the theft as a fraction of the power he will have when he steals the power from Galactus.

It shouldn't matter which of the two is the hardest to steal. If Doom as you suggest only worked to accumulate his own personal power, he might as well, if Odin was stronger as Galactus have robbed that instead.

But then again I think it's non canon anyways.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Lets see, Doom says that the power of the Cosmic Cube is matchless, and then he states that the power that will come at his disposal when he steals Galactus power, will make the power he has at that point of time before the steal, a fraction of his overall power, so the power of Galactus is in Doom's eyes significantly above what power the cosmic cube has.
lol, do you know what a "fraction" is? 1/2 is a fraction. 99/100 is a fraction. It doesn't speak at all to the relative power of the two.

Originally posted by King Kandy
lol, do you know what a "fraction" is? 1/2 is a fraction. 99/100 is a fraction. It doesn't speak at all to the relative power of the two.

I know what a fraction is pure mathematical, but in this context I'll stick to what Oxford Dictionary says concerning the literal meaning if you don't mind



Or Free online dictionary

Originally posted by Utrigita
That is true, what you fail to take into consideration is that Doom draws a line between before and after he gains Galactus power. And Doom sees the power he has before Galactus power, as a fraction of the power he will gain when he steals Galactus power.

This doesn't contradict what I said.



Here's what Reed says about the Cosmic Cube when listing the devices.

http://cl.ly/3E2T1h3B3h2a220p2z1G/Image_2011.07.02_4_01_08_PM.png



Because it was the icing on the cake. It's what brought all the element together into one, perfect package.



Sure it should. Doom is going to go after the target which has the highest success rate. He knew more about Galactus than Odin when he formulated his plan, and the technology he employed was geared towards siphoning cosmic energy.

Originally posted by Wodenson
This doesn't contradict what I said.



Here's what Reed says about the Cosmic Cube when listing the devices.

http://cl.ly/3E2T1h3B3h2a220p2z1G/Image_2011.07.02_4_01_08_PM.png



Because it was the icing on the cake. It's what brought all the element together into one, perfect package.



Sure it should. Doom is going to go after the target which has the highest success rate. He knew more about Galactus than Odin when he formulated his plan, and the technology he employed was geared towards siphoning cosmic energy.

Then why was it important initially to point out that Doom was boosted with other artifacts when he thrashed Odin, if you doesn't disagree with the Cosmic Cube being but a fraction of the overall power at Doom's disposal at that point of time?

And yet afterwards Reed referes to Doom after having drained Galactus as having obtained ultimate power. That wasn't mentioned beforehand, he suggest the Cosmic Cube would suffice, something that we can assume Doom with the power from the Ultimate Machine was well aware of wasn't the case.

A perfect package that would seem incomplete if Doom had decided to go for Galactus knowing that Odin was stronger, given what Doom aimed to accomplish that just seems stupid.

After having obtained the Ultimate Machine, which had gathered all the watchers knowledge concerning the known universe, I find it rather unlikely that Doom's knowledge about Odin would in any way be lacking.

btw, next time just post the entire page instead of panels.

Originally posted by Digi
Guys. This is how arguments are ended once and for all.



Sorry. But lulz.

I have feelings too you know! :-(
Digi!!

Originally posted by Utrigita
knowledge about Odin would in any way be lacking.

btw, next time just post the entire page instead of panels.

People post panels instead of entire pages to misinform...

And seriously... Back in the days when Odin was compared to galactus were
Also the days when surfer and thor could time travel...
When spiderman could hurt firelord...

Etc etc...

Galactus is not written the same now as he was back in the older days.

... When has Odin even done anything directly or indirectly that brought the living tribunal into action due to the scope of his powers... Korvac had the knowledge and power of a portion of galactus... And what happened...

Originally posted by Utrigita
I know what a fraction is pure mathematical, but in this context I'll stick to what Oxford Dictionary says concerning the literal meaning if you don't mind



Or Free online dictionary
That is the literal meaning. lol, dictionaries do include multiple definitions, you know. You can't just pick the one you like and decide that's the "literal" one.

For instance, this is what the free dictionary actually says:



Well gee, looks like my definition was actually the first one. What a pathetic lie. Did you really think I wouldn't check? It isn't wise to pull this kind of thing when the answer can be looked up by anyone with a computer. #3 is the only one that agrees with you, so how the hell is the #3 suddenly the "literal" one?

Dictionary.com:



This one doesn't even INCLUDE the "small part" definition.

World English Dictionary:



Once again, your definition is not the most common at all; it is actually a minority.

Originally posted by rotiart
And seriously... Back in the days when Odin was compared to galactus were
Also the days when surfer and thor could time travel...
When spiderman could hurt firelord...


wut?

spidey/fl was 90's (late 80's??) in any event, we're talking 60's & 70's. again, we'll soon see how far they've come.....

Character levels vary from year to year and decade to decade. What is most important is how these levels are portrayed currently.

It may be true that Odin was up there (Galactus level maybe) in the past but clearly that has changed. Galactus is now understood to be higher than him currently. I don't see that as a debate. It is clear to a HIGH MAJORITY of comic fans.

Just my 2 cents.

Originally posted by h1a8
Character levels vary from year to year and decade to decade. What is most important is how these levels are portrayed currently.

It may be true that Odin was up there (Galactus level maybe) in the past but clearly that has changed. Galactus is now understood to be higher than him currently. I don't see that as a debate. It is clear to a HIGH MAJORITY of comic fans.

Just my 2 cents.
Aren't they about to fight in Thor? I guess that will show exactly how they stand, currently.

Part of me wants to see a good, fairly even fight.

Another part questions whether Thor denting Surfer's skull with a headbutt points towards writer bias..

I mean, I can buy Thor messing Surfer up, but denting his head with a headbutt is a bit much..

Hey, better than blood and thunder where he knocked SS out with a single blow...

Originally posted by Harbinger
- Beats Mephisto in his own realm


Originally posted by Wodenson
- Produces a son who has beaten Mephisto in his own realm


I would probably remove both of these feats. Beating Mephisto in his own realm isn't necessarily a feat of power. Adam Warlock did it before.

Galactus stomps,

though I hope Odin wins in their next bout . It will be a funny time here on KMC.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Then why was it important initially to point out that Doom was boosted with other artifacts when he thrashed Odin, if you doesn't disagree with the Cosmic Cube being but a fraction of the overall power at Doom's disposal at that point of time?

Because the 'fraction' of Doom's power, which constituted his non-Galactus portion, was enough to rival Galactus in and of itself. Prior to absorbing Galactus' power, Doom essentially had access to Beyonder-level power. So the combination of Galactus power AND a Cosmic Cube (not to mention the other stuff) is what Odin was up against.

You can't get around this fact. Stop trying.



Are you being intentionally thick?



I already addressed this. Come up with something new.



I don't find it unlikely. I think there are things about Odin beyond the ken of the Watchers. After all, Odin predates them.



Lets make a deal. I post whatever I want, and you sit there and like it. Sound fair?

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Galactus stomps,

though I hope Odin wins in their next bout . It will be a funny time here on KMC.

Far as I understand it Odin is attempting to stop galactus from achieving godhood...

Hence galactus is an antagonist in the story...

Thus Odin an Thor as the heroes will win the day

Originally posted by Wodenson
Because the 'fraction' of Doom's power, which constituted his non-Galactus portion, was enough to rival Galactus in and of itself. Prior to absorbing Galactus' power, Doom essentially had access to Beyonder-level power. So the combination of Galactus power AND a Cosmic Cube (not to mention the other stuff) is what Odin was up against.

You can't get around this fact. Stop trying.



Are you being intentionally thick?



I already addressed this. Come up with something new.



I don't find it unlikely. I think there are things about Odin beyond the ken of the Watchers. After all, Odin predates them.



Lets make a deal. I post whatever I want, and you sit there and like it. Sound fair?


Where the heck did you get that Odin pre dates the watchers?

I was sure that it's been stated the celestials predate the asgardians...
And the watchers and celestials arose together due to the fulcrum...

edit.

Just for shit and giggles, to show how much the gods sucks when compared to Galactus:
http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/9584/thor161178be.jpg


http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/241/h1ic7.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/84/h2zj7.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/455/h3pu4.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/143/h6js1.jpg/


And now, to show how much of a badass he should be:
The place of Galactus:
http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/1496/silversurfer198903121bj4.jpg

Galactus against a "In the same ballpark as Odin in power"-being like:
http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/3394/thanos0222rd4.jpg

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/5/51954/1159592-thor_annual_1989__014_36_37.jpg

I wouldn't be able to accept Odin statlemating Galactus.

the deciding factor will prolly by the galactus seed

we will see

G wins.


thor cant beat mephisto in his own realm

http://cl.ly/3q1O0m3c1t2P3n2x1333/Image_2011.07.04_11_33_02_AM.png

Originally posted by 753
G wins.


thor cant beat mephisto in his own realm

Do you mean Thor can't beat Mephisto in his own realm again?

Originally posted by Wodenson
Do you mean Thor can't beat Mephisto in his own realm again? I mean he cant and... context!

@753

Dude Thor did better vs Mephisto, in Mephisto's own realm, than Galactus did. It's a fact. Mephisto even said no side would win and it would be a perpetual stalemate.

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Just for shit and giggles, to show how much the gods sucks when compared to Galactus:

A couple of things :

a) Thanos' might is lilliputian when compared to Odin's too
b) The Soul Gem has failed vs Thor, so it will fail vs Odin
c) Thor was wondering out loud if Odin could beat Galactus at full power, or the Destroyer destroy him. Nothing was proven. It's just Thor's musings.
d) Having a high "station" in the universe doesn't mean anything relative to your power. Galactus couldn't beat Mephisto in his own realm without resorting to devouring it, yet Thor/Mephisto were stuck in a perpetual draw fighting it out fair and square.

The page where Thor describes the 'Powers of the Universe' is out of continuity.

Originally posted by zopzop
@753

Dude Thor did better vs Mephisto, in Mephisto's own realm, than Galactus did. It's a fact. Mephisto even said no side would win and it would be a perpetual stalemate. and there are the facts that he lies through his teeth all the time, puts on shows for lesser beings and has always wanted to take thor's soul through corruptiona dn not just kill him and be done with it; and then there is time he desintegrated mjolnir in his realm, as he is omnipotent within it, and the time he warped the universe to erase spider-man's marriage from history, and the time he showed doom that the laws of physics dont apply to him in his realm. but sure, thor can beat him in his realm on his own.

@753

I don't feel like finding the issue and reuploading the scans. Mephisto COULD NOT BEAT Thor in Mephisto's own realm. The fight took place in Thor 310. It was going to be an eternal stalemate until both agreed to back off.

How do we know that the Mjolnir incident wasn't an illusion? You yourself said he lies.

Originally posted by zopzop
@753

I don't feel like finding the issue and reuploading the scans. Mephisto COULD NOT BEAT Thor in Mephisto's own realm. The fight took place in Thor 310. It was going to be an eternal stalemate until both agreed to back off.

How do we know that the Mjolnir incident wasn't an illusion? You yourself said he lies. it's possible, but there is more evidence backing the fact that laws of physics dont apply to his realm than to him not being able to beat a herald in it

@753

Quick question, who has Mephisto ever beaten in his own realm? Were they at least herald level? Because I'm drawing a blank trying to think of someone.

Originally posted by zopzop
@753

Quick question, who has Mephisto ever beaten in his own realm? Were they at least herald level? Because I'm drawing a blank trying to think of someone. doom and strange with prep IINM, plus briefly stalemating Galactus, SS was nothing next to him either

Originally posted by zopzop
A couple of things :

a) Thanos' might is lilliputian when compared to Odin's too
b) The Soul Gem has failed vs Thor, so it will fail vs Odin
c) Thor was wondering out loud if Odin could beat Galactus at full power, or the Destroyer destroy him. Nothing was proven. It's just Thor's musings.
d) Having a high "station" in the universe doesn't mean anything relative to your power. Galactus couldn't beat Mephisto in his own realm without resorting to devouring it, yet Thor/Mephisto were stuck in a perpetual draw fighting it out fair and square.

a) Bullshit. Odin going for the kill wasn't even KO'ed Thanos. He puts him on his ass, and win, but if you want, I can put a scan of what a Thanos / Galactus fight looks like.
Spoiler: It's not pretty.

b) Are you talking about the fight where Thor was empowered with the Power Gem?

c) ok

d) Mephisto was invincible in his realm, so Galactus was going to absorb THE ENTIRE REALM. So not only Galactus would have won against Mephisto, but he would have completly destroyed Hell. And it should be added that Galactus should be able to do the same with Asgard.

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
a) Bullshit. Odin going for the kill wasn't even KO'ed Thanos. He puts him on his ass, and win, but if you want, I can put a scan of what a Thanos / Galactus fight looks like.
Spoiler: It's not pretty.

b) Are you talking about the fight where Thor was empowered with the Power Gem?

c) ok

d) Mephisto was invincible in his realm, so Galactus was going to absorb THE ENTIRE REALM. So not only Galactus would have won against Mephisto, but he would have completly destroyed Hell. And it should be added that Galactus should be able to do the same with Asgard.

a) Don't bother, I saw that fight. Thanos knocked Galactus off his feet and clear across the surface of that planet/moon/ship and knocked his helmet off. After Galactus composed himself and had Thanos on his knees, he needed to replenish himself because of the amount of energy he expended in getting through Thanos' shields.

In contrast, Thanos couldn't even budge Odin. When Odin was fighting Thanos he was going all out like Galactus was. He wasn't drawing on his other reservoirs of power like he did vs Surtur. He was wearing Thanos down..........slowly and Odin didn't need "replenishment" after.

b) Yes it was during the BLood and Thunder arc, but no, Thor didn't have the Power Gem yet. The Soul Gem just straight up failed vs Thor. And if it failed vs Thor, it will fail vs Odin.

c)...

d) Thor STALEMATED "all powerful" Mephisto, in Mephisto's realm! Odin would crush Mephisto anywhere.

ss also overpowered mephisto in his realm. another time ss was shown to be quite below mephisto in hell. mephisto is simply a bizarre character with high and low showings in hell. ss has also dealt with and defeated the soul gem. with it, adam warlock pwnd mephisto in hell. again, he's got good and bad showings. i'd say g having to resort devouring hell to beat him is NOT the best thing to bring up when talking about galactus's power.

Originally posted by zopzop
a) Don't bother, I saw that fight. Thanos knocked Galactus off his feet and clear across the surface of that planet/moon/ship and knocked his helmet off. After Galactus composed himself and had Thanos on his knees, he needed to replenish himself because of the amount of energy he expended in getting through Thanos' shields.

In contrast, Thanos couldn't even budge Odin. When Odin was fighting Thanos he was going all out like Galactus was. He wasn't drawing on his other reservoirs of power like he did vs Surtur. He was wearing Thanos down..........slowly and Odin didn't need "replenishment" after.

b) Yes it was during the BLood and Thunder arc, but no, Thor didn't have the Power Gem yet. The Soul Gem just straight up failed vs Thor. And if it failed vs Thor, it will fail vs Odin.

c)...

d) Thor STALEMATED "all powerful" Mephisto, in Mephisto's realm! Odin would crush Mephisto anywhere.

a) Lol. Galactus was weak, because he was affected by the Hunger. He pwned Thanos in a second, and had him almost begging for mercy, in his worst lost in career. As for Odin, Thanos wasn't even going for the kill (he wasn't against Galactus too, because he was aware that he didn't stand a chance), he wanted to catch Odin's attention because Thor had to be cured, and only Odin was able to do it. Odin use Gungir, but wasn't able to score a solid victory. Which is, to say the least, what Galactus did.

b) Pretty sure he had the gem.

c) ...

d) So what? **** Mephisto, Galactus was about to own Hell!

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
a) Lol. Galactus was weak, because he was affected by the Hunger. He pwned Thanos in a second, and had him almost begging for mercy, in his worst lost in career. As for Odin, Thanos wasn't even going for the kill (he wasn't against Galactus too, because he was aware that he didn't stand a chance), he wanted to catch Odin's attention because Thor had to be cured, and only Odin was able to do it. Odin use Gungir, but wasn't able to score a solid victory. Which is, to say the least, what Galactus did.

b) Pretty sure he had the gem.

c) ...

d) So what? **** Mephisto, Galactus was about to own Hell!

a) Thanos went to Galactus with the intention to talk but Galactus ignored him. Thanos wasn't looking for a fight. Thanos knocked Galactus off his feet and sent him flying clear across the planet/moon/ship. Thanos couldn't even budge Odin.

b) Nope, he didn't. Adam even commented on how an Asgardian soul isn't like a mortal soul and is fortified against the Soul Gem's attack.

c)...

d) Yes he was about to own "hell" but that's only because Mephisto fought him to a stalemate. Same as what Thor did. Fought Mephisto to a stalemate. Odin would CRUSH Mephisto in or out of his realm.

Originally posted by leonidas
ss also overpowered mephisto in his realm. another time ss was shown to be quite below mephisto in hell. mephisto is simply a bizarre character with high and low showings in hell. ss has also dealt with and defeated the soul gem. with it, adam warlock pwnd mephisto in hell. again, he's got good and bad showings. i'd say g having to resort devouring hell to beat him is NOT the best thing to bring up when talking about galactus's power. I thought SS just 'overpowered' mephisto's atempts to take his oul or corrupt him. it is true that he fluctuates wildly, but it is also true he feigns weakness whenever it suits his pabyrintic plans and is known to put on idiotic shows for otherss

Originally posted by 753
I thought SS just 'overpowered' mephisto's atempts to take his oul or corrupt him. it is true that he fluctuates wildly, but it is also true he feigns weakness whenever it suits his pabyrintic plans and is known to put on idiotic shows for otherss

nah, h2h ss actually drove mephisto to his knees. and i knoiw he, at times, feigns weakness, but that seems a touch.... convenient to me, and i've been hearing it a lot lately when mephisto's name comes up. he's just rather inconsisent. reminds me a little of the stranger in that sense. his uber showings are great, but they get muddled with his lesser ones. i like the character, always have, just really hard to say with any substance what his TRUE level is.

Originally posted by zopzop
a) Thanos went to Galactus with the intention to talk but Galactus ignored him. Thanos wasn't looking for a fight. Thanos knocked Galactus off his feet and sent him flying clear across the planet/moon/ship. Thanos couldn't even budge Odin.

b) Nope, he didn't. Adam even commented on how an Asgardian soul isn't like a mortal soul and is fortified against the Soul Gem's attack.

c)...

d) Yes he was about to own "hell" but that's only because Mephisto fought him to a stalemate. Same as what Thor did. Fought Mephisto to a stalemate. Odin would CRUSH Mephisto in or out of his realm.

What does thanos knocking Galactus off his feet have any importance on? It was stated the very next panel that the blast did nothing whatsoever except to elicit G's anger. You act as if Thanos gave him a mortal blow. Are you now going to count how many blasts it took for Odin to bring Thanos to his knees?

Yes because the same Mephisto that Thor fought was also written as being powerful enough to shake the firmament as a result of their battle. Clearly that Mephisto==the one Galactus fought. Great logic there.

Woodenson... When Doom acquired Galactus power... the didn't even notice the cube falling and losing it. He didn't he NOTICE IT. That should tell you which was more powerful and the more imporant artifact.

Originally posted by Power Cosmic II
What does thanos knocking Galactus off his feet have any importance on? It was stated the very next panel that the blast did nothing whatsoever except to elicit G's anger. You act as if Thanos gave him a mortal blow. Are you now going to count how many blasts it took for Odin to bring Thanos to his knees?

Yes because the same Mephisto that Thor fought was also written as being powerful enough to shake the firmament as a result of their battle. Clearly that Mephisto==the one Galactus fought. Great logic there.

a) I know Galactus wasn't hurt. That was stated on panel. The point was, Thanos could NOT budge Odin one bit, but he humiliated Galactus by sending him flying, even knocking his helmet off. Thanos never hurt Odin AND he never humiliated him the way he humiliated Galactus.

Odin wasn't going all out to kill Thanos, if you don't believe me see his other fights with Galaxy busters like Seth and Surtur where he grows in size and lays the smackdown.

b) Did Mephisto not state ON PANEL, that he couldn't beat Thor and they'd stalemate forever, while in Mephisto's own realm? Was this shown on panel? They even called a grudging truce because the battle was pointless.

Originally posted by zopzop
a) I know Galactus wasn't hurt. That was stated on panel. The point was, Thanos could NOT budge Odin one bit, but he humiliated Galactus by sending him flying, even knocking his helmet off. Thanos never hurt Odin AND he never humiliated him the way he humiliated Galactus.

Odin wasn't going all out to kill Thanos, if you don't believe me see his other fights with Galaxy busters like Seth and Surtur where he grows in size and lays the smackdown.

b) Did Mephisto not state ON PANEL, that he couldn't beat Thor and they'd stalemate forever, while in Mephisto's own realm? Was this shown on panel? They even called a grudging truce because the battle was pointless. humiliated Galactus? by rocking him off balance? G would have twoshot thanos. odin kept dumping energy on him while thanos tanked or forced his throguh way it. it's obvious that the power gap between thanos and G was bigger than the one between odin adn thanos

Originally posted by 753
humiliated Galactus? by rocking him off balance? G would have twoshot thanos. odin kept dumping energy on him while thanos tanked or forced his throguh way it. it's obvious that the power gap between thanos and G was bigger than the one between odin adn thanos

Yes, humiliated :
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/7061/696884thanosblastbigg2s.th.jpg http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/9135/thanos0507ec5.th.jpg

Thanos wasn't doing ANYTHING to Odin aside from annoying him.

Mephisto >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thor.

Galactus >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Odin.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Mephisto >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thor.

Galactus >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Odin.

was there ever any doubt to this?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Mephisto >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thor.

Galactus >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Odin.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
was there ever any doubt to this? Reasonable doubt? No.

Farcical doubt that is manufactured by some of the most ridiculous cherry-picking double-talk around? Plenty.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Mephisto >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thor.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Reasonable doubt? No.

Farcical doubt that is manufactured by some of the most ridiculous cherry-picking double-talk around? Plenty.
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/4020/1693383thor198131022sup.th.jpg

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsMephisto09.jpg

Lol.. Teh ownage..

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsMephisto09.jpg

I L L U S I O N S. But thanks for playing.

^ Heard that excuse before. It wasn't an illusion. And never was it confirmed (much less alluded to) as being an illusion in the slightest.

But using your standards, I might as well say that Mephisto capitulating a stalemate to Thor was "an illusion" as well. At least that's far more in line with the many times Mephisto has feigned defeat to cocky heroes to further his own machinations.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Heard that excuse before. It wasn't an illusion. And never was it confirmed (much less alluded to) as being an illusion in the slightest.

But using your standards, I might as well say that Mephisto capitulating a stalemate to Thor was "an illusion" as well. At least that's far more in line with the many times Mephisto has feigned defeat to cocky heroes to further his own machinations.

So Odin's soul really was in Mephisto's hell?

^ Yeah, that was actually proven to be an illusion, unlike Mephisto holding onto Mjolnir, slagging it and then chucking it back at Thor. The fact that Mephisto did one thing clearly revealed as an illusion does, in no way, support everything else he did as an illusion (when no such suggestion is even made).

You'd have a point if everything else Mephisto did was an illusion. However, the harpy that attacked him and the thorns which were entrapping Thor were not illusions.

Mephisto >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thor.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Yeah, that was actually proven to be an illusion, unlike Mephisto holding onto Mjolnir, slagging it and then chucking it back at Thor. The fact that Mephisto did one thing clearly revealed as an illusion does, in no way, support everything else he did as an illusion (when no such suggestion is even made).

You'd have a point if everything else Mephisto did was an illusion. However, the harpy that attacked him and the thorns which were entrapping Thor were not illusions.

Mephisto >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thor.

So you can't prove it wasn't an illusion any more than I can prove it was, despite the fact that the very next second Mephisto summon's an illusion of Odin's soul? FAIL

nevertheless, one assumtion is more plausible than the other

Yeah, the fact that they were both illusions.

no the fact that Mephisto is greater than Thor

Originally posted by zopzop
So you can't prove it wasn't an illusion any more than I can prove it was, despite the fact that the very next second Mephisto summon's an illusion of Odin's soul? FAIL ... I don't have to prove a negative. Don't be ridiculous.

The harpy and the thorns that attacked Thor weren't illusions. Like I said, Mephisto utterly slagging Mjolnir and chuckng it back at Thor could possibly be seen as an illusion had everything Mephisto did in that fight be a conjured illusion.

Fact is, Odin was the only illusion. Everything else wasn't. And how exactly would that illusion work anyway? Thor throws it Mephisto, Mephisto makes Mjolnir invisible as he dodges it (since he can't pick it up?), conjures up an illusion, slags it, then reforms it and throws it back conveniently right at the exact moment Mjolnir would be on its return flight?

Give me a break.

Originally posted by zopzop
a) I know Galactus wasn't hurt. That was stated on panel. The point was, Thanos could NOT budge Odin one bit, but he humiliated Galactus by sending him flying, even knocking his helmet off. Thanos never hurt Odin AND he never humiliated him the way he humiliated Galactus.

Odin wasn't going all out to kill Thanos, if you don't believe me see his other fights with Galaxy busters like Seth and Surtur where he grows in size and lays the smackdown.

b) Did Mephisto not state ON PANEL, that he couldn't beat Thor and they'd stalemate forever, while in Mephisto's own realm? Was this shown on panel? They even called a grudging truce because the battle was pointless.

So you place a premium on artistic depiction of a white bald man over comments that the blast did nothing except enrage Galactus? You have some pretty fecal logic if you go by the distance one character moves another as an indicator of durability. That only works for someone like juggernaut.

Remind me again how many shots it took for Odin to even move thanos to a compromised position? Wait don't tell me, Odin wasn't trying his hardest and just wanted to lay waste to asgard with his fruitless blasts while Thanos kept going at him again and again and again and again. Odin pulled out gungir because he wasn't trying. Right.

Again your simplistic logic. You're going to tell me that Odin "growing in size and lays the smackdown" against Seth and Surtur is an indicator of Odin holding back against Thanos, while simultaneously excreting the logic that mephisto "growing in size" and shaking the biblical heavens in his battle with Galactus indicates that Mephisto<<<Thor?

I can't imagine how you don't laugh at your own posts. The two Odins you just compared were written by different writers. The two Mephistos you just compared were written by different writers.

Stop arguing with yourself and apply your logic uniformly.

Originally posted by zopzop
Yes, humiliated :
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/7061/696884thanosblastbigg2s.th.jpg http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/9135/thanos0507ec5.th.jpg

Thanos wasn't doing ANYTHING to Odin aside from annoying him.

So annoyed that Odin wanted to destroy asgard with the collateral damage from the blasts he was firing at thanos, right?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
... I don't have to prove a negative. Don't be ridiculous.

The harpy and the thorns that attacked Thor weren't illusions. Like I said, Mephisto utterly slagging Mjolnir and chuckng it back at Thor could possibly be seen as an illusion had everything Mephisto did in that fight be a conjured illusion.

Fact is, Odin was the only illusion. Everything else wasn't. And how exactly would that illusion work anyway? Thor throws it Mephisto, Mephisto makes Mjolnir invisible as he dodges it (since he can't pick it up?), conjures up an illusion, slags it, then reforms it and throws it back conveniently right at the exact moment Mjolnir would be on its return flight?

Give me a break. lol

Originally posted by zopzop
Yes, humiliated :
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/7061/696884thanosblastbigg2s.th.jpg http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/9135/thanos0507ec5.th.jpg

Thanos wasn't doing ANYTHING to Odin aside from annoying him. So you are calling Odin a liar ?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Fact is.....

Fact? FAIL!

You don't have any proof that Mjolnir incident was real especially when he lied not two seconds later with an image of Odin.

Originally posted by Power Cosmic II
So you place a premium on artistic depiction of a white bald man over comments that the blast did nothing except enrage Galactus? You have some pretty fecal logic if you go by the distance one character moves another as an indicator of durability. That only works for someone like juggernaut.

Remind me again how many shots it took for Odin to even move thanos to a compromised position? Wait don't tell me, Odin wasn't trying his hardest and just wanted to lay waste to asgard with his fruitless blasts while Thanos kept going at him again and again and again and again. Odin pulled out gungir because he wasn't trying. Right.

Again your simplistic logic. You're going to tell me that Odin "growing in size and lays the smackdown" against Seth and Surtur is an indicator of Odin holding back against Thanos, while simultaneously excreting the logic that mephisto "growing in size" and shaking the biblical heavens in his battle with Galactus indicates that Mephisto<<<Thor?

I can't imagine how you don't laugh at your own posts. The two Odins you just compared were written by different writers. The two Mephistos you just compared were written by different writers.

Stop arguing with yourself and apply your logic uniformly.

Thanos blasted Galactus off his feet and clear across a planet/moon/whaterver and knocked his helmet off, leaving him a smoldering mess. The fact that it didn't hurt Galactus is meaningless since Thanos likewise didn't hurt Odin but NEVER humiliated him in such a fashion.

Now can you show me scans of Mephisto beating Thor, in or out of his realm? Because the best he did was stalemate. Otherwise STFU and move on with your BS.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So you are calling Odin a liar ?

No, I'm calling Odin lazy. Because we've all seen what happens when he gets serious in a fight.

Originally posted by zopzop
No, I'm calling Odin lazy. Because we've all seen what happens when he gets serious in a fight. Why would Odin suggest he respects Thanos as a worthy opponent if he really just viewed him as a minor annoyance.

Originally posted by zopzop
Thanos blasted Galactus off his feet and clear across a planet/moon/whaterver and knocked his helmet off, leaving him a smoldering mess. The fact that it didn't hurt Galactus is meaningless since Thanos likewise didn't hurt Odin but NEVER humiliated him in such a fashion.

Now can you show me scans of Mephisto beating Thor, in or out of his realm? Because the best he did was stalemate. Otherwise STFU and move on with your BS. even if we were to take this bullshit at facevalue zopzop, all this would demonstrate is that odin is better at bracing himself than Galactus while G's energy output>>>>>>Odin's.

Originally posted by 753
even if we were to take this bullshit at facevalue zopzop, all this would demonstrate is that odin is better at bracing himself than Galactus while G's energy output>>>>>>Odin's.

Galactus was out for blood after Thanos humiliated him. He even expended huge amounts of energy to get through Thanos' shields. Thanos didn't go there looking for a fight but to get his attention and stop him endangering the universe.

It's also true that Thanos didn't go looking for a fight with Odin and the situation was far less dire. From Thanos' perspective, Thor was already subdued and definitely not a universal level threat. From Odin's perspective, Thor was subdued but unharmed, at worst he was their (Thanos and crews) prisoner.

Odin NEVER really poured it on vs Thanos like Galactus did because Thanos was no danger to Odin at all. Thanos never humiliated Odin like he did Galactus. Thanos had Thor as his prisoner but Thor was unharmed. If anything Odin was teaching Thanos a lesson in manners.

@@Zopzop

Odin admitted on panel he was trying to kill Thanos. He failed despite trying and then stopping when he was interrupted. Everything I argue is on panel whereas you make up your own theories regarding Odin's mindset and temperament.

Originally posted by zopzop
Fact? FAIL!

You don't have any proof that Mjolnir incident was real especially when he lied not two seconds later with an image of Odin. I'll not validate this nonsense any further by holding your hands on how to effect reading interpretation and apply the rules of proof. Trying to reinforce a negative proof fallacy with an association fallacy (poorly done btw) hasn't improved your position at all.

It's obvious you want everything that depicted Thor as an inferior to be fake and on the flipside, have flimsy words aggrandizing Thor to be genuine. Your assertions are worthless and baseless.

^I have to agree. Odin was impressed with Thanos, first he saw him like the rest, like an insect that can't take a beating but then he saw that he can tank some damage und got serious. It was a very good durability feat from Thanos.

Odin would have won in the end imho.

Even in the superman vs thanos thread, nearly a third of people gave the majority to supes.

When 92% of a threads respondents vote one way, that is probably a sign that the thread is spite and should be closed.

Originally posted by rotiart
Let's make a poll and end the argument once and for all. Galactus takes on Odin.

No gear for either means non gungir, odinsword, or destroyer armor etc. For Odin.
No worldship, ultimate nullifier etc for galactus.

Galactus wins with no world ship, UN etc vs. Odin with Destroyer armor, gungir, and Odinsword.

Originally posted by zopzop
Thanos blasted Galactus off his feet and clear across a planet/moon/whaterver and knocked his helmet off, leaving him a smoldering mess. The fact that it didn't hurt Galactus is meaningless since Thanos likewise didn't hurt Odin but NEVER humiliated him in such a fashion.

Now can you show me scans of Mephisto beating Thor, in or out of his realm? Because the best he did was stalemate. Otherwise STFU and move on with your BS.

First of all don't ever tell anyone to STFU on this forum. You are one of the worst posters on this board with one of the most horrendous logic I have ever seen. I don't even remember the last time someone elicited so many posts rebuking worthless logic. You've got a talent for it and can't even respond with anything since you're too busy being bent over by everyone else in this thread.

I don't have to show you shit except for your inept debate tactics. Keep cherry picking feats and ignoring context and portrayals by other writers. Someone's made himself into the new kmc whipping boy

Originally posted by Power Cosmic II
First of all don't ever tell anyone to STFU on this forum. You are one of the worst posters on this board with one of the most horrendous logic I have ever seen. I don't even remember the last time someone elicited so many posts rebuking worthless logic. You've got a talent for it and can't even respond with anything since you're too busy being bent over by everyone else in this thread.

I don't have to show you shit except for your inept debate tactics. Keep cherry picking feats and ignoring context and portrayals by other writers. Someone's made himself into the new kmc whipping boy

Translation :
I can't produce scans to backup my reasoning and I'm just going to pout like a child.

You can't produce ANY scans of Mephisto beating Thor in or out of his realm, they fought to a draw and both admitted it would have been an eternal stalemate (I even provided the scans). Yet we have scans of Galactus resorting to devouring Mephisto's realm because like Thor, it was a stalemate.

Odin > Thor. If Thor fought Mephisto to a standstill, Odin would absolutely crush him. Thor performed as well as Galactus vs Mephisto in his own realm till Galactus got tired of the stalemate and attempted to devour Mephisto's hell.

This is all on panel. It's not my opinion. You just don't like it because of how YOU think the fights should have gone down. That's not my problem, it's your problem.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I'll not validate this nonsense any further by holding your hands on how to effect reading interpretation and apply the rules of proof. Trying to reinforce a negative proof fallacy with an association fallacy (poorly done btw) hasn't improved your position at all.

It's obvious you want everything that depicted Thor as an inferior to be fake and on the flipside, have flimsy words aggrandizing Thor to be genuine. Your assertions are worthless and baseless.

Let me get this straight, we have a skyfather level artifact that has absorbed galaxy busting attacks, shattered Celestial armor, defied other Skyfathers attempts to overcome it's enchantments, and is backed by the most powerful active Skyfather in Marvel vs a guy that uses illusions and lies to confuse his opponents and during the very issue where he claimed to have reduced the hammer to pudding also lied about summoning a skyfather's spirit (literally the very next thing he did after "reducing the hammer to pudding" was summoning "Odin" to confront Thor).

My money is on it's an illusion. This assumption is no less valid then your assumption that Mephisto actually reduced the hammer to pudding.

What isn't an assumption and backed up with on panel evidence is : neither could defeat the other and the fight (even in Mephisto's realm) would be an eternal stalemate.

^ Mephisto didn't claim anything. He did it.

Mephisto has curbstomped teams of heroes. Mephisto took on Galactus straight up in his realm. Retconned the 616 universe.

Making Thor and Mjolnir's enchantment look trite in the face of his evil was as simple as he made it look.

Like I said, your negative proof fallacies aren't reinforced with association fallacies. Find a better argument or deal with it.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Mephisto >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thor.


Mephisto's been defeated by characters on Thor's level,. hasn't he?

I know Surfer did it, in his own realm, and he's not >>>>>> then Thor.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Mephisto didn't claim anything. He did it.

Mephisto has curbstomped teams of heroes. Mephisto took on Galactus straight up in his realm. Retconned the 616 universe.

Making Thor and Mjolnir's enchantment look trite in the face of his evil was as simple as he made it look.

Like I said, your negative proof fallacies aren't reinforced with association fallacies. Find a better argument or deal with it.

Why? He literally LIED TO THOR'S FACE and produced the "spirit" of his father and claimed it was the real Odin, RIGHT AFTER he "reduced Mjolnir to pudding". My argument is just fine.

Plus I produced scans stating that Mephisto could NOT BEAT THOR even in Mephisto's own realm. This isn't my opinion, this is stated on panel.

Originally posted by cdtm
Mephisto's been defeated by characters on Thor's level,. hasn't he?

I know Surfer did it, in his own realm, and he's not >>>>>> then Thor.

Context.

Mephisto vs the Silver Surfer comes down to Mephisto NOT wanting to kill Surfer but break him, so he can lay claim to his soul. For all Surfer's power, he's still a mortal. On panel Mephisto claimed he could crush the Surfer whenever he wants but doesn't want to because he wants his soul. Then he proved it by kicking his @$$ and it took Galactus to save Surfer and Nova.

Basically the only thing that saves Surfer from Mephisto, is the Surfer's "pure soul" garbage.

Thor is a GOD. Big difference. Mephisto stated on panel that he could not beat Thor, even within Mephisto's own realm. Sure Thor wouldn't win either, but he wouldn't lose. The fight would go on for eternity.

http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff512/Thorshammmer/mephistoholdsback.jpg

Originally posted by zopzop
Why? He literally LIED TO THOR'S FACE and produced the "spirit" of his father and claimed it was the real Odin, RIGHT AFTER he "reduced Mjolnir to pudding". My argument is just fine.

Plus I produced scans stating that Mephisto could NOT BEAT THOR even in Mephisto's own realm. This isn't my opinion, this is stated on panel. That's an association fallacy. I might as well argue that since your last argument was stupid, so must this one as well. In fact, let's run with that.

Mephisto's taken on worse. Deal with it.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
That's an association fallacy. I might as well argue that since your last argument was stupid, so must this one as well. In fact, let's run with that.

Mephisto's taken on worse. Deal with it.

And yet he COULD NOT BEAT THOR in his own realm by his own admission and had to relinquish the souls he stole.

^ And yet, he's made Thor look like a weak feeb, encasing him in mystic mylar. He's taken on Galactus straight up, something Thor cannot do. Mephisto has admitted that he cannot slay Surfer, Doom, Strange, etc. He wants their souls.

You want to cherrypick, that's your prerogative.

Retconning 616 universe >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything Thor's done.

Suck on that cherry for all its worth.

Originally posted by zopzop
Context.

Mephisto vs the Silver Surfer comes down to Mephisto NOT wanting to kill Surfer but break him, so he can lay claim to his soul. For all Surfer's power, he's still a mortal. On panel Mephisto claimed he could crush the Surfer whenever he wants but doesn't want to because he wants his soul. Then he proved it by kicking his @$$ and it took Galactus to save Surfer and Nova.

Basically the only thing that saves Surfer from Mephisto, is the Surfer's "pure soul" garbage.




Thor is a GOD. Big difference. Mephisto stated on panel that he could not beat Thor, even within Mephisto's own realm. Sure Thor wouldn't win either, but he wouldn't lose. The fight would go on for eternity.

http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff512/Thorshammmer/mephistoholdsback.jpg

Mephisto also admitted defeat to Surfer. You've probably seen the scan, but if not I'll try and locate it..

Regardless, you're saying Mephisto was using illusions/lying against Thor, yet being truthful against Surfer when he claimed his PC is nothing? Sounds like a double standard.

And like you admitted yourself, Mephisto did take on Big G:

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/7/71145/1600687-606739_mephistobattlesgalactusan2_super_super.jpg

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/7/71145/1566547-mephisto_super.jpg

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/7/71145/1566539-299926_8_mephisto_vs_galactus_super_super.jpg

If that's Mephisto's operating power level in his own realm, neither Thor nor Surfer have any business defeating him. At least, not on sheer power.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ And yet, he's made Thor look like a weak feeb, encasing him in mystic mylar.

Context genius. He was at death's door after the fight with the Serpent and cursed by Hela.

http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/1480/ownedkm.th.jpg

Suck on that.



And Mephisto still can't beat Thor by his own admission as shown on panel.

Originally posted by cdtm

If that's Mephisto's operating power level in his own realm, neither Thor nor Surfer have any business defeating him. At least, not on sheer power.

Surfer never has without resorting to that "pure soul" garbage. But Thor at least stalemated Mephisto fair and square. I even provided the scan. He didn't beat Mephisto, but Mephisto admitted he couldn't beat Thor either and that they'd fight for eternity.

Originally posted by zopzop
Context genius. He was at death's door after the fight with the Serpent and cursed by Hela.

http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/1480/ownedkm.th.jpg

Suck on that. Which affected his physical body. His soul was released from his physical body. Read the comic, nimrod. Originally posted by zopzop
And Mephisto still can't beat Thor by his own admission as shown on panel. Yeah, just play around with him like he does all heroes and tackle opponents far beyond Thor's own station.

Your description of Mephisto's tribulations with Thor echoes Surfer, Strange, Doom, etc. Nothing new. Deal with it.

Originally posted by zopzop


Context genius. He was at death's door after the fight with the Serpent and cursed by Hela.

http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/1480/ownedkm.th.jpg

Suck on that.



And Mephisto still can't beat Thor by his own admission as shown on panel.

"You will be mine, one way or another. I shall possess you!"

"by freeing my soul, you've handed me the means to victory."

"I see the truth in it. I-I cannot break him."

Your own scan proves Mephisto isn't trying to defeat Thor, but break and possess him.

And from Thor's words, it sounds like he's not even using a corporal form, but fighting as a spirit/soul. I can buy Thor "defeating" Mephisto by refusing to be broken and indefinitely defy him.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Which affected his physical body. His soul was released from his physical body. Read the comic, nimrod. Yeah, just play around with him like he does all heroes and tackle opponents far beyond Thor's own station.

Uhm he was dying and cursed by Hela. His soul was being fought over by two Death Gods. This wasn't a "normal" fight by any means. We saw what happened when a HEALTHY and LIVING Thor took the fight to Mephisto in Mephisto's realm. Mephisto couldn't do jack to him except stalemate him.



Except we have Mephisto stating on panel that he could not beat Thor in a straight up fight where Thor isn't a spirit, cursed or otherwise hampered.

Originally posted by cdtm
"You will be mine, one way or another. I shall possess you!"

"by freeing my soul, you've handed me the means to victory."

"I see the truth in it. I-I cannot break him."

Your own scan proves Mephisto isn't trying to defeat Thor, but break and possess him.

And from Thor's words, it sounds like he's not even using a corporal form, but fighting as a spirit/soul. I can buy Thor "defeating" Mephisto by refusing to be broken and indefinitely defy him.

Dude that was in responsible to OneDumb, Thor was DYING and cursed by Hela. It wasn't a fair fight. That was Thor's spirit that Hela and Mephisto were fighting over.

This is the scan I was referring to when I replied to you :
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/4020/1693383thor198131022sup.th.jpg