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Stipulations: Gamora starts the match pre defeated.

No, he doesn't need it. Debate.

Danny.

gamora

Gamora

Danny.

Iron Fist has the speed and skill advantage, but Gamora has durability advantage and the capability to one shot. Danny's Iron Fist is powerful, but it will take several clean hits to put out Gamora's lights and she should be able to land a single hit before that happens.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Iron Fist has the speed and skill advantage, but Gamora has durability advantage and the capability to one shot. Danny's Iron Fist is powerful, but it will take several clean hits to put out Gamora's lights and she should be able to land a single hit before that happens. I'd actually say post Orson teachings Danny has a very good shot at beating Gamora. Learning from a guy who's got a book of 64 generations of Iron Fist's techniques is no joke.

Originally posted by Uriel005
I'd actually say post Orson teachings Danny has a very good shot at beating Gamora. Learning from a guy who's got a book of 64 generations of Iron Fist's techniques is no joke.

In practice what has he actual done since getting the book that makes you think he could take out Gamora?

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
In practice what has he actual done since getting the book that makes you think he could take out Gamora?
that is the problem. I bet that he won't learn anything from it. If he does it'll be years from now when he gets another ongoing from someone who cares.

Gamora would be 10 Iron FIst.

I can't see Iron Fist winning this at all. He may impress her with his tenacity but he's outgunned.

He's no longer tired out by chi use so IF is spammable as are chi enhancements to contend with Gamora.

Gamora is faster in running speed and h2h combat (but i don't think anything IF can't contend with) as far as skillwise they are about even. But Gamora is going to have a clear reach/strength/durability advantage.

Gamora is good enough to tank IF best hits and is she does get hit she can tank a few of the mightiest blows but we must not forget her crazy healing factor as well. So yeah IF is in for a beat down.

Originally posted by Uriel005
He's no longer tired out by chi use so IF is spammable as are chi enhancements to contend with Gamora.

He went for hours against Chiantang, who defeated the Defenders in a later story. (Hulk, Strange, and Namor among the team.)

http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz176/jalekmoye/Danny%20respect%20thread/fights/dragon.jpg

http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz176/jalekmoye/Danny%20respect%20thread/fights/dragon1.jpg

http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz176/jalekmoye/Danny%20respect%20thread/fights/dragon2.jpg

http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz176/jalekmoye/Danny%20respect%20thread/fights/dragon3.jpg

http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz176/jalekmoye/Danny%20respect%20thread/fights/dragon4.jpg

http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz176/jalekmoye/Danny%20respect%20thread/fights/dragon5.jpg

http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz176/jalekmoye/Danny%20respect%20thread/fights/dragon6.jpg

He was crazed, but that didn't affect his strength or stamina. That was all Danny, using his full potential.

This is right up there with Gamora knocking around Maxim and making Drax say "Ow" with a kick, imo.

But it's so out there even for Danny, it might be a little PIS.. I mean, the Dark Dragon took out Hulk, Dr. Strange, Namor, and Surfer! And I can't see Danny doing anything to Maxim, like Gamora did..

On the other hand, Gamora can knock around class 100's, but isn't a class 100 herself. Usually, if she takes a good hit from the heavyweights, she goes down...

I'm not sure how to call this. Basically, if Gamora has the speed and durability feats, she wins. If she doesn't, Danny wins. Even if Gamora was class 50, that simply isn't enough, because the Wrecking Crew and Cage were around that tier when Danny took them down...

I dont feel that Danny should be competing with Gamora, but I admit that I might rate her a little higher than most others.

Originally posted by tkitna
I dont feel that Danny should be competing with Gamora, but I admit that I might rate her a little higher than most others. How do you rate IF?

Originally posted by Mindset
How do you rate IF?

A fair question.

I rate him about mid tier myself. Really, a mid tier killer (Look at what he's done to Luke Cage..), but out classed by upper tiers like Namor or Herc.

IF is a bit of a glass cannon in the sense that he's strong enough to take out a mid-tier (with the Iron Fist strike) but has street-level durability.

Originally posted by oldsmokey
IF is a bit of a glass cannon in the sense that he's strong enough to take out a mid-tier (with the Iron Fist strike) but has street-level durability.

He has FAR beyond street level durability.

Originally posted by dmills
He has FAR beyond street level durability.

Indeed.

A much weaker Danny survived a character exploding that was basically a walking nuclear reactor.

I would say:

Strength: Gamora (but IF attacks can exceed the power of her attacks)
Speed: Iron Fist (since he has the better speed feats)
Skill: Iron Fist (but not by a lot)
Durability: Gamora (although IF has some nice feats here too)

Conclusion: A good fight.
Well maybe Gamora a slight majority. I'm still not sure though.

IF is good.. but all things considered Gamora is a bit better IMO.

Originally posted by Mshinu
IF is good.. but all things considered Gamora is a bit better IMO. Better at what?

Originally posted by Mindset
Better at what?

Kicking butt obviously. As I said, IMO.

But IF has kicked better butt.

Originally posted by Mindset
But IF has kicked better butt.

Gamora did kick around Drax and Maxim.

The best Iron Fist did, was Iron Man and War Machine. And maybe that Dark Dragon, but you could argue that's PIS because he kicked around Hulk, Surfer, Thor, Strange, and Namor at the same time..

But that doesn't mean Danny can't walk all over her. Not if he's faster, and can dish out more than she can take. After all, when Maxim hits her, she loses.. Generally, she competes outside her weight class by not getting hit. So it's up to Gamora supporters to prove her durability is beyond anything Danny can hurt, and her speed is quicker than what Danny can keep up with.

Arnold may be much stronger than Bruce Lee, but he still ain't beating him in a fight.

Originally posted by cdtm
Gamora did kick around Drax and Maxim.

The best Iron Fist did, was Iron Man and War Machine. And maybe that Dark Dragon, but you could argue that's PIS because he kicked around Hulk, Surfer, Thor, Strange, and Namor at the same time..

But that doesn't mean Danny can't walk all over her. Not if he's faster, and can dish out more than she can take. After all, when Maxim hits her, she loses.. Generally, she competes outside her weight class by not getting hit. So it's up to Gamora supporters to prove her durability is beyond anything Danny can hurt, and her speed is quicker than what Danny can keep up with.

Arnold may be much stronger than Bruce Lee, but he still ain't beating him in a fight. You're talking the new weaker Drax, right?

IF could beat him, as could Iron Man.


If you meant the old Drax, then she didn't do anything to him except make some hits that didn't even hurt him. IF would have done better.

Originally posted by Mindset
You're talking the new weaker Drax, right?

IF could beat him, as could Iron Man.

No, the dumb version.

They never really fought, but she did kick him into a mountainside or wall a few times, and he said "Ow" from it. Nothing major, but still more than I can see even Danny Rand doing (Or at least, can't think of a comparable example.)

And Maxim's up there himself in strength. High class 100, good durability. Even challenged Drax to an arm wrestling competition.

Originally posted by cdtm
No, the dumb version.

They never really fought, but she did kick him into a mountainside or wall a few times, and he said "Ow" from it. Nothing major, but still more than I can see even Danny Rand doing (Or at least, can't think of a comparable example.)

And Maxim's up there himself in strength. High class 100, good durability. Even challenged Drax to an arm wrestling competition. Danny took down a helicarrier with a punch.

He hits harder than Gamora, he is faster than Gamora, and he is at least as skilled.

He would have done better.

I don't recall her really doing anything to Drax. Nothing of significance, at least.

Can you see Danny challenging Namor? Or Hulk?

Because, Maxim's in that weight class, and Gamora was knocking him around with attacks.

Yes, I can.

If you actually look at the fight between Gamora and Maxim you'd see she did what anyone with super speed and super strength could do. In fact, Spiderman and IF would probably do better.

You act like IF doesn't take on Class 100s.

Originally posted by Mindset
Yes, I can.

If you actually look at the fight between Gamora and Maxim you'd see she did what anyone with super speed and super strength could do. In fact, Spiderman and IF would probably do better.

You act like IF doesn't take on Class 100s.

What class 100's did he challenge, and do as well against?

He didn't do so well against Hiromi, who's probably roughly on par with Savage Hulk..

Wrecking Crew, Thing. and Iron Man.

Hiromi is also a better fighter than SH.

Namor usually kicks Iron Mans arse though. Thing, too.

As for the Wrecking Crew, weren't they class 50 back in those days?

It doesn't matter how much more powerful Gamora is than Iron Fist. She could be a million times more powerful, but she could never be more powerful than the Fist

Originally posted by cdtm
Namor usually kicks Iron Mans arse though. Thing, too.

As for the Wrecking Crew, weren't they class 50 back in those days? And IM would kick Maxim's ass.

Namor would kick Maxim's ass.

Thing would kick Maxim's ass.

Do you see where I'm going with this?

Originally posted by Mindset
And IM would kick Maxim's ass.

Namor would kick Maxim's ass.

Thing would kick Maxim's ass.

Do you see where I'm going with this?

Maxim is much close to Namor's class, though.

Iron Man or Thing on their best day can't really bother Namor much. The guy can probably take Thing and Iron Man at the same time. I mean, Namor can give Herc a good fight. HERC! Do you want to argue Iron Man or Thing, or both at the same time, can make Herc work up much of a sweat?

Being 100% honest here, I think Danny Rand would be more of a threat than Thing or Iron Man would, h2h.

IMO, even though Gamora didn't really cause Maxim serious damage, her performance against him is equivalent to performing well against Namor, Herc, Thor, or characters in that weight class.

Edit: And I forgot to add my point:

While I think Danny can do better than IM or Thing against Namor, or even Maxim, do any examples exist of Danny performing as well as Gamora did against characters in that weight class, as they do for Gamora? She has the Maxim fights, and the Ronan fight. Others, too.

So what does Danny have besides Iron Man or Thing?

Originally posted by cdtm
Maxim is much close to Namor's class, though.

Iron Man or Thing on their best day can't really bother Namor much. The guy can probably take Thing and Iron Man at the same time. I mean, Namor can give Herc a good fight. HERC! Do you want to argue Iron Man or Thing, or both at the same time, can make Herc work up much of a sweat?

Being 100% honest here, I think Danny Rand would be more of a threat than Thing or Iron Man would, h2h.

IMO, even though Gamora didn't really cause Maxim serious damage, her performance against him is equivalent to performing well against Namor, Herc, Thor, or characters in that weight class.

Edit: And I forgot to add my point:

While I think Danny can do better than IM or Thing against Namor, or even Maxim, do any examples exist of Danny performing as well as Gamora did against characters in that weight class, as they do for Gamora? She has the Maxim fights, and the Ronan fight. Others, too.

So what does Danny have besides Iron Man or Thing?
No, he really isn't.


If you think IM or Thing can't bother Namor, then you have no idea what these characters are capable of, seriously. Yes, IM and Thing can make Herc work up a sweat. IM more so than Thing because he has the speed advantage.

She didn't do anything to Maxim, she danced around him. Street levelers do that to Class 100s all the time. Her performance against Maxim is like Spiderman's performance against Hulk.

Originally posted by Mindset
And IM would kick Maxim's ass.

Namor would kick Maxim's ass.

Thing would kick Maxim's ass.

Do you see where I'm going with this?

Maxam would shit all over those who you just named. In one-on-one.

He one-shotted Wonderman, and bfr Hercules himself by outwrestling him.

Iron Fist would break his hand on him.

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Maxam would shit all over those who you just named. In one-on-one.

He one-shotted Wonderman, and bfr Hercules himself by outwrestling him.

Iron Fist would break his hand on him. You don't know anything you're talking about.

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Maxam would shit all over those who you just named. In one-on-one.

He one-shotted Wonderman, and bfr Hercules himself by outwrestling him.

Iron Fist would break his hand on him. I agree, Fist would break Maxam's hand on Maxam's unconscious body

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
I agree, Fist would break Maxam's hand on Maxam's unconscious body

There are so few of us geniuses left.

Originally posted by Mindset
How do you rate IF?

Without his Chi, he's a basic street leveler in my opinion. Since he has it though, he seems to be able to put down some characters that would seem way out of his league.

He's bad ass, but I just cant ever see him holding his own against somebody like Ronan. Heck, I dont know. Gamora has more low showings than high, so I guess Danny stands a chance.

I would say Danny definitely has a chance by the mere facts:

1. His attack power is much greater than hers
2. His speed and skill are slightly greater than hers

Originally posted by h1a8

2. His speed and skill are slightly greater than hers

Why do you think this? I'm not saying either way, i'm just curious as to what he's done that sets him at a higher tier then her regarding speed and skill.

Originally posted by tkitna
Why do you think this? I'm not saying either way, i'm just curious as to what he's done that sets him at a higher tier then her regarding speed and skill.

Danny has wins and stalemates over top tier martial artists. The only character of any mentionable skill Gamora has fought was Wolverine, and she didn't win.

Speed feats isn't even worth mentioning. Iron Fist as speed feats. Gamora does not.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Danny has wins and stalemates over top tier martial artists. The only character of any mentionable skill Gamora has fought was Wolverine, and she didn't win.


You mean when she got distracted and Wolverine was finally able to land with his claws. All things considered, she was doing pretty good before the distraction.

Again, not arguing because I dont have all of her appearances and definatly dont have all of Dannys, but when a character gets labeled as the 'Most Dangerous Woman In The Universe' and fights people like Ronan, Thanos, and Maxam, its hard for me to give IF the win. Maybe all of Marvels women are losers. Who knows.

Maybe someone can enlighten me, because I know almost nothing about Gamora's martial arts feats, but why is she on the same level as Karate Kid on KMC's Martial Artist Heirarchy ?

Then again, I disagree with the placement of a number of people on that list...

Originally posted by Cogito
Maybe someone can enlighten me, because I know almost nothing about Gamora's martial arts feats, but why is she on the same level as Karate Kid on KMC's Martial Artist Heirarchy ?

Then again, I disagree with the placement of a number of people on that list...

Because some people on KMC are insane. Thanos was on the same level as Karate Kid on that skill chart for a long time.

Originally posted by tkitna
You mean when she got distracted and Wolverine was finally able to land with his claws. All things considered, she was doing pretty good before the distraction.

Again, not arguing because I dont have all of her appearances and definatly dont have all of Dannys, but when a character gets labeled as the 'Most Dangerous Woman In The Universe' and fights people like Ronan, Thanos, and Maxam, its hard for me to give IF the win. Maybe all of Marvels women are losers. Who knows.

Made me spit up my Pepsi @ "Maybe all Marvels women are losers. Who knows."

Originally posted by tkitna
You mean when she got distracted and Wolverine was finally able to land with his claws. All things considered, she was doing pretty good before the distraction.


Just looked at this little scuffle again and it wasnt anything. I thought they had an extended fight for a few panels on this occasion, but was wrong. Oh well, I still think she would win, but maybe not.

Originally posted by tkitna
Just looked at this little scuffle again and it wasnt anything. I thought they had an extended fight for a few panels on this occasion, but was wrong. Oh well, I still think she would win, but maybe not.

She beats Danny. Her damage soak and strength are too high, and Danny is neither skilled nor fast enough to avoid her indefinitely while peppering her with IFs and she only needs to connect once to win.

Sorry, Mindset. I did want Danny to win this..

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/3816/annihilationronan3005xy3.jpg

http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/6162/annihilationronan3007vz4.jpg

But even he isn't putting someone down who tanked a hit from his universal weapon.

Plus, here's the Drax moment I mentioned earlier:

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/6779/warlockandtheinfinitywapr3.th.jpg
http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/9818/goodshotvt4.th.jpg

She did that to stupidly powerful dumb Drax.

Also, if Wolverine gave any trouble at all to that Gamora, it's total PIS.

Originally posted by cdtm
Also, if Wolverine gave any trouble at all to that Gamora, it's total PIS.

Wolverine would completely and utterly trash Gamora.

I don't see how. Ronan's universal weapon messed can challenge Surfer, and utterly messed up Ravenous, a guy who gave Surfer a hard time. And Logans going to stand up against that?

If he can do it, Danny can certainly do it, considering Danny is >>> Wolverine. But I can't see Danny doing it.

Originally posted by cdtm
I don't see how. Ronan's universal weapon messed can challenge Surfer, and utterly messed up Ravenous, a guy who gave Surfer a hard time. And Logans going to stand up against that?

If he can do it, Danny can certainly do it, considering Danny is >>> Wolverine. But I can't see Danny doing it.

While I disagree with Sranks view of Wolverine vs Danny. Wolverine's attacks are piercing while Danny's are blunt/energy. Character don't necessarily have the same defense for both. Srank admitted that Danny is faster and better than her so assuming Wolverine is his equal I get why he thinks Wolverine would win and Danny wouldn't

Originally posted by cdtm
I don't see how. Ronan's universal weapon messed can challenge Surfer, and utterly messed up Ravenous, a guy who gave Surfer a hard time. And Logans going to stand up against that?

If he can do it, Danny can certainly do it, considering Danny is >>> Wolverine. But I can't see Danny doing it.

Ronan jobbed to Gamora and fought like and idiot. If he fought like that against Wolverine, Logan would give him a fight too. He should have just trapped her indefinitely in a stasis field and beat her unconscious. He used his abilities sparingly and got into a needless slug feast with a character he could have effortlessly beat, for the sake of making the issue entertaining.

Gamora lacks the damage output to overwhelm Wolverine's healing factor before he overloads hers. Wolverine and Danny have different types of damage output. Wolverine has slashing / piercing damage, Danny's is blunt. Gamora has high end durability that will help her tank Iron Fist's IF, but she won't be able to turn Wolverine's claws with her durability, and she doesn't heal fast enough to get sliced up and keep fighting. In GotG it took her weeks to regen her skin after she got burnt up, Wolverine does that in between panels. If you gave Danny a bladed weapon he would likely beat Gamora as well, but as it stands she is too durable for his method of attack.

FYI Wolverine would leave Iron Fist out at the curb for the Garbageman too.

*weeping joy* Verily, I doth sense the truth in your words! *crying*

Originally posted by srankmissingnin

FYI Wolverine would leave Iron Fist out at the curb for the Garbageman too.

Mindsets right again, as usual.

Last time I'll ever doubt it.

Originally posted by Mindset
Yes, I can.

If you actually look at the fight between Gamora and Maxim you'd see she did what anyone with super speed and super strength could do. In fact, Spiderman and IF would probably do better.

You act like IF doesn't take on Class 100s.

I don't know what I was thinking. You're right, as usual.

Danny wins.

Lets never fight again. ^_^

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
If you gave Danny a bladed weapon he would likely beat Gamora as well, but as it stands she is too durable for his method of attack.

Often forgotten: Danny can cut like a blade with his IF.

As for the fight, I'm leaning toward Gamora. Danny hits harder, but only with the IFs. I doubt it's hard enough to KO post-power up Gamora, who was shrugging off Ronan's hammer. IF hits hard, but his non-IF striking power is only around Cap's level. Danny has better than peak-human durability and stamina, IMO, but he's not taking many of Gamora's regular blows.

So really, it all comes down to how fast you think Gamora is. We know she's fast enoughto taunt other superpowered people about their inability to hit them/make them hit each other by accident/etc (guys like Thanos, Rogue and Thor come to mind). Beyond that, it's unquantifiable by feats. Danny, by feats, is much faster.

Originally posted by Dream Stuff
Often forgotten: Danny can cut like a blade with his IF.

As for the fight, I'm leaning toward Gamora. Danny hits harder, but only with the IFs. I doubt it's hard enough to KO post-power up Gamora, who was shrugging off Ronan's hammer. IF hits hard, but his non-IF striking power is only around Cap's level. Danny has better than peak-human durability and stamina, IMO, but he's not taking many of Gamora's regular blows.

So really, it all comes down to how fast you think Gamora is. We know she's fast enoughto taunt other superpowered people about their inability to hit them/make them hit each other by accident/etc (guys like Thanos, Rogue and Thor come to mind). Beyond that, it's unquantifiable by feats. Danny, by feats, is much faster.

Lets talk Danny's durability:

It's good enough to shrug off hits from War Machine, not to mention survive this:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v330/CDTM3000/IronFist03-TheCitysNotforBurning-18.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v330/CDTM3000/IronFist04-Holocaust-01.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v330/CDTM3000/IronFist04-Holocaust-02.jpg

The explosion injured him pretty badly, but he survived.. To merely grapple with a walking uranium pile, Danny would need durability higher than Cap or Spidey, imo...

At the least, his durability should be good enough to take the odd hit or two. But since imo he's faster, most blows would be glancing ones.




The thing is, Ronan one shot KOed Ravenous! And he, in turn, was surviving Surfer making black holes on top of him..

Unless you're willing to argue Gamora is more durable than Ravenous, and also without comparable feats to draw on, I'm inclined to call that one PIS.. Maxim did one shot KO her, and I've seen Gamora have problems with lesser attacks than what Ronan and his universal weapon can dish out..

he'd fist him to death

Draw. 5/5

Originally posted by cdtm
Lets talk Danny's durability:

It's good enough to shrug off hits from War Machine, not to mention survive this:

At the least, his durability should be good enough to take the odd hit or two. But since imo he's faster, most blows would be glancing ones.

Not doubting Danny's durability. I think it's a crime when people claim he's only peak human without his special attack. And he is expressly gifted at rolling with hits. That said, he's still going to feel ever blow Gamora lands, given her striking power (KOing Terrax, one-shotting She Hulk, etc).




I'm not saying she's more durable than Ravenous. To be fair, Ronan's hit on Ravenous got him flat-footed directly to the side of his face so hard it broke the hammer. Had Gamora let herself get hit as squarely as that, she would have gone down too. Still, she took a couple of hits, including an energy blast Ronan was bragging about that didn't noticeably slow her down. I think that fight is a good measure of her post-powerup durability.

That's a reminder, Gamora has gotten an explicit power-up since Maxim got her and she had "problems with lesser attacks."

Gamora and easily

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Gamora and easily

This.

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Gamora

Gamora

Gamora.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Gamora and easily Wrong.Originally posted by Glorificus
This. Not this.Originally posted by Stoic
Gamora Wrong.Originally posted by thanos-prime
Gamora. Wrong.

Originally posted by Mindset
Wrong. Not this. Wrong. Wrong. Hehe.