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The Light and the Dark join to fight a threat to the entire galaxy. Can they win?

If its too tough they have Sourge there as well.

The Sith Emperor can destroy them all. He is an organic weapon of mass destruction.

The Sith Emperor eliminated his entire Dark Council comprising of the strongest Sith Lords in the Galaxy by himself simultaneously.

Damn you - Bioware.

Depends. Satele is grand master and Malgus is uber powerful at the end of the TOR game. Most likely they get owned.

Indeed.

Together, Satele Shan and Darth Malgus can dominate most adversaries in the history of the Star Wars. I believe, they can take out even Darth Sidious.

However, the problem is that it is impossible to survive Sith Emperor's Force powers. Any Jedi or Sith caught is TOAST after a while.

The three of them (at peak) might be capable of defeating the Sith Emperor but they can also die in the process.

Revan held his own for a time. If he had someone like Malgus attacking the Emperor simultaneously, it's pretty possible to beat the Emperor. I'm not familiar with Satele's powers.

They can defeat Sidious but not Tenebrae? Interesting.

Revan's command of the Force is unique. He was more powerful then even Darth Nihilus.

He performed a feat that no other Jedi or Sith has ever performed in the history of Star Wars:

The Emperor stood in the exact same position as before; it was as if he hadn't even moved. Revan began to sense the oppressive presence of the dark side weighing down on him. The Emperor was trying to crush his will: to dominate and enslave his mind as he had before. This time, however, Revan was ready.

Instead of charging forward, he opened himself up to the Force, letting both the light and the dark side flow through him like twin rushing rivers. But instead of focusing or channeling the Force, he released it in its purest form.

There was brilliant flash as the air between the two combatants lit up. The energy unleashed was powerful enough to send Revan staggering. The Emperor, unprepared and with much of his strength diverted to his effort to dominate Revan's mind, was sent flying backward.

However, when Sith Emperor unleashed his Force attacks, Revan was in serious trouble.

Satele Shan has been described as a Force prodigy.

Check a video of her here:

1ToztqqDcaY

She becomes more powerful afterwards.

Originally posted by Nephthys
They can defeat Sidious but not Tenebrae? Interesting.
You have no clue of his power.

No one can survive his Force powers. No one.

The Darth Sidious you saw in the movies is nothing in comparison.

Only DE Sidious is a worthy opponent. However, that too because of his ability to create Force Storms.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Revan's command of the Force is unique. He was more powerful then even Darth Nihilus.

He performed a feat that no other Jedi or Sith has ever performed in the history of Star Wars:

The Emperor stood in the exact same position as before; it was as if he hadn't even moved. Revan began to sense the oppressive presence of the dark side weighing down on him. The Emperor was trying to crush his will: to dominate and enslave his mind as he had before. This time, however, Revan was ready.

Instead of charging forward, he opened himself up to the Force, letting both the light and the dark side flow through him like twin rushing rivers. But instead of focusing or channeling the Force, he released it in its purest form.

There was brilliant flash as the air between the two combatants lit up. The energy unleashed was powerful enough to send Revan staggering. The Emperor, unprepared and with much of his strength diverted to his effort to dominate Revan's mind, was sent flying backward.

However, when Sith Emperor unleashed his Force attacks, Revan was in serious trouble.

He sent him flying backwards?


Yes, unprecidented.


(I know what you meant, but using the light an dark sides at once doesn't mean that he unstoppable. The energy released doesn't seem to be that damaging or powerful. That technique doesn't really seem that offensively powerful.)

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
You have no clue of his power.

No one can survive his Force powers. No one.

The Darth Sidious you saw in the movies is nothing in comparison.

Only DE Sidious is a worthy opponent. However, that too because of his ability to create Force Storms.


What about Abeloth? She destroyed an entire city is a fit of rage at one point.

Originally posted by Nephthys
He sent him flying backwards?


Yes, unprecidented.


(I know what you meant, but using the light an dark sides at once doesn't mean that he unstoppable. The energy released doesn't seem to be that damaging or powerful. That technique doesn't really seem that offensively powerful.)
You have no clue of what you are talking about. It was a signature move which unleashed the Force in its purest form. Revan's focus was on countering the immense mental barrage of the Sith Emperor. He was not trying to crush the entire building.

You cannot even expect to even nudge Sith Emperor from his position when he is attacking you.

Originally posted by Nephthys
What about Abeloth? She destroyed an entire city is a fit of rage at one point.
The Sith Emperor destroyed all life of an entire planet and also removed the Force completely from it. He devoured every organic being in the process ranging from tiny insects to powerful Sith Lords. He himself survived that kind of power projection and became more powerful then anything in the Star Wars Galaxy. Those who dared to step in to that planet were shocked to the core and could not survive on its surface for long periods.

A 1000 years later, he was planning to exterminate the entire Galaxy and not just the Republic.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
You have no clue of what you are talking about. It was a signature move which unleashed the Force in its purest form. Revan's focus was on countering the immense mental barrage of the Sith Emperor. He was not trying to crush the entire building.

You cannot even expect to even nudge Sith Emperor from his position when he is attacking you.

You're wrong. Your assertion that it was a technique meant to counter the Emperors telepathical assault is simply an unfounded interpretation. Didn't Revan also teach Scourge and the Exile how to resist the Emperors telepaphic powers? Were they also able to channel the Light and Dark sides?

And if that technique is only meant to counter telepathic domination, how then will it enable Revan to defeat Nihilus, who does not fight with telepathy?

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
The Sith Emperor destroyed all life in the entire planet and also removed the Force completetly from it. He devoured every organic being in the process ranging from tiny insects to powerful Sith Lords.

Also, he was planning to exterminate the entire Galaxy.


Are you refering to the ritual that took him several weeks and needed several hundred Sith Lords to complete? Well yes, I'm sue he can use that ability in combat.

So was Nihilus.

Nihilus seems more impressive than the sith emperor IMO. He caused mass destruction on a planetary level and drained the life essence of 100 jedi, in what? Minutes? It took a ritual for the sith emperor to drain 100 dark lords without them knowing.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Nihilus seems more impressive than the sith emperor IMO. He caused mass destruction on a planetary level and drained the life essence of 100 jedi, in what? Minutes? It took a ritual for the sith emperor to drain 100 dark lords without them knowing.


We don't actually know how long it took Nihilus to drain the planet and it was still vastly less impressive than the Emperor. Furthermore, there weren't 100 jedi on Katarr. After the JCW, barely 100 jedi remained in the galaxy. It could have been 5-10 jedi for all you know. And Nihilus' hunger was killing him. The Emperor suffered none of those side effects.

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
We don't actually know how long it took Nihilus to drain the planet and it was still vastly less impressive than the Emperor. Furthermore, there weren't 100 jedi on Katarr. After the JCW, barely 100 jedi remained in the galaxy. It could have been 5-10 jedi for all you know. And Nihilus' hunger was killing him. The Emperor suffered none of those side effects.

Did the sith emperor not use a ritual to perform his feat? And did he not also trick those dark lords in order to drain them? Nihilus' feat took far less than several weeks, that's for sure.

I'm just not seeing how the sith emperor is more impressive. Also, what other feats does he have besides the drain he used and his telepathy?

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Did the sith emperor not use a ritual to perform his feat? And did he not also trick those dark lords in order to drain them? Nihilus' feat took far less than several weeks, that's for sure.
How do you know? How many jedi were on the planet?



His telepathy, power, sith sorcery, all more impressive.

Regardless of the initial means the Sith Emperor used to accomplish the ritual, it worked, and now he's a Force demigod.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Did the sith emperor not use a ritual to perform his feat? And did he not also trick those dark lords in order to drain them? Nihilus' feat took far less than several weeks, that's for sure.
Nihilus also technically performed a ritual. You cannot destroy an entire planet with a single Force attack. It takes rituals to perform such feats. Also, Nihilus was not on the planet when he performed his ritual. He significantly lacks in tolerance abilities.

Also, Sith Emperor's ritual lasted lot less then weeks too. Not only this, the Sith Emperor was on the planet and survived that incredible power projection; the peak of destructive power of the dark side.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
I'm just not seeing how the sith emperor is more impressive. Also, what other feats does he have besides the drain he used and his telepathy?
Because you know nothing about his abilities.

1. He has incredible telepathic abilities. He can quickly break the will of many many individuals simultaneously. Nihilus never reached this level.

2. His direct offensive force powers are one of the deadliest in the history of Star Wars and he can incinerate his adversaries without sufficient effort. He does not needs to rely on the Force Drain techniques. Nihilus is a fail in this regard and he lacks the tolerance of the Sith Emperor.

Jedi Exile, Mandalore, and Visas were sufficient to defeat Darth Nihilus. Against the Sith Emperor, they stand no chance.

During the time of Revan, the Sith Emperor eliminated several Dark Council members simultaneously.

To give you an idea; a single member of the Dark Council was capable of eliminating both Lorge Scourge and Jedi Exile simultaneously in a single duel.

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
How do you know? How many jedi were on the planet?



His telepathy, power, sith sorcery, all more impressive.

Let's make this easier. Let's say Nihilus and the sith emperor both face off on the Ravager, how will the sith emperor overcome Darth Nihilus without a ritual? What are his feats with sorcery?

No doubt the sith emperor is a force titan, but I think he is being a little overhyped. However, I'll be honest: I don't know much about him, which is why I'm asking.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Let's make this easier. Let's say Nihilus and the sith emperor both face off on the Ravager, how will the sith emperor overcome Darth Nihilus without a ritual? What are his feats with sorcery?

No doubt the sith emperor is a force titan, but I think he is being a little overhyped. However, I'll be honest: I don't know much about him, which is why I'm asking.
Very simple:

1. He will crush the WILL of Nihilus. It is unlikely that Nihilus can make through this.

2. He will incinerate Nihilus with his Force powers. No form of defensive abilities can protect against his powers. Not even those of Master Yoda.

Originally posted by Lucius
Regardless of the initial means the Sith Emperor used to accomplish the ritual, it worked, and now he's a Force demigod.

I'm not arguing rather it worked or not. Of course it worked. But I need a little more than "he's a demigod now". Hell, I can say Nihilus is a demigod.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Very simple:

1. He will crush the WILL of Nihilus. It is unlikely that Nihilus can make through this.

2. He will incinerate Nihilus with his Force powers. No form of defensive abilities can protect against his powers. Not even those of Master Yoda.

Ok lol

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
I'm not arguing rather it worked or not. Of course it worked. But I need a little more than "he's a demigod now". Hell, I can say Nihilus is a demigod.
Are you even paying attention to my points?

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
We don't actually know how long it took Nihilus to drain the planet and it was still vastly less impressive than the Emperor. Furthermore, there weren't 100 jedi on Katarr. After the JCW, barely 100 jedi remained in the galaxy. It could have been 5-10 jedi for all you know. And Nihilus' hunger was killing him. The Emperor suffered none of those side effects.

Actually we do. Unseen, Unheard specifies before he starts that 'in under an hour '.

The temptation to actively participate in this thread is... formidable.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Actually we do. Unseen, Unheard specifies before he starts that 'in under an hour '.
Unseen Unheard does not reveals that how long it took Nihilus to build up for that kind of power before he spoke those words.

Against Exile, you see him unleashing only a single bolt of that power in a moment.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
The temptation to actively participate in this thread is... formidable.

Please do. We need you.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Unseen Unheard does not reveals that how long it took Nihilus to build up for that kind of power before he spoke those words.

Against Exile, you see him unleashing only a single bolt of that power in a moment.

Except we know that he can't build it up:

Kreia: 'It is not something he can direct or focus.'

Nephthys
Please do. We need you.

Honestly, I'm mildly annoyed with you. Technically, as the creator of this thread, you are responsible for all of the inane, moronic remarks made within by those whose stupidity is LeGenDary. You are the source of this dark temptation and I would kindly ask you to stop.

But I am here... should I?

Originally posted by Nephthys
Except we know that he can't build it up:

Kreia: 'It is not something he can direct or focus.'
Then why he failed to pull off that feat on Ravager?

If not the Jedi Exile, he could have taken down all others in the process. And then he would only had to face Jedi Exile in combat.

Kriea is in to hyperboles too. You will know this once you will read the Revan novel.

Jedi Exile considers Revan to be more powerful then Nihilus. And Revan could not stop the Sith Emperor.

Not to forget that the Jedi Exile was no match for a single Dark Council member. And Sith Emperor eliminated several of them simultaneously.

Did you just make a potentially valid point? I sense the presence of God at work here.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Then why he failed to pull off that feat on Ravager?

If not the Jedi Exile, he could have taken down all others in the process. And then he would only had to face Jedi Exile in combat.

Kriea is in to hyperboles too. You will know this once you will read the Revan novel.

Jedi Exile considers Revan to be more powerful then Nihilus. And Revan could not stop the Sith Emperor.

Easy. He was extremely weakened from trying ot eat the Exile and then immediately attacked. Also he was Force bonded to Visas, so trying to eat her would be like trying to eat himself, and not even a staving dog tries that. Mandalore is a non-Force sensistive, so he wouldn't even register to Nihilus, who is specifically drawn to force sensitives.


OR, since it is 'nor something he can direct' he'd have just hit the Exile with it again. And obviously he isn't going to try that again.

The Sith emperor happens to be a huge upgrade to Nihilus.

I've been forced to provide a reluctant pimpsmack to a certain group of people across three message boards in the form of an impressively cited and well worded reality check as to the holistic nature of Vitiate's powers and I suppose this may very well be the fourth.

The bottom line is that Vitiate is a figure of enormous power and may very well be among the most powerful Force users in the totality of canon, but he is never remotely established to be the reigning champion in anything other than his own time. His ability to drain Nathema was impressive, but required a protracted period of time and the presence of hundreds of Sith Lords. {Nihilus and Sidious, in comparison, are never stated in any source to require time or assistance in any form.} Vitiate's ability to mentally subjugate the likes of Revan and Malak is impressive, but this was contingent upon an emphatic qualifier made by Revan: "We underestimated him." The next time they met, Revan was prepared and was able to resist Vitiate's clumsy attempts to dominate his mind. Scourge and Surik were likewise prepared. {There is at least one other Sith Lord who has demonstrated the ability to thoroughly subjugate the minds of others-- and he did so on the scale of billions and quite possibly trillions.}

Originally posted by Nephthys
Easy. He was extremely weakened from trying ot eat the Exile and then immediately attacked.
Point is that we saw him unleashing a single bolt at a time. At maximum, he could have done what Kriea did in a moment?

Planetary wide scale of attack takes a long time of preperation, focus, and meditation.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Also he was Force bonded to Visas, so trying to eat her would be like trying to eat himself, and not even a staving dog tries that.
Did Nihilus not realized that Visas had cheated him? He put her in stasis too before he attacked Jedi Exile.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Mandalore is a non-Force sensistive, so he wouldn't even register to Nihilus, who is specifically drawn to force sensitives.
Another weakness of him. The Sith Emperor has no such weakness.

Originally posted by Nephthys
OR, since it is 'nor something he can direct' he'd have just hit the Exile with it again. And obviously he isn't going to try that again.
The problem is that how good is he with other force abilities? Why he failed to defeat Jedi Exile and her companions with his other abilities?

He became an incredible draining machine but he was not perfect.

Are we forgetting that Satele is a direct descendant of Revan? It can be argued that she had the potential to be as powerful or surpass his command of the Force. But again that can only be argued. The Order could have possibly not taught her everything in fear that she might become another Revan. In the 'Hope' trailer, she used the Force in stop a lightsaber blade from killing her on her hand. And it seemed the blade was melting. And she was in fight with Malgus who is an extremely powerful Sith. At the time according to novelization, she was only a Knight, not a Grand Master. I'm not sure Luke wields a Force shield that strong. That's like pitting TFU 2 Starkiller against Revan. It would be an epic fail on his part.

Revan and The Exile never had kid . . . but that is yet to come. Who knows what the authors will write next. Maybe Starkiller is of the Exile bloodline.

I fail to see how Sidious' drain is close to the level of Nihilus or Vitiate. He drained his planet over a few decades. Everyone lived out their lives while this didn't grant him any special upgrades in his powers. Vitiate drained everything, including the force. He then made Scourge immortal.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Point is that we saw him unleashing a single bolt at a time. At maximum, he could have done what Kriea did in a moment?

Planetary wide scale of attack takes a long time of preperation, focus, and meditation.

He could but didn't. He was weak and under attack.

No it doesn't. Kreia actually can use the attack and actually knows Nihilus a hell of a lot better than you or I and she specifically says that he can't focus it. Kreia >>>>>>>>>> you opinion.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Did Nihilus not realized that Visas had cheated him? He put her in stasis too before he attacked Jedi Exile.

Yes, he did. But killing her weakens him.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Another weakness of him. The Sith Emperor has no such weakness.

You're so wonderfully objective.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
The problem is that how good is he with other force abilities? Why he failed to defeat Jedi Exile and her companions with his other abilities?

He became an incredible draining machine but he was not perfect.

He was capable of using telekinesis to lift his ship, the Ravager out of the gravity well of Malachor V. When the Exile attacks him he just pust the party in stasis easily. And no, he failed to defeat them because he was starved and weakened from trying to drain the Exile.

He is still one of the most powerfiul Sith Lords ever. You have a weird habit of saying people aren't perfect. No shit.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
I've been forced to provide a reluctant pimpsmack to a certain group of people across three message boards in the form of an impressively cited and well worded reality check as to the holistic nature of Vitiate's powers and I suppose this may very well be the fourth.
Your turn to get pimpsmacked.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
The bottom line is that Vitiate is a figure of enormous power and may very well be among the most powerful Force users in the totality of canon, but he is never remotely established to be the reigning champion in anything other than his own time.
What nonsense.

He had been the most powerful Sith Lord in the entire Galaxy for a very very long time. He lived for over a 1000 years.

He is a worthy contendor for the most powerful Sith Lord in history besides Darth Sidious and Darth Plagueis.

Even if he is finally taken down, no lone Jedi can stop him or is involved.

He was only 10 years old when he stripped a Dark Lord of the Sith of his powers and killed him.

A feat comparable to that of Nihilus at that time against Darth Traya.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
His ability to drain Nathema was impressive, but required a protracted period of time and the presence of hundreds of Sith Lords. {Nihilus and Sidious, in comparison, are never stated in any source to require time or assistance in any form.}
His feat on Nathema surpasses the destructive intensity of the power projected by Nihilus. No one survived his ritual.

In case of

The diffrence between what Nihilus and Vitiate did was that Nihilus killed all life on the planet while Vitiate, more or less, killed the planet and everything on it.

Regardless, of the Nihilus and Vitiate debate, Vitiate would win in this thread. Hell he could likely turn both of them into his bitches.

I believe Baras and Malgus are both against the Emperor according to end game content. Does anybody support this guy? Also, what more can it say about his power if his policies are generally unpopular within his empire, yet he's ruled it for over 1,400 years?

Originally posted by Nephthys
He was the one performing the ritual.
Covered above. Genius, next time think before you make a point.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Naturally. he's completely unstoppable and no-one can ever hope tpo match him ever.
He is incredibly powerful.

Revan's force defensive abilities were no less then that of Master Yoda and yet he faltered. It can be safely argued that Revan's defensive capabilties were even better then those of Master Yoda. The Force attacks that Yoda faced in the movies from Count Dooku and Darth Sidious were nothing in comparison to what the Sith Emperor demonstrated.

And before you decide to challenge the above statement, think twice. Before there is information that will confirm my point and destroy your arguments.

Deal with it.

ROTS Sidious shouldn't even be in the same breath as this guy. Only DE Sidious is allowed, if ANY incarnation of Sidious makes sense.

Safe to say Revan was stronger than all the sith of his time as well, Vitiate excluded.

Legend, if you continue to be abusive in your discussion with me I will end it. Blunt your ****ing tongue or don't use it.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Legend, if you continue to be abusive in your discussion with me I will end it. Blunt your ****ing tongue or don't use it.
You have a habit of offending others with your silly arguments, which you repeat again and again and without doing any proper digging. I have to explain the damn things to you again and again. Why is this? Why can you not grasp anything properly? Why I have to exert a lot to make you understand anything? Am I communicating in Foreign language?

Either you pay attention or don't waste my time.

Enjoy your time on Ignore ****ass.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Enjoy your time on Ignore ****ass.
Typical reaction of a COWARD who cannot get out of the mental chains of fanboyism.

You will not stop me from properly representing information.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
You will not stop me from misrepresenting information.

LOL!

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
ROTS Sidious shouldn't even be in the same breath as this guy. Only DE Sidious is allowed, if ANY incarnation of Sidious makes sense.

Was not ROTS Sidious referred to as the most powerful Sith in history? I seem to recall at least some of those quotes refered to him at that time.

I thought you bought into those quotes.

Originally posted by ares834

Oops! I slipped.

I am giving fair treatment to all characters. I have many canonical sources under my possession. I can differentiate between what is correct and what is not correct. I can differentiate between the hyperbole and truth.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Was not ROTS Sidious referred to as the most powerful Sith in history? I seem to recall at least some of those quotes refered to him at that time.

I thought you bought into those quotes.
At that time, SWTOR did not happened.

Things are changing in the history of Star Wars mythos.

ROTS Sidious does not compares to the Lord Vitiate. A retcon is clearly in order.

My Victim
Your turn to get pimpsmacked.

This may have been accurate had it pertained to my sexcursions in the bedroom, but since I can only assume you're referencing this discussion, even you {with formidable expertise in subscribing to horrendous logic} could not be more wrong.



{Which is why I said his time; his time clearly being the duration of his life.}



Plagueis, definitely. Sidious, not really.



You would do well to explain how this is relevant.







Nihilus didn't require the presence of hundreds of other Sith to achieve his ends and neither did Sidious. Continuing you dismiss this fact will be interpreted as an automatic concession on your part. If you want to discuss this, fine, but be courteous enough to not cherrypick the text and remove critical contextual pieces?



Thanks in advance,
Your humble Pimpsmacker

no u excellent



You have failed to prove that in ways so thorough and complete as to inspire awe from those who make careers in failing at what they love above all else in life.



In what regard was he ever unique other than in conquering the galaxy and destroying Jedi {which your boy failed to do, by the way}?



If you actually read Dark Empire, you'd know that Sidious was stopped by "the Force and all the Jedi who came before" Luke and Leia. That's an exact quote, by the by.




I have no need to hide it. The fact remains that Nyriss is unable to verify the story's authenticity.



Proof that he conducted his planet-draining ritual, which was never in doubt, not that he stole his father's Force powers at age 10.



It doesn't matter what his intent was.
The fact remains that he needed their assistance to conduct the ritual, because he couldn't do it alone. Nihilus and Sidious are not known to have needed such help.



You regard being on the wrong end of an ass-kicking as entertainment? Well that explains your social life.



Regards,
Your humble Pimpsmacker



None of this confirms that Vitiate did anything but overthrow his father. What methods were used and at what age is not confirmed by Revan.



Regards {again},
Your humble Pimpsmacker

That quote has as much validity as the one that stated Palpatine knew everything. That's been proven to be erroneous at best, stupidity at worse.

DS
That quote has as much validity as the one that stated Palpatine knew everything. That's been proven to be erroneous at best, stupidity at worse.

Explain, or is the truth of your words suddenly self-evident?

That you have failed to make a valid argument in favor of Vitiate's supremacy? Way ahead of you.



Fascinating remarks from the world's foremost authority on "babbling." Your evaluations of these characters are irrelevant; I'm not interested in your baseless opinion, I'm interested in that which you can provide from sources.



Again, your personal evaluations of these characters are uninteresting to me. More important is the fact that I do not regard Sidious as "unique" in anything other than his accomplishments, which transcend Vitiate's.



She says she cannot verify the authenticity of the story. Revan does not confirm the details {which is what we're discussing}, just the broad story. There is no misrepresentation on my end; we cannot take her word as the gospel.



What I'd like is proof that he removed his father's powers at age 10. Nothing you have provided confirms this.





I'm waiting for a source that confirms or even remotely implies that he can utilize the ritual unaided and in a combat scenario. Take your time.



We can tell from your posts that unlike your sources, your issues are in abundance. Therapy is your friend.



And she flat-out says she can't confirm the story.

/discussion

I want sources, not bullshit.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
That you have failed to make a valid argument in favor of Vitiate's supremacy? Way ahead of you.
You are posting bullshit and nothing else.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
Fascinating remarks from the world's foremost authority on "babbling." Your evaluations of these characters are irrelevant; I'm not interested in your baseless opinion, I'm interested in that which you can provide from sources.
You have better source to counter the information provided by Lord Nyriss? If yes, please present it.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
Again, your personal evaluations of these characters are uninteresting to me. More important is the fact that I do not regard Sidious as "unique" in anything other than his accomplishments, which transcend Vitiate's.
As I have explained to you, the setting of both cases is entirely different. It matters a lot. And Sidious follows what has been preached by Revan; the infamous Rule of Two. So the original credit goes to?

Also, we are discussing the Sith Emperor's powers and destructive feats. We are not discussing the conquest of the Republic. That is irrelevant topic in this thread.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
She says she cannot verify the authenticity of the story. Revan does not confirm the details {which is what we're discussing}, just the broad story. There is no misrepresentation on my end; we cannot take her word as the gospel.
She says that a lot earlier. Get this in your thick skull. I have presented the whole quotes afterwards.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
What I'd like is proof that he removed his father's powers at age 10. Nothing you have provided confirms this.
You have better source to counter the information provided by Lord Nyriss? If yes, please present it.

Otherwise, SU.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers


I'm waiting for a source that confirms or even remotely implies that he can utilize the ritual unaided and in a combat scenario. Take your time.
No one is saying that he would perform that ritual in combat scenario. From where did you get this funny idea or are you drunk?

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
We can tell from your posts that unlike your sources, your issues are in abundance. Therapy is your friend.
You need therapy actually.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
And she flat-out says she can't confirm the story.
That is before she talks about Lord Dramad, you numbskull.

At the age of 13, he meets Marka Ragnos who acknowledges his rule over Nathema.

You cannot disprove any of this. You took one statement of hers and blew it out of the proportion. I doubt that you even have the novel.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
/discussion

I want sources, not bullshit.
You provide the sources that can disprove information provided by Lord Nyriss. You are posting bullshit and nothing else.

I don't need to disprove anything. When a character admits she may very well be wrong with what she is saying, that's all the latitude I need to question it.

Nyriss says that she is unable to verify its authenticity; this is an admission that she does not know if it actually happened this way.

Failure to provide these sources in your next post will be taken as an automatic concession and you'll be placed on ignore for your efforts.

I have the book, thanks.
She still says she cannot confirm the facts of the story.

Concession accepted, thanks for the debate. The back of my hand is a bit read from that pimpsmacking, though.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
I have the book, thanks.
She still says she cannot confirm the facts of the story.

Concession accepted, thanks for the debate. The back of my hand is a bit read from that pimpsmacking, though.
And yet you are weak at understanding things.

She also very clearly makes this statement:

"But if you had ever met the Emperor in person, you would not be so hesitant to accept the tale as fact."

Lord Nyriss understands Sith Emperor much better then Lord Scourge. She is a member of his Dark Council.

Ask Drew, if you have further questions.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers


Explain, or is the truth of your words suddenly self-evident?

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
Explain, or is the truth of your words suddenly self-evident?
Meaning you take some quotes at face value and vehemently debate others, all according to your bias. Please, stop making this so easy.

DS

Meaning you take some quotes at face value and vehemently debate others, all according to your bias. Please, stop making this so easy.

Explain how the quote was proven to be erroneous.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
Explain how the quote was proven to be erroneous.
Show us the details.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
Explain how the quote was proven to be erroneous.

Do you really need an explanation as to how "Sidious knew everything" doesn't make sense? Here's one, he didn't discover the secrets to immortality as Vitiate did. So if there's one, there's 2. Doesn't appear he knew Luke's special force lightning. Doesn't appear he knew the Emperor's other ritual that made Scourge immortal. You can see where this is going.

I think RevanSpoilers meant the quote where it took all the previous Jedi to contain his spirit.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I think RevanSpoilers meant the quote where it took all the previous Jedi to contain his spirit.

Why would Gideon Revanspoilers respond with a quote that I didn't argue for or against?

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
If you actually read Dark Empire, you'd know that Sidious was stopped by "the Force and all the Jedi who came before" Luke and Leia. That's an exact quote, by the by.

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
That quote has as much validity as the one that stated Palpatine knew everything. That's been proven to be erroneous at best, stupidity at worse.

Yes, the quote in question has been proven erroneous, hence the response. Nobody argued the jedi quote. Arguin the validity of the jedi quote is for a different time.

ty nephlez

DS
Yes, the quote in question has been proven erroneous, hence the response. Nobody argued the jedi quote. Arguin the validity of the jedi quote is for a different time.

I don't think I said Sidious knew everything.

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
Do you really need an explanation as to how "Sidious knew everything" doesn't make sense? Here's one, he didn't discover the secrets to immortality as Vitiate did. So if there's one, there's 2. Doesn't appear he knew Luke's special force lightning. Doesn't appear he knew the Emperor's other ritual that made Scourge immortal. You can see where this is going.
Excellent points.

Here is another one.

Sidious doesn't appear to know Lord Vitiate's special Force lightning Storm either which was purplish in color and was considerably more devastating then the versions we saw in the movies.

If the Sith Emperor was in place of Sidious on the Death Star in ROTJ and would have unleashed his powers, he would have incinerated both Darth Vader and Luke with relative ease.

You've mentioned that quote many times and at my comment regarding it, apparently questioned how it could be erroneous.

DS
You've mentioned that quote many times and at my comment regarding it, apparently questioned how it could be erroneous.

One of us misread or mistyped, because that quote {about Sidious knowing every technique} wasn't brought up or defended by me in this thread. What was brought up was Brand's declaration that the Force and all the Jedi who came before Luke would kept Sidious trapped in limbo.



That quote has as much validity as the one that stated Palpatine knew everything. That's been proven to be erroneous at best, stupidity at worse.

^ This was your original remark at the bottom of page 3. In it, you compare the validity of the quote I used {about the Force and all the Jedi keeping Sidious in limbo} to the one about Sidious being believed to have mastered every technique.

Hence my question: How is the quote about the Force and Jedi invalid?

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Excellent points.

Here is another one.

Sidious doesn't appear to know Lord Vitiate's special Force lightning Storm either which was purplish in color and was considerably more devastating then the versions we saw in the movies.

Not a very good point considering we see Palpatine atually incernate other people with his lightning. The only resonable conclusion is he was holding back his full power in the movies.

Originally posted by ares834
Not a very good point considering we see Palpatine atually incernate other people with his lightning. The only resonable conclusion is he was holding back his full power in the movies.
No, it is a valid point.

Lord Vitiate's Force lightning is entirely different from that of the Darth Sidious. Even the color of his Force lightning is entirely different.

Lord Nyriss's special Force lightning could also incinerate very powerful individuals with contact. Something far deadlier then what Count Dooku has demonstrated. Yet Revan absorbed and deflected it back at her. In comparison, Yoda was finding much harder to absorb the Force lightning of ROTS Sidious, which was also less deadlier then that of Lord Nyriss.

However;

A dozen bolts of purple lightning arced from the Emperor toward him. Revan tried to draw them in and contain them, but the Emperor was infinitely more powerful than Darth Nyriss had ever been.

Revan's flesh began to melt. There was too much power in the Force attacks of Lord Vitiate.

Also, Sidious was trying hard to electorcute ROTJ Luke. Watch his video again.

Lord Vitiate would have reduced both Vader and ROTJ Luke to charred ash with his devastating Force Lightning Storm quickly.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Lord Vitiate's Force lightning is different from that of the Darth Sidious. Even the color of his lightning is entirely different.

Lord Nyriss's Force lightning could also incinerate powerful individuals with contact. Something far deadlier then what Count Dooku has demonstrated. Yet Revan absorbed and deflected it back at her.

What does the power of Dooku's lightning have to do with Sidious?



And yet, the power didn't reduce Revan to ash hell it doesn't even kill him. Meanwhile Sidious's does kill Vader after a rather short time a character who according to TFU is quite capable of taking vast amounts of lightning relatively unharmed.



Lol. Palpatine is torturing Luke. In fact, the RotJ novel claims his lightning intesifies at times... And when we take the EU into consideration in which Sidious is shown to burn down an entire legion of Stormies with a single burst on incinerate three dark Jedi it's quite clear he was not using the full breath of his power.

For a comparison Vader was able to withstand Starkillers lightning, which was powerful enough to destroy an AT-AT, and yet Sidious' lightning easily killed him. I believe thats what you were talking about ares?

Originally posted by ares834
What does the power of Dooku's lightning have to do with Sidious?
What is so special about Sidious's Force lightning? Don't give me the comment of him reducing a few opponents to charred ash because Lord Nyriss was capable of doing the same.

Originally posted by ares834
And yet, the power didn't reduce Revan to ash hell it doesn't even kill him.
Because, Revan's defensive abilities were EXCELLENT. But he got burned badly and he would have died if T3 had not stepped in. Do the math.

Originally posted by ares834
Meanwhile Sidious's does kill Vader after a rather short time a character who according to TFU is quite capable of taking vast amounts of lightning relatively unharmed.
Galen's Force lightning abilities are nothing unique. Vader dies because his mechanical parts get electrocuted. There is no comparison between what Sidious demonstrates and what Lord Vitiate demonstrates.

Originally posted by ares834
Lol. Palpatine is torturing Luke. In fact, the RotJ novel claims his lightning intesifies at times... And when we take the EU into consideration in which Sidious is shown to burn down an entire legion of Stormies with a single burst on incinerate three dark Jedi it's quite clear he was not using the full breath of his power.
Yes, he is torturing Luke.

However, he also says after a while; and now you will die. He was serious at that time.

And don't give me that three Dark Jedi crap.

Lord Nyriss's special Force lightining was capable of incinerating both Lord Scourge and Jedi Exile simultaneously. Even herself regardless of his very fine defensive abilities. And Emperor's Force lightning was considerably more powerful.

Yep, in the novel he tanks Starkiller lightning and in the cutscenes for TFU 2 Starkiller channels a massive amount of lightning into him as well.

Originally posted by Nephthys
For a comparison Vader was able to withstand Starkillers lightning, which was powerful enough to destroy an AT-AT, and yet Sidious' lightning easily killed him. I believe thats what you were talking about ares?
Starkiller is nothing unique in this regard. Machinery is always vulnerable to electric currents.

Also, Sidious's lightning did not killed him. He willingly sacrified himself.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
What is so special about Sidious's Force lightning? Don't give me the comment of him reducing a few opponents to charred ash because Lord Nyriss was capable of doing the same.

Cool. And yet Vitiate's lightning did not.



Intresting... I did not realize he was still holding back the Emperor's lightning when he was writhing on the floor whith his mask fusing to his face. That's a mighty fine pain tolerance there.



Yep, Palps is better. Also Vader has insulation in his armor to protect him from lightning which would make him more resistant than a human. Furthermore, Starkiller has some insane lightning feats like when he deactivates an AT-AT. (Thanks Neph)



I didn't realize "And now you will die" meant "you will die this instant".



Hmm... I must have miss read the book as I could swear Scourge and the Exile were no incinerated and survived their encounter with Nyriss. Also where did Nyriss demonstrate these "very fine defensive abilities".

Sidious was obviously trying to slowly torture Luke to death. I don't know why thats hard for people to understand.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
One of us misread or mistyped, because that quote {about Sidious knowing every technique} wasn't brought up or defended by me in this thread. What was brought up was Brand's declaration that the Force and all the Jedi who came before Luke would kept Sidious trapped in limbo.



That quote has as much validity as the one that stated Palpatine knew everything. That's been proven to be erroneous at best, stupidity at worse.

I've never claimed that you mentioned it in this thread. I simply stated that you have used it in the past. As to how this particular quote could be invalid, how exactly does Brand know? Did every single Jedi in the history of the order talk to him in that instant he died? Did he have some kind of epiphany? It's not believable in any way.

Originally posted by ares834
Cool. And yet Vitiate's lightning did not.
Answer my question. What is so special about Sidious's Force lighting? Darth Bane was equally proficient in its use. Even Revan is claimed to have performed Force Lightning Storm, which is its greatest form.

Originally posted by ares834
Intresting... I did not realize he was still holding back the Emperor's lightning when he was writhing on the floor whith his mask fusing to his face. That's a mighty fine pain tolerance there.
Because you have no idea how much power was behind that Force Lightning Storm. 12 purplish and incredibly hot bolts had struck Revan simultaneously. And Lord Vitiate was channelling more and more power in to them. No one could have survived such power.

Originally posted by ares834
Yep, Palps is better. Also Vader has insulation in his armor to protect him from lightning which would make him more resistant than a human. Furthermore, Starkiller has some insane lightning feats like when he deactivates an AT-AT. (Thanks Neph
Palp's is better then that of Galen. However, Palp's have been rivalled by other Sith Lords in intensity and power.

And electrocuting machines it not a big deal with electric discharges. Try it out in real life and you will know what I am saying. Machines are immensely vulnerable to effects of electrocution.

Originally posted by ares834
I didn't realize "And now you will die" meant "you will die this instant".
Watch his video. His face expression was showing that he doing his best after he stated that Luke will die. When Vader touched him, he got electrocuted.

Originally posted by ares834
Hmm... I must have miss read the book as I could swear Scourge and the Exile were no incinerated and survived their encounter with Nyriss.
Don't come up with bullshit comments like these. I expect better from you at least.

Revan saved them, genius.

Originally posted by ares834
Also where did Nyriss demonstrate these "very fine defensive abilities".
She demonstrated the ability to counter Force attacks from her opponents with her own. Scourge realized that he was no match for her in combat. She alone put the Sith Trimuvirate to shame in her duel against Lord Scourge and Jedi Exile simultaneously.

DS
I've never claimed that you mentioned it in this thread. I simply stated that you have used it in the past.

If the quote was never addressed here and you didn't take issue with the quote that was until just now, what was the point of your remark?



No clue, but I figured since the child was offering unconfirmed third party accounts, so would I.

Revan did.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
Revan did.
He was saved by T3, genius.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
If the quote was never addressed here and you didn't take issue with the quote that was until just now, what was the point of your remark?
::igh:::









Except it's expected from some while others should be held to a higher standard.

Guess you should word your arguments better, "genius."

This is the best way to educate the child that his cause is lost. He'll fail on either terms.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
Guess you should word your arguments better, "genius."
You have the novel genius. Go through it.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
This is the best way to educate the child that his cause is lost. He'll fail on either terms. Not really, unless you really want us to believe you only used that quote to prove how ignorant his quotes were. It looks like you were using it to further your argument.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
This is the best way to educate the child that his cause is lost. He'll fail on either terms.
You severly lack in logical reasoning. You are giving me vague statements. Show me the independent sources that contradict every word of Lord Nyriss. She is one of the major sources on the history of the Sith Emperor. Many of her points have been supported by the data uncovered by the Jedi Exile and Revan also supported her account regarding Lord Dramath, in simple fashion. He is an outsider, so he expectedly does not knows much. Lord Nyriss was even mentioning the age of Sith Emperor on various events.

Unless a contradictory account comes in to the picture, you have no argument. Till then Lord Nyriss's statements are canonical and valid.

Just because Kriea was in to hyperboles, it does not proves that others are in to them as well. Different people have different personalities.

This is the crux of the whole argument.

Considering she freely admits that she doesn't know whether its true or not I think her story is worth shit personally.

DS
Not really, unless you really want us to believe you only used that quote to prove how ignorant his quotes were. It looks like you were using it to further your argument.

Feel free to speculate.

Neph
Considering she freely admits that she doesn't know whether its true or not I think her story is worth shit personally.

That's a horrible approach to take. How dare you question her recount of an admittedly unconfirmed legend? Do you hate Revan?

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Answer my question. What is so special about Sidious's Force lighting? Darth Bane was equally proficient in its use. Even Revan is claimed to have performed Force Lightning Storm, which is its greatest form.

Palpatine has killed vast amounts of stormtroopers, incinerated three dark jedi powerful enough to ressurect Maul, incinerated a Syth Worm, etc... And yes Bane may rival him with lightning and I would say the Emperor does as well, however Revan has yet to do so unless you consider the idea that he bolstered Nyriss's lightning.



I never once denied that it wouldn't kill Revan I only said that it didn't.



Never said otherwise.



We are also incapable of producing technology at the level the SW verse is meaning to compare our to theirs is faulty logic. Furthermore, in TFU 2 novel it's claims that Vader has insulation to protect him from the effects of electricity.



His face expressions show no such thing. All he is doing is snarling in rage. Hell, Luke isn't even illuminated (we don't see his skeleton like Windu and Vader) meaning it's quite clear that this isn't Palp's full power.



Then don't say it was capable of it because quite simply we don't know if it is.



Where are these "very fine defensive capabilties" shown? You failed to adress my question completely.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
Feel free to speculate. No need, you'll predictably try to hedge your bets.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
That's a horrible approach to take. How dare you question her recount of an admittedly unconfirmed legend? Do you hate Revan?

Yes. Its the mullet. It enrages me!

Nephthys
Yes. Its the mullet. It enrages me!

Understandable, but inexcusable.
To criticize Revan on any level is to hate him unconditionally.

Tread lightly.

I'll tread on his FACE!

****ing white trash.

But tread on his face lightly

I'll use my Boots of Elvenkind + 5.


ON HIS FACE! DUAL-WIELD *****!

Originally posted by ares834
Palpatine has killed vast amounts of stormtroopers,
No big deal. Any Sith Lord proficient in the use of Force lightning could have done the same.

Lord Nyriss confronted two guards before she met Lord Scourge and Jedi Exile. Both of them were instantly reduced to charred corpses by her Force lightning attack.

Originally posted by ares834
incinerated three dark jedi powerful enough to ressurect Maul,
That was a ritual, genius. Again prove that they were as powerful as Lord Scourge and Jedi Exile.

Originally posted by ares834
incinerated a Syth Worm,
Big deal? Another defenceless creature. I am willing to place my bets on the tolerance capabilities of a powerful Jedi and Sith in comparison.

Originally posted by ares834
etc... And yes Bane may rival him wiht lightning however I would say the Emperor does as well, however Revan has yet to do so unless you consider the idea that he bolstered Nyriss's lightning.
Lord Vitiate surpassed both of them. His Force lightning is special. It has different color. He can extend it to extreme levels. And it is extremely lethal. Think of the scenario like this; Lord Nyriss was proficient in the use of Force lightning. Emperor was vastly more powerful then her.

Originally posted by ares834
I never once denied that it wouldn't kill Revan I only said that it didn't.
And your point is? T3 stepped in to save him. Revan was no less then Master Yoda in absorbing the effects of Force Lightning attacks. Infact better then him in this regard.

Originally posted by ares834
Never said otherwise.
Lord Vitiate's Force lightning is deadliest yet seen.

Originally posted by ares834
We are also incapable of producing technology at the level the SW verse is meaning to compare our to theirs is faulty logic.
This is faulty logic actually. My point is that machinery is vulnerable to raw electric power.

Have a look at what a single bolt of raw lightning can do to machinery:

http://de.acidcow.com/pics/20100813/lightning_strikes_car_02.jpg

Originally posted by ares834
Furthermore, in TFU 2 novel it's claims that Vader has insulation to protect him from the effects of electricity.
Vader certainly had some defensive abilities. However, was still vulnerable to powerful Force lightning attacks. Sidious proved this.

Originally posted by ares834
His face expressions show no such thing. All he is doing is snarling in rage. Hell, Luke isn't even illuminated (we don't see his skeleton like Windu and Vader) meaning it's quite clear that this isn't Palp's full power.
Then why he says that now you will die? Was he joking?

Originally posted by ares834
Then don't say it was capable of it because quite simply we don't know if it is.
It actually was.

Originally posted by ares834
Wear are these "very fine defensive capabilties" shown? You failed to adress my question completely.
Here is one:

Nyriss seized on the opportunity to focus all her efforts on breaking through Meetra's defenses. The Jedi was clearly overmatched; though she managed to hold her ground, she was forced down to one knee.

In the awkward position her right flank was exposed, and Nyriss brought her blade in to deliver a crippling cut. At the same time, Scourge lashed out with the Force, catching Nyriss flush in the center of her chest. An ordinary foe would have been thrown clear across the room, but Nyriss instinctively threw up a Force barrier to protect herself, absorbing and redirecting the brunt of the impact. Even so, Scourge's attack knocked her off balance just enough to send her lightsaber wide of the mark, giving Meetra the opportunity she needed to scramble away to safety.

Scourge rushed forward, hoping to drive Nyriss back into a corner, but she met his charge with an invisible wave of rippling energy. It picked Scourge up and tossed him head-over-heels, sending him crashing to the wall.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
No big deal. Any Sith Lord proficient in the use of Force lightning could have done the same.

Really? Then you won't mind giving me an example where another Sith Lord killed around thirty men with a single blast of lightning.



What was a ritual? Regardless, they ressurected Darth Maul an impressive feat. And no I'm not going to prove they are as strong as Scourge or the Exile as I never said they were.



How about you prove it instead.



Ohh. Purple lightning... lulz. That really doesn't mean jack shit regardless, Sidious's lightning is purple in TFU.



Proove that he is better than Yoda.



You haven't proved this yet. Hell, it didn't even instantly kill Revan when it struck him.



How is it faulty. You are comparing our tech to theirs while SW Tech is far superior to our in almost every regard.



DId you ignore what I just posted? TFU 2 directly states he has insulation that protects him from the effects of electricity!



No. He was killing him. However, that doesn't preclude the possabilty that he was taking his time.



The prove it.



So blocking a force push that would have kocked her across the room means she has "very fine defensive capabilties"... Lol. I guess that random guard that Revan pushed must have had extrordinary defensive abilties.

Originally posted by ares834
Really? Then you won't mind giving me an example where another Sith Lord killed around thirty men with a single blast of lightning.
No need. Use your brain.

Originally posted by ares834
What was a ritual? Regardless, they ressurected Darth Maul an impressive feat. And no I'm not going to prove they are as strong as Scourge or the Exile as I never said they were.
Now put this thing in your mind; Lord Nyriss was so proficient in the use of Force lightning that she was capable of exterminating both Jedi Exile and Lord Scourge simultaneously with it. She herself could not tolerate her own lethal blasts of Force lightning. If Revan could effortlessely block this kind of power with bare hands, he can do so very easily against Darth Sidious and Darth Bane. More explanation below.

Originally posted by ares834
How about you prove it instead.
Use your brain. The ability to use the Force is what actually makes all the difference.

Originally posted by ares834
Ohh. Purple lightning... lulz. That really doesn't mean jack shit regardless, Sidious's lightning is purple in TFU.
It is indication of different level of energies. Sidious's Lightning is not exactly purplish. It radiates blue sparks.

Originally posted by ares834
Proove that he is better than Yoda.
Count Dooku's Force lightning is shit in comparison to that of Lord Nyriss. Yoda stopped that of Count Dooku's perfectly.

Lord Nyriss's Force lightning was definitely more powerful then the Force Lightning attacks of Sidious shown in the movies. His Force lightning attacks never managed to reduce any powerful Jedi to ash. Lord Nyriss's was capable of doing this. And yet Revan effortlessely blocked her lethal Force lightning attack which also comprised of 12 bolts. In comparison, Yoda struggled to contain the effects of Force lightning attacks of ROTS Sidious. Do the math.

Originally posted by ares834
You haven't proved this yet. Hell, it didn't even instantly kill Revan when it struck him.
Because Revan had exceptional defensive capabilities. See the comparsion above. Revan has greater command of the Force then Darth Nihilus as per belief of Jedi Exile herself. He was the most powerful Jedi in the Jedi Order of his time. He is easily top 5 material. You think that he would not last a few minutes?

Originally posted by ares834
How is it faulty. You are comparing our tech to theirs while SW Tech is far superior to our in almost every regard.
And yet that technology is not lightning-proof. Use common sense.

Originally posted by ares834
DId you ignore what I just posted? TFU 2 directly states he has insulation that protects him from the effects of electricity!
So what? Lethal Force lightning attacks would still destroy him. Vader is not invincible. Not even close. And neither he can do what Revan could.

Originally posted by ares834
No. He was killing him. However, that doesn't preclude the possabilty that he was taking his time.
He had tortured him already. After he felt that he had weakened the defenses of Luke, he made that statement and unleashed strongest barrage of his Lightning comprising of 3 to 4 bolts at least to kill him. But Vader stepped in.

Originally posted by ares834
The prove it.
You think that Revan would have survived? Don't throw these two-wordly terms. Use common sense.

Originally posted by ares834
So blocking a force push that would have kocked her across the room means she has "very fine defensive capabilties"... Lol.
Was she sent flying accross the room? Hello? Hello? Can you read?

She was focusing on Jedi Exile at that moment. The Force attack of Lord Scourge came completely unexpected. And yet she managed to throw a decent defence in the process, which absorbed the main brunt of that Force power. Try to grasp her situation and what she does under such circumstances.

Originally posted by ares834
I guess that random guard that Revan pushed must have had extrordinary defensive abilties.
That was not a random guard. It was an Elite guard and Sith Emperor was empowering it. Do you think that an ordinary being would be able to tolerate the Force push of Revan?

Got bored.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
No need. Use your brain.

Your response to him asking for proof is 'use your brain?' What if we all did that, that would make arguments so much easier.

When someone asks you a question its a good idea to respond, even if its 'No ares, I'm talking shit. You are right, that is an extremely impressive display of power.'

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Now put this thing in your mind; Lord Nyriss was so proficient in the use of Force lightning that she capable of exterminating both Jedi Exile and Lord Scourge simultaneously. She herself could no tolerate her own lethal blasts of Force lightning. If Revan could effortlessely block this kind of power with bare hands, he can do so very easily against Darth Sidious and Darth Bane.

"Nyriss's eyes went wide as Revan unleashed the power of her own attack against her." {pg. 248}

He did not block it, he absorbed it.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Use your brain. The ability to use the Force is what actually makes all the difference.

No it doesn't. Cite the source that claims that being powerful with the Force increases your ability to withstand lightning.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
It is indication of different level of energies. Sidious's Lightning is not exactly purplish. It radiates blue sparks.

Whats you source that Force Lightning being purple means its more powerful? Or are you just making that up?

tFUWrCHGfHM

7.06

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Count Dooku's Force lightning is shit in comparison to that of Lord Nyriss. Yoda stopped that of Count Dooku's perfectly.

Lord Nyriss's Force lightning was definitely more powerful then the Force Lightning attacks of Sidious shown in the movies. His Force lightning attacks never managed to reduce any powerful Jedi to ash. Lord Nyriss's was capable of doing this. And yet Revan effortlessely blocked her lethal Force lightning attack which also comprised of 12 bolts. In comparison, Yoda struggled to contain the effects of Force lightning attacks of ROTS Sidious. Do the math.

You're making unfounded assertions again. Sidious' Lightning at the time was enough to reduce creatures to ash. Since you havn't proven at all that its more impressive to do that to a powerful Force sensitive, you cannot make the claim that her lightning was more impressive than his.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Because Revan had exceptional defensive capabilities. See the comparsion above. Revan has greater command of the Force then Darth Nihilus as per belief of Jedi Exile herself. He was the most powerful Jedi in the Jedi Order of his time. He is easily top 5 material. You think that he would not last a few minutes?

The Exile was a Revan fangirl. Her opinion means very little.


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
And yet that technology is not lightning-proof. Use common sense.

Its a ****ing AT-AT. Not only is it the pinnacle of the Empires ground based military but its massive. That Galen was able to stop it with a casual blast of lightning (and then topple it with a force push) is incredibly impressive.

By your own image, a bolt of lightning was only enough to slightly damage the back of a car. Can you imagine how much more powerful Starkillers lightning would have to be to overwhelm a 20 meter tall metal behemoth comprising of technology lightyears ahead of our own? Past your incredible bias of course.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
So what? Lethal Force lightning attacks would still destroy him. Vader is not invincible. Not even close. And neither he can do what Revan could.

Wrong. Starkiller has killed with his lightning, so it is lethal and yet his lightning barely affected Vader. Sidious killed him with a short 3 second burst.

Do the math.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
He had tortured him already. After he felt that he had weakened the defenses of Luke, he made that statement and unleashed strongest barrage of his Lightning comprising of 3 to 4 bolts at least to kill him. But Vader stepped in.

Bullshit. He was slowly torturing him to death. He wanted to make it as slow and agonising as possible. That does not prove that he can't kill with his lightning. You are so full of shit.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Was she sent flying accross the room? Hello? Hello? Can you read?

Can you? Was that what he said? Maybe you should read a bit more. Take it word for word. Slowly, like a child. It must be hard for you to understand a foreign language. Theres no shame in needing help.

The clear implication of his point was that all she did was block a fairly weak force push that would have done no more than send her across the room. Unimpressive, and no exactly 'very fine.'

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
She was focusing on Jedi Exile at that moment. The Force attack of Lord Scourge came completely unexpected. And yet she managed to throw a decent defence in the process, which absorbed the main brunt of that Force power. Try to grasp her situation and what she does under such circumstances.

She has quick reflexes. That is all that proves.

Thanks Neph.

I've decided that ignoring him is too good for him.

Fool. You've played right in to his trap.

I've always been all for the old timey Jedi and Sith being more powerful, but there's something so vexing about it now that all the characters are pretty much two-dimensional simps written for a buck.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I've always been all for the old timey Jedi and Sith being more powerful, but there's something so vexing about it now that all the characters are pretty much two-dimensional simps written for a buck.
I wanted to clarify about the event shown in that gameplay:

We see Galen blocking Sidious's Force lightning with bare hands.

As per novelization, he actually does this. However, the event has much more in to it then what is shown in the gameplay:

A squadron of stormtroopers ran into the room, led by a limping Darth Vader. They raised their blasters to gun down the Rebels as they fled up the Rogue Shadow's ramp.

"No!" the apprentice cried, dropping his defenses to strike one last time at the Imperials. Energy surged through him. He felt as though a star had blazed to life in his chest. Driven by concern for his friends rather than himself, he embraced the Force completely, utterly, and was rewarded with strength that made his efforts with the dark side look like those of a child. His nerves were on fire. Streamers of light radiated from his skin. His bones glowed like radiant lava.

He saw rather than felt the massive shock wave that consumed a large portion of what remained of the observation dome. A glowing bubble of fire tore the stormtroopers to shreds and engulfed Vader and the Emperor. Shrapnel filled the air like dust caught in the beam of the Death Star's powerful laser.

Tossed like a leaf, the Rogue Shadow fled in haste, ramp snapping shut on its precious cargo.

The apprentice felt himself leaving his body again. Or was his body leaving him this time? He felt ripped apart by the energy that had flowed through him. Every cell was in shock; every fiber shook. The fire on his face possessed no heat at all. His limbs felt as distant as the farthest arms of the galaxy. He was amazed there was enough left of him to think at all.

Source: TFU Novel

Galen lets his guard down while he is absorbing the effects of Force lightning from Darth Sidious. A very SILLY move but he has decided to sacrifice himself.

He performs a Force attack simultaneously while he is also holding Sidious.

Afterwards, Galen unleashes a blast of energy which sends him and Sidious flying in different directions. Galen actually sacrificed himself to save his friends.

See the difference between intended message of gameplay and novel? Gameplay mechanics are never trustworthy sources.

@ The above is for you to; Neph.

Either that post of mine was re-worded on your end, or you took my meaning waaaaaaaay out to sea.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Either that post of mine was re-worded on your end, or you took my meaning waaaaaaaay out to sea.
No, that was not my intention and neither I have reworded your response.

Just wanted to expose Neph.

Some members treat Sidious as if he is some kind of Force-God. He is not. And he was nothing

Damn, my response got cut.

Continuing it:

And he was nothing in comparison to Lord Vitiate in the movies and even TFU novels.

Lord Vitiate eliminated his entire Dark Council, which comprised of the strongest Sith Lords in the Galaxy. Just one Dark Council member was capable of handling both Lord Scourge and Jedi Exile simultaneously. It proves that how powerful Lord Vitiate really is. One can only imagine that how devastating are his Force powers. He will manhandle even the most powerful Jedi of PT era.

We need to get used to all the shit that is turning out in the EU lately. It is actually good in the sense that we are getting counter-balance against the top characters of PT and post PT era characters. This will help in keeping fanboyism of later eras under check. The crux of my argument.

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
ROTS Sidious shouldn't even be in the same breath as this guy. Only DE Sidious is allowed, if ANY incarnation of Sidious makes sense.

Really? What makes Vitiate so far ahead of ROTS Sidious? His greatest feat of power was performed with a ritual and with a lot of help.

As for DE Sidious, there is no argument that can be made that would put Vitiate on Sidious' level.


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Damn, my response got cut.

Continuing it:

And he was nothing in comparison to Lord Vitiate in the movies and even TFU novels.

Lord Vitiate eliminated his entire Dark Council, which comprised of the strongest Sith Lords in the Galaxy. Just one Dark Council member was capable of handling both Lord Scourge and Jedi Exile simultaneously. It proves that how powerful Lord Vitiate really is. One can only imagine that how devastating are his Force powers. He will manhandle even the most powerful Jedi of PT era.

We need to get used to all the shit that is turning out in the EU lately. It is actually good in the sense that we are getting counter-balance against the top characters of PT and post PT era characters. This will help in keeping fanboyism of later eras under check. The crux of my argument.

I have no problem with someone arguing for their favorite character or era, but what you're doing is pathetic.

yeah... and vitiate isn't even real.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66

I have no problem with someone arguing for their favorite character or era, but what you're doing is pathetic.

Have we learned nothing?

When you feel the need to call someone in your online community pathetic because of their level or quality of participation, you are inadvertently insulting yourself while simultaneously undermining the motivation of everyone else to respond. If he's pathetic, SIDIOUS 66, even after his diligent and extensive arguments, what does that make you?

I don't agree with that. If he had made the implication that posting on an internet board about star wars, in general, made one pathetic, then you'd have a point. But he didn't. What he stated was that the level of obsession Legend is displaying is pathetic. Ergo, he wouldn't be insulting himself unless he also displayed that level of obsession.

Lot of help? He mind crushed hundreds of sith lords as soon as they came to his planet. He reigned supreme for 1,400 years. He has no need for a saber because he can wtfpwn you without one. He single handedly destroyed the dark council. There is NO argument for ROTS Sidious to be compared to him on any level. DE Sidious is more of a challenge but you'll have to provide a good argument as to how he would oppose Vitiate. I suggest you read the book first before confirming your continuing OT bias.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
I don't agree with that. If he had made the implication that posting on an internet board about star wars, in general, made one pathetic, then you'd have a point. But he didn't. What he stated was that the level of obsession Legend is displaying is pathetic. Ergo, he wouldn't be insulting himself unless he also displayed that level of obsession.
But, you see, Legend is doing nothing more than excelling at making an argument. In fact, he's doing so much more effectively than I've seen from almost anyone else. (Stubbornness is all you need to win the internet.) In my eyes, SIDIOUS 66 is calling Legend's efforts pathetic, while SIDIOUS 66's own efforts are of consistently lesser quality, thereby disparaging himself.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
When confronted with two Jedi and a Sith, he was unable to replicate the feat. Vitiate has not been shown to mentally subjugate the mind of a fully prepared intellect who is strong in the Force. The fact that he apparently didn't exert this level of influence over the Dark Council is testament to this.

1. Doesn't mean he couldn't, it means it might take time, like the ritual did.
2. He didn't need to influence the dark council when he can just kill them all and replace them, which he did.



They all went into his chambers, none came out. The Imperial Guard isn't powerful enough to deal with council members. Pretty obvious they got owned by Vitiate.




I haven't seen anyone sufficiently argue ROTS Sidious being anywher near Vitiate in terms of power.



Owning Revan without a blade is pretty damn impressive. Not sure how he killed the dark council but it's possible he drained them. You'll have to fill me in on what chance Sidious has.

DS
1. Doesn't mean he couldn't, it means it might take time, like the ritual did.
2. He didn't need to influence the dark council when he can just kill them all and replace them, which he did.

Vitiate reigned for more than a thousand years, I fail to see how time was a commodity in short supply for him. I also fail to see why he would refuse to subjugate the Dark Council if he could, since he clearly feared them enough to execute all of them at the mere possibility of treachery.



It is possible that Vitiate, as the authority who determined the time and place of their execution, used a ritual to kill them. There is no evidence that indicates he slayed them with his bare hands and under his own power.



Then I guess we're both unimpressed with the other side's arguments.



Defeating Revan is impressive, but the fact that he was put on his ass doesn't bode well for the idea that he's so untouchable in combat as to not need a lightsaber.



Exactly, a ritual may have been used. Something unlikely to occur in the midst of combat.



Different thread, different forum.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
Vitiate reigned for more than a thousand years, I fail to see how time was a commodity in short supply for him. I also fail to see why he would refuse to subjugate the Dark Council if he could, since he clearly feared them enough to execute all of them at the mere possibility of treachery.

These questions are merely fluff. The point is, he COULD defeat them all because he DID.


It's possible that he banged them all before killing them too. All we know is it's hinted to be a very short meeting. They came in, nobody left. And if he DID use a ritual, he did it against the most powerful members of the Empire, all 11 of them. What chance does Sidious have?



It required Revan to do something we've never seen in the mythos, force enlightenment both equal parts light and dark, to put the emperor on his ass.





I'm not following here. He had 11 of the most powerful members in his chambers at one time. If he was able to overcome them with a ritual, then what does one man have?

DS
These questions are merely fluff. The point is, he COULD defeat them all because he DID.

I could say that Sidious defeated ten thousand Jedi and I would technically be correct, though the manner in which that occurred would be irrelevant to this discussion; I could also say that Sidious killed the four Jedi Masters sent to arrest him and I would technically be correct, though the fact that Windu defeated him in single combat would undermine the way that fact is interpreted.

Context is critical.



Where is this hinted?



Because there's no indication that this ritual could be conducted in combat.



The first time, and then he simply deflected the Emperor's lightning back against him courtesy of the lightsaber.



Unless Sidious is facing this ritual as per the parameters of the thread, I don't think this will be an issue.

Originally posted by RevanSpoilers
I could say that Sidious defeated ten thousand Jedi and I would technically be correct, though the manner in which that occurred would be irrelevant to this discussion; I could also say that Sidious killed the four Jedi Masters sent to arrest him and I would technically be correct, though the fact that Windu defeated him in single combat would undermine the way that fact is interpreted.

Context is critical.
There's a difference. We know the sith lords went into the emperor's chamber alone, and they didn't leave. As far as I know, nobody else is allowed into his chambers. And your context would be completely misleading and does not equate to what I'm saying. Now, if the Imperial guard were the ones to do the deed or allowed in the chambers, then I would use the "technically" argument as well.




Around the time the Imperial Guard is attacking Nyriss' stronghold. Would have to dig it up.


You have 11 sith lords in his chamber. If he's able to mind crush them before they can achieve some kind of combat stance, then what does Sidious have going for him?




Then the emperor got mad, and wtfpwned Revan with his force storm. Don't think Sidious is blocking that.



If Sidious could survive the mind crush or the force storm or whatever the hell else Vitiate has going for him, then maybe we can talk.

You're misunderstanding: I'm saying that it is possible that Vitiate enacted a ritual to slay his minions and was preparing for it before they arrived. {Since he knew when they'd be coming.} There is no evidence that he killed them singlehandedly in combat.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
I doubt he can just wtfpwn ROTS Sidious without one. In fact, he might even need one, and there is nothing to suggest that he can even rival Sidious in that area.

From what I've heard, he never even touches a lightsaber.

Depends how you define "combined power". He has immortality because of those 100 sith lords, and his voice sounds like many different beings talking simultaneously. Just sayin.

From the written rules of this section:


(reported)

Be careful, reporting a mod constitutes criticism and in the land of KMC Soviet Russia, that offense is punishable by ban and closed thread.

Um, i reported sids, not rexy.

and i feel like if the code wont let you ignore a mod, there'd be no reason to let you report one

You actually reported him...

Damn, should have reported someone else.

if i know Z, there has been no actual reporting.

If his involvement is unnecessary then obviously it's not needed.

Jesus Zam. Can you tone down the preachy, pretentious ******* mode please? You're not a mod, so please stop acting like one.

This forum's mod more or less abandoned it a loong time ago. Kinda like Raz left us all here to die.